Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2018-12-11 | 2018-12-13 → ↓
00:05 feedbot http://bimbo.club/?p=103 << Bimbo.Club -- TMSR Log Summary - 11/20/2018
~ 4 hours 28 minutes ~
04:33 phf i was confused by the correctness/fairness thread, until i realized that the use of the word "fair" has changed to its complete opposite from the traditional western use. in folklore fair is a sometimes begrudging recognition and internal compromise of correctness: something is not to your liking, but it's fair, i.e. correct
04:40 phf fair has been since long hijacked by socialist, so preoccupation with fairness is an indicator
~ 5 hours 29 minutes ~
10:10 mircea_popescu hey Mocky_ how's the hunt going ?
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10:12 mircea_popescu phf the folk fairness you think of is purely eastern. western fairness was always female-driven, and socialistically flavoured.
10:13 mircea_popescu east of the hajnal line, "fair" means "it's true i'm a poor peasant who needs this chunk of bread, yet the devil saw it first and well... fair is fair"
10:13 mircea_popescu west of the hajnal line, however, "fair" is exclusively found in "it's not fair that old man's daugther do all the work while old woman's daugthers get all the praise"
10:15 mircea_popescu and yes, the distinction is very specifically driven by the "marriage patterns", ie, western franks allowing women much more choice in mating (resulting predictably in a large contingent of unmated females, a larger still contingent of mated-once, and a much later first mating overal). all this produces a lot of idle time to waste wringing wrists.
10:17 mircea_popescu nicoleci it occurs to me summarizing may be not the best use of your time. how about you switch to some http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-04#1878206 instead ?
10:17 a111 Logged on 2018-12-04 00:58 asciilifeform: i dun expect these will ever be OCR'd, hand-typesetted-cum-diagrams newtonola is possibly a bridge too far for ocr.
10:18 mircea_popescu pick one article from there (preferably -- something interesting!), and make a post of it. transcribe it correctly, include all images (cleanned up if they need it ; or restated as http://trilema.com/2018/how-to-html-math/ if practicable) and there you go.
10:23 asciilifeform oh guten morgen mircea_popescu !
10:23 mircea_popescu hola!
10:23 mircea_popescu i wake up, with a bladder fulla pee and a bladder fulla words. and more than half the time it's the 2nd that actually makes snoozing impossible.
10:23 mircea_popescu modern man eh.
10:23 * asciilifeform still grinding through htmlization of ch14, grr
10:28 mircea_popescu asciilifeform trilema readership has an idea for you! http://trilema.com/2018/how-to-html-math/#comment-127197
~ 33 minutes ~
11:02 BingoBoingo !!gettrust cruciform
11:09 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i saw the plugin thing earlier. it has exactly same problem as latex-by-hand -- bitmapism, resulting in nonsearchable and nonseeable-in-lynx etc text
11:10 asciilifeform if i were writing for dead tree, would've latexed long ago. but i aint
11:10 mircea_popescu but you ~could~ add the actual latex source as an alt tag on the image, resulting in... searchable, and viewable in [correctly working] lynx.
11:11 asciilifeform alt-tags aint searchable in graphical browser
11:11 asciilifeform i want searchable-errywhere.
11:11 mircea_popescu there's no way out of this, alf : inasmuch as "math" is not fully alphabetic (as it isn't, because it includes procedural items as well as characters) you WILL HAVE TO add some notation to your "text".
11:11 mircea_popescu and the way this wound will heal is exactly thus : properly adnotated math that then is properly rendered WHERE TERMINALS WORK
11:11 mircea_popescu and there only.
11:12 mircea_popescu don't try to fix people's terminals from across the cable.
11:12 asciilifeform if html centralcommittee had been slightly less retarded, we could've had bitmaps with searchable backing text; or font-height attribute; or any number of 1 thing that'd cure the retardation. but so happens that they were dropped as children, and so we have this.
11:12 mircea_popescu nevermind that. really nobody cares what the empire does.
11:12 asciilifeform i care strictly when stuck cleaning up the splatter with own hand.
11:14 asciilifeform meanwhile, in other tardations, re http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-11#1879893 >> the radiographers all seem to want 2-3k. which is lulzy, cuz for half of that one can simply buy the machine..
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11:14 a111 Logged on 2018-12-11 23:38 asciilifeform: in older lulz, 1d 18h left on the https://www.ebay.com/itm/Symbolics-MacIvory-model-3-8-MW-in-an-Apple-Quadra-650-80-MB-9-GB-Genera-8-3/113428507092 auction; i'ma bid, and if can get for under 5 , will have the thing xray tomographied ( sadly i have a quite finite budget presently for the proj )
11:14 mircea_popescu so do the sane thing, make bitmap with latex tag, and be done with it.
11:16 asciilifeform so happens that already wrangled the heaviest piece into shape
11:18 mircea_popescu tbh im not even sure what we want for a web scripting language is php, ie, "text preprocessor"
11:19 mircea_popescu what we really want is probably some derivation of latex.
11:19 mircea_popescu i utterly don't need a scriptable wrapper to do string manipulation, what the holy shit is this, onyl someone who grew up on c strings can imagine such nonsense.
11:30 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: if had browser that eats sane sexpr instead of the customary shitsoup, good % of what folx want in 'processor' falls away
11:30 mircea_popescu aha.
11:31 mircea_popescu nfi what they were thinking when they came up with the <tag> bs.
11:31 asciilifeform whole thing is fractally retarded
11:31 mircea_popescu srsly now, who farted that low level abstraction ?
11:31 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: ibm.
11:31 mircea_popescu sounds like one of the fet tards.
11:31 asciilifeform recall, sgml committee.
11:31 mircea_popescu "oh, arbtrarily placed tags that sometimes close"
11:31 mircea_popescu wtf.
11:34 mircea_popescu and the thing that truly gets my goat, is that all this inane "simplicity -- computers have to do the work for people" reinterpreted as "computers have to do the work to compensate for utterly destructured psychogenic noise -- and you have to write the assurance software for the software they run" was only pushed in the first place so "accessible" because then "more people get involved". forgetting all the while that the "peo
11:34 mircea_popescu ple" symbol in that "more people get involved" does NOT denote ~actual~ people. it denotes the sort of people who need a computer to think for them in order to participate in intellectual affairs. ie, NON!!!!-people!
11:34 mircea_popescu and then here we fucking are.
11:35 mircea_popescu "oh, the computer should make snails fly, so that it makes flight accessible to snails, so that there's more birds around which will make even more computers even better bla bla bla".
11:35 mircea_popescu motherfucker, all that builds is a large contingent of snails who think they can fly, which is PRECISELY technological debt.
11:35 mircea_popescu why the fuck do i want to carry through the world a huge pile of tech debt ?
11:36 * asciilifeform sorta has entire www on subj..
11:37 mircea_popescu there's no fucking benefit, the world was better off when there were four computers about total and the fucktarded secretutes sucked dick in office bathrooms instead of derping about how "you don't understand computers" because their stupidphones cut off fields silently and THEY ARE TOO FUCKING STUPID TO REALISE this is a problem, and specifically of theirs...
11:38 mircea_popescu and then of course also lack the meta-cognitive capacity to realise that this is simple metonimy, the stupidphone doesn't do that just to one filed that's "too long", but to ALL FIELDS. which is how they end up with notions about "#metoo" and etcetera.
11:38 mircea_popescu holy shit, fractally retarded.
11:38 asciilifeform mechanization + idiocy == mechanized idiocy, noose at 11
11:38 mircea_popescu i have no fucking idea who thought accessibility is a good idea.
11:39 mircea_popescu the world, not as a sum, but throughout, each-individual-component-as-well-as-all-groups-of-components, is worse off for computers being more accessible thusly.
11:39 asciilifeform ( see also e.g. http://www.loper-os.org/?p=165#selection-185.841-185.1259 )
11:40 mircea_popescu and no, showing me the sweet leet https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Camp_Lazear_Wellcome_L0000010.jpg they've built by hammering in nails with that microscope doesn't fucking impress.
11:40 asciilifeform the other detail is that -- unsurprisingly -- the item that became 'accessible' is typically closer to electro-dildo, while actual comp is less gettable than it's been since early '80s
11:41 mircea_popescu asciilifeform word.
11:42 asciilifeform in su folx would sometimes secretly repair a crippled 'demilitarized' museum rifle; turning a current-day pc into actual comp is actually ~harder~ procedure than this
11:46 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-02#1877837 << no, see, "you only think that because you're old".
11:46 a111 Logged on 2018-12-02 18:33 mircea_popescu: meanwhile in today's dose of elaborate #metoo #thinker files, http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/x4Yp0/?raw=true
11:46 mircea_popescu i wonder how many people ignored the dumbass before she formed the notion that the problem isn't her being stupid -- but other people being old.
11:50 feedbot http://qntra.net/2018/12/theresa-may-no-confidence-vote-coming-tonight/ << Qntra -- Theresa May No Confidence Vote Coming Tonight
11:55 mircea_popescu BingoBoingo hey, seems in the ruckus we forgot a lulzy piece : https://news.stanford.edu/2018/12/06/shoucheng-zhang-obituary/ (stanford ablates 55 yo nobel winner physicist because too chinese).
11:56 mircea_popescu "In lieu of flowers, his family has asked that gifts in Zhang’s memory be made to Stanford University".
11:56 mircea_popescu give usg.stanford some money why don't you.
11:58 mircea_popescu (dood had some bitcoin investment, and was diddling the kidnapped woman, is the idea).
11:59 asciilifeform i mailed it in as a qntra fodder the other day
11:59 mircea_popescu a cool.
11:59 mircea_popescu asciilifeform you busy ?
12:00 asciilifeform quite busy with c14. why
12:00 mircea_popescu wanna start a discussion of http://www.loper-os.org/#selection-37.0-65.730 ? seems to me mature.
12:00 asciilifeform link b0rked
12:00 asciilifeform ( recall bug )
12:00 asciilifeform reload pg plox & rebake?
12:02 mircea_popescu the On the Free Software movement quote. http://www.loper-os.org/?p=165#selection-37.0-65.730
12:02 asciilifeform pretty sure we had 5 or 6 thrds re that one snip
12:02 asciilifeform got new observation ?
12:02 mircea_popescu yeah, let's delve.
12:04 mircea_popescu so, on one hand, he is entirely correct in saying that useful work has to be paid, and whether its abstract work or digging ditches makes no difference. there's nothing special about writing software "that millions will use" (ie, generality) -- because the writer can get sick, and the person handling sick people will HAVE TO drop what they're doing and instead look at deeply similar splotches on a screen and say ~specific~ wo
12:04 mircea_popescu rds that are only applicable or interesting to his own particular case.
12:04 BingoBoingo mircea_popescu asciilifeform Got burried in ruckus, Going to try to write it up
12:04 mircea_popescu since the doctor's entitled to some compensation to even out his opportunity cost, the dilemma naggum presents is quite soundly footed : "get sick for a while, see". and plenty of other items go just this way.
12:05 mircea_popescu now, conversely -- it is impossible, leaving aside how it is impracticable, to try and make software "secret". from the color of bits to what have you, the notion that you can somehow wrangle ~a concrete, objectified representation~ of the abstract in question to "carry value" is also broken.
12:06 mircea_popescu which is his mistake, he thinks "code has value" is approachable in the terms of "fish has value". but fish has value per line, and code does NOT have value per line. in fact -- each extra pound of fish increases the value of the fish cache ; but every extra line of code DECREASES the value of the code cache.
12:07 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: from reading of whole naggum corpus, i am under impression that he certainly knew this.
12:07 mircea_popescu there's a further, important element that he neglects. specifically -- consider slavery.
12:07 asciilifeform ( and knew that most extant software has ~negative~, in particular, value )
12:07 mircea_popescu suppose, as a thought experiment, we are now in charge of the world. we are to say how it is to be run.
12:07 asciilifeform ( a la http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-25#1866192 )
12:07 a111 Logged on 2018-10-25 19:15 asciilifeform: at the risk of repeating ancient thread -- 'the best machine is no machine', it weighs nuffin, needs no maintenance. and the best proggy, is no proggy at all, if a problem can be solved without writing proggy, it ought to be. erry line of coad can be rightfully pictured as an act of intellectual littering. y'know, like throwing cig butt or bottle on the ground in the park.
12:08 * asciilifeform supposes...
12:08 mircea_popescu there's a female born, somewhere in the indistinct midwest. aged 16, she correctly [yet without having read it] applies the http://trilema.com/2013/whore-strat/ "what female is supposed to be", ends up enslaved by some guy, whom we'll call avik.
12:09 mircea_popescu now let's look at this system : it's not nicole's place to judge her master avik ; separated from this her master avik is a moron. is it our intention that everything should stand as it fell ?
12:10 mircea_popescu and you can't say "she should read trilema and figure shit out". a slave doesn't have this, a slave will do what random moron tells them to, which i guess would be going to college or some shit.
12:10 asciilifeform somehow it dun bother anybody that avik's spleen cannot judge that he's a moron and walk away
12:11 asciilifeform not errybody gets to 'judge'
12:11 mircea_popescu if, in point of fact, code is kept under wraps, you are, in point of fact, forcing the world into a "things lay where they fell" scheme, and slavery becomes untenable (and deeply something i can't support).
12:11 mircea_popescu open code has this fundamental capacity, of doing for you what my fetlife bots do for me.
12:11 mircea_popescu passive, yes, but everyone who is here is here ~because they read code~, not because they didn't.
12:11 asciilifeform in practice the friction of 'closed' is finite. bolix is as closed as it gets and i'ma still rape it.
12:11 mircea_popescu as you well should.
12:12 mircea_popescu so in short -- naggum's dilemma must be resolved ~without~ closing the code.
12:12 mircea_popescu which seems to me contrary to what he's advocating.
12:12 mircea_popescu but open code is rather the direct underpinning of items like http://trilema.com/2016/i-am-firmly-against-universal-franchise/
12:13 mircea_popescu something like that utterly can't stand UNLESS "the logs are right there, what've you been doing".
12:13 asciilifeform my impression is that he was motivated moar by http://www.loper-os.org/?p=165#selection-453.0-453.732 + http://www.loper-os.org/?p=165#selection-145.292-145.611 than 'pay me pay me'
12:13 asciilifeform fwiw ~nuffin of lasting value that asciilifeform learned about programming came from reading gnu hairballs.
12:14 mircea_popescu probably. still -- notice how ~easy~ it is for us to discard pointless items, howsoever "friendly" they might be.
12:14 asciilifeform ( mostly, in fact, came from reading material written by folx who lived half century or longer without touching a comp )
12:14 mircea_popescu i believe.
12:14 mircea_popescu yet i do not agree with his "destroy value" view.
12:15 mircea_popescu leaving aside my observation of anyone else's experience -- the "here's mp-wp codebase" has not appreciably destroyed something as far as i can tell.
12:15 mircea_popescu it seems deeply boneheaded to believe publication destroys value, a sort of harlan elinson tack.
12:15 asciilifeform the gnu folx 'destroyed' plenty, by sheer volume of noise swamping signal.
12:16 mircea_popescu (by which i mean, specifically "i know i'm a hack, and i know i have a finite time until they figure it out, so the more i make while saying the least -- the better")
12:16 mircea_popescu guy always had a very early-steamengine/textilemill-engineering flavour to me
12:16 asciilifeform ellison's entire life consisted of this. sorta how d00d became infamous lobbyist for 'eternal copyrights' etc
12:16 mircea_popescu right.
12:16 asciilifeform quintessentially american writer.
12:16 mircea_popescu and all my reservations re naggum, historically, came from this elinson flavour i here and there detected.
12:17 mircea_popescu but it's chiefly around this sort of misstatements, "oh, open code destroys value".
12:18 mircea_popescu now, none of this is an argument for ~all code forever open~. there's no all comers here, and indeed the overwhelm factor is a problem.
12:18 mircea_popescu but the web (metaphorically, the spider web of existence) has to be and remain traversable from the outside.
12:18 asciilifeform let's recall the hole that naggum sat in. d00d tried to make living by actually solving tricky problems for folx willing to pay ( oil, gas, jurisprudential db people, etc ) . found that it became harder and eventually impossible on acct of various factors, incl. the lemonization of the market by shitgnomes, asinine eurotaxation regimes, etc
12:18 mircea_popescu otherwise, what we're building will collapse. and i can prove it, too -- very much goedelian crunch.
12:19 mircea_popescu asciilifeform our friend avik does the same, believe it or not.
12:19 asciilifeform then saw the very tools of his trade vanishing, as the commercial lisp people slowly starved cuz idjits went 'let's hire 9000 java monkeys, freeeee tooling'
12:19 mircea_popescu ie, i would propose as a foundational myth, "avik killed naggum". there's something here.
12:20 asciilifeform ~the~ foundational q, imho, of software having a non-zimbabweistic future -- is whether avik can be prevented from killing naggum.
12:21 mircea_popescu the problem doesn't need to be stated in terms of "oil, gas" bla bla, "let's imagine adults still exist somewhere". this dork works for a packaging manufacturer, but the problem's evident from the "small business owner" - "web expert" interactions, well documented online.
12:21 mircea_popescu the domain specialist is uniquely unqualified and deeply unable to hire computer expert.
12:21 mircea_popescu which is why hospitals don't let you choose the shaman.
12:21 mircea_popescu ~they~ choose the shaman.
12:22 mircea_popescu to bring this full circle : the perceived difference between particularizing (doctor) and generalizing (computer scientist) abstract work is entirely hallucinated. the ~only~ way to correctly pay for abstract work is as allocations from crown.
12:22 asciilifeform !#s pay sunlight
12:22 a111 7 results for "pay sunlight", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=pay%20sunlight
12:22 asciilifeform ^ see also
12:22 mircea_popescu copyright is a deeply dysfunctional, dumb and braindamaged attempt to "open" the crown allocation process.
12:23 mircea_popescu (above, generalizing work is work that done once serves many ; particularizing is work which has to be done every time, and each time according to a standard).
12:24 mircea_popescu note how the "solution" idiots came up with (and failed to verbalize) was exactly "consultancy", ie, "we'll live off the value of the particularizing tail of our generalizing workl"
12:24 mircea_popescu this dun fucking work in practice, for the reasons obvious from the proper formulation.
12:24 asciilifeform sometimes abstract work is done by kamikazes who do it from principle, at the expense of sleep and walks in park, the way asciilifeform bakes e.g. ffa. but in general yes , it simply dun happen because nobody pays.
12:25 mircea_popescu and so here's how feudalism becomes inescapable : man will have to get sudan or w/e land (plus the attached bipedal or multipedal livestock) in exchange for having written republican smgl or w/e.
12:25 asciilifeform ( or happens as side effect of 'particulars' )
12:25 mircea_popescu because there's strictly no other way.
12:25 mircea_popescu asciilifeform and sometimes, the salvation of slaves comes from reading trilema instead of sleep and so on.
12:25 mircea_popescu yes, upwards social mobility only ever works this way.
12:26 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: hence naggum's formulation 'open softs are a surplus phenomenon'
12:26 mircea_popescu but that's incorrect. ~thoguht~ and especially ~abstract work~ is a surplus phenomenon.
12:27 mircea_popescu because it's what it is, if you're hungry go farm, if you're lonely go spawn. if you're nothing in particular -- which is to say, if you're finally human -- how about you do something useful finally.
12:27 asciilifeform well yes, anyffing published without expectation of moolah, is 'surplus phenomena', whether theorem or proggy or symphony etc
12:27 mircea_popescu mno.
12:27 mircea_popescu that's the confounding approach there.
12:27 asciilifeform hm?
12:28 mircea_popescu it's a case of wheel powering engine again. all abstract work is a surplus phenomena because the surprlus predates the work. not because "we're poor, but we hope to pay the bills by thinking".
12:28 mircea_popescu but because "eh, whatever, fridge's too full anyway, let's do somethjing interesting today".\
12:29 asciilifeform i did say 'without expectation of moolah' neh
12:29 mircea_popescu the thinking by which you hope to pay the bills, that's how you get C and mass marketed "films".
12:29 mircea_popescu asciilifeform but the timing's wrong. without ~need~.
12:29 mircea_popescu it's not that you don't expect it ; it's that you don't need it.
12:29 asciilifeform well yes. singing on street corner with hat 'please throw a penny' is not 'from surplus'
12:29 asciilifeform or because likes to sing
12:30 feedbot http://qntra.net/2018/12/stanford-garbage-collects-chinese-professor-investor/ << Qntra -- Stanford Garbage Collects Chinese Professor Investor
12:30 mircea_popescu doctor does not sit in er room going "i hope someone shows up or else i starve".
12:30 mircea_popescu because that's not a state of mind conducive to doctoring in the first place.
12:30 mircea_popescu doctor goes "well... i guess i could sleep... but i dun feel like it... or i could farm... meh farming... let's see if there's something interesting to do".
12:31 mircea_popescu this is not ~formally~ what happens, for purely coincidental reasons. it is ~fundamentally~ what happens, which is why it's important.
12:32 asciilifeform right
12:33 asciilifeform i'm not convinced that naggum would've disagreed with this formulation tho
12:33 BingoBoingo <mircea_popescu> ie, i would propose as a foundational myth, "avik killed naggum". there's something here. << And he did it for (((packing))) Peanuts!
12:34 asciilifeform ( and will add, it is ordinarily trivial to distinguish folx who theorem 'from causes' from the ones who 'for purposes' i.e. 'maybe someone throws penny into hat' )
12:34 mircea_popescu so to sum all this up : naggum is right in that what he does can't be free. naggum is wrong in that the tangible expression of abstracts could have value (what next, doctor supports self by selling ultrasound drawings ?!) ; and moreover closed code in the copyright/microsoft sense makes the slaves&harem&wot world impossible.
12:34 mircea_popescu BingoBoingo there's little sadder in creation than overstretched underachievers, "oh, i got perfect sat scores" "why ?"
12:34 asciilifeform ( see also http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-01#1868473 + http://btcbase.org/log/2015-11-07#1319527 )
12:34 a111 Logged on 2018-11-01 18:01 asciilifeform: i dun work for prizes, medals, mircea_popescu knows this.
12:34 a111 Logged on 2015-11-07 23:21 asciilifeform: 'Не надо мне пощады,не надо мне награды, / а дайте мне винтовку и дайте мне коня... / А если я погибну,пусть красные отряды, / пусть красные отряды отплатят за меня.' (tm) (r) (mega-classic)
12:35 mircea_popescu asciilifeform sadly we'll never know what he'd have said, avik got to him first.
12:36 mircea_popescu the only remaining open problem is, of course, valuation.
12:36 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: 1 of my nitpicks with the 'open/closed wars' people is the annoying fact of http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-06#1793733
12:36 a111 Logged on 2018-04-06 21:12 asciilifeform: a 500k-loc ( ignoring even for a moment the far greater heft of 'modern' wonders ) c/cpp proggy is, for all intents and purposes, closed-source, even if every line is published, because it is quite impossible for anyone -- even author -- to get a proper grip on its behaviour space
12:37 asciilifeform i.e. just about all of the problems of 'closed' world , were re-created on substrate of 'open', without anyone so much as deliberately trying
12:37 mircea_popescu given a set of ("the place formerly known as sudan", "a monopoly on aviation", "the empire state building") and ("has written proper sgml", "heroically reversed bolix stack","found way to write without getting out of bed"), which is the correct matching ?
12:38 asciilifeform for the d00d handing out the medals to decide, neh
12:38 asciilifeform sorta why odin put him upon the green earth
12:38 mircea_popescu asciilifeform that is ~exactly~ what i'm leveraging : ALL abstractions are "closed-source" by their very nature -- witness how cats don't read them. then let's use this natural barrier to select the future lordship.
12:38 mircea_popescu asciilifeform the decision'd better make sense, which is to say, meaningful rather than arbitrary.
12:39 asciilifeform it'll make sense, in the http://btcbase.org/log/2017-08-28#1704268 model.
12:39 a111 Logged on 2017-08-28 23:10 mircea_popescu: kanzure " Obviously there is no possiblity of meaning outside of a structure of authority, and the authority can not be predicated on the meaning."
12:40 mircea_popescu hm.
12:40 mircea_popescu i guess it'd better.
12:41 asciilifeform i dun complain that, e.g., mircea_popescu pays for ice cream but not udplib, it's his dubloons, just as he dun complain that asciilifeform buys ice cream instead of euloratronium, errybody is master of own chest, large or small
12:42 asciilifeform ( and it dun keep us from making mutually happy trades on other occasions )
12:43 mircea_popescu this seems to me unrelated.
12:44 mircea_popescu consider tomorrow emperor of china writes in, wants to give taiwan to republic as peace gift.
12:44 asciilifeform the 1 occasion where related, is coupla instances in yrs past when asciilifeform's 'from cause' worx ground to a halt on acct of having to earn bread in saeculum, then asciilifeform rolls eyes at folx who 'motherfucker, where is the promised X/Y/Z'
12:45 mircea_popescu taiwan will have to have a governor, and i will do what ? name the most capable ? the most bored ? suppose we do the medieval thing and separate the work from the benefice. then who gets the latter ? and so on.
12:45 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i'd hope that mircea_popescu knows how to drive a taiwan, cuz chances are that i'd wrap it around a telephone pole, lol
12:46 mircea_popescu it is certainly a good thing emperor of china is not gifting taiwans right now. but the matter remains -- the reward for good work is generally more work in the same vein.
12:46 mircea_popescu this is nice and dandy -- until someone actually needs some work of their own.
12:46 asciilifeform aha
12:47 mircea_popescu consider this taken to extremes : suppose the lordship's a few hundred, ie the most it can ever possibly take, and each are castles with hundreds of knights within and so on.
12:47 * asciilifeform supposes
12:48 mircea_popescu asciilifeform falls sick, and he suddenly has 95 surgeons at his bedstand, because well known and respected and so on. meanwhile young'un dies somewhere i nsilence. asciilifeform could have readily dispensed with the spurious 95th surgeon, kept 94. but... power laws right, and http://trilema.com/2013/stage-n-bitcoin-exists/#selection-101.196-101.253
12:49 asciilifeform this aint any moar avoidable than resistive losses in mains wiring
12:49 mircea_popescu in short : the current system of allocating labour is offensively stupid ; and the rudiments of what we have here promise to work. but so far... spreading dun work!
12:49 mircea_popescu to some degree.
12:50 mircea_popescu the above "question of valuation" as well as the "it'd better make sense" readily translate into "give me resistive loss formula".
12:50 mircea_popescu they're statements of the same problem.
12:51 * asciilifeform can speak only for self, but on various occasions risked piggy bank to try an' convert from serf to d00d who '100% worx from cause', but on each occasion lost shirt. maybe other l1 folx will have better fortune, and sit on mt olympus with mircea_popescu , i dun presently expect to
12:51 mircea_popescu where's this relate ?
12:51 asciilifeform the allocations thing
12:51 mircea_popescu hm
12:52 asciilifeform ( in case forgot, asciilifeform spends 80+% of time on perpetrating saecular warcrimes in microshit land, rather than anyffing useful )
12:52 asciilifeform so, asciilifeform's resistive loss is ~80%.
12:52 mircea_popescu yeah, that's a whole other can of intricate strange. i wasn't gonna address it till as you say, some l1 folks move on.
12:53 asciilifeform mircea_popescu's is, let's suppose, 1%, however much time he spends tying his shoes and operating the levers of his outer empire
12:53 mircea_popescu asciilifeform ah, that's not at ALL what was meant by "resistive loss". what was meant was, some labour wastage will occur through guy A getting 1.epsilon the work he needs while guy B getting 1-epsilon and perhaps dying for it.
12:53 asciilifeform a
12:53 mircea_popescu asciilifeform actually the girls tie my shoes.
12:53 mircea_popescu believe this or not, i reach such levels of chinese emperorhood.
12:53 asciilifeform a+++ louis xiii
12:55 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: the item you were thinking of, then, i'd call impedance mismatch loss, rather than plain resistive
12:55 asciilifeform ( simply to nitpick!11 )
12:55 asciilifeform in ye olde supercomp world, was known as 'process starvation'
12:55 mircea_popescu however you call it. but it seems to me, which was the original driver, it seems to me naggum's dilemma illustrates a missing chunk rather than anything else.
12:56 asciilifeform my impression when reading was that he was thinking of asciilifeform's variant of resistive loss. but possible asciilifeform's bias.
12:56 mircea_popescu ie, "yes, that's untenable, but no this is stupid (and ultimately also untenable), so..."
12:56 mircea_popescu asciilifeform how do you mean ?
12:57 asciilifeform in his discussion where, approx, 'yes it's good and well that some folx sit and solve ~some~ problems in spare time from salt mine, but not all problems are susceptible to this treatment'
12:57 mircea_popescu i don't think you were following my "suppose". let's do over.
12:58 * asciilifeform rewinds tape..
12:58 mircea_popescu suppose suppose the lordship owns the world, in all particulars, entirely. the last rebel was long ago executed. i can write to any and all doctors, "hey, please X". so can you. so can etcetera.
12:59 asciilifeform ok..
12:59 mircea_popescu at this juncture, if the king falls ill every doctor in the realm will crowd the palace, and if the provincial governor of taiwan happens to need apendectomy he might even die.
12:59 mircea_popescu so ~how~ do you signal optimal allocation.
13:00 mircea_popescu and don't tell me "money". money is eminently broken in handling all this, proof positive being that if you get a hospital bill you can't say if it's correct or not
13:00 asciilifeform right -- even if yer king, resources still finite. consider stalin's dilemma of whether to withdraw zhukov's army from far east. ( banked on zorge's report that jp will not break peace treaty, and withdrew 80% . but still had to leave some )
13:00 mircea_popescu (if you get that x ray machine delivered, you can tell what % of socket power it wastes)
13:00 mircea_popescu so this is what i thought we were discussing -- "some inefficiency necessarily part of world". yes, agreed -- but how much ?
13:01 asciilifeform aa!
13:01 mircea_popescu whence ? and how much ?
13:01 mircea_popescu and if you answer this, you necessarily answer "how to value work" as well as "what meaning has king's arbitrarity" and so on.
13:01 asciilifeform sorta summarizes king's entire job description, neh
13:01 mircea_popescu but the 1900s gold dubloons do NOT work for this. because lines of code, or "eyeballs upon cell cultures" are NOT like barels of fish.
13:02 asciilifeform valuing people/works.
13:02 mircea_popescu there's no market forces available.
13:02 asciilifeform correct.
13:02 mircea_popescu it's perfectly find to "let market find price of steel hull ship".
13:02 asciilifeform ( and , as asciilifeform is fond of observing, stalin's approach on many occasions performed 9000x better than merchant's dubloons approach )
13:02 mircea_popescu it is very fucking dubious to imagine market will "find price" to tell naggum how much of his code-juju he has to give up to doctor.
13:02 asciilifeform indeed
13:05 mircea_popescu which is ultimately the problem here -- note the orig formulation wasn't in "so many dollars" terms. it was very much nearly the http://trilema.com/2013/regarding-money/
13:05 mircea_popescu he wants ~to be able to get other professionals to help him when he needs it~, he doesn't want "more dough" specifically and as such.
13:05 mircea_popescu ie, he wants sufficient claim to fame as to make the "i'd like to live rather than die" proposition defensible. he doesn't even want money as such at all
13:06 mircea_popescu (because money is like taiwan -- now you gotta drive)
13:08 BingoBoingo !!invoice mircea_popescu 0.0216 nicoleci shared hosting annual
13:08 BingoBoingo !!invoice mircea_popescu 0.0.0578066 S.MG test server monthly
13:08 deedbot Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/Ifrr6/?raw=true
13:08 mircea_popescu and i suspect this fundamental intuition is what drives a lot of high socialism (like high protestantism, the nonsense among intelligent folks, as opposed to low) -- the intuition that the 1800 notion of money, perfectly adequate as it is for concretes, utterly fails on abstracts and what one needs is a lot more abstracts than concretes.
13:08 mircea_popescu BingoBoingo is that a new math ?
13:08 BingoBoingo http://pizarroisp.net/shared-hosting/ << Updated, 10% discount on shared hosting for annual over monthly subscriptions now official
13:09 BingoBoingo <mircea_popescu> BingoBoingo is that a new math ? << It is 0.002 x 12 with a 10% discount applied
13:09 mircea_popescu my math only has one dot per number!
13:09 BingoBoingo Ah
13:09 BingoBoingo !!invoice mircea_popescu 0.0578066 S.MG test server monthly
13:09 BingoBoingo Math reverted
13:09 deedbot Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/SK4L0/?raw=true
13:10 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: money is shorthand, i.e. simply the 'binders' of http://www.loper-os.org/?p=165#selection-165.74-165.439
13:11 asciilifeform only numismatics want money 'per se'
13:11 asciilifeform *numismatists
13:11 BingoBoingo !!v 57D0BD15B2C0608D4BA2E38CB0052DF3AD3953CB6DD330B8369736EE5BE87096
13:11 mircea_popescu it seems to me what has happened here was, a certain notion of money got shoehorned into evolving practice with nary a thought given to what works how.
13:11 deedbot Invoiced mircea_popescu 0.0578066 << S.MG test server monthly
13:11 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: rather analogous to the lumped approximation of maxwell that engineers typically work with
13:11 asciilifeform i.e. adequate inside certain boundaries, but generally wildly wrong
13:12 BingoBoingo !!v 51DB5F3A673D0C84513440CC4783B4D6A44C8932949F21E370B75058DAE35E0A
13:12 deedbot Invoiced mircea_popescu 0.0216 << nicoleci shared hosting annual
13:13 mircea_popescu the money of http://btcbase.org/log/2014-03-10#553680 und die hundert millionen in meinem schatz is eminently NOT the money of "$5 turn knob - $9995 know which" (i can't find teh logline nao)
13:13 a111 Logged on 2014-03-10 15:06 mircea_popescu: sie gonnen mir nicht Schlesien und die Grafschaft Glatz...
13:14 asciilifeform aha, we had a a++ mircea_popescu thread re 'allocative vs subsistance functions of moneys'
13:14 mircea_popescu quite. but it's clarifying in my head!
13:15 mircea_popescu think about it -- they "pay" doctors, in fredericus rex dubloons, while they ALSO insist they... do what ? document their work, yes ? ie, construct the basis of wot-based payment.
13:15 mircea_popescu it's stupidly kept "closed", but what do you want to know when talking to a doctor ? "the list of previous cases plox" right ? ie "wot ?"
13:16 mircea_popescu meanwhile "money" in the dubloon sense is going away (certainly away from the hands of the plebs) to be replaced by... abstract version, plastic, db-money. so how does new man pay for doctor ? oh, he gives to hospital ~the voucher his place of employment gave him~.
13:16 mircea_popescu ie, empire is doing exactly what we're discussing here, just, ineptly.
13:17 * asciilifeform observed on numerous occasions that 'phree world' converged to exactly a 9000x less efficient version of ye olde su allocative structure
13:17 mircea_popescu "why does joe have voucher hospital x accepts where moe does not ?" "cuz visa black platinum blalblabla" "wut ?" "his employer is in the wot and vouches for him!"
13:17 mircea_popescu quite so!
13:21 mircea_popescu aanyway. labour allocation is broken and nobody has any better.
↖ ↖
13:23 * asciilifeform cannot disagree
~ 31 minutes ~
13:54 asciilifeform wb Mocky
13:54 Mocky http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-11#1879752 Just bill me for my hosting, one year plz
13:54 a111 Logged on 2018-12-11 20:09 BingoBoingo: mircea_popescu: Also up for renewal are Mocky and nicoleci's shared hosting instances which you paid through December
13:54 Mocky thx asciilifeform
13:56 Mocky http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-12#1879959 painfully slow from my pov, got three phone interviews coming up but not on the calendar yet cuz peeps taking time off. a bunch more that I'm waiting to hear about.
13:56 a111 Logged on 2018-12-12 15:10 mircea_popescu: hey Mocky_ how's the hunt going ?
13:57 mircea_popescu it occurs to me, pending how well this goes, that we could have a bourbaki
13:57 mircea_popescu get it 500 remote jobs, can just do the work in here.
13:58 asciilifeform that'd rock
13:58 asciilifeform and could even be possible, if heathens weren't jawdroppingly retarded
13:58 mircea_popescu i don't see why it wouldn't be possible, tbh.
13:58 mircea_popescu certainly worth a try.
13:59 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: for my enlightenment, plox describe brief algo for 'try'
14:00 Mocky why, cuz so many extra hands?
14:00 mircea_popescu have a team of specialist appliers to jobs, dump all the task in some flatfile for you folks to pass around encrypted, and that's pretty much it.
14:00 mircea_popescu whoever feels like doing some saeculum work that day draws a ticket.
14:01 asciilifeform i dunno where in saeculum works are packaged in parcels like this ( outside of 'fiverr' )
14:01 mircea_popescu remote job. you apply, you get it, right ?
14:01 Mocky relatedly, i haven't even applied to remote jobs yet. hand cranking through local options still
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14:02 mircea_popescu Mocky i suspect "local job" is by now thin wrapper over "social security handout"
↖
14:02 mircea_popescu like ye olde su "capital job".
14:03 Mocky in the past I've given serious consideration to arbitraging out my own secular tasks to indians or whathaveyou
14:03 mircea_popescu right ?
14:03 mircea_popescu i know this exists, whole outfits predicated on this scheme.
14:03 * asciilifeform does remote, for yrs nao. but it's still packaged in the form of 'here's this 1 d00d, and we rub lamp and he grants wishes, with voice command'. nao conceivably ~someone~ ~somewhere~ aint ameri-tarded and actually packages ~work~, rather than 'we rent a d00d and command via voice' , but i haven't seen this with own eyes yet.
14:03 mircea_popescu various small african/indian/etc towns fed this way.
14:04 trinque aha, Mocky and Oracle both
14:04 mircea_popescu asciilifeform nothing wrong with still providing the bindings. what, so hard to pick up phone ?
14:04 asciilifeform rright, but the ameri-afflicted will balk if diff voice each time.
14:04 BingoBoingo !!invoice Mocky 0.0216 Shared hosting annual
14:04 mircea_popescu so use same voice.
14:04 asciilifeform so that means d00d does full-time neh
14:04 mircea_popescu neh.
14:04 deedbot Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/CAI8a/?raw=true
14:04 mircea_popescu voice does full time.
14:05 asciilifeform but even aside from ameri-tardation, generally they also want short-latency. ( what if nobody in bourbaki picks up ? )
14:05 mircea_popescu well, this is why i never mentioned this earlier.
14:05 asciilifeform how do you do 'voice full time' but other hands do the works, with short latency ?
14:05 mircea_popescu i'd suspect we can possibly cover it by now. dunno.
14:05 BingoBoingo !!v 44895C03E486B69D7CFC8DB1C235B2E311E73F7B0D3481D52518BD3CA64A0498
14:05 mircea_popescu asciilifeform i expect you're not hired out in stretches of fifteen minutes, like starvation whores.
14:05 deedbot Invoiced Mocky 0.0216 << Shared hosting annual
14:05 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: no, quite opposite
14:05 mircea_popescu programmers are whores, but usually under a roof, not on the street.
14:05 mircea_popescu asciilifeform so then ?
14:06 asciilifeform afaik items that actually cuttable into 15min packets are generally 'deskilled minwage' horror
14:06 asciilifeform rather than anyffing anybody here would touch
14:06 mircea_popescu you're so fucking obstructive, it's almost like your second nature in some fields.
14:07 asciilifeform 'bridge will carry 50 tanks' 'but what about 51st' is sorta what asciilifeform does for living, lol
14:07 mircea_popescu look, "short latency", what's that mean ? either it means you're cutting carrots one at a time, or else it means you don't, therefore perfectly possible to have a specialist phone robot.
14:07 mircea_popescu now what's the problem ?
14:08 asciilifeform i can speak only for self. but for instance asciilifeform , in saeculum, maintains a 100s-kloc winblowz atrocity. and this requires keeping it loaded into head. how would this go under mircea_popescu's scheme ? each d00d in bourbaki stuck also loading it ?
14:08 asciilifeform ( and keeping the dev envir around, etc ) ?
14:08 mircea_popescu nah. you're the only one that picks those sets of tickets.
14:08 asciilifeform sorta what happens already lol
14:09 Mocky my concern is that often it takes me a year to build an accurate enough mental model to be able to solve problem which prompted the lamp rubbing in a reasonable time
14:09 mircea_popescu no. because already, you sit on ass not hunting for jobs while mocky isn't doing any work.
14:09 mircea_popescu pooling works for this reason.
14:09 mircea_popescu Mocky people get fired all the time, who gives a shit.
14:09 Mocky but i'm totally down to give it a try (after employed). it's gonna be hoot!
14:10 mircea_popescu your issue is you keep creating these unrequitted love relationships withj employers.
14:10 mircea_popescu this scheme'd massively help your cognitive impairement.
14:10 mircea_popescu there's exactly 0 reason to ever care about some dollar-holding schmuck.
14:11 mircea_popescu notaperson.
14:12 asciilifeform buncha dirt is also notaperson, but farmer -- stuck giving a shit re dirt
14:12 mircea_popescu not in the sense of sticking with the farm after dust bowl event.
14:13 mircea_popescu (the other thing that will come to light, of course, is that 364 days of that proverbial mocky year are sheer makework, of the http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-12#1880272 type ; and the various "specific problems" that "employers encounter" entirely unspecific)
14:13 a111 Logged on 2018-12-12 19:02 mircea_popescu: Mocky i suspect "local job" is by now thin wrapper over "social security handout"
14:13 asciilifeform farmer can certainly walk away from his dirt, but then is naked but for shirt on his back.
14:13 mircea_popescu just as naked as was before.
14:13 Mocky brb, recruiter call! pfft
14:13 mircea_popescu "i have an employer" is the substance of the insanity here discussed. no, you don't HAVE jack. it has.
14:16 asciilifeform in practice, they're scarce (esp. if impose the condition of no 'office commute' idjicies ). ~possibly~ for world-class specialists this aint so, i suppose i've never reached this level so cannot comment there
14:17 asciilifeform took, e.g., asciilifeform , most of 2016 to find 1
14:17 asciilifeform ( while sat in salt mine with ~0 juice available for productive tmsr worx )
14:18 mircea_popescu this is a facet of what i'm saying : rather than have you "look for a girlfriend as best i can when i perceive i need one", how about you have a ~girl~ look for girlfriends ALL THE TIME, and you can pick one or a few when inclined.
14:19 asciilifeform ( and in my experience the worx that actually pay, don't 1024chicken-ize at all )
14:19 mircea_popescu ie, your problems, my dear farmer, come from the fact that you only try to kill cockroaches when "they get to be too many"
14:19 asciilifeform in abstract yes -- this is why folx form consultancies
14:19 mircea_popescu obviously a dishelved incel finally pushed to dating by desperation is going to produce less meat than a purpose-dedicated female, yes ?
14:19 mircea_popescu right.
14:20 * asciilifeform would switch, in a heartbeat, to fulltiming at hypothetical tmsr consultancy, if it could be made to get off ground
14:25 Mocky no mr. recruiter I don't have experience with Docker, as fun as that sounds
14:26 mircea_popescu i expect if attempted it'll immediately run into the same problem pizarro is encountering, whereas bois will do ANYTHING WHATSOEVER, no matter how patently stupid and laughing impending beheading in the face, just as long as it's NOT "talk to a lot of people".
↖
14:27 mircea_popescu whereas this, like that, like all other interface-the-empire things, require the http://btcbase.org/log/2018-08-28#1845274 centerpiece.
14:27 a111 Logged on 2018-08-28 22:27 mircea_popescu: and i do mean ~every single last one~. i talk to every single chick on fetlife, meaning EVERY SINGLE ONE. that's the job of existence. nothing else passes muster.
14:29 diana_coman http://btcbase.org/log/2018-12-12#1880271 -> I was under the impression that Mocky wasn't tied up /very happy in current place; why local /us anyway?
14:29 a111 Logged on 2018-12-12 19:01 Mocky: relatedly, i haven't even applied to remote jobs yet. hand cranking through local options still
14:29 asciilifeform fetlife is a handy corral for gurlz. what'd be equiv, in mircea_popescu's eye, for this ?
14:29 mircea_popescu "gotta start somewhere"
14:29 mircea_popescu asciilifeform "handy" in what sense ? cuz you know from reading eg http://trilema.com/2015/okcupidcom-the-dating-site/ about ~all the others~ ?
14:30 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2018-04-19#1802755 << did you walk that db yet btw ?
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14:30 a111 Logged on 2018-04-19 01:51 mircea_popescu: ascii_lander, mod6 ben_vulpes the above q is serious, btw. have someone represent you on digitalpoint / whatever hosting forums ? or you deem it premature ?
14:30 asciilifeform 'handy' in sense of 'here's this list of some-gurlz-some-elizas', for i in L... do '
14:30 mircea_popescu no, "handy" in the sense of "mp already did the work of enumerating tghe venues so i can name one that's handy on those shoulders"
14:31 Mocky when I look deeply enough into my pockets I see hunger about 6 weeks away, and my phone getting shut off and so I look for the closest solution at hand
14:31 asciilifeform BingoBoingo ( who iirc took this duty ) plox to comment re mircea_popescu's q ^
14:31 mircea_popescu diana_coman ever thought about taking in a 50yo male slave, mediteranean complexion ?
14:32 mircea_popescu asciilifeform ikr.
14:32 diana_coman not until now; thinking
14:33 mircea_popescu well you got like six weeks...
14:33 * asciilifeform pictures Mocky as diana_coman's butler
14:33 Mocky hell no
14:33 diana_coman ahahaha
14:33 Mocky nothing personal!
14:34 Mocky not looking for help to solve my own problems. I'll solve and then contribute solutions to other problems
14:34 diana_coman might burn more than hunger for sure
14:34 diana_coman Mocky, don't worry, nobody will ever help you against own wishes
14:34 mircea_popescu Mocky you know, there's way worse fates than enslavement.
14:35 Mocky doesn't appeal
14:37 Mocky advice wise, i'm happy to accept help. action wise, I'll take the action
14:37 mircea_popescu well then.
14:37 BingoBoingo <mircea_popescu> no, "handy" in the sense of "mp already did the work of enumerating tghe venues so i can name one that's handy on those shoulders" << Out of tophost.com, hostingdiscussion.com, topsearch.com, warriorforums, and forums.hostsearch.com, it seems only Digitalpoint might be worth a revisit
14:37 mircea_popescu what's a visit do ?
14:38 BingoBoingo Well, a plumb, Most of these "hosting" forums maybe see 20 posts a year from the same 4 wankers spamming in a circle
14:39 BingoBoingo <mircea_popescu> what's a visit do ? << A visit allow a read of "Is anyone here", Was anyone here 2,4,5,10 years ago
14:39 mircea_popescu why not just enumerate the userbase and message them all ?
↖
14:40 BingoBoingo Fuck it, why not try
14:41 BingoBoingo ^ Any awk ninjas want to try this on a few forums?
↖ ↖
14:47 asciilifeform Mocky: fwiw i've rarely been >6mo of battery charge away from hunger ( and on the few occasions when were, blew it on attempt at jailbreaking out ) , and at times was 6wk also.
14:49 Mocky anyway, I don't think specialist job applier is all that hard to do. tech companies are ripe for being gamed
14:51 Mocky i'm past most of my frustration with it now, noticing their weaknesses. if you can code A* on a white board in 10 minutes with no errors while talking intelligently about their beloved frameworks, then not hiring you would be a struggle
14:52 asciilifeform only problem is that they typically expect the d00d who drew on the board to later show up in their shithole 9-5
14:53 Mocky tru, but once they want you, some will allow remote. They've got to fill those recs by the end of the quarter!
14:54 Mocky plus many adverise remote to begin with
15:00 Mocky for bonus points, train a black chix to be specialist job applier
15:02 mircea_popescu aha.
15:02 Mocky i've thought about brushing up on my ebonics to troll some interviews. show up in brand new nike airs and NBA jersey, use gangster analogies for everything while talking computer science like everybody knows that shit
15:03 mircea_popescu i'd do it.
15:03 mircea_popescu i make it a rule to never be the most frustrated/annoyed/etc one in the room.
15:03 mircea_popescu if i'm pissed off, it just means someone else will have to be pissed off x2
15:04 mircea_popescu so... "if you don't want to rue the day you were born, better make sure i'm not out looking for a job ever. i hate that shit."
~ 28 minutes ~
15:33 feedbot http://qntra.net/2018/12/vatican-finance-chief-cardinal-george-pell-convicted-of-sexual-abuse-in-australia-with-supression-order-barring-australian-reporting-on-conviction/ << Qntra -- Vatican Finance Chief Cardinal George Pell Convicted Of Sexual Abuse In Australia With Supression Order Barring Australian Reporting On Conviction
15:38 BingoBoingo ^ A Lesser Podesta Convicted
~ 22 minutes ~
16:01 mircea_popescu keks wtf is this nonsense.
16:01 mircea_popescu they had a secret session of #australia and everything ? lmao.
16:01 mircea_popescu world of 6yos.
16:01 asciilifeform lol seekrit trials
16:02 asciilifeform au is a kinda beta test lab for cutting-edge nato reich retardations
16:02 asciilifeform ( recall, they have 'great firewall' nao, etc )
16:05 BingoBoingo <asciilifeform> lol seekrit trials << Apparently the standard for trials in Australia is seekrit until appeal in order to "avoid biasing retrial juries"
16:05 BingoBoingo But Austria apparently hasn't tried anyone worth the mention until now
16:06 asciilifeform lemme guess, appeal trial also seekrit, 'to avoid biasing' n+1th appeal ?
16:06 asciilifeform lol!
16:06 BingoBoingo <mircea_popescu> world of 6yos. << On the Cardinal's lap
16:06 asciilifeform recursively, whole chain, from 1st trial to beheading, seekrit
16:06 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: Puede Ser, I haven't given much though to Australia's Kangaroo Courts as a legal system to get involved in
16:07 asciilifeform i'm still waiting for the next logical step of convergence to brezhnev's su, i.e. психушка instead of trial
16:07 asciilifeform !#s психушка
16:07 a111 16 results for "психушка", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=%D0%BF%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%85%D1%83%D1%88%D0%BA%D0%B0
16:08 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: it's a test bed for the rest of reich
16:09 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: So is Canada, NZ, UK, etc. Everyone of the five eyes is a test bed for the others
16:10 BingoBoingo Or 5-eyes and a mouth (Phillipines)
16:16 BingoBoingo And the local response to alt-Leprosy in Salto has been a dog purge https://www.elobservador.com.uy/nota/unos-600-perros-fueron-sacrificados-por-tener-leishmaniasis-2018121210112
16:18 BingoBoingo An a rare non-performance after advance deposit case made the paper https://www.elobservador.com.uy/nota/pagaron-150-000-por-una-fiesta-de-15-pero-el-dia-previo-no-habia-salon-ni-la-confiteria-2018121119208
~ 19 minutes ~
16:37 BingoBoingo And in further inflating away the peso: https://www.elobservador.com.uy/nota/lanzan-emision-record-de-us-500-millones-en-el-mercado-de-valores-uruguayo--2018121213554
~ 37 minutes ~
17:15 feedbot http://qntra.net/2018/12/fbi-entraps-young-woman-into-terrorism-charges-by-becoming-her-entire-social-circle/ << Qntra -- FBI Entraps Young Woman Into Terrorism Charges By Becoming Her Entire Social Circle
↖
17:17 trinque whatever, fbi just wanted friends.
17:22 BingoBoingo Ah, like that story where the frog ate the scorpion because that's just what they do. It's their nature to eat
17:24 mircea_popescu tl
17:24 mircea_popescu top keks.
17:25 mircea_popescu i imagine pantsuit.fbi is gonna start farming these, much like pantsuit.academia is farming "scholars" and pantsuit.tech is farming blackchickscode.
17:26 mircea_popescu (conversely : there was a slavegirl in toledo, ohio none of you lazy bums got to in time.)
17:31 asciilifeform !#s death ray
17:31 a111 100 results for "death ray", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=death%20ray
17:44 mircea_popescu hey, "the message got cut off" has its effects.
17:50 BingoBoingo Well, seems pretty clear they are just farming them now
~ 2 hours 57 minutes ~
20:47 * asciilifeform finally grunted out & typeset new proof for ch14. nao for measure-77-times-cut-1ce..
~ 1 hours 44 minutes ~
22:31 feedbot http://bimbo.club/?p=104 << Bimbo.Club -- TMSR Log Summary - 11/21/2018
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