Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2016-04-07 | 2016-04-09 → ↓
00:06 ben_vulpes asciilifeform: 83 > 95?
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00:07 ben_vulpes mod6: i have a trashy pdf copy of dodrill's 95 ada instructional material. lmk if you want a copy.
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00:08 ben_vulpes very very educational.
00:08 ben_vulpes much like the language in its explicitness.
~ 27 minutes ~
00:35 mats upon arrival at http://fr.anco.is/2016/bitbet-auction-a-winrar-is-znort987 i am greeted with auth dialog and 'The server says: Fuck you..'
00:37 ben_vulpes i get basic auth request too
00:37 trinque http://fr.anco.is/wp-admin/admin-ajax.php <<
~ 3 hours 4 minutes ~
03:42 davout ben_vulpes trinque mats ty, fixed. this particular flavour of retardation has been shot in the head
~ 4 hours 20 minutes ~
08:03 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448516 << nope
08:04 asciilifeform quite unlike the rest of computing, yes, but don't take my word for it
08:07 PeterL http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448483 << I said the same thing in the other chan a few hours earlier http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-04-2016#1443837
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~ 31 minutes ~
08:38 jurov lmao whats this <a href='http://btcbase.org/log/...'>http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/...
08:39 jurov (see $currentline-2 in the btcbase log)
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08:42 jurov and the lmao line is badly escaped, too
08:46 jurov phf ^
08:53 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448517 << again, unlike literally the entire whole of rest of computingdom, the old adas are neither less-broken NOR BETTER-supported.
08:53 asciilifeform read the rationale b00kz, understand how and why.
~ 25 minutes ~
09:19 mircea_popescu ;;later tell wywialm yes but do it here.
09:19 gribble The operation succeeded.
09:20 mircea_popescu davout> ben_vulpes trinque mats ty, fixed. this particular flavour of retardation has been shot in the head << making it the... 5th ? since bitbet receivership brought serious republican scrutiny to franco.is blog ?
09:20 mircea_popescu PeterL good call.
09:22 mircea_popescu for the republic's store of reaction gifs, in case of need : http://49.media.tumblr.com/560a9088996bebfe3e89c4275dd5aa5b/tumblr_o1god4CWCq1ule9rko1_500.gif
09:32 mircea_popescu $up wywialm
09:33 deedbot wywialm voiced for 30 minutes.
09:33 mircea_popescu $gettrust deedbot wywialm
09:33 deedbot L1: 0, L2: 1 by 1 connections.
09:33 mircea_popescu you should be able to self-voice.
09:33 wywialm hi, thanks
09:34 wywialm i haven't yet got the hang of deedbot voicing
09:34 mircea_popescu you pm it $up and decrypt the otp it gives you, then pass it back with $v <result>
09:35 wywialm ah, ok, similarly to the previous assbot
09:36 mircea_popescu quite.
09:37 jurov hi wywialm
09:38 wywialm could you please share what are the plans for MPEx future, besides what has already been revealed at the announcement? in particular, S.MPOE produced majority of volume. Are there any plans to increase the activity on other stocks?
09:38 wywialm hi jurov
09:39 mircea_popescu wywialm you familiar with that buffett quote about volume ?
09:40 wywialm i'm familiar in general on his views on not having a liquid market available, but cannot recall the quote
09:41 mircea_popescu well, there's plenty. one went something like "to call a party with low capital and high transacted volume an investor is not unlike calling a guy in a dirty overcoat that stalks women and jacks off a romantic".
09:42 wywialm i didn't even know this one
09:42 wywialm but it is adequate
09:42 mircea_popescu another's what he said to the berkshire market maker, ie that if the next trade happens next quarter he'll be happy.
09:42 mircea_popescu the idea here is that mpex is a strictly correct and strictly complete reflection of bitcoin business, such as it is.
09:42 mircea_popescu if one's not happy with the volume thereof, one's only recourse is to start a business.
09:43 mircea_popescu attempting to "create business" from the position of the central bank is both stupid and a doomed enterprise.
09:43 mircea_popescu taking mpex private resolves the last possible avenue for derps to argue about this point.
09:44 wywialm indeed it does. but without liquid (or at least 'fairly liquid') stocks, there can be no derivatives market on top of them (no hedging available at reasonable price).
09:45 mircea_popescu and without a solid protocol there can be no serious interest in cryptocurrency.
09:45 wywialm also, the interest of a shareholder in a public company is not always in line with the exchange's. And exchange can encourage volume or discourage it.
09:45 mircea_popescu while these facts are exactly that - facts ; the situation remains what it is. lots of people working to fix it, of course, but until it's fixed it's not fixed.
09:46 wywialm re: protocol - agreed.
09:46 mircea_popescu i think the intention is for mpex to be neutral.
09:46 mircea_popescu historically, or at least in my read of history, anything but neutral resulted in destruction of value from a secular perspective.
09:49 wywialm i hope you are right in this case.
09:49 mircea_popescu if anything, the bitbet experience has taught me that i had been erring in the supportive direction, at any rate.
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09:50 mircea_popescu apparently even the slightest insulation from risk is bound to be misinterpreted in the most extensively insane sense. i have nfi how the fed chairman sleeps at night.
09:51 mircea_popescu but, currently, i am not even convinced the possibility of hedging is actually a wealth increaser.
09:52 wywialm it is certainly in some situations a wealth-preserver (or not wealth decreaser). as with any insurance, it comes at a cost
09:52 mircea_popescu the immediate correlate of "oh, i can distribute my risk to unknown parties" is, "i'll right now!! put less thought into the matter proportionately". however, whether the risk distribution works or does not work is not actually known, or even computed, now. this impedance causes trouble.
09:53 jurov yeah, right, let us eschew insulation from risk and send out zero fee transactions, lest it be misinterpreted!
09:53 mircea_popescu wywialm you might be familiar with the unpopular office of the censor in the roman empire. his job was principally to deny women, 2nd class citizens with very little self-expression debuchees allowed by society outside of conspicuous consumption, the use of luxurious products.
09:53 wywialm in a general sense, we can expoit less than 1 correlation among different assets, bets or scenarios
09:53 mircea_popescu the reason was very strictly that, obviously, if you pay ten aurei for a nice purple, and then wear it off, you WILL be ten aureii less rich.
09:54 mircea_popescu jurov i have nfi why the peanut gallery got stuck on "0 fee tx", and i have nfi why you particularly wanna paint yourself in those colors, but w/e.
09:54 wywialm yes i am familiar with the censor
09:54 wywialm office
09:54 mircea_popescu what's next, we're gonna discuss whether "obama is for the people" ?
09:54 mircea_popescu wywialm well, the idea is that what people want and what people need rarely meet.
09:55 mircea_popescu obvious why people want insurance. unobvious that such a thing is even possible.
09:55 wywialm i certainly agree with that observation
09:55 mircea_popescu yes, it is frequerntly implemented. but always as a ponzi to date.
09:55 mod6 (04:07) <+ben_vulpes> mod6: i have a trashy pdf copy of dodrill's 95 ada instructional material. lmk if you want a copy. << sure! hit me with a link or we can talk in pm if you wanna exchange in other method.
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09:57 wywialm nevertheless, in a very general sense, any action involves taking specific risks and avoiding others. Say, me not invested in S.BBET successfully insulated me from the risk of it going into receivership
09:57 mircea_popescu except now you can't make bets.
09:57 mircea_popescu successful insulation is another way to say economically dead, really.
09:58 mircea_popescu or i guess more properly : "you'll be economically insulated when you're dead."
09:58 wywialm yes, it is not possible to be insulated from anything and stay 'active' in any meaningful way, but it doesn't mean that you can be exposed to everything or that one shouldn't choose carefully what risks to take and from which to insulate.
09:59 mircea_popescu this is the defense against the risks problem above usually deemed as rational. the problem here is that this in practice always devolves to a sort of "when confronted with the number e, i wish to be insulated from the part past the decimal point and underwrite the part before the decimal point".
09:59 mircea_popescu this splitting works for definedrisks. it can never work when you want to put defined risks in one pile and undefinable risks in the other pile.
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10:00 mircea_popescu because you can't trade away what you can't define.
10:00 wywialm oh, yes, we certainly agree on that point. one cannot trade something which is not an asset.
10:01 mircea_popescu even if it were a liability, but it must be specified.
10:01 wywialm but i suspect we may come close to a sort of tautology quite soon
10:01 mircea_popescu so in this sense the "split risks so i only undertake what i want to" works well in theory and on paper, but it is in practice always devolved to a luzly idiocy like "the gauss copula", direct equivalent to yesterday's discussion re the problem of computers
10:02 mircea_popescu see http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-07#1448116
10:03 wywialm it still works when you realize that you have to invest in something and there is no risk-free asset
10:04 mircea_popescu this "realize" is of the nature of "you have to understand we love you", ie, entirely devoid of cognitive content. it is a bit of propaganda one has to accept. ok, so they accept it - or don't. fine. what now ?
10:04 mircea_popescu how is it, for that matter, different from "you have to accept, as a hyip investor, that it's not really an investment".
10:06 mircea_popescu (and for people who aren't in finance and don't follow that trade, perhaps a good primer for the "gaussian copula" lulz is http://trilema.com/2013/why-mpex-is-better-than-fiat-institutions-part-349085-we-dont-use-excel/ seeing how nobody wants to admit or discuss the matter anymore much like the jews forgot all about sabbatai zevi.)
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10:14 wywialm in a hyip world, you have to 'invest' something that is at least a bit worthwhile to scam it from you, which means that there is at least one non-hyip asset and holding it without investing is an investment decision. holding this asset (e.g. USD) is not itself risk-free, but insulates you from hyip risk and exposes you to other risks
10:14 mircea_popescu wait, and it's not worthwhile for the social security administration to scam it from you ?
10:14 mircea_popescu how come they keep doing it ?!
10:14 wywialm that's why 'it exposes you to other risks'
10:15 mircea_popescu there's no executive priviledge vested in anyone but myself. if the president of the united states and some low life in niger say the same thing, they ARE the same thing.
10:15 mircea_popescu i and i alone benefit from the priviledge of calling it "other risks". not them.
10:15 mircea_popescu they gotta call it what it is.
10:16 wywialm yes, i'm looking from the investor's perspective (or at least try to)
10:16 mircea_popescu well, from the investor's perspective, "you have to accept that this is bullshit anyway" is the same thing in either case.
10:18 wywialm not all bullshits are made equal
10:18 mircea_popescu maybe. but this suddenly is a different discussion than the lofty place we started.
10:19 mircea_popescu indeed, not all bullshits are made equal ; and supposedly the market might help distinguish. maybe so.
10:19 mircea_popescu but once the market is both predicated on and discerning the bullshit, you have constructed a very unstable circularity.
10:19 wywialm i still hold that is not possible that every asset is a scam
10:20 mircea_popescu which, as a sidepoint, is exactly why increased integration (aka, globalisation) comes with exponentially increased instability.
10:20 mircea_popescu with less integration, the respective bullshits can at least be somewhat measured against each other on the fx markets.
10:21 wywialm but while it is possible that there is only one bullshit (global currency) it is not possible that the number of currencies equals number of economic and political entitites
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10:22 mircea_popescu wywialm i sympathize with the "not every asset is a scam angle". but consider say apple. could it buy russia ?
10:22 mircea_popescu "it's not a scam, it's a meaningless paper construction built by people who weren't evil, just wrong, and who should have known better but didn't" ?
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10:25 wywialm of course there are limits to corporate valuation based on marginal transactions and comparison of this valuation to total nominal spending of final goods aka GDP
10:26 wywialm and these limits are obvious once you start comparing apples and russias
10:26 wywialm :)
10:27 mircea_popescu let's make it even worse. suppose tomorrow its governmental sponsor announces that it is "under investigation" for "violations". you know for a fact they can steal any amount from its coffers, liek they did with say jpm.
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10:27 mircea_popescu for the simple reason that they put it there in the first place.
10:27 mircea_popescu suppose, alternatively, that tomorrow china declares that apple is banned as a terrorist organisation, and no azn corp can do business with them.
10:27 mircea_popescu etc.
10:28 mircea_popescu (jpm reference : http://trilema.com/2013/bad-news-for-jpm/ )
10:28 wywialm yes, indeed this is why economic power is no power at all unless explicitly (but not always consciously) involved in politics
10:29 wywialm as in your 'millionaire' essay, cash is of no political significance unless its holder or political institutions around him makes it political
10:31 mircea_popescu something like that. at least in macro terms, cash is not much more or much else than a right to organise activity.
10:31 mircea_popescu and motherfucker this black chocolate with almods thing is to die for.
10:35 mircea_popescu anyway - back to the scam thing briefly - bitcoin does in fact deliver on its "best economics lab ever devised" role, for they capable and willing to look. the whole "didn't start out as a scam" thing that is pretty much the universal rule of fiat anything, played itself more obviously, more rapidly, in the hands of more naive people less versed in covering it up.
10:35 mircea_popescu so... yeah.
10:36 mircea_popescu you'll be hard pressed to find a fiat corp today that is anything but another pirate ; and even fifty years ago you'd have been hard pressed to find a fiat corp that wasn't a sort of bASIC from our friend tom with blood and tears.
10:37 mircea_popescu and HAD you found it, it'd have been some family venture ran either by the hardass patriarch that founded it, or else by an exactly cloned son.
10:39 mircea_popescu also re http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448620 : i suspect that's actually the role corporate paper (generally stocks, or else bonds - corporate bonds being the EXACT equivalent of national currencies, by the way, supported in the same way) plays here.
10:42 wywialm yes, it is quite insightful to look at corporate papers as a national currency. Both are composed from a liquidity premium and a claim on some assets. In case of national currencies, the liquidity premium is very large and claim on central bank's assets very weak, but not nonexistent
10:43 wywialm the quality or even existence of those assets are a separate thing
10:43 mircea_popescu actually, in the case of non-sovereign central banks, the claim on assets is VERY strong. recall the case with cyprus ? ( http://trilema.com/2013/time-for-europe-to-repeal-the-us-backed-aml-crap/ )
10:43 mircea_popescu just as soon as the damage done to a hated third party (here, the russians and especially the saudis) exceeds the damage done to the item itself, it's 100%.
10:44 wywialm true observation
10:45 mircea_popescu i am for my needs persuaded that strictly the only reason germany does not today confiscate every fixed good in current possession of its peon population is that the net result is deemed less than continuing with the current nonsense.
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10:45 mircea_popescu once that changes - they'll take it all. and i don't mean houses and cars, i mean blood and livers. they also have a market value.
10:45 wywialm well, they once tried that
10:45 mircea_popescu aha.
10:46 wywialm and in Poland it won't be easily forgotten
10:46 mircea_popescu the important point, at least to my eyes, is that exactly nothing has changed.
10:48 wywialm this view seems to be increasingly more prevalent, lately, in particular in connection to their solving of the recent EU problems
10:49 mircea_popescu ah, but i don';t mean it re germany specifically. could have said france or italy just as well. what i mean is, that a "rule of law" bureaucratic government with an economic presence is strictly speaking the nazi party irrespective of any consideration, chief on the list what they say or think they want.
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10:49 mircea_popescu this entire fiat sovereignity bullshit has to end, and the sooner the better. preferably before it does yet another rendition of its signature stupidity.
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10:50 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448593 << 'we have packaged the defective transistors separately!111'
10:50 mircea_popescu o hai alf.
10:51 asciilifeform guten morgen mircea_popescu !
10:51 mircea_popescu in typical republican fashion, while everyone else was sleeping we got together and shat a few hundred lines of heavy duty material into the logs. go us!
10:51 phf oh hello, we're talking about language
10:53 mircea_popescu let the permanent record indelibly state that you people are driving me to drink. it is not even noon here, and what started as "shit i need breakfast to keep up with this guy. and some chocolate. more chocolate" is by now my 2nd glass of cognac.
10:54 asciilifeform $gettrust wywialm
10:55 deedbot L1: 0, L2: 3 by 1 connections.
10:56 mircea_popescu btw phf you gonna document what the little blue graph on top of pages even is ?
10:57 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448569 << this is sorta why i was astonished at the high sale price; buyer will have to build ~his own~ mircea_popescutron
10:58 asciilifeform (of bbet)
10:58 mircea_popescu maybe buyer has it. who knoes.
10:58 asciilifeform (cue jurov's 'one that shoots 0fee tx!111')
10:58 asciilifeform but srsly, just ~storing~ 100s of btc is nontrivial, esp in the barbarian lands
10:59 mircea_popescu i imagine you did some speccing work since you bid huh.
10:59 phf mircea_popescu: if i end up finding it at all useful, i will. i used spacing to indicate when were the active parts of day, so i'm trying this graph to provide an equivalent functionality. it's a number of messages/hour of day histogram
10:59 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: before.
10:59 mircea_popescu aha.
10:59 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it was 'mortido' that led me to bid. i wanted to see if i could pull it off without getting killed immediately.
11:00 mircea_popescu see the above german liver equation.
11:00 asciilifeform aha!
11:03 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448586 << i have a scan of the canonical (j. barnes) 2012, if either of you want.
11:06 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448622 << was it mircea_popescu at c2 who had a talk about how 'scammitude' is rather like friction, and is not escapeable ?
11:07 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448626 << afaik there is nothing to keep usg from zeroing out any usd account they feel like, whenever
11:07 asciilifeform 'ghaddafi's usd are no longer valid!11'
11:07 mircea_popescu quite.
11:09 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448645 << recall mr mold's 'reign of fnargl' ?
11:12 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448652 << which is precisely why i call the thing 'nazi' and its hypothetical center of mass - hitler.
11:13 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448653 << this performance is not likely avoidable.
11:13 asciilifeform too many biodiesel candidates walking.
11:14 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448603 << i'm beginning to suspect that ~every~ subj has its shabbatai zev.
11:16 mircea_popescu asciilifeform there's one dispute to be had. i doubt very much hitler was anything but a center of mass. yes roosevelt intuited that since he wants the bureaucracy, the right move is to blame hitler, and yes churchill went along with it. but in point of fact...
11:17 mircea_popescu nah, hitler's a minor player. it was der partei.
11:17 mircea_popescu ;;google die partei, die partei, die hat immer recht
11:17 gribble Lied der Partei - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lied_der_Partei>; The Party is Always Right! - German Joys: <http://andrewhammel.typepad.com/german_joys/2007/01/das_lied_der_pa.html>; Ernst Busch - Lied der Partei - YouTube: <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eByxIINticQ>
11:22 asciilifeform randomly, http://imgur.com/a/vYO6K
11:22 mircea_popescu asciilifeform should the performance not be avoided, for it not being avoidable or for any other reason, such as that i feel like blood that morning, the bill will be paid, both here and in heaven, by the fiat governments and no one else.
11:22 asciilifeform ^ the antic in the 1st photo turned out to be, apparently, weev!
11:23 mircea_popescu asciilifeform when's the paper from ?
11:26 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: univ. of md. rag
11:26 asciilifeform 'diamondback'
11:27 asciilifeform circa some time last wk
11:27 mircea_popescu ah ah.
11:27 mircea_popescu guy underwent a white supremacist conversion in prison. (which is not particularly surprising - gotta make some friends somehow!)
11:27 mircea_popescu was curious if this was pre-term or not.
11:28 asciilifeform http://archive.is/5QqLI
11:29 asciilifeform http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/29/nyregion/hacker-weev-says-he-printed-anti-semitic-and-racist-fliers-at-colleges-across-us.html?_r=0 << also lulzy re same
11:31 deedbot- [Trilema] Dark Horse - http://trilema.com/2016/dark-horse/
11:32 mircea_popescu "He was convicted of violating the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act and faced 41 months in prison, but the sentence was overturned." reheheheallly. what ever happeend to "he was wrongfully prosecuted by X and unlawfully imprisoned for 41 months before the people finally came to their senses" ?
11:32 mircea_popescu or is that not how you say usg dun goofed in usg.agitprop
11:34 asciilifeform iirc 'overturned on a technicality' (tm)
11:34 mircea_popescu orly.
11:34 mircea_popescu you mean "wrongfully convicted on a technicality"
11:35 BingoBoingo <mircea_popescu> guy underwent a white supremacist conversion in prison. (which is not particularly surprising - gotta make some friends somehow!) << He was kinda a play white supremacist before prison for the lulz. Switch was flipped in prison.
11:35 mircea_popescu a ? haven't really been following.
11:35 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: american courts largely operate 'on technicalities' now, except when usg's verdict is assured by a tame freisler. it is how they avoid crafting inconvenient precedents.
11:36 mircea_popescu so then ?
11:36 mircea_popescu here's how spears work : they have a business end and a handle. the handle - always points toward you. the business end - always points to the enemy.
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11:36 mircea_popescu there is no exception to this rule.
11:36 asciilifeform aha.
11:36 mircea_popescu thus therefore, he was wrongfully convicted on a technicality.
11:37 mircea_popescu ntowr.
11:37 asciilifeform http://thisainthell.us/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/claymore-thumb1-300x222.jpg << for ref.
11:37 mircea_popescu haha yeah.
11:39 asciilifeform but it was the tampon donation bin that really melted my brain.
11:39 asciilifeform i looked inside, wondering if anyone threw in used one, but - apparently not.
11:41 mircea_popescu no idea wtf they must be thinking - poor woman should get free tampons from strangers rather than become the domestic servant / slave / whatever of a not-poor woman ? or sex toy of a man ? or or or ?
11:41 mircea_popescu wtf.
11:42 mircea_popescu this "need therefore get" bs is inane already. "need therefore labour"!
11:42 asciilifeform i have profoundly nfi!
11:42 asciilifeform though here in the land of the great inca, all women formally belong to the great inca
11:43 asciilifeform who dispenses food and tampon alike!11
11:43 mircea_popescu great inca's a basic bitch.
~ 16 minutes ~
12:00 davout mircea_popescu: http://dpaste.com/0HR7P5B.txt
12:13 shinohai https://news.bitcoin.com/coinwallet-forced-shut-data-breach/ <<< use moar online wallets.
12:21 ben_vulpes asciilifeform: i would *love* a copy of that
12:21 ben_vulpes mod6: i'll get you a dump later today
12:36 ButtNewsButt http://qntra.net/2016/04/furry-perverts-hack-radio-stations-to-evangelize-their-filth/
12:36 deedbot- [Qntra] Furry Perverts Hack Radio Stations To Evangelize Their Filth - http://qntra.net/2016/04/furry-perverts-hack-radio-stations-to-evangelize-their-filth/
~ 19 minutes ~
12:56 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: oh for fucks sake!1 that's qntraworthy now?!
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12:57 BingoBoingo Infrastructure is being taken over by deviant perverts!
12:57 BingoBoingo What's yet another credit card break when this is happening.
12:58 asciilifeform http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/04/neutered-random-number-generator-let-man-rig-million-dollar-lotteries << lulzier nyooz imho
12:59 BingoBoingo I'll get there when the coffee brews up.
13:01 asciilifeform http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2016/04/baby-who-had-his-diapers-searched-at-airport-is-part-of-class-action-suit << lulz from same rag.
13:02 asciilifeform ''According to the civil complaint filed in federal court in Virginia on Tuesday, the boy had been given an “SSSS designation indicating that he had been designated as a ‘known or suspected terrorist'" while going through airport security. Since he was a seven-month-old, Baby Doe, as he is referred to, was subject to “extensive searches,” including rifling through all of his diapers.'
13:05 BingoBoingo anyways asciilifeform 1. Furfags don't have a Turing or a Jurov to redeem them
13:05 BingoBoingo 2. Broadcast radio is a big deal
13:05 BingoBoingo 3. Some people here are now parents and need the warning
13:06 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: big deal how ?
13:06 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: What else do people listen to when driving around the big prison?
13:06 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: personally i listen to 'радио звезда'
13:06 BingoBoingo Spotify and Pandora don't have live traffic updates
13:06 asciilifeform which is spiffy, has b00kz
13:07 asciilifeform right now it is doing life & times of Peter I
13:07 BingoBoingo Ah
13:07 BingoBoingo But what if natural gas life is ignited by construction derps along your commute route?
13:07 jurov til BingoBoingo takes exception not only with fatties, but also with furries?
13:07 asciilifeform also has interludes for 'hot new weapons system of the day'
13:08 asciilifeform or 'etymology of such&such word'
13:08 asciilifeform or 'how inner ear works'
13:09 asciilifeform this is the moscow public radio btw
13:09 asciilifeform picture culture with actual... culture
13:10 asciilifeform Apr 08 13:07:40 <BingoBoingo>But what if natural gas life is ignited by construction derps along your commute route? << as i pointed out, this dun happen 'round here.
13:10 BingoBoingo jurov: There's a consistency to this
13:10 asciilifeform the 'luckiest' we ever get is massive 'pile-up'
13:11 BingoBoingo jurov: Also the only Furry I know anywhere near bitcoin is that fellow who does the mycellium fungus wallet marketing
13:11 asciilifeform i'm not convinced that 'furries' actually exist.
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13:12 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: We don't usually get massive pileups and these pipe explosions are infrequent. House explosions happen anywhere orcs are allowed to go feral while playing homeowner
13:14 BingoBoingo Anyways this is perhaps the most apt summary of journalism ever: "I kind of like the idea that he’s taught himself not to look because if he looks it’s just neverending, right? You have to know when, as Superman, when to intervene and when not to. Or not when not to, you can’t be everywhere at once, literally you can’t be everywhere at once, so he has to be really selective in a weird way about where he chooses to interfere."
13:16 ben_vulpes http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/04/neutered-random-number-generator-let-man-rig-million-dollar-lotteries/ << run more dynamically-compiled mission-critical code!
13:17 asciilifeform ON WINBLOWZ
13:17 asciilifeform for ~several state lottos at once~
13:18 trinque hats off to everyone who didn't get caught like this guy.
13:19 BingoBoingo This reminds me of the mcdonalds monopoly promotion where the $$$ prizes all went to friends and relatives of the vendor doing the printing for years before they were caught
13:20 asciilifeform casino is a little smarter.
13:20 asciilifeform my brother once participated in the programming for a video poker machine, and was informed by his co. that he will, likely, never be permitted inside a casino in usa
13:20 asciilifeform (he laughed, having no desire to ever set foot in one)
13:22 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: afaik mcd broke no laws in that case
13:22 asciilifeform given as it was not a lotto.
13:22 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: But the printing vendor did
13:35 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: incidentally, ianal, and i wonder what counts as proof of malfeasance in a lotto operator.
13:36 asciilifeform does an unlikely win per se ?
13:36 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: I'm not sure
13:36 pete_dushenski had a dream last night that znort woulda gladly paid twice what he did. man alive are these ex post rationalisation engines humming.
13:36 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: srsly build yer own bbet ?
13:36 pete_dushenski ;;later tell danielpbarron http://www.contravex.com/2016/04/07/that-time-i-let-outright-ownership-of-bitbet-slip-through-my-fingers/#comment-43114
13:36 gribble The operation succeeded.
13:36 asciilifeform kako warned that his src isn't of much use to civilians anyway
13:37 BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: Get a saw and go outside. Clear some brush and your mind?
13:37 ben_vulpes pete_dushenski: just outta curiosity, how were you going to run the thing?
13:37 ben_vulpes hire the beedawg?
13:38 BingoBoingo I kinda though he was going to use BBet to teach pantagruel and himself how to code
13:38 ben_vulpes (b-dog, amusingly, a nickname of mine from the nineties)
13:39 pete_dushenski asciilifeform: bbet was established player. hard to replicate. "go build own mpex" about as useful.
13:40 BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: Maybe you can buy Betmoose?
13:40 pete_dushenski BingoBoingo: it's going to be 15C+ today, so the bicycle is getting dusted off fo sho. sorta does the same job as hacktimesawtime
13:40 BingoBoingo And then finally rename contravex to MooseCawks!!!
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13:41 pete_dushenski ben_vulpes: ha! if i knew you'd be open to the idea, i mighta bet more ;)
13:41 BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: hacksaw is exactly wrong saw to use outdoors on brush
13:42 pete_dushenski BingoBoingo: the pantacode angle crossed my mind actually
13:42 BingoBoingo For outdoor brush clearing you want either a chainsaw, reciprocating saw with appropriate blade, or good old fashioned crosscut saw.
13:42 pete_dushenski BingoBoingo: and hack (with axe) then saw (with two-man lumberjack specialsaw) not hacksaw
13:43 BingoBoingo Oh, ic
13:43 pete_dushenski *s/bet/bid more
13:43 asciilifeform two-man lumberjack specialsaw << iirc it is called 'misery whip'
13:44 asciilifeform $up DonaldTrumpOfBTC
13:44 BingoBoingo $up DonaldTrumpOfBTC
13:44 deedbot DonaldTrumpOfBTC voiced for 30 minutes.
13:44 BingoBoingo Hello Mr Clinton
13:44 deedbot DonaldTrumpOfBTC voiced for 30 minutes.
13:48 DonaldTrumpOfBTC should the most senile republic of bitcoin build a firewall to keep chinese miners out?
13:48 asciilifeform $down DonaldTrumpOfBTC
13:52 BingoBoingo asciilifeform: I told you Trump was just a clinton stooge
13:56 pete_dushenski ben_vulpes: anyways, at a management level i had in mind to increase the vig/fee and hold on to house bet winnings in an effort to increase revenue to compensate for mistaken txen, resolutions, etc., obviously appreciating that this may, at least initially, discourage some users. was also going to tag in some meatwot to assist with moderation and actively scour meatwot for potential bookies. toyed with th
13:56 pete_dushenski e idea of changing min 0conf but never quite resolved that quandary myself... alas. it was going to be a steep learning curve to be sure, but i was up for the challenge.
13:58 BingoBoingo ;;later tell shinohai pls to write up lottery rng shennaniganz
13:58 gribble The operation succeeded.
13:59 pete_dushenski BingoBoingo: i think you're better off asking ivanka trump to write for qntra than shinohai. he just doesn't wanna, it seems.
14:01 BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: Clintons can't write for qntra
14:01 BingoBoingo Too far outside WoT
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14:01 pete_dushenski that's racialist
14:01 BingoBoingo Actively inside the anti-WoT
14:01 ben_vulpes mwell, was nominating stan. wouldn'ta been averse to it myself.
14:01 pete_dushenski all non-wot is anti-wot
14:02 BingoBoingo Well whoever want lottery RBG story can take it. I'm not finding a sufficient outrage to attack it.
14:03 BingoBoingo <pete_dushenski> all non-wot is anti-wot << No. People outside the WoT can still be renown as especially evil.
14:04 pete_dushenski ben_vulpes: i momentarily considered stan as an operational partner, but then quickly recalled the ongoing s.nsa saga and how it's basically made "two weeks" (tm) (r) his middle name. not that i fault the 'poor' bastard. he only has so many dr. octopus tentacles with which to do maffs and whatnot.
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14:04 pete_dushenski ben_vulpes: you mighta been a better fit in some ways, but you also obviously have your hands full with biz, kidz, and foundation
14:06 pete_dushenski bbet really had to be a meatwot project for me
14:07 ben_vulpes sure, right
14:08 phf hire indians™
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14:08 shinohai BingoBoingo: link me to sauce? Will give it a whirl when I get back home.
14:09 ben_vulpes hey, they're in the meatwot!
14:10 shinohai Plus, unlike with UStards - no worries about which bathrooms to use. They shit in street!
14:10 pete_dushenski asciilifeform: another reason why i wouldn't build my own bbet : the same reason i also wouldn't build my own cpu fab. i'm less 'inventor' than 'pro-scavenger'. i'm not 'early adopter', but rather 'fast follower'. to work to my strengths, i wouldn't start my own bbet anymore than you'd start your own strip club.
14:11 phf http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448528 << jurov thanks i'll look into it. i mean, the http parser consists of search "http" and then search for a set of separators, it's as ghetto as it gets, but i had better results with that approach overall than using a regex
14:11 phf *url parser rather
14:11 jurov but the problem isn't url parsing
14:12 jurov but escaping of < in the output
14:12 jurov at least it looks so
14:12 pete_dushenski shinohai: don't be surprised if ustards go that way too, particularly as average skin shade continues to endarken
14:13 shinohai hue
14:13 phf jurov: oh oh oh you're talking about log.bitcoin-assets urls being hijacked
14:13 jurov phf that's separate issue
14:13 phf that's … intentional, but obviously breaks after the split
14:13 BingoBoingo shinohai: http://arstechnica.com/security/2016/04/neutered-random-number-generator-let-man-rig-million-dollar-lotteries
14:13 BingoBoingo brb
14:14 jurov Whoever was waiting for coinbr withdrawals, mircea_popescu flushed some this morning, and I did the others now
14:14 shinohai thx BingoBoingo having a nice outdoors lunch, will give it a crack.
14:14 phf jurov: you're talking about this line "PeterL: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448483 << I said the same thing in the other chan a few hours earlier http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=07-04-2016#1443837" yeah?
14:15 jurov phf: it can be soved by other ways then having different host in the label and href
14:15 jurov *other ways than
14:15 phf sure, the ref arrow does the same thing
14:16 jurov like, you can do do s/log.bitcoin.assets/btcbase.org/ globally on everything before the log was launched
14:16 phf that's retarded
14:16 jurov wut?
14:17 phf you can also arbitrarily patch other people's words and claim authenticity
14:17 jurov and for new entries, if user links to the other place, elt it be
14:17 jurov phf so patching urls is okay?
14:17 phf urls are not part of log
14:18 phf urls are interpretation of what the log is saying in the display facility
14:18 phf in this case log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date urls are treated as a "pointer to a log location"
14:19 jurov I expressly request that when i *today* drop #b-a URL , it should NOT be aliased to btcbase.
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14:19 jurov *explicitly
14:19 phf jurov: that's obviously a bug and should be fixed :) i just want to have our priors straight
14:20 phf also url patching facility is from before the arrows, so to some extent can now be dropped entirely
14:20 jurov ok, ty
14:23 pete_dushenski in other news, autonomous semi trucks are about to get the vote : http://qz.com/656104/a-fleet-of-trucks-just-drove-themselves-across-europe/
14:25 pete_dushenski one for BingoBoingo and his political crusades : http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35965362 because what is politics if not a movie ?
14:25 pete_dushenski 'Presidential contenders make cautious movie picks'
14:33 phf jurov: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448526
14:34 jurov phf: yup
14:34 phf old urls are still hijacked though, i think i'm going to disable that, and let just arrows do their thing
14:44 jurov or do the hijacking properly in all cases where it's needed, like polimedia.us -> trilema.com
14:51 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448821 << on top of my usual doings i now also spend time looking for wurk...
14:55 pete_dushenski done pulling up excel when boss walks by so soon ? or is guy who stormed out setting a precedent you're keen to follow ?
14:56 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: l0l excel
14:57 asciilifeform i'm simply tired of having to leave the house.
14:58 asciilifeform dun understand why i should have to, to write motherfucking software
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14:58 pete_dushenski commuting is pretty gay, no argument
14:59 pete_dushenski i, for one, couldn't imagine spending >1hr just to ~travel~ to work and back. each way. my mind boggles that millions in 'first world' spend 3hrs+ (this is sop in, say, toronto)
14:59 pete_dushenski s/way/day
15:00 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: i routinely sit 3-4 h/day in car.
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15:02 pete_dushenski surprised you haven't programmed own autonomous car ferfuxake. it wouldn't take a month's worth of time stuck behind idiotic wheel in mordor traffic
15:02 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: i actually don't have much to choose from. 95+% of work in my field requires usg 'top secret'.
15:02 asciilifeform in fact i got a call from no less than motherfucking ft meade the other day.
15:02 asciilifeform not bureaucrats proper, mind you, but contractors with $maxint
15:03 asciilifeform they desperately want serfs.
15:03 pete_dushenski ft. meade doesn't read logs ? for cereal ?
15:03 asciilifeform nobody reads logz.
15:03 asciilifeform apparently.
15:03 pete_dushenski and here i was thinking that we were #1 google hit besttimeeverytime
15:04 pete_dushenski so much for that theory
15:04 asciilifeform i have learned that:
15:04 asciilifeform a) there is ~0 demand for the things i know how to do among honest-work folks
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15:04 asciilifeform b) the folks who ~are~ hiring reversers, CAN'T FIND them
15:05 asciilifeform mircea_popescu will probably, when he wakes up, remind me that i oughta learn a new profession, e.g, organ grinder
15:06 asciilifeform and also will probably not forget to remind that i am ~useless and will be pig food eventually
15:06 asciilifeform (mega-revelation!11)
15:07 asciilifeform in other nyooz, https://www.reddit.com/r/shapeshiftio/comments/4dx6k4/shapeshift_update_april_7_security_breach
15:07 asciilifeform ^ vorhees pwned
15:07 pete_dushenski nah, he'll remind you that soviet chick doesn't need to know when 'wall falls', just needs to know right guy to get her through to other side. there was mega-thread on this at one point.
15:08 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: mircea_popescu generally doesn't have actionable advice for blokes
15:08 asciilifeform 'go and eat a pistol, first pray to vishnu that you can be reborn hot chik'
15:08 pete_dushenski 'be awesome or die' (tm) (r)
15:08 asciilifeform aha. mega-algo.
15:09 pete_dushenski the ultimate otp
15:09 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: were you here for the 'everett's device' thread ?
15:09 pete_dushenski not that i recall
15:09 asciilifeform do you recall h. everett ?
15:09 asciilifeform of 'many worlds qm'
15:09 shinohai ;;later tell BingoBoingo http://ix.io/vG3
15:09 gribble The operation succeeded.
15:10 pete_dushenski asciilifeform: hm. 'fraid not.
15:10 asciilifeform fella who proposed 'parallel universes' treatment of qm, vs bohr's original 'magically collapsing wavefunction when you look at it'
15:11 asciilifeform e's model is not physically demonstable as THE correct model (but neither is bohr's)
15:11 asciilifeform BUT it has the advantage of removing the idiot vitalism that bohr pissed back into physics
15:12 asciilifeform at any rate, everett device is this gadget that tries to guess the answer to a trapdoor problem, e.g., deriving mircea_popescu's private key primes
15:12 asciilifeform and if it fails, it shoots the user in the head
15:12 pete_dushenski ;;later tell danielpbarron http://www.contravex.com/2016/04/07/that-time-i-let-outright-ownership-of-bitbet-slip-through-my-fingers/#comment-43166
15:12 gribble The operation succeeded.
15:12 asciilifeform according to everett's mechanics, the outcome of using this device is that you wake up in the universe where the primes were guessed.
15:13 asciilifeform correctly.
15:13 asciilifeform (or, alternatively, where the pistol jammed)
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15:13 pete_dushenski haha i like it.
15:14 pete_dushenski everett's device sounds like how stan would design computers and/or bitcoin.
15:14 ben_vulpes slightly less time consuming than attempting to jump through the vault door, i suppose
15:14 asciilifeform actually it is how they make mircea_popescus.
15:16 BingoBoingo ty shinohai
15:16 asciilifeform his algo, in my summary, was, approx., 'start by being 10,000 bright and suicidally daring ro teenagers in the roaring '90s, end by being one mircea_popescu' or the like.
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15:16 asciilifeform in mechanical eng. parlance,
15:16 asciilifeform it is an ~ablative~ rather than an ~additive~ manufacturing process.
15:16 asciilifeform think milling vs '3d printing'.
15:17 asciilifeform generally works great, it is how su made ballet dancers, chess champions, etc.
15:18 pete_dushenski also how us made rockefeller(s)
15:19 pete_dushenski how canada still makes hockey players too, though this is the solitary domain where this strategy is herein employed.
15:19 shinohai ;;ticker
15:20 gribble Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 420.71, Best ask: 420.81, Bid-ask spread: 0.10000, Last trade: 420.71, 24 hour volume: 6944.94381268, 24 hour low: 420.01, 24 hour high: 424.49, 24 hour vwap: None
15:20 asciilifeform anyway i regard the algo as being ~entirely uninteresting.
15:20 danielpbarron pete_dushenski, I'm just sayin' my bid was valid, and the first! I can sign something to this effect if anyone seriously doubts
15:20 asciilifeform yes, it is interesting to know, e.g., how petroleum was formed in the ground, from dead organisms
15:20 asciilifeform but it does NOT help anyone make moar
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15:20 asciilifeform when it runs out.
15:21 pete_dushenski asciilifeform: also how ukr farmers and rocath french-canadians rose to prominence in the last few centuries in this country : 8 children families sop. mormons continue this practise (plus mega-secrecy) and they're not doing too shabbily by most measures.
15:22 pete_dushenski danielpbarron: i hear you, i do. but it's sorta over and done with at this point.
15:22 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: not so secretly, they - and the hassidim of nyc - collect 'single mother' pensions by the megatonne
15:22 asciilifeform (given as the marriages are not officiated by usg, the women all register as welfare mother cases)
15:22 asciilifeform mega-profit.
15:23 pete_dushenski asciilifeform: have you ever been inside mormon temple ? unless you're architect or engineer who built the thing, or practising mormon thereafter, the answer is nope.
15:23 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: they give tours
15:23 asciilifeform i used to work right next to it
15:24 asciilifeform but couldn't be arsed.
15:24 pete_dushenski tour of what, bathrooms ? front lawn ?
15:24 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: i have nfi! never went!
15:25 asciilifeform they have some exhibits for infidels
15:27 ben_vulpes https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2016/02/24/federal-food-stamp-fraud-charges-could-topple-warren-jeffss-flds-church-utahs-largest-polygamous-sect/ << latest and greatest re welfare
15:27 phf Actually I remember threads from perhaps 2014 where mp was trying to communicate mp-ness, my impression is that he gave up from lack of grokking
15:28 phf What I'm saying it wasn't always "eat a naggant or be awesome"
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15:29 danielpbarron http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448877 >> i routinely sit 3-4 h/day in car. << I knew a guy who went by train from Madison, Ct to NYC every weekday, and another guy who went from rhode island!! to NYC, also train. And to tie into current thread, there was a 3rd guy on the train who was mormon.
15:29 phf It was causes/purposes, original be rich guide, move to Argentina do cash, etc.
15:29 asciilifeform phf: how does 'move to argentina and do cash' work on folks who ain't already rich
15:30 phf You seen the prophet?
15:30 asciilifeform waiwut
15:31 phf Maybe I got the name wrong, about young Arab in prison
15:31 asciilifeform ah no i only read mircea_popescu's review of it.
15:33 phf Anyway I can't communicate that point because I only infrequently manage it, and the results are always predictably +ev, but perhaps it's the idea that minimax requires painful break, but then possibility space opens up and a talented person like yourself will have a relatively easy (though not effortless) time exploiting it
15:34 asciilifeform 'talented' is not a scalar.
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15:34 asciilifeform though mircea_popescu appears to think so.
15:34 phf And it's most definitely that you can't reason out of minimax, so sitting there "how does" is not going to work
15:35 phf That's usually when you put on a gas mask
15:35 asciilifeform this is sorta why the 'r-strategy' game is played with teenagers
15:35 asciilifeform because they are dumb enough to do a screamingly -ev thing
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15:35 asciilifeform they don't get wedged in minimax pits.
15:39 asciilifeform but briefly back to thread, imho it is important to understand that asking 'how to be mircea_popescu' is a fundamentally broken question, not unlike 'how do i win the lotto'
15:41 phf Sure it's idiotic but that's where conversation ~ended~ with an obvious "eat a naggant" response
15:41 asciilifeform it is actually interesting to me, how mircea_popescu has a very strong respect for folks who take suicidally dumb risks (e.g., the 'oregon patriot' folk, isis snackbars, etc.)
15:41 asciilifeform could it be because fella himself took a strongly -ev tack and won ?
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15:42 asciilifeform lessee what he says when wakes up.
15:43 asciilifeform i recall he had a spiffy article, where he cooked up an alternative to the maslow 'pyramid' thing, with 'mystical domination - being right when there was no good reason you could be right' as #5
15:44 phf It started with wolf teaching rabbits to hunt with a playfulness and earnestly "this how you put mouth on jugular see!!" with rabbits going "eww jugular how to hunt carrots like mp?" with an obvious "wtf durp" response
15:44 asciilifeform this is not an unfair summary.
15:45 asciilifeform to be complete, it oughta also contain a reminder that there is not a forest where you can put 10 bil. wolves.
15:45 asciilifeform and have'em eat.
~ 16 minutes ~
16:01 punkman asciilifeform: but briefly back to thread, imho it is important to understand that asking 'how to be mircea_popescu' is a fundamentally broken question, not unlike 'how do i win the lotto' << hey we just had the answer to lotto. you cheat.
16:02 asciilifeform punkman: when you cheat at lotto, you are simply playing another lotto.
16:02 asciilifeform where you can't cheat.
16:02 asciilifeform (i.e. 10,001 of 'you' will be caught and jailed, 1 - wins.)
16:04 asciilifeform http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2012/02/wheel-of-misfortune.html << while we're on the subj.
16:06 trinque the lottery metaphor doesn't square with the wolves and rabbits metaphor at all.
16:06 trinque one's a pile of fungible derps; the other pointedly isn't
16:10 trinque (in all fairness to the rabbits, I'm aware of at least one instance of a rabbit eating the ears off his weaker brother)
16:11 asciilifeform trinque: you can't be a well-fed wolf just by wanting.
16:12 asciilifeform i have nfi how many mircea_popescus fit on one earth, but i doubt that even 100 do.
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16:21 trinque asciilifeform: seems on the order of magnitude of the number of countries.
16:22 asciilifeform trinque: precious little to do with countries.
16:23 trinque I'd say it has everything to do with the architecture of human societies.
16:23 jurov wow, now alf's playing "become mp or bust"?
16:23 asciilifeform from my admittedly amateur understanding, mircea_popescus are produced when power verticals ~collapse~ and teenagers are competing in re cutting throats rather than who can be best young sov bureaucrat.
16:23 trinque jurov: who the fuck are you talking to, the audience?
16:23 asciilifeform jurov: nah, if i wanted to play, i oughta have played when i was 5
16:23 jurov to peanut gallery!
16:24 trinque yawn
16:24 trinque asciilifeform: seems exactly the right thing to happen right before another power vertical is established
16:24 * trinque thinks of ender wielding legions as though they are part of his extended body
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16:25 jurov asciilifeform: really, no-commute-sleep-adlibitum is quite reachable even without going mp-complete
16:25 asciilifeform jurov: from my current position it is as fantastical as going to mars.
16:27 trinque back to the thread, considering people in isolation is an artifact of this world's thinking.
16:27 jurov no, it's just because you have cut yourself from most exits by forbidding yourself to pay any taxes
16:27 asciilifeform jurov: i presently pay ~50% tax.
16:27 asciilifeform more still, if you count the 'tax breaks' other usians get (e.g. mortgage) that i don't.
16:28 trinque "why is it so hard for an mp to build his superorganism?" is a more interesting question to me than "why not moar mp?"
16:28 asciilifeform why hard.
16:28 asciilifeform he has it.
16:29 jurov create a business, deduct expenses etc...but that discussion's dead horse, i guess
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16:32 * danielpbarron gets to sleep adlibitum for most of the year -- has seasonal job, very little sleep during that season, and zero personal time to speak of
16:34 danielpbarron and since it's not all-year-round, and since no week is even the same really, i don't really get sick of working
16:36 mircea_popescu davout i have nfi what you did here. for one thing, shareholders don't get 86, they get 86 + 1% of resolveed bets - 13.37
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16:39 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448733 << there's this internet lore furry thing, so i suppose it intends to be high comedy ; but meh.
16:41 asciilifeform jurov: business requires capital.
16:41 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448761 << had one ambushed by sluts at bdsm event thing, i thought i recounted for teh logs.\
16:44 deedbot- [Qntra] Weak RNG Assists Man's Lottery Fortune - http://qntra.net/2016/04/weak-rng-assists-mans-lottery-fortune/
16:44 phf danielpbarron: my impression is that in all seriousness asciilifeform pines for a technology priest status in an hierarchy that's at the very least not rotten through and through, i.e. building machines for non-lizard-hitler. he despairs since one is not available. as such "become crust punk" advise is totally inapplicable to him
16:44 jurov asciilifeform: Yes.
16:45 mircea_popescu it is altogether dubious, however, that priest-like organisation may exist in world bereft of some sort of hitler.
16:45 asciilifeform phf is a winner!
16:45 asciilifeform ding!
16:45 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: who said it could.
16:45 mircea_popescu well wanting something you know can't exist is an idle sort of onanism.
16:45 mircea_popescu i'm not even sure the word want may be thus prostituted.
16:45 asciilifeform ultimately all living things want ridiculous things that could not possibly exist.
16:45 mircea_popescu this is not so.
16:46 phf maybe human hitler is ok, just as long he's not the venusian variety
16:46 mircea_popescu "all women" maybe, and even this is dubious.
16:46 mircea_popescu phf this sounds to me a lot like "we'll build actual programming language on top of this approximating processor thing".
16:47 asciilifeform as a matter of fact, we will.
16:47 mircea_popescu either that or we'll mesterul manole all over the place.
16:47 asciilifeform either that or we get eaten.
16:47 mircea_popescu not even.
16:48 asciilifeform error:1408F119:SSL routines:SSL3_GET_RECORD:decryption failed or bad record mac] << ?!
16:48 mircea_popescu contrary to what the disney cartoon re-enactions of "the dinosaur age" may show for cinematic value, most dinosaurs died of organ failure, not of being eaten by a supposedly functional superpreditor that in point of fact was barely adequate to count as a manatee in modern terms.
16:49 asciilifeform i thought they died of starvation?
16:49 asciilifeform after meteor 'nuke winter'
16:49 mircea_popescu i mean historically not finally.
16:50 asciilifeform ah
16:50 asciilifeform 'you have died of [death] ! please play again.' -- 'oregon trail'
16:50 mircea_popescu quite.
16:52 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448791 << heh, prolly best bet if that's what he's after is find the freelancer.com injun that did the coding in the first place
16:53 mircea_popescu lol most senile republic :D
16:53 mircea_popescu i suppose the capital really should be alzheimera
16:54 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448814 << no ho is too far out of wot!
16:56 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448825 << no he really had the right idea, something like that'd have been a great way to sanitize one's own meatwot.
16:57 mircea_popescu phf i bet you the reason ghetto beats regexp is that regexp is horribly implemented in w/e you use.
16:57 mircea_popescu generally, it's the one thing most hideously implemented anywhere.
16:58 pete_dushenski ha http://fr.anco.is/2016/bitbet-auction-a-winrar-is-znort987#comment-8496
16:59 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448857 << he has a point i think ; while the semantic content of links may perhaps be argued in that way phf , seeing how for instance redirects are honored etc ; nevertheless can't simply hijack people's links.
17:00 mircea_popescu davout for my curiosity, did you move the hotwallet funds or did you pass the codebase along with the hotwallet ?
↖
17:02 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448873 << check it out, he's caught bad habits from irc.
17:02 phf original purpose was to let me read log references without leaving the log reader, but jurov later suggested doing a more exhaustive link fix for deprecated urls
17:03 phf the whole link fix has been superseded by annotations anyway
17:03 mircea_popescu i can see why pre-dragon log would link to itself rather than build an outside dependency. who even knows how long the old log website will last.
17:03 mircea_popescu but that is then. now - people link to whatever they want and it's what it is.
17:04 mircea_popescu asciilifeform: i have learned that: a) there is ~0 demand for the things i know how to do among honest-work folks b) the folks who ~are~ hiring reversers, CAN'T FIND them << "socialism works" in other words.
17:04 mircea_popescu this is exactly how it fucking goes.
17:05 phf "there is nothing wrong with your television set. do not attempt to adjust the picture. we are controlling transmission."
17:06 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: this is a charitable interpretation
17:06 mircea_popescu so im charitable.
17:06 phf behavior was obviously buggy, with an equally trivial fix, i.e. fragment < last-t-a-entry-id
17:06 asciilifeform (the most reality-based hypothesis is that ~asciilifeform~ simply isn't 133337 enough to score decent gig)
17:07 phf but the question of link hijack remains, i will revisit it after i refine the annotation mechanism a bit
17:07 mircea_popescu this isn't how it works. decent gigs, like slutty chicks, aren't "earned", especially not in the linear, old mia farrow view of earning.
17:07 asciilifeform yeah i get it i read nietzsche too
17:08 mircea_popescu well then show it lol
17:08 asciilifeform i also read caesar, where do i 'show' ~that~.
17:08 mircea_popescu where you keep bawing on alexander's grave like some sort of future great general ? i dunno.
17:09 asciilifeform l0l
17:09 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448918 << this is no light matter.
17:10 mircea_popescu biggest problem with everett's notions of qm, and why bohr was a respected physicist whereas everett was a sort of h. ellison, was that he purports to have some sort of q-independent causality.
17:10 asciilifeform i have 0 respect for the vitalist bohr.
↖
17:10 mircea_popescu for all you know, the cause and effect chain breaks down and the pistol jams BECAUSE you tied the cart to this arrangement
17:10 asciilifeform and i see his respectability as wholly engineered and 'aged statesman' dowager crud.
17:10 mircea_popescu this approach is so utterly naive as to rather call to mind britney spears.
17:11 mircea_popescu well, not like you have to!
17:11 mircea_popescu but the problem remains teh problem.
17:11 asciilifeform the man was in a deeper sense an antiscientist than lysenko.
17:11 mircea_popescu how so ?
17:11 asciilifeform vitalist.
17:11 asciilifeform and connived to bring back vitalism.
17:11 asciilifeform successfully.
17:11 mircea_popescu einstein, same measure ?
17:11 asciilifeform nope.
17:11 mircea_popescu but god doth not play dice ?
17:11 asciilifeform where did e put in 'magical brain rays collapsing wavefunction'
17:11 asciilifeform he did not.
17:12 mircea_popescu right in there.
17:12 asciilifeform nowhere.
17:12 mircea_popescu you forget or simplky dunno the ridiculous phase towards the end where he was refusing various bits of physics on the grounds that they insulted his religious notions ?
17:12 asciilifeform quote me where einstein in his ~productive~ life privileged man.
17:12 asciilifeform (as bohr did)
17:13 mircea_popescu you just moved to scotsman argument.
17:13 asciilifeform fine, in his entire body of work
17:13 asciilifeform where?
17:14 mircea_popescu you not familiar with the scandal where einstein wouldn't take the heisenberg uncertainity ?
17:14 asciilifeform i am
17:14 asciilifeform he was into 'clockwork world' aha.
17:15 mircea_popescu and this is not meeting your standards ?
17:15 asciilifeform it is precise opposite.
17:15 mircea_popescu i do not follow.
17:15 asciilifeform (he demanded a model that does not admit chance anywhere.)
17:15 mircea_popescu and from this you infer that ?
17:16 asciilifeform afaik at no point did e proclaim 'this physical system behaves differently when some human is looking at it'
17:16 mircea_popescu human has nothing to do with this.
17:16 asciilifeform an idiocy that ~ought~ to have gotten bohr into a productive and happy life of tractor-driving
17:16 asciilifeform instead of physics
17:16 mircea_popescu i have nfi what you read, but human wasn't bohr's concern either.
17:17 asciilifeform he had motherfucking 'sentient observers'
17:17 mircea_popescu the point is that interaction changes a system and observation is not priviledged.
17:17 asciilifeform actually he privileged observers (e.g., the man, but not the cat)
17:17 mircea_popescu you'll hafta quote.
17:18 asciilifeform bohr rather.
17:20 * asciilifeform will have to come back to this.
17:20 mircea_popescu sentient is in any case not the proper word. the point is that if observer future behaviour is modulated by the observation, this is one class of thing. such as is the man, or the cat. and if observer future behaviour is not so modulated, then this is another class of thing. such as a rock.
17:20 mircea_popescu but this is a purely mental exercise, and of no particular physical relevancy, really.
17:20 asciilifeform it is a dodge.
17:20 mircea_popescu dodging what ?
17:21 asciilifeform dodging the question of what ~actually~ happens.
17:21 mircea_popescu nothing actually happens.
17:21 asciilifeform in all previous physical theories, there is a solid reality presumed.
17:21 mircea_popescu which goes directly to your "correct program for all electrically-possible inputs". there is never going to be a very interesting program which takes an ennumeralbe list of inputs. such is the sad fate of things.
17:21 mircea_popescu yes, but this presumption is unwarranted.
17:21 asciilifeform admitting mushmind idiocy is a poetteringization of physics.
17:22 mircea_popescu uh.
17:23 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: present-day state of the art in programs is closer to the arab 'insha'llah' ('allah's will drives atoms to do whatever the fuck they want, what is this science thing') than to anything else.
17:23 mircea_popescu well sure.
17:23 asciilifeform ~some measure of sanity~ is possible.
17:23 mircea_popescu hey, there's no objection to your very valid criticisms in locus.
17:24 mircea_popescu but they'll never build such a tower of babel as to actually touch the definitive-complete-actually-happens-clockwork.
17:24 asciilifeform surely not.
17:24 mircea_popescu so you're a vitalist and shame on you.
17:25 asciilifeform but recall that prior to structural steel, a 6-story bldg that isn't a pyramid is a 'tower of babel'
17:25 asciilifeform every bit as 'space lift tower' is today.
17:25 asciilifeform all i propose is the 'structural steel.'
17:25 mircea_popescu nah, roman insulae were as tall as 10-12 stories.
17:25 asciilifeform worx so long as you don't put in cast-iron bathtubs, pianos...
17:26 asciilifeform rome was lighter use case for structures.
17:26 mircea_popescu well, hagia sofia still stands, and it carried gilded roof.
17:26 asciilifeform roof.
17:26 mircea_popescu but yes, be it 6 and 12, whatever it is, still low.
17:26 asciilifeform (roof cheats, can have buttresses, columns.)
17:26 mircea_popescu yeh
17:26 mircea_popescu latin really means "cheat"
17:27 asciilifeform l0l
17:29 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448924 << this is actually eerily accurate ;/
17:29 * deedbot hands you a broomstick.
17:29 mircea_popescu certainlyt most of the people i cared to hang out over the years are stiff.
↖
17:42 phf problem with parsing urls is not regex or no regex, it's that you can't reliably parse a url without resorting to heuristics OR doing nlp on context. all ; , : ) are valid constituents of url path, query and fragment, so you can't know where url ends and context begins.
17:50 mircea_popescu that's also a thing
17:56 asciilifeform or could simply load it
17:56 asciilifeform if not errorcode --> valid url....
18:00 mircea_popescu what of dead links ?
18:01 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448936 << this is nonsense. people are born every day. yes, you won't be able to make the present crop regain their youth / live forever / be happy / bla bla. nor are these valid goals, outside of daydreaming.
18:03 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448952 << the incentive for hearing that, notwithstanding whatever may have been said, is that the answer's ready and includes no actual effort.\
18:04 mircea_popescu and you didn't getg the name wrong, un prophete.
18:05 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448961 << that';s not the real issue. the really issue is that SELF is not a scalar, and you'd want it to be.
18:05 mircea_popescu \
18:06 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448966 << mno. it's because they're humble enough.
18:06 asciilifeform same thing.
18:06 mircea_popescu for the record, adults are by and large MUCH dumber than teenagers. which is why i will accept a shoddy seventeen year old to serve, but not a thirty-one year old were her ass gilded.
18:07 mircea_popescu i've yet to meet a teen actually as dumb as the average adult. ignorant, sure, but that's something else.
18:07 asciilifeform i thought it was the wrinkles ?
18:07 mircea_popescu you'd think that, for the same reason you think all tyhe other things around this topic.
18:07 mircea_popescu but no, i couldn't care less bout the wrinkles.
18:07 asciilifeform actually i have certifiably nfi
18:08 asciilifeform my scale-model mircea_popescu fails me.
18:10 asciilifeform but waitasec
18:10 asciilifeform since when do we give a flying fuck about 'average adult' ?
18:10 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448971 << mno. it's because the fella despises the huswife notions of valuation ; and knows enough about risk to understand wtf it ACTUALLY is, and has the experience of it to have verified such understanding. earlier's convo with polish econ guy related.
18:10 mircea_popescu asciilifeform since we're discussing people in general.
18:13 mircea_popescu see as a forinstance, you ~think~ that going up to some angry looking black dudes propping a streetlight in the bad part of town and sticking them up with your bare hands is "insanely suicidal risk". this is exactly not how it fucking works, as drexl explains for your benefit, if you were paying attention.
18:17 asciilifeform who?
18:17 asciilifeform (who is drexl ?)
18:17 mircea_popescu drexl.
18:17 mircea_popescu this guy, thinks he's a nigger. got a bad scar and missing eye.
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18:17 asciilifeform i burn with eagerness to follow this guru ?!
18:18 asciilifeform can haz guru with 2 eyez?
18:18 mircea_popescu ;;google "now i know i'm pretty, but i ain't as pretty as a couple of titties"
18:18 gribble Drexl Spivey (Character) - Quotes - IMDb: <http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0006549/quotes>; True Romance (1993) - Quotes - IMDb: <http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0108399/quotes>; Drexl Spivey - The Quentin Tarantino Archives: <http://wiki.tarantino.info/index.php/Drexl_Spivey>
18:18 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448987 << very many, actually. the least bothersome thing to a mp is another one.
18:20 asciilifeform then who did mircea_popescu's friends ( http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1449148 ) in ?
18:20 mircea_popescu and ftr, power verticals collapse BECAUSE of appearance of the mythical beast, not the other way.
18:20 asciilifeform orcs ?
18:20 mircea_popescu mps are the product of mps and nothing else.
18:20 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: where were they in 1970s su then
18:20 asciilifeform sleeping in the ground ? like cicada eggs ?
18:20 mircea_popescu apparently - not there. i dunno, wasn't there myself.
18:21 mircea_popescu and you have to appreciate, your particular notion of "living very long time" as summum bonum is not widely shared.
18:21 asciilifeform actually this is not mine
18:22 asciilifeform i did not say 'would like to live very long time!11' but only that 'not in a hurry to eat the luger yet'
18:22 asciilifeform different thing.
18:22 asciilifeform in point of fact i am on record as 'i dun need being 50 yo for anything.'
18:23 asciilifeform on the other hand i recognize that the things i actually like (and consider vital) are very much not widely shared.
18:24 mircea_popescu anyway, there's very little competition going on. i have numerous memories of "teenagers trying to compete" throughout schooling - starting with say this girl in 3rd grade even. i never competed with anyone, wtf do i care.
18:24 asciilifeform ok who killed mircea_popescu's chums then ?
18:24 asciilifeform meteors ?
18:24 mircea_popescu meteors, cancer, orcs, other ones, women, drinking, boredom...
18:24 mircea_popescu what usually kills people ?
18:25 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=09-03-2015#1046786 << oblig
18:25 asciilifeform (new logz broken ?)
18:25 asciilifeform i will repeat it here, i suppose:
18:26 asciilifeform wife says to drunken husband, 'every night you drink, drink, you never bring money home, you worthless piece of shit, go visit the cemetary - see how many gravestones say 'died of vodka.'..'
↖
18:26 asciilifeform husband goes off, actually goes to count.
↖
18:26 asciilifeform comes back, says,
↖
18:26 asciilifeform 'i counted, read the cards on the wreaths. said things like, 'from wife', 'from son', 'from mother-in-law' - but none said 'from vodka.' nobody died from vodka.'
↖
18:26 mircea_popescu i see it in teh new logz
18:26 asciilifeform hm.
18:26 asciilifeform what am i doing wrong
18:27 mircea_popescu vodka!
18:27 asciilifeform apparently!
18:27 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/09-03-2015#1046786 << 404
↖
18:30 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1448998 << you know, if anyone actually cares, i had that book, and read it at the age (romanians did these super-glossy high value looking sf series for some reason, for a few years were the best physical item books avail in ro. http://www.endernews.com/images/covers/rom-1994-nemira.jpg << this one), but didn't think much of it. read to me like so much purple prose, some derp jacking off w
18:30 mircea_popescu ith substititive fantasies, lots of that sort of crud floating around at the time. liked n. spinrad's alte americi and masinaria rock&roll way better.
18:30 * deedbot hands you a broomstick.
18:30 mircea_popescu actually, am i the only norman spinrad reader ?
18:31 asciilifeform not only one.
18:31 asciilifeform and i never liked 'ender'
18:31 asciilifeform it is somehow pathologically american b00k.
18:31 mircea_popescu (alte americi ie other americas was an anthology, street meet ; the lost continent ; world war last ; la vie continue)
18:31 asciilifeform i was never able to pin down quite why
18:32 mircea_popescu notably, he has the sex-fiend ex car salesman thing. guy predicted trump!
18:32 mircea_popescu then again most people predicted trump.
18:32 asciilifeform sheckley predicted the shit-future
18:32 asciilifeform where nothing really changed.
18:33 asciilifeform afaik the only one who did.
18:33 mircea_popescu well... huxley neh ?
18:33 asciilifeform nah huxley's world at least had sex and dope
18:33 asciilifeform as a matter of course
18:33 asciilifeform and satisfied sheeple
18:34 * asciilifeform never thought much of huxley
18:35 asciilifeform and iirc he got seriously hot&bothered thinkin' of '30s totalitarian inca empires.
18:35 asciilifeform like 99% of the 'intellectualz' of his time.
18:35 mircea_popescu heh
18:35 asciilifeform i find this as bitter a pill as mircea_popescu does rms.
18:36 * asciilifeform bbl
18:36 mircea_popescu http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1449008 << dfidn't go anywhere last time, no.
~ 27 minutes ~
19:04 deedbot- [Qntra] Shapeshift.io Hacked - http://qntra.net/2016/04/shapeshift-io-hacked/
19:06 shinohai BingoBoingo: spelling of "breech" to "breach"
~ 23 minutes ~
19:30 BingoBoingo ty
19:31 shinohai np, unless that was a pun on Erik Voorhee's ass xD
19:32 BingoBoingo mebbe
~ 38 minutes ~
20:11 jurov mircea_popescu: is there any mpex mintenance going on?
20:21 mircea_popescu bg
20:21 mircea_popescu n
20:21 mircea_popescu jurov couldja ask the actual question plox ty.
20:22 jurov set email
20:22 jurov *sent
20:23 mircea_popescu aite.
20:23 mircea_popescu dpaste faster, ftr.
↖
20:24 jurov mk
20:24 mircea_popescu $voice mthreat
20:24 deedbot $voice mthreat is not a command.
↖
20:25 mircea_popescu $up mthreat
20:25 deedbot mthreat voiced for 30 minutes.
20:25 mircea_popescu mthreat were you talking to deedbot- with a - ?
20:33 mircea_popescu jurov yeah, basically. s.bbet is no longer available for trade ; shareholders will receive liquidation as calculated stated earlier ; f.mpif is also no longer available for trade ; it will be liquidated end of april.
20:33 jurov and s.qntr?
20:33 mircea_popescu nothing peculiar there.
20:35 jurov mpex is not processing s.qntr orders, too
20:35 mircea_popescu was soem delay but i see it did.
20:35 mircea_popescu check ?
20:36 jurov yes, it went through
20:36 jurov thanks
20:38 mthreat no just deedbot
20:39 mircea_popescu mthreat weird.
20:39 mircea_popescu trinque hey, various peeps complaining deedbot is ignoring their $up.
20:39 mircea_popescu slow's kinda not good in that spot as it makes people think it dun work.
20:42 trinque yep, I need to replace that box; it's straining under doing that and being a bitcoin node at the same time
20:43 trinque mthreat: replies to me in about 12sec currently
20:43 trinque isn't replying at all to you?
20:44 mthreat trinque: it does for $up, but I don't know what command to send for the "verify" command
20:44 mthreat trinque: i tried 'help', etc, can't find a help
20:44 trinque oh, $v with the OTP
20:44 trinque yes it does need a $help
20:44 mthreat ok
20:44 mthreat or a $verify alias to $v :)
20:44 trinque certainly
20:45 trinque I'm gonna poke the DC monday about moving to a box with moar cores, and will probably push some updates to the bot itself too then
20:45 mthreat thanks, it works!
20:45 trinque yw :)
20:46 mthreat mircea_popescu: anyway, just a trip to the US. Went to the classic jet aircraft association conference, met bunch of jet pilots.
20:48 mthreat and ate chipotle
20:59 mircea_popescu is that the thing that makes you shit blood ?
20:59 mircea_popescu it's $v btw. never was !verify eitehr, !v.
21:01 shinohai mthreat and ate chipotle <<< hope you don't die of dysentery (tm)
21:14 mircea_popescu 12 is nb tbh trinque
~ 15 minutes ~
21:30 mthreat no dysentery here, my gut is strong
21:42 mthreat mircea_popescu: speaking of dysentery, we should get lunch soon
21:52 trinque An I/O error occurred: undocumented reason (return code: 5).
21:52 trinque SSL error queue is empty.
21:52 trinque weird stuff
21:56 trinque $help
21:56 deedbot http://deedbot.org/help.html
21:56 trinque mthreat: ^
22:02 mthreat trinque: sweet thanks
~ 29 minutes ~
22:32 trinque once more.
22:36 trinque ok. built a binary and I have that being managed by runit
22:37 trinque
22:37 * deedbot hands you a broomstick.
↖
22:45 phf asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-04-08#1449212 << is iso8601 order
↖
22:46 phf for how much confusion the order switch creates, perhaps should allow for reversal, but i'd really like there to be one canonical way
22:50 trinque fixed the barf with leading whitespace, and hooked the thing into runit.
22:52 trinque $gettrust deedbot trinque
22:52 deedbot L1: 1, L2: 5 by 5 connections.
22:52 phf i wrote a statemachine to manage bot state, but now connection doesn't want to croak :/
22:53 trinque heh, fleanode will have a seizure any moment now
22:53 phf oh i'm sure it's going to go down 5 minutes after i check in for the night
23:02 * trinque must be getting sleepy, repeating himself
23:02 trinque to bed
23:11 punkman god morgen
23:20 shinohai Guten Morgen, Herr punkman
23:22 mircea_popescu mthreat lol sure.
23:23 punkman http://i.imgur.com/kIvV0ow.jpg
23:23 mircea_popescu phf croak != cloak
23:24 punkman heh
23:25 phf i meant the first one
23:26 punkman bought that Hario grinder yesterday, gotta wonder if the Engrish in the manual is not on purpose.
23:26 phf i want to observe state transition (and timing) during fall over, to take it to a next step
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