Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2015-03-05 | 2015-03-07 → ↓
00:00 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5400 @ 0.00041679 = 2.2507 BTC [-]
00:01 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: i drove the hog to the forest & turned it loose there. found it interesting how the beast had to be shaken out of the trap, wouldn't simply leave on its own
00:03 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: They tend to do that. Amazing though on the other side how over time it takes increasing enticements to get them trapped in the first place.
00:03 assbot AMAZING COMPANY!
00:05 mod6 thanks asciilifeform :]
00:06 mod6 let me know how it goes. my full-sync test with the static bin is up to height=273236 currently.
00:06 mod6 i'll check back in tomorrow.
00:06 asciilifeform i confess that i can't bring myself to run the thing that eats infinite memory, any more
00:07 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15900 @ 0.00041899 = 6.6619 BTC [+] {3}
00:07 mod6 i understand. i think the first objective will be to resolve that issue once we get the milestone "release" bundled up.
00:07 mod6 then that'll be another version bump & release in itself.
00:08 mod6 ok, im off for a bit. night #b-a!
00:18 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27910 @ 0.0004059 = 11.3287 BTC [-] {4}
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00:39 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8300 @ 0.00040004 = 3.3203 BTC [-]
00:48 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17861 @ 0.00039583 = 7.0699 BTC [-] {3}
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02:22 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9419 @ 0.00039861 = 3.7545 BTC [+]
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02:44 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8650 @ 0.00039594 = 3.4249 BTC [-]
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03:06 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16700 @ 0.00039594 = 6.6122 BTC [-]
03:14 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5350 @ 0.00039309 = 2.103 BTC [-]
03:19 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 88 @ 0.03401 = 2.9929 BTC [+]
03:21 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5300 @ 0.00039309 = 2.0834 BTC [-]
03:23 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4548 @ 0.00038978 = 1.7727 BTC [-] {2}
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04:00 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19621 @ 0.00040252 = 7.8978 BTC [+] {2}
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04:21 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11906 @ 0.00040472 = 4.8186 BTC [+]
04:22 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7494 @ 0.00040472 = 3.033 BTC [+]
04:33 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9538 @ 0.00040264 = 3.8404 BTC [-] {2}
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04:55 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16450 @ 0.00040599 = 6.6785 BTC [+] {3}
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05:15 assbot [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 425 @ 0.00474189 = 2.0153 BTC [-] {7}
05:16 assbot [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 243 @ 0.00474063 = 1.152 BTC [-] {6}
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05:35 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20380 @ 0.00039375 = 8.0246 BTC [-] {2}
05:46 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13600 @ 0.0004039 = 5.493 BTC [+]
05:55 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11850 @ 0.00039375 = 4.6659 BTC [-]
06:00 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20200 @ 0.00040778 = 8.2372 BTC [+] {3}
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06:20 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17900 @ 0.00039375 = 7.0481 BTC [-]
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06:38 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12477 @ 0.00038844 = 4.8466 BTC [-] {3}
06:44 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24788 @ 0.00037813 = 9.3731 BTC [-] {3}
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07:03 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26450 @ 0.00037186 = 9.8357 BTC [-] {2}
07:11 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15800 @ 0.00036667 = 5.7934 BTC [-] {4}
07:13 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12550 @ 0.0003589 = 4.5042 BTC [-]
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07:32 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15972 @ 0.00038039 = 6.0756 BTC [+] {3}
07:35 chetty https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_2lGkEU4Xs
07:36 assbot malvina reynolds - little boxes - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1aPW26Q )
07:40 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29097 @ 0.00038699 = 11.2602 BTC [+] {2}
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08:27 danielpbarron height=253958 vs height=200309 (usb3: height=234842)
08:28 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20537 @ 0.00040221 = 8.2602 BTC [+] {2}
08:38 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17700 @ 0.00038094 = 6.7426 BTC [-] {2}
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09:00 chetty http://rt.com/news/238241-canadian-charged-cellphone-passcode/
09:00 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/17XXGle )
09:08 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17171 @ 0.00037164 = 6.3814 BTC [-]
09:15 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3650 @ 0.00037067 = 1.3529 BTC [-]
09:27 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8874 @ 0.00037067 = 3.2893 BTC [-]
09:31 mod6 up to height=288287 (static build)
09:35 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40477 @ 0.00037164 = 15.0429 BTC [+]
09:37 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6200 @ 0.00036961 = 2.2916 BTC [-] {2}
09:40 PeterL does therealbitcoin list have an rss feed?
09:46 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5514 @ 0.00036719 = 2.0247 BTC [-]
09:54 jurov no
09:55 jurov just register as recipient?
10:01 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12880 @ 0.00036578 = 4.7112 BTC [-]
10:05 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8720 @ 0.00036578 = 3.1896 BTC [-]
10:18 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15300 @ 0.00036386 = 5.5671 BTC [-] {2}
10:27 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33900 @ 0.00036474 = 12.3647 BTC [+] {3}
10:28 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3800 @ 0.0003605 = 1.3699 BTC [-]
10:35 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6784 @ 0.00035904 = 2.4357 BTC [-] {2}
10:37 BingoBoingo http://forum.utorrent.com/topic/95041-warning-epicscale-riskware-silently-installed-with-latest-utorrent/
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10:40 davout this kind of stuff will probably happen more and more
10:42 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5918 @ 0.00037164 = 2.1994 BTC [+]
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10:58 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15050 @ 0.00039092 = 5.8833 BTC [+]
11:01 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37750 @ 0.00040972 = 15.4669 BTC [+] {4}
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11:30 jurov ^ heh these utorrent forums. "account suspended"
11:31 nubbins` chetty it amazes me that people still carry non-wiped devices over int'l borders
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11:32 nubbins` FWIW canada customs have consistently provided me with the least-pleasant border crossing experiences of any agency
11:33 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11300 @ 0.00041394 = 4.6775 BTC [+]
11:40 chetty only safe place is inside your head, for now
11:42 chetty although I have crossed boarders in last year a few times with no problems, I am always ready
11:44 PeterL you made renters angry?
11:47 scoopbot New post on Qntra.net by Bingo Boingo: http://qntra.net/2015/03/crapware-still-bundles-mining-software/
11:48 chetty and I can't type either :/
11:54 danielpbarron "Noticed the laptop was 'laggy' and then I saw the mysterious E in the taskbar. Blamed the kids again but then I saw the Utorrent update comments and bingo, me too," Ian notes. << people with children are pirating movies?
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11:55 PeterL why would people with children be different?
11:57 * danielpbarron shrugs
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12:17 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15500 @ 0.00041633 = 6.4531 BTC [+] {2}
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12:34 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22000 @ 0.00041863 = 9.2099 BTC [+] {5}
12:42 thestringpuller dead as fuck in here today
12:42 PeterL no kidding
12:43 PeterL deader, unless you are a necrophile
12:44 thestringpuller Everyone has meatspace things to do!
12:51 asciilifeform re: border searches - interestingly, if your cargo doesn't look like consumer electronics, the inspectors tend to ignore it (granted that it doesn't pattern-match 't3rr0r1s7!!!111')
12:52 PeterL example?
12:53 asciilifeform PeterL: when i went to mircea_popescu's conference-2, had an attache of rng samples, which nobody at any of the borders was interested in so much as opening much less demanding to know how to plug them in
12:54 asciilifeform i found this odd enough to still wonder why
12:54 mike_c they didn't want to make you suspicious so you wouldn't see the people following you.
12:54 asciilifeform might have to do with 'lottery' system for inspections
12:54 PeterL if you had one in your pocket instead of in case, would they have been interested by it?
12:55 asciilifeform generally you have to 'win' the 'lottery' to get the full-bore arse search
13:01 scoopbot New post on Qntra.net by PeterL: http://qntra.net/2015/03/summary-of-mpex-stocks-and-funds-february-2015/
13:04 danielpbarron PeterL, something's not right with the beginning of the MiniGame paragraph
13:05 PeterL BingoBoingo: the link for s.mg is not closed, could you fix?
13:05 PeterL just needs a >S.MG</a> in there
13:07 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5600 @ 0.00041389 = 2.3178 BTC [-]
13:08 BingoBoingo fxd
13:15 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13037 @ 0.00042204 = 5.5021 BTC [+]
13:18 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14633 @ 0.00042212 = 6.1769 BTC [+] {2}
13:24 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45300 @ 0.0004136 = 18.7361 BTC [-] {2}
13:25 trinque asciilifeform: average border guard probably says 1) is he brown? 2) did any of our HYPER ADVANCED detectors smell bomb? 3) is he flagged for harassment 4) does he look afraid
13:25 trinque I have a family member that's tagged for harassment at the border for political involvement in the 70s
13:38 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17500 @ 0.00041996 = 7.3493 BTC [+] {3}
13:45 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9104 @ 0.00042301 = 3.8511 BTC [+] {2}
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14:02 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: http://www.epicscale.com << the spamatronic 'cpu broker' used in the crapware described in recent qntra piece
14:02 assbot Epic Scale ... ( http://bit.ly/1G7qOl8 )
14:02 asciilifeform worth a mention somewhere?
14:03 asciilifeform this one has a 'charity' flavour
14:03 asciilifeform 'join our botnet voluntarily, save orphans!'
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14:04 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Possibly. Mentioned by name in the linked TorrentFreak piece.
14:05 asciilifeform aha
14:05 asciilifeform but the sheer lameness, worth a discussion
14:06 asciilifeform evidently they ran short of chumps dumb enough to install the thing voluntarily
14:06 asciilifeform and had to try something new
14:07 BingoBoingo There's been a number of these things. This was actually one of the business's "CoinLab" explored
14:10 BingoBoingo The proposed a guarenteed payment pool for GPU miners where once ASICs arrived the GPUs would be aimed at other computing tasks
14:12 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: this type of chumpatron has a name, though i'm blanking on what it was
14:12 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: sometimes discussed in historical chumpatronics literature, re: schemes to 'invest in xxxx, and once it tanks, we'll buy it up for firewood we promise'
14:13 BingoBoingo Ah
14:15 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3306 @ 0.00042314 = 1.3989 BTC [+]
14:15 mats AAPL joins DJI
14:15 mats replacing AT&T
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14:40 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21600 @ 0.00042687 = 9.2204 BTC [+] {2}
14:47 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26349 @ 0.0004315 = 11.3696 BTC [+]
14:57 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10648 @ 0.00043451 = 4.6267 BTC [+]
15:02 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31100 @ 0.00040436 = 12.5756 BTC [-] {4}
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15:28 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13500 @ 0.00039942 = 5.3922 BTC [-] {2}
15:31 PeterL Trying to find a good link for this, http://townhall.com/tipsheet/katiepavlich/2015/02/16/atf-trying-to-ban-ar15-ammo-under-guise-of-law-enforcement-safety-n1957622
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15:31 assbot ATF Trying to Ban AR-15 Ammo Under Guise of "Law Enforcement Safety" - Katie Pavlich ... ( http://bit.ly/1KyOxBe )
15:31 PeterL maybe asciilifeform 's desire to make bullet in jungle conditions is more urgent than we thought?
15:33 asciilifeform PeterL: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=26-02-2015#1034504 << original thread here
15:33 assbot Logged on 26-02-2015 17:54:22; asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: it was clear to anyone who gives a fuck that usg would target ammunition, rather than small arms per se, when it 'gets serious'
15:33 PeterL Apparently the government has started changing the rules, then asking for public comment (which they then ignore)
15:34 asciilifeform PeterL: small nuance here, also. the 'jungle shells' don't have to actually be made to work, in a sense. think about how the 'gavin fork' thing, which died - or at least went into hibernation - merely from knowing that response is ready
15:34 asciilifeform sorta like the logic of nuke war
15:34 chetty they even ignore the courts, why bother with the silly 'public'
15:35 trinque I don't see how national-scale weapons control could be implemented in the US
15:35 trinque they can try; there are hordes of rednecks in the woods already stocked up for armageddon
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15:35 asciilifeform trinque: it mostly was in '68
15:35 chetty walk softly and carry a big stick won't ever change, at least not the big stick part :)
15:36 trinque asciilifeform: I think people who never leave cities tend to forget how much weaponry is just outside
15:36 trinque and people who actually know how to use them
15:36 asciilifeform the 'hordes' are dealt with in the same way as anarchists 100 years ago - moles, stoolies, provocateurs, and, if these fail, massed attack with costly 20th c. armour/aviation
15:37 asciilifeform (today's substitute for the maxim gun of the pinkertons, you could say)
15:38 asciilifeform if there were a 'rural militia' with above room-temperature iq, usa would already look like iraq
↖ ↖
15:38 asciilifeform it doesn't. ergo, there isn't.
15:38 danielpbarron perhaps it'll be like with legal weed -- permitted to do bitcoin, or permitted to own a gun. choose one.
15:39 asciilifeform wai wat
15:39 trinque asciilifeform: I don't think things have gotten bad enough yet for them, the rednecks
15:40 chetty yeah, need the bubba effect to kick in
15:40 trinque I could see someone clever turning them into a far-right movement of some kind
15:41 trinque invoke the "end times", etc
15:41 asciilifeform trinque: as i understand, this isn't ru circa 1917, the hypothetical rebels don't 'just want to be left alone' - not one in ten thousand is able to grow anything edible without regular deliveries of petrol, pesticides, etc.
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15:41 chetty right? left? too the moon might as well be. right and left don't make sense anymore
15:41 asciilifeform washington doesn't need to 'waco' them - just to stop sending the trucks (command economy, recall?)
15:42 asciilifeform what's more, the would-be mutineers mostly know this.
15:42 trinque asciilifeform: how collapsed are we considering?
15:42 asciilifeform when they go to the forest and blast away at bull's eyes, it's really a psychological release
15:42 trinque enough for pieces of the military to break off and start fighting for texas?
15:43 asciilifeform trinque: usa is what anthropologists call a 'palace economy'
15:43 asciilifeform what are the folks 'fighting for texas' eating?
15:43 trinque mexicans?
15:43 trinque lol, just kidding
15:43 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15425 @ 0.00041173 = 6.3509 BTC [+] {3}
15:44 bitstein asciilifeform: bbq of course, http://franklinbarbecue.com/
15:44 assbot Franklin Barbecue ... ( http://bit.ly/1A4Qqvp )
15:44 trinque bitstein: austin resident?
15:45 asciilifeform is this roughly analogous to marie antoinette's cake ?
15:45 bitstein trinque: yep
15:45 trinque bitstein: nice! I lived there for years, grew up in houston
15:46 danielpbarron I once visited a false church community in waco, tx (no relation to that other thing) and they seemed capable of sustaining themselves independent of any supply lines. But maybe all the ground tilling was just for show -- I didn't stay there year-round; just for a week for their "harvest festival"
15:46 trinque danielpbarron: my parents have a farm that produces far in surplus of what they need
15:47 trinque the problem being the neighbors of course, in such a situation
15:47 asciilifeform danielpbarron: 100% closed cycle? no one taking modern pharma products of any kind? no electrical devices ? lit with candles, made of animal fat ? etc
15:47 danielpbarron a lot of them had iPhones
15:49 PeterL danielpbarron: I imagine they have to import metal to make their farm implements, or are they doing mining and refining too?
15:49 danielpbarron and come to think of it, a lot of their industry was exporting to outsiders. things like "hand made whatever"
15:49 trinque PeterL: you don't need infinite amounts of tools, once you have them
15:49 trinque and enough spare parts
15:49 PeterL but tools do not last forever
15:50 trinque this idea that people cannot possibly survive without vast supply chains is pretty new...
15:50 danielpbarron i still have those gloves and hat. not gonna say it isn't high quality.
15:50 trinque I mean if we're headed back to the stone age, might as well eat a bullet in that situation
15:51 trinque asciilifeform: were all (former) Soviets growing their own food?
15:51 trinque I'd expect they were living off the state's teat mostly
15:51 trinque but could be way off
15:51 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=26-11-2013#393769
15:51 assbot Logged on 26-11-2013 17:41:46; asciilifeform: "There's a shift in people's thinking as essential items become scarce. They believe that... hoarders created the shortage... if someone can establish such a link between the crisis and you, you have a problem.'
15:52 trinque of course, yet what, 5% population decline, maybe 10?
15:52 asciilifeform trinque: accurate data is hard to come by, but at one point something like 80% of the calories consumed came from amateur gardens
15:53 trinque asciilifeform: I would want to know whether that was mostly a reaction after collapse, or something which people had in advance
15:53 asciilifeform trinque: try to remember the substantial differences between the two empires
15:53 trinque actually "in advance" would make sense if there were ongoing shortages
15:53 asciilifeform no one in ussr could be evicted from their income suddenly zeroing;
15:53 asciilifeform major cities did not have populations of orcs ready to riot and burn;
15:53 asciilifeform the heat - mostly stayed on; etc
15:53 trinque that sounds like surviving 3 weeks in the woods at most though
15:54 trinque pick a spot far enough that no one hungry is going to wander there on foot
15:54 trinque let the cities burn themselves out
15:54 asciilifeform and live there for the rest of your life ?
15:54 asciilifeform you're still thinking in terms of temporary disruptions in 'business as usual'
15:54 PeterL wait out collapse, then return to scrounge resources from ruins?
15:55 asciilifeform even in a very optimistic scenario like ussr, the disappearance of 'business as usual' could last for decades.
15:55 asciilifeform PeterL: only in hollywood films do burned out husks of cities contain anything you would like to pick up - vs. corpses and unexploded ordnance
15:56 trinque asciilifeform: I don't mean that I'd return to the city 3wks later
15:56 PeterL I was just trying to finish trinque's idea of hiding in the woods for 3 weeks
15:56 danielpbarron is it foolish to assume that I can bribe my way out of catastrophe?
15:56 PeterL danielpbarron: yes
15:56 trinque I mean the cities wont be a risk to the rural areas after some period of starvation
15:56 asciilifeform somehow everybody (at least every adult male) thinks that he's the clever bugger who will notice the things everyone else has overlooked, survive catastrophes that put the rest of the area to bed for good, etc.
15:56 asciilifeform danielpbarron: it isn't foolish, but the time to do so is strictly -before-
15:56 asciilifeform when the planes are still flying
15:57 trinque asciilifeform: well you at least fight back as the knife's plunged in
15:57 danielpbarron i don't think i'll be rich enough to bribe my way out until -after- it begins
15:57 asciilifeform trinque: i'm specifically addressing the fantasies of 'survive' rather than 'die with honour' (there'll be death of every kind available to all-comers, then)
15:57 trinque danielpbarron: someone will just beat the private keys out of you
15:58 trinque asciilifeform: ah, I agree that I'm probably dead
15:58 trinque this is more a question of what to do until then
15:59 trinque no worse than the situation was before though, right?
15:59 trinque I'm as good as dead no matter what I'm doing, given a long enough timeline
15:59 trinque but, one will still try to increase his chances even as lowered into the oil
16:00 danielpbarron i'm probably in the *worst* place to be when this stuff goes down, although asciilifeform's locale doesn't sound very pleasant either
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16:00 PeterL asciilifeform: danielpbarron: it isn't foolish, but the time to do so is strictly -before- << surviving is dependent on having useful skills and wot connections to others with skills, the time to gain these is also strictly -before-
16:02 asciilifeform iirc we spoke re: the sewer pumps here at least once
16:03 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=27-06-2014#735017
16:03 assbot Logged on 27-06-2014 04:19:50; asciilifeform: speaking of sewage, i recently had occasion to learn the details behind herr orlov's assertion that usa minus mains current will drown in own shit
16:03 asciilifeform ^ thread
16:06 cazalla danielpbarron, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044264 <<< i've managed to watch maybe 2-3 movies from start to end since son was born.. maybe the guy's kids are older but that just seems to take even more free time away
16:06 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 16:54:35; danielpbarron: "Noticed the laptop was 'laggy' and then I saw the mysterious E in the taskbar. Blamed the kids again but then I saw the Utorrent update comments and bingo, me too," Ian notes. << people with children are pirating movies?
16:10 cazalla the majority of movies are shit anyway so even if i had the time to watch them on the reg, they are not even worth pirating
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16:18 trinque asciilifeform: I'd think there's enough talent right here to escape a gravity well
16:19 asciilifeform trinque: escape from gravity well is the most personal matter imaginable
16:19 asciilifeform trinque: something each of us must solve entirely on his own
16:19 trinque that seems foolish, though sure, I'm making my own moves aside from derping here
16:20 trinque a big, profitable company would hurt how?
16:20 asciilifeform trinque: there's a reason i used rocketry as the analogy
16:21 asciilifeform getting just one person (not even talking about family, friends, pets, possessions, etc) permanently out of not only usa but the nato financial octopus - is probably more expensive than launching it into orbit
16:21 asciilifeform if you -actually- tally up the costs, realistically
16:22 asciilifeform and i am specifically not speaking of mircea_popescu's favourite 'rescue animals', young gurlz
16:22 trinque lol
16:22 asciilifeform speaking of everything -else-
16:22 asciilifeform other lifeforms that don't have a zoo ready to house them gratis
16:23 jurov what is "nato financial octopus"?
16:23 asciilifeform jurov: the loose set of all banks that play ball with usg, all locales where there isn't an icbm battery between you and usg, etc
16:24 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23100 @ 0.00039383 = 9.0975 BTC [-] {3}
16:24 cazalla BingoBoingo, maybe should've saved the utorrent forum complaints.. forum offline now lol
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16:25 asciilifeform trinque: the hypothetical 'mutual assistance' org you suggest would roughly resolve to a 'society for let's we all get filthy rich, and not warren-buffet-usg-rich either, but mircea_popescu-rich'
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16:25 BingoBoingo cazalla: I missed that window
16:25 asciilifeform which is generally not how it works.
16:25 trinque well not mutual assistance and not an org
16:25 asciilifeform anyone who offers to 'help you get rich' in specifically these terms is either a imbecile or sc4mz0r
16:25 trinque for example if there was a tiny rasp-pi sized lisp machine, I think that'd be sellable
16:26 trinque I don't want help; I have my own businesses
16:26 trinque point being that no matter what's going on in the world at large, there are products to sell
16:26 asciilifeform trinque: a pocket-sized fission power plant would also be 'sellable'
16:26 trinque asciilifeform: your cardano, perfect example
16:26 trinque asciilifeform: sure but that's hyperbolic compared to "I can attach this to a printer, card scanner, whatever, and it does what it is told"
16:27 asciilifeform trinque: if you don't understand that this costs ~$trillion and requires a sovereign country in your pocket, you have not thought the matter through.
16:27 asciilifeform i might exaggerate slightly, but at any rate it won't be accomplished by a fella with a day job.
↖
16:28 trinque asciilifeform: sure; yet I think people forget millions can be made owning a chain of car washes
16:28 trinque geniuses especially
16:28 asciilifeform trinque: 'millions can be made' doing nothing but snorting coke
16:28 asciilifeform if you're a u.s. blue-blood
16:31 trinque ehhh, you can still start businesses in the US
16:31 trinque you just have to be willing to starve
16:31 trinque and/or to lower yourself a bit
16:32 trinque plenty of retards out there owning strip clubs, parking garages, snow plow companies
16:32 trinque and also in particular, astoundingly shitty software companies that can be bested without much effort
16:35 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16000 @ 0.0003986 = 6.3776 BTC [+] {2}
16:36 trinque along those lines I am really starting to consider moving back to TX
16:36 trinque no state income tax, cheap-as-hell rent
16:36 trinque *booming* economy
~ 15 minutes ~
16:52 asciilifeform trinque: i'll be the last to disagree that it's still possible, today, to squeeze out a 'living' doing something in usa. question is how long it will remain true, for one's particular profession, for particular locale (do you like drilling for oil?), etc
16:54 asciilifeform trinque: also understand that even if you get 'usa-rich' it does not automatically translate to freeworld-rich.
16:54 asciilifeform (see the numerous old 'exit tax' threads here and elsewhere)
16:56 mircea_popescu asciilifeform http://trilema.com/2015/a-sjsqd-walks-into-a-pub/#comment-112528
16:56 assbot A sjsqd walks into a pub... pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg2Fbg )
17:00 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i like PeterL's suggestion
17:00 mircea_popescu it's not bad.
17:00 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: though i still insist that 'red' cryptomaterial should not touch the networked box
17:00 asciilifeform that is, the extant wallet&node combo kitchen-toilet is pure lunacy
17:01 mircea_popescu surely.
17:02 mircea_popescu ideally you want exactly what ben_vulpes was proposing : a node server with a wallet client
17:02 asciilifeform every node is already a 'wallet client'
17:02 mircea_popescu but even admitting this were done correctly, the problem still remains of what txn the client should order broadcast.
17:02 asciilifeform (in that it can swallow a tx if fed)
17:03 mircea_popescu asciilifeform kinda how sane people use this : wallet on a system behind a node system in a nat.
17:03 mircea_popescu !up sjsqd
17:03 sjsqd hi
17:03 mircea_popescu hello.
17:04 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6085 @ 0.00039974 = 2.4324 BTC [+]
17:04 sjsqd was trying to sign up for your site but it forwards to a blank page
17:04 mircea_popescu what exactly did you do ?
17:04 sjsqd otherwise still also trying to read through 6 months of IRC logs haha
17:04 sjsqd put in my email and 10,000 credits and pressed submit
17:05 mircea_popescu hm. that's odd, it shouldn't do that.
17:05 sjsqd the page that shows as being blank = http://trilema.com/wp-content/themes/trilema/trilema_credits.php
17:05 assbot Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg469E )
17:09 mircea_popescu do you have redirects disabled maybe ?
17:09 mircea_popescu also, make sure you typed the email address correctly.
17:10 mircea_popescu $ curl -IL http://trilema.com/wp-content/themes/trilema/trilema_credits.php | more
17:10 assbot Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg4YuM )
17:10 mircea_popescu HTTP/1.1 302 Moved Temporarily
17:10 mircea_popescu Location: http://trilema.com
17:10 assbot Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg4XqR )
17:11 sjsqd email address is correct
17:11 sjsqd and I don't think I have redirects disabled
17:15 sjsqd I tried a few different options on my computer but got the same result
17:16 mircea_popescu ahahaha you found a bug
17:16 mircea_popescu if you fill in with something other than 10k or with nothing at all it works.
17:16 mircea_popescu if however you explicitly specify the default...
17:16 mircea_popescu lmao
17:17 sjsqd haha
17:18 sjsqd I'm pretty sure I tried another figure but yes you're correct it works now
17:26 mircea_popescu sjsqd also, get in the wot.
17:27 sjsqd yes I will I briefly read about it earlier
17:27 sjsqd I've just had quite a few things on at the moment, otherwise I would be a bit more active
17:27 sjsqd but I do find this channel and the websites/sources surrounding it interesting
17:31 mircea_popescu !up airgapped
17:32 airgapped mircea_popescu: thanks
17:32 airgapped http://airgapped.net/2015/03/building-bitcoin-node-on-raspberry-pi-2/
17:32 assbot Building Bitcoin node on Raspberry Pi 2 | Airgapped ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg7L7e )
17:32 mircea_popescu sure.
17:33 airgapped ^ including for reference, may be usefull for someone
17:34 mircea_popescu i don't recall why we didn't like the pi for this purpoise, but it's in teh logs.
17:34 trinque paging asciilifeform
17:35 airgapped this one is new, more RAM, so far rock solid
17:35 mircea_popescu how much ram does it have now ? 4g ?
17:36 airgapped 1g
17:36 danielpbarron looks like it's just more expensive
17:36 trinque mystery binary blob drivers are required to run the thing
17:36 danielpbarron the pogo is < 20 USD
17:36 airgapped working on pogo as we speak
17:36 mircea_popescu danielpbarron more a case of "there's all these people who got pis because excitement, now have nothing to use them for", i thought,
17:36 mircea_popescu so in that sense, it costs zero.
17:37 airgapped yes, the blob is there
17:37 mircea_popescu yeah, that's what it was.
17:37 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 46 @ 0.03400002 = 1.564 BTC [-] {2}
17:37 danielpbarron airgapped, you might be intrested in this -> http://danielpbarron.com/pogo/howto.txt
17:37 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg8sxe )
17:37 airgapped so for me this is also temp solution
17:37 mircea_popescu the pi is currently being worked on as a first example of a fully fits in head machine.
17:38 mircea_popescu sorry i mean the pogo not the pi
17:38 airgapped thanks will look at it
17:38 danielpbarron still a work in progress, see also the root directory of that file
17:38 airgapped also on my desk VoCore
17:38 airgapped next in line
17:39 mircea_popescu airgapped you should prolly get in the wot while at it.
17:39 airgapped danielpbarron: nice, mised it in the logs
17:39 cazalla ;;later tell bingoboingo enjoy :) i didn't end up drinking last night so no issues there
17:39 gribble The operation succeeded.
17:40 airgapped I'm in the wot
17:40 danielpbarron airgapped, the WoT forked
17:40 mircea_popescu !gettrust airgapped
17:40 assbot airgapped is not registered in WoT.
17:41 airgapped OK, so I need some help
17:41 mircea_popescu <airgapped> I'm in the wot < since when ?
17:41 airgapped registered few days ago
17:41 mircea_popescu airgapped http://wiki.bitcoin-assets.com/irc_bots/assbot <
17:41 assbot irc_bots:assbot [bitcoin assets wiki] ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg8Xrk )
17:41 danielpbarron he did it the gribble way
17:42 mircea_popescu if you were in gribble pre 2015, you were imported. otherwise, gotta reg your key with assbot.
17:42 airgapped have registered it with gribble
17:42 airgapped should do the same with assbot?
17:43 mircea_popescu so then it's halfa minute. yeah, see the link for commands.
17:43 airgapped thanks, will do
17:44 pete_dushenski purim scoop: http://www.contravex.com/2015/03/06/signing-a-shoe-is-the-same-as-signing-the-papers/
17:44 assbot Signing a shoe is the same as signing the papers. | Contravex: A blog by Pete Dushenski ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg9mKe )
17:47 airgapped !register 178BF6EEA4C3A737F70878AC5E40172FEBBA0713
17:47 assbot Searching pgp.mit.edu for key with fingerprint: 178BF6EEA4C3A737F70878AC5E40172FEBBA0713. This may take a few moments.
17:47 assbot Key EBBA0713 / "airgapped <airgapped@countermail.com>" successfully imported.
17:47 assbot Registration successful.
17:47 pete_dushenski eh wd.
17:48 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 27 @ 0.03753703 = 1.0135 BTC [+] {2}
17:48 pete_dushenski airgapped i'm guessing https://twitter.com/airgapped is you ?
17:48 assbot Airgapped (@airgapped) | Twitter ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bg9REh )
17:50 airgapped pete_dushenski: yes
17:50 danielpbarron !v assbot:danielpbarron.rate.airgapped.1:b3f7991004a4bbbbd349279c39bb1e5431f940bcc8e103b36d37d3d83b3ae7f6
17:50 assbot Successfully added a rating of 1 for airgapped with note: Working on the pogo thing.
17:50 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7008 @ 0.00039911 = 2.797 BTC [-]
17:51 airgapped danielpbarron: thanks
17:51 pete_dushenski airgapped cool.
17:51 pete_dushenski airgapped so what's your background ?
17:51 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17100 @ 0.00040988 = 7.0089 BTC [+] {4}
17:52 airgapped embedded, crypto
17:53 pete_dushenski crypto i get, but what's 'embedded' ?
17:54 airgapped embedded microcontrolers
17:54 airgapped ARM based mostly
17:56 mircea_popescu !rate airgapped 1 New blood
17:56 assbot Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/48cd0483320774d1
17:56 pete_dushenski ah neat.
17:56 mircea_popescu !v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.airgapped.1:9fdc995fb92b89f46ae90459ad60e2b6c87f4627292744d93d9e0c7c8f3f0be7
17:56 assbot Successfully added a rating of 1 for airgapped with note: New blood
17:57 mircea_popescu ;;later tell peterl since you asked : http://trilema.com/2015/fderp-janyary-february-2015-combined-statement/
17:57 assbot F.DERP Janyary - February 2015 Combined Statement pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1BgaYUc )
17:57 gribble The operation succeeded.
17:57 mike_c heh, i kind of like that better. "janyary"
17:57 pete_dushenski airgapped so are you working in the field currently ? or is this more of a hobby of yours ?
17:58 jurov <mircea_popescu> i don't recall why we didn't like the pi for this purpois << alf proclaimed it as depending on binary turd (that supposedly leaks key material by any channel conceivable), thus unworthy
17:59 jurov oh and mircea_popescu withdrawals pls
17:59 airgapped pete_dushenski: working, I specialize in "secure" microcontrolers
↖
18:00 pete_dushenski is there such a thing as 'secure' arm ?
18:01 pete_dushenski i'm under the impression, though hardly an expert, that there isn't.
18:06 pete_dushenski http://qntra.net/2015/03/14-bidders-34-bids-in-latest-usms-bitcoin-auction/#comment-13004 << first i've heard of 'coin'
18:06 assbot 14 Bidders 34 Bids In Latest USMS Bitcoin Auction | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1GrQ7lA )
18:08 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8700 @ 0.00041098 = 3.5755 BTC [+]
18:09 mike_c you just haven't heard the name. it's the winklevii etf.
18:10 pete_dushenski o that's right.
18:11 pete_dushenski lol kinda even funnier now
18:11 mike_c yeah :)
18:11 pete_dushenski i thought it was some white-list or something
18:11 pete_dushenski or other 2.0 thing
18:15 pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044120 << burn baby burn.
18:15 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 03:30:18; mircea_popescu: and that is, joining the wot early, and helping set the world on fire. it. strictly it.
18:16 scoopbot New post on Trilema by Mircea Popescu: http://trilema.com/2015/fderp-janyary-february-2015-combined-statement/
18:16 thestringpuller its a canadian eh?
18:17 pete_dushenski lol hey man.
18:17 pete_dushenski http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044256 << this is no surprise, people watch tv, eat at mcd's, etc.
18:17 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 16:31:33; nubbins`: chetty it amazes me that people still carry non-wiped devices over int'l borders
18:17 pete_dushenski 'people'
18:19 jurov well... if i wasn't on this chan, i'd easily ended up carrying any to/from canada
18:20 jurov wiping both my ntb and phone would appear completely insane to me
18:20 kakobrekla if you werent on this chan you could actually carry it as well hehe
18:21 jurov wut?
18:21 pete_dushenski are you calling him a fat desk-jockey ?
18:21 kakobrekla well, now you are flagged suspekterorista
18:22 danielpbarron what is to wipe on a phone that they don't already have? It's not like my keys are on the thing
18:22 pete_dushenski pictures of yourself ripping bongs ?
18:23 danielpbarron is that incriminating? could be anything in that bong!
18:23 danielpbarron also, they already have those pictures, presumably
18:23 pete_dushenski i'm pretty sure traveling is incriminating
18:24 jurov but really, do they routinely rummage through photos and documents? and when i have virtualbox on desktop, will they ask me to fire all the vms, too?
18:24 pete_dushenski 'you're going to join isis! i know it!'
18:24 pete_dushenski jurov nah, it's just people getting fussed about the theatre
18:25 pete_dushenski it's obvious that airport security is about as meaningfully useful as curtains on a submarine
18:25 danielpbarron what if i'm caught traveling with my private key ascii armored and printed on a sheet of paper? do they even know well enough to ask for a passphrase?
18:25 kakobrekla at this stage they wont check vms as they are pretending to check if device is real device or real bomb only.
18:25 jurov inb4 virtualized bombs
18:26 kakobrekla its anal rape half way only
↖
18:26 kakobrekla !s enemy half
18:26 assbot 5 results for 'enemy half' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=enemy+half
18:27 kakobrekla its there
18:27 danielpbarron not that it matters, but telling a passphrase should surely be considered "testifying against yourself"
18:30 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5850 @ 0.00039911 = 2.3348 BTC [-]
18:33 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9100 @ 0.00039765 = 3.6186 BTC [-] {2}
18:36 asciilifeform "secure" microcontrolers << ugh
18:36 pete_dushenski my impression as well, if based on your impression ;)
18:37 asciilifeform no srsly, not much special expertise needed to see why this is an Intrinsically Bad Idea (TM)
18:39 asciilifeform if 'secure' but not user-verifiable, the only people against whom it attempts security is: you. the owner.
18:39 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8893 @ 0.00038911 = 3.4604 BTC [-] {3}
18:40 pete_dushenski and are arm inherently not user verifiable ?
18:40 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: ic is inherently nonverifiable
18:40 asciilifeform if you own electron microscope and have a couple of years free, and wish to do nothing else - then yes, possibly verifiable.
18:40 asciilifeform doesn't matter if 'arm' or whatever.
18:41 asciilifeform it is absolutely essential, to understand what is being spoken of here, to go back to the thread about the specificity of hardware-diddling.
↖ ↖
18:41 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9300 @ 0.0003873 = 3.6019 BTC [-] {2}
18:41 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=19-02-2015#1024428 and below
18:41 assbot Logged on 19-02-2015 04:39:24; asciilifeform: decimation: a diddled die of 100 gates in a tiled matrix will do what, exactly ?
18:42 asciilifeform for the benefit of n00bs, i will briefly elaborate
↖
18:42 asciilifeform say the enemy is baking custom silicon -just to slip into my supply lines-
18:42 asciilifeform say he can design anything, within reason, just in time
18:42 kakobrekla !up airgapped
18:43 asciilifeform his options depend on what i (think i am) buying
18:43 asciilifeform if i'm buying a general-purpose cpu, and he does not have a precise bitwise knowledge of what i intend to run on it, his options are rather limited
18:43 airgapped kakobrekla: thanks
18:44 asciilifeform though if he can get a real-time covert channel into my unit, he can perhaps accomplish something with a simple 'hidden debug' trick
18:44 asciilifeform if i'm buying 'fpga', and he doesn't have the exact bitstream, he's more or less shit out of luck
18:44 asciilifeform but let's reverse course and suppose that i'm buying a very specific crypto asic
18:44 asciilifeform that, say, cranks 8192-bit rsa.
18:44 asciilifeform and nothing else.
18:45 asciilifeform or, better yet, generates keys for such.
18:45 asciilifeform then the question of what changes he ought to slip into the masks at the fab becomes absolutely trivial
18:45 asciilifeform as in, undergrad-level problem.
18:45 asciilifeform because he is no longer firing at a 'moving target' but a bull's eye, so to speak.
18:46 asciilifeform to make long story short (i am quite uncertain that making it longer will improve the understanding of anyone who does not already grasp the above) -
18:47 asciilifeform if you're buying dedicated 'crypto' silicon, on your own free will - you are a moron;
18:47 pete_dushenski so the more specific the task of the chip, as is moreso the case with arm then general-purpose cpu, the easier it is to attack
18:47 asciilifeform if you're selling it, having understood the above line of reasoning and can offer no meaningful counter - you are a scammer.
↖
18:47 asciilifeform if you are neither of these things, it is still useful to know who is one of these two things.
18:47 airgapped asciilifeform: fully agree secure micro does not exists whatever some may claim
18:48 asciilifeform airgapped: not merely 'not exists'
18:48 asciilifeform is -intrinsic- snake oil
18:48 asciilifeform like perpetuum mobile
18:48 asciilifeform or 'free energy machine' as they tend to be called now
18:48 airgapped yes, you ar eright
18:48 asciilifeform airgapped: and yet you introduced this as your line of work? care to justify ?
18:49 asciilifeform if somebody walks in and 'i drop screaming nuns out of helicopters for their insurance money' there'd better be a good story at least.
18:50 airgapped working with microcontrolers
18:50 airgapped adding crypto blocks/accelerators
18:51 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044590
18:51 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 22:59:43; airgapped: pete_dushenski: working, I specialize in "secure" microcontrolers
18:51 asciilifeform airgapped: and it never once occurred to you that it was not an entirely honest line of work ?
18:51 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9682 @ 0.00040821 = 3.9523 BTC [+]
18:52 airgapped yes they call it secure but I fully agree these are just micros with crypto accelertion
18:53 airgapped trully secure processor does not exists
18:53 asciilifeform airgapped: you still appear to be talking about it as something that could exist in essentially the same form pushed by scammers
18:54 asciilifeform rather than an object that -categorically- does not exist, like a box inside which 1 == 2.
18:55 airgapped no I have no illusion that secure processor exists
18:55 asciilifeform airgapped: let's take your word. why, then, do you spend your days working on a problem to which the answer cannot exist ?
↖
18:56 airgapped the only option is airgapped machine and nothing beyod
18:56 asciilifeform ^ doesn't answer my question
18:57 airgapped interest in crypto algorithms and practical implementaitons
18:59 airgapped translating crypto/math into implementaion running on small machines
19:00 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: 'raspberry pi' << terrible machine for the money, plus long history of disinformation and hype bordering on outright fraud: >> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=01-03-2014#540882 http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=22-01-2015#988359 etc
19:00 assbot Logged on 01-03-2014 22:42:52; asciilifeform: re: raspberry pi: the news item is - a sham
19:00 assbot Logged on 22-01-2015 21:52:21; asciilifeform: 'raspberry?' terrible, terrible i/o. ethernet on same usb as the storage. no thanks.
19:01 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: and deliberately pseudo-open architecture (runs linux, sure, but with massive closed blobs required even to boot. and vendor regularly pays media mouthpieces to lie about it; also posts astroturfed comments)
↖ ↖ ↖ ↖
19:03 asciilifeform jurov: ...that supposedly leaks key material by any channel conceivable << i never suggested any specific channel.
19:04 asciilifeform jurov: recall mircea_popescu's 'act from cause not towards purpose' heuristic? it applies here
19:04 airgapped asciilifeform: ever looked at VoCore?
19:04 asciilifeform jurov: we don't need to know -precisely- what kind of rape broadcom intends for us
19:04 asciilifeform jurov: for all we know, ver.1 doesn't even come with a raper
19:05 asciilifeform jurov: just built to get us in the rape pens quicker.
19:05 asciilifeform !s vocore
19:05 assbot 3 results for 'vocore' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=vocore
19:05 asciilifeform ^ was discussed here before
19:06 asciilifeform airgapped: if you want to carry out crypto on a chip with built-in radio, be my guest
19:06 asciilifeform i'll pass.
19:06 airgapped have one but it also contains bin blobs
19:06 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=18-03-2014#564580 << thread
19:06 assbot Logged on 18-03-2014 01:19:43; asciilifeform: our friends at ft. meade call this 'NONSTOP'
19:07 asciilifeform in this case it doesn't even matter whether there are blobs
19:07 asciilifeform thing's a 'submarine with screen door'
19:08 asciilifeform doesn't even matter if the radio is switched on
19:08 asciilifeform and if you went to school and they didn't teach why this is, go and get your money back
19:09 airgapped we are running out of options here
19:11 airgapped I have been loking for minimal node for some time but there is no good option it seems
19:12 asciilifeform !s pogo
19:12 assbot 194 results for 'pogo' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=pogo
19:12 asciilifeform ^ small 'nas' computer available in usa for < 20 usd; reasonably-well-understood leaked chip docs; reasonable performance
19:12 asciilifeform not perfect by any means, but a number of folks here are experimenting with it
19:13 airgapped yes, will try this one
19:13 asciilifeform for the lack of a clearly superior 'bang for the buck' elsewhere
19:13 asciilifeform !up airgapped
19:14 asciilifeform there is some conflation of unrelated things here
19:14 asciilifeform bitcoin node is not really a cryptographically-sensitive device
19:14 asciilifeform (assuming one does not partake in the braindamage of using a node as a wallet)
19:15 mircea_popescu shit.
19:15 mircea_popescu janyary my foot! omg! I GOT BUGS! THEY'RE MULTYPLYYNG
19:15 mircea_popescu an' i'm losing control...
19:16 airgapped what i'm looking for is just a node, wallet is out of scope
19:17 airgapped I'm running it on latest rp but pogo looks like good alternative
19:18 asciilifeform airgapped: read the #b-a logs, there is a wealth of material on the subject
19:18 airgapped I will, danielpbarron already pointed out his notes
19:19 cazalla asciilifeform, i read orlov's post soviet lessons.. article last night and my impression is that some of what he predicts relies on suggestion we've passed peak oil, but then i have read elsewhere peak oil has been debunked or that we're not even close to passing it.. can you share thoughts? not much turns up in logs
19:19 asciilifeform cazalla: the 'debunkings' are crude sham jobs to put the plebes to sleep
19:20 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11515 @ 0.00038955 = 4.4857 BTC [-] {2}
19:20 mircea_popescu cazalla it is elementary that if you keep taking out of a sack and never adding, eventually you run out.
19:20 asciilifeform cazalla: it is worth your while to become acquainted with the actual theory (vs the popular disinfo presentation of it) - rather than 'running out of oil', considerably more complicated (approximately, running out of -economical- oil)
19:20 mircea_popescu whetrher you care or not - entirely different discussion.
19:21 asciilifeform likewise, 'running out' is a broad stroke
19:21 asciilifeform implies the price going from reasonable to $maxint overnight, or the like
19:22 asciilifeform actual reality of nonrewables exhaustion is considerably more interesting
19:22 mircea_popescu for that matter... it turns out there's not enough rare earths on earth to make an ipad for each person alive.
19:22 cazalla mircea_popescu, whether you care or not would be influenced if you are to run out tomorrow or 100-200 years from now though
19:22 asciilifeform (price spike - not necessarily large, economic convulsions leading to 'demand destruction', price drops, useless mouths resume proliferating, etc. rinse&repeat)
19:22 asciilifeform cazalla: again, 'run out' is a dodge concept
19:23 mircea_popescu cazalla this decade is out of the question.
19:23 asciilifeform no mineral 'runs out' like the air in a diver's tank
19:23 mircea_popescu but once the saudi flood is done, imo that's it, oil will only ever be expensive.
19:23 mircea_popescu asciilifeform oil is not a mineral in this sense tho.
19:24 mircea_popescu you can't run out of carbon, ie, the element. but you can run out of, say, sugar. venus is a fine example.
19:24 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: 'mineral - wrong word, yes. meant 'полезные ископаемые' in general
19:24 asciilifeform approx. 'useful shit to dig up'
19:24 asciilifeform implies that you can dig up economically
19:24 mircea_popescu vespene gas
19:24 cazalla vespene gas actually works well considering what an end game of broodwar looked like once it ran out
19:25 mircea_popescu cazalla anyway, practically, the peak oil thing is a lot less interesting now that electric cars have been demonstrated than 20 years ago. (dunno if you know, but this has been a fringe theory for > 50, almost 100 years by now)
19:25 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: moves the mineral question to the storage battery
19:25 mircea_popescu yes, but that is considerably less explored a space.
19:25 asciilifeform (as well as the rest of the electro-junk in there)
19:26 mircea_popescu also, lithium, blessfully, is a lowly element.
19:26 asciilifeform Li isn't especially abundant in economically recoverable form
19:26 mircea_popescu that can change.
19:26 cazalla mircea_popescu, it's not that i'm interested in it (or would understand/appreciate the issue tbh) but it seemed obvious way to poke a hole in orlov's prediction, at least that it might occur in my lifetime anyway
19:26 asciilifeform if gonna fuse H to get it, may as well do it right in the car...
19:27 mircea_popescu asciilifeform "if you're gonna fuck, might as well make the chick you're fucking in the same go" ?
19:27 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: if you know how, then yes!
19:27 mircea_popescu nuts.
19:27 asciilifeform cazalla: most of orlov's mechanics apply to any kind of anglo world collapse, not necessarily 'petro-flavoured'
19:29 asciilifeform incidentally
19:29 asciilifeform the (very old!) nickel-iron battery is superior to Li (and all other extant chemistries) in all respects but energy density
19:30 asciilifeform virtually indestructible
19:30 mircea_popescu speaking of which, S.CARS would be pretty cool. a company that a) aspires atmospheric H2, b) fuses it into Li c) which it uses to make car batteries while d) the energy so produced it uses to make the cars and fill them up.
19:30 asciilifeform iirc there are 100+ year old examples which still function as rated!
19:30 mircea_popescu prolly not even cost a trillion.
19:30 mircea_popescu asciilifeform not to mention the earth is about 80% nickel and iron by mass.
19:31 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it also laughs at deep-cycling, overcharging, heat, vibration...
19:31 asciilifeform but as ancient tech, for some reason not of interest to any existing manufacturer outside of china
19:31 asciilifeform (where it is used in farm equipment, iirc)
19:31 mircea_popescu you know, i'd like to read a sf novel which explores a future where technology has re-arranged deep magma of earth into a humongo battery
19:32 cazalla related to running out of something.. techcrunch reports yesterday's bitcoin auction was the last of dpr's coins.. bloomberg quote usms as saying otherwise
19:32 mircea_popescu and the human civilisation is organised around the implicit currency of "Stored joules"
19:32 mircea_popescu cazalla hardest thing for a fraudster is to keep the story straight.
19:33 asciilifeform ;;google nickel-iron battery
19:33 gribble nickel iron battery information: <http://www.nickel-iron-battery.com/>; Nickel–iron battery - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nickel%E2%80%93iron_battery>; Nickel-Iron NiFe batteries by Iron Edison: <http://ironedison.com/>
19:33 asciilifeform ^ lol, is that an american firm?!
19:34 asciilifeform wonder what they charge.
19:36 mircea_popescu asciilifeform iirc decade old data, it cost about 2.5-3x as much but obviously you never had to replace anything.
19:36 asciilifeform aha
19:36 asciilifeform like mercedes.
19:36 mircea_popescu people generally went for the "cheaper" solutions that rarely last 5 years
19:37 asciilifeform same story as the rest of technocivilization
19:37 mircea_popescu right.
19:37 asciilifeform thing wants new electrolyte every 2-3 decades, but it costs pennies
19:37 mircea_popescu some of the cleverer dcs use them bnecause they're so very tolerant. which makes it the best heuristic to evaluate the operational wisdom of any dc.
19:38 mircea_popescu "do you have a basementfull of nife ?" "o yeah! shit rocks" vs "say wut ?"
19:39 mircea_popescu then they run for 4 years and have to replace the batteries, and run for another 2 and there's a lightning strike and have to replace them again. tru story.
19:39 asciilifeform standard Pb cells are good for 2-3 tops
19:39 asciilifeform (less if actually put to use)
19:39 mircea_popescu i don't think you may use pb anymore.
19:40 asciilifeform pretty much the only remaining use permitted worldwide is battery
19:40 mircea_popescu mno, actually being phased out, for years now.
19:40 asciilifeform hm must be eu thing
19:40 asciilifeform what did they decree? NiMH?
19:40 mircea_popescu im not really that up to date. prolly.
19:40 asciilifeform (in usa, cars, trucks, 'ups' - ~100% Pb)
19:41 mircea_popescu i wouldn't be so sure you'll get permits for new development in the us, eithert.
19:41 mircea_popescu this is a different discussion.
19:41 asciilifeform every ups vendor i know of is shipping chinese cells
19:41 mircea_popescu and new cars also don't really come with lead batteries.
19:41 asciilifeform haven't seen an auto shop yet that stocks anything but Pb battery
19:41 asciilifeform and was in one not long ago
19:41 mircea_popescu aftermarket diff story
19:42 asciilifeform possibly
19:42 * asciilifeform not diligent scholar of the subject
19:42 mircea_popescu anyway, to imagine the "ban smoking" thing is an isolated incident is naive. no, there's a shitton of these underway, continuously, and generally unreported.
19:43 asciilifeform one of the most famous idiocies was the light bulb thing
19:43 asciilifeform there is always some joker standing ready to take over from whatever widget is up for the ban hammer
19:43 mircea_popescu 3rd world killer basically.
19:44 mircea_popescu "O, you're now advanced enough where you could start some light industry ? fu!"
19:44 asciilifeform they're permitted industry, just under very... different terms
19:44 asciilifeform more belgian-rubber.
19:45 mircea_popescu right. the tlp described phenomenon of "oh, this class of medicine is now generic ? guess what, on a review of the data available it turns out it wasn't effective anyway, so we're using Y now instead".
19:45 asciilifeform pharma sop
19:45 mircea_popescu it's not just medicine. it's pretty much everything.
19:45 asciilifeform i'll add that virtually 100% of r&d investment by extant pharma firms is precisely this and only this
19:45 asciilifeform 'find a place to stick an extra methyl where it won't matter but now patentable'
19:48 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044250 << holy shit this is the stupidest thing ever. srsly, cpu mining ?
19:48 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 15:37:55; BingoBoingo: http://forum.utorrent.com/topic/95041-warning-epicscale-riskware-silently-installed-with-latest-utorrent/
19:50 mircea_popescu ;;later tell bingoboingo that epicscale debacle prolly qntrable.
19:50 gribble The operation succeeded.
19:50 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it's on qntra alrady
19:50 asciilifeform *already
19:50 mircea_popescu ah nm :)
19:50 asciilifeform http://qntra.net/2015/03/crapware-still-bundles-mining-software
19:50 assbot Crapware Still Bundles Mining Software | Qntra.net ... ( http://bit.ly/18YutHR )
19:51 mircea_popescu sveet.
~ 15 minutes ~
20:06 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7931 @ 0.00038574 = 3.0593 BTC [-]
20:10 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3661 @ 0.00038574 = 1.4122 BTC [-]
20:13 cazalla http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/07/world/europe/german-law-requires-more-women-on-corporate-boards.html?_r=0
20:13 assbot Log In - The New York Times ... ( http://bit.ly/18YwKCU )
20:14 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2942 @ 0.00038508 = 1.1329 BTC [-] {2}
20:14 mircea_popescu nuts.
20:15 mircea_popescu the demographics of qntra readership as depicted by quantcast never cease to amaze me.
20:17 mike_c apparently we're all asian men 25-34
20:17 cazalla what's behind the push for such things?
20:17 cazalla maybe qntra needs quotas so that 30% of readers are women
20:17 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044298 << it's so appalingly dumb tho. cpu bitcoin miner would barely make any satoshi.
20:17 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 19:03:35; asciilifeform: 'join our botnet voluntarily, save orphans!'
20:18 mircea_popescu mike_c politically active, politically unafilliated, filthy rich, mostly azn, some caucasian.
20:18 mircea_popescu (in fact it's mostly white with more asian than "normal", which considering the normal is gawker-and-wikipedia dumbternets... )
20:19 mircea_popescu mike_c anyway, the demographic that supposedly "doesn'ty exist" and "doesn't matter" and "never wins elections" and so on and so forth.
20:19 mike_c it'll be interesting to see it after another couple 10x bumps
20:20 cazalla what's the other in race demo? jews?
20:20 mircea_popescu prolly, judging by how it looks.
20:21 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: cpu bitcoin miner would barely make any satoshi << cargocult
20:21 mircea_popescu i dun get it, honest.
20:21 asciilifeform also - until we hear otherwise - safe to assume that it was mining a crackpot alt
20:21 asciilifeform (they typically do nowadays)
20:21 mircea_popescu they specifically said bitcoin tho
20:21 asciilifeform hm.
20:21 mircea_popescu but yes, thisd would make sense, with some shitty alt.
20:21 asciilifeform then unadulterated idiocy
20:22 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7415 @ 0.00038588 = 2.8613 BTC [+]
20:23 mircea_popescu btw, anyone put together the "usg will target ammunition rather than small arms" with the "various agencies bought and stored millions of rounds at the beginning of this decade" to come to a "usg will ban ammunition period" thing yet ?
20:23 mircea_popescu as in, they are actually making rounds the future currency ?
20:23 asciilifeform lol not deliberately
20:24 mircea_popescu usg survival plan once shtf ? "well...we got the largest stores of ammo of anyone...so..."
20:24 asciilifeform even to have it happen by accident would require some sort of standardization
20:24 mircea_popescu why ? they banned smoking alright
20:24 mircea_popescu over the dead bodies of smokers.
20:24 asciilifeform iirc most of the famous stockpile is '.40', a caliber unpopular outside of usg afaik
20:25 asciilifeform (pistol round)
20:25 mircea_popescu honestly i'd have stored .5 AP
20:25 asciilifeform http://www.firearmstalk.com/images/3/9/0/8/3/thumb2_rounds-178.jpg
20:25 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1H9snQL )
20:25 asciilifeform ^ center
20:25 asciilifeform was, iirc, designed specially for usg
20:26 mircea_popescu http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/04/50_AE_and_32_ACP.jpg/275px-50_AE_and_32_ACP.jpg there.
20:26 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1H9sAmU )
20:27 mircea_popescu except the thing pictured is not a proper ap round.
20:27 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: are you sure you were thinking of -this- .50 ?
20:27 mircea_popescu no, it's what wikipedia had.
20:27 asciilifeform rather than what is called .50 bmg in usa
20:27 asciilifeform (the one found worldwide, actually used in everything from light aircraft to sniper)
20:28 asciilifeform http://www.gunslot.com/files/gunslot/images/52467.jpg << that one
20:28 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/18Yyf45 )
20:28 mircea_popescu apparently the de .5 ap, explosive, incendiary etc rounds are secret on internet.en ?
20:29 mircea_popescu asciilifeform the bmg is a machine gun round not a pistol round
20:31 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: in english-speaking world 'weirdo' rounds (explode, flechette, etc.) are generally made for '12' shotgun
20:31 mircea_popescu anyway, the thing is just on the margin : the common "action express" .5 round is generally stopped by a level 3 and always by a level 4 vest.
20:31 mircea_popescu but the ap variant cuts through any practical armor, and generally can be used against lightly armored aircraft as well.
20:32 asciilifeform fire at aircraft from pistol barrel, lol!
20:32 mircea_popescu sure.
20:32 asciilifeform where, at the airfield ?
20:32 asciilifeform walk up to it?
20:32 mircea_popescu urban warfare baby.
20:33 asciilifeform the .5 pistol is considered a 'crackpot' curio in usa
20:33 asciilifeform (not sure about elsewhere)
20:33 mircea_popescu it's hard to fire for womenz.
20:33 asciilifeform sorta reminiscent of the late-medieval 'hand cannone'
20:34 mircea_popescu it is just about at the tolerance level of a physically elite man.
20:34 asciilifeform why not at least give it a wooden folding stock like the old 'mauser'
20:34 mircea_popescu lol
20:34 asciilifeform even 'elite' pistolero has wrists, they aren't made of stone
20:34 mircea_popescu by the time you're shooting this it supposedly no longer matters.
20:35 mircea_popescu anyway, pointless stock. if you can use stocked stuff just get a carbine or something.
20:35 asciilifeform http://www.lonesentry.com/articles/jp_tankhunters/fig1_japanese_lunge_mine_antitank.jpg << obligatory 'for when it no longer matters' weapon
20:35 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/18YyXye )
20:35 asciilifeform invented - unsurprisingly - in jp
20:36 mircea_popescu let's put it the other way : a sharp tungsten tipped .5 round is >20 bux.
20:37 mircea_popescu you can shoot through us style "walls" by ir with it just fine.
20:37 mircea_popescu now... how many wrists does 20 bux a round buy ?
20:37 asciilifeform you can shoot through u.s. 'walls' with almost anything
20:37 asciilifeform probably even arbalest.
20:38 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: speaking of small arms, are you familiar with (historic) 'gyrojet' ?
20:38 asciilifeform famous failed product (no one seems to agree precisely why failed) but very instructive re: yesterday's thread
20:39 mircea_popescu lol arbalest guerilla regiment. gastraphetes!
20:39 asciilifeform as it used a miniature rocket (approx. the size of .5 round...) which was fin-stabilized and rotated, it needed only a very simple firing mechanism and low-pressure barrel
20:39 asciilifeform (smooth of course)
20:39 mircea_popescu is this the french "rocket" fired from small arm ?
20:39 asciilifeform but functioned otherwise like a regular pistol
20:39 asciilifeform american
20:39 mircea_popescu that trivially ended up pushing against branches etc ?
20:39 asciilifeform nope
20:39 asciilifeform after a metre or so, went at same speed as regular round
20:40 asciilifeform so no good for shooting a fella in the head directly. but otherwise worked
20:40 asciilifeform today (and for some decades) it is a museum rarity (r. reagan, famously, owned one)
20:40 asciilifeform but i bring it up because of the 'low-tech small arms' thread
20:40 asciilifeform needs only very basic metallurgy
20:41 asciilifeform and can be scaled up arbitrarily
20:41 asciilifeform (being a rocket rather than cannon)
20:41 asciilifeform http://world.guns.ru/handguns/hg/usa/gyrojet-e.html
20:41 assbot Modern Firearms - Gyrojet ... ( http://bit.ly/18YzEHG )
20:41 asciilifeform ^ basic summary
20:41 mircea_popescu well... once the usd v2.0 pistol rounds thinkg takes form, we can make these :D
20:43 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044327 << note that there weren't nearly as many of these in 1995.
20:43 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 20:35:22; trinque: they can try; there are hordes of rednecks in the woods already stocked up for armageddon
20:43 mircea_popescu in a sense, the trying causes it.
20:43 asciilifeform http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20141024152906/starfrontiers/images/0/07/13mm_gyrojet_pistol_round.jpg << rocket
20:43 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1H9w9tp )
20:44 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044334 << nope, not yet. it still pays.
20:44 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 20:38:28; asciilifeform: if there were a 'rural militia' with above room-temperature iq, usa would already look like iraq
20:44 asciilifeform (looks like i misremembered re: fins)
20:44 mircea_popescu give it a week and a half of "we can no longer give you free stuff"
20:44 mircea_popescu remember that time when food stamp system ran out of funds, took a three day hiaturs, everyone held their breath ?
20:44 trinque nobody I was talking about collects food stamps
20:45 mircea_popescu that was the equivalent of the mike hearn "let's test bitcoin". the result came out kinda clearly - 9 maybe 10 days. that's it.
20:45 mircea_popescu trinque sure. but they're not the problem, either.
20:46 thestringpuller mircea_popescu: would like Francis Underwood if he were a real person.
20:46 mircea_popescu ;;ud Francis Underwood
20:46 gribble http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Francis+Underwood | Representative Francis J. “Frank” Underwood (born July 26, 1959) is the House Majority Whip and anti-hero of the hit Netflix original "House of Cards". He is, on ...
20:46 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4985 @ 0.00039876 = 1.9878 BTC [-]
20:47 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044342 << i think you grossly misunderstand it. yes, they'd love to be left alone, yes all of them could grow with no deliveries of anything.
20:47 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 20:41:27; asciilifeform: trinque: as i understand, this isn't ru circa 1917, the hypothetical rebels don't 'just want to be left alone' - not one in ten thousand is able to grow anything edible without regular deliveries of petrol, pesticides, etc.
20:47 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: you must be thinking of another usa on another alternate planet earth
20:48 thestringpuller mircea_popescu: i just think you'd admire someone who'd want to completely gut the welfare state
20:48 mircea_popescu recall, i actually spent months walking that place.
20:48 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: where ?
20:48 thestringpuller s/admire/respect
20:48 asciilifeform appalachia ?
20:48 mircea_popescu asciilifeform from boston to nuevo laredo, all the way.
20:48 trinque granted my parents farm might not be the most defensible place, but it *does* produce using about 1850s level tech
20:48 asciilifeform or perhaps where the amish are found ?
20:48 asciilifeform there are a few places with 'living fossils' yes
20:48 mircea_popescu i spent months going from town to town by bus.
20:48 trinque the place even has its own natural gas well, heh
20:48 trinque mircea_popescu: wow, very cool
20:49 mircea_popescu so it may be a case that YOU be thinking of another usa hm ? :D
20:49 asciilifeform trinque: the place even has its own natural gas well << realize that it turns the place into a non-negotiable military objective - read: target - rather than survival haven
20:49 mircea_popescu i thoughjt the discussion was "left alone"
20:50 mircea_popescu trinque chetty was with me!
20:50 trinque mircea_popescu: I want the book on your life someday.
20:50 trinque I'd probably have to learn romanian and read that part of trilema
20:51 asciilifeform my understanding (by no means perfect) is that the 'can produce and feed selves with 1850 tech' and 'armed for civil war' crowds are disjoint sets in usa
20:51 mircea_popescu lol. that'd work.
20:51 trinque asciilifeform: that part does probably rule out the place in particular
20:51 mircea_popescu asciilifeform used to be, 20 years ago.
20:51 mircea_popescu they broadly merged.
20:51 trinque my point was people can produce food
20:51 trinque the gas isn't involved in the food production
20:51 trinque just makes keeping the cows alive easier
20:52 asciilifeform trinque: the gas makes the spot a strategic objective for anyone with pretensions of keeping some basic tech going and any kind of army whatsoever
20:52 trinque no no, I concede that
20:52 mircea_popescu asciilifeform the scenario was "stop the trucks!"
20:52 asciilifeform (most likely whatever the largest and nearest usg fragment is)
20:53 trinque the trucks stop and they still eat, til someone comes for the natural gas
20:53 mircea_popescu well... maybe his uncle!
20:53 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: the short-term picture? sure
20:53 mircea_popescu thjis idea that the remnants automatically inherit the land is naive. one in ten is my experience.
20:54 asciilifeform usg doesn't need 'the land' (again ru-1917 thinking pattern) for much. only the gas wells, etc., industry, fields, slaves
20:55 mircea_popescu this idea that the remnants automatically inherit a chunk of the future is naive. one in ten is my experience.
20:56 asciilifeform probably not automatic, no
20:57 mircea_popescu the reason there even is a remnant in the first place - vz, the collapse - is that they didn't have enough virility in the system.
20:57 mircea_popescu it's not magically sprung up by the end. expect a good half of usg to just lay down and die, just like that.
20:57 asciilifeform but the folks with actual mil training (plus shoulder-launched antitank rockets, real-time satellite view, other goodies) will have a 'fair' fight with the others over it.
20:57 mircea_popescu expect the aspirational 20% to murder the rest of the 40% in the process of selecting the half of itself that may go on.
20:57 asciilifeform sop
20:57 mircea_popescu right. so... one in ten.
20:58 trinque so the stepdad's ex-mil and well armed/trained
20:58 mircea_popescu and 0% of the "responsibility to govern". if two dukedoms over someone makes clitoris stu, expect nobody to care.
20:58 trinque whatever that's worth in the situation
20:58 mircea_popescu trinque hence "<mircea_popescu> well... maybe his uncle!"
20:58 trinque what I'm gathering though is I have very little rational options beyond get rich, and do it now
↖
20:59 mircea_popescu that'd be the gist of it.
20:59 asciilifeform if two dukedoms over someone makes clitoris stu, expect nobody to care << the whole notion that someone must care, is a bizarre creation of the patients in usg asylum
20:59 mircea_popescu unlike at... no point in history, lol.
20:59 trinque heh, yeah
20:59 mircea_popescu asciilifeform aye.
20:59 * mircea_popescu delights in picturing the hordes of "awareness raisers".
21:00 mircea_popescu "have you raised any awareness today, brother ?"
21:00 trinque compulsively plugging dead phones into dead outlets over and over
21:05 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4401 @ 0.00039876 = 1.7549 BTC [-]
21:11 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11700 @ 0.00040964 = 4.7928 BTC [+] {2}
21:16 asciilifeform has anyone here managed to get adacore's 'gps' to run on anything other than winblows ?
21:16 asciilifeform (or so much as tried)
21:19 scoopbot New post on Qntra.net by cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/03/ross-ulbricht-seeks-new-trial/
21:27 decimation re: batteries < I've never heard of a non-Pb car battery http://corporate.interstatebatteries.com/msds/
21:27 assbot Safety Data Sheets (SDS) | Interstate Batteries, Inc. ... ( http://bit.ly/1GscbfJ )
21:32 decimation asciilifeform: re: gyrojet < lol "recoiless rifle" from your fist? Does the exhaust burn your eye out too?
~ 17 minutes ~
21:49 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044411 << "a whore floats in all weather".
21:49 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 21:00:46; danielpbarron: i'm probably in the *worst* place to be when this stuff goes down, although asciilifeform's locale doesn't sound very pleasant either
21:50 mircea_popescu location's really a secondary concern.
21:51 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044419 <<< fwiw, i watch films made in the past 20 years <1% of the time.
21:51 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 21:10:10; cazalla: the majority of movies are shit anyway so even if i had the time to watch them on the reg, they are not even worth pirating
21:51 mircea_popescu talk about a scavenger cult
21:54 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044435 << prolly good idea to make this policy now. archive and screenshot EVERYTHING.
21:54 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 21:24:35; cazalla: BingoBoingo, maybe should've saved the utorrent forum complaints.. forum offline now lol
21:54 mircea_popescu archive.today thing works fine.
21:55 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044436 << so what's the problem with that ?
21:55 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 21:25:02; asciilifeform: trinque: the hypothetical 'mutual assistance' org you suggest would roughly resolve to a 'society for let's we all get filthy rich, and not warren-buffet-usg-rich either, but mircea_popescu-rich'
21:56 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044448 << "slightly" :D
21:56 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 21:27:52; asciilifeform: i might exaggerate slightly, but at any rate it won't be accomplished by a fella with a day job.
22:03 danielpbarron http://danielpbarron.com/Avatar_X.txt "On why your comment was removed? Well, you decided to do a slight snide remark and at the same time promote another site. If you had just said: qntra is worth a look. they are more into articles and commentary though. Then you comment would be still there."
22:03 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1MdpbEF )
22:03 mircea_popescu wassat ?
22:05 danielpbarron a private thing between me and a moderator of "THE Bitcoin Community on Google+ since 2012"
22:05 mircea_popescu lol ok.
22:05 asciilifeform danielpbarron: wallowing with the eagles again, eh ?
22:05 decimation danielpbarron: someone uses google+ besides poettering?
22:05 danielpbarron i was surprised too, decimation
22:05 mircea_popescu there was a fetlife "btc" fetish group
22:06 mircea_popescu dead since... i dunno, 2013ish
22:06 danielpbarron i barely use the thing and i have 1/5 the "views" of Ethereum's page
22:07 decimation I came upon a google+ stat awhile ago in the logs: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=22-01-2015#987609
22:07 assbot Logged on 22-01-2015 04:54:20; decimation: lol http://www.businessinsider.com/google-active-users-2015-1 " In other words, 0.2-0.3% of all G+ profiles, about 4-6 million users, have made public posts in 2015. "
22:08 mircea_popescu i thought it was pretty much dead, goiung the way of te yahoo briefcase or w/e
22:08 decimation ;;calc 0.003*6000000
22:08 gribble 18000
22:08 asciilifeform counting supposed users is pure spamatronics anyway
22:08 danielpbarron if it's dead it's because mods like the one i talked to "remove posts and comments all the time and every single day."
22:10 decimation well, if the numbers above are in the right ballpark, google+ has the population of a county seat in rural kansas
22:11 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044628 << lol. ironically, it is!
22:11 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 23:26:21; kakobrekla: its anal rape half way only
22:11 mircea_popescu decimation i think you're doing it wrong. ~5mn made posts, of a total > 10bn profiles ?
22:12 decimation possibly, I read it the other way
22:12 scoopbot New post on Trilema by Mircea Popescu: http://trilema.com/2015/fderp-january-february-2015-combined-statement/
22:12 scoopbot New post on Trilema by Mircea Popescu: http://trilema.com/2015/mpif-fmpif-february-2015-statement/
22:12 decimation yeah upon re-reading the article you are right
22:13 mircea_popescu it just doesn't make sense for g+ to only have a few mn profiles for all the resoureces they poured into it.
22:13 decimation that's around the population of arizona
22:13 mircea_popescu more's the point, even that watsapp spam outfit had 100mn active.
22:14 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4000 @ 0.00040661 = 1.6264 BTC [-]
22:14 decimation yeah but that's a slightly different case right? in the sense that whatsapp enabled cross-platform communications?
22:15 * decimation has never used whatsapp nor ever plans to
22:17 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 2818 @ 0.00041098 = 1.1581 BTC [+]
22:17 mircea_popescu it's mostly a thirld world thing i gather.
22:17 * asciilifeform is just barely aware of what it was/is, and doesn't think he knows anyone who has seen much less used it
22:18 decimation but if they are simply piping sms from one network to another, than their 'user count' has the same significance as that which the bum who owns brooklyn bridge can claim
22:19 mircea_popescu it's an app.
22:19 mircea_popescu their user count has as much significance as princess leia's ex boyfriend count.
22:19 mircea_popescu not like anyone's marrying her anyway.
22:19 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044667 << arm is not actually "purpose built silicone".
22:19 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 23:47:26; asciilifeform: if you're selling it, having understood the above line of reasoning and can offer no meaningful counter - you are a scammer.
22:20 decimation jabba the hut has a purpose for her
22:20 mircea_popescu does he wear a hoodie ?
22:20 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: he specifically mentioned cryptoaccelerator modules
22:20 mircea_popescu a
22:20 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: (these are often included as coprocessor 'cores' on conventional cpu)
22:21 mircea_popescu and specifically disused by people serious about their crypto
22:21 asciilifeform the chip found in 'pogo', incidentally, has a somewhat dusty one
22:21 decimation asciilifeform: actually you could 'harden' a microcontroller against side channel attacks
22:21 asciilifeform and yes specifically disused
22:21 asciilifeform decimation: the manufacturer can claim to harden against attack. can even do so, to an extent. you - buyer - have no way to distinguish; not to learn what else is - or is not - inside
22:22 asciilifeform i seriously didn't imagine this being such a hard concept for folks to grasp
22:22 decimation asciilifeform: aye. nor could any amount of 'crypto module software' help
22:22 mircea_popescu lol alf giving airgapped guy an incredibly hard time
22:23 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044688 << cuz someone pays him toi.
22:23 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 23:55:48; asciilifeform: airgapped: let's take your word. why, then, do you spend your days working on a problem to which the answer cannot exist ?
22:23 mircea_popescu i know people who try to write novels. another problem for which the solution can not exist.
22:23 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i've no idea who he is, but he fit my expected pattern for the inevitably next mr yetmoarspam far too well
22:23 mircea_popescu you gotta learn to behead people after rather than before, you nut you.
22:23 mircea_popescu give love a chance!
22:23 asciilifeform if fella's any good he'll snap that head back on & rejoin
22:24 mircea_popescu if he's any bad, also.
22:24 asciilifeform lol
22:24 asciilifeform probably.
22:24 mircea_popescu why then doi you claim to solve a problem through a process through which no solution could be had!
22:25 asciilifeform hm?
22:25 mircea_popescu explicitly : what is the difference between him making secure crypto arms and you cutting random heads ?
22:25 asciilifeform wouldn't dream of trying to solve the particular problem in that thread
22:26 asciilifeform poor fella arrived just as i was thinking of attempting essay re: specificity-of-diddling
22:26 asciilifeform and ended up it
22:26 mircea_popescu lol.
22:26 mircea_popescu happens.
22:26 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=06-03-2015#1044644 << beginning of thread
22:26 assbot Logged on 06-03-2015 23:41:18; asciilifeform: it is absolutely essential, to understand what is being spoken of here, to go back to the thread about the specificity of hardware-diddling.
22:27 asciilifeform to borrow mircea_popescu's terminology, buying a dedicated, e.g., rsa silicon, communicates information to enemy which he has no business learning
22:27 asciilifeform regarding your intentions to compute rsa funktion
22:27 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-03-2015#1044696 << this is sadly such sop, i doubt most derps even register there's anything wrong with it.,
22:27 assbot Logged on 07-03-2015 00:01:46; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: and deliberately pseudo-open architecture (runs linux, sure, but with massive closed blobs required even to boot. and vendor regularly pays media mouthpieces to lie about it; also posts astroturfed comments)
22:27 asciilifeform 'raspberry' is egregious and famously so even among the other horrors
22:28 asciilifeform in, for example, the fact that the 'blob' does not merely initialize the hardware, but actually runs at all times on its own coprocessor
22:28 decimation asciilifeform: would you ever voluntarily use a broadcom chip for anything?
22:28 decimation asciilifeform: that's sop in every smartphone that exists
22:28 decimation can't even examine the blob
22:28 asciilifeform decimation: can't say that i would
22:30 asciilifeform 'from cause rather than from principle'
22:30 asciilifeform folks ask me questions like this in meatspace and i end up explaining that no, i do not necessarily know of a specific sin for that specific part number
22:30 asciilifeform but 'fruit of poison tree'
22:31 asciilifeform *rather than purpose
22:31 asciilifeform damnit
22:31 asciilifeform cause rather than purpose.
22:33 decimation yeah I get your point
22:33 asciilifeform now, i happen to have a large collection of hard (and soft) ware that i consider questionable. but it is kept around specifically for abusive experimentation rather than 'use' in the usual sense.
22:33 decimation hopefully one day you will be able to buy your matrix of logic cells from costco to feed into your Mr Fuser
22:34 * asciilifeform wishes he could name someone other than himself who is working on this problem, but cannot
22:35 decimation so prevailing 30 year fixed mortgage rates went from 3.5 to 4.0 in about 2 weeks
22:36 mircea_popescu clearly desperate bid to reign in inflation
22:36 decimation and 10 year treasuries went from %2.1 to %2.25 just today
22:36 mircea_popescu by now every fucking wikipedia entry containing a sum of dollars has to have a "x in 2013 dollars" affixed.
22:36 decimation all this is because usg released a report that said that 30k more people 'have jobs' and wages were flat
22:36 mircea_popescu no, all this because they're not stupid, and would like to not hang.
22:37 decimation which doesn't mean shit for actual economics but means alot for the magic fed decision meter
22:37 mircea_popescu i'm so curious if next mulatoo in chief actually finds a volcker v2.0
22:38 * asciilifeform wonders what the rate would have to be to cut off the chump flow
22:38 asciilifeform 100% ?
22:38 asciilifeform 1000?
22:39 decimation the problem is, if you raise rates to the 18% per annum that real estate prices in new york imply, you quickly find that usg is paying all its tax to debtors
22:40 mircea_popescu nah, my guess atm is 32.
22:40 mircea_popescu !up ponzi
22:40 ponzi ;;seen wences
22:40 gribble wences was last seen in #bitcoin-assets 1 year, 37 weeks, 6 days, 3 hours, 4 minutes, and 47 seconds ago: <wences> mircea, are you here?
22:40 mircea_popescu but as a theoretical, probably impractical solution. otherwise, 1-2% hikes each quarter for the next 3-5 years would be what a sane cb would do
22:41 mircea_popescu decimation you don;t mega hike it, you put it on a pain plan.
22:42 cazalla mircea_popescu> archive.today thing works fine. <<< i have started to do this
22:42 mircea_popescu good.
22:43 asciilifeform ideally the mirror would be a genuine #b-a-affiliated box, no ?
22:44 asciilifeform would suck to lose all the mirrored pages in one shot if archive.today is taken out
22:44 mircea_popescu well... yes.
22:44 mircea_popescu nothing beats a local copy, obviously
22:45 mircea_popescu really important stuff can also be deedbot-'d
22:45 cazalla well archive.today provides a download of the archive it makes as well
22:45 cazalla (and yes i know that this cannot be 100% trusted)
22:46 mircea_popescu it makes a nice jpg of the page that can be downloaded.
22:47 decimation what's a 'pain plan'?
22:47 decimation pay the little people 0% when inflation is well above 10%?
22:47 mircea_popescu when you tell the slavegirl "today, you X this much, and tomorrow X+k, and so forth each day X+nk"
22:48 mircea_popescu "the only thing you know for sure is that tomorrow's going to be worse" = pain plan
22:48 mircea_popescu pretty much every good computer game ever.
22:49 decimation heh yeah
22:51 decimation not only will usg be paying all of its tax revenue to debtors, the fed's $4.5 trillion worth of 3% mortgages won't look so good
22:53 mircea_popescu yeah well.
22:54 mircea_popescu i'm not a miracle worker, i'm a butcher. i don't revive dead cows, i just cut them apart.
22:59 decimation ;;calc 18000000000*0.2
22:59 gribble 3600000000
23:00 decimation so at 20% rate, usg pays $3.6 trillion in interest per year. current annual tax revenue is $3.1 trillion
23:01 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 31 @ 0.0341 = 1.0571 BTC [-]
23:05 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8478 @ 0.00042348 = 3.5903 BTC [+] {2}
23:11 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7500 @ 0.00042457 = 3.1843 BTC [+]
23:17 decimation heh EUR/USD fell to $1.08 from $1.10
↖
23:17 asciilifeform now kakobrekla can buy pogo!
23:17 asciilifeform lol
23:23 decimation asciilifeform: now's the time to import euro strange I guess
23:33 mircea_popescu ;;later tell decimation short explanation as to why exactly it can no longer be fixed.
23:33 gribble The operation succeeded.
23:33 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9999 @ 0.00042457 = 4.2453 BTC [+]
23:44 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6100 @ 0.00042457 = 2.5899 BTC [+]
23:44 mircea_popescu digging up to see which the fuck earl of somerset was pete talking about (i thought that's a duchy), it turns out there's two different 1st earls of somerset : John Beaufort (Gaunt's son, in 1300s) and Robert Carr, in the 1500s.
23:50 thestringpuller mircea_popescu: ;)
23:51 mircea_popescu unrelatedly : the middle german term for a tournament is... butthurt.
23:52 mircea_popescu bouhourt in french.
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