Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans

← 2022-01-14 | 2022-01-16 →
00:00 signpost probably oughta differentiate the political paperization (i.e. not-your-keys-not-your-coin) vs derivatives markets which yes, oughta be driving price discovery.
00:00 signpost but yeah, I don't in principle have any problem with folks betting on the future price of bitcoin. part of the process.
00:04 signpost even on the subject of political paperization, assets are custodied properly every day.
00:06 * signpost will never use such a thing, but doesn't usually expect to be "the demo" regardless of which is under discussion.
00:06 signpost that said extracting usable coins from such entities works just fine. the goxes these days are pretty quick about withdrawals.
00:09 signpost could even be that strong money *exacerbates* the fiat-driven market cycle rather than ending it, as gambler investment banks cycle between casino assets and bitcoin.
00:10 * signpost imagines a cycle not unlike shitcoins and bitcoin between bitcoin and stocks, real estate, whatever can be tokenized.
00:10 signpost maybe this game isn't even a bad evolutionary filter. eat too much risk, get deaded.
00:10 * signpost bbl
~ 18 minutes ~
00:29 asciilifeform << imho the enemy's strategy is presently to 'raise it to stratosphere then drop outta plane' periodically.
00:29 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 18:17:42 mats: bitcoin had no business going to 20k
00:29 dulapbot Logged on 2021-12-29 22:17:22 asciilifeform: usg's entire anti-btc strategy currently seems to reduce to 'turn it into speculative hell', lest it become the obvious go-to inflation shelter
00:29 asciilifeform worx a+++ so far
00:29 mats i don't think it works at all
00:30 asciilifeform it worx in that btcusd aint monotonically tracking 'the real inflation'(tm)(r) and this effectively keeps out over9000 would-be buyers who would otherwise throw usg.stocks, real estate, etc. to junkyard and go 'full bore' btc
00:30 mats doesn't suppress the price, it keeps breaking all time highs
00:31 asciilifeform indeed, but on timescale of yrs
00:32 asciilifeform whereas if yer a plebe saver, and anticipate possibly needing the fiatola at ~arbitrary time, btc volatility is perceived as lethal
00:32 mats much is made of bitcoins as a 'democratic' phenomenon, and in some ways, it is, having started life (and gone to stratosphere) as a retail phenomenon
00:33 asciilifeform (esp. considering that the exch rate uptick is taxes as 'income' if you -- plebe, who does not have with what to 'loss harvest' and play tax games -- sell)
00:33 asciilifeform *taxed
00:33 mats but that's fading, and its too bad if poor people weren't smart or early enough to hold
00:34 asciilifeform separately from plebemarket, mega-orgs which operate on quarterly/yrly timescale also find 'too hot' on acct of the artificial volatility
00:35 mats 'bitcoin isn't for the poor' -mp
00:35 mats short termism is intellectual poverty
00:35 asciilifeform << this'd be the case if the paper products were not products of reich financial engineering, where scamola deliberately unprosecuted (in fact encouraged), and freshly printed fiatola is delivered by the traincar to the compliant perps
00:35 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 18:31:56 mats: and the more paper products there are, the closer the market gets to accurately discovering the price
00:36 asciilifeform mats: in principle asciilifeform agrees. gotta ask the q of why folx still invest in reichpaper tho rather than btc. and the volatility is inescapably part of the answer.
00:38 asciilifeform << the smart/long-thinking folx, as mats in fact pointed out, aint letting go, because why would they (does it look like the printing press will perma-stop, ever? 'when hell freezes')
00:38 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 18:21:56 mats: i.e. there is but also, we know that bitcorns are extremely hoarded, and that the ratio of trade volume to liquidity is enormous compared to other assets
00:38 mats the printing press will stop when usd has competition
00:39 asciilifeform has competition since '09. the only meaningfully different competitor is btc.
00:39 mats rmb,eur,jpy are relatively quickly displacing dollar dominance
00:39 * asciilifeform doesn't distinguish at root b/w the various fiatolas
00:39 asciilifeform some print moar atm, some less, all effectively exactly same item
00:40 asciilifeform toiletpaper.
00:41 mats if bitcoin is really sound money, it will eventually put a ceiling on printing or else malignant fiat debasement will occur
00:41 asciilifeform mats: what means here 'malignant fiat debasement' ?
00:42 asciilifeform ( and, separately, how does mats picture 'ceiling on printing', when reich is ~100% powered by same, for past 100+y ? )
00:42 mats people fleeing fiat for other assets and sound money
00:42 asciilifeform happening for 100+y, this flight; and much of what lizards concern selves with is emplacement of minefields in the path of the fleeing
00:43 mats reich is still flying on tailwinds of back-to-back world war winning
00:43 asciilifeform from fdr's gold seizures to present-day antibtc shenanigans
00:43 mats gold sucks, and it died
00:44 asciilifeform sucked largely because vulnerable to lizarding : can't teleport it, or hide it in yer head
00:44 asciilifeform bugs since fixed by btc
00:45 asciilifeform the fundamental bug, however -- that it can be paperized, i.e. fraudulent 'musical chairs' promisetronic instruments passed off to the gullible as 'equivalent' to the real thing, is perhaps unfixable
00:45 asciilifeform and is main thrust of btc control efforts afaik.
00:45 mats sucks for the gullible, not my problem
00:46 asciilifeform sucks to a degree for erryone, in that there is not a deterministic algo for fleeing inflatola and consequently reich continues to steam along by stealing from ~erryone
00:47 asciilifeform (and inexpensively for reich)
00:48 mats everyone can custody their own wallets, in principle
00:49 asciilifeform what folx can't so much do is to actually 'live in btc', and the continued success of the paper machine is the reason why.
00:49 dulapbot Logged on 2021-11-19 11:19:42 asciilifeform: signpost: re 'why pest' -- asciilifeform is a btc aficionado of the (nearly extinct, possib.) old school -- would like to live in world where can get paid in uninflating, untaxable coinz, and buy necessities of live in same. doubt that anyone living nao will live to see such thing, but asciilifeform specifically interested in work which could make it at least conceivable.
00:49 asciilifeform megavolatility makes conducting day-to-day biz in pure btc largely impossible for afaik anyone.
00:49 mats sure
00:50 asciilifeform hence wai turned into casino (for 'txers') and 'hoard' (for 'hodlers') with no '3rd option'
00:50 mats all anyone can do is bide their time until the game changes
00:50 mats i.e. 18-19th century style redrawing of maps
00:51 asciilifeform i.e. until 'victory'.
00:51 * asciilifeform 'hodl' until victory/death.
00:53 asciilifeform asciilifeform's arg upstack is that btc paperization aint some kinda 'healthy ecology of price discovery' but rather organized enemy action with a clear purpose of preventing migration of day-to-day economic activity to btcism
00:53 asciilifeform and peculiarly effective, at that, even among 'black market' folx (most of whom still rely on usd and spampaypals)
00:54 asciilifeform what could set in motion 'victory', presently asciilifeform does not know.
00:54 mats i get it and i don't agree, it is disorganised and it is perpetually on the back foot
00:54 asciilifeform organizedly disorganized, lol
00:55 asciilifeform like all other reich activity
00:57 * asciilifeform recommends his strategy -- of conducting biz in btc strictly to fill a hodl -- to others, but not under illusion that it is generally applicable
00:57 asciilifeform a la 1940s 'buy victory bonds!'(tm)(r)
00:58 asciilifeform it's afaik the only algo currently known for -- even partially -- 'checking out' of printola.
00:59 asciilifeform yes, you can't 'eat' from it, must eat from 'day job'. but at least yer supplying a needed good/service to btc holders and if you live long enuff, can crack open that piggy.
01:00 asciilifeform (or alternatively fill that of anuther supplier)
01:00 asciilifeform operate, if you will, 'half-duplex' economy.
01:00 asciilifeform if over9000 folx do this, before long the 'half' becomes 'full' duplex.
01:02 mats maybe a cryptofiat pegged to bitcoins duplex economy
01:03 asciilifeform wat's 'cryptofiat' ?
01:03 asciilifeform (shitcoins?)
01:03 mats yeah, tethers and stablecoins denominated in fiat
01:03 asciilifeform from asciilifeform's pov shitcoins are simply ponzis (operated with the connivance of reich, which fails to prosecute'em)
01:04 mats i can't imagine doing more than a fe tx per year after btc has matured, fees are too high
01:04 mats few
01:04 asciilifeform mats: the fees seem on-par w/ bank wire cost
01:04 asciilifeform at any given time
01:04 * asciilifeform never understood the 'fees too high' whines
01:04 mats that's because the big hodlers don't move shit
01:05 asciilifeform ( ever ship, by snailmail, a bar of au, or item of equiv. value ? how was the fee ? )
01:05 mats and it can still cost $40-90usd when network activity is high
01:05 asciilifeform imho this is a tired, old mikehearnism. fees are exactly right, irrespective of what they happen to be.
01:06 mats i fully expect tx fees to hit $400-900 when 'victory'
01:06 asciilifeform well when sandwich is 1000$ lol, then yes
01:06 mats i don't have a problem with tx fees, its the cost to run the machine, but it'll never be within 3 magnitudes of visa
01:06 asciilifeform asciilifeform's 'problem' with fees as they are is merely that they go only to miner, and not to the over9000 folx who gotta blow disk on storing 4evah the block
01:07 mats and the floor transaction might be in the neighborhood of $10-20k
01:07 asciilifeform the 'solution' to 'fees high', if one insists on 'solving', is for there to be over9000 signpost-style wot walletrons.
01:07 asciilifeform instead of 'a' 'visa'.
01:07 asciilifeform i.e. you go to yer l1 hawaladar.
01:08 asciilifeform this 'problem' solved 100% by arabs in the 900s a.d.
01:08 mats that doesn't scale
01:08 mats whether you can trust your greengrocer with a tab is a personal matter
01:08 asciilifeform scales enuff to power rise of islam etc
01:08 asciilifeform and much of medieval commerce
01:09 mats its a structural problem, western societies are mostly exceptionally low trust environments
01:09 asciilifeform in fact , it's the only thing that scales; dun scale (it is funded by continued theft on historically unprecedented scale, is the only reason it superficially appears solvent)
01:09 mats lol what
01:10 mats its said that people really know, what, 30 people?
01:11 asciilifeform visa is powered by deliberately-enabled cc fraud, with merchants bearing the cost and passing it to konsoomer.
01:11 dulapbot (trilema) 2017-07-13 asciilifeform: ( usgological 'economy' is structured so that the cc fraud is essential nutrient to it. hence the studious avoidance of anything even vaguely smelling of a final solution - e.g. genuine crypto, single-use cc #, etc )
01:11 dulapbot (trilema) 2018-05-22 asciilifeform: the 'they hire somebody to make proper rsa card', it's a 'fried ice' hypothetical, tho. because the cc 'fraud' is a required element of maintaining the konsoomer 'purchasing' circulation the system needs in order to live.
01:11 mats hawala scales for people that have both money and friends, family
01:11 asciilifeform i.e. healthy human beings.
01:12 asciilifeform (vs 'human-lite' bioengineering waste product of the reich)
01:12 mats but most people don't have money or friends with money
01:12 asciilifeform that there's wat to fix.
01:12 mats not fixable
01:12 asciilifeform make friends or live&die in startopologyschwitz.
01:13 asciilifeform wotronics is the logical conclusion of the 'fix'.
01:14 asciilifeform mats: could be 'not fixable', in which case great inca devours planet3 and eventually implodes, w/ consequent reversion to stone age. pray, then, for asteroid.
01:15 * asciilifeform prefers to believe in possibility that -- fixable.
01:15 mats great inca is how humans will leave this crowded rock
01:15 asciilifeform lol
01:15 mats sad, but true
01:15 asciilifeform mats: yer posting from 1970s or wat
01:16 asciilifeform sad to inform mats, sovok-1 went bust, and sovok-2 soon to follow.
01:16 asciilifeform it aint flying you or i to alpha centauri, no.
01:16 mats resource concentration is how some guy got together a crown dispensation to crew three ships for a suicide visit over water
01:17 asciilifeform mats: this being so, the problem is the sharp drop in quality of available human material.
01:17 asciilifeform yesterday's crown dispensations were for rockets, today's -- for yachts.
01:17 asciilifeform tomorrow's will be for panem et circenses simply to keep the zombies from rampaging.
01:18 mats maybe some hero figures out and distributes how to build an 'epstein drive' with a bunch of rocks and pig iron, idk
01:18 mats seems unlikely
01:18 asciilifeform right, and they fly over9000 ustards to proxima centauri where they can do the fractional reserve thing again and rinse&repeat, lol
01:19 asciilifeform mats: ever read the strugatsky brothers ?
01:19 mats maybe ustards get their own planet, chinamen get a red planet, argentines etc
01:19 asciilifeform ( sovok-1 mega-sf writers; compl. w/ glorious communist galactic fyootoor )
01:19 mats nop
01:20 asciilifeform oughta. and there's a decent brit translation of the pertinent b00x
01:20 mats what titles should i start on?
01:20 asciilifeform their galactic wonderworld sank & depressed in keeping w/ fate of '80s sovok
01:22 asciilifeform mats: 'The Inhabited Island'; 'Beetle in the Anthill'; 'The Time Wanderers'; 'Snail on the Slope'.
01:22 mats okie
01:22 asciilifeform much rec'd.
01:23 * asciilifeform must bbl
01:24 mats in book recommendations, i've been working through 'in the dragon's shadow', on china and relations with its se asian neighbors,
01:32 mats chinese dispensations are still fueling scientific progress, at any rate
01:33 mats i.e.
01:34 asciilifeform mats: 'we haven't gone full tard yet and intend to continue having mains current, even if with 1950s tech' is a++ but not imho correct to label 'scientific progress'.
01:35 asciilifeform if they were building 440e9$ of working ~fusion~ stations, then yes, would say 'the chinese are bulldozing on with progress'
01:35 mats
01:36 asciilifeform '70s called and wait their 'progress' back, lol
01:36 asciilifeform *want
01:36 * asciilifeform clapped also for chinese lunohod but it aint 'progress'
01:36 mats well, you prob saw this on fusion,
01:37 mats its slow, what can i say, but it moves
01:37 asciilifeform tokamak has been ~same since 1st ed.
01:37 mats don't be such a debbie downer
01:37 asciilifeform still can't plug into it
01:37 * asciilifeform will clap if could !
01:37 asciilifeform dun see any symptom of +ev fusion tho , yet
01:38 asciilifeform mats: dunno how old you are, but asciilifeform been reading effectively identical press releases for tokamak justabout since was oldenuff to read
01:38 asciilifeform they dun seem to change.
01:38 mats the chinamen are making the right moves, banning big tech opiates like always-on multiplayer games and humiliating tencent
01:38 asciilifeform they at least seem to be keeping soviet state of art moar or less alive.
01:38 asciilifeform which is a++.
01:38 mats meanwhile usg is completely ignoring the d-meth proliferation problem
01:39 asciilifeform possib. that problem oughta 'solve' in ~other~ direction
01:39 mats
01:39 dulapbot Logged on 2021-12-29 22:01:33 mats: on meth,
01:39 mats one of the most important reads in 2021 on decline imo
01:39 asciilifeform tabletop meth+xyz printer for all reich inmates, a la 'distributed defense' (how ? if knew, would say)
01:39 asciilifeform then have all the folx who can't self-moderate od within the year.
01:39 asciilifeform problem solved.
01:40 mats anyway, good chat, cya
01:40 asciilifeform 'night mats
~ 2 hours 59 minutes ~
04:40 signpost mats: how do you square this and this?
04:40 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 19:54:38 mats: i get it and i don't agree, it is disorganised and it is perpetually on the back foot
04:40 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 20:15:35 mats: great inca is how humans will leave this crowded rock
04:42 signpost << recall old threads re: the reich merely allowing a few nerds into the upper caste via bitcoin to circulate fresh blood.
04:42 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 19:32:47 mats: much is made of bitcoins as a 'democratic' phenomenon, and in some ways, it is, having started life (and gone to stratosphere) as a retail phenomenon
04:43 signpost << even ruble inflation is supposedly lower than US atm.
04:43 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 19:39:24 mats: rmb,eur,jpy are relatively quickly displacing dollar dominance
04:45 signpost << lightning's not all wrong on this, just implemented atop segwit for no good reason.
04:45 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 20:04:04 mats: i can't imagine doing more than a fe tx per year after btc has matured, fees are too high
04:47 signpost a "credible threat" to pay is as good as settlement if done correctly, counterparties can ratchet forward signed proposals on a disbursement of multisig address for a long time.
04:49 signpost also possible there's a quick, highly liquid shitcoin chain that takes the cash role.
04:51 signpost << if it scales large enough for a few thousand people on earth doing this, that few thousand people will conquer for a long time.
04:51 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 20:08:32 asciilifeform: scales enuff to power rise of islam etc
04:51 signpost honor's powerful technology
04:51 signpost scales further than the honorable with the sword
04:51 signpost but I'll be dead well before the walmart era ends, I'm sure.
04:56 * signpost has considered that chinese fentanyl, meth, etc is in a confucian paternalistic way doing us a favor, in exactly this regard.
04:56 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 20:39:48 asciilifeform: then have all the folx who can't self-moderate od within the year.
~ 9 hours 52 minutes ~
14:49 asciilifeform $ticker btc usd
14:49 busybot Current BTC price in USD: $43258.63
14:49 asciilifeform !w poll
14:49 watchglass Polling 14 nodes...
14:49 watchglass : Alive: (0.081s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr= Blocks=718823
14:49 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.093s) V=70001 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718823
14:49 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.112s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718823
14:49 watchglass : Alive: (0.083s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718823 (Operator: asciilifeform)
14:49 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.118s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718823 (Operator: asciilifeform)
14:49 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.141s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr= Blocks=718823
14:49 watchglass : Alive: (0.143s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr= Blocks=718823 (Operator: whaack)
14:49 watchglass : Alive: (0.143s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718823
14:49 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.262s) V=88888 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718823
14:49 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.304s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718421
14:49 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.328s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718580
14:49 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.646s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718823
14:49 watchglass : Alive: (0.488s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=718823
14:50 watchglass : Busy? (No answer in 100 sec.)
14:56 asciilifeform << well it aint hyperinflating. ru runs on moar old-fashioned 'eastern despotism' rather than west reich's printola firehose.
14:56 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 23:43:50 signpost: << even ruble inflation is supposedly lower than US atm.
14:57 asciilifeform (phunphakt: in ru 'free & clear' home ownership rate is ~90%.)
14:58 asciilifeform granted, the typical owned property is a 2-3room flat, not palace.
15:03 asciilifeform << imho attempts to make 'bitcoin w/ cheaper tx' mechanically are wrongheaded ('you get whatcha pay for') and the Right Thing solution is informal (i.e. wotronic) systems
15:03 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 23:47:06 signpost: a "credible threat" to pay is as good as settlement if done correctly, counterparties can ratchet forward signed proposals on a disbursement of multisig address for a long time.
15:03 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 20:07:29 asciilifeform: the 'solution' to 'fees high', if one insists on 'solving', is for there to be over9000 signpost-style wot walletrons.
15:07 asciilifeform signpost's wallet was a++ example in prolly moar ways than was obv. at the time -- for instance, our drowned nutter was rather fond of trashy subscription www gamez, and asciilifeform bought his subscriptions (w/ paypalisms), ate coin via signpost's wallet, worked a++ and 'ecologically clean'
15:08 asciilifeform << most powerful 'tech' there ever was.
15:08 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 23:51:06 signpost: honor's powerful technology
15:10 asciilifeform << fwiw domestically they solved opium in the old-fashioned eastern despotism way -- heads-off
15:10 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 23:56:16 signpost: has considered that chinese fentanyl, meth, etc is in a confucian paternalistic way doing us a favor, in exactly this regard.
~ 1 hours 49 minutes ~
16:59 billymg i enjoyed the reading the discussion last night. imo the elephant in the room with 'wot-powered layer 2' is that, according to reich law at least, it is totally illegal. iirc this is the reason signpost shut down the deedbot wallet
16:59 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-15 10:03:38 asciilifeform: << imho attempts to make 'bitcoin w/ cheaper tx' mechanically are wrongheaded ('you get whatcha pay for') and the Right Thing solution is informal (i.e. wotronic) systems
16:59 asciilifeform billymg: justabout errything worth doing with btc is 100% reich-illegal.
17:00 billymg asciilifeform: right, aware
17:01 asciilifeform even things not worth doing. e.g. run cpu miner for a year, mine a satoshi's worth, yer an outlaw unless you reported 'gain'
17:01 asciilifeform 'illegal integers'(tm)(r). aint just for 1337 w4r3z anymoar!
17:02 asciilifeform in fact the whole pretense that there are reich.permitted activities worth doing with bitcoin is lulzy.
17:03 asciilifeform imho ~whole point of bothering with the extremely gnarly rube goldberg apparatus is to piss on the reich in various ways.
17:15 asciilifeform billymg: worth noting that it's a rather sickly, anemic elephant.
17:15 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-13 14:22:28 asciilifeform: billymg: afaik the only presently effective snoopage happens at the direct gox level
17:17 asciilifeform ( see e.g. also. )
17:17 dulapbot Logged on 2020-12-17 19:39:26 asciilifeform: for instance, afaik 100% of 'illicit exchange man' arrests to date, were 'controlled buys' a la dope. i.e. intrinsically impossible in a solid wot context.
17:17 dulapbot Logged on 2020-12-17 19:41:37 asciilifeform: ( usg tradition moar or less ~requires~ a 'controlled buy', i.e. executed by a dedicated stoolie, to convict a contrabandist. and not merely 'd00d admitted on his www that he once sold a bitcoin'. e.g. mp admitted that he once killed and ate a man, but observe that no one tried to arrest him for it )
17:19 * asciilifeform rewriting large chunk of spec, will bbl
~ 55 minutes ~
18:14 mats << i think of usg and ccp as separate pyramids
18:14 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 23:40:15 signpost: mats: how do you square this and this?
18:16 mats << the problem with this kind of thinking is that the new meth literally induces mental illness, and quickly, it is a completely next level social contagion compared to opis and fent. the atlantic article is a long read, but worth it
18:16 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-14 23:56:16 signpost: has considered that chinese fentanyl, meth, etc is in a confucian paternalistic way doing us a favor, in exactly this regard.
18:17 mats d-meth abuse isn't really treatable in the same manner, rehab is even more ineffective, and people are permanently changed after a handful of uses
18:20 mats >Treating them was daunting. Despite years of research, science has found no equivalent of methadone or Suboxone to help subdue meth cravings and allow people addicted to the drug a chance to break from it and begin repairing their life. And, like many others I spoke with, Jobe found that the human connection essential to successful drug treatment was almost impossible to establish. “It takes longer for them to actually be here
18:20 mats mentally,” Jobe said. “Before, we didn’t keep anybody more than nine months. Now we’re running up to 14 months, because it’s not until six or nine months that we finally find out who we got.” Some can’t remember their life before jail. “It’s not unusual for them to ask what they were found guilty of and sentenced to,” she said.
~ 1 hours 50 minutes ~
20:10 signpost yeah, I can see how this is like being flooded by refugees if they linger rather than die.
20:15 signpost "Portland, Oregon, began seeing the flood of meth around 2013." << I got to see the rapid decay of portland first hand while living there.
20:26 signpost "Until we begin to look out for the most vulnerable among us, there's no reason to expect them to abate." << figured it was going to close with something like this.
20:27 signpost imho the blunter and more realistic rendering is that a peasantry isn't capable of deciding its own use, and the american answer has for a generation or two been "nothing".
20:28 signpost not a bad article, but the culture for which it was written is incapable of making the decisions that would solve this problem.
20:29 whaack howdy signpost
20:29 signpost hey whaack, how goes?
20:31 whaack in trbexplorer news i think i'm going to wrap up with what i have now, noteable missing features from the genesis will be : a well tested push tx, up-to-date blocks (trbexplorer currently sits 2 blocks behind the tip, which is dangerously close, given that all reorgs are manual, and atm there is not even a system to detect for reorgs), and a system for viewing transactions in the mempool
20:32 whaack signpost: it's alright, but my rsi has been flaring up a bit (better than yesterday, but overall on a downward trend) and it is hot here today, so the discomfort level is pretty high
20:35 signpost sucks, iirc you're a guitar player too eh?
20:35 whaack yeah, and that's what brought back the flares
20:35 * signpost has had to put the thing down now and again.
20:35 signpost yeah
20:35 whaack i was doing quite well, i would say 80% pain reduction, and i started playing again
20:36 signpost I put pretty light strings on the strat, fun for bends etc too
20:36 whaack the pain from playing the guitar comes the day after, while i was playing i felt a little discomfort but it was very minimal
20:37 whaack i use medium tension nylon strings
20:45 whaack on another topic, i met a guy who is setting up a "boutique" btc miing operation in CR
20:46 signpost a hashrate-for-rent sort of thing?
20:48 whaack yeah, idk yet if he's doing the small PMB game or if he's just selling a datahouse for a miner or what
20:48 shinohai <<< If you aren't using Ernie Ball Slinky Strings (tm) on yer strat, are you really playing?
20:48 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-15 15:36:44 signpost: I put pretty light strings on the strat, fun for bends etc too
20:50 whaack i have the alergic 'it's a scam' response to mining operations, i once threw $300 in the fire for a PMB when i first learned about bitcoin
20:50 whaack they gave me drops of satoshi and then cut off the faucet
20:50 whaack no idea to ever know if they actually had machines
20:51 signpost shinohai: been doing those slinky cobalt strings
20:51 signpost they have this sort of shimmer to them I like
20:52 signpost whaack: yeah, I figure just buy btc directly with the money
20:52 signpost I'd only get involved with mining if I were one of the owners of the mine, and even then only if I also had an under-market electricity connection
20:53 whaack signpost: i am intersted in being a part of a mien where the owner is in my L1 WOT and as a cohort the mine is able to produce 1 block per year, as an independent pool
20:54 whaack mine*
20:54 thimbronion successfully compiled smalpest
20:54 whaack thimbronion: grats, but what is smalpest
20:54 signpost jonsykkel's impl
20:54 thimbronion jonsykkel's pestron
20:54 whaack ah great
20:55 signpost whaack: and yeah, I can see the benefits of wot being able to squeeze out own blox now and then
20:57 whaack signpost: this may be a way more interesting idea when the price of btc goes up relative to the block reward
20:58 whaack err by way more interesting i mean way more economically feasible
21:01 asciilifeform << can't resist to ask, tho : given that d is the bioactive isomer, why would columned meth have such supposedly spectacularly diff effect from 2x dose of racemic ?
21:01 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-15 13:17:34 mats: d-meth abuse isn't really treatable in the same manner, rehab is even more ineffective, and people are permanently changed after a handful of uses
21:01 asciilifeform ( l does ~0 other than unstuff the nose; at one pt was even sold otc in usa, asciilifeform recalls seeing it on shelf )
21:02 * asciilifeform paging ghost of laddel!111
21:02 asciilifeform !q seen-anywhere gabriel_laddel
21:02 dulapbot gabriel_laddel last seen in #trilema on 2018-05-02 00:59:35: F-
21:03 asciilifeform mats: possib. moar interesting aspect is that meth is a performance dope, and in some professions afaik not entirely 'optional' (e.g. long-haul trucking). prolly explains some of the 'difficulty of kicking'
21:05 asciilifeform the 'permanently changed' thing may even be that the eater (an overworked 'blue collar') simply realizes that 'yes it is possible to be awake'
21:06 asciilifeform sorta like how 1 reason why opiates mega-phenomenon in usa is that large % of population has permanent pain all over body from decades w/out access to medical attn
21:06 asciilifeform they take a pill and 'hey it is possible to not be in pain'. cure that.
21:07 * signpost suspects working multiple jobs is indeed the "gateway" to uppers for many, or jobs with long hours, yes
21:07 signpost pleb gets knocked from two jobs to three to stay alive, finds crank
21:08 signpost helps also with the void of meaninglessness of no job
21:10 verisimilitude I've now found this:
21:11 verisimilitude This actually looks rather nice, but its JavaScript nature will likely disqualify it for us.
21:12 * signpost hasn't gotten mad at graphviz yet
21:22 verisimilitude I'm to understand using deedbot was a way of getting a promise of coins, without the need to send them yet, right?
21:22 verisimilitude How is this different from ``hammering in nails with a microscope'', asciilifeform?
21:23 verisimilitude If trust be the answer, how's that different from those investors in the article, besides trusting the wrong person?
21:27 whaack verisimilitude: what article are you referring to?
21:28 signpost verisimilitude: "getting a promise of coins" is a bizarre definition of an invoicing system
21:28 signpost but yes, I suppose that's one way of looking at it.
21:28 verisimilitude
21:32 signpost please excuse while I update ratings.
21:32 signpost !!v 4F292A7AAC8EB262DA3DAA0B702BA1339582BBDC502D919EC410D81E701289D3
21:32 deedbot signpost rated adlai 2 << old-timer lisper
21:32 signpost !!v 1548670A39F6C57E6A94EA47FA8926FAA0DF9804357705FF1DED2A76DB33E716
21:32 deedbot signpost updated rating of asciilifeform from 1 to 5 << honorable member of former republic, writes at, ideological inspiration to many of us, inventor of pest protocol and author of P
21:32 signpost !!v 26CFB5F50022934F1507AC5FA7DEC7B9AB255875C24DF5474C5E67DE82864E4E
21:32 deedbot signpost rated billymg 3 << competent www dev, writes at, runs
21:32 signpost !!v 38F4DB4537BBB67478B1FF6BDF623F7B199B540A551B1CF8D2240982F7505EEA
21:32 deedbot signpost updated rating of BingoBoingo from 1 to 4 << honorable member of the former republic. escaped the reich before most.
21:33 signpost !!v 36052397816FB790CE042ECF93C8B25873C9009C853109CAE72DAD1395226731
21:33 deedbot signpost rated cgra 2 << FFA and TRB work.
21:33 signpost !!v 6DB040667298D662B7CD665FCA00208C0B3CEBE954D37FA7D8AA9C52C50411D0
21:33 deedbot signpost rated danielpbarron 2 << old timer, honorable, if one-dimensional these days.
21:33 signpost !!v 32B26FDB61DB8B6469AF7CB07E3AFD4B0710D1C13B19829D0D6447F190251B6B
21:33 deedbot signpost rated jonsykkel 2 << developer of smalpest at
21:33 signpost !!v C049A6672E5EB17DA836BFA610D78EB535D30A6766DD52D37259D8036C4BBEE4
21:33 deedbot signpost updated rating of mats from 1 to 2 << old-timer
21:33 signpost !!v 8A406421435EA0F9BC425E1634519F1AF6AF0488C9E60844BF1B2C2F6B47A201
21:33 deedbot signpost rated mod6 4 << honorable member of the former republic, much work on TRB.
21:33 signpost !!v 47C70D39BBA6607FBB8A9FFB8372D937380FD86D8D35FF2D44B3459F4D8C0809
21:33 deedbot signpost rated PeterL 2 << old-timer
21:33 signpost !!v C9969F0D75E060F40703AE9575B2D9F1451DDC6094E2CF7B85509AD874AD72D0
21:33 deedbot signpost rated shinohai 3 << republican old-timer and once writer for qntra
21:33 signpost !!v 78A86A684F3714BA601CA1EB3157AA38624C8AE35969F3DEB6E6F7AE1497BF71
21:33 deedbot signpost rated verisimilitude 2 << author of
21:33 signpost !!v C7B28B5350F123F2D81EE2E0F028865B4A66A0CC81DDC872ECFD567C59BF4323
21:33 deedbot signpost updated rating of whaack from 1 to 3 << old-timer, author of, ongoing work on block explorer
21:33 signpost done
21:36 verisimilitude Know I'm pleased with my rating.
21:36 verisimilitude Now that I've spent a few years here, I really should generate a better key and rate you.
21:37 whaack verisimilitude: yeah i don't see your point re deedbot wallet being related to a poor use of bitcoin, i think every1 using the wallet knew exactly the risk they were taking on by having signpost be their counterparty, yes his service is the same as a 'webwallet' but it's a webwallet where we had the ceo in our l1 and we used for a tiny portion of our coins.
21:37 signpost feel free to send me a signature with the old key of new and I'll update.
21:37 verisimilitude I've an old Thinkpad, which should be free from the Intel ME, that I can use.
21:38 verisimilitude I just need to take it apart and remove its wireless hardware first, and then install a decent GNU/Linux on it.
21:38 verisimilitude So it's what, hammering in nails with a ruler instead, whaack?
21:39 signpost might as well gut it of speakers, mic, camera, etc while in there
21:39 signpost verisimilitude: perhaps macroexpand. do you mean that it's working around flaws in bitcoin to use such a system?
21:40 verisimilitude No; I simply saw similarities.
21:41 signpost considering block size, regardless of what one chooses at the beginning, one can always imagine ways to increase transaction throughput such that it's insufficient.
21:43 signpost one can either bloat block size such that it impacts decentralization or permit systems which invest trust in a particular operator.
21:43 signpost I won't say a third doesn't exist, but if it does, has not been invented.
~ 1 hours 1 minutes ~
22:45 * asciilifeform wouldn't 'hold breath waiting' for the invention of a train where 'errybody can ride whenever they feel like, all at the same time, for 0 cost'
22:46 asciilifeform y'wouldn't ~want~ to ride that train, even if it were there.
22:47 asciilifeform catching ride in friend's benz -- yes, is wat deedbotwallet was. worked a++.
22:47 whaack afternoon asciilifeform
22:48 asciilifeform verisimilitude: it was used largely for small tx, i.e. coupla bitcents, where makes 0 sense to pony up tx fee that'd dwarf the payload
22:48 whaack how did redraft of spec go
22:48 asciilifeform wb whaack
22:48 asciilifeform still didn't get to it, lol, moving crates in truck etc
22:48 whaack nice to do work that's not at the computer, maybe?
22:49 asciilifeform would be nicer not in the frost but what can do
22:49 * asciilifeform bbl,teatime
22:49 whaack heh enjoy
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