| 01:12 |
mircea_popescu |
BingoBoingo "we have a legacy hairball to entangle" literally says "previous management worked for empire and against republic, created negative value we have to pour value into to bring back to 0". |
| 01:12 |
mircea_popescu |
this is fucking intolerable. |
| 01:13 |
mircea_popescu |
to do nothing is one thing. to do things that then someone will have to come later and untangle... holy hell on wheels. |
| |
~ 7 hours 19 minutes ~ |
| 08:32 |
mircea_popescu |
check me out, i wrote a whole blog article for irc ;/ anyway, here goeth : |
| 08:32 |
mircea_popescu |
mod6 after a night's meditation, I still don't see a direct solution for your problem. |
| |
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| 08:32 |
mircea_popescu |
it seems to me inescapably the case that you have not been putting either enough time or enough thought into this, and continuing in like manner for year upon year. the inescapable result was accumulation, of exactly the wrong kind : every day you personally grew a little smaller than your image in the forum, and compensating for the difference drew, as any other credit, upon your capacities to service, until eventually the g |
| |
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| 08:32 |
mircea_popescu |
ap could be serviced no more. |
| 08:32 |
mircea_popescu |
you can't really be the head of the foundation as a guy who monthly publishes a page of .txt on a website somewhere ; you can't really be the board of the isp as a guy who comes up with http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-05#1858303 and http://btcbase.org/log/2018-08-05#1839737 and http://btcbase.org/log/2018-08-31#1846185 and http://btcbase.org/log/2018-06-13#1825070 |
| |
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| 08:32 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-10-05 01:33 mod6: I actually didn't think it was any big deal, as previous months I had made these deals behind closed doors with jurov as wel. |
| 08:32 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-08-05 22:13 mod6: I've gotta run for a bit here, maybe later when you're availble we can go through calculating that customer equity. i did some adding, but I came up about 50% short. clearly missing something there. |
| 08:32 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-08-31 16:21 mircea_popescu: you seriously can't be sitting there spending hours on this pennies thing. |
| 08:32 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-06-13 20:27 mod6: I was thinking that if L1/L2 people around here want to emplace a banner on their blog to help drive some traffic to PizzaroISP.net and earn some btc, let us know. |
| 08:32 |
mircea_popescu |
consider http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-15#1813491 : it was six months ago, and i knew then as you can see now that the passage of time will vindicate the point. if "nobody has been wasting any time by any stretch of the imagination", where did six months go ? |
| 08:32 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-05-15 14:36 mod6: We are discussing/thinking about how to recapitalize, get more rockchips, customers. So this is on going. I don't think anyone is wasting anytime by any streach of imagination.[ |
| 08:32 |
mircea_popescu |
this may not be obvious to you, though it is screamingly obvious to me (and not just to me, witness http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870964 / http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870958 ) : the various inexplicable and outright infantile "problems" you are encountering are entirely manufactured, and transparently as a defense against change. |
| 08:32 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 04:10 trinque: is there some kind of christian purity involved in the tool choice? |
| 08:32 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 04:02 trinque: you need to quit circumambulating and run some ads, contact folks you think might be good candidates for clients, literally anything |
| 08:33 |
mircea_popescu |
the "sad" news, from this perspective (though it is boldly and fundamentally the exact opposite of sad) is that no, there isn't any "return to the grand old days" on the table. ~emphatically~ not. bitcoin ain't going back to spending a summer at 2 dollars a coin ; and consequentlly you're not going back to being the mod6 of 2013 on ten hours a week and lukewarm committment. |
| |
↖ ↖ |
| 08:33 |
mircea_popescu |
yes hanbot remembers that time fondly ; and certainly so do i. but as things stand presently the practical choices before you are either to make a major committment of both time and attention towards living up to the lofty position of a lord, and catch up on that proverbial "legacy hairball" ; or else to limit yourself to testing some code here and there as time permits and publish the occasional piece. this, on the long term |
| 08:33 |
mircea_popescu |
. on the short term you'll have to take some time off and think long and hard and in all seriousness about what you want from this life, because continuing on your present course can't possibly bring much beyond disaster. |
| |
↖ |
| 08:33 |
mircea_popescu |
can you ~believe~ how much like something you'd read on tardstalk "investments" your workproduct ends up ?! and this in 2018 ? why, because you've been secretly saving it through a time capsule, insulated from review, all this time ?! god almighty, last thing i want is the yahoo peterl-ism of 2013 perpetuated a second past the end of that year. |
| |
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| 08:33 |
mircea_popescu |
you're a good man, and i trust you, and i know as a matter of fact my trust's not misplaced. we absolutely have to either adjust you to the tasks you have or the tasks you have to you, however, because there's simply no way to maintain trustworthyness on the long haul while capacity-activity mismatch is ongoing. |
| |
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| 08:36 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: fwiw, the 'legacy hairball' was actually a common lisp rewrite of http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-05#1809743 item ( and iirc published here ) |
| 08:36 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-05-05 00:07 asciilifeform: ben_vulpes, mod6 , mircea_popescu , et al : http://www.loper-os.org/pub/piz_tab.html << corrections of central column or other init params, welcome |
| 08:38 |
asciilifeform |
presently appears that i may have to 'disentangle' it with own hands ( if mod6 has nervous breakdown ) and put it back in service. it was retired when ben_vulpes went into sabbatical, mod6 preferred to do the numbers with pen |
| 08:43 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: do you see any potential problem in idea of making the 'spreadshit' realtime-public ? ( when we get heathen customers, they may want their names omitted, i suppose, but as it stands i can't picture why not ) |
| 08:44 |
mircea_popescu |
not really. |
| 08:45 |
mircea_popescu |
so salt-hash the names, what diff does it make. |
| 08:45 |
asciilifeform |
imho it's the Right Thing. |
| 08:45 |
mircea_popescu |
double-hash it, customer knows his private hash, knows the salt, can verify his line secretly and no more. |
| 08:45 |
mircea_popescu |
what, crypto is new now ? |
| 08:45 |
asciilifeform |
good idea |
| 08:46 |
mircea_popescu |
notice how in this brief span of ten minutes we've done MORE for pizarro than the above mentioned six months produced! |
| 08:46 |
mircea_popescu |
srsly, this obvious market leadership has to await today morning ?! why the fuck, srsly now, nobody here heard of crypto before ? |
| 08:48 |
mircea_popescu |
and in the same vein : if i lose my fucking carkeys, my "prospective plan for carkey finding" doesn't read ANYTHING like "day 1 : look for carkeys ; day 2 : look for carkeys ; day 3 : look for carkeys ; day 4...". |
| |
↖ |
| 08:48 |
asciilifeform |
as i understand, doesn't even require crypto, customer supplies ( achtung, customers ! ) arbitrary bitstring, it will be his pseudonym in the document. |
| 08:49 |
mircea_popescu |
my plan looks like day 1 : look everywhere (no, that ~everywhere~ isn't a manner of speech) while taking breaks to ejaculate profanity and try and think wtf i did ; day 2 : hang all the servants maids etc in the dungeon and gets the hose again until i am satisfied by the account of each one as to how they've not lost my keys for me ; day 3 : get new keys, install webcams, gps trackers and etc." |
| 08:50 |
mircea_popescu |
there's a difference! for one thing, i as well as anyone can tell the 2nd thing ENDS!!! it's not ongoing for fucking ever, who the fuck heard of this "planning with a halting problem" ?! |
| 08:50 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform no, issue it to them. |
| 08:50 |
mircea_popescu |
don't ask the customer for things you don't have to. customer pays, that's enough. |
| |
↖ |
| 08:50 |
asciilifeform |
indeed better. |
| 08:51 |
mircea_popescu |
not like you don't have fg. |
| 08:51 |
asciilifeform |
mod6: let's get this off the ground asap |
| 08:51 |
mircea_popescu |
amusingly, since pizarro's website runs mp-wp, which is php, this can all be done in... an hour ? |
| 08:53 |
asciilifeform |
soon as BingoBoingo & mod6 wake up, we start to glue the necessary pieces . |
| 08:54 |
asciilifeform |
ben_vulpes's proggy was not wwwtronic, so i'm thinking we'll begin by updating it to the current numberz and posting it verbatim (signed by the principals) |
| 08:54 |
asciilifeform |
(it produces txt output when run) |
| 08:56 |
mircea_popescu |
anyway, nothing wrong with doing any way you're doing, pen, lisp, whjatever. but there's something massively wrong with doing it in such a way as to impedance mismatch you to the breaking point, wth. if pen works well then use pen, but IT THEN HAS TO WORK WELL. do not use if works ~poorly~ instead of well. |
| 08:56 |
asciilifeform |
after asciilifeform's conveyor ( http://www.loper-os.org/?p=2735 << public ! nao ) is emptied, can then attempt an item which sits on www and takes signed updates via form box, possibly |
| 08:57 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: this is 100% troo |
| 08:57 |
mircea_popescu |
why can't you just use the normal upload process. give it a txt file and let it work. |
| 08:57 |
mircea_popescu |
like it processes an image (in http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-10#1870557 discussion) it can process a report too! there's hooks! |
| 08:57 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-10 02:39 mircea_popescu: what do you even scale them with ? |
| 08:57 |
mircea_popescu |
or a csv or w/e. |
| 08:58 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: will start with exactly this. imho it will suffice. |
| 08:58 |
mircea_popescu |
anything that doesn't fail to match the numbers indeed suffices! |
| 08:58 |
asciilifeform |
only after mine field cleared , will make sense to gild the lily, supposing it even needs gilding. |
| 09:02 |
asciilifeform |
the 1 open q is whether mod6 will continue as treasurer, presently he is the only 1 with access to the coins + the realtime tx history which powers the spreadshit |
| |
↖ |
| 09:02 |
asciilifeform |
i'm thinking BingoBoingo oughta take this in own hands ( BingoBoingo ? ) |
| 09:03 |
mircea_popescu |
pizarro could get fancy, run a publicly-advertised dedicated node, dumpblocks or w/e to get the txen, push them into mp-wp 100% automatically. |
| 09:03 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: this is what i was thinking under header of 'when we gild the lily' |
| |
↖ |
| 09:03 |
mircea_popescu |
(this in no way requires hotwalletisms, you can keep the wallets @home for this just as well - node's watcjhing specified addressen) |
| 09:03 |
asciilifeform |
for nao need simple, working number crunch asap. |
| 09:04 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform aha, i can see the logic. |
| 09:05 |
mircea_popescu |
pretty elegant and certainly value-building. "our isp consists of marketplace relationships, AND remarkable workforce, AND industry-leading custom software process". |
| 09:07 |
asciilifeform |
after we get the simplest working item up & running, i'ma ask trinque if he is interested in helping (in exch for shares, perhaps) us to avoid reinventing wheel, and solder his payment system to our acct system |
| 09:08 |
asciilifeform |
currently trinque is the grandmaster of noad-powered realtime mechanics. |
| 09:09 |
mircea_popescu |
i don't think that's necessarily the way to go. for one thing, man's doing cuntoo ; for the other thing, you are well advised to run own node and do own thing rather than build an irc dependency into your isp. |
| 09:09 |
asciilifeform |
we already have an irc dependency ( it is the only contact method ) |
| 09:09 |
mircea_popescu |
but, having him consult on how to get your own thing going, that makes perfect sense. |
| 09:09 |
asciilifeform |
but i can see the logic |
| 09:09 |
asciilifeform |
and yes it dun have to be irc-powered, necessarily |
| 09:10 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform the contact method's done like that for a very good reason -- to extrude people out of the zekshit. |
| 09:11 |
mircea_popescu |
you don't get the same benefit from not running a node ; nor from not knowing how to note-to-web. |
| 09:11 |
mircea_popescu |
node*-to-web. |
| 09:11 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo, mod6 : i'd like to make as much of that massive txt turd we've been pgp'ing back and forth, public asap -- it is unseemly imho that simple factoids like ' today BingoBoingo was cured of yellow fewer and took delivery of 5 hdds' are 'classified', wtf |
| 09:11 |
mircea_popescu |
yeah, what's with this cult of secrecy ? |
| 09:12 |
mircea_popescu |
seems pizarro's been growing all kinda pantsuit warts, not mere bureaucracy-ism but the whole shebang. |
| 09:12 |
mircea_popescu |
nearly avoided getting a code of conduct, too! |
| 09:13 |
mircea_popescu |
imagine what a beauty of foresight and strategic superiority that'd have been, /me proceeds to hang linus on own petard for getting one, "but mp... pizarro also has ?" |
| 09:13 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: thing does contain 'launch codes' presently. it needs some actual disentanglement, after which i expect pgp-turd traffic will be minimal ( just how often we change launch codes ?? ) and 99+% of the thing is to be posted in realtime. |
| 09:14 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform consider for your own edification that the ~whole~ mocky thing was run with 0 crypto the entire length up until his return. |
| 09:14 |
mircea_popescu |
perhaps the first diplomatic mission in the 3k year long history of diplomacy that ~didn't even need crypto~. |
| 09:14 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: indeed |
| 09:15 |
mircea_popescu |
and it was neither to my loss nor to his nor to the republic in any sense. you read it and you liked it. |
| 09:15 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: ours, i think, is moar of a case of 'this is nice rifle, let's take it fishing', pgp offers temptation to 'cipher and then see later', i agree that it is dangerous. |
| 09:16 |
mircea_popescu |
yes but holy shit, nobody does it ~here~. why the fuck do you boys go straight back to it the moment you're @treefort ?! |
| 09:16 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: there ~is~ small body of non-(realtime)-publishable fact, e.g. who's sending wires, logins, etc |
| 09:17 |
asciilifeform |
my concern is that this somehow snowballed to include half a MB of things that have no biznis being seekrit |
| 09:17 |
asciilifeform |
initially 'missile codes' were 80%+ of the pizarro comms, so problem was latent |
| 09:18 |
mircea_popescu |
sure, so you have some secrets. nothing wrong with this. but you don't have half a mb of secrets, as you well point out. |
| 09:19 |
asciilifeform |
and yes this ~is~ the very same disease of which usg is dying. i'd like to fix this before we drown in ocean of stupid. |
| 09:19 |
mircea_popescu |
please. |
| 09:19 |
mircea_popescu |
a, before i forget -- trinque a++ consultant. i dunno what it is with the man, it's almost as if he earns his living doing this or something. |
| 09:20 |
mircea_popescu |
but he installed me a deluge on his cuntoo on my server to spec and a job very well done indeed. |
| 09:20 |
asciilifeform |
is why i am hoping to engage him in process. |
| 09:20 |
asciilifeform |
( tho as i presently understand, his conveyor is at least as packed as mine ) |
| 09:21 |
mircea_popescu |
sounds like nightmare case, you know, "take this popular app, make it run on your hand-distilled industrial machinery in this closet here". come back the next day, "all done" i'm like... |
| 09:21 |
asciilifeform |
was it actually a hairball of glibcish dependencies ? or build cleanly |
| 09:21 |
mircea_popescu |
i was not involved. but the girls love using it. |
| 09:21 |
asciilifeform |
( i have a box here that is waiting for new-cuntoo.. ) |
| 09:22 |
asciilifeform |
aa |
| 09:26 |
mircea_popescu |
in other fucken lulz, https://www.elitedaily.com/dating/12-reasons-men-never-pick-good-girl/782903 << remember back when it was 2008 and people honestly thought this sort of crap (thinly veiled mfa, really, but otherwise IAC's "publishing", even has the structure) is "the way to riches on web" ? back when they also thought "(((america))) will be wealthy through the process of doing each other's laundry" and other such inaniti |
| 09:26 |
mircea_popescu |
es. |
| 09:26 |
asciilifeform |
i dunno that any 'think' was involved at any point |
| 09:26 |
mircea_popescu |
but do you remember the 70s, back when people honestly thought "equal partnerships" are possible, and even desirable among the genders, and there can be such a thing as "career women" and so on ? and they will be mated through the process of informing men "how to", as if men fucking give a shit, or ever possibly could ? |
| 09:26 |
asciilifeform |
straight cargocult, like other spamola |
| 09:27 |
mircea_popescu |
ALSO straight cargocult, also like all spamola. really bitch, "this is how men should" ? men fucking should, reheheally ? |
| 09:27 |
asciilifeform |
these aint actually words. as in, out of human. they're from shannonizer. |
| 09:28 |
mircea_popescu |
to quote from the all-fet, "shadowscar00 20F Rope Bunny 1h How about you drop whatever it is YOURE doing and read my fuckin bio" "LordMPofTMSR 1h Nah." |
| 09:28 |
mircea_popescu |
because it ain't fucking happening, what the fuck. |
| 09:28 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform no, i guarantee you there's a pete dushenski somewhere pen-on-paper-ing them. |
| 09:28 |
asciilifeform |
meat-cranked shannonizer is still shannonizer, neh |
| 09:28 |
asciilifeform |
i can't picture anybody actually thinking this crud. |
| 09:29 |
asciilifeform |
i dun expect nigerian 419 'prince' actually thinks he ~is~ a prince |
| 09:30 |
mircea_popescu |
having met some... yes he does. http://trilema.com/2013/search-and-destroy/#selection-61.1-61.41 |
| 09:30 |
asciilifeform |
earlier today, racoon said to asciilifeform , 'how about you drop whatever YOUR doing and eat garbage with me' ; asciilifeform answered also 'Nah' |
| 09:31 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: met whom? 'prince' ? |
| 09:32 |
mircea_popescu |
dork in question literally thinks he "is helping make the world a better place" by "helping men" "understand" "women". in the sense of "understand" from "you have to understand" in http://trilema.com/2017/mimi-metallurgico-ferito-nellonore/#selection-91.19-95.2 ; and in the sense of "women" from "what pantsuited hilarities all over boston would like to pretend the fillies are and do". very much something of the blood and bone |
| 09:32 |
mircea_popescu |
of http://trilema.com/2017/juno/#footnote_3_71569 nonsense. |
| 09:32 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform yes, "prince". |
| 09:33 |
asciilifeform |
biologically damaged folx, i.e. 'cucks', do apparently exist, mircea_popescu documented the subj half to death, yes |
| 09:33 |
mircea_popescu |
all the http://trilema.com/2018/must-suck-to-be-one-of-you-average-guy-with-a-great-sense-of-humor-losers-seriously-now/ are produced ~somehow~ you realise. this is the avenue they are produced : men who read cucks' notions and ideas about "how the world should be^H^H^H^H is" |
| 09:34 |
asciilifeform |
i'm presently unconvinced that they are created by reading anyffin, tho. presumably created in childhood, by some combo of defective progenitors and envir pollutants, ~then~ go on to 'read' things |
| 09:34 |
mircea_popescu |
"IĀm sorry good girls, but itĀs true. But first, allow me to clarify. There are plenty of bad girls who come across as good girls to the untrained eye. These women will play straight arrows out in public, but once they get you behind closed doors, they unleash the beast." << straight up rewrite of the xtian holy book. "they may suck, but maybe deep down there's some nonsuck ?". srsly now ?! |
| 09:34 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform these are the environment pollutants. |
| 09:35 |
asciilifeform |
i was thinking moar along the lines of oestrogenic plasticizers etc |
| 09:35 |
mircea_popescu |
For More Of His Thoughts And Ramblings, Follow Paul Hudson On Twitter And Facebook. |
| 09:36 |
asciilifeform |
lol i'd actually rather join racoon in garbage restaurant.. |
| |
~ 16 minutes ~ |
| 09:52 |
BingoBoingo |
mircea_popescu asciilifeform: Thank you for how to cut and kill the hairball |
| 09:53 |
BingoBoingo |
And thank you trinque for the questions that started it |
| 09:53 |
mircea_popescu |
that's ok, we're here all week. |
| 10:00 |
BingoBoingo |
<asciilifeform> i'm thinking BingoBoingo oughta take this in own hands ( BingoBoingo ? ) << I can do this |
| 10:04 |
BingoBoingo |
<asciilifeform> ben_vulpes's proggy was not wwwtronic, so i'm thinking we'll begin by updating it to the current numberz and posting it verbatim (signed by the principals) << There was a program? |
| 10:04 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo: yes ! |
| 10:05 |
BingoBoingo |
Anyway's I'll start splitting the customer accounts from the notes and then the notes from the launch codes |
| 10:06 |
asciilifeform |
ty BingoBoingo |
| 10:07 |
BingoBoingo |
The thought of reading that thing with an eye to killing it... I have tears of relief |
| 10:10 |
asciilifeform |
it's a fucking disgrace , and i'm party to it, it happened on my watch. i'ma clear my calendar today, BingoBoingo plox to lemme know asap what you need on my end |
| 10:15 |
* |
asciilifeform brb |
| 10:18 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: Will let you know when questions come |
| 10:26 |
mircea_popescu |
btw, re http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871034 : i've ended up conflating two things i think and the result is confusing. so a) obviously as things stand now, and perfectly defensibly for an indefinite future the way to go is to pipe the result of !!balance into some publishatron ; however b) if and when pizarro decides to capitalize on its abundance of highly qualified personnel to create a "bitcoin isp software package", |
| 10:26 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 14:03 asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: this is what i was thinking under header of 'when we gild the lily' |
| 10:26 |
mircea_popescu |
it is well advised to get to brass tacks and have a node and everything. and i fully agree that b is not here, nor is this anymore than a purely theoretical discussion. |
| 10:27 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform ah come the fuck on, he finds out there's a program mid nov ? why, he didn't look in the right place in the pgpball ? |
| |
↖ |
| 10:33 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: it was ben_vulpes's thing, and doesn't appear to be in the pgpball, was a separate communique, part of ben_vulpes's 'i'm off to the desert' msg |
| 10:33 |
asciilifeform |
is however iirc in pizarro log, presently digging for the most recent known incarnation |
| 10:34 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: and yes eventually we will want 'software package' imho |
| 10:34 |
asciilifeform |
presently i'm concerned with ripping out the current duct tape, however. |
| 10:36 |
mircea_popescu |
the dream includes autonomous robotic isps that set themselves up. so -- yes. |
| 10:37 |
BingoBoingo |
Anyways, we already have an mp-wp. Once things are clean and clear and organized, they can land there. |
| 10:37 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: a good % of isp is sadly not automatable with present tech. but spreadshit is not one of'em |
| 10:37 |
mircea_popescu |
i have nfi what part. |
| 10:38 |
mircea_popescu |
but yes, having reich "bank accounts" for imaginary, computer-brained "persons" is certainly part of the overal design. |
| 10:38 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: the part where physical irons move, get hoisted, endisked, etc |
| 10:38 |
asciilifeform |
and yes that also |
| 10:38 |
mircea_popescu |
whole fucking point is to degrade empire to that level of http://trilema.com/2016/give-computers-the-vote-theyre-cheaper-than-women-even/ |
| 10:38 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform they move by order eh. besides, subs and all that. |
| 10:38 |
asciilifeform |
sumbody's gotta interface with heathendom, presently state of the art afaik does not give robot for this |
| 10:40 |
asciilifeform |
prior to pizarro, i pictured 'tmsr isp' as a moar 'noncontact' item, where heathen contract is signed and robotic 'bring server into gossip net' item is installed immediately. but FG / we-want-custom-irons etc changed this picture |
| 10:42 |
asciilifeform |
if there were advances on the ideal-net-of-perfectly-redundant-boxes front ( as described in e.g. mircea_popescu's 'uci' piece ) conceivably there could be a place for such 'isp'. but it still cannot replace an actual cage where you can put actual sealed irons with custom fillings. |
| 10:45 |
asciilifeform |
( asciilifeform strongly suspects that the idea of replacing '2 strong oxen with 1024 chickens' in the ~general case~ is a perpetuum mobile. witness the heathens and their 'cloudism' , it is a circus ) |
| |
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| 10:47 |
mircea_popescu |
asciilifeform nothing prevents "irene" the bot from hiring such a cage. |
| 10:47 |
asciilifeform |
( it worked, in certain sense of 'worked', for bitcoin -- but it is not only a quite narrow problem set, but very diff affair in re process latency than what folx generally expect of 'server' ) |
| 10:48 |
mircea_popescu |
yes BingoBoingo is not replaceable. but pizarro can very well be an imaginary woman. |
| 10:49 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: if robo-woman can muster the hiring of actual pair of hands, to hoist boxen, weasel heathens into 'bank acct', etc -- then yes. tho it still wouldn't crack the problem of 'loyal hands' |
| 10:49 |
mircea_popescu |
has wot for that :) |
| 10:49 |
asciilifeform |
lol wot aint automatable |
| 10:49 |
mircea_popescu |
not in the general case. but for its needs it is -- "i follow his lordship x, and sink with him". |
| 10:50 |
mircea_popescu |
ie, exactly what the shinohais of this world are stuck doing, like it or not like it. |
| 10:50 |
mircea_popescu |
not everyone born whole. |
| 10:50 |
asciilifeform |
thus far there's exactly 1 BingoBoingo and he'd better not contract yellow fever. not even speaking of hypothetical robot that births BingoBoingos... |
| 10:51 |
mircea_popescu |
and before there was one there were none. |
| 10:52 |
asciilifeform |
as always neh |
| 10:54 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: while we're on 'fyootoor techs' : i suspect that a working radio net would make 'robo-pizarro' a substantially moar practical notion. ( i.e. if 'cage' could in just about anywhere, not necessarily 'dc' ) |
| 10:54 |
mircea_popescu |
very much so yes. |
| |
↖ |
| 10:54 |
asciilifeform |
cuz then all you really need is a mains socket. |
| 10:54 |
asciilifeform |
( and within range of the nearest jungle mast ) |
| 10:54 |
mircea_popescu |
and there's stuff to look at re power and so on. dammi tempu etc. |
| 10:55 |
asciilifeform |
traditional dc, with its fiber trunks, is somewhat intrinsically incatronic item imho |
| 10:57 |
asciilifeform |
once ~current~ item no longer in acute danger of choking on own vomit, can potentially revisit this. |
| 10:57 |
* |
asciilifeform brb,teatime |
| 11:00 |
mircea_popescu |
agreed. |
| 11:00 |
BingoBoingo |
<asciilifeform> prior to pizarro, i pictured 'tmsr isp' as a moar 'noncontact' item, where heathen contract is signed and robotic 'bring server into gossip net' item is installed immediately. but FG / we-want-custom-irons etc changed this picture << This and those surprise power cycling of dulap I/II (I forget the dulap version history) |
| |
↖ |
| 11:04 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: When you return let me know if you have a preferred manner for hashing salted customer strings |
| |
↖ |
| 11:05 |
mircea_popescu |
keccak!!! |
| 11:06 |
BingoBoingo |
One or two rounds? |
| 11:07 |
BingoBoingo |
How much salt to shake out of the FUCKGOATS? |
| 11:09 |
ben_vulpes |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871118 << i never used a program. i documented and shared the accounting process with mod6 when i took sabbatical. i lack the log link atm but here's a copy of my original instructions http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/8YtMo/?raw=true |
| 11:09 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 15:27 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform ah come the fuck on, he finds out there's a program mid nov ? why, he didn't look in the right place in the pgpball ? |
| 11:10 |
ben_vulpes |
and i never used a program because, (again cannot find the log link in reasonable-response time) at one point i was working on a schema for tracking customers and what they were paying for and mircea_popescu said something along the lines of "wtf this is a simple text file and accounting problem" |
| |
↖ |
| 11:11 |
mircea_popescu |
i still can't imagine how ~any approach fails on it, seeing how the whole customer list is what, dozen ? less ? |
| 11:16 |
ben_vulpes |
it takes quite a bit of time, and is full of manual ops, missteps on any of which foul the whole thing. my inclination is always to automate these and sweat the correctness of the automation instead of the correctness of the process again and again. |
| 11:20 |
mircea_popescu |
the drawback is that you get humans who can't add. |
| 11:20 |
mircea_popescu |
there's merit to automating things ; but a strict inability to do basic accounting results in and fosters the development of serious other problems. such as a strict inability to plan. |
| 11:20 |
mircea_popescu |
in the end this chokes life out. |
| 11:22 |
mircea_popescu |
i certainly can see the narrative that goes "first, the task was to add 6 and 8 and 11 ; then ben_vulpes wanted to take some hours to print out an adhesive 25 to paste on a box we'd therefore call computer ; then mod6 took a few days to complicatedly add by hand to 24 and 26 and so on". it's still a 0.3 second job, harsh mistress experiences notwithstanding. |
| 11:28 |
ben_vulpes |
it may be an 0.3s job to you or one of the ladies that you've trained. every time i sat down to categorize the list of incoming/outgoing into cash account vs customer equity; depreciate the hardware; walk the customer list to determine how much to debit the customer equity line; calculate the value of the btc and uyu i spent about eight hours on it in i estimate in retrospect two four hour shifts (from |
| 11:28 |
ben_vulpes |
~bedtime until ~midnight by memory), then at least another four to check my results, which frequently included mistakes like mis-markings of which services which customers had paid for and for how long. |
| 11:29 |
ben_vulpes |
(ftr about 8 days behind on log, eating from both ends atm) |
| 11:29 |
mircea_popescu |
there's something here. |
| 11:42 |
asciilifeform |
ben_vulpes: i am vehehehery confused nao; i definitely recall a common lisp tabulator thing with numberz |
| 11:42 |
asciilifeform |
am i hallucinating or wat |
| 11:42 |
ben_vulpes |
asciilifeform: never existed. i tabulated in org-mode and did all of the calculations by hand. |
| 11:43 |
asciilifeform |
holy fuq |
| 11:44 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo, mod6 either of you remember this existing ? did cosmic ray hit asciilifeform's head ?? |
| 11:45 |
ben_vulpes |
footsoldiering task for me: regrind financials from april forward, april being the second-to-last time i audited cash held against statement claims (last time was before handoff to mod6, the correctness of which mod6 apparently doubts per http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870970 ) |
| 11:45 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 04:16 mod6: Ok, so I'm gonna call it a night. What I do know at this point is the ``surplus'' that we're seeing in the statements goes back at least through the August report. However, I'm not even certain at this point if what I'm seeing is actually incorrect, as I said earlier. Or if I just don't understand what I'm looking at. There's a strong chance that I just don't understand it. |
| 11:47 |
asciilifeform |
ben_vulpes: if you suspect the eggog was on your watch... do you think you can get the correct #s today ? |
| 11:47 |
ben_vulpes |
no. |
| 11:47 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: It could be a bitflip. |
| 11:47 |
asciilifeform |
ben_vulpes: ... this wk ? |
| 11:47 |
asciilifeform |
what i specifically want to avoid, is the scenario where we 'ok ben_vulpes fix' and then month later we're moar-phucked |
| 11:48 |
ben_vulpes |
i'm thinking that i actually want to rerun the numbers at sept, because i was damned certain that everything was kosher at that point. |
| 11:48 |
asciilifeform |
i'ma crib a method from mircea_popescu : ben_vulpes how long do ya think you need to say ~whether you have info~ for us to work with |
| 11:49 |
asciilifeform |
i.e. should we wait for ben_vulpes function to return ? or must soldier on without |
| 11:50 |
ben_vulpes |
asciilifeform: i will know when this discrepancy crept in by wednesday. |
| 11:50 |
asciilifeform |
ty ben_vulpes ! |
| 11:52 |
asciilifeform |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871149 << before that little subthread gets entirely lost in the cacophony of the moar urgent matters : mircea_popescu i also suspect that even without radio etc exotica, gossiptronic routing would give ~same connective reliability to e.g. a flat in kamchatka with 3 heathen isp pipes, as actual dc cage has today |
| |
↖ |
| 11:52 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 15:54 mircea_popescu: very much so yes. |
| 11:53 |
ben_vulpes |
asciilifeform: i betcha you're conflating my confusion in http://btcbase.org/log/2018-05-04#1809642 with there being a program written. |
| 11:53 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-05-04 19:55 ben_vulpes: !W (- 9.15831827 0.399861) |
| 11:53 |
asciilifeform |
ben_vulpes: if you swear there aint one, i'ma believe, because i so far have turned up no trace of it in my own records |
| 11:53 |
asciilifeform |
will have to go with 'cosmic ray in asciilifeform's head' |
| 11:54 |
asciilifeform |
i'll admit to having had this problem in the past, i read so much l0gz that they work into dreams when i sleep |
| 11:54 |
ben_vulpes |
i could dig up the reams of satoshi-addition on my eng pad if it would ease your mind |
| 11:55 |
asciilifeform |
ben_vulpes: lol i dun need 'eased', i'ma be happy when the bug is fixed. |
| 11:55 |
asciilifeform |
and the duct tape replaced with proper steel welds. |
| 11:56 |
ben_vulpes |
i will find where it came from. |
| 11:56 |
asciilifeform |
ty ben_vulpes |
| 11:57 |
BingoBoingo |
<asciilifeform> i'll admit to having had this problem in the past, i read so much l0gz that they work into dreams when i sleep << My worst nighmares have involved text scrolling in a window |
| 11:59 |
asciilifeform |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871158 << it isn't clear to me that hashing is even needed -- issue to each customer a 256bit string (base64 it) out of a FG, that will be his pseudonym in the public spreadshit. |
| 11:59 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 16:04 BingoBoingo: asciilifeform: When you return let me know if you have a preferred manner for hashing salted customer strings |
| 12:00 |
asciilifeform |
pgp each acct holder's bitz, to him. |
| 12:00 |
asciilifeform |
after that we use'em as handle in the spreadshit to refer to his acct. |
| 12:04 |
asciilifeform |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871157 << ftr BingoBoingo's history is correct, dulap I and II perished by orc hand |
| 12:04 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 16:00 BingoBoingo: <asciilifeform> prior to pizarro, i pictured 'tmsr isp' as a moar 'noncontact' item, where heathen contract is signed and robotic 'bring server into gossip net' item is installed immediately. but FG / we-want-custom-irons etc changed this picture << This and those surprise power cycling of dulap I/II (I forget the dulap version history) |
| 12:04 |
mircea_popescu |
hey, methods are on display to be cribbed. |
| 12:05 |
asciilifeform |
incidentally, unmanned 'dc in flat' is imho a potential useful application for ciphered/zeroized-on-disturbance hdd item discussed some wks ago. |
| |
↖ |
| 12:07 |
mircea_popescu |
dc in flat ? |
| 12:07 |
asciilifeform |
( e.g. , on my shelf i have a little demo with solid state gyro, lights a 'bang yer dead' symbolic lamp if picked up and moved ~half metre, but not if desk kicked / small earthquake ) |
| 12:07 |
asciilifeform |
mircea_popescu: was in re http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871192 minor subthread |
| 12:07 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 16:52 asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871149 << before that little subthread gets entirely lost in the cacophony of the moar urgent matters : mircea_popescu i also suspect that even without radio etc exotica, gossiptronic routing would give ~same connective reliability to e.g. a flat in kamchatka with 3 heathen isp pipes, as actual dc cage has today |
| 12:08 |
mircea_popescu |
oh oh |
| 12:08 |
mircea_popescu |
for some reason dc resolved to "air conditionning" in my head lol |
| 12:08 |
asciilifeform |
aa lol |
| 12:09 |
asciilifeform |
aircondition is not entirely irrelevant to server-wrangling, tho. |
| 12:09 |
asciilifeform |
but i will add, e.g. rk draws (and emits as heat naturally) ~7watt on a bad day. |
| 12:09 |
asciilifeform |
'server' dun have to mean 'opteron graf zeppelin' |
| 12:10 |
asciilifeform |
a 20kg crate can carry enuff battery to power rk and any modems for ~week of mains outage. |
| 12:14 |
asciilifeform |
imho it is entirely feasible , in principle, to bake these such that a usg.thief (or whatever other species) wins only a few hundy's worth of rusty irons, if he steals. |
| 12:19 |
asciilifeform |
( item will be , granted, thinkable only 1ce we have gossip + self-zeroizing hdd ) |
| 12:20 |
* |
asciilifeform brb |
| 12:28 |
BingoBoingo |
<asciilifeform> but i will add, e.g. rk draws (and emits as heat naturally) ~7watt on a bad day. << On this note new heavy metal rockchip drives were still cool to the touch when I visited the rack yesterday |
| 12:34 |
mod6 |
mornin' |
| 12:34 |
* |
mod6 reads |
| 12:41 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870978 << I appreciate you taking the time to think on it, Sir. |
| 12:41 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 13:32 mircea_popescu: mod6 after a night's meditation, I still don't see a direct solution for your problem. |
| 12:42 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870979 << Yeah, I'm disappointed with how things turned out. |
| 12:42 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 13:32 mircea_popescu: it seems to me inescapably the case that you have not been putting either enough time or enough thought into this, and continuing in like manner for year upon year. the inescapable result was accumulation, of exactly the wrong kind : every day you personally grew a little smaller than your image in the forum, and compensating for the difference drew, as any other credit, upon your capacities to service, until eventually the g |
| 12:43 |
deedbot |
http://trilema.com/2018/heres-something-you-dont-see-nearly-often-enough/ << Trilema - Here's something you don't see nearly often enough |
| 12:43 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870981 << You're right, I'm trying to be objective here, I'm not doing a good job on either. |
| 12:43 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 13:32 mircea_popescu: you can't really be the head of the foundation as a guy who monthly publishes a page of .txt on a website somewhere ; you can't really be the board of the isp as a guy who comes up with http://btcbase.org/log/2018-10-05#1858303 and http://btcbase.org/log/2018-08-05#1839737 and http://btcbase.org/log/2018-08-31#1846185 and http://btcbase.org/log/2018-06-13#1825070 |
| 12:43 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870991 << ah yes, what a time it was tho! |
| 12:43 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 13:33 mircea_popescu: the "sad" news, from this perspective (though it is boldly and fundamentally the exact opposite of sad) is that no, there isn't any "return to the grand old days" on the table. ~emphatically~ not. bitcoin ain't going back to spending a summer at 2 dollars a coin ; and consequentlly you're not going back to being the mod6 of 2013 on ten hours a week and lukewarm committment. |
| 12:45 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870993 << I agree, need to re-think my life. |
| 12:45 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 13:33 mircea_popescu: . on the short term you'll have to take some time off and think long and hard and in all seriousness about what you want from this life, because continuing on your present course can't possibly bring much beyond disaster. |
| 12:45 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870994 << Having been there myself since '11 and all of the scams, believe me, this is the last thing that I wanted. |
| 12:45 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 13:33 mircea_popescu: can you ~believe~ how much like something you'd read on tardstalk "investments" your workproduct ends up ?! and this in 2018 ? why, because you've been secretly saving it through a time capsule, insulated from review, all this time ?! god almighty, last thing i want is the yahoo peterl-ism of 2013 perpetuated a second past the end of that year. |
| 12:46 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1870995 << Thank you for saying as much, what I've learned from the Republic can not be ever measured. I agree with the point, however. |
| 12:46 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 13:33 mircea_popescu: you're a good man, and i trust you, and i know as a matter of fact my trust's not misplaced. we absolutely have to either adjust you to the tasks you have or the tasks you have to you, however, because there's simply no way to maintain trustworthyness on the long haul while capacity-activity mismatch is ongoing. |
| 12:47 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871008 << Point taken. |
| 12:47 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 13:48 mircea_popescu: and in the same vein : if i lose my fucking carkeys, my "prospective plan for carkey finding" doesn't read ANYTHING like "day 1 : look for carkeys ; day 2 : look for carkeys ; day 3 : look for carkeys ; day 4...". |
| 12:49 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871031 << I will not. I will send the remaining Pizarro coins in my deedbot wallet to BingoBoingo today. |
| 12:49 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 14:02 asciilifeform: the 1 open q is whether mod6 will continue as treasurer, presently he is the only 1 with access to the coins + the realtime tx history which powers the spreadshit |
| 12:51 |
mod6 |
I will take some time to think it over, but this past year has taken a tremendous toll on my physical and mental health. I'm not doing right by myself, my family or the republic. I always said that I wanted to do the Republic as my main thing in life (outside family), but as I've said before, we're just not quite there yet. |
| 12:52 |
mod6 |
So I think the correct thing to do here is to step-down from the Pizarro board, let someone else direct and lead the company to glory, as opposed to the back pages of tardstalk. |
| 12:53 |
mod6 |
The same goes with the Foundation, new leadership is required. This means that I will not be within the lordship anymore, but better that, than dishonor. |
| 12:53 |
mircea_popescu |
get some rest and see how it looks after. |
| 12:53 |
mod6 |
Yeah, I'll think it over, Sir. But, my main objective is to do what is best for the whole, instead of the individual. |
| 12:54 |
mircea_popescu |
dunno that these two can be distinguished. there's really no whole outside of teh individuals involved. |
| 12:55 |
mod6 |
In my mind, the Republic isn't just a bunch of individuals - at the low level, of course, we are. But we're here for something greater than ourselves, and that is what drives all of us to put time and money into. |
| 12:56 |
mod6 |
!!ledger |
| 12:56 |
deedbot |
http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/MEFVY/?raw=true |
| 13:01 |
asciilifeform |
ohey wb mod6 |
| 13:02 |
mod6 |
hai asciilifeform |
| 13:03 |
mod6 |
!Qcalc 1.16275485 - 0.08479669 |
| 13:03 |
lobbesbot |
mod6: 1.07795816 |
| 13:03 |
mod6 |
!!pay BingoBoingo 1.07795816 |
| 13:04 |
deedbot |
Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/9yuhU/?raw=true |
| 13:07 |
asciilifeform |
mod6: take sabbatical if you must , but plox to rethink 'i'ma quit errything', you did the work of 6 men, and we're quite short of hands as it is |
| 13:08 |
mod6 |
!!v 7CCA5775D375C0F6BD172BCB4384A5166BA0444EEC01EDCB40BB1C86C2B19F96 |
| 13:08 |
deedbot |
mod6 paid BingoBoingo 1.07795816 |
| 13:10 |
mod6 |
ben_vulpes: While we're at it, BingoBoingo reminded me that xmas time is upon us, and it might be a very good time to start shopping for some Pizarro hardware with those amazon credits you're holding. Just a reminder. |
| 13:10 |
mod6 |
(I had half-forgotten about it myself) |
| 13:10 |
asciilifeform |
mod6: consider srsly also BingoBoingo's earlier suggestion, of a coupla wks of low-stress vacation in BingoBoingostan |
| 13:11 |
asciilifeform |
( it's a supremely relaxy place, asciilifeform recommends a+++ ) |
| 13:11 |
asciilifeform |
aaand it's summer there nao. |
| 13:11 |
BingoBoingo |
Can confirm it is summer |
| 13:11 |
mod6 |
asciilifeform: I'll take some time, but in all honesty, I think Mr. Popescu has it on all accounts. I don't even think he wants to be right on this one, yet he is. And presently, there is nothing I can do to pour myself into the Republic, Foundation, or Pizarro more than I currently am. And at this level of commitment, is harmful to all. |
| 13:12 |
asciilifeform |
mod6: pour less, or rather, with less strain to health |
| 13:12 |
asciilifeform |
i had similar moment last yr |
| 13:13 |
asciilifeform |
took coupla wks ~off, learned buncha hieroglyphs. |
| 13:14 |
mod6 |
I believe. |
| 13:14 |
mod6 |
!!sent-invoices |
| 13:14 |
asciilifeform |
mod6: it's in the l0gz, recall, mircea_popescu was getting ready to tear off my epaulettes |
| 13:14 |
deedbot |
http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/XGMWf/?raw=true |
| 13:15 |
mod6 |
!!ledger |
| 13:15 |
deedbot |
http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/h948k/?raw=true |
| 13:15 |
mod6 |
Yeah, I recall. There's just no more to give, presently. |
| 13:15 |
asciilifeform |
mod6: msg is not 'give moar' , but 'catch breath' |
| 13:17 |
asciilifeform |
mod6: i'ma work with BingoBoingo + ben_vulpes to get the spreadshit aligned & published; mod6 meanwhile srsly spend some time in a hammock |
| 13:25 |
mod6 |
BingoBoingo: don't forget to send those invoices when you get a chance today. |
| 13:28 |
BingoBoingo |
Update: I have hit a groove on a consistent style for the customer account information. I am going to stretch the legs and look for some non-chocolate food soon. For a preview, here is the style as applied to the S.MG and S.NSA accounts - http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/mVzN6/?raw=true |
| 13:28 |
BingoBoingo |
Comments, suggestion, and feedback welcome |
| 13:28 |
mircea_popescu |
certainly "work less on dead ends, more on productive stuff, and stop grabbing knives by blade" |
| 13:29 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo: imho loox pretty good |
| 13:30 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: Most of what's left is continuing down the list and doing good old fashioned janitor work |
| 13:31 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo: lemme know when you have enuff that it is ready to be programmatized. |
| 13:31 |
* |
asciilifeform aiming to grasp the correct end of this knife.. |
| 13:33 |
BingoBoingo |
<mod6> BingoBoingo: don't forget to send those invoices when you get a chance today. << Since I am elbow deep in the customer information today, I plan to fire off the invoices as soon as things are polished up. |
| 13:36 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: I will let you know when it's done. I have a poor eye for what would be enough to programmatize from |
| 13:36 |
asciilifeform |
the complete set of raw inputs, really |
| 13:36 |
asciilifeform |
but aite |
| 13:37 |
asciilifeform |
i'ma not wander too far from console today. |
| 13:37 |
asciilifeform |
( originally calendar'd today to be spend in mathematical torture room, but this takes precedence ) |
| 13:44 |
BingoBoingo |
Well, I am about to set far enough away to grab a big chunk of meat, or maybe some shrimp and savor this delicious pile of tedium in front of me |
| |
~ 1 hours 37 minutes ~ |
| 15:22 |
ben_vulpes |
BingoBoingo mod6: are there any non-pizarro transactions in the ledger outputs that i have from both of you? |
| |
↖ |
| 15:24 |
ben_vulpes |
i'm walking from july forward, comparing cash position on the pizarro book at the end of each month to cash held for pizarro in both of your accounts, want to ensure that i'm not rolling any personal transactions into the calculations. |
| 15:25 |
BingoBoingo |
ben_vulpes: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/SHMK3/?raw=true |
| |
~ 20 minutes ~ |
| 15:46 |
diana_coman |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-10#1870705 -> the more I think of this, the less I see the case for it: essentially I don't think the serialization part should really be that important that it forces upstream to deal with fixed-size records only sort of thing. Also, for the case at hand, it's basically unclear that the gain is worth it anyway: yes, fixed-size (i.e. max-size) record means one can do the serialization of that directly but the |
| 15:46 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-10 20:12 mircea_popescu: only question is if this gains anything or just pushes some garbage downstream |
| 15:46 |
diana_coman |
re are still all those parts that are anyway no concern of upper layers (e.g. crc, padding) so there is still some part that has to walk the thing component-by-component anyway. The more I look at it, the more I get the impression that the idea of "serialize in 1 statement the whole stuff" is not worth pushing beyond simple types (i.e. yes, serialize in one line unsigned_32 but not the whole content of one message) |
| 15:56 |
diana_coman |
perhaps if the structures and protocol were way hairier than they there, the gains would be worth it - but in such case I'm not sure it wouldn't point to a need to simplify rather than a need for streams or some such |
| 15:57 |
asciilifeform |
diana_coman: fwiw it's exactly where i ended up drawing the line in 'nqb' |
| 15:58 |
diana_coman |
asciilifeform, where? |
| 15:58 |
asciilifeform |
( had stream-powered serializer-deserializer for the 'varint' type, errything else did diana_coman-style ) |
| 15:58 |
asciilifeform |
diana_coman: the 'not worth writing 500 ln so that record can be eaten/shat in 1 line' formulation |
| 15:58 |
diana_coman |
ah, I see it; I did look and I saw you used both but I couldn't confidently identify the decision as to where one and where the other |
| 15:59 |
asciilifeform |
i used 'stream'ism where it actually made sense to do so, i.e. where otherwise would be stuck kludging together an adhoc reimplementation of stream |
| 16:00 |
asciilifeform |
( there's nuffin magic about 'stream' per se, it's just a thing that eats and shits bytes and has an internal fill-position counter ) |
| 16:00 |
diana_coman |
streams start looking increasingly to me like an abstraction born out of "I *have to deal* with those insane inputs so ..." |
| 16:00 |
asciilifeform |
i also used stream subclass to give automagic 'hash all the bytes that go through this wire' thing |
| 16:00 |
asciilifeform |
diana_coman: it's the correct model for ~some~ devices |
| 16:01 |
asciilifeform |
defo not all, or anywhere near. |
| 16:01 |
diana_coman |
right; I meant in it's current use of "default, everywhere" |
| 16:01 |
diana_coman |
its*; gah, my spelling is atrocious lately |
| 16:05 |
asciilifeform |
if you have a 'cassette' that contains some unknown number of variably-sized gibblets, e.g. bitcoin block, yer stuck with some form of stream (either ada's, or hand-sewn replacement, tho so far i am actually happy with ada's and see no need to sew replacement) |
| 16:05 |
asciilifeform |
outside of that context, it is imho harmful abstraction, only gets in the way |
| 16:06 |
asciilifeform |
when i have the choice, i'd rather write proggy to need no such cassettes ( observe, streams are not used in ffa ) |
| 16:07 |
asciilifeform |
not outside the unix subsystem's stdio anyway |
| 16:07 |
* |
asciilifeform brb |
| 16:09 |
diana_coman |
pretty much that: if it's so ugly that you can't handle it sanely, then either fix it or, failing that, use Ada's Streams since that's what they are for anyway. |
| |
~ 49 minutes ~ |
| 16:58 |
ben_vulpes |
ty BingoBoingo |
| 17:03 |
mod6 |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871301 << looking... |
| 17:03 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 20:22 ben_vulpes: BingoBoingo mod6: are there any non-pizarro transactions in the ledger outputs that i have from both of you? |
| 17:09 |
mod6 |
Alright, beginning with 2018-07-15, all transactions in my ledger are Pizarro transactions. Nothing personal in there after that date (where ben_vulpes sent me the funds). |
| 17:09 |
BingoBoingo |
ATTN ALL - http://pizarroisp.net/pizarro-records/ << Coded Customer Histories and BTC/USD Price Points |
| |
↖ |
| 17:10 |
BingoBoingo |
^ asciilifeform |
| 17:10 |
ben_vulpes |
ty mod6 |
| 17:11 |
mod6 |
ben_vulpes: np! |
| 17:11 |
mod6 |
BingoBoingo: Looks good! The November 2018 link for the price point goes to the wrong log entry. |
| 17:11 |
mod6 |
Seems to go to the same as the october one. |
| 17:11 |
BingoBoingo |
ty, will fix |
| 17:12 |
mod6 |
np |
| 17:12 |
BingoBoingo |
But, kind of a benefit of putting the information in the light is that this stuff gets spotted |
| 17:12 |
mod6 |
*nod* looks great, I like the use of the hash there. |
| 17:13 |
mod6 |
I've been doing some chores here, I gotta run away again and do more. :/ ben_vulpes, if you have another Q, just ping me. |
| 17:15 |
BingoBoingo |
It's just FUCKGOATS output used for the IDs per the alf suggestion |
| |
↖ |
| 17:22 |
ben_vulpes |
in addition to the furnace door being taped on and the dishwasher motor being burned out, the washing machine drain hose is trying to wiggle itself free today. |
| 17:24 |
BingoBoingo |
!!invoice mircea_popescu 0.05786600 S.MG Test Server |
| 17:25 |
deedbot |
Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/87lrP/?raw=true |
| 17:25 |
BingoBoingo |
!!v 07CF3A4297774926E72D784125B9B123BE002B51B2B13FF4A77BEA9ADEDCDD71 |
| 17:25 |
deedbot |
Invoiced mircea_popescu 0.05786600 << S.MG Test Server |
| 17:26 |
BingoBoingo |
!!invoice trinque 0.02396351 Colocation And Shared Hosting |
| 17:26 |
deedbot |
Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/vlWuK/?raw=true |
| 17:26 |
BingoBoingo |
!!v 570722B8B1E715A7389CBA7AD27A0F99DBDC119F8DE58B708DBD5EE0C9DA1D77 |
| 17:27 |
deedbot |
Invoiced trinque 0.02396351 << Colocation And Shared Hosting |
| 17:27 |
BingoBoingo |
!!invoice jurov 0.02196351 BTC Foundation Colocation |
| 17:27 |
deedbot |
Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/saoer/?raw=true |
| 17:28 |
BingoBoingo |
!!v E0B02E2A8006FC0CC76C8F91AA21A9654E41C39CA636987EC9679EA2EEB81A6C |
| 17:28 |
deedbot |
Invoiced jurov 0.02196351 << BTC Foundation Colocation |
| 17:29 |
BingoBoingo |
!!invoice bvt 0.00266666 Shared Hosting one month + third of a month prorated to regularize billing cycle |
| 17:29 |
deedbot |
Get your OTP: http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/uSpa8/?raw=true |
| 17:29 |
BingoBoingo |
!!v 1448CE3141B6342980CD0DB5D7210CBEDC73F14196A5EF907F3BD40EBF9185E8 |
| 17:29 |
deedbot |
Invoiced bvt 0.00266666 << Shared Hosting one month + third of a month prorated to regularize billing cycle |
| 17:30 |
BingoBoingo |
Invoices dispatched |
| |
~ 37 minutes ~ |
| 18:07 |
asciilifeform |
ty BingoBoingo ! |
| 18:09 |
asciilifeform |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871331 << loox great. next step will be to get all of the 'and then i got bitten by tsetse fly and then bought 3 hdd' minutiae published |
| 18:09 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 22:09 BingoBoingo: ATTN ALL - http://pizarroisp.net/pizarro-records/ << Coded Customer Histories and BTC/USD Price Points |
| 18:09 |
asciilifeform |
http://btcbase.org/log/2018-11-11#1871342 << out of curiosity, BingoBoingo , didja simply strip off the 8th bit or wat, howdidja make'em |
| 18:09 |
a111 |
Logged on 2018-11-11 22:15 BingoBoingo: It's just FUCKGOATS output used for the IDs per the alf suggestion |
| 18:16 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: I just plucked 12 character strings outta the soup |
| 18:16 |
asciilifeform |
aa |
| 18:17 |
asciilifeform |
i suppose they were right next to the worx of shakespeare and the amd launch coadez!11 |
| 18:17 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: I expect the minutiae to be ready within the week. I'd like to get some punch list stuff out of the way. |
| 18:18 |
* |
BingoBoingo will head to the datacenter to get Rockchip drive imaged per earlier dispatch |
| 18:18 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo: aite. lemme know if you need asciilifeform to dig through own records |
| 18:18 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo: oh hey let's |
| 18:18 |
asciilifeform |
lemme know if you wanna do it yerself or the classic way. |
| 18:21 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: I'll take the standard F image. Will walk over now to place the drive and ping when I get back. Will move imaged drive to the Rockchip during a later walk. |
| 18:21 |
asciilifeform |
ok |
| 18:22 |
asciilifeform |
make sure plox that it's the only drive plugged into dulap |
| 18:22 |
BingoBoingo |
Crisis management today meant missing the weekly Feria round trip walk |
| |
~ 15 minutes ~ |
| 18:38 |
deedbot |
http://trilema.com/2018/heres-something-you-probably-see-more-often-than-theres-any-need-to/ << Trilema - Here's something you probably see more often than there's any need to |
| 18:53 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: It is the only usb drive plugged in |
| 18:53 |
asciilifeform |
ok BingoBoingo you want stock 'F' ? |
| 18:53 |
BingoBoingo |
Yeah stock F plus iptables |
| 18:53 |
asciilifeform |
aite |
| 18:55 |
asciilifeform |
gimme 15m |
| 18:55 |
BingoBoingo |
In other local news: PeƱarol won the national championship this afternoon |
| 18:55 |
asciilifeform |
btw BingoBoingo didja ever get the iptables kernel ? |
| 18:55 |
asciilifeform |
recall that kernel dun live on the hd |
| 18:55 |
asciilifeform |
it lives on sd |
| 18:55 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: I did |
| 18:56 |
asciilifeform |
ok will be ready in ~10m |
| 18:56 |
BingoBoingo |
Sweet |
| 19:00 |
asciilifeform |
ok done |
| 19:00 |
asciilifeform |
boot up yer rk, BingoBoingo , and then http://p.bvulpes.com/pastes/abcAC/?raw=true and lemme know. |
| 19:03 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: Will do in a bit, got some news of the world to cover |
| |
~ 34 minutes ~ |
| 19:38 |
deedbot |
http://qntra.net/2018/11/frances-macron-nationalism-is-a-form-of-treason/ << Qntra - France's Macron: Nationalism Is A Form Of Treason |
| 19:38 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo: plox to test rk shortly, i gotta go to meat in ~20m |
| 19:38 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: Will test later tonight. Feel free to enjoy the meat |
| |
~ 2 hours 4 minutes ~ |
| 21:43 |
mircea_popescu |
top keks. |
| 21:43 |
mircea_popescu |
who the fuck is this macaron anyway. |
| |
~ 1 hours ~ |
| 22:43 |
trinque |
!!v 5B236BCA31AFCEB434A8434E9730FC5698337A7795F37ACF85F37C5270A7F008 |
| 22:43 |
deedbot |
trinque paid BingoBoingo invoice 4 |
| 22:47 |
ben_vulpes |
BingoBoingo: 2 q's: how much pizarro btc were you holding in your deedbot account as of september 7, and how much elsewhere? |
| 22:49 |
ben_vulpes |
prior to september 7th, i mean. |
| |
~ 16 minutes ~ |
| 23:05 |
BingoBoingo |
Prior to September 7th, zero Pizarro Bitcoin was in the deedbot wallet. The payment of the Foundation colo invoice was the first Pizarro transaction outside of payments as a customer/wildcatter. Outside of deedbot I am holding 0.20113128 BTC Pizarro carryover BTC from the BBISP days. |
| 23:05 |
BingoBoingo |
asciilifeform: Ty, Rockchip tested a success |
| 23:06 |
ben_vulpes |
BingoBoingo: ty |
| 23:09 |
asciilifeform |
BingoBoingo: cool |
| |
~ 15 minutes ~ |
| 23:24 |
BingoBoingo |
And now to play with auctionbot |
| 23:24 |
BingoBoingo |
!Xsell 145mn 96 One lot of 14,500 S.QNTR shares |
| 23:24 |
auctionbot |
Sell order # 1007 created by BingoBoingo: One lot of 14,500 S.QNTR shares Opening: 145mn ecu Ending: 2018-11-15 16:25:23.664854 UTC (95 hours) |
| 23:32 |
BingoBoingo |
And in other local news as I decompress the brain for sleep, locals keep telling me the pichis aren't the center of Uruguaya culture and yet, the paper of record publishes too much about them https://www.elobservador.com.uy/nota/la-ciudad-de-los-indigentes-2018119195210 |
| |
~ 15 minutes ~ |
| 23:48 |
trinque |
BingoBoingo: why not link the "Remote Hands" text on the Pizarro website to your blog? |
| 23:49 |
BingoBoingo |
trinque: Linking to the blog is pointless until I bring the blog online again. It's on the top of tomorrow's do list |
| 23:49 |
trinque |
I didn't know it was offline, but at any rate, would make the mention of "remote hands" a hell of a lot more meaningful |
| 23:50 |
BingoBoingo |
But, yeah that is definitely a solid idea |
| 23:51 |
trinque |
"this is a real person, proved not by our marketing blather but by link straight to the man's letters" |