00:08 |
asciilifeform |
signpost: at the risk of pedantry -- asciilifeform aint even convinced the #s are any good for ~that~ : |
00:09 |
asciilifeform |
signpost: quite possibly, they could change by any factor you like and life will remain essentially same as before. or, conversely, stay same, but at the same time -- tanks in streets. |
00:09 |
signpost |
yeah perhaps. |
00:09 |
asciilifeform |
fwiw su collapse wasn't especially related to any published #s |
00:12 |
asciilifeform |
the amt of effort which goes into fiddling the Official #s is not on acct of any physical effect of said manipulation. similarly to how the # of monk-hours spent in prayer in 1100s was not a metric connected with any physical effect. |
00:14 |
signpost |
what was interesting was that in billymg's graph the value of btc as a proportion of monetary mass (however inaccurately expressed) has been remaining roughly level for some time. |
00:17 |
* |
signpost unfortunately groggy from last night's gas leak episode and mild covid, so probably oughta shelve interpretation until brain's fully in gear. |
00:18 |
signpost |
I'd think there must be a great deal of BTC buying going on continuously if this proportion is remaining level while the denominator is exploding upward. |
00:19 |
signpost |
tldr: get 'em while they're hot. |
00:21 |
signpost |
probably the paperization of this "trade" is what undermines the thought, that printola can be aimed at causing futures ETFs to dump whenever the regime likes, and the redditards on exchanges will likewise panic. |
00:21 |
* |
signpost hopes there is another such panic soon, would be nice to separate such folks from their coin. |
| |
~ 41 minutes ~ |
01:02 |
mats |
its a dumb correlation that doesn't mean anything |
01:03 |
mats |
bitcoin is still tiny compared to the rest of the financial universe |
01:07 |
mats |
why would you add m1 to m2 ??? |
01:08 |
mats |
do you know that m2 includes m1? |
| |
↖ |
| |
~ 31 minutes ~ |
01:39 |
signpost |
I did not, so there you go. |
01:44 |
mats |
i feel a little bad about being aggressive, but there's a pattern of og bitcoiners making poorly formed claims about how things work |
| |
↖ |
01:45 |
mats |
and maybe theyve gotten used to it because other people who dont know better have given them the benefit of the doubt |
01:45 |
mats |
because they think youre rich and therefore competent |
01:57 |
signpost |
nah, just trying to make sense of a mad world, man |
| |
↖ |
01:57 |
signpost |
doesn't mean it will |
02:07 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-29#1070102 << at the risk of repeating self, it aint clear to asciilifeform that m1, m_n etc tell us anyffin useful re 'how things work' |
02:07 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 20:36:50 mats: i feel a little bad about being aggressive, but there's a pattern of og bitcoiners making poorly formed claims about how things work |
02:07 |
asciilifeform |
they're reich.fictions. |
02:08 |
asciilifeform |
while mats is technically correct, imho is rather like pointing out that light sword in star wars is exactly 1.8 metres or whatnot |
02:13 |
mats |
its not useful to call them fictions without explaining why you think it is |
02:14 |
mats |
everyone on the planet with money that has a vested interest in useful figures so they can monitor their business concerns, are all in on it? |
02:14 |
asciilifeform |
mats: what next, 'explain why you think' reich.inflation stat is fiction ? |
02:15 |
asciilifeform |
is mats's null hypothesis really that 'reich stats are troo' ? |
02:17 |
mats |
well, go on then |
02:17 |
asciilifeform |
mats: outta curiosity, do you believe e.g. stats published by pyongyang? (if not, why not?) |
02:17 |
mats |
every dealer with used car inventory is lying? |
02:17 |
mats |
everyone in the auto supply chain is in on the fiction? |
02:18 |
mats |
they've all hidden parts and cars in secret hangars? |
02:18 |
asciilifeform |
how does auto supply play into m1, m_n etc ? |
02:18 |
signpost |
you seem upset mats. |
02:18 |
signpost |
perhaps trying to raise awareness of groupthink you've seen on twitter. |
02:18 |
mats |
you mentioned inflation, which in usa refers to the consumer price inflation |
02:19 |
mats |
the 'all the stats are lying' is a useful shit test for people willing to swallow a lie |
02:19 |
mats |
or are we going to revisit the mp era again? |
02:19 |
asciilifeform |
mats: it aint a seekrit that the Official reich.inflation quite overtly excludes almost errybody's major expenses (housing, medical, collegism, etc) |
02:20 |
signpost |
mats: like I said, you're trying to start a fight with someone in your head. |
02:21 |
mats |
i understand that the way various items are weighted in cpi is opaque |
02:21 |
asciilifeform |
mats: asciilifeform's assertion aint 'they're lying', but that they've no obvious relation to physical reality, 'not even the kind of connexion that is contained in a direct lie' |
02:21 |
dulapbot |
(trilema) 2014-07-03 asciilifeform: 'But actually, he thought as he re-adjusted the Ministry of Plenty's figures, it was not even forgery. It was merely the substitution of one piece of nonsense for another. Most of the material that you were dealing with had no connexion with anything in the real world, not even the kind of connexion that is contained in a direct lie. Statistics were just as much a fantasy in their original version as in their re |
02:22 |
asciilifeform |
mats: there's nuffin opaque about the deliberate exclusion of e.g. housing cost |
02:22 |
asciilifeform |
(if it were to be included, the Official inflation would be 20-30% & climbing) |
02:22 |
asciilifeform |
usg would then have to index e.g. pensions to that, and would be zimbabwe broke by next mon. |
02:23 |
mats |
its not excluded lol |
02:23 |
mats |
you could truthfully say that you think its understated, but it is not excluded |
02:24 |
asciilifeform |
mats: this is rather obvious hairsplitting, and if somebody were doing it at you you'd balk |
02:24 |
* |
signpost reads https://www.bls.gov/cpi/factsheets/owners-equivalent-rent-and-rent.pdf for the hell of it. |
02:26 |
signpost |
bwahaha their official word is that only hypothetical rent is included because the rest is an investment instrument. |
02:26 |
signpost |
fuck 'em all. |
02:26 |
signpost |
mats: it would satisfy you in some way if I accepted ^ as sane? |
02:26 |
asciilifeform |
'Housing units are not in the CPI market basket.' |
02:28 |
signpost |
CPI samples are selected in stages. The sample of 87 CPI pricing areas was selected |
02:28 |
signpost |
first for use by all components of the CPI. The pricing areas are metropolitan areas |
02:28 |
signpost |
and smaller urban places selected to represent 38 CPI areas of the urban United |
02:28 |
signpost |
States. |
02:29 |
signpost |
they pick from wherever they like, I'm sure according to a standard of "fairness" which unweights the places people actually do productive work. |
02:29 |
asciilifeform |
indeed |
02:29 |
* |
signpost had enough of this fine govt website for today. |
02:30 |
asciilifeform |
the quickest way to see what reich stats are worth is to look at own wallet. asciilifeform's expenses in past 2y up considerably farther from the Official 6% or what was it. |
| |
↖ |
02:30 |
asciilifeform |
'your lying eyes' |
02:34 |
mats |
https://www.bls.gov/cpi/tables/relative-importance/2020.htm housing is about 42% of cpi |
02:36 |
signpost |
and if you look just below it's using the rent notion I linked. |
02:37 |
signpost |
and the sampling method. |
02:38 |
signpost |
at any rate, if mats wants to feel safe in the hands of his government, welcome to it. |
02:38 |
mats |
they get to these figures by surveying homeowners and renters, sure, that's problematic |
02:38 |
mats |
but you could say that, if you knew that was the case |
02:38 |
signpost |
I do not aspire to refine my recommendations for public policy. |
02:39 |
mats |
if you want to reach other people who might in principle would share your view of reality, you have to start with facts |
02:39 |
mats |
in principle share* |
02:39 |
signpost |
all I'm doing is tolerating your projections of what that may be. |
02:42 |
signpost |
my first word in the thread was how unclear all of it is, not an interpretation of the screen-squiggles. |
02:43 |
signpost |
anyway, perhaps mats can be bothered to make a more fundamental point. the current back-and-forth is pretty tedious. |
02:44 |
mats |
said what i meant to say, so i'll leave it here |
02:46 |
signpost |
mats: as for "revisit the mp era" perhaps this will clarify a bit http://ossasepia.com/2021/11/16/the-tragic-flaw-in-modern-interpretation/#comment-15771 |
02:50 |
signpost |
anyway, I like being called out dumb when merited. by far the best feature of TMSR. |
02:52 |
mats |
its easy to misunderstand what the measures are telling you if you don't care to look at exactly how it works |
02:53 |
mats |
usg has changed the calculation of cpi multiple times |
02:53 |
mats |
looking at the curve literally isn't useful at all |
02:53 |
signpost |
mats: not being glib here, but I'd genuinely read you on it if you wrote. |
02:54 |
signpost |
everyone accumulating his own pile of trivia and expecting that the other made same pile doesn't make for much. |
02:54 |
mats |
i've repeated some of the republic bullshit to actual finance people and learned very quickly how much of a retarded follower that i am |
02:56 |
* |
signpost has observed several folks just stick a minus sign in front of the "republic bullshit" and think they've fixed their heads. |
02:56 |
signpost |
at any rate, happy to hear what nuance there may be in CPI, if you were to inform me. |
02:57 |
signpost |
less happy to be a punching bag for all of TMSR philosophy, though I'm working to unwind some of that myself. |
02:58 |
signpost |
as it relates to mp, much of it probably has to be taken as propaganda intending to separate folks from the empire. |
02:59 |
* |
signpost figures also when people hear "propaganda" they think synonym for lies, and it's a completely other thing. |
02:59 |
signpost |
but anyway. |
03:00 |
mats |
https://www.bls.gov/cpi/additional-resources/historical-changes.htm |
03:01 |
asciilifeform |
from asciilifeform's pov, is very strange to see this kinda thing framed as a 'lol, mp ideology!' when can see not only own, but literally errybody in meatwot with palpably lighter wallets erry yr since 4evah ago on acct of prices |
03:01 |
asciilifeform |
'but you aint Typical Konsoomers' 'introduce me to a Typical Konsoomer plz' |
03:02 |
mats |
cpi isn't for individual consumption |
03:02 |
asciilifeform |
'avg. temperature in the hospital is only up 0.1 degree' 'but errybody is dying of typhus' 'so ok, we weigh the temp of the morgue occupants too, explain why shouldn't' |
| |
↖ |
03:03 |
mats |
if you want to look at how certain things have changed, there is e.g. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/csushpinsa |
03:04 |
signpost |
is the summary here "mats said memes from tmsr and got smacked by banker friends"? |
03:04 |
asciilifeform |
avg. temp incl. morgue. |
03:04 |
asciilifeform |
'let's include meth belt in house price index' yea |
| |
↖ |
03:05 |
mats |
there are housing prices indices for regions |
03:05 |
mats |
so you can exclude meth belt. |
03:06 |
asciilifeform |
mats: iirc you've lived in a # of locales in usa, and know that 'meth belt' is not geographically confined, can walk to outpost of it from almost anywhere |
03:07 |
signpost |
this is going to be a really stupid thread as long as mats refuses to state the case he wishes to make. |
03:07 |
signpost |
FRED's a decent source of economic stats? |
03:07 |
asciilifeform |
near as i can tell, the case is a variant of 'stop believing your lying eyes' |
03:08 |
mats |
the meth problem has really accelerated over the last decade |
03:08 |
asciilifeform |
i can look at own lightening wallet in one hand, and the Official stats in other hand, and guess which one will believe. |
03:09 |
mats |
i was very clear, not sure how to elaborate further without more tedious back-and-forth |
03:09 |
* |
asciilifeform finds this experience surreal, in the old sovok nobody one'd be likely to meet entertained belief in Official stats |
| |
↖ |
03:09 |
mats |
on meth, https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2021/11/the-new-meth/620174 |
| |
↖ ↖ |
03:09 |
asciilifeform |
in the current reich, otoh, constantly running into such folx |
03:09 |
signpost |
asciilifeform: look it's our first collapse! |
03:09 |
signpost |
:D |
03:09 |
asciilifeform |
signpost: 3rd, arguably |
03:10 |
signpost |
we're forgetful |
03:10 |
asciilifeform |
fdr's, then nixon's |
03:10 |
signpost |
mats: you have an ideological axe to grind behind the particulars. which is fine, I also. |
03:10 |
signpost |
but you should say it. |
03:11 |
mats |
i did. 'lying by statistics' is a real thing that happens, but you gotta be able to say what the lies are |
03:11 |
signpost |
or I could guess, but when you were doing that my direction was grating as all hell. |
03:11 |
* |
asciilifeform can't speak for mats, but suspects he is suffering from same malaise as e.g. asciilifeform's mother. i.e. doesn't like, ~really~ doesn't like the idea that he's living in a scaled-up pyongyang, hence 'it aint so' |
03:11 |
signpost |
mats: why would I spend effort trying to understand which of the US government's pronouncements are lies and which true? |
03:12 |
mats |
if i can't explain something to a first year student, i haven't really understood |
03:12 |
signpost |
mats: if we have good measures of inflation, what's the best way to normalize BTC price for it? |
| |
↖ |
03:13 |
mats |
i don't understand the question at all |
03:13 |
mats |
btc flows have nothing to do with consumer price inflation |
| |
↖ |
03:13 |
mats |
and i can't think of how the flows relate to monetary inflation either |
03:14 |
signpost |
you're kind of a miserable guy, in the end. |
03:14 |
mats |
like, maybe in a hand-wavey way |
03:14 |
signpost |
"hm what's this chart mean" "the government's economic statistics are reliable" "solve a problem with them" "what kind of an idiot asks this question' |
03:14 |
* |
signpost yawns |
03:15 |
* |
asciilifeform suspects 'religious' difference w/ mats, i.e. incompat. null hypothesese, will leave off for nao |
03:15 |
asciilifeform |
may just as readily ask dpb to explain why christmas celebrators are damned to 9th circle of hell |
03:16 |
signpost |
it's more like dpb importantly feigning masturbatory shock that you don't already know. |
03:16 |
signpost |
and even he doesn't do that. |
03:16 |
asciilifeform |
this thread will be a lulzy reread when usd goes ruble circa '93 |
03:17 |
asciilifeform |
(without anyffin in the way of 'warning' via 'm1' 'm2' etc) |
03:17 |
signpost |
if the USSR had invented MMT it'd be sending generation ships to alpha centauri today. |
03:18 |
asciilifeform |
mmt? |
03:18 |
signpost |
"modern monetary theory" |
03:18 |
asciilifeform |
a |
03:19 |
mats |
you could say that usg backstopping bonds has driven yields into the ground, and that this has sparked a rush into other asset classes like housing and bitcoin by allocators in search of yield |
03:20 |
asciilifeform |
hilariously was hrusch who 'drank the koolaid' and 1st demanded that the books actually balance (despite operating a command economy, with money as effectively ritual object), nearly tanked then |
03:20 |
asciilifeform |
mats: 'yield' in this case is 'keeping yer money' |
03:21 |
mats |
you could say that the decline of usd as a share of foreign reserves held by central banks has fallen to ~20y lows, sitting at 59%, and that the continuation of this pattern could lead to more flows into btc and eventual downgrading of usd |
03:23 |
signpost |
entirely reasonable to say that current BTC exchange rate really only reflects that it's the ultimate speculative object in a spectrum of them, if I interpret correctly. |
03:24 |
signpost |
seems both this can be true and that long-term holding addresses continue to accumulate, which appears also to be true. |
03:24 |
signpost |
I think I said way above that I hope the BTC speculative bubble pops, selfishly. |
| |
↖ |
03:25 |
* |
signpost is curious what other TMSR propaganda he sees in my thinking. |
03:25 |
mats |
the spot price is a terrible signal |
03:25 |
asciilifeform |
usg's entire anti-btc strategy currently seems to reduce to 'turn it into speculative hell', lest it become the obvious go-to inflation shelter |
| |
↖ ↖ ↖ ↖ |
03:25 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-11-22 13:23:33 asciilifeform: ( the lizard strategy is interesting imho: to mask the inflation shelter aspect of btc by artificially pumping it up and 'burying' the rise with paperola) |
03:25 |
mats |
one of many reasons it swings so heavily is because bitcoins and the rest of the cryptoasset universe trade 24/7 and are also highly liquid |
03:26 |
mats |
if you're lucky, cryptoasset to cryptoasset exchange can take as little as an hour, you'd be lucky to get a day in the rest of the fossilised financial universe |
03:26 |
signpost |
asciilifeform: yeah, the "no spot ETFs" position gives that away. |
03:26 |
asciilifeform |
(is wai they legalized 'institutional' leveraged-maggotting on top of btc) |
03:27 |
mats |
i find that complaining about bitcoin volatility is a lot like being mad that an airplane is flying instead of taxiing on the ground |
03:27 |
asciilifeform |
imho flew quite well enuff in '11 |
03:27 |
asciilifeform |
pre-'institutionalization' |
03:27 |
mats |
institutions have barely gotten started |
03:28 |
mats |
slow moving ships, those |
03:28 |
* |
asciilifeform counts the usg-tolerated goxes , which buy & sell largely imaginary coins, dispense leverage, etc. under institutions |
| |
↖ |
03:29 |
asciilifeform |
not merely e.g. investment banks |
03:30 |
* |
asciilifeform must bbl |
03:31 |
signpost |
yeah, I don't think it's surprising to say the game of financial corewars going on in crypto generates the volatility, and that this will go up. |
03:31 |
mats |
the 24/7 trading and liquidity is why volatility is so high, whenever the wind blows, folk can make emotional trades |
| |
↖ |
03:31 |
* |
signpost doesn't either expect to be a part of a revolutionary something which removes the folks kicking in the pool |
03:32 |
signpost |
long-BTC in my mind is a bet that the US meets its 1991 moment in my lifetime, and I don't care what the price is meanwhile. |
03:32 |
signpost |
I don't trade. |
03:33 |
mats |
meanwhile equities trading is highly compressed into ~30 hours a week |
03:36 |
mats |
anyway, good chat, afk |
03:37 |
signpost |
cya |
| |
~ 6 hours 42 minutes ~ |
10:19 |
sad235szd |
morning |
| |
~ 32 minutes ~ |
10:51 |
sad235szd |
any canadians here (or anyone with an opinion for this ) thoughts? [https://www.ubiworks.ca/guaranteed-livable-basic-income] [is there possibility of this to pass sooner OR later?] |
| |
~ 1 hours 40 minutes ~ |
12:32 |
scoopbot |
New post on btcinfo: Installing slimv using esthlos-v |
12:39 |
asciilifeform |
sad235szd: ithought they already had welfarism there ? |
12:44 |
asciilifeform |
sad235szd: 'ubiism' is political bait for idjits tho. keep in mind what happens to prices from demand-side subsidies. |
12:44 |
dulapbot |
(trilema) 2014-11-02 asciilifeform: i often wonder what take #2 would be like, if they understood what happens to price (e.g., usa with credit and 'college loans', etc) |
12:45 |
asciilifeform |
(e.g. landlord:'hey, nice, heard errybody's getting 5k$/mo for phree. yer rent is nao n+5k') |
12:46 |
asciilifeform |
$ticker btc usd |
12:46 |
busybot |
Current BTC price in USD: $47641.6 |
12:46 |
asciilifeform |
!w poll |
12:46 |
watchglass |
Polling 14 nodes... |
12:46 |
watchglass |
205.134.172.26:8333 : Alive: (0.081s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr=0.0.0.0:8333 Blocks=716396 |
12:46 |
watchglass |
205.134.172.6:8333 : (172-6.core.ai.net) Alive: (0.086s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr=0.0.0.0:8333 Blocks=716396 |
12:46 |
watchglass |
54.39.156.171:8333 : (ns562940.ip-54-39-156.net) Alive: (0.111s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=716396 |
12:46 |
watchglass |
205.134.172.4:8333 : (172-4.core.ai.net) Alive: (0.084s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=716396 |
12:46 |
watchglass |
205.134.172.27:8333 : Alive: (0.144s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=716396 (Operator: asciilifeform) |
12:46 |
watchglass |
205.134.172.28:8333 : Alive: (0.083s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr=0.0.0.0:8333 Blocks=716396 (Operator: whaack) |
12:46 |
watchglass |
71.191.220.241:8333 : (pool-71-191-220-241.washdc.fios.verizon.net) Alive: (0.170s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=716396 (Operator: asciilifeform) |
12:47 |
watchglass |
208.94.240.42:8333 : Alive: (0.143s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=716396 |
12:47 |
watchglass |
143.202.160.10:8333 : Alive: (0.245s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=716396 |
12:47 |
watchglass |
54.38.94.63:8333 : (ns3140226.ip-54-38-94.eu) Alive: (0.267s) V=88888 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.8.88.88/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=716396 |
12:47 |
watchglass |
94.176.238.102:8333 : (2ppf.s.time4vps.cloud) Alive: (0.364s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=715925 |
12:47 |
watchglass |
82.79.58.192:8333 : (static-82-79-58-192.rdsnet.ro) Alive: (0.407s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=715925 |
12:47 |
watchglass |
103.36.92.112:8333 : (terebe.ns01.net) Alive: (0.620s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=716396 |
12:47 |
watchglass |
75.106.222.93:8333 : Could not connect! |
12:48 |
asciilifeform |
sad235szd: in usa, they recently sent coupla $k to ~erryone 'for phree' ('stimulus'). all it did was create an auto shortage, morons immediately used the cheques as down-payments for auto loans |
| |
↖ ↖ |
12:49 |
asciilifeform |
~doubling prices pretty quickly. |
| |
~ 28 minutes ~ |
13:17 |
* |
whaack knows a canadian chick here cashing in on the ubi scam, afaik money winds up with a cr drug dealer shortly after it hits her bank account |
13:24 |
billymg |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-29#1070100 << thanks for pointing out the logic flaw in the chart, like signpost i'm just trying to find some useful signal, like everyone else |
13:24 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 20:00:14 mats: do you know that m2 includes m1? |
13:24 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 20:49:21 signpost: nah, just trying to make sense of a mad world, man |
13:28 |
billymg |
mats: what i was hoping to get from the chart was a sense of BTC's "share of the pie", it seems that might not be the right metric, USD spot is also a terrible measure of that because USD itself is unreliable |
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13:29 |
billymg |
that's also how i understood this question |
13:29 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 22:04:51 signpost: mats: if we have good measures of inflation, what's the best way to normalize BTC price for it? |
13:30 |
* |
billymg has nfi what "btc flows" are, perhaps mats will elaborate |
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13:30 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 22:05:31 mats: btc flows have nothing to do with consumer price inflation |
13:35 |
billymg |
mats: perhaps the word "inflation" is difficult to work with because of the various definitions and measures. but if one wanted a sense of bitcoin's share of global wealth, or % of global wealth stored in bitcoin, would one be able to calculate this (or even get remotely close)? |
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| |
~ 18 minutes ~ |
13:53 |
billymg |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-29#1070071 << had brought this up at some point too, yours seems cleaner than arbitrarily stripping in the bot/logger |
13:53 |
bitbot |
(pest) 2021-12-01 billymg: i'm also wondering what to do in the logger with the hearsay annotations in the future. should log bots just peer with everyone in the net? should it just be stripped off, or maybe shown on hover? there's also the issue that [] are valid characters in IRC nicks |
13:53 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 17:32:33 asciilifeform: considering a cmd for pest spec, 'SLAVE <handle>', for use w/ bots such as billymg's; sets a condition where broadcasts received via <nick> register as immediates |
| |
~ 16 minutes ~ |
14:10 |
billymg |
if bitcoin crashed back to 3 digits i'd run, not walk, to nearest office farm that would have me and start dumping ~90% of the proceeds into btc. i'm not holding my breath though because i suspect the entire reason they pumped it in the first place was to prevent plebs from loading up |
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14:10 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 22:16:48 signpost: I think I said way above that I hope the BTC speculative bubble pops, selfishly. |
14:10 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 13:18:55 asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-29#1070003 << reich pumped it, which makes it trivial for'em to then dump it |
| |
~ 16 minutes ~ |
14:26 |
sad235szd |
asciilifeform: idk, with all that automation |
14:26 |
sad235szd |
sure there must be some bright/good sides under the veil of the 'good intensions'/slavery m ? |
14:26 |
sad235szd |
*surely |
14:27 |
sad235szd |
i mean u become like fully dependent on gooberment/mercy of gooberment but still hah |
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↖ |
14:29 |
sad235szd |
btw naturally dried pineapple is the shit, you should try if , if not already )) |
| |
~ 18 minutes ~ |
14:47 |
shinohai |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-29#1070071 <<< this satisfies my lust for anti-pc things. |
14:47 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 17:32:33 asciilifeform: considering a cmd for pest spec, 'SLAVE <handle>', for use w/ bots such as billymg's; sets a condition where broadcasts received via <nick> register as immediates |
14:56 |
sad235szd |
in other news girly looks guilty but will that emerge amount to something, who knows |
| |
↖ |
14:56 |
cgra |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-28#1069958 << from a group of apparent, non-ideal options (incl markdown and 'roll your own'), i ended up choosing "reStructuredText" when deciding how to begin drawing down trb picture while eating the c++ spaghetti |
14:56 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-28 15:13:42 asciilifeform: what asciilifeform would much prefer is a non-retarded 'markdown' that knows how to order endnotes. but dun seem to exist |
14:56 |
cgra |
it may or may not fit your purpose, but at least it appears to properly permit multiple invocations of same footnotes and lets you define anchors you can organize irrespective of section numbering. i don't know if automatic section numbering works, in case you needed that also. |
14:56 |
cgra |
and no idea if helps anything re diagrams |
15:04 |
asciilifeform |
cgra: ty, will take a look |
15:06 |
cgra |
for me, for now does what md doesn't and i figured maybe can convert later to smth else with own code, if need be (speaking of which, not clear to this noob at all how to formulate a proper replacement) |
15:06 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-09-13 19:51:27 asciilifeform: a civilized replacement (sexprs!!!) for 'markdown' would be an a++ noob project. |
15:09 |
asciilifeform |
cgra: the scheme asciilifeform had in mind was (text "...foo..."), (link "http://foo"), (section "foo"), (subsection-n n "sectionname"), (endnote "endnote text"), etc |
15:10 |
asciilifeform |
... n being 'depth' of subsection |
15:11 |
asciilifeform |
output would be html, similar to markdown's |
15:12 |
asciilifeform |
'endnote' prolly oughta take a handle, so can use w/ 'link' |
15:12 |
asciilifeform |
(endnote foo "text") then can (link foo) |
15:13 |
asciilifeform |
or rather, (link "text" foo) |
15:13 |
asciilifeform |
imho whole thing'd be a pg or so of cl |
15:14 |
asciilifeform |
prolly could even bake it using 'cl-who'. |
15:15 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070300 << likely if they had enuff waterfall fuel to make this happen, already would |
15:15 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 09:02:10 billymg: if bitcoin crashed back to 3 digits i'd run, not walk, to nearest office farm that would have me and start dumping ~90% of the proceeds into btc. i'm not holding my breath though because i suspect the entire reason they pumped it in the first place was to prevent plebs from loadin |
15:16 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070310 << likely will get 'epsteined' in the clink, even if doesn't start squealing |
15:16 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 09:48:09 sad235szd: in other news girly looks guilty but will that emerge amount to something, who knows |
15:17 |
sad235szd |
ye it's possible |
15:17 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070296 << in actuality wealth aint printolade, or even btc, but goods/services; from this pov, 'btc's share of pie' (i.e. goods/services buyable directly with actual btc) is microscopic |
15:17 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 08:27:06 billymg: mats: perhaps the word "inflation" is difficult to work with because of the various definitions and measures. but if one wanted a sense of bitcoin's share of global wealth, or % of global wealth stored in bitcoin, would one be able to calculate this (or even get remotely close)? |
15:18 |
sad235szd |
yet epstein is not 100% dead imo |
15:18 |
sad235szd |
weird |
15:18 |
asciilifeform |
sad235szd: what makes you think he aint dead? |
15:23 |
asciilifeform |
billymg: keep in mind that 1 of the aims of reich's btc damping is to buy it up 'cheaply'. (certainly not for 'giveaway' of cheapcoinz to plebes) |
15:24 |
asciilifeform |
( hence the slow conversion of goxes into 'roach motels' where coin enters, but does not leave ) |
15:24 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 10:33:22 billymg: lol, from the same rag: "Korean crypto exchange ‎Coinone will no longer allow withdrawals to unverified external wallets" |
15:25 |
sad235szd |
idk from what i've seen/read/also a little bit of intuition |
15:25 |
sad235szd |
does deedbot still accepts registering for the wot btw |
15:25 |
asciilifeform |
!!help |
15:25 |
deedbot |
http://deedbot.org/help.html |
15:25 |
deedbot |
http://deedbot.org/help.html |
15:25 |
asciilifeform |
hm signpost , bug ^ ? |
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15:26 |
asciilifeform |
sad235szd: i expect !!register worx |
15:26 |
sad235szd |
i mean ive posted few times but not from the paste.deedbot , does it works with external cer |
15:26 |
asciilifeform |
oughta |
15:26 |
sad235szd |
then strange |
15:27 |
asciilifeform |
sad235szd: try it, and if barfs, i expect signpost will help you when he wakes up |
15:28 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070306 << it aint as if there's any shortage of reading material re what it's like to be warehoused in a reich-sponsored flat, for instance. |
15:29 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 09:19:08 sad235szd: i mean u become like fully dependent on gooberment/mercy of gooberment but still hah |
15:29 |
asciilifeform |
( if yer in usa, can walk to nearest 'section 8 park' and see for yerself ) |
15:32 |
sad235szd |
i know only section.80 |
15:32 |
sad235szd |
kendrick lamar :>> xaxa |
15:34 |
sad235szd |
will try to get informed throughout |
15:39 |
skylamer |
!!register https://pastebin.com/raw/kUjx0PJX |
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15:39 |
skylamer |
nope |
15:44 |
shinohai |
I'll be back on pestnet later, having comcast issuez |
| |
~ 15 minutes ~ |
15:59 |
mats |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070285 << The auto shortage is the product of supply chain issues, ie, supply-driven, not demand-driven. i believe a majority of stimulus checks went into the stock market |
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15:59 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 07:40:52 asciilifeform: sad235szd: in usa, they recently sent coupla $k to ~erryone 'for phree' ('stimulus'). all it did was create an auto shortage, morons immediately used the cheques as down-payments for auto loans |
16:00 |
mats |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070291 << I think realised cap is a more useful signal than market cap. I compare btc’s realised cap today, 0.45tn, with the rest of the financial universe: gold is about 10tn, usd 21tn, global stock market cap 100tn |
16:00 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 08:20:10 billymg: mats: what i was hoping to get from the chart was a sense of BTC's "share of the pie", it seems that might not be the right metric, USD spot is also a terrible measure of that because USD itself is unreliable |
16:01 |
mats |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070294 << flows are the movement of money |
16:01 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 08:22:27 billymg: has nfi what "btc flows" are, perhaps mats will elaborate |
16:03 |
mats |
many populists believe the fed is to blame for today's inflation problems, i think that's a mistake |
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↖ ↖ |
16:16 |
sad235szd |
yea jfk knew it was a mistake, too |
16:17 |
billymg |
mats: that's sort of what it sounded like. so flow would be another term for the "velocity of money"? or different? |
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16:18 |
billymg |
the reason for my confusion was because the question was posed as "what's the best way to normalize BTC price for [inflation]?" -- i.e. didn't see anything in the question about "flows" |
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↖ |
16:24 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070356 << 404 ? |
16:24 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 10:31:34 skylamer: !!register https://pastebin.com/raw/kUjx0PJX |
16:24 |
billymg |
re: inflation: to me if you have 10 gold bars in the world and each is worth $10M, if 10 more are dropped from space you now have 20 and each is worth $5M. so yes, if the fed printer goes brrr, i see that as having a direct effect on price inflation |
16:26 |
asciilifeform |
billymg: not necessarily linear |
16:29 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070359 << quite conceivably tru re desk-fliers; otoh asciilifeform lives in a 'working class' neighborhood and was able to see with naked eye a # of new autos appearing erry time that printer went brr |
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↖ ↖ |
16:29 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 10:51:52 mats: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070285 << The auto shortage is the product of supply chain issues, ie, supply-driven, not demand-driven. i believe a majority of stimulus checks went into the stock market |
16:30 |
asciilifeform |
would be surprising if this ~hadn't~ eventually created parts shortage. |
16:35 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070368 << imho this is a 'phlogiston'. i.e. implicitly assumes that there is such a unit as 'actual money' and that usd, btc, are at any given moment simply multiples of said unit. whereas no such entity exists. |
16:35 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 11:10:51 billymg: the reason for my confusion was because the question was posed as "what's the best way to normalize BTC price for [inflation]?" -- i.e. didn't see anything in the question about "flows" |
16:50 |
billymg |
asciilifeform: right, not linear, just saying if you keep printing more dollars you can't expect them to hold the same purchasing power forever |
16:51 |
billymg |
which i didn't even think was controversial |
16:51 |
asciilifeform |
billymg: not only not holds same purchasing power, but as the destruction of the industrial economy carries on (by, among other means, printolade-flooding) the purchasing power drops nonlinearly |
16:52 |
asciilifeform |
already there are things you can't easily buy, whether you have a stash of usd, gold dubloons, or even btc |
16:53 |
asciilifeform |
( recall e.g. mp's piece where 'turkeys are finite' ) |
16:54 |
billymg |
asciilifeform: yeah, not disagreeing, just waiting to hear how it's not the fed's fault |
| |
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16:54 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 10:55:44 mats: many populists believe the fed is to blame for today's inflation problems, i think that's a mistake |
16:55 |
billymg |
asciilifeform: not sure if the same piece but the mpism i remember is "something something take dollar buy a bun take a billion dollars buy a billion buns. there ain't a billion buns!" |
16:55 |
asciilifeform |
approx |
16:56 |
asciilifeform |
historically hyperinflation comes from simple attempt to maintain 'biz as usual' in spite of not having with what |
16:56 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-09-27 10:49:47 asciilifeform: PeterL: both come from same root -- lizards' desire to keep their yachts, palaces, and cocaine despite a collapsing support base. i.e. same thing that happened in e.g. argentina. (or 1700s fr. for that matter. and plenty of other places.) |
16:57 |
asciilifeform |
e.g. '20s austria trying to keep vienna going despite no longer having countryside of the empire connected to it |
17:02 |
asciilifeform |
after not too long, you end up with actual physical problems which are no longer correctable by fiddling paper. e.g. shortages of fuel, parts, transport, for farm equip., consequent food scarcity, the inevitable requisitions and resistance to same, etc |
17:08 |
asciilifeform |
(incl. 'labour shortage' where folx dun see a point in clocking in while remaining homeless ) |
17:08 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-24 22:11:54 asciilifeform: ( or they will replace the workers who can't live on the inflatola and dun see point in working ? ) |
17:13 |
asciilifeform |
hoarding supplies becomes the obv. smart thing to do, putting further pressure on suppliers |
17:14 |
asciilifeform |
whole process moar or less exhaustively documented, repeated many times in past century. |
| |
~ 1 hours 14 minutes ~ |
18:29 |
* |
asciilifeform updated 0xFC draft with fix for this gotcha, and with 'SLAVE'/'UNSLAVE' cmds. |
| |
↖ |
18:29 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-10 13:03:12 jonsykkel: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-09-19#1058812 << if this is a point you get same with address cast 276byte ciphertext |
18:29 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-29 17:32:33 asciilifeform: considering a cmd for pest spec, 'SLAVE <handle>', for use w/ bots such as billymg's; sets a condition where broadcasts received via <nick> register as immediates |
18:29 |
asciilifeform |
^ achtung thimbronion , jonsykkel , et al |
18:29 |
* |
asciilifeform aware of various other things that must be done re spec but sadly short on time atm |
18:42 |
jonsykkel |
cool, il update my thing |
18:42 |
asciilifeform |
ty jonsykkel |
18:43 |
* |
asciilifeform not had chance to test jonsykkel's pestron just yet |
18:45 |
jonsykkel |
no hurry, will still murder testnet if connected to it anyway |
18:46 |
asciilifeform |
jonsykkel: how's that? |
18:46 |
asciilifeform |
(spams?) |
18:46 |
jonsykkel |
blatta9983 crashes when recv getdata messages |
18:46 |
asciilifeform |
aa |
18:46 |
asciilifeform |
tsk |
18:47 |
jonsykkel |
(potentialy other unhandled ones as well, dunno dident test) |
18:47 |
asciilifeform |
the correct behaviour per spec is to ignore unspecified msg coads |
18:47 |
jonsykkel |
indeed |
18:47 |
asciilifeform |
( subj ) |
18:59 |
signpost |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070344 << yeah, it didn't like having two processes running against same db. I shut off the #pest one for now. |
18:59 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 10:18:03 asciilifeform: hm signpost , bug ^ ? |
19:00 |
asciilifeform |
a |
19:00 |
signpost |
was farting responses arbitrarily to either depending on which won the race |
19:01 |
signpost |
sad235szd: feel free to register |
19:05 |
shinohai |
jonsykkel: iff'n ya want to peer using yer smol pest, feel free to gpgram me a key. |
19:07 |
jonsykkel |
shinohai: aight can do that, lemme quickly add slaves and addrcasts first |
19:07 |
shinohai |
kk |
19:11 |
asciilifeform |
'haste makes waste', jonsykkel , dun hurry to add knobs |
19:13 |
jonsykkel |
sure, these particular updates are 5lines of code however (addr cast was done already. just gotta padding 266->262) |
19:14 |
signpost |
sad235szd: when you reg, use http://paste.deedbot.org/ per http://deedbot.org/help.html |
19:16 |
asciilifeform |
jonsykkel: a ok |
19:17 |
asciilifeform |
signpost: ha, asciilifeform in fact fughot that it requires paste.deedbot, thought it eats whatever url |
19:17 |
asciilifeform |
(like !!deed) |
19:23 |
signpost |
actually might not even require that, dunno what the gent did |
19:23 |
signpost |
but I'm around, can retry whenever |
19:24 |
signpost |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070365 << seems weird that there would be a singular blame. |
19:24 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 10:55:44 mats: many populists believe the fed is to blame for today's inflation problems, i think that's a mistake |
19:26 |
* |
signpost wouldn't be surprised if much of the brrrrr is circulating in the casinos, sure. |
19:27 |
signpost |
but (speculating here, so watch your blood pressure) I wouldn't be surprised if casino patrons take their winnings and seek yield elsewhere, driving bubbles in things that would be considered "consumer inflation" |
19:28 |
signpost |
housing, I'd be shocked if you argued it hadn't been turned into a speculative instrument, so much so that zillow et al are getting in. |
19:29 |
signpost |
supply chains are also casino-ified, no? freight derivatives and so on. |
19:32 |
asciilifeform |
signpost: often enuff, i'd suspect, elementary 'lemme buy x nao before can't any longer' |
19:32 |
asciilifeform |
auto, house, tinned food, gpu, you name it |
19:32 |
signpost |
yeah, that's "incentivize spending not hoarding (TM)" in the limit, eh? |
19:32 |
asciilifeform |
aaha |
19:33 |
asciilifeform |
is how weimarization typically goes. |
19:33 |
* |
shinohai is looking at a fully-restored 1988 Mazda RX-7 that comes with asking price of $9K |
19:34 |
* |
asciilifeform recalls when a fella tried to sell him precisely that one for btc, in '14 |
19:35 |
shinohai |
This one comes with spare 13B engine, so I can practice my die grinding skills! :D |
19:35 |
asciilifeform |
shinohai: if you go in for that kinda thing, wainot |
19:35 |
* |
signpost haz a tundra that'll probably last him til unborn kids go to college |
19:37 |
* |
asciilifeform recently bought an ancient, rusty f150 w/ 8ft bed, for work on new pad. still running month later |
19:37 |
signpost |
mats: anyway to wrap up, perhaps assuming a fiat currency must exist (which I don't), the fed has done the right things given circumstances. this will still fail as all central planning of things too big to understand fail. |
19:37 |
shinohai |
Sadly it would be a "weekend" or track car. I think the Georgia Highway Patrol would frown upon me stowing whores in the hatch ..... |
19:38 |
signpost |
whether that failure is reflected in degradation of food, still-shittier plastitextiles, w/e, doesn't really matter to me. |
19:38 |
asciilifeform |
imho 'blame fed' is rather like to 'blame gosplan' for su collapse. it aint 'blameless', but is merely instrument of lizards |
| |
↖ |
19:38 |
signpost |
and I believe "everyone knew" the soviets were just about to surpass us in all economic measures right up until they crumbled. |
19:39 |
jonsykkel |
2nd gen rx7 very gool car. turbo? |
19:39 |
signpost |
maybe mats has been making some money in the markets, which if so, great! |
19:39 |
shinohai |
jonsykkel: yes, single precision turbo 68 |
19:39 |
jonsykkel |
nice |
19:40 |
sad235szd |
i am here |
19:40 |
* |
sad235szd is back |
19:40 |
shinohai |
Same guy also haz 1993 FD with a $45K tag on it, 88mm turbo on that one,, i'ts an angry lil bitch. |
19:40 |
sad235szd |
so signpost, it's just doesn't work it seems idk why tried both in chan and in /q |
19:40 |
jonsykkel |
i bet |
19:41 |
asciilifeform |
sad235szd: try again nao |
19:41 |
sad235szd |
oks |
19:41 |
jonsykkel |
not as good looking tho |
19:42 |
signpost |
you are missing the protocol on your url |
19:42 |
shinohai |
im just a sucker for the1988 model w/ 5-speed, they are getting rarer to find unmolested. |
19:43 |
jonsykkel |
anything else than manual useless |
19:43 |
sad235szd |
says 'already registered' |
19:43 |
sad235szd |
hmm |
19:43 |
signpost |
then it is |
19:43 |
signpost |
one of your attempts worked |
19:43 |
sad235szd |
cool |
19:43 |
signpost |
why do you keep switching out of the nick you registered? |
19:43 |
sad235szd |
cuz i was checking on the site, is there irc command for that tho |
19:44 |
sad235szd |
habit |
19:44 |
signpost |
site's generated by a batch job at an interval |
19:44 |
sad235szd |
oh |
19:44 |
signpost |
just keep whichever name you want to use |
19:44 |
sad235szd |
okay |
19:45 |
sad235szd |
but it had ` ( a special character ) in it when was the gpg first reg, is that a problem tho? |
19:46 |
sad235szd |
from now on im with da new nikkk |
19:46 |
signpost |
it stored whatever you registered. |
19:46 |
skylamer` |
thanks |
19:54 |
skylamer` |
truth or ? not |
19:56 |
shinohai |
skylamer`: I investigated, found true. |
19:56 |
jonsykkel |
accurate enuf |
20:02 |
skylamer` |
the randomized study succeded |
20:04 |
signpost |
moar signal plz, less noise |
20:15 |
shinohai |
jonsykkel: can haz vpatch when you add the new bits, etc ? |
20:16 |
jonsykkel |
shinohai: sure il put on www and let u know |
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~ 39 minutes ~ |
20:56 |
jonsykkel |
asciilifeform: are you meant to check that speaker field matches peer that you successfully decrypted addr cast from? (if not, how to distinguish bounce baks of own addr casts) |
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~ 1 hours 36 minutes ~ |
22:32 |
mats |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070367 << velocity of money is a different thing. flow is the net of all cash inflows and outflows |
22:32 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 11:09:44 billymg: mats: that's sort of what it sounded like. so flow would be another term for the "velocity of money"? or different? |
22:33 |
mats |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070383 << like i said before, the current inflation woes are due to supply-side problems, not monetary policy |
22:33 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 11:46:26 billymg: asciilifeform: yeah, not disagreeing, just waiting to hear how it's not the fed's fault |
22:37 |
mats |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070373 << sure, the printer is sortof to blame. but also, people have been shut-in for a long time, discretionary spending on cafes, beers, restaurants, gas and car insurance, night clubs, etc, went way down, while checks and unemployment insurance kept rolling in |
22:37 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 11:21:25 asciilifeform: http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070359 << quite conceivably tru re desk-fliers; otoh asciilifeform lives in a 'working class' neighborhood and was able to see with naked eye a # of new autos appearing erry time that printer went brr |
22:37 |
mats |
lots of pent-up demand there |
22:40 |
mats |
and lots of handouts. student loan payments were suspended -- still are, until at least may2022 and possibly even through midterm election season -- and the intervening period even counts toward public service loan forgiveness time |
22:40 |
signpost |
yeah, trying to recall where I saw an interesting graph of how much retail spending had been pulled forward according to the historic trend. |
22:41 |
mats |
a nice little giveaway for public slaves |
22:43 |
signpost |
sounds like you lay more blame on direct authoritarian intervention than monetary policy. seems pretty reasonable to me. |
22:43 |
signpost |
except insofar as authoritarian control of the monetary policy (including monetizing govt debt) enables the interventions. |
22:44 |
mats |
tapering hasn't begun yet, overnight reverse repos are still in progress |
22:44 |
mats |
but it is important to separate out the factors instead of flailing |
22:45 |
signpost |
sure, I'm enjoying you laying it out. |
22:46 |
mats |
in other news, https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/Datawatch/Central-banks-accelerate-shift-from-dollar-to-gold-worldwide |
22:47 |
mats |
https://blogs.imf.org/2021/05/05/us-dollar-share-of-global-foreign-exchange-reserves-drops-to-25-year-low |
22:47 |
mats |
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2021-12-14/doj-china-initiative-to-catch-spies-prompts-fbi-misconduct-racism-claims |
22:48 |
mats |
https://archive.is/c3QMw FT "The oldest asset class of all still dominates modern wealth: Low interest rates in advanced countries have pushed money into real estate instead of business investment" |
22:49 |
mats |
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/nov/07/what-have-low-interest-rates-done-for-britain-depressingly-little-bank-of-england |
22:50 |
mats |
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/may/6/general-chinas-africa-outreach-poses-threat-from-a |
22:53 |
asciilifeform |
http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2021-12-30#1070489 << there's no wot entry / key for self, so this aint actually a problem |
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22:53 |
dulapbot |
Logged on 2021-12-30 15:48:14 jonsykkel: asciilifeform: are you meant to check that speaker field matches peer that you successfully decrypted addr cast from? (if not, how to distinguish bounce baks of own addr casts) |
22:54 |
asciilifeform |
thinkaboutit. |
22:55 |
asciilifeform |
value of speaker field dun make any diff there. |
22:57 |
jonsykkel |
asciilifeform: theres isnt wot entry for self, but the addr casts are rebroadcast, so you get your own casts returned back to you and decryption will succeed for peer that you originally created that cast for |
22:57 |
asciilifeform |
oh hm |
22:57 |
jonsykkel |
(aka will look like cast originated from that peer, if only look at stuff inside Text field) |
22:58 |
asciilifeform |
jonsykkel is right, oughta specify that speaker field matches |
22:58 |
* |
asciilifeform will amend spec |
22:58 |
jonsykkel |
alrite |
23:05 |
asciilifeform |
done. ty jonsykkel . |
23:05 |
jonsykkel |
exelent |
23:08 |
asciilifeform |
a possibly more general point is that a station ought not to process incoming messages which appear to be from self, at all |
23:09 |
asciilifeform |
(nor should it rebroadcast a message back to its originator, ever) |
23:09 |
asciilifeform |
both are iirc known bugs in the current blatta |
23:10 |
asciilifeform |
prolly also oughta be in spec |
23:10 |
* |
asciilifeform not atm awake enuff to properly saw on the spec |
23:14 |
jonsykkel |
i think can simply put all messages you originate in dedup buffer |
23:15 |
jonsykkel |
if rely on speaker field might get problems if change handle at wrong moment and so on |
23:15 |
jonsykkel |
not that that would happen very often exactly |