Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2019-05-15 | 2019-05-17 → ↓
04:52 * mp_en_viaje is reading "old" ie early 19th century romanian matter ; whenever has to look up words, discovers the ONLY example usage available is taken from the very text he's working on, often enough the EXACT context. eg, clironomie is, technically, a romanian word (cognate of ϰλιρουόμος, and not FROM it, because at the time greece did not exist, and most of the elite greeks lived in istanbul and in current romania. we could rigurously say Ï°Î
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04:52 mp_en_viaje it's a very dubious state pf affairs!
~ 1 hours 37 minutes ~
06:30 diana_coman hm, poor as in "only one use for such word" ? perhaps that specific work is in fact available online hence the example usage from it?
06:43 mp_en_viaje offline matter.
~ 1 hours 15 minutes ~
07:59 feedbot http://trilema.com/2019/domestic-casting/ << Trilema -- Domestic casting
~ 2 hours 28 minutes ~
10:27 jurov !!v 7B596FFBF5092F02E59A72596D61BFD5202BF95D043F822E76FBE20D87A2FD70
10:27 deedbot jurov paid BingoBoingo invoice 11
10:39 mp_en_viaje in other ancient lulzies, http://washington.cbslocal.com/2012/05/14/tsa-agents-conduct-full-monty-pat-down-on-henry-kissinger/
10:39 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: iirc he's still alive even nao
10:40 mp_en_viaje aha.
10:41 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913541 << btw i see a http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-30#1532187 . on what sorta box didja greek this in
10:41 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 08:52 mp_en_viaje is reading "old" ie early 19th century romanian matter ; whenever has to look up words, discovers the ONLY example usage available is taken from the very text he's working on, often enough the EXACT context. eg, clironomie is, technically, a romanian word (cognate of ϰλιρουόμος, and not FROM it, because at the time greece did not exist, and most of the elite greeks lived in istanbul and in current romania. we could rigurously say Ï°Î
10:41 a111 Logged on 2016-08-30 20:34 asciilifeform: бНОПНЯ ВХРЮК? (tm) (r)
10:43 mp_en_viaje ej wtf
10:45 mp_en_viaje ϰλιρουομία != χλιρουομια huh!
10:45 asciilifeform screenshit.
10:45 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: ~this~ one displays tho.
10:46 mp_en_viaje both tho ? and in log too ?
10:46 asciilifeform in log also.
10:46 asciilifeform and on several diff terminals.
10:46 mp_en_viaje though you will notice, chars AEE DIFFERENT!
10:46 asciilifeform the line after 'wtf' displays a+++
10:46 asciilifeform both sides of !=
10:47 * mp_en_viaje is reading "old" ie early 19th century romanian matter ; whenever has to look up words, discovers the ONLY example usage available is taken from the very text he's working on, often enough the EXACT context. eg, clironomie is, technically, a romanian word (cognate of ϰλιρουόμος, and not FROM it, because at the time greece did not exist, and most of the elite greeks lived in istanbul and in current romania. we could rigurously say Ï°Î
10:47 mp_en_viaje ϰλιρουόμος ϰλιρουομία χλιρουομια
10:48 mp_en_viaje what the holy fuck. so 1st line above is exact repost of logline original ; 2nd line is paste of content
10:48 asciilifeform i suspect mp_en_viaje's term settings but cannot immediately guess wtf
10:48 mp_en_viaje cognate of ϰλιρουόμος, and not FROM it, because at the time greece did not exist, and most of the elite greeks lived in istanbul and in current romania. we could rigurously say ϰλιρουόμος
10:48 mp_en_viaje HAHA!
10:48 asciilifeform nao worx
10:49 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, check this out : line ends up cut, so therefore utf meaning gets fucked.
10:49 mp_en_viaje cut is right through the greek word.
10:49 asciilifeform cuz, evidently, uni-sad, cut off a 0xfe or what was the leading char
10:49 asciilifeform ('frame shift' in geneticist's parlance... )
11:01 asciilifeform meanwhile, in http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-15#1913498 lulz, apparently http://bitcoinrabbithole.org/writings/bitcoin-or-how-to-hammer-in-nails-with-a-microscope/ also. seems like a straight case of http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-26#1874733 -ism.
11:01 a111 Logged on 2019-05-15 06:38 mp_en_viaje: bitcoinrabbithole.org/writings/ok-so-what-is-bitcoin-disrupting/ imagine that shit, and then http://archive.is/IqhDe#selection-605.1-607.13 (fancy that wonder, i'm the #1 author, with 6 "works" to nic carter's 5.)
11:01 a111 Logged on 2018-11-26 15:24 asciilifeform: meanwhile, in spam lulz, http://www.eghtesadban.com/events/5560171/finite-field-arithmetic-chapter-12b-karatsuba-redux-part-2-of-2
11:03 asciilifeform 'brilliant biznis model', i suppose. 'let's lift text and inject ads'
11:13 BingoBoingo And we appear to have an ethically sourced, wild caught question in the Qntrmments http://qntra.net/2019/05/semiconductor-market-headed-towards-downturn-as-more-intel-data-leak-flaws-emerge/#comment-129460
11:14 asciilifeform answr'd
11:22 BingoBoingo tyvm
11:23 * asciilifeform wonders wtf the asker was thinking
11:23 * asciilifeform brb:teatime.
~ 30 minutes ~
11:54 mp_en_viaje in other lulz, $ echo "ϰλιρουόμος ϰλιρουομία χλιρουομια" | xxd
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11:54 mp_en_viaje 0000000: cfb0 cebb ceb9 cf81 cebf cf85 cf8c cebc ................
11:54 mp_en_viaje 0000010: cebf cf82 20cf b0ce bbce b9cf 81ce bfcf .... ...........
11:54 mp_en_viaje 0000020: 85ce bfce bcce afce b120 cf87 cebb ceb9 ......... ......
11:54 mp_en_viaje 0000030: cf81 cebf cf85 cebf cebc ceb9 ceb1 0a ...............
11:54 mp_en_viaje cfb0, cfb0, cf87. wtf.
11:57 mp_en_viaje why the fuck are there two ambiguous minuscule chis ?!
~ 25 minutes ~
12:22 asciilifeform wonderful world of unibarf
12:22 asciilifeform there's at least a dozen ambiguous (often, bitwise-identical bitmap on output) variants for ~erry char
12:23 mp_en_viaje muts.
12:23 mp_en_viaje nuts.*
12:23 mp_en_viaje anyway, my archive aparently uses the 1st one ; google apparently uses the 2nd one.
12:24 mp_en_viaje not really got the time to look into digital etymology right nao, but pretty fucking stupid.
12:25 asciilifeform it's merely tip of a stupidity iceberg that goes all the way down to fucking cthulhu at bottom of the sea
12:28 feedbot http://qntra.net/2019/05/cold-dead-hands-new-zealand-swat-teams-start-overwhelming-force-gun-confiscation-raids/ << Qntra -- Cold Dead Hands? New Zealand SWAT Teams Start "Overwhelming Force" Gun Confiscation Raids
12:29 mp_en_viaje o hey, leningrad.
12:30 BingoBoingo "A phone call would have worked just as well." << For who?
12:31 asciilifeform seems like nz is 'behind the curve' vs usa. here they simply show up an' machinegun yer cardboard house from 2 sides and ~then~ search
12:31 BingoBoingo US uses pretext though.
12:32 asciilifeform pretext costs half a penny or so of printer paper at local 'court'
12:34 BingoBoingo Right. Skipping the pretext and rolling up with 30 stooges seems an expensive option.
12:35 mp_en_viaje especially because should someone shoot a few sets of 30 stooges, that'd be strictly speasking the end of pantsuit government in the island. permanently.
12:35 mp_en_viaje irreplaceable resource.
12:36 BingoBoingo Indeed. Whereas pretext and "war on pretext" lets the derealization continue over a few body piles.
12:36 asciilifeform in usa, 'future of policing' is prolly http://btcbase.org/log/2015-03-26#1072977 ; in usg periphery like nz, i expect soon enuff they'll just drop 500kg bomb from air and write down 'today neutralized terrorist compound' etc
12:36 a111 Logged on 2015-03-26 20:43 asciilifeform: one to break doors, gates; one to threaten bystanders, if any, with 'accidental' fire; one to shoot; and perhaps one with a cage that arrestee -might- be permitted to surrender into, if the bot's voice-recognition system works and if orders included a possible live capture
12:36 mp_en_viaje kinda how i explain this sort of behaviour. if you were a deeply unpopular, and irredeemably, unfixably unpopular tyranny, and all you had were two sets of reserves for your 30-man strong repressive police, wouldn't YOU go all out ?
12:36 mp_en_viaje now, while you still have it ? because it fucking obviously won't last ?
12:37 mp_en_viaje seems typical besieged cavalry behaviour, "if we charge now we charge now, and if we wait till tomorrow we charge with hungrier horses"
12:37 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: what makesya think 'irreplaceable' ? there's always collaborators to be had
12:37 asciilifeform just like in erry other occupied shithole
12:37 mp_en_viaje absolutely never. i npoint of fact im not so sure about the 30.
12:37 mp_en_viaje do this experiment : walk up to kids gathered on college campus, ask "how man yof you would fight me if i raped this girl ?"
12:38 mp_en_viaje count the hands. rape the girl, then break the arms off the 2-3 brave/irrational idiots and bash their heads in with them
12:38 mp_en_viaje then ask again, and count again.
12:38 BingoBoingo 30 sounds about right. That's a classroom. Probably a safety in numbers thing.
12:38 mp_en_viaje it's my guess that systematically shooting about 15% or so of the first line troops would result in >80% deserion rate.
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12:39 mp_en_viaje this guess is also well buttressed by texas, new mexico, arizona and southern california "law enforcement" experience -- all it took for the usg to abandon the southern provinces was for the cartel to frown.
12:40 mp_en_viaje see, it's not "collaborators" that are needed. it's people brave enough to go into room and maybe get shot. for pantsuitism! where the fuck can such be had ? russia couldn't produce anymore for afghanistan than usg could for vietnam.
12:40 asciilifeform somewhat diff. proposition from abandoning christchurch or washington, neh. if abandon capital, they may as well wagner/cyanide
12:40 mp_en_viaje socialisms just don't grow men, what's so hard about this ?
12:40 mp_en_viaje "an athenian woman once asked gorgo, how come spartans are the only greeks who respect women ???"
12:41 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, christchurch isn't the nz capital. look over at tripoli lulz.
12:41 asciilifeform right, sorta how nyc aint officially usg capital
12:41 asciilifeform but afaik nypd not yet disbanded
12:41 mp_en_viaje chirstchurch is a smallish town, ironically on the short list of possible mp migration spots lo many years ago.
12:42 asciilifeform i recall this
12:42 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, nobody happens to want ny.
12:43 mp_en_viaje anyway. all it'd take is the deliberate execution of about 5 new zealand govt batausi.
12:43 mp_en_viaje after which, no more new zealand government, for at least three-four decades. haiti-like.
12:43 asciilifeform who wants nz tho. ( chinese ? )
12:43 mp_en_viaje i imagine the arabs. nfi tbh.
12:44 asciilifeform iirc the argies also thought 'no one will want falklands' tho.
12:44 mp_en_viaje fwiw, we could note the dispute is strictly internal socialist dispute, the ultra-reds "terroristed" the moderate-blue group.
12:46 asciilifeform rright, subj d00d accused of trotsk^H^H^H^H^H^H'islamophobic' plot
12:50 * asciilifeform realizes that he hasn't the faintest clue re nz, never could even be arsed to see aerial map of it. pictures it as a sort of larger falklands.
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12:50 asciilifeform i.e. brit reservation fulla sheep fuckers
12:52 asciilifeform i dun recall whether mp_en_viaje ever said anyffin re how it fell of his list. ( if above theory correct, mp_en_viaje could even nao have himself crowned king there etc )
12:53 asciilifeform *fell off
12:53 asciilifeform !!up stjohn_piano_2
12:53 deedbot stjohn_piano_2 voiced for 30 minutes.
12:54 stjohn_piano_2 thanks asciilifeform for the !!up
12:54 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: plox to say quickly who you are, and what biz you have here.
12:54 stjohn_piano_2 my name is stjohn piano. i run edgecase.net, which offers several services that may be of interest to people here.
12:54 stjohn_piano_2 i've read a lot of the logs
12:54 stjohn_piano_2 i have registered my communications public key with deedbot. my master public key (which is nearly 2 years old, timestamped in the Bitcoin blockchain) is http://edgecase.net/articles/public_key_identity_document_stjohn_piano
12:54 stjohn_piano_2 i made this current key my communications agent via this contract: http://edgecase.net/articles/contract_0
12:55 asciilifeform !!key stjohn_piano_2
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12:55 deedbot http://wot.deedbot.org/CF59A71DAC5722F695C3A730F6DC1E61599152AC.asc
12:55 asciilifeform !!rate stjohn_piano_2 1 temp voice / new blood
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12:55 deedbot Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/q34GD/?raw=true
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12:55 stjohn_piano_2 thanks
12:56 asciilifeform !!v FF7C9ADCF790A263E1B28677967A89BF6540306F3F59FB42BAC41C73894342B5
12:56 deedbot asciilifeform rated stjohn_piano_2 1 << temp voice / new blood
12:57 asciilifeform http://edgecase.net/articles/offline_installation_of_a_c_compiler_on_centos_69_minimal_on_kalkin << tried 'cuntoo' yet ?
12:58 stjohn_piano_2 no, but it's on my list.
12:58 stjohn_piano_2 hm.
12:58 asciilifeform how about ave1's gnat ?
12:58 stjohn_piano_2 i had some prepared commands, but i'm having some trouble decrypting the otp.
12:59 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: ditto.
12:59 asciilifeform cat yer_otp.txt | gpg --decrypt ?
13:00 stjohn_piano_2 well, i'm using the sequences i developed in
13:00 stjohn_piano_2 http://edgecase.net/articles/gpg_1410_stateless_operations
13:00 asciilifeform if you have the key you regged with, it'll go
13:00 stjohn_piano_2 i'll try that
13:01 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: asciilifeform's 'stateless pgp' mechanism.
13:02 * mp_en_viaje recently took girls at local argentine-style socialist hq here in romania. if the argentines were totally useless retards, they'd make the place an embassy. but of course they are totally useless retards.
13:02 stjohn_piano_2 ah ty
13:02 mp_en_viaje anyway, 100% borderline sleeve priceless cuntlets and their typical cultural and civilisational environs.
13:02 mp_en_viaje including printed matter about "real estate justice" in the typical argentine style, the works.
13:03 mp_en_viaje they were very bothered by my cheesing & wineing the two sluts.
13:03 asciilifeform lol wtf is 'real estate justice' ? errybody gets a phree palace ?
13:03 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: when i run your command there, I get: "gpg: encrypted with RSA key, ID C8EFFF13, gpg: decryption failed: secret key not available"
13:03 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, lengthy interviews with morons living in social dwellings as if they were people, pretentious if ineptly constructed "studies", discussions of "the potentials and limits of legality -- how to construct the altcoin irl"
13:03 mp_en_viaje and so on.
13:03 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: plz compare output of http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913651 w/ your key
13:03 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 16:55 asciilifeform: !!key stjohn_piano_2
13:04 mp_en_viaje really, 100% tardstalk but in this guise of "every moron that should have been hanged is a point of interest and nothing else really matters"
13:05 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: diff shows "Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux)" as the only difference.
13:05 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: i can grasp the 'old world socialism', where http://btcbase.org/log/2019-03-25#1904728 ; i dun really grasp ~these~, they dun even make surface sense to the uninitated
13:05 a111 Logged on 2019-03-25 16:40 asciilifeform: oblig : 'Всіх панів до ’дної ями, Буржуїв за буржуями Будем, будем бить! Будем, будем бить!'(tm)(r)(pavlo tichina)(ukr)
13:05 mp_en_viaje exactly what you'd expect of a "partido marxista-leninista-maoista", the theory of the squatting and "criticism of unbridled capitalism"
13:06 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, socialism never made sense.
13:06 mp_en_viaje today;s socialism continues that tradition, in exactly the same way, through new forms.
13:08 mp_en_viaje http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913639 << it's really a sort of haiti.
13:08 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 16:50 asciilifeform realizes that he hasn't the faintest clue re nz, never could even be arsed to see aerial map of it. pictures it as a sort of larger falklands.
13:08 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: robber getting run over by train because he thought could hop on, 'makes sense' . terry davis getting run over cuz he thought train was an angel coming to take him to st peter's gate, doesn't rise even to the level, it requires being a terry davis to grasp
13:08 mp_en_viaje but anyway, you can't crown yourself king in places that aren't kingdom. the only thing you can crown yourself, or be crowned for that matter, in new zealand is scapegoat. which isn't the sort of crowning anyone who's not actually a biological goat is interested in.
13:09 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, which portion of socialism do you say made sense like the former rather than like the latter ?
13:09 mp_en_viaje imo each and all forever and always "made sense" only like the latter. from late 1700s french nonsense to 1800 italian lulz, all through the johhny come latelyes in anglo and russoworld.
13:10 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, http://edgecase.net/ << is this modelled visually after trilema ?
13:10 asciilifeform y'know, the 1917 wave, where 'let's kill landlord and divide the lands', it at least obeyed conservation of mass. 'erryone deserves phree palace' is next level of wtf. who is to provide, martians ?
13:10 mp_en_viaje cuz to me teh similarity's striking.
13:10 BingoBoingo <mp_en_viaje> fwiw, we could note the dispute is strictly internal socialist dispute, the ultra-reds "terroristed" the moderate-blue group. << Guy claimed to be a "green" fwiw
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13:11 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: gpg --list-packets shows that the key ID is C8EFFF13 in the OTP file. The key ID of my public key is 5991 52AC. Is this expected? (the fingerprint shown by deedbot in the earlier line is correct, though).
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13:12 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, and how does the "let's kill the only people who know wtf is going on" make sense ?
13:12 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: yes, very much so.
13:12 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: diff the pgpdump -i output of the two pubkeys.
13:12 stjohn_piano_2 i studied trilema's layout.
13:12 mp_en_viaje interesting.
13:12 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: will do.
13:12 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, why not make a mp-wp tree patch then ?
13:13 mp_en_viaje iirc people were looking for some more themes
13:13 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: consider diff b/w 'im'a go pirate on the high seas, take spanish gold' vs 'i'ma pray for gold to fall from sky', is the contemplated diff.
13:13 mp_en_viaje http://btcbase.org/patches?patchset=mp-wp&search= << item
13:13 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, i tell you i don't see it.
13:13 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: i severely dislike PHP.
13:13 stjohn_piano_2 but i did consider it.
13:14 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: what didja write yer www in ?
13:14 mp_en_viaje you have to understand, you can't ~anachronize~ ; you gotta explain how it makes sense in time-bound context. otherwise yes forever it'll be the case "past makes sense, present does not"
13:14 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: python
13:14 mp_en_viaje so this is a python blog thing ?
13:14 stjohn_piano_2 sort of.
13:15 stjohn_piano_2 it's an html rendering / presentation of a series of text articles.
13:15 stjohn_piano_2 the original items can be downloaded via the "Download this article" link.
13:16 mp_en_viaje http://edgecase.net/pages/edgecase_datafeed << http://edgecase.net/articles/contract_0 what is this nonsense tho ? what's "This article has been digitally signed by Edgecase Datafeed." even mean ?!
13:16 asciilifeform loox like stjohn_piano_2 built/attempted to build a 'display these pgp-signed .txt with html sugar' mechanism ?
13:16 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform has it.
13:16 stjohn_piano_2 except that the signature is wrapped and embedded at the end of the text article.
13:17 mp_en_viaje and do you also hate v along with php ?
13:17 mp_en_viaje http://edgecase.net/tools/manage_ip_addresses << what;s this do ?
13:17 * stjohn_piano_2 is learning pgpdump in the background, btw
13:17 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: no, just haven't got to it yet.
13:18 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: how long, approx, have you been eating the logs ?
13:18 stjohn_piano_2 manage_ip_addresses is a small interface for the paywall ip addresses. it's a thrown-together paywall, not fantastic, but functional.
13:18 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: a long time.
13:18 stjohn_piano_2 but i've been recovering from severe rsi
13:18 mp_en_viaje http://edgecase.net/articles/conversation_programmer_licences << what's the weird here ? a) wrt to a buncha people calling themselves x piano ; b) wrt to hand-publishing what's eminently a chatlog, as such ? why not use a logger and only publish selected snippets that need notes and such ?
↖ ↖
13:18 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: v is aug '15 -- present day item.
13:18 stjohn_piano_2 until recently, chat has been an unaffordable liability.
13:19 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, apparently he implemented ye olde trilema credits thing..
13:19 asciilifeform loox like
13:19 mp_en_viaje wth is a rsi ?
13:19 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: will eventually switch over to v, yes.
13:20 stjohn_piano_2 repetitive strain injury. too much typing, causes muscle buildup.
13:20 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: hand mutilation from misconfigged kbd, typically
13:20 mp_en_viaje http://edgecase.net/articles/checkpoint_8 << what;s this ?
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13:20 stjohn_piano_2 http://edgecase.net/articles/an_overview_of_repetitive_strain_injury_rsi
13:20 mp_en_viaje aok.
13:21 asciilifeform oblig naggum re subj
13:21 a111 Logged on 2014-09-22 04:33 asciilifeform: switching caps lock and ctrl << 'Emacs actually comes with a builting Emacs Aptitude Test. Do you remap your keyboard or the Emacs keybindings before the chords and sequences it comes with by default have wreaked havoc with your hands? If you do not do anything to make Emacs more convenient for yourself, you may not have the prerequisite aptitude to use it productive.' (naggum, who else. http://www.xach.com/na
13:21 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913731 << i've only recently set up IRC. http://edgecase.net/articles/setting_up_irc_irssi_znc_digital_ocean_freenode
13:21 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:18 mp_en_viaje: http://edgecase.net/articles/conversation_programmer_licences << what's the weird here ? a) wrt to a buncha people calling themselves x piano ; b) wrt to hand-publishing what's eminently a chatlog, as such ? why not use a logger and only publish selected snippets that need notes and such ?
13:21 mp_en_viaje http://edgecase.net/articles/gpg_1410_stateless_operations << this sounds a lot like what ben_vulpes was doing at some point iirc.
13:21 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, but why the heck would you use digital ocean.
13:21 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: first thing i bumped into that solved my problem.
13:22 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: re gpg, seems like he reimplemented the mechanism in orig v
13:22 asciilifeform where 'homedir' in /tmp etc
13:22 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, aha.
13:22 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, ok, so what services would we be interested in ?
13:23 asciilifeform 'Nicholas Piano: It needs to be something that proves someone's worth beyond a doubt. Imagine we treated programmer failure like the death of a patient in surgery. Think of a system tested so completely that every possible use case has been accounted for. Perhaps an air traffic control simulation ...'
13:23 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: ever read ffa series ?
13:23 asciilifeform !!up stjohn_piano_2
13:23 deedbot stjohn_piano_2 voiced for 30 minutes.
13:24 stjohn_piano_2 thanks for voice.
13:24 mp_en_viaje http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913697 << yes, but there;s no such thin gas green. there's red-socialist as in http://btcbase.org/log/2017-08-22#1702376 and then the blue socialists as in clinton-dnc
13:24 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:10 BingoBoingo: <mp_en_viaje> fwiw, we could note the dispute is strictly internal socialist dispute, the ultra-reds "terroristed" the moderate-blue group. << Guy claimed to be a "green" fwiw
13:24 a111 Logged on 2017-08-22 19:36 mircea_popescu: which, amusingly, makes the jesus pantsuits ACTUALLY MORE PROGRESSIVE than the new yorker crowd.
13:24 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: yes, although i have not been able to understand it.
13:24 mp_en_viaje that's a strange yes.
13:24 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: http://edgecase.net/pages/edgecase_services
13:24 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: this is actually 1st time anyone wrote in and said 'i tried but not understood'. plz feel free to leave comments re what did not understand.
13:24 stjohn_piano_2 i mean, i understand the idea.
13:25 stjohn_piano_2 i have not spent the time to go through the pieces manually.
13:25 asciilifeform aa
13:25 mp_en_viaje ok, but "consulting services" means nothing and secure publication's what qntra already exists for ? why would i use your thing ?
13:25 BingoBoingo mp_en_viaje: In practice it seems so. Neither the reds nor the blues have a monopoly on the mud hut deindustrialists.
13:26 stjohn_piano_2 checkpoint articles are hashed and made into bitcoin addresses. some bitcoin is transferred to this address, much like deedbot.
13:26 stjohn_piano_2 i cannot alter previously published articles.
13:26 mp_en_viaje and it's worth your time to do this by yourself rather than actually use deedbot because why ? tryina learn how shit works ?
13:26 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: didja notice that output of http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913740 is a eggog ?
13:26 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:20 mp_en_viaje: http://edgecase.net/articles/checkpoint_8 << what;s this ?
13:27 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: yes, I've learned a lot. also distribution of risk.
13:27 mp_en_viaje http://edgecase.net/articles/displaying_hex_bytes_for_manual_copying << is this exactly what i did in http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913584 ?!
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13:27 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 15:54 mp_en_viaje: in other lulz, $ echo "ϰλιρουόμος ϰλιρουομία χλιρουομια" | xxd
13:27 stjohn_piano_2 you wrote an article once about parsimony vs efficiency, i think.
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13:27 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: i did not. thanks.
13:27 mp_en_viaje right.
13:28 mp_en_viaje so i take it the pissing into blockchain of article checksum is automated ? or you do it by hand on some level ?
13:28 stjohn_piano_2 hand-crafted transactions.
13:28 stjohn_piano_2 uploaded to one of the various broadcast places.
13:28 mp_en_viaje umm. why the fuck would anyone. then whine about rsi ? how about not waste your time doing machine works.
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13:29 * mp_en_viaje is currently quite satisfied with the trilema/rss > irc > archive.is system of archival. for one thing, on very rare occasions i will retrofix a typo or something. for the other, if i actually wanted to deed each trilema article i would, but by automating that itnerface. seems overkill atm.
13:29 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: i'ma guess he's trying to 'airgap' but with no slave typists
13:29 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, what's the sense in airgapping published material ?
13:29 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913777 << yes
13:29 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:27 mp_en_viaje: http://edgecase.net/articles/displaying_hex_bytes_for_manual_copying << is this exactly what i did in http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913584 ?!
13:29 asciilifeform the tx i mean
13:30 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: exactly
13:30 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, so do you see something wrong with having an article about a script that does |xxd ?
13:30 mp_en_viaje because if i had a criticism to present toyou re your (in many ways quite laudable) efforts -- it'd be this scratching around head with wrong hand approach to life.
13:30 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: certainly. i'm not certain that i knew about xxd at the time.
13:30 mp_en_viaje are you coming from academia or something ?
13:31 stjohn_piano_2 ah fair
13:31 stjohn_piano_2 no
13:31 mp_en_viaje but you nevertheless understand what i mean ?
13:31 stjohn_piano_2 yes
13:31 mp_en_viaje aite.
13:32 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913785 << well, i had time to think. wanted to understand transactions, and by doing so achieve airgapped bitcoin storage.
13:32 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:28 mp_en_viaje: umm. why the fuck would anyone. then whine about rsi ? how about not waste your time doing machine works.
13:32 mp_en_viaje fair enough.
13:32 stjohn_piano_2 transactions for timestamping is a bonus.
13:33 mp_en_viaje anyway, to belabour the point : there is immense value in having low barriers. part of why trilema is so great is all the time i put into making it very easy for myself to write on/for it. and my life in general is very finely tuned by this principle.
13:33 stjohn_piano_2 makes sense.
13:34 mp_en_viaje if soemthing you should do can be accomplished in one hand motion, you'll do it a lot easier than if you have to first curtsy and then proceed. and a curtsy can be anything -- including having to remember the name of a script.
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13:34 asciilifeform ^ is how asciilifeform ended up with pedal board, bank of programmable keys, etc..
13:34 mp_en_viaje all sorts of unexpected things improve productivity, and the thing with improved productivity is that it's a very hard exponential -- cutting yet another 1% dead weight produces massive gains because it lowers effort under pleasure threshold.
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13:35 mp_en_viaje one sure as fuck loves writing when the path from idea to published article is an hour or so.
13:35 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: diffing the output of pgpdump -i [key] and pgpdump -i [deedbotkey] shows no difference.
13:35 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, aha, and how linux ended up with the lulzy util names. and so on
13:36 mp_en_viaje does he even have ratings ?
13:36 mp_en_viaje !!key stjohn_piano_2
13:36 deedbot http://wot.deedbot.org/CF59A71DAC5722F695C3A730F6DC1E61599152AC.asc
13:36 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913653
13:36 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 16:55 asciilifeform: !!rate stjohn_piano_2 1 temp voice / new blood
13:36 mp_en_viaje a ok.
13:36 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913808 << have learned this painfully, yes.
13:36 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:34 mp_en_viaje: if soemthing you should do can be accomplished in one hand motion, you'll do it a lot easier than if you have to first curtsy and then proceed. and a curtsy can be anything -- including having to remember the name of a script.
13:36 asciilifeform !!gettrust stjohn_piano_2
13:36 deedbot L1: 1, L2: 0 by 0 connections.
13:36 mp_en_viaje ...
13:36 asciilifeform seems like that part worx
13:37 mp_en_viaje a right right.
13:37 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, so why "If Edgecase cannot answer your question, Edgecase will probably be able to suggest some potential avenues of exploration." ? wtf is an edgecase then
13:37 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: the name of the company
13:38 mp_en_viaje so is it you and a friend made a company and you call each other piano-something and the company is edgecase ?
13:39 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: my name is actually StJohn Piano. my brother's name is Nicholas Piano. the company is just me.
13:39 mp_en_viaje why can't i select "Plaintext renditions of books, documents, and PDF files" off http://edgecase.net/pages/edgecase_services ? you against javascript also ?
13:39 mp_en_viaje wait, that is your actual name ?!
13:39 stjohn_piano_2 i have not implemented a javascript select thing yet.
13:39 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: yes
13:40 * stjohn_piano_2 is reading http://edgecase.net/articles/basic_gpg_commands to try to use GPG the normal way to decrypt the otp.
13:40 mp_en_viaje nuts. it so happens it sounds exactly like what the "transparently clever & ironic" made-up name an xkcd-minded 2010s cleverist would come up with.
13:41 mp_en_viaje so i guess i just assumed, lol. sat.
13:41 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: i agree. no problem, i'm used to that reaction.
13:41 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: at the risk of belabouring the obv., you gotta see to it that yer custom pgp wrapper actually has access to the priv that went with the pub you regged
13:42 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: yes. i have imported the corresponding priv key to this instance of gpg.
13:42 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, to continue that line, what'd http://bimbo.club/2019/05/philosophical-transactions-for-the-months-of-jan-febr-and-march-1716-part-v/ cost if edgecase did it ?
13:42 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: i highly doubt that edgecase can compete with slave labour.
13:42 mp_en_viaje may i be curious ?
13:42 stjohn_piano_2 hm.
13:42 mp_en_viaje nicoleci, ey bimbo, how long did that take you ?
13:44 stjohn_piano_2 well, we'd choose some hourly rate agreeable to both of us. i'd use an OCR site and correct the result. eventually, i might invest time in my own ocr fork.
13:44 mp_en_viaje you can't ocr that.
13:44 mp_en_viaje i mean, it'll be more work to correct than to write.
13:44 stjohn_piano_2 ah. i'll look at the original.
13:44 asciilifeform was gonna say. stjohn_piano_2 take a look at his input, it's the ultimate, possibly, torture test for ocrtron, 18th c. manuscript.
13:44 nicoleci mp_en_viaje, that was a long one, five hours...
13:45 mp_en_viaje ty nicoleci
13:45 stjohn_piano_2 ah. ouch.
13:46 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: if you're a serious meat-ocr, asciilifeform has a tough cookie, http://btcbase.org/log/2019-04-23#1909563 , would defo pay for quality hand-entry of it
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13:46 a111 Logged on 2019-04-23 22:59 asciilifeform: here we go : 1801 schematics ; 1801 manual vol.1 1801 manual vol.2 .
13:46 stjohn_piano_2 well, i'd use human-powered ocr then (given residual rsi). i've hired transcribers before. i'd then correct the result myself.
13:46 asciilifeform possibly even worse ^ , btw, than mp_en_viaje's item
13:46 BingoBoingo human-powered ocr has a high error rate when the wrong bipeds are involved
13:47 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: noshit
13:47 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: this computer doesn't have a djvu reader, but i have no doubt that it's painful.
13:48 asciilifeform i dare say this is not the 1st line of work i'd picture a fella with broken hands going into..
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13:48 mp_en_viaje so look, and i hope you don't take this the wrong way (a hope mostly fed by your claim to have read the logs) : you're a guy with an evident humanities / non-technical background trying to get something going, start a company, all that stuff. nothing wrong with that. you are however currently beset by two prongs of problem. one is that in your quest to do something, you often do things that are getting in your own way -- there's no benefit for you f
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13:48 mp_en_viaje rom all the pomp of "datafeed article 103," etc. it just clunks up your thought process. i know you don' tthink so, familiarity breeds a feeling of safety etc. but it's absolutely never worth it to have more shit than you need.
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13:48 BingoBoingo And a lot of people advertising for "transcription" aren't the sort equipped to decode cultureal artifacts
13:48 stjohn_piano_2 BingoBoingo: I use relatives.
13:48 mp_en_viaje the other prong is that you don't actually have anything you can compete in. slave labour or no slave labour, she does it in five hours and you don't.
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13:48 mp_en_viaje now -- the 2nd is probably more approachable.
13:48 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: soviet-era typewritten + pencilled corrections, if yer curious
13:49 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913862 << yes, reading logs has thickened skin substantially.
13:49 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:48 mp_en_viaje: so look, and i hope you don't take this the wrong way (a hope mostly fed by your claim to have read the logs) : you're a guy with an evident humanities / non-technical background trying to get something going, start a company, all that stuff. nothing wrong with that. you are however currently beset by two prongs of problem. one is that in your quest to do something, you often do things that are getting in your own way -- there's no benefit for you f
13:49 mp_en_viaje so, what are you realy good at ?
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13:50 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: ah interesting.
13:50 stjohn_piano_2 hm.
13:50 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: thanks for feedback, by the way.
13:51 stjohn_piano_2 i have unfortunately worked mostly in small businesses, making me something of a "learn this thing quickly well enough to get it to do X function".
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13:52 stjohn_piano_2 i guess i could say that i'm very good at reading a lot of material and picking out the bit that is necessary for a problem.
13:52 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: this sorta thing is almost universal afflication of young folx. i can see why you choked on ffa tho, it has literally no 'parts that can be safely skipped'
13:52 asciilifeform curable, is the good news
13:53 stjohn_piano_2 ha
13:53 stjohn_piano_2 yes.
13:53 asciilifeform !!up stjohn_piano_2
13:53 deedbot stjohn_piano_2 voiced for 30 minutes.
13:54 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: got anywhere re the puzzler of why key noworky?
13:54 asciilifeform you'll defo want to fix asap.
13:55 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: no. still tracing back over the steps.
13:55 stjohn_piano_2 i know, hadn't expected this part to produce trouble.
13:55 asciilifeform this sorta underscores mp_en_viaje's point -- if you have automation in the loop, it had better work and actually save time
13:56 asciilifeform unreliable robotics is far worse than none at all
13:56 stjohn_piano_2 agreed.
13:56 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, in a sense, the issue here you'll now have to transition into maturity.
13:57 mp_en_viaje http://btcbase.org/log/2018-09-05#1848033 and all that.
13:57 a111 Logged on 2018-09-05 16:52 mircea_popescu: well, there's that old "as i became a man i put the things of childhood aside". "something else", you know ? not a girl, no, but who knows what terror ?!
13:58 mp_en_viaje certainly displays the patience required, to, eg, make a quite pretty mp-wp clone in python.
13:58 mp_en_viaje did you yourself do that btw ?
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13:59 stjohn_piano_2 puzzler: why the key ID in the otp message is C8EFFF13, while my key's fingerprint is 599152AC. importing the private key into gpg produces (in gpg --list-keys) the correct key ID 599152AC. diffing the key returned by deedbot with my public key shows no difference.
13:59 stjohn_piano_2 (correct key ID of the public key) *
14:00 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: seems like your pgptron still doesn't have access to the corresponding priv ?
14:00 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: re: maturity: good point.
14:00 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, he prolly registered they main but gpg wants to use the sub (or vice-versa, i dun recall which this was)
14:00 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913894 << really wanted more-or-less self-contained unchangeable publishing. thought i might as well make it look nice.
14:00 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:58 mp_en_viaje: did you yourself do that btw ?
14:01 stjohn_piano_2 my pgptron is gpg 1.4.10, compiled from mp's original source in deedbot.
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14:01 stjohn_piano_2 i've abandoned the stateless commands and am using the basic stuff.
14:02 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: in the case of subkeyism, he oughta then see a diff b/w the dumps, as i understand
14:02 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: i have imported the corresponding priv. will now export pub and confirm that it's the same as the one in deedbot.
14:04 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, if you think about it, not only common, but forced because necessary. the human condition in postmodernism, as "lost on a raft atop sea of nonsense" kinda forces the tribe's expendable labour (ie, young males) into the "quickly search through large portions of sea"
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14:06 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: have exported pub-derived-from-priv and diffed it with pub-downloaded-from-deedbot. no difference other than "Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux)".
14:06 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: hey, dun have to go far for this, e.g. asciilifeform earns bread these days by 'which 11 pages of microshit docs add up to the truth re $kernelknob' etc
14:06 stjohn_piano_2 so my working assumption is that the priv is in fact the right one.
14:06 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, do the voicing in here
14:06 mp_en_viaje say !!up
14:06 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: also plz paste the eggog output from attempt
14:07 stjohn_piano_2 eggog:
14:07 stjohn_piano_2 $ gpg --decrypt encrypted_otp.asc
14:07 stjohn_piano_2 gpg: encrypted with RSA key, ID C8EFFF13
14:07 stjohn_piano_2 gpg: decryption failed: secret key not available
14:07 mp_en_viaje do it here.
14:07 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: ok. round 2 i.e. new OTP?
14:08 mp_en_viaje just say !!up
14:08 stjohn_piano_2 !!up
14:08 deedbot Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/tiMdL/?raw=true
14:08 stjohn_piano_2 !!up stjohn_piano_2
14:08 stjohn_piano_2 ah
14:08 deedbot Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/yXnbk/?raw=true
14:08 mp_en_viaje moterucker, just once.
14:08 stjohn_piano_2 sorry
14:08 stjohn_piano_2 should i use the first or second, or either?
14:08 mp_en_viaje curl http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/yXnbk/?raw=true | gpg
14:09 mp_en_viaje ^ put that in a term
14:09 stjohn_piano_2 ok
14:09 asciilifeform Key ID - 0xEB915D5A625FF273 interestingly in both
14:09 asciilifeform which aint any of the subs in his regged pub
14:09 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: result:
14:09 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, seems inconceivable the nick was pre-registered ?!
14:09 stjohn_piano_2 gpg: encrypted with 4096-bit RSA key, ID 625FF273, created 2019-04-15 "stjohn_piano_2"
14:09 stjohn_piano_2 UP stjohn_piano_2
14:09 stjohn_piano_2 224B5AF74B3FDF7674566BBBC2C7AF0E46D68F6586E03C255C2631FD34BE60DD
14:10 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, say !!v 224B5AF74B3FDF7674566BBBC2C7AF0E46D68F6586E03C255C2631FD34BE60DD
14:10 stjohn_piano_2 !!v 224B5AF74B3FDF7674566BBBC2C7AF0E46D68F6586E03C255C2631FD34BE60DD
14:10 deedbot You are now voiced in #trilema
14:10 stjohn_piano_2 huh
14:10 mp_en_viaje you're such a dork...
14:10 asciilifeform oh hey, decrypted
14:10 stjohn_piano_2 ah. first time -> opened link in browser, copied text into file. did not use curl.
14:10 stjohn_piano_2 possibly browser introduced some stuff.
14:11 mp_en_viaje browser eh.
14:12 asciilifeform aa there we go, ...273 was his primary (pgpdump for soemreason doesn't dump fphash of primary)
14:12 stjohn_piano_2 asciiliform, mp_en_viaje: thanks for the help
14:13 mp_en_viaje yw.
14:13 mp_en_viaje speaking of slave labour, naked girls in my room packing my shirts. "watch, like this. see ?"
14:16 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: in the future, you'll want to do exactly same manipulation, but in privmsg w/ deedbot .
14:16 mp_en_viaje well he'll be hard pressed to do it here if unvoiced, lol
14:16 asciilifeform aha
14:19 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: ah. thanks.
14:19 stjohn_piano_2 strange. doing the operation again with the original OTP still produces the error.
14:19 stjohn_piano_2 curl http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/q34GD/?raw=true | gpg produces:
14:20 stjohn_piano_2 gpg: encrypted with RSA key, ID C8EFFF13
14:20 stjohn_piano_2 gpg: decryption failed: secret key not available
14:20 mp_en_viaje anyway, here's a consultancy i'm willing to hire you for : find some place that a) doesn't suck and b) offers a good price to advertise trilema on. large venues only ; none of the pompous bullshit. bulk adult traffic would do fine for instance, maybe talk to the juicyads dorks.
14:20 mp_en_viaje that something within your scope ?
14:21 stjohn_piano_2 not so far, but i can certainly see if i can do it.
14:22 asciilifeform Key ID - 0x889ACC4FC8EFFF13 is defo not any of his subs ~or~ the primary. trinque ^ prolly worth a look
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14:22 mp_en_viaje well, maybe i misread the substance of http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913875 ; afaik 80% of what "small business" means for the past ~decade is exaftly the above.
14:22 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:51 stjohn_piano_2: i have unfortunately worked mostly in small businesses, making me something of a "learn this thing quickly well enough to get it to do X function".
14:23 stjohn_piano_2 ah
14:23 stjohn_piano_2 hm. let's do a quick run-through:
14:23 mp_en_viaje ever since that graham scammer completely lost it, and started whining about some idiots who "handmade cereal boxes to sell their idea"
14:24 stjohn_piano_2 I've done: writing python scripts to sort large amounts of transcription data, running transcription projects, setting up raspberry-pi-powered cameras, figuring out what to do about gdpr, bookkeeping.
14:25 stjohn_piano_2 as a quick snapshot.
14:25 asciilifeform soo mainly to do with automating ocr ?
14:26 mp_en_viaje ah i see.
14:26 stjohn_piano_2 no, not as paid work.
14:26 stjohn_piano_2 that was just experimentation with edgecase.
14:26 mp_en_viaje so basically you were involved in one small biz, and it had something or the other to do with digitization, or w/e in that vein.
14:26 asciilifeform a. stjohn_piano_2 what have you done for pay ?
14:26 stjohn_piano_2 ah. actually two businesses. one was a furniture factory, one did speech rec system tuning.
14:27 stjohn_piano_2 furniture factory wanted to see if they could make and sell a cnc mini-mill.
14:27 stjohn_piano_2 speec rec company wanted transcription projects to test the speech systems.
14:28 asciilifeform mini-mill << ~extremely~ saturated market btw.
14:28 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: ^ those, for pay.
14:28 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: so i discovered, yes.
14:28 * mp_en_viaje chuckles thinking back on the dfays of http://trilema.com/2012/lets-have-fun-with-paul-graham/ ; remember back when internet "people" actually thought paul graham has shit to say on topics and things ?
14:28 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: even did have, circa 2008 or so
14:28 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, ok, but what did you do for them ? accounting ?
14:29 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, more like in 90s, didn't they write a lisp-web thing ?
14:29 mp_en_viaje tho i suspect other guy wrote, graham talked.
14:29 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913906 << this is an excellent description
14:29 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 18:04 mp_en_viaje: asciilifeform, if you think about it, not only common, but forced because necessary. the human condition in postmodernism, as "lost on a raft atop sea of nonsense" kinda forces the tribe's expendable labour (ie, young males) into the "quickly search through large portions of sea"
14:30 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: did, but wasn't what he was known for, was still trade seekrit. was known for 2 schoolbooks on commonlisp.
14:30 * asciilifeform has both on shelf, they're notbad
14:30 asciilifeform mid-1990s
14:30 mp_en_viaje his forray into business however, is sadly reminiscent of tucker max.
14:30 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: pg openly admitted it was 'yahoo'-powered peripheral scam.
14:31 asciilifeform ~then~ something snapped in his head, and came delusions of 'biznis genius'
14:31 mp_en_viaje aha. but i meant since, made a "ycombinator" thing.
14:31 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: furniture factory: i studied all the components i was given and tried to make them work together: so, camera, computer, motion controller, servomotors, wiring etc.
14:31 stjohn_piano_2 to make mini-mill thing for wood.
14:31 mp_en_viaje apparently those are easy to get, in usgistan. then again... long standing tradition, who still recalls the "tribes" genius.
14:31 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: right, it's what he did with the bag of moola. immediately politruks appeared to 'help' him 'see light' etc
14:32 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, so mechanical engineer for factory and then software engineer for sound recording thing ?
14:32 mp_en_viaje !#s seth godin
14:32 a111 7 results for "seth godin", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=seth%20godin
14:32 mp_en_viaje o look! logs remember.
14:32 stjohn_piano_2 speech rec company: learned to build / tune /test speech rec systems (nuance, grxml). ran transcription projects for the test data. wrote statistical sampler scripts for the output.
14:33 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: yes, exactly
14:33 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: i have cnc mill (for metal, not only wood, albeit slow) right here, made from scavenged materials + 1970s 'sherline'. it's a weekend's work. i.e. pretty hard to make profit selling'em, china nao ships complete kits.
14:33 stjohn_piano_2 although for speech rec, it was small company (my father), so I also did bookkeeping, reading about taxes, setting up computers, etc.
14:33 mp_en_viaje "One of the most popular in the world 7,000 posts so far, more than a million readers." ; dude's still going, check him out. les keks.
14:33 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, so what did you go to school for ?
14:34 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: i agree. goal was to make "cnc mill for consumers" i.e. cheap.
14:34 mp_en_viaje inb4 "painting"
14:34 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: electronic engineering
↖
14:34 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: the rub is, 'konsoomer' dun particularly care to spray cutting oil and aluminum swarf all over himself
14:34 asciilifeform hence popularity of '3d print' nonsense
14:35 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: i learned early on that he who has the money gets to decide what to spend it on.
14:35 mp_en_viaje stjohn_piano_2, aite. i guess you're fated to thicken the rows of techs then.
14:35 stjohn_piano_2 in this case, mini-mill for consumer.
14:35 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: as you have also probably found already, it is quite difficult to manufacture ~anything~ 'cheap' in ameristan.
14:36 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: makes sense. i don't think i'm a good choice for advertising work.
14:36 mp_en_viaje Kinds of truth “Gravity’s not just a good idea, it’s the law.” << check out the schmuck, "oh, here, nobody will notice pantsuitist pretense, let's talk about how gravity is the law. because hilary mcloser voted it!!!"
14:36 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: where was this
14:36 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: i have indeed.
14:36 mp_en_viaje https://seths.blog/2019/05/kinds-of-truth/ << this might be the dumbest piece of drivel i read today.
14:36 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: aint that an infamous crap artist ? i fughet
14:37 mp_en_viaje yeah. they're this cloud of idiots, this dude, graham, jobs, they all wear stupid clothes and aim to impress the gullible public by a certain style of fireworks.
14:38 mp_en_viaje usually shaved head, rolled up sweater, "eternal life", etcetera.
14:38 mp_en_viaje goes all the way back to tang dynasty.
14:38 asciilifeform upstack, '...those who purchase programming time now have a reason to care about programmer quality much more than they used to... obviously this will take a while. it'll happen first wherever software systems are interfacing with bitcoin. or are under pressure from ransomware. wherever it hurts the most.'
14:38 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 17:18 mp_en_viaje: http://edgecase.net/articles/conversation_programmer_licences << what's the weird here ? a) wrt to a buncha people calling themselves x piano ; b) wrt to hand-publishing what's eminently a chatlog, as such ? why not use a logger and only publish selected snippets that need notes and such ?
14:39 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2 ^ is true. but slow. e.g. mp_en_viaje and asciilifeform baked a trng in '16; one might imagine erry single serious btc user would've bought. but guess what.
14:39 asciilifeform 'the gears of the gods turn slowly' etc
14:39 mp_en_viaje every single serious user did buy
14:39 asciilifeform could even be
14:40 asciilifeform scratch surface of $subj, and find that the # of 'serious' folx is 100-1000x smaller than you could have dreamed.
14:41 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: yes, unfortunately.
14:41 asciilifeform the ultimate mindfuck, is when you find that you already know 100% of'em, by name..
14:41 stjohn_piano_2 interest from my friends and acquaintances in "store bitcoin on paper securely" using edgecase stuff has been: ~0.
14:42 asciilifeform thing is, erryone already has paper
14:42 stjohn_piano_2 variant in this case is: use raspberry pi to generate offline transaction to confirm address validity.
14:43 asciilifeform why generate tx to validate addr ? it's a pretty simple algo, with checksum
14:43 asciilifeform dun even need computer, really
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14:44 stjohn_piano_2 well, in my initial half-understanding of bitcoin, was nervous about moving bitcoin into offline address without knowing (for certain) that i could retrieve it.
↖
14:46 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: ftr 1 of the worst possible choices of iron for anyffin safety-critical
14:46 a111 Logged on 2015-03-07 00:01 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: and deliberately pseudo-open architecture (runs linux, sure, but with massive closed blobs required even to boot. and vendor regularly pays media mouthpieces to lie about it; also posts astroturfed comments)
14:47 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914041 << well, i don't yet know how to do ecdsa, ripemd160, sha256 on paper.
14:47 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 18:43 asciilifeform: dun even need computer, really
14:47 asciilifeform ( popularly said 'it is cheap at least', but even this is disinfo, there are similar chinese boards costing half or less )
14:48 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: all this is true. is it still a bad idea if you run the raspi offline forever?
14:48 asciilifeform certainly terrible idea, if yer using e.g. the onboard rng.
14:48 stjohn_piano_2 nope
14:48 stjohn_piano_2 dice.
14:48 asciilifeform i'd still rather use old 486 etc.
14:49 stjohn_piano_2 ah. when i started on quest, i had filed all computers under "untrustworthy".
14:50 stjohn_piano_2 having spent significant time in their guts
14:51 stjohn_piano_2 e.g. dig dig dig "ah, this Y is a wrapper around a half-melted X"
14:52 asciilifeform generally speaking, ideal irons for safety-critical system are from 'pre-internet age', i.e. the kind you could write working emulator for in a weekend or 2
14:52 a111 Logged on 2019-04-23 22:59 asciilifeform: here we go : 1801 schematics ; 1801 manual vol.1 1801 manual vol.2 .
14:53 asciilifeform see also mp_en_viaje's formulation .
14:54 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: yes. the approach, for now, is fine.
14:54 asciilifeform asciilifeform, for instance, has small stockpile of soviet-made cpu. not enuff for 'let's make wallet product', and certainly there aint enuff demand to even consider such thing, but for personal use.
14:54 stjohn_piano_2 i contemplated a future (my middle age?) in which all of the old stuff no longer works.
14:54 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: that 'future' is now.
14:55 stjohn_piano_2 ah cool
14:55 stjohn_piano_2 yes, very nearly. but some 90s-era cpus still run, no?
14:55 asciilifeform 70s, 80s, also work a+++
14:56 stjohn_piano_2 ah interesting. did not know that. had assumed old stuff would break in some way over time.
14:56 asciilifeform issue tends to be with 2000s 'konsoomer' irons .
14:56 a111 Logged on 2019-05-12 03:29 asciilifeform: mp_en_viaje: not only that period. i have strong suspicion that 'capacitor plague' never trooly ended, or will
14:56 stjohn_piano_2 aha.
14:56 asciilifeform around 10y ago the expectation became 'will be thrown out in 2-3y' and manufactured accordingly.
14:56 stjohn_piano_2 well, when (roughly) can ~all the 70s, 80s stuff be expected to be dead, purely from entropy.
14:56 stjohn_piano_2 ?
14:57 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: you will find interesting that it is possible to build computer to last 100+ yrs.
14:57 asciilifeform and without even trying specifically.
14:57 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: yes. i noticed. i have a 10yo macbook that functions still, while newer ones.... well, not so good.
14:57 asciilifeform i have 1980s items that still not only work, but with original seals.
14:57 stjohn_piano_2 huh. now that is interesting.
14:58 asciilifeform even hard disks.
14:58 stjohn_piano_2 so digging through junkyards is actually workable for my lifetime?
14:58 asciilifeform depends where -- over here in east usa, junkyard nowadays contains 2-3 y.o. comps.
14:58 stjohn_piano_2 i'm in the uk, for my sins.
14:59 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: consider a trip to e.g. romania .
14:59 a111 Logged on 2018-05-30 19:23 asciilifeform: http://www.loper-os.org/pub/timis17/timis_gypsies_1.jpg http://www.loper-os.org/pub/timis17/timis_gypsies_2.jpg http://www.loper-os.org/pub/timis17/timis_gypsies_3.jpg http://www.loper-os.org/pub/timis17/timis_gypsies_4.jpg http://www.loper-os.org/pub/timis17/timis_gypsies_5.jpg
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14:59 stjohn_piano_2 aha
14:59 asciilifeform take a large trunk or two.
15:00 stjohn_piano_2 question becomes: spend lots of time becoming expert in old tech, run homebrew hardware for running a wallet, but then: how to monetise? the expenditure in time alone is enormous.
15:01 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: i'll be the very last to say 'how to monetize'. the subj is re the simple matter of with what to construct machine so that you can even ~have~ money, should you come up with from where to get.
15:02 stjohn_piano_2 the question in my mind is: does this strategy lose out to write-bitcoin-scripts-in-scripting-language to run offline on whatever cheap hardware china makes?
15:02 asciilifeform the 20-30 serious btc people that apparently exist, already each constructed for himself an acceptable walletron, is my understanding.
15:02 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: ah.
15:03 asciilifeform the risk from using one built by another pair of hands, pretty much always makes it seem a losing proposition to purchase a walletron of any kind whatsoever. hence why the market for'em is fulla rubbish, built for chumps.
15:03 stjohn_piano_2 yeah.
15:03 asciilifeform consider how leonid brezhnev insisted on driving own limo.
15:04 asciilifeform there is famous joke from the time, where some official gets a ride in his car, and thinks 'who is that fella, who is so high and mighty that brezhnev himself is his driver !!'
15:04 asciilifeform ( 'important' was... his driver. who was there simply in case he gets tired. )
15:06 stjohn_piano_2 ouch.
15:06 stjohn_piano_2 although, i am surprised. i had thought "driver" was one category of subordinate where you could trust that the subordinate would do the work carefully, for his own sake.
↖
15:07 asciilifeform 'trust but verify'
15:08 asciilifeform sultan abdul hamid ii of course had guards. but also could, is said, hit a thimble from 50 metres with nagant, with either hand
15:09 asciilifeform ( and iirc so can mp_en_viaje )
15:10 asciilifeform point being, even if you have 100 pairs of hands, for the 1 that is actually attached to your shoulders there is not really a substitute.
15:10 stjohn_piano_2 ah.
15:11 stjohn_piano_2 yes. people try, but final responsibility can never be outsourced.
15:12 asciilifeform observe, on fg www, the series of 'and now x tested' links. the buyers, did not simply 'believe' that unit worx, they took the time to verify.
15:12 stjohn_piano_2 people reeeeally try though. "machine learning" (rather than "statistical sampler with paremeter adjustment").
↖
15:13 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje had a piece re the futility.
15:13 asciilifeform 'As to the agent... his interests are very much not aligned with theirs. He wants to take as much for himself -- as well is his right, and as exactly is proper. They should have nothing, and he should have it all.' etc
15:14 stjohn_piano_2 re: testing: excellent. i will eventually buy one. need to get a job first.
15:14 mp_en_viaje http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914042 << bitcoin addresses have a checksum built in, last coupla chars.
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15:14 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 18:44 stjohn_piano_2: well, in my initial half-understanding of bitcoin, was nervous about moving bitcoin into offline address without knowing (for certain) that i could retrieve it.
15:15 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform: thanks. i have read it already though (and much of trilema).
15:16 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914109 << yes. i didn't even trust the implementation of the hash function though. i started out with the assumption "it's all terrible" and the conclusion was "the only true test is to get a transaction from this address into the blockchain".
15:16 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 19:14 mp_en_viaje: http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914042 << bitcoin addresses have a checksum built in, last coupla chars.
15:17 mp_en_viaje i guess so.
15:17 mp_en_viaje you understand there's a (very theoretical) weaking of an address through reuse tho ?
15:17 stjohn_piano_2 yes
15:18 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: there's a potential down-side tho, of this method -- addr that has never transacted is shielded by the hash (i.e. the pubkey is not available to third party yet) as well as the ecc mechanism; one that has transacted , is only shielded by the latter
15:19 mp_en_viaje right.
15:19 stjohn_piano_2 yup
15:19 stjohn_piano_2 i wrote this up myself, to figure it out
15:19 * stjohn_piano_2 digs for link
15:19 stjohn_piano_2 http://edgecase.net/articles/using_a_transaction_to_validate_a_bitcoin_address
15:20 stjohn_piano_2 section is called "Does the hash in a Bitcoin address provide any protection?" (if you search the page for that string, you'll get to it)
15:20 mp_en_viaje http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914097 << some people use slave labour.
15:20 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 19:06 stjohn_piano_2: although, i am surprised. i had thought "driver" was one category of subordinate where you could trust that the subordinate would do the work carefully, for his own sake.
15:20 mp_en_viaje hard to beat the loving slave in most personal applications.
15:20 stjohn_piano_2 to quote myself "To attack a hidden-key address, an adversary would need to discover weaknesses in: ECDSA, SHA256, RIPEMD-160. These weaknesses would also have to be compatible. To attack a known-key address, an adversary would only need to discover a weakness in ECDSA."
15:21 stjohn_piano_2 mp_en_viaje: yes.
15:21 mp_en_viaje http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914105 << this is actually a pretty decent name for it. SSPA.
15:21 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 19:12 stjohn_piano_2: people reeeeally try though. "machine learning" (rather than "statistical sampler with paremeter adjustment").
15:21 mp_en_viaje parameter*, but anyway.
15:23 stjohn_piano_2 i'm going to get off the screen for today.
15:23 stjohn_piano_2 asciilifeform, mp_en_viaje: thanks again for the patient help.
15:25 asciilifeform stjohn_piano_2: laters.
~ 21 minutes ~
15:47 mp_en_viaje meanwhile in same old lulz : a) https://www.linkedin.com/in/nicolereneecichocki purged (ineptly, https://duckduckgo.com/?q=nicole+renee+cichocki][google] eg still lists it) ; b) spare invented http://www.truthbeautyandgoodness.net/about
↖
15:47 mp_en_viaje "Nicole's curiosity about life has put her on a path of ever-deepening self-discovery. She believes in gentleness towards oneself, practicing gratitude, always having fun, and that laughter is one of the great keys to well-being."
15:47 mp_en_viaje a ~hair stylist~, mind you.
15:52 diana_coman o.O they replaced her profile on linked in??
15:54 diana_coman lmao embeautyment
15:54 mp_en_viaje diana_coman, well, removed any tmsr reference on one ; invented a spare.
15:56 mp_en_viaje the mechanical similarity to the phuctor example should be illustrative enough. it's one thing for the "sceptical" tard to say whatever bla-bla re the former case ; but the two presented together are particularly strong, because absolutely the only commonality is their unpalatability to the femstate.
15:56 diana_coman ah, ah, purged refs on it; (linked in site was derping re login bla bla so I didn't get to see the content)
15:56 mp_en_viaje precisely how one defeats the pantsuit strategy : unconnected examples.
15:56 mp_en_viaje diana_coman, https://nl.linkedin.com/in/nicolereneecichocki also wants login /
15:57 mp_en_viaje ?
15:57 diana_coman yes
15:58 diana_coman at least on the public toilet I can even access it
15:58 mp_en_viaje (anyway, this is the answer, for the record, as to "but mp... why would you EVEN DO such a silly thing ?!?!" i do such "silly things" because nobody cancelled http://trilema.com/2012/strategic-superiority-a-saga/ ; i know what i wanted to have done last year to humiliate stupidity today.)
15:58 diana_coman on which I can access the linkedin site I mean; possibly some paywall or whatever, didn't bother to really go around it
15:58 mp_en_viaje diana_coman, i dunno, they do some rotation whining and displaying thing.
15:59 * diana_coman even still has somewhere a profile in there but can't be quite bothered atm about it
16:10 stjohn_piano_2 just back to say: solved (non-)mystery of OTP
16:10 stjohn_piano_2 by mistake, i was attempting to decrypt the OTP sent to asciilifeform
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16:11 stjohn_piano_2 in my notes, i had this sequence: 1) join forum, 2) deedbot will present OTP, 3) decrypt OTP, 4) use !!v OTP.
16:11 stjohn_piano_2 http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913654 << pattern-matched as "ah, here is OTP"
16:11 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 16:55 deedbot: Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/q34GD/?raw=true
16:11 diana_coman heh, as I was reading the log, I was wondering if you were trying there the right OTP or someone else's
16:11 diana_coman stjohn_piano_2: you need to ask; and it's a more general rule really
16:11 diana_coman nobody pushing stuff at you
16:11 mp_en_viaje diana_coman, https://i.ibb.co/9qMb2jS/nicole.png
16:12 stjohn_piano_2 diana_coman: yes. makes sense. annoying mistake on my part.
16:12 diana_coman btw re http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914012 -> I'd have thought you'd go straight for asciilifeform's TRNG schematics then, at the very least?
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16:12 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 18:34 stjohn_piano_2: mp_en_viaje: electronic engineering
16:12 stjohn_piano_2 ^ trinque. hope you see the above about OTP before doing any investigation.
16:13 diana_coman mp_en_viaje: ty
16:15 stjohn_piano_2 diana_coman: i had a look.
16:17 diana_coman stjohn_piano_2: re programming otherwise, there's eulora with a shit-ton of interesting stuff to do but there like ~anywhere, it's always about digging deeper rather than looking wider as it were
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16:19 stjohn_piano_2 diana_coman: gtg for now. will reply at a later date.
16:19 diana_coman laters
~ 58 minutes ~
17:17 BingoBoingo In other news: African Face http://archive.is/xOE0e#selection-825.1-831.174
17:22 mp_en_viaje the question as to WHY " They couldn’t even get real Africans for the parts. " is amusingly left unaddressed.
17:23 mp_en_viaje hey, maybe if real africans weren't really subhuman, they could be economically useful ?
17:23 mp_en_viaje #justathought.
17:23 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914135 << bahahahahaha! and for extra lulz, phuctor was 'replaced' in <2hrs -- whereas this took, wat was it, 6mo ?
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17:23 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 19:47 mp_en_viaje: meanwhile in same old lulz : a) https://www.linkedin.com/in/nicolereneecichocki purged (ineptly, https://duckduckgo.com/?q=nicole+renee+cichocki][google] eg still lists it) ; b) spare invented http://www.truthbeautyandgoodness.net/about
17:24 mp_en_viaje the answer's in http://trilema.com/2013/attention-cunt/
17:25 asciilifeform re wai took >6mo?! aint cunt supposed to be a nonmaskable-interrupt
17:25 mp_en_viaje "they know how to work those"
17:25 asciilifeform also wtf re the randomly dropping terrorist paragraph. normally they simply delete whole page
17:26 mp_en_viaje i dunno, "being plausibly deniable & unobvious" i guess.
↖
17:26 * asciilifeform guesses that if nicoleci were to log in an' put back, will find it readonly ?
17:27 mp_en_viaje nah, prolly stays for a while, is deleted again, then "please verify acct", then "here's an imaginary someone else by your name", then etc.
17:27 asciilifeform like erry other heathen 'host' www, 'linkedin' has 'term of service' where 'we can drop yer account if we dun like your face' . but iirc nuffin about 'we will blue-pencil paragraphs'
17:28 mp_en_viaje http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-01#1511945 and all that. socialism has a grand total of exactly 1 strategies.
17:28 a111 Logged on 2016-08-01 00:44 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-01#1511937 << oh, "color revolutions" dun work ? tell you what, we'll steal your country's exports and with the proceeds finance an alt-country we'll pretend is realy your country. ha-ha!
17:28 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: i actually used it briefly , many yrs ago, at the time it was just this tool for workers to drop in their cv and auto-spam it to employers etc
17:28 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, currently im most amused at the inventing imaginary person with the most obscure of names. somehow oddly this chick didn't exist last year.
17:29 asciilifeform oblig
17:29 mp_en_viaje "oh mp, existed, you just didn't dig deep enough" "yeah. right."
17:30 asciilifeform the sheer hamfistedness, pretty entertaining imho
17:30 mp_en_viaje ikr.
17:33 mp_en_viaje anyway, i dunno imperial "platforms" have much utility beyond this derivative comedy value, of making a laughingstock of the empire and it's inept movements.
17:33 * asciilifeform wonders whether fatlife yet 'replaced' mp_en_viaje with that old fart retired mayor d00d or who was it
17:34 mp_en_viaje heh. haven't logged in forever, they might even have.
17:35 mp_en_viaje i dunno, kinda thoroughly squeezed lemon, imo.
17:35 asciilifeform thought so, given as not mentioned in log for a while nao
17:37 mp_en_viaje yeah, cuz frankly i can't imagine what more.
17:38 asciilifeform iirc mp_en_viaje wrote a pretty good sifter for it, so if lemon had juice yet, would presumably still give juice
17:38 nicoleci it seems like some linkedin 'developers' read the logs and got butthurt
17:38 mp_en_viaje nicoleci, how you figure ?
17:39 nicoleci mp_en_viaje, it shows that people from linkedin viewed my profile and like asciilifeform said, why just delete the company instead of the whole profile
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17:39 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, part and parcel of problem there is fetlife really nosedived past ~coupla years. it's one thing to sift through mountain river for gold ; it's another to sift through garden hose spout.
17:39 mp_en_viaje nicoleci, ahahaha! can screencap ?
17:40 mp_en_viaje use alt-f2 in firefox to open up console, then type :screenshot filename.png --fullscreen
17:40 asciilifeform btw fwiw , http://www.loper-os.org/pub/ddg_nicoleci.jpg << ddg still lists
17:40 mp_en_viaje then upload to https://imgbb.com/ ; double-click on icon, left click copy image link
17:40 asciilifeform yandex ditto
17:42 asciilifeform nicoleci, mp_en_viaje : i have possible piece for this puzzler : asciilifeform's old notes suggest that this particular heathen pit structures text for censors as 'patch' deltas
17:42 asciilifeform hence why 'deleted 1 para' possib.
17:42 diana_coman possibly they "cleaned" her account for herself since it can't possibly be that she wrote such a thing there !!
17:42 asciilifeform diana_coman: there in fact are trojans which post spam to this & other heathen pits as 'updates'
17:43 asciilifeform so possibly framed as this, on the derp end
17:43 mp_en_viaje i'd expect. item leaks like a sieve.
17:43 diana_coman aha
17:43 mp_en_viaje in fact, possibly the WORST software i've ever seen.
17:43 nicoleci mp_en_viaje, cant since i clicked off and it now shows different views, unless of course i wanna pay for that sweet sweet premium account
17:43 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: it's a pretty standard, as they go, 'indian code'
17:43 asciilifeform rather similar to fatlife, arsebook, etc
17:43 mp_en_viaje ALL the script-side cleverness you can imagine, it;s beyond comprehension. i do nto expect they currently can maintain their codebase.
17:44 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, dissimilar in terms of complexity.
17:44 mp_en_viaje nicoleci, aok
17:44 asciilifeform india 'maintains'..
17:44 * asciilifeform can't speak re the complexity, did not use intensively
17:44 mp_en_viaje fetlife relatively straightforward naive, linkedin employs truly complicated tower of obfuscation to prevent scraping.
17:45 asciilifeform lol!
17:45 asciilifeform typically these , are the tallest piles o'shit
17:45 mp_en_viaje i didn't use at all. i know things through... guru meditation.
17:45 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, it;s so bad they're stuck having multiple paths for reliability.
17:45 asciilifeform ( result eventually is ~always where ~only~ scrapers can even read )
17:45 mp_en_viaje if you can imagine this.
17:46 asciilifeform nicoleci: lol, 'premium acct' ?! what do ~these~ get, 9000x faster censor ?
17:47 mp_en_viaje ie, if obfuscator of pathway A results in unloadable page, there's also pathway B.
17:47 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: via cloudfart or how
17:47 asciilifeform iirc we saw a thing like this at one pt
17:47 mp_en_viaje no, all in js.
17:47 asciilifeform a
17:47 asciilifeform nuts.
17:48 mp_en_viaje js deliverer estimates if the final webdocument whatever is right or not, tries diff approach.
17:48 asciilifeform sounds like typical india. betcha there's a 1000-tall pile of if-thens in there.
17:48 mp_en_viaje can play six hours of original doom on the cpu juice one linkedin pageload requires.
17:48 nicoleci asciilifeform, lol. you get the special privilege of getting the FULL linkedin approved names of whose viewed your profile instead of just the job titles, plus all the other hr bullshit like being able to post a job add
17:49 nicoleci they spam their premium feature
17:49 asciilifeform nicoleci: iirc this was a usg.valley play at 'arsebook, but for work, make it so that plebe can't find work if we kick him off site'
17:50 asciilifeform haven't heard much about it in past 5-6y tho
17:50 mp_en_viaje pretty much all of the "web 2.0" usg."tech" stuff peaked cca lehman brothers days.
17:51 asciilifeform btw there was an actual Official similar www for usg civil service. in, naturally, microshit 'asp', erry other page load was eggog
17:51 asciilifeform prolly still exists today.
17:51 nicoleci asciilifeform, sounds about right with the theme of connections vs qualifications
17:51 asciilifeform afaik the only ministry that didn't use it, was nsa, they had even shoddier thing in java
17:52 * asciilifeform 10y ago or so, was starving long enuff to actually try'em all
17:52 mp_en_viaje i imagine Mocky recently did also.
17:53 asciilifeform nsa had the classiest output, they actually sent ~snail mail~ 'we regret to inform you...' full year, like clockwork , erry 8 weeks
17:53 asciilifeform ( some statute required'em , iirc, to 'consider' applicant N times '
17:53 asciilifeform )
17:55 asciilifeform nicoleci: the 'connections' wank was hilarious. e.g. asciilifeform had generals, admirals, etc. as 'connections'
17:55 mp_en_viaje nicoleci, try the screenshot thing in any case, so you learn how to use it.
17:55 asciilifeform ( you could spam people and they usually clicked 'ok wainot' )
17:56 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, great way to earn a living from eg albanian secret service. "oh look, i have connection!!!"
17:56 nicoleci asciilifeform, 'we regret to inform you' is built into sites like careerbuilder and indeed jobs now. they even write the reject message for hr people
17:56 asciilifeform if they're dumbenuff, wainot
17:57 asciilifeform nicoleci: was form letter, mandated by statute in 1972 or somesuch
17:57 nicoleci mp_en_viaje, ok yes Master
17:58 asciilifeform the lulzy part was that snailmail, from ft meade, complete with eagles etc
17:58 mp_en_viaje not yet moved to octopi ?
17:58 asciilifeform this slightly prior to octopus with 'gott mit uns' lol
17:59 mp_en_viaje such a lizzard, that octopus.
17:59 nicoleci asciilifeform, i think it is still mandated to send letters for government jobs (more regulations for proof of hire eligibility)
17:59 asciilifeform (~that~ was logo of spy satellite ministry, iirc also applied there, but no snail)
18:00 asciilifeform on acct of some ancient and obscure bureaucratic degree, usg has ~two~ nsa, 1 usual and 1 that does sats
18:00 asciilifeform *decree
18:00 mp_en_viaje actually, for a decade or so it has a real nsa and the traditional nsa. on top of ^
18:01 asciilifeform ( + cia + two dozen or so misc. tentacles staffed mostly by ex-army )
18:01 asciilifeform and these
18:01 asciilifeform and whoknows whateelse, asciilifeform doesn't get reports on his desk re how many there are atm
18:02 asciilifeform the various lulzministries grow like mushrooms, there is no decree that they may not overlap, quite opposite
18:02 mp_en_viaje the less they do, the more are needed.
18:03 Mocky I used a few different sites, but nsa or anything with 'clearance'... not *that* hungry
18:03 asciilifeform naturally, like any other hypertrophied organ
18:03 asciilifeform Mocky: for extra lulz, i still get megatonnes of recruiter spam, 'dear sir, if you have 'top seekrit clearance', we have a ... opening'
18:05 Mocky I had one recruiter 'if you get hired, they will sponsor your clearance' 'no thx' 'what??!??'
18:06 asciilifeform Mocky: i left a slave galley at one time when they presented me with a fully-filled set of forms and 'we shall do you great honour, mr. d, already paid for, nao please sign here to take holy orders'
18:08 asciilifeform Mocky: the ones where already gotta be a eunuch right off the door, pretty easy to avoid
18:08 asciilifeform otoh the other kind, where you sit for 6mo and then 'we have a great honour for you...' trickier
18:08 mp_en_viaje http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/aX2bw/?raw=true << leaving aside nonstandard html codes, consider : 9452+3436+189943+46242+29630+76205+10674+604+1353+126745 = half mb of js.
↖
18:09 Mocky got my current job via linkedin, msg from recruiter wed, I answered thurs, interview friday and monday
18:09 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: half MB is even 'slim' by modern standards, for these.
18:09 mp_en_viaje https://static.licdn.com/sc/h/bimxgd2lcefc8j7rjufg6duxj sampler. and yeah, all instance-generated
18:09 asciilifeform of course generated. i doubt that the collective stable of monkeys have typed in half MB all together in 10y
18:09 mp_en_viaje asciilifeform, slim because naive derpitude load large piles of ~unused libs. but this is trimmed.
18:10 asciilifeform 'var Fingerprinting={sendFingerprint:function(b,d,e){var a=Fingerprinting.getFingerprintData(),c=new XMLHttpRequest;a["x-f-uc"]=e;a.csrf_token=d;c.open("POST",b);c.setRequestHeader("Content-type","application/json");c.send(JSON.stringify(a))},collectInitialFingerprint:function(b,d,e,a){setTimeout(function(){Fingerprinting.sendFingerprint(b,d,e)},a)}...' lol
18:10 asciilifeform + half MB of obfuscolade
18:10 mp_en_viaje yeah
18:11 mp_en_viaje then lulz like https://radar.cedexis.com/1556296336/radar.html?customer-id=11326 and https://i2-zuvofetrjalsubyssxcwblzgemxbus.init.cedexis-radar.net/i2/1/11326/j1/20/115/1558044281/0/0/providers.json?imagesok=1&n=0&p=1&r=0&t=1
18:11 Mocky rounded corners aint cheap
18:11 mp_en_viaje (citrixism)
18:12 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: entertainingly, some yrs ago i had to write a 'decompiler' for these, to pull out ie 'sploits etc
18:13 mp_en_viaje "Real user monitoring data drives all aspects of Citrix Intelligent Traffic Management Citrix collects information from across more than 50,000 networks daily. Over 130 Clouds, CDNs and Datacenters are measured daily. Hundreds of millions of clients generate over 14 billion RUM data points every day."
18:13 mp_en_viaje ~tor for corporate.
18:13 mp_en_viaje in fact, the codebase similarity is staggering.
18:14 asciilifeform 'convergent evolution' . y'know, like how 'new world' & 'old world' vulture, unrelated birds, but to naked eye exactly alike
18:16 asciilifeform upstack : asciilifeform at one time learned that nsa has an unofficial exemption from 'discrimination laws', they dun hire ru folx -- but china a+++ a-ok
18:17 mp_en_viaje rather, very narrow pool. as in http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913620
18:17 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 16:38 mp_en_viaje: it's my guess that systematically shooting about 15% or so of the first line troops would result in >80% deserion rate.
18:17 asciilifeform ( dunno re cia, was never yet hungry enuff to try ~there~ )
18:18 mp_en_viaje ~nobody available that can write the sort of shit they want, is willing to do it, and will even talk to them. so... reuse, recycle, reduce.
18:18 asciilifeform mp_en_viaje: i recall coupla yrs ago an nsa flunkie reportedly ate a bullet in afghan. was novel enuff that was newsworthy.
18:19 asciilifeform ( dunno how 'desk flyer' ends up in afghan, i guess grunts could not be trusted not to mate cable connectors using sledgehammer..? )
18:19 mp_en_viaje gotta distinguish the tiny core of productive employees from the large skirtings of african employees.
18:20 asciilifeform iirc we had coupla thrds re whether they even still ~have~ a 'core of productive' somewhere.
18:21 asciilifeform it dun take so many hands to turn 'and we put buffer overflow at X' from microshit, into 'deliverables'
18:21 mp_en_viaje well, this was more re producing the webolade.
18:21 asciilifeform last i knew, ~that~ was contracted out to same people who http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914284
18:21 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 22:08 mp_en_viaje: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/aX2bw/?raw=true << leaving aside nonstandard html codes, consider : 9452+3436+189943+46242+29630+76205+10674+604+1353+126745 = half mb of js.
18:22 mp_en_viaje both tor-likes and linkedin-likes are ~same vintage and ~same flavour for a reason.
18:22 asciilifeform it dun happen in the gulag proper
18:22 asciilifeform happens at 10-20man shops scattered all over
18:23 mp_en_viaje this is not coincidental ; nor is it yesterday or yesteryear vintage (which latest circumstance is prolly least happy re reich prospects)
18:25 mp_en_viaje Mocky, just sat and sifted through recruiter spam ?
18:26 Mocky in fact yes
18:27 mp_en_viaje aha.
18:37 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1914153 << lol, after asciilifeform went for tea thought 'hrm, that fp looked familiar', sure enuff http://btcbase.org/log/2019-05-16#1913962 << >> asciilifeform's primary sub fp
18:37 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 20:10 stjohn_piano_2: by mistake, i was attempting to decrypt the OTP sent to asciilifeform
18:37 a111 Logged on 2019-05-16 18:22 asciilifeform: Key ID - 0x889ACC4FC8EFFF13 is defo not any of his subs ~or~ the primary. trinque ^ prolly worth a look
18:37 asciilifeform but loox like stjohn_piano_2 realized already.
18:37 asciilifeform afaik 1st fella to press ~this~ particular 'anykey' ..
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18:39 asciilifeform 'doctor, you gave me these pills but nothing happens' 'didja take'em?' 'of course took, they're right here in my pocket'
~ 1 hours 25 minutes ~
20:05 asciilifeform in other ~recent lulz, 'Mar 9, 2019 - US citizens travelling to Europe will need to obtain a visa from 2021, the European Union (EU) has said.'
20:06 asciilifeform ( just as argentina stopped, lol )
20:06 asciilifeform at least this , 10bux, vs argie 200
~ 3 hours 29 minutes ~
23:35 mp_en_viaje 10 bux likely won't last, either.
23:36 asciilifeform noshit
23:36 mp_en_viaje it's transparently a slot for us to humiliate itself, which it won't do, so...
23:36 asciilifeform i dunget wai even start with 10
23:36 asciilifeform wainot 100, 1000
23:38 asciilifeform for so long as it's < the typical plane ticket, tourists will prolly still pony up
23:42 asciilifeform ( where is the limit of the 'brilliant biz plan', i have nfi, but they haven't even scratched surface yet.. )
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