Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2016-09-11 | 2016-09-13 → ↓
00:01 BingoBoingo !~covertress pls to fix your IRC flouncer? consider hosting it on a different interwebz pipe? Preferably one with more consisent pressure and brazed copper fittings?
00:01 jhvh1 BingoBoingo: Error: "covertress" is not a valid command.
00:02 BingoBoingo !~later tell covertress pls to fix your IRC flouncer? consider hosting it on a different interwebz pipe? Preferably one with more consisent pressure and brazed copper fittings?
00:02 jhvh1 BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
00:07 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539757 << this makes 0 sense. what 'connections' are there in anyone's gossipd picture ?
00:07 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 03:54 ben_vulpes: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-11#1539662 << you know i had a whole thing typed out but i think the core is that mircea_popescu is talking connections and asciilifeform is talking blobs
00:07 asciilifeform thing's supposed to be stateless.
00:09 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539752 << 74.45.228.159, 74.45.228.160, 74.45.231.125, 74.45.228.49, 74.45.0.60 -- are all currently up and happily report being tropos boxes.
00:09 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 03:33 deedbot: http://phuctor.nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/986CBE61250486DABCEC88D21AEBC21E3B49C40F0EB81B86305B3FD41350E0ED << Recent Phuctorings. - Phuctored: 12821434770207124962218342772669979580034410699894792217009678098194556802269429235901909465304384529740402801239415068853092063888103297243254641064047113 divides RSA Moduli belonging to '74.45.228.159 (ssh-rsa key from 74.45.228.159 (13-14 June 2016 extraction) for Phuctor import. Ask asciilifeform or framedragger on
00:09 asciilifeform $s tropos
00:09 asciilifeform motherfucker
00:10 asciilifeform #!s tropos
00:10 asciilifeform !~s tropos
00:10 jhvh1 asciilifeform: Error: "s" is not a valid command.
00:10 phf no that last one should've worked let me check
00:10 asciilifeform why the FUCK did $s have to move.
00:10 phf !#s i don't know
00:10 a111 723 results for "i don't know", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=i%20don't%20know
00:10 asciilifeform can we have a perma-moratorium on this nonsense ?
00:11 asciilifeform mircea_popescu ?
00:11 asciilifeform search should be a single-char command
00:11 asciilifeform dun matter which char
00:13 BingoBoingo !#s tropos
00:13 a111 14 results for "tropos", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=tropos
00:16 asciilifeform ohio; pennsylvania; new york.
00:21 asciilifeform danielpbarron: your www appears to be dead ?
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00:24 asciilifeform !#s 12821434770207124962218342772669979580034410699894792217009678098194556802269429235901909465304384529740402801239415068853092063888103297243254641064047113
00:24 a111 11 results for "12821434770207124962218342772669979580034410699894792217009678098194556802269429235901909465304384529740402801239415068853092063888103297243254641064047113", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=12821434770207124962218342772669979580034410699894792217009678098194556802269429235901909465304384529740402801239415068853092063888103297243254641064047113
00:24 asciilifeform ^ pretty strange.
~ 27 minutes ~
00:51 pete_dushenski http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-11#1539601 << /me wonders to what extent fiat central bankers lie awake at night spinning the same observation round and round their fatigued noggins worried sick about their own altcoins.
00:51 a111 Logged on 2016-09-11 16:22 mircea_popescu: the point ~everyone, from the propellerhead ethidiots to yours truly, prefers to not observe the fact that bitcoin can not be part of economic activity as is, because unspecified machinery with unpredictable behaviours are exactly not the substance of contractual agreements.
00:58 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: i did call for nuke war over the high-S idiocy...
00:59 asciilifeform (principally via the building, hypothetically, of a high-S-only pool)
00:59 asciilifeform but no takers, mega-surprise.
01:06 pete_dushenski asciilifeform: i recall. and without the nukeforkpocalypse, i thought that using mod6's '-lows' flag was sop...
01:09 asciilifeform pete_dushenski: yeah i have nfi how mircea_popescu ended up emitting a high-S. and he never, iirc, said. probably was test.
01:12 pete_dushenski such is his prerogative.
01:14 BingoBoingo http://oglaf.com/insummary/
01:16 pete_dushenski lel
~ 28 minutes ~
01:45 ben_vulpes asciilifeform: i have no idea how challenge/response is stateless
01:50 ben_vulpes one of the other things i had scribbled down is that asciilifeform wants a crypto-hard wall against "teh ddos", and mircea_popescu appears satisfied that uninformed idiots who can't find keys are enough of a pill against the ddos. i don't see how this is an improvement on the ip address, which the average netizen is entirely uncognizant of.
01:51 ben_vulpes can't imagine my failure to understand belongs on trilema
~ 3 hours 1 minutes ~
04:53 mircea_popescu ben_vulpes it belongs there inasmuch as the explanation belongs there.
~ 32 minutes ~
05:26 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#9 << a) that dude looks too much like a dork to be dpb ; b) notice how many of these schmucks are wanted for "the dpr crime", aka "said heretic things to usg agents while unaware of their being usg agents, facts to which usg agents swear" ?
05:26 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [02:28:46] <shinohai> danielpbarron arrested for planting a bomb: http://archive.is/vsGpQ
05:28 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#23 << great idea!
05:28 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [03:10:19] <pete_dushenski> speaking of making use of blogs, i've taken the liberty of compiling the various #trilema bots, their calls, and their functions onto a single page >> bots.contravex.com
05:28 mircea_popescu should have a proper list of commands rather than a few words description of what it does though.
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05:30 Framedragger re. scriba, "Call function : [TBD]", i was told http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-29#1531244 so i use !#, too? i can change this
05:30 a111 Logged on 2016-08-29 15:13 mircea_popescu: no, !#
05:30 Framedragger !#hello
05:30 scriba Hello, world!
05:30 Framedragger (commands tbd, if any)
05:32 mircea_popescu ahaha doh.
05:32 mircea_popescu Framedragger be a darling move it to !$ thanks.
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05:32 Framedragger np
05:33 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#25 << the sad result of girls reaching literacy without the experience of beating.
05:33 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [03:11:59] <BingoBoingo> https://i.imgur.com/fl1n0ib.jpg
05:33 mircea_popescu seriously now, stop spawning this scum.
05:36 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#29 << check out infertile old woman angry at the fact that she's old & infertile so taking it out on peoplez! for shame.
05:36 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [03:20:11] <BingoBoingo> http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3779582/Nurse-caught-CCTV-having-sex-dead-disabled-girl-s-waterbed-child-s-grieving-foster-parents-allowed-return-work.html
05:37 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#30 << just a friendly reminder that prb dun work is all.
05:37 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [03:22:32] <pete_dushenski> http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-11#1539612 << still stuck eh...
05:39 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#37 << one wonders, of course, if hanno boeck ( http://trilema.com/2016/psa-hanno-bock-still-a-deceitful-shitbag/ ) is stuck in an airport somewhere furiously editing his speech on his "research" which entirely consists of repackaging material published by the republic for his dorky friends with internet / mental disabilities. or whether they'll just publish an incomplete list and pretend no
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05:39 mircea_popescu t to notice.
05:39 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [03:35:52] <BingoBoingo> To celebrate these 9/12 phuctorings https://i.sli.mg/0FzhV3.png A SEASON!
05:41 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#54 << ahahaha you!
05:41 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [04:10:01] <asciilifeform> #!s tropos
05:42 mircea_popescu !#s buttseks
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05:42 a111 9 results for "buttseks", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=buttseks
05:42 mircea_popescu win
05:45 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#61 << we can have a perma moratorium on the following nonsense : you tend to bitch loudly about irrelevant shit. stop doing it. it's a waste of your time ; and it significantly degrades your standing.
05:45 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [04:10:57] <asciilifeform> can we have a perma-moratorium on this nonsense ?
05:46 mircea_popescu memorialized examples include you bitching about phuctor's hosting for spurious reasons, which resulted in enemy thanking us for a year of downtime. i had hoped you learned lesson, but ferrocranium is severe with you.
05:46 mircea_popescu it also includes in recent memory you bitching about a111 logging, only to discover presently that actually you love it.
05:47 mircea_popescu ima skip the endless deluge of similar idiocy in between the two quoted points. stop whining like an impotent retard who has internalized his impotence and consequently whines as loudly as he can and does not stick to his whining a moment later. it's unseemly.
05:49 Framedragger !$hello
05:49 scriba Hello, world!
05:49 mircea_popescu Framedragger hostmaks. you're doing them wrong.
05:49 Framedragger (may put in additional commands but those are lower priority)
05:49 Framedragger yeah meknows, it should first do the hostmask and only then enter room. will need to check innards of bot.
05:49 mircea_popescu aite.
06:00 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#76 << i recall explaining then, but i guess it didn't stick : the fact that transactions are malleable means no such thing as a "high only" pool may exist - others can malleate your "high only" txn and mine them as lows. meanwhile network effects prevent you building a mining farm that mines high-s txn : unless you control a significant portion of the hash, you will just mine orphans.
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06:00 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [04:59:38] <asciilifeform> but no takers, mega-surprise.
06:00 mircea_popescu and these two points aren't unrelated. the keystone of maturity is an ability to pick fights judiciously.
06:02 mircea_popescu and for that matter, a good measure of power is the overlap between "judiciously" and "it fucking pisses me off".
06:02 mircea_popescu with the caveat, of course, that it's one of those "greeks, exactly backwards, exactly right" : the infantile mind will expect the sentence speaks about the world. in fact, it speaks about the self.
06:04 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#80 << ahahaha ok this may be the best oglaf yet.
06:04 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [05:14:43] <BingoBoingo> http://oglaf.com/insummary/
~ 1 hours 3 minutes ~
07:08 Framedragger mircea_popescu, asciilifeform: regarding gossipd, aside from the central point of disagreement, regarding a "lighter" matter: what about subscribing/unsubscribing to "topics" (a kind of pubsub model)? because there's no discussion of multiparty chat as of now; or is there not to be, in gossipd?
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07:13 Framedragger topic-based publish/subscribe has been sorta well researched, but i guess this problem is on another 'layer': gossipd document would leave this for 'implementation'. even though it may not be trivial at all, to make decisions regarding such matters, choose best spec, or design it from ground zero. but of course makes sense to discuss the foundations first
07:16 * Framedragger obligatory swear towards paywalled PDFs. two evils at the same time, "CS" "academia" ftw
07:22 Framedragger (for anyone curious, three relevant PDFs regarding pubsub-based p2p in http://fd.mkj.lt/stuff/p2p-pubsub/ - yes, PDFs, i know)
07:24 Framedragger (the most general one is http://fd.mkj.lt/stuff/p2p-pubsub/2012.mw.pdf - pubsub based p2p architecture called poldercast)
07:31 adlai !~later tell BingoBoingo http://wotpaste.cascadianhacker.com/pastes/og87o/?raw=true
07:31 jhvh1 adlai: The operation succeeded.
07:32 danielpbarron http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539784 << the trilema effect. Even with caching my dinky blog box gets jammed sometimes. I always archive.is the latest post before it hits the bot though
07:32 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 04:21 asciilifeform: danielpbarron: your www appears to be dead ?
07:43 Framedragger btw as reported by kakobrekla and HN crowd, http://legalhackers.com/advisories/MySQL-Exploit-Remote-Root-Code-Execution-Privesc-CVE-2016-6662.html
07:44 Framedragger summary by one lucb1e, "people that can run queries on your MySQL server, either by legit access (shared webhosting or something else) or via an SQL-injection vulnerability, can execute commands that might root your server. Looking at the PoC, it seems possible to overwrite any file that the MySQL user (or whichever user MySQL runs as) can write to."
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07:46 Framedragger and also from the cve, "The vulnerability can be exploited even if security modules SELinux and AppArmor are installed with default active policies for MySQL service on major Linux distributions."
07:46 * shinohai suddeny remember why he detests MySQL
07:51 Framedragger (the PoC seems neat, with a custom bogus malloc library that mysql is told to use by a malicious config file loaded by malicious mysql trigger)
07:54 shinohai Maybe I should switch to an ethereum-based database >.>
07:55 Framedragger shinohai: you misspelt mongodb!
07:55 shinohai >.<
08:06 jurov what's interesting, i don't see anything possibly related here: https://github.com/MariaDB/server/commits/10.1
08:07 jurov nor other branches/releases
08:07 jurov does not look like "vendor fixed"
08:19 davout danielpbarron: you still hosting on a tamagotchi or sthg?
~ 16 minutes ~
08:35 trinque lel
08:40 * shinohai remembers this scam site called "mybitcoinjob.com" that was being hosted on a cellphone and could be dos'd with a simple nmap scan.
08:44 trinque http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539848 << on another layer indeed
08:44 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 11:08 Framedragger: mircea_popescu, asciilifeform: regarding gossipd, aside from the central point of disagreement, regarding a "lighter" matter: what about subscribing/unsubscribing to "topics" (a kind of pubsub model)? because there's no discussion of multiparty chat as of now; or is there not to be, in gossipd?
08:45 trinque keep it simple lest http://btcbase.org/log/2016-06-14#1482397
08:45 a111 Logged on 2016-06-14 04:33 mircea_popescu: otherwise - hole, night, creeps in.
08:53 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#134 << what do you mean ? X forwards all he's heard, from all his friends, to all his friends.
08:53 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [11:08:04] <Framedragger> mircea_popescu, asciilifeform: regarding gossipd, aside from the central point of disagreement, regarding a "lighter" matter: what about subscribing/unsubscribing to "topics" (a kind of pubsub model)? because there's no discussion of multiparty chat as of now; or is there not to be, in gossipd?
08:53 mircea_popescu there's one chat, and it's universal-party.
08:54 Framedragger trinque: yeah, fair enough
08:54 mircea_popescu and for that matter, why the heck are we discussing this here rather than there ;/
08:54 Framedragger mircea_popescu: ah, shit. for some reason the first time i've read the message storage format (in the general sense), i.e. "time, X, Y, text", i read it as from X directed towards Y. my shitty fault
08:54 Framedragger mircea_popescu: because i thought the question may have been truly stupid, and turns out it sorta was!
08:55 jurov scriba: that's message format on application level, but not even network level is resolved yet
08:55 * Framedragger should teach scriba to talk back :p
08:55 Framedragger jurov: yeah okay, you're right folks
08:55 mircea_popescu yes, but now if i want to say "i suppose if one wants channels he can just prefix his lines with #trilema or whatever, but this is deliberately left to implementation" i don't have where to.
08:56 Framedragger mircea_popescu: so i'll write a short comment
08:56 mircea_popescu next time.
08:57 Framedragger k.
08:58 Framedragger mircea_popescu: but you don't think there may be a problem with flood of messages in the network across all "channels" / topics? it'd be neat if there was a way for a node to specify that it's only interested in things (specified by prefix, as in your example) under #trilema
08:59 mircea_popescu just bear this in mind, there's no stupid questions, only stupid people. and deciding the venue of a question decides the venue of the answer, which is a major problem, as it conflicts with a fundamental principle ( ie http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-07#1536621 ).
08:59 a111 Logged on 2016-09-07 23:51 asciilifeform: this happens, just like at your university, in the manner the elders decide. and not the manner the novice prefers.
08:59 jurov Framedragger: irc also floods you with everythign in all channels, it' responisibility of your client to neatly sort it out
09:00 Framedragger mircea_popescu: gotcha. i felt shy because all these other smart people don't comment on the article, damn their restraint
09:00 mircea_popescu moreover nothing prevents emergent/de facto specs. the job of the gossipd spec is to keep people from doing world-breaking idiotic stuff. how they handle their own wives is their own problem.
09:01 Framedragger i see, i see; clear separation - makes sense
09:12 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539822 << i think the boeckfest was over on friday night
09:12 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 09:39 mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#37 << one wonders, of course, if hanno boeck ( http://trilema.com/2016/psa-hanno-bock-still-a-deceitful-shitbag/ ) is stuck in an airport somewhere furiously editing his speech on his "research" which entirely consists of repackaging material published by the republic for his dorky friends with internet / mental disabilities. or whether they'll just publish an incomplete list and pretend no
09:12 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [03:35:52] <BingoBoingo> To celebrate these 9/12 phuctorings https://i.sli.mg/0FzhV3.png A SEASON!
09:13 asciilifeform ^ interesting. is this correct mechanism ? ( 2 bots answer )
09:14 trinque one bot saw the other's link.
09:14 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539827 << mircea_popescu throws rotten tomato at me but afaik there is not a canonical manual of commands, nor is it possible to find whether the latest knob rewiring took, without brute test of three or four of these
09:14 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 09:42 mircea_popescu: !#s buttseks
09:15 asciilifeform e.g., http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539813
09:15 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 09:32 mircea_popescu: Framedragger be a darling move it to !$ thanks.
09:16 asciilifeform !$ buttseks
09:16 asciilifeform apparently - not yet.
09:16 mircea_popescu asciilifeform yeah, truly there isn't, and truly tis a problem. but your question wasn't "hey, shouldn't we have a canonical manual of commands or something ?" to which the answer would have been "go, write" rather than tomato.
09:16 Framedragger !$hello
09:16 scriba Hello, world!
09:16 mircea_popescu one earns his tomato.
09:16 Framedragger no search yet
09:16 trinque I recommend each bot implements botname: help
09:16 trinque I haven't yet, but can.
09:16 mircea_popescu nah, should answer in pm
09:16 mircea_popescu truly doth not belong in trilema
09:17 trinque works for me
09:17 asciilifeform mircea_popescu et al : would be imho spiffy if one could get a sexprtronic list of commands out of a bot in pm
09:17 trinque point being then can discover prefixes and commands.
09:17 asciilifeform aha
09:18 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539841 << the second half of this is afaik true, but the first item is trivially solved by not sending the tx anywhere else.
09:18 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 10:00 mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#76 << i recall explaining then, but i guess it didn't stick : the fact that transactions are malleable means no such thing as a "high only" pool may exist - others can malleate your "high only" txn and mine them as lows. meanwhile network effects prevent you building a mining farm that mines high-s txn : unless you control a significant portion of the hash, you will just mine orphans.
09:18 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [04:59:38] <asciilifeform> but no takers, mega-surprise.
09:18 trinque new prefixes are worth it in that they allow command name overlap.
09:18 asciilifeform let it go over proper crypto to the high-s pool.
09:19 trinque so then no one mine's atop your block, and what
09:19 asciilifeform trinque: mircea_popescu was correct in his formulation that you gotta be large enough for them to die if they refuse, for this to work.
09:19 mircea_popescu (notice also, for the sake of stating the obvious - that what glyphs one's monitor displays is a matter of local configuration ; that if one wishes to type ζ and have a certain bot respond with a search that someone is encouraged to look into macros, keybindings, or whatever solution of this problem his locale prefers ; finally that nothing keeps asciilifeform from getting phf to have a111 behave any arbitrary way in #asciil
09:19 mircea_popescu ifeform, and that there's a trilema article on this topic ; and finally that italians do it better : http://66.media.tumblr.com/fc49140463f06998aa16e4dde0f9217f/tumblr_ny6xzbsqoG1revz5to1_500.gif )
09:20 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: how do i locally configure my terminal to emit mircea_popescu's command-of-the-day ?
09:20 mircea_popescu a question for teh ages.
09:21 asciilifeform the annoying part was the game of simon-says, not the 'too many buttons', ftr.
09:21 mircea_popescu the "secret tx pool" thing is trivial in theory ; in practice it opens you to a whole cat and mouse game and it didn't seem to me we're there yet.
09:21 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: would be interesting to see this expanded on
09:21 mircea_popescu asciilifeform i know. but this is the nominalist axion. you're stuck with some level of simon says
09:22 mircea_popescu asciilifeform what's to expand though ? the thing with secrets is that someone will be leaking them ; much like the thing with chastity vows. now find him, etc.
09:22 asciilifeform well if your own pool leaks, you're done
09:22 asciilifeform and who exactly else will leak ?
09:22 asciilifeform the users ? then they are retarded.
09:23 asciilifeform there is no 3rd party in the envisioned scheme.
09:23 mircea_popescu every group of 20 people contains one retard.
09:23 asciilifeform so he leaks HIS tx.
09:23 asciilifeform let him die.
09:23 asciilifeform the secrets are in no way shared between the users.
09:36 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539858 << pretty great. thing is long overdue for its behind-the-shed bullet, just like openssl.
09:36 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 11:44 Framedragger: summary by one lucb1e, "people that can run queries on your MySQL server, either by legit access (shared webhosting or something else) or via an SQL-injection vulnerability, can execute commands that might root your server. Looking at the PoC, it seems possible to overwrite any file that the MySQL user (or whichever user MySQL runs as) can write to."
09:37 mircea_popescu afaik this was known for a decade
09:38 asciilifeform the particular exploit ?
09:38 asciilifeform not publicly
09:38 mircea_popescu nah, just, "running mysql ~= open shell"
09:38 asciilifeform .. or the overdue bullet ?
09:38 asciilifeform ah.
09:39 mircea_popescu a good part of why "shared hosting" as a fiction for the masses moved to "cloud hosting" as a fiction for the masses being that there was already no way to secure a lamp environment enough to multiuser it.
09:40 asciilifeform heh i still recall when folks believed that their unixen were 'multi user' os etc. aha.
09:40 mircea_popescu yawell.
09:41 mircea_popescu gotta start somewhere. and that somewhere is always the same : everyone steps out of his mother's cunt covered in blood and guts, not to mention shit half the time.
09:41 mircea_popescu !#s birthright's grime
09:41 a111 0 results for "birthright's grime", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=birthright's%20grime
09:41 mircea_popescu aww.
09:47 asciilifeform https://archive.is/zq3op << in other lulz.
09:50 mircea_popescu the problems of the fiat world.
09:50 mircea_popescu "we don't have identity" "well... cattle dun need identity"
09:52 Framedragger http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#199 << sounds good to me
09:52 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [13:16:34] <trinque> I recommend each bot implements botname: help
09:52 Framedragger (in the form of http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#201)
09:52 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [13:16:53] <mircea_popescu> nah, should answer in pm
09:54 mircea_popescu trinque i know i brought this on myself, but an unsubscribe will be useful so i don't get everything on gossipd spec twice lol
09:56 mircea_popescu and in other irrelevant news, that article's the weirdest thing i ever saw. apparently it attracted huge interest - but is linked virtually nowhere.
09:56 * mircea_popescu is starting to suspect darknet larger than previously estimated.
09:57 asciilifeform what means 'huge interest but linked nowhere' ?
09:57 asciilifeform i dun get it
09:57 mircea_popescu well, it's the 2nd most read article this month, which i've never seen before for a recent piece.
09:57 asciilifeform and relatedly, i have a proposed cut of the gordian knot, but now i gotta write it up
09:57 mircea_popescu write, write.
09:57 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: 'read' presumably means unique loads ?
09:57 asciilifeform because i confess, i refreshed it a buncha times
09:58 mircea_popescu you'd still count as one.
09:58 asciilifeform aite
09:58 mircea_popescu no, we're talking 17k different ips, plenty with garbled or no user agent, so you know. linked behind a password "protected" forum or w/e.
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09:59 asciilifeform lulzy.
09:59 mircea_popescu in any case more than what slashdot provides. so there could be a dark slashdot somewhere ?
09:59 Framedragger you may want to put an update linking to the new doc in http://trilema.com/2015/artifexd-a-better-ircd-rfc/ mircea_popescu
09:59 mircea_popescu it should have trackbacked hmm
09:59 mircea_popescu Framedragger it's there, #46
09:59 Framedragger .onion forums (they still exist, yes) deliberately exclude http referrer header fwiw
09:59 Framedragger ah, k, my bad
10:00 Framedragger (ah indeed, that counts)
10:02 mircea_popescu incidentally, how the fuck did the "butterfly" misspelling of a flutterby catch on ?
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10:02 mircea_popescu it's fucking obviously wrong. #conspiracy
10:02 * mircea_popescu blames pdf to text converters.
10:04 Framedragger heh. etymology is indeed unclear, full of speculation https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/butterfly
10:04 Framedragger #scribblingmonkconspiracy
10:05 mircea_popescu (pretty obvious to me : if you run finger over winds, the sensation is of buttery smoothness, esp if expression is restricted to the field of experience at the time.)
10:05 mircea_popescu wings*
10:08 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#146 << security modules ftw.
10:08 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [11:46:17] <Framedragger> and also from the cve, "The vulnerability can be exploited even if security modules SELinux and AppArmor are installed with default active policies for MySQL service on major Linux distributions."
10:11 Framedragger (phenomenological clarity notwithstanding, it's not super clear. word may come from old english butere (wiktionary), but that's only one explanation. no/few cited sources it seems)
10:12 mircea_popescu butterfly visual aid : http://67.media.tumblr.com/452cef85f2dce87f90c26c1480c6bae4/tumblr_nij9b19J1l1tkf673o1_500.gif
10:13 Framedragger heh!
10:13 mircea_popescu now you know what "baby i'm spent but if you wanna come over we can watch porn and do the butterfly" means.
10:15 * Framedragger may have been hinted at this very night. the laziness is sometimes frustratin'!
10:15 Framedragger at that*
10:16 mircea_popescu coming next on trilema, a butterfly classification by preferred wrist motion. learn to distinguish the circular girl from the more common sideways girl and the very rare vertical motion girl.
10:18 Framedragger wouldn't exactly object to reading that. girls sometimes are not in the know, either, which is pffft.
10:19 mircea_popescu i was just being facetious! no such article is being prepared! sorry to disappoint.
10:19 mircea_popescu but in the meanwhile, why not try everything see what works. you could call it fuckd-dc
10:20 Framedragger nono i figured re actual article
10:20 Framedragger right on
10:20 mircea_popescu (it's also a wonder why they don't teach girls to masturbate in sex ed / have special sherub camps etc.)
10:21 Framedragger !#tmsr radio
10:21 Framedragger !# tmsr radio
10:21 Framedragger !#s tmsr radio
10:21 a111 2 results for "tmsr radio", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=tmsr%20radio
10:22 Framedragger entirely unrelated: wouldn't it be somethin' to test out some gossipd ideas over *actual* cheap long wave or whatever wave radio devices between these here people?
10:22 mircea_popescu surely.
10:22 mircea_popescu once we have some sort of acceptabru spec all sorts of prototyping work can begin
10:23 Framedragger i think rtl-sdr dongles may be enough, no?
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10:23 Framedragger suresure
10:23 mircea_popescu possibly, i dunno
10:23 mircea_popescu but honestly, gossipd as a finished product can not possibly come other than with a mesh-over-wifi and mesh-over-radio ready made.
10:24 mircea_popescu as people (alf, mostly) pointed out in the intervening coupla years, there's absolutely no sane reason to marry gossipd to extant-internet, or tcp/ip or etc, as the original draft was trying to
10:25 Framedragger indeed, indeed. hence an itch to try things over radio whilst reading those comments there
10:25 mircea_popescu truth being that this is a historical occasion, with actually correct, well designed internet within grasp
10:26 Framedragger yawell, don't forget, routing is not a trivial problem. this is only the very beginning, i think. an occasion nonetheless though, surely!
10:26 mircea_popescu the very beginning.
10:29 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1540016 << these don't transmit.
10:29 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 14:23 Framedragger: i think rtl-sdr dongles may be enough, no?
10:29 asciilifeform you might be thinking of 'gnu radio' etc.
10:30 mircea_popescu you can get emitting ones too neh ?
10:30 asciilifeform that'd be 'gnu radio'.
10:30 mircea_popescu aok
10:30 asciilifeform 'rtl-sdr' (i have a couple here) are cheapo programmable wideband ~receivers~
10:30 mircea_popescu why don't they call them sdrr then!
10:31 asciilifeform which is a quite useful thing, both for 'i can hear my keyboard across the street, wtf', other experiments, but also for picking up eventually mircea_popescu's shortwave.
10:31 Framedragger asciilifeform: ah yeah, that's what it'd be called then. (there is some experimental stuff but nvm, http://www.rtl-sdr.com/using-the-rtl-sdr-as-a-transmitter/ )
10:31 asciilifeform Framedragger: the linked piece is approx. same as the 'transmit with my vga card' from 1990s.
10:32 asciilifeform it is not a useful way to do anything.
10:32 Framedragger and, you know, listening to them weird russian number stations and pulsars http://www.rtl-sdr.com/using-the-rtl-sdr-as-a-transmitter/
10:32 Framedragger asciilifeform: suresure! you're right
10:32 mircea_popescu another thing i'd like to see prototyped is quadcopter mediated data exchange. have the guy plug out a usb stick from one back panel, fly it over, plug it into another back panel.
10:32 asciilifeform as a receiver it's pretty good (but no shortwave without a freq. down-converter, iirc)
10:32 Framedragger clipbaord http://websdr.ewi.utwente.nl:8901/
10:32 Framedragger ^
10:33 mircea_popescu this, incidentally, is quite viable, if the animal spends ten minutes in flight and carries say 32 GB sticks you're looking at
10:33 mircea_popescu !~calc 32 * 2 ** 30 * 8 / 10 / 60
10:33 jhvh1 mircea_popescu: 32 * 2 ** 30 * 8 / 10 / 60 = 4.581298449066667E8
10:33 Framedragger ah yeah, the "terabytes of USB keys in truck" data rate
10:33 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: this presupposes a 100% landing rate, and a time 0 to encipher and fill the stick, and then to empty it
10:33 mircea_popescu half tbps
10:33 mircea_popescu asciilifeform raptor baby
10:34 asciilifeform even then.
10:34 mircea_popescu why ? you can lose SOME sticks.
10:34 asciilifeform 'lose some choppers' quickly becomes expensive.
10:34 mircea_popescu this is not a design concern at this level.
10:34 asciilifeform esp. if all you're trying to do is to cover a 10min flight range.
10:34 asciilifeform which is ~all you get from extant batteries.
10:34 mircea_popescu what do they do, like 10km/h ?
10:34 Framedragger !#s cuba usb
10:34 a111 0 results for "cuba usb", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=cuba%20usb
10:34 Framedragger https://www.fastcompany.com/3048163/in-cuba-an-underground-network-armed-with-usb-drives-does-the-work-of-google-and-youtube
10:35 asciilifeform lel sneakernet is 'exotic' now ?
10:35 * Framedragger too young to remember soviet
10:36 mircea_popescu the thing with the 10minute / 2km range is that in most circumstances, this is a half hour distance. if you have to drive it - gotta park, unpark, holy shit. most people live within 2km of their friends anyway.
10:36 asciilifeform Framedragger: we traded games like 'elite', rather than lolcat vids, but otherwise similar.
10:37 Framedragger cool stuff. same with films, vinyls etc as i understand it
10:37 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: chopper as ~radio relay~ is imho more interesting.
10:37 * shinohai fondly remembers all-night lan parties in his neighborhood.
10:37 asciilifeform it would significantly complicate enemy triangulation, if you had a great many.
10:38 asciilifeform (recall the saddam gps jammer thread)
10:38 asciilifeform i have wondered what the state-of-the-art in ~stationkeeping~ re quadcopter presently is.
10:38 asciilifeform (how long could it sit put at a few km altitude if it had solar battery etc.)
10:39 Framedragger i'd look at HAB
10:39 asciilifeform balloons suck
10:39 Framedragger better than 10 minutes of fly time
10:39 asciilifeform they leak. and have gigantic radar cross-sections.
10:40 asciilifeform ergo not a suitable instrument for the bite of 10,000,001 gnats against the back of a dying sovereign.
10:41 Framedragger there exist very small HABs with basically just a transmitter/repeater and super small solar cell, fwiw
10:41 asciilifeform thing is still visible from half a continent away on radar.
10:41 asciilifeform and pops in a month or so.
10:41 asciilifeform all the while blown around by the four winds
10:41 shinohai Too much restricted airspace in my area: http://www.myajc.com/news/drones-no-fly/
10:41 asciilifeform (unless tethered to the ground, and you can recall how well that worked for usg last year)
10:41 Framedragger i think you may be disappoint at the amount of stationkeeping time you can do on quadcopter or w/e, even with a large solar cell which then surely will render a larger radar profile; but maybe i'm mistaken - interesting
10:42 asciilifeform shinohai: the whole point of cheap chopper is to piss on 'restricted'
10:42 Framedragger asciilifeform: a month >> "stationkeeping time", so there's that. and they can be super cheap. and mass-produced. a HAB army anyone?
10:42 trinque why chopper rather than small plane
10:42 Framedragger but yeah disadvantages galore
10:42 trinque same-ish size, but generates lift.
10:43 trinque have the thing circle
10:43 asciilifeform trinque: no especially good reason. plane with well-programmed comp can probably just as well keep station.
10:43 mircea_popescu airborne relay also perfectly fine.
10:43 asciilifeform in fact, the ideal machine would likely be an ornithopter that - unlike any extant ornithopter - rides air currents.
10:43 mircea_popescu anyway, the beauty of bitcoin is that it actually allows one to permissionlessly serve.
10:43 mircea_popescu build your chopper fleet, cover some nodes, earn BTC.
10:44 * shinohai is suddenly very interested
10:44 asciilifeform we also had a thread some years ago about flying machines draping parasitic inductor-powered relays on power lines, etc.
10:44 Framedragger ornithopter would be l33t
10:44 asciilifeform and other terrorisms.
10:44 mircea_popescu asciilifeform if i wanted it to stay put i'd simply add a baloon.
10:45 mircea_popescu dirigible very workable as a 2-3kg quadcopper
10:45 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: wind.
10:45 mircea_popescu even so.
10:45 asciilifeform which is why few folks are riding dirigibles today.
10:45 mircea_popescu folks are heavy.
10:45 Framedragger so what, wind. have redundant amounts
10:45 mircea_popescu this is calculable, energy loss to course correction vs energy saved from buoyancy.
10:46 asciilifeform H2 has ~1g/L of lift. He2 - slightly less.
10:46 mircea_popescu also top of balloon makes the perfect surface for solar cells.
10:46 Framedragger microhabs are like a chip with cell, mass in grams
10:46 mircea_popescu Framedragger the copter itself would be most of the mass.
10:46 Framedragger unless, you know, you removed the copter!
10:46 Framedragger but, sure
10:46 mircea_popescu anyway. this sketch of a discussion should suffice to show that the enemy has no hope of ever getting a perimeter around the network again.
10:47 mircea_popescu Framedragger ideally you want it to empty the balloon and return "home" sometime.
10:47 asciilifeform some years ago i had a very lengthy exchange with al schwartz about an ocean bottle relay
10:47 mircea_popescu but this aside sure, the design space is wide open.
10:47 asciilifeform (he had - and afaik still has - a 'drop sealed champaigne bottles from airplanes, with messages, track currents' project)
10:48 Framedragger (for the logs - http://www.pi-in-the-sky.com/ - yes this is more of a toy - still)
10:48 Framedragger nice.
10:48 asciilifeform the nifty thing about my (circa 2009) sketch of 'naval gossipd' is that power is cheap
10:48 asciilifeform bottle is rolled by the waves.
10:48 mircea_popescu shinohai i don't think anyone seriously contemplates importing the aferations of random soi dissant sovereigns.
10:50 mircea_popescu re plane vs chopper : afaik per watt, chopper offers more flight than plane.
10:50 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it depends what means 'flight'
10:50 mircea_popescu that "lift" plane generates comes at a massive cost
10:50 mircea_popescu asciilifeform as implicit here, "be a station in flight"
10:50 asciilifeform chopper converts to brick (models do not have the inertial mass to autorotate) if power cut.
10:50 asciilifeform plane - not.
10:51 mircea_popescu eh, the plane-to-glider conversion is a sort of "my car is also a submarine"
10:51 mircea_popescu never works too well.
10:51 BingoBoingo <Framedragger> unless, you know, you removed the copter! << THermocouple, epoxy, car exhaust!
10:51 mircea_popescu yeah BingoBoingo is right, we also had the "add to people's cars, without asking the people, have it powered from heat exchange etc"
10:52 asciilifeform BingoBoingo, mircea_popescu : more 'bang for the buck' if parasitically ovipositing on rooftop chimneys, lights, street lamps, similar.
10:52 mircea_popescu also, sure.
10:52 mircea_popescu no movement there, but yes.
10:53 mircea_popescu also, a chopper fleet able to do anon cctv takeout missions is something with a future.
10:53 asciilifeform great with a balanced diet of that 30w laser diode.
10:53 mircea_popescu "takeout how ?" "spray epoxy glue on lens"
10:53 asciilifeform lens is too cheap.
10:53 asciilifeform melt the ccd.
10:54 asciilifeform (ordinary vandals live in every town and lenses unscrew)
10:54 mircea_popescu the expense of servicing cameras is getting crew to mount pole etc. not the parts. the parts are all cheap - great satan just prints to cover.
10:54 asciilifeform in usa there are even aficionados who shoot'em out
10:54 asciilifeform it is common enough problem in towns with 'traffic camera.'
10:54 mircea_popescu chopper should also be able to fire a 38 yes.
10:54 mircea_popescu should work.
10:55 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: the small chopper that fires so much as a 'bb' accurately and stays upright is afaik yet unsolved problem.
10:55 mircea_popescu and coupled with gossipd, it becomes impossible to establish "whose chopper this is". owner reports his choppers stolen, good luck "enforcing".
10:55 mircea_popescu asciilifeform eh, what, it can't handle a few g's ? why not ?
10:56 asciilifeform buy toystore chopper and then kick it in flight
10:56 asciilifeform and you'll see.
10:56 asciilifeform the motors are too small to adequately compensate for the 'jerk'.
10:56 mircea_popescu you compensate for it over time.
10:56 asciilifeform sorta same reason why 'virtual glove' never is able to simulate banging your fist on a hard table, it always ends up being a 'gellatin' table.
10:57 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: you cannot compensate for dynamic instability (roll, spin) 'over time'
10:57 PeterL http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539987 << obvious to any schoolchild - insect has ~0 to do with butter, but clearly you can see it flutter as it goes by, therefore many kids have separately come up with genius transform to flutterby
10:57 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 14:02 mircea_popescu: incidentally, how the fuck did the "butterfly" misspelling of a flutterby catch on ?
10:57 asciilifeform it has to be immediate.
10:57 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: buy a toy and try it.
10:57 asciilifeform whack it with a table tennis paddle.
10:58 asciilifeform ... before we lose this thread, i will point out that the correct projectile weapon for a toy flyer is 'gyrojet' rocket.
10:58 asciilifeform very simple to manufacture, also.
10:58 BingoBoingo PeterL: No, the reverse. Thing should be called Flutterby, but retards insist on calling it butterfly
10:58 asciilifeform this way you avoid eating the blunt end of newton's 3rd law.
10:58 asciilifeform !#s gyrojet
10:58 a111 13 results for "gyrojet", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=gyrojet
10:59 mircea_popescu anyway. 38 shot is about 300 W at barrel exit. for a 3kg shooter this translates to say 10 m/s
11:00 mircea_popescu big whoop, over ten seconds friction + your engines reduce it to .5
11:01 PeterL gyroget: cool futuristic weapon that does not actually perform as well as classic rifle. Would have been useful if instead of firing bullet-sized thing would fire slightly larger grenade type thing.
11:01 asciilifeform if you can avoid roll.
11:01 mircea_popescu not to say that gyrojet is out or anything.
11:01 mircea_popescu asciilifeform well you are the one pointing the shot.
11:01 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: this was, believe or not, a problem even for large plane.
11:01 asciilifeform who recalls the a10 gunship.
11:01 mircea_popescu hey, warthog does manage to fire those "girl you'd fuck" sized bullets...
11:02 deedbot http://qntra.net/2016/09/difficulty-up-2-3-in-fifth-adjustment-since-second-halving/ << Qntra - Difficulty Up 2.3% In Fifth Adjustment Since Second Halving
11:02 mircea_popescu note the GAU-8 fires 30x173 at 1km/s
11:02 * shinohai will release an army of these in neighborhood: http://archive.is/Sd1Yh
11:03 mircea_popescu !~google PGU-13/B HEI weight
11:03 jhvh1 mircea_popescu: 30mm GAU-8/A Ammunition - Orbital ATK: <https://www.orbitalatk.com/defense-systems/armament-systems/30mm/docs/GAU-8A_Fact_Sheet.pdf>; PGU -46/ B HEI - Orbital ATK: <https://www.orbitalatk.com/defense-systems/armament-systems/30mm/docs/PGU-46B_Fact_Sheet.pdf>; GAU-8 Avenger - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GAU-8_Avenger>
11:05 mircea_popescu fucken useless.
11:05 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: roughly arithmetize the mass of the bullet / mass of the aircraft , in each case.
11:05 mircea_popescu trying to.
11:05 asciilifeform firing, e.g., luger, from a toy chopper, is roughly similar to the notion of firing 'big bertha' from a 'warthog'.
11:06 asciilifeform which is to say: you ~could~. exactly ~once~.
11:07 mircea_popescu seems the cannon fires 400gram projectiles, about 70/s. so it expells 30kgs of material per second ; and it weighs 150 tons.
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11:07 mircea_popescu meanwhile the scheme contemplated here expells 100 grams of material per second, and weighs 3kgs.
11:07 mircea_popescu so like two degrees of magnitude off
11:08 mircea_popescu however, the constraints are material durability and relative density, because the main factor is atmospheric response.
11:08 asciilifeform that's the other thing - impedance mismatch between weapon and airframe.
11:08 mircea_popescu also the chopper not being a plane, it can tolerate a lot more than the warthog could.
11:08 mircea_popescu also, it's not manned.
11:09 asciilifeform the latter is typically made of soft, light stuff.
11:09 mircea_popescu yeah you'd need duralumin framed choppers.
11:09 mircea_popescu but really - using plastic for a serious (as opposed to toy) chopper is stupid, you want duralumin anyway
11:09 asciilifeform know why these are not in the toystore ?
11:09 asciilifeform small engines have atrocious power-weight ratio.
11:09 mircea_popescu yeah, but plastic is heavier than duralumin per strength.
11:09 asciilifeform modellists build aluminum choppers, they are motorbike-sized.
11:10 asciilifeform once in a while you hear of a fella who got carried away at the controls, lost his head.
11:10 asciilifeform (yes)
11:10 mircea_popescu modellists suffer from mental disabilities, too.
11:10 asciilifeform they don't scale down from that size.
11:10 mircea_popescu duralumin has about 70k psi.
11:11 asciilifeform try it on paper. take the useful payload lift of the toy engines, and subtract the mass of the aluminum airframe from it.
11:11 mircea_popescu whatever vynil toy store uses has what, 60 ? if you're lucky and it's very good, pvc has like 15
11:12 mircea_popescu so basically, a beam made of 1kg of plastic could be made of 1gram of duralumin.
11:12 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: fatigue is not the issue. behaviour under shock wave is the issue.
11:12 asciilifeform plastics crack.
11:12 mircea_popescu metal beats polymer under shock.
11:12 mircea_popescu quite.
11:13 mircea_popescu serious application chopper will be made of aluminum alloy, not vinyl.
11:13 asciilifeform (even the fabled glock, cracks. but at least not right away. might want to look into what glock frame was made from.)
11:13 asciilifeform and this is , unlike much of the other matter, not a theoretical question, folks have sweated over 'what is the smallest aluminum chopper that can fly' , read them, not me.
11:13 mircea_popescu and a kg of duralumin hull will cut a hole through a pile of plastic choppers.
11:14 mircea_popescu they are not in my wot ; i will ignore them happily.
11:15 asciilifeform diametric is quite likely flying an oddball chopper as we speak. roust him from his sleep, and ask.
11:15 asciilifeform (fella built 1,001 types.)
11:15 mircea_popescu !~later tell diametric do you know of a good reason a 2-3kg chopper couldn't be built on aluminum alloy frame ? not whether it is, nor why afficionado's don't, but whether couldn't.
11:15 jhvh1 mircea_popescu: The operation succeeded.
11:16 mircea_popescu meanwhile at the weird farms, http://67.media.tumblr.com/2698f6760e7f0f575560258cdb67b94f/tumblr_nwphykHJLg1ucyfvgo1_1280.jpg
11:18 asciilifeform https://www.google.com/search?as_st=y&tbm=isch&as_q=aluminum+quadcopter+frame << no shortage.
11:19 mircea_popescu then... what are you on about lol.
11:19 asciilifeform the cost.
11:19 mircea_popescu 200 bux ?
11:19 asciilifeform (in endurance)
11:19 mircea_popescu http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/MF-500mm-Aluminum-Tube-Folding-Four-axis-Alien-Quadcopter-Aircraft-Frame-w-MF-BMP-Brushless-Gimbal/206605_1562408736.html << neat looking thing, too.
11:20 asciilifeform i know of no example with anything but plastic props, incidentally.
11:20 asciilifeform they, as every aficionado knows, reliably shatter if they so much as touch a blade of grass.
11:20 mircea_popescu so. that item above : for 200 bucks, can fire a 38. you will have to add some software for it to fire in a convenient direction for itself while also hitting target.
11:21 mircea_popescu not unsolvable problem.
11:21 asciilifeform ideally straight down.
11:21 mircea_popescu or straight up, or against current mommentum or w/e.
11:21 asciilifeform and entirely coincidental with center of mass.
11:22 asciilifeform 'straight up' will likely convert the thing to a brick immediately.
11:22 mircea_popescu possibly. depends how high this is.
11:22 mircea_popescu in fact, this is a study on ballistics. fire from center of mass at 3pi/4 angle, go for a parabolic ride.
11:23 PeterL https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SNPJMk2fgJU << related
11:23 mircea_popescu (why 45 degrees ? maximum distance. which means maximum friction.)
11:23 asciilifeform PeterL: not that idiocy again
11:24 PeterL sorry
11:24 asciilifeform (astonishing how many imbeciles bought it wholesale)
11:24 asciilifeform quite reminiscent of the 'balloon boy' incident.
11:26 mircea_popescu quite reminescent of the "man half penis" medieval things.
11:26 asciilifeform dog-heads!1111
11:26 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-08#1537276 << oblig.
11:26 a111 Logged on 2016-09-08 15:53 asciilifeform: heads, leucrota, manticores, vultures, paranders, weasels, dragons, hoopoes, owls, basilisks, hypnales, presters, spectafici, scorpions, saurians, whales, scitales, amphisbenae, iaculi, dipsases, green lizards, pilot fish, octopi, morays, and sea turtles.' -- eco's 'name of the rose'
11:29 asciilifeform btw if yer firing straight down, why not shotgun shell.
11:29 mircea_popescu i dunno why not.
11:29 asciilifeform more or less ideal weapon for the scenario
11:29 asciilifeform low-pressure; smooth bore.
11:29 mircea_popescu why not spider shot lol.
11:29 asciilifeform what's that
11:29 mircea_popescu ancient marine warfare thing. like linked shot but smaller.
11:30 mircea_popescu basically "cannonball made of chain, unwraps in flight."
11:30 asciilifeform can fit these, and more, in '12 gauge' shell.
11:30 mircea_popescu aha.
11:30 asciilifeform iirc they are even commercially sold in usa.
11:30 asciilifeform (for what, i have nfi.)
11:30 PeterL why not just drop bullet from above rather than firing?
11:30 asciilifeform there are even, iirc, white phosphorous shells.
11:30 mircea_popescu hey, some people take pest control seriously.
11:30 mircea_popescu VARMINT GUN
11:30 asciilifeform PeterL: great if you're 70km in orbit
11:31 PeterL how high would it need to be to be lethal?
11:31 mircea_popescu omaigerd you can do your math too cantcha ?
11:31 asciilifeform PeterL: ww1 state of the art
11:31 asciilifeform caltrop dropped from biplane.
11:31 mircea_popescu mv**2 = 2mgh
11:31 asciilifeform they also had little darts.
11:31 PeterL (I probably calculated that in HS physics class, but I am too lazy now)
11:32 asciilifeform laziness, of this type, is a sin, PeterL .
11:32 mircea_popescu !~calc 1000 * 2 / 2 / 10
11:32 PeterL sorry
11:32 jhvh1 mircea_popescu: 1000 * 2 / 2 / 10 = 100
11:32 mircea_popescu oops
11:32 mircea_popescu !~calc 1000 ** 2 / 2 / 10
11:32 jhvh1 mircea_popescu: 1000 ** 2 / 2 / 10 = 50000
11:32 mircea_popescu 50km gives you 1000 m/s (ie, gau-8 muzzle velocity) for arbitrary item discounting air friction.
11:33 asciilifeform terminal velocity for the dart is usually much less.
11:33 mircea_popescu rather, yes.
11:33 asciilifeform you cannot actually discount the friction, aha.
11:34 PeterL add some fins to get it spinning, avoids tumbling
11:34 mircea_popescu at the cost of more friction
11:34 asciilifeform !# horse splashes
11:34 asciilifeform !#s horse splashes
11:34 a111 6 results for "horse splashes", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=horse%20splashes
11:35 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2015-02-14#1018441 << re terminal velocities.
11:35 a111 Logged on 2015-02-14 05:25 asciilifeform: 'You can drop a mouse down a thousand-yard mine shaft; and, on arriving at the bottom, it gets a slight shock and walks away, provided that the ground is fairly soft. A rat is killed, a man is broken, a horse splashes.'
11:35 mircea_popescu such elegant expression. schwartz iirc ?
11:35 asciilifeform jbs haldane.
11:35 mircea_popescu ah ok
11:36 asciilifeform http://irl.cs.ucla.edu/papers/right-size.html << subj.
11:36 asciilifeform c. 1928.
11:37 asciilifeform worth a read.
11:39 asciilifeform and eminently relevant to the 'pistol on quadcopter' thread.
11:41 asciilifeform 'A wet mouse has to carry about its own weight of water. A wet fly has to lift many times its own weight and, as everyone knows, a fly once wetted by water or any other liquid is in a very serious position indeed. An insect going for a drink is in as great danger as a man leaning out over a precipice in search of food. If it once falls into the grip of the surface tension of the water—that is to say, gets wet—it is likely to rema
11:41 asciilifeform in so until it drowns. A few insects, such as water-beetles, contrive to be unwettable; the majority keep well away from their drink by means of a long proboscis.'
11:46 asciilifeform and in particular, '...a large bird such as an eagle or kite does not keep in the air mainly by moving its wings. It is generally to be seen soaring, that is to say balanced on a rising column of air. And even soaring becomes more and more difficult with increasing size. Were this not the case eagles might be as large as tigers and as formidable to man as hostile aeroplanes.'
11:48 PeterL looks like a bullet terminal velocity is about 100 m/s, so you would reach that anywhere over 500 m.
11:48 asciilifeform PeterL: bombardiering is an actual thing, could read up on the problems involved with actually hitting target.
11:48 asciilifeform not as if subj were a new thing discovered this week.
11:49 asciilifeform goes back a century.
11:50 PeterL not saying it is new, just that it might help with quadcopter armaments, using gravity to assist rather than trying to think of shooting like guy standing on ground
11:51 asciilifeform one reason why ordinary airplanes drop bombs, rather than darts, is that the necessary accuracy for a dart hitting a man-sized target is not available.
11:51 asciilifeform for entirely mundane physical reasons.
11:52 asciilifeform now one interesting scenario is if the flying machine dropped ~itself~ as a bomb, using propellers for course correction on the way down.
11:53 PeterL smatbomb?
11:53 PeterL *smartbomb
11:53 asciilifeform not so much 'smart' required depending on what is being aimed at.
11:54 PeterL I guess if it is cheap enough/target is high value that could be useful
11:55 thestringpuller asciilifeform: So. Turns out your Drone thing is a reality.
11:56 thestringpuller https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/22/drone-carrying-drugs-crashes-near-mexican-us-border
11:56 thestringpuller old news tho
11:56 asciilifeform thestringpuller: these come out every month or so.
11:56 asciilifeform and that's just the publicized ones.
11:58 thestringpuller i kno. but i've talked with a hobbyist turned "professional" and does discreet delivery with drones in this manner. they've gotten highly advanced.
11:58 Framedragger hipster SF version still exists (found this some months ago) : https://trees.delivery/
11:58 thestringpuller his master idea is having a mobile charging network for long distance flights
11:59 thestringpuller currently dude is working on in air "refueling"
11:59 ben_vulpes https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/22/drone-carrying-drugs-crashes-near-mexican-us-border << why people do this and not fixed wing is a mind-boggle
11:59 Framedragger huh very neat, good for him says i
11:59 ben_vulpes could be ~entirely autonomous barring loading of landing strip coordinates
12:00 ben_vulpes small market of remote delivery could be served by a fleet of autonomous, gas-fueled fixed-wings.
12:00 ben_vulpes make the recipient fuel 'em back up, what
12:00 thestringpuller ben_vulpes: this is actually what I just said
12:01 ben_vulpes no, not in the slightest wtf.
12:01 ben_vulpes "discreen delivery with drones in this manner" is a quadcopter per the guardian link
12:01 trinque said a bunch of vague and refueling in spookyquotes
12:01 ben_vulpes and just how does one 'refuel' a qc in flight, hot swap lipo?
12:01 thestringpuller no. per my commentary.
12:02 ben_vulpes do please cite where you said anything re fixed wing or ice
12:02 thestringpuller the ArduPlane project is old af, but requires actual brain to use.
12:02 asciilifeform lel, 'seekrit' gas-fueled model plane
12:02 asciilifeform ever ~heard~ one of these things go ?
12:02 ben_vulpes discreet 2 stroke!
12:02 thestringpuller "drone" is a general term ben_vulpes NO NEED to get all riled up
12:02 asciilifeform ahahahahaha lolk.
12:02 ben_vulpes discreet *ice*
12:02 thestringpuller Perhaps I should just use UAV for now on
12:03 ben_vulpes "drone" is a made up product category by mattel
12:04 asciilifeform 'drone' as name for pilotless machine is circa ww2
12:04 BingoBoingo <ben_vulpes> discreet 2 stroke! << :Launch and Retrieval vehicles double as lawcare truck!
12:04 asciilifeform (they were good ~strictly for target practice then)
12:04 PeterL I thought "drone" was just a less-TLA-y version of "UAV"?
12:05 asciilifeform (in ru we just say 'безпилотник')
12:08 thestringpuller For one two stroke engine planes are from the fucking 50's. Those are antiques. Most advanced hobbyist used nitro powered planes. They are slightly noisier than RC model, but given how high you can fly them in practice it's kinda whatever. Second, the autonomous part has been around since the arduino became "mainstream" albeit asciilifeform may find it a snore fest the APM unit can fully control an RC plane. If programmed properly it
12:09 asciilifeform thestringpuller: if the thing is landing cargo of cocaine or plutonium in your back yard, the noise is not 'whatever'
12:09 thestringpuller doesn't land.
12:09 BingoBoingo thestringpuller: But large amounts of nitro fuel can not be excused as "occupational necessity" as 2-cycle gas/oil mix can.
12:09 thestringpuller or at least doesn't land with payload
12:09 asciilifeform thestringpuller: bomber ?
12:10 thestringpuller i guess it's the same physics involved.
12:10 asciilifeform incidentally, if noise is no concern, why not use 'pulsejet' engine as in ww2 'buzz bomb.'
12:10 asciilifeform doesn't get any cheaper.
12:10 asciilifeform no rotors, no propellers
12:11 asciilifeform http://aardvark.co.nz/pjet/availablenow.shtml << see also.
12:12 thestringpuller Those fuckers.
12:12 thestringpuller You'll see a few muthafuckers with those things on the airfield. I dunno how "reliable" they are tho. Then again, I'm not enough of a pilot to even call myself a hobbyist.
12:13 thestringpuller The only reason the RC plane-UAV dropoff service became a thing was due to insurmountable traffic.
12:14 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#586 << yes ; main point of wings in pajura is to pilot the downward thrust towards victim.
12:14 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [15:46:35] <asciilifeform> and in particular, '...a large bird such as an eagle or kite does not keep in the air mainly by moving its wings. It is generally to be seen soaring, that is to say balanced on a rising column of air. And even soaring becomes more and more difficult with increasing size. Were this not the case eagles might be as large as tigers and as formidable to
12:14 scriba man as hostile aeroplanes.'
12:14 mircea_popescu ~fins.
12:15 asciilifeform thestringpuller: the film clip in link is good illustration.
12:15 asciilifeform engine that costs what ~can of sardines costs.
12:15 asciilifeform no props, no pistons, no oil.
12:15 thestringpuller No throttle.
12:15 asciilifeform why not ?
12:16 thestringpuller was a joke. the one you sent is a pretty advanced version :P
12:17 asciilifeform http://www.airindustriesresearch.com/siram/images/diagram.jpg << can dispense with the flapper also.
12:17 asciilifeform now all you have is... a spark plug and pipe.
12:17 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#617 << tesla "energy at distance" inductors!
12:17 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [16:01:39] <ben_vulpes> and just how does one 'refuel' a qc in flight, hot swap lipo?
12:17 thestringpuller BingoBoingo: large amounts of nitro fuel << hobby shops don't seem to care. People go through barrels of the thing during a nerdy weekend with friends on the airfield.
12:18 asciilifeform thestringpuller: $1000 piston engine on 'disposable' machine is idiocy.
12:18 asciilifeform fine for usg. not so great for people who actually count their money.
12:18 BingoBoingo thestringpuller: Yes, but when going out to landing strip one doesn't deal with shopkeeps. WHich is why you need to have stringtimmers on truck.
12:18 mircea_popescu (incidentally, the usb-bandwidth drone could in principle be designed with two batteries. it starts using one, then when dead moves to other. and design could allow for drone tango - where they connect, as per ancient thread with alf, to make bigger drone - which could conceivably allow them to swap batteries, in a strange sort of robomating dance)
12:19 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: '2 batteries, fallover' is pretty standard.
12:19 mircea_popescu yes but give your friend your fallover battery isnt
12:19 thestringpuller asciilifeform: Um. I met a hobbyist once who spent 10 grand on a plane. Point for Traffic Delivery Bypasser is to be resusable not "disposable".
12:19 asciilifeform recall the 'battery to fly loaf of bread to buenos aires from washington' thread ?
12:20 mircea_popescu yeah, none of this is very practical yet.
12:20 mircea_popescu i paranthesized mostly for the ... robomorphical interest. SEX! for machines! increases their lifespan, just like for people, but differently.
12:21 mircea_popescu "why do drones prefer to fuck young drones ?" "fresher batteries"
12:27 mircea_popescu incidentally, what's the current list of public trb nodes ? i have -connect=108.31.170.49 54.187.227.228 46.166.165.30 91.218.246.31 172.86.178.46 50.168.67.12 of which a coupla be answering.
12:30 mircea_popescu oh and re the "it's not hillary" conspiracy theory : it'd be fucking epic if they actually... switcher her with trump. "you dun wanna vote for clinton ? fine, vote for trump then!"
12:30 mircea_popescu "we'll just move the contents later, what."
12:35 asciilifeform eh i can see a, e.g., michele obama, switcheroo, but not the old fart.
12:35 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: if either of my trbtrons aren't answering, now or whenever, gimme a ping
12:35 asciilifeform i'd like to know.
12:36 asciilifeform incidentally perhaps mircea_popescu remembers this, but '-connect' results in a node that no one can ever connect to.
12:36 asciilifeform (it can only be operated with local knobs)
12:37 asciilifeform if this is the intended item, ignore.
12:42 shinohai From tardstalk "News: Due to DDoS attacks, there may be periodic downtime."
12:50 mircea_popescu aite.
12:53 mircea_popescu yeah imagine that, you'd expect obama'd have upgraded to a recent model sometime in the past 8 years.
12:56 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: that's not an authorized part of the kabuki.
12:56 asciilifeform last time they had a pres who wasn't a capon, they had to shoot him.
12:59 BingoBoingo At is age and weight the edema has likely already capon-ized his cajones. All that's left of historical Trump the bankruptcy artist is a stimulant habit and sorry for his loss.
12:59 asciilifeform dunno about you BingoBoingo but i'm lookin' forward to the sovgeriatric era of usa
13:00 asciilifeform when they wheel one in, and cart him out 6mo later, rinse, repeat.
13:00 BingoBoingo lol, next time I gotta make the "candidates are old" declaration in press will have to wheel that out.
13:01 asciilifeform see brezhnev, andropov, et al.
13:01 asciilifeform !#s gerontocracy
13:01 a111 4 results for "gerontocracy", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=gerontocracy
~ 25 minutes ~
13:26 phf asciilifeform: are you using breadboarded/soldered version, or you ended up printing the pcb too for the keyboard controller?
↖
13:27 asciilifeform phf: i bought the pcb.
13:27 asciilifeform you can also make own, if you like, it is not complicated.
13:27 asciilifeform can also load in own fw.
13:27 asciilifeform (the fw is not complicated either.)
13:28 phf i was thinking of just doing a mess of wires, but there was that shop floating around in the logs, that would print a pcb for you and put chips on it
13:28 asciilifeform phf: won't work. the capacitative sensing needs ~equal paths.
13:28 asciilifeform and minimal stray load.
13:29 asciilifeform macrofab will print the pcb.
13:29 asciilifeform and populate.
13:29 asciilifeform if you buy cornall's pcb, be aware that the usb jack comes off if you so much as fart on iot.
13:29 asciilifeform *it
13:29 asciilifeform verily it suxx.
13:33 asciilifeform http://trilema.com/2016/gossipd-design-document/#comment-119015 << and yes i know mircea_popescu has auto-ping, but linking here for other folks.
13:33 shinohai !~later tell thestringpuller http://archive.is/6eUmF
13:33 jhvh1 shinohai: The operation succeeded.
13:34 asciilifeform ^ this crackpottery brought to you by h. altschuller's 'exacerbate the unwanted phenomenon to solve it' heuristic.
13:34 asciilifeform as described in his last 'triz' and elsewhere.
13:34 PeterL phf is there a way to make search on logs non-case sensitive?
13:35 phf PeterL: not until i fix the algorithm, that was on my backlog but got overtaken with all the stability issues
13:38 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it also solves replay.
13:39 phf i wanted to fix the unicode search in the process, but i'll punt on that for one. it kind of works, but not surprisingly doing boyer-moore correctly with unicode is ugly and suboptimal.
13:45 asciilifeform http://trilema.com/2016/gossipd-design-document/#comment-119016 << addendum.
13:47 asciilifeform phf: the hard part is to actually get a hold of a 'model f'.
↖
13:48 asciilifeform (the pc xt model f is iirc unsuitable.)
13:54 phf like in that russian joke "i got two"
13:55 phf picked them up from a retrohardware person i know. pretty sure i burned some respect points for being "the retrokeyboard faggot"
13:56 asciilifeform phf: make sure it is not the 100x more common but identically-shaped 'terminal model-m.'
13:57 phf both are 6110xxx, but i'll know for sure once i start poking at them. in either case they were free
13:57 asciilifeform is the bottom made of iron ?
13:57 asciilifeform if yes - model f.
13:57 asciilifeform (and the legs are on round swivels)
13:58 asciilifeform i also recommend to sand and repaint the whole thing, with 'appliance epoxy' (get in any american houshold goods shop)
13:58 asciilifeform i did.
14:01 asciilifeform do not try to paint the legs, or the wells they rotate in. i did, and then had to scrape the paint off with a knife, they did not want to turn. the tolerances are quite surprisingly fine.
14:02 asciilifeform likewise do NOT try to paint the plastic clips that retain the stabilizer wires on long keys. pop'em out by pushing with a blunt pencil from the bottom side. they will happily sit back in later.
14:02 phf i'm having hard time figuring out how to even raise those legs without repainting
14:02 asciilifeform push on the round buttons.
14:02 phf aaah
14:02 asciilifeform there is a spring mechanism.
14:02 asciilifeform be sure to photograph it before pulling it apart.
14:02 asciilifeform it is a bitch to get together.
14:03 asciilifeform the real misery is soldering the ribbon.
14:04 asciilifeform desolder the old one with copper wick, do NOT simply cut it off !
14:05 phf nah, i'm just going to dremel the thing and replace it with cherry switches
14:06 asciilifeform lel phf it is easier to make new one.
14:06 asciilifeform there is no place for any kind of switch in that thing.
14:06 phf :>
14:06 asciilifeform ( phf is prolly trolololling but pointing out for readers. )
14:07 phf i think the goal really is to read paino forte from capacitance. at fortississimo keyboard should start injecting random "fuck" and "motherfucker" into stream as you type
14:07 asciilifeform phf: i inadvertently made this the first time i put it together.
14:08 asciilifeform calibrated the sensitivity a little low.
14:08 asciilifeform or rather, high.
14:08 asciilifeform but yes - with this beast, you actually COULD.
14:08 asciilifeform another bonus is that there is no reason this thing would ever fear water, or dust.
14:09 asciilifeform (there are no exposed contacts)
14:09 asciilifeform it is almost as joyous a thing as the old reed switch keyboards in ru.
14:15 thestringpuller phf: Did you see the raid on that camp at burning man? Shit's gotten crazy there. Inhouse fighting.
14:26 phf didn't see the raid itself, but yeah much talk was about it on arrival
14:26 asciilifeform care to summarize for folks who have nfi ?
14:29 phf bezzlers come to burn, pay for overpriced accommodations, act like assholes. this year one of those overpriced accommodations places got raided. water tank poured onto audio equipment, electric lines cut, tires punctured, etc.
14:29 asciilifeform by whom ?
14:30 thestringpuller by burners who were po'ed
14:30 asciilifeform ??
14:31 thestringpuller out of the other 70k people a group of them were probably like "fuck deez guys" went ot their camp and fucked it up
14:31 asciilifeform phf: what means 'overpriced accommodations' in this context ?
14:31 thestringpuller 70k people go to burning man and establish camps. a small few who aren't really burners just, SF-folk who wanna do drugs and "party" would buy rvs and stuff
14:32 thestringpuller and then have basically burning man "Hotel style" which fine, but it was a "closed camp" which
14:32 thestringpuller is considered extremely rude to the hippie folk who embrace the spirit and principles of burning man
14:33 asciilifeform for what purpose do the 'closed' folk come to the same fest ?
14:33 asciilifeform they could just as easily have their own, neh ?
14:33 * asciilifeform quite innocent of subj
14:34 phf asciilifeform: well, i don't know the details of "white ocean" camp in question, but it usually involved souped up rv's, a staff of paid employees to do your cooking for you, often direct flight from wherever to black rock city airport, etc.
14:34 PeterL asciilifeform http://trilema.com/2016/gossipd-design-document/#comment-119021 response
14:34 * mircea_popescu goes to read comments.
14:35 phf asciilifeform: sort of nobody cares if you're reach, but there's already been tension between people who are roughing it and people who are doing it in comfort.
14:35 asciilifeform PeterL: answer'd.
14:35 PeterL "Glamping" instead of "camping"
14:35 thestringpuller phf: well when you commodify the experience it goes against the spirit of the thing.
14:35 asciilifeform phf: it was a mindfuck a year or two ago reading about burningman's internal usg camp.
14:36 phf thestringpuller: burning man is not a TAZ, so i've no idea what you're talking about
14:36 asciilifeform what's that
14:37 thestringpuller phf: Decommodification In order to preserve the spirit of gifting, our community seeks to create social environments that are unmediated by commercial sponsorships
14:37 phf asciilifeform: the california weirdo concept from which "burning man" sprung up.
14:38 asciilifeform phf: enlighten me
14:38 thestringpuller from >> burningman.org/culture/philosophical-center/10-principles
14:38 asciilifeform i thought it was just this artsy festival thing.
14:39 thestringpuller full thing: "In order to preserve the spirit of gifting, our community seeks to create social environments that are unmediated by commercial sponsorships, transactions, or advertising. We stand ready to protect our culture from such exploitation. We resist the substitution of consumption for participatory experience."
14:39 thestringpuller ^- the camp in question was turning the experience into a commodity...
14:39 ben_vulpes yeah i mean if you buy that i've got a ticket to this other desert festival to sell ya
14:39 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: in case this wasn't obvious from the comment, the 'lighthouse' scheme is a variant of 'd-c', rather than 'sh', but with some of the advantages of the latter.
14:40 deedbot http://cascadianhacker.com/the-california-zephyr << CH - The California Zephyr
14:41 thestringpuller ben_vulpes: man. so bitter against da hippies.
14:41 ben_vulpes not even wrong
~ 18 minutes ~
15:00 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#689 << oya. such khruschlulz...
15:00 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [16:59:58] <asciilifeform> dunno about you BingoBoingo but i'm lookin' forward to the sovgeriatric era of usa
15:06 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#744 << ahahaha ok
15:06 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [18:07:19] <phf> i think the goal really is to read paino forte from capacitance. at fortississimo keyboard should start injecting random "fuck" and "motherfucker" into stream as you type
15:10 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#761 << yeah well tell you what, when i go to http://trilema.com/2016/lxs-ninxs/ i ALSO don't go to eat cooked rats and live with nine other people in a bathroom. i go to enjoy the cheap local cunt while preserving my luxurious lifestyle.
15:10 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [18:31:52] <thestringpuller> 70k people go to burning man and establish camps. a small few who aren't really burners just, SF-folk who wanna do drugs and "party" would buy rvs and stuff
15:10 mircea_popescu sane country'd have rounded up the 70k people, beat the shit out of them, made them re-make audio equipment, tyres etc by hand
15:10 mircea_popescu twice, for good measure.
15:10 mircea_popescu the fucking entitlement in that land, it's something else by now.
15:11 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: as i understand, the tension comes from burningman having once been a 'poorfag resort' where folks pretend that mircea_popescu doesn't exist, etc.
15:11 mircea_popescu obviously.
15:11 asciilifeform *where folks go to pretend
15:11 mircea_popescu tough titties as well.
15:12 asciilifeform plus i had nfi that mircea_popescu had to move his legs to get the 'cheap local cunt', i thought it gravitated into his event horizon by itself
15:12 mircea_popescu optionality follows wealth not will. this is a point young dicklets love to eschew, which is why violence is a societal requirement.
15:12 mircea_popescu asciilifeform variety is the mother of invention.
15:14 asciilifeform fwiw it isn't the 'cooked rat' that puts asciilifeform off the fest, but the '9 people in a bathroom'
15:14 asciilifeform i'd happily eat the rat in the forest, alone.
15:14 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#770 << this is a luxury. as all other luxuries, strictly reserved for the rich.
15:14 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [18:35:03] <phf> asciilifeform: sort of nobody cares if you're reach, but there's already been tension between people who are roughing it and people who are doing it in comfort.
15:14 mircea_popescu poor people don't get to not care i'm rich.
15:15 thestringpuller mircea_popescu: except in burn land you really don't...
15:15 mircea_popescu evidently, eh.
15:15 mircea_popescu "except my wife really doesn't" also.
15:15 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: eh you can club'em over the head, if can be bothered, but they won't quit trying to not care - why would they.
15:15 mircea_popescu i am not against their trying lol.
15:15 thestringpuller there are plenty of rich people who go to burns with open camps :P
15:16 mircea_popescu for the same money they could try to become a cat-dragon or w/e. try with all their might, they still don't get to.
15:16 thestringpuller except that isn't _the point_
15:16 mircea_popescu thestringpuller optionality follows wealth not will. rich people can do whatever they want. poorfags however - poorfag.
15:16 mircea_popescu you don't get to say what the point is once money walks in.
15:17 asciilifeform which is how usg has its own posh resort inside burningman.
15:17 mircea_popescu rather.
15:17 asciilifeform as per last year's thread.
15:17 mircea_popescu funny - they didn't burn THAT.
15:17 mircea_popescu ie, they're upset at the lucky crabs, not at the guy putting them all in the pot.
15:18 asciilifeform crab, i suspect, understands that he cannot constructively deal with the cook.
15:18 asciilifeform with other crabs - yes.
15:18 mircea_popescu define constructively. he's meat anyway.
15:18 asciilifeform whatever would make a difference.
15:18 mircea_popescu if were gonna pour water, could as well poured it there as here.
15:19 thestringpuller mircea_popescu: ideally a burn is based on willing participants following a set of principles i.e. decommodification. Traditionally this results in wealth being "non existent". But ideals and actuality are usually different.
15:19 mircea_popescu anyway. an inept, unskilled AND DISOBEDIENT populace. in the quaint words of the virgin mary, "holy shit dude"
15:19 mircea_popescu thestringpuller you're not serious, are you ?
15:20 thestringpuller in burn world I am. in this world yea it's not realistic.
15:22 asciilifeform now i gotta ask, would mircea_popescu bust into 'disneyland' to remind the childrenz that there aren't actually any such thing as friendly gigantic mice ?
15:22 mircea_popescu and this doesn't suggest anything to you ?
15:22 asciilifeform because as i understand 'burningman', it is a similar item
15:22 mircea_popescu asciilifeform not really ; why'd i bothar.
15:22 asciilifeform well why would you bother with 'burningman' ?
15:22 mircea_popescu but children and young adults are different populations. i only fuck the latter.
15:23 mircea_popescu so yes, if need be or fancy strikes, i will break through the delusions of interesting piece of meat.
15:23 asciilifeform so simple cunt harvest ?
15:24 mircea_popescu that i am one of the few (hopefully i'm not the only one!) who also bestows the gift of cognition in the process does not change the fact.
15:24 mircea_popescu asciilifeform what else could it conceivably be used for ? you gonna hire people for your sf start-up ?
15:25 asciilifeform i am at a loss re any other use.
15:25 mircea_popescu i suppose at a young age merely rubbing on a large aggregate of human bodies counts as a use.
15:25 phf fwiw, we're not talking about mp coming to the burn and fucking shit up
15:26 mircea_popescu but with time it becomes uninteresting, and then tedious.
15:26 mircea_popescu phf yeah i know, buncha fucktards on mom's credit card, elliot wanna-bes.
15:26 phf it's very much an act from cause place by design, and if mp comes as mp and does his mp thing, only people who will complain should and must be fucked with.
15:27 mircea_popescu yes yes. i have no intention to burn the burn.
15:28 mircea_popescu anyway, the problem is evidently that the few were afraid of the many ; and the many smelled this and fucked them. wealth isn't actually involved, tis a matter of fear.
15:28 phf bm has always been bezzle rich, it's the big party for jwzs, and the actual confrontation is between bezzle rich san francisco hippies who "get it" and bezzle rich new york preppies who want their van fulls of paid-for bored and disinterested supermodels
15:29 asciilifeform fwiw i can smell the jwz from a continent away, and have never felt much desire to go.
15:29 mircea_popescu aha
15:29 phf the core of the argument "if you bring your supermodel, she must be covered in alkaline dust by friday, otherwise she looks `too clean`"
15:30 mircea_popescu yeah right, because i'm going to fuck roadkill to pacify the natives now.
15:33 mircea_popescu asciilifeform at a young enough age though, it easily passes for "age specific idiocy" and you don't notice.
15:40 trinque thestringpuller: where the fuck is this "decommodification [sic]" in the ticket price of going, lol
15:40 trinque shouldn't it be free because wealth is bad?
15:40 trinque they don't get to apply the filter of cost and then deny it!
15:47 mircea_popescu aaand gossipd updated.
15:47 asciilifeform trinque: 'презренные деньги'
15:47 mircea_popescu trinque you mean you can't just drive there ?!
15:47 asciilifeform where's that 'translate' knob again.
15:47 mircea_popescu !~translate RU to EN презренные деньги
15:47 jhvh1 mircea_popescu: contemptible money
15:47 mircea_popescu almost!
15:47 asciilifeform it isn't a thing in english quite yet.
15:48 mircea_popescu damnable money!
15:48 PeterL dirty lucre?
15:48 asciilifeform hm. possibly.
15:49 mircea_popescu o hey ya not bad. filthy lucre
15:50 shinohai !~bash 12
15:50 jhvh1 Last 12 lines bashed and pending publication
15:51 * mircea_popescu is very happy he sat down to try and pin down that spec.
15:51 trinque mircea_popescu: nope. you have to buy a ticket to go to equality camp.
15:51 mircea_popescu it is turning into a thing of beauty.
15:51 mircea_popescu trinque so if i just walk in they... what ?
15:53 trinque dunno how or if they police it. I don't go.
15:53 trinque phf: ?
15:53 mircea_popescu speaking of which, i was recently invited at some "theatric performance" in a very nice old building here, i suppose the local best-effort equivalent of one of those ny things, artsy chicks daughters/wives of lawyers etc.
15:54 mircea_popescu we show up, it's like a locked door. but i happen to know the doorman, so he opens up and we go in, at which point girly wants... to see id.
15:55 mircea_popescu i tell her i dun have any ; she explains that... "it's not her rules". i turn around, ask guy to open door as we're leaving, they go frenzied on the phones, eventually girly is like "no problem, no problem".
15:55 mircea_popescu apparently - didn't need id anymoar. dem rules.
15:56 mircea_popescu we didn't stay anyway, i have a very short tolerance for pompous idiocy these days. but i imagine the whole "ticket to go to desert camp" must be very much the same thing. what, they got chicken wire around the perimeter and watchtowers ?
16:06 phf it's a very large and flat desert, there's no "just walking in" without being noticed. all they need to do is line of sight the perimeter more often than it'll take you to get to perimeter
16:09 mircea_popescu at night ? spotlights ?
16:09 phf yeah
16:09 mircea_popescu ahahaha really ?
16:09 phf aha :D
16:10 trinque even better
16:10 mircea_popescu how do they get power ?
16:10 mircea_popescu gensets for spotlights for to make sure gets $$$ from ustards ?
16:10 phf a moving object on such a flat space will light up with even most cursory of sweeps, so you can keep the whole concentration camp aspect under the radar
16:11 mircea_popescu what if you park your van right NEXT to their invisible fence, and start giving out free beer for tits ?
16:12 phf i think the way it works is that bmorg technically rents out the entire black rock desert, and then puts the festival somewhere in the center
16:12 mircea_popescu that this affair hasn't spontaneously degenerated into about 500 different, vaguely connected camps is testament to the sheer and amazing lack of testosterone in that population.
16:12 mircea_popescu ahahaha rents from whom ?
16:13 phf usg, as represented by bureau of land management
16:13 mircea_popescu and you'd better not say "us govt" because then i expect proper bidding yes ?
16:13 phf i suspect blm are the first one to get your
16:14 mircea_popescu so how much btc would it cost me to organize burning man instead of "bmorg" whatever the fuck that is.
16:14 phf ~~11500
16:15 mircea_popescu that this hasn't deteriorated into an endless battle of injunctions is even more shocking. bejewels, not even the lawyers work in the us anymore ?
↖
16:15 mircea_popescu almost worth it to do it and then exclude all black people.
16:15 mircea_popescu or what'd piss off the jwz crowd more, gays ?
16:17 phf i suspect nobody cares enough to bid on a desert at $7 million bezzles, what would be the appeal?
16:17 mircea_popescu what's worse, to outbid teh inspektion der konzentrationslager and then insult the ~11.5% slice or the ~2.5% slice ?
16:17 mircea_popescu phf you can put "no niggers" signs every 10 paces.
16:17 mircea_popescu what are you going to do with 7mn ? buy advertising ?
16:18 phf it's already the de facto rule. i think i saw maybe 5 black people in the whole 7 days. (one said that his nickname is "nerdy digger")
16:19 mircea_popescu yeah, gotta go with gays.
16:19 mircea_popescu or you know, not gays because chicks might not show up. how about transshitheads and people with disabilities.
16:19 mircea_popescu lose out on that whole "i want to fuck a quadriplegic" crowd.
16:26 asciilifeform it's a crowd?!
16:26 mircea_popescu i'm sure.
16:27 mircea_popescu asciilifeform you should prolly write a lighthouse thingamajig spec and ping trilema.
16:29 asciilifeform i'ma throw a very basic likbez into a comment, and possibly expand on it later.
16:34 phf "camp polyparadise"
16:39 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: posted.
16:42 Framedragger (heh nice nod to uk nuclear submarine policy asciilifeform)
16:46 deedbot http://trilema.com/2016/two-moon-junction/ << Trilema - Two Moon Junction
~ 17 minutes ~
17:03 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: last 4 comments add up to pretty much whole idea as i conceive it.
17:05 asciilifeform $up kenpat07
17:05 asciilifeform !!up kenpat07
17:05 deedbot kenpat07 voiced for 30 minutes.
17:07 phf $help
17:08 phf i guess the idea is that you do "$help" and all the bots harass you with pm's of what they can do?
17:10 asciilifeform aha.
17:10 asciilifeform hopefully it will normally suffice to search the log for the last time this was done
~ 19 minutes ~
17:29 trinque why do I need to see your command that results in PMs ?
17:30 trinque send the bot in question a "help" pm
17:30 asciilifeform which bot.
17:30 asciilifeform what if i want ~all~ ?
17:30 asciilifeform sum total of available commands.
17:30 shinohai asciilifeform: mine has page coming soon 9tm0
17:31 asciilifeform i like phf's scheme
17:31 asciilifeform $help and ALL the bots pm you.
17:32 shinohai You dont like individual help commands?
17:33 asciilifeform not if i have nfi where to send'em, shinohai
17:33 asciilifeform or if they consist of $!##$R#@#help, $$#$#$$help, etc.
17:33 asciilifeform that have to be fired individually.
17:34 shinohai I'm just following republic consensus accord to the laws of the bickening
17:34 asciilifeform alternatively i can print out a wall chart for myself once mircea_popescu is done randomly rearranging these...
17:35 trinque oh my god the bitching
17:36 trinque the prefixes were a good idea *because people's fucking bots wont stay up*
17:36 trinque and I can for example implement everything everyone else has over time and when theirs goes away, we shrug
17:36 asciilifeform trinque: for the sake of argument, it is possible to have 1 prefix that triggers, e.g., phf's bot if the latter is up, and Framedragger's if it is not, etc.
17:37 trinque I'm not adding a bunch of retarded state to my bot to be polite to phf's et al
17:37 asciilifeform fair'nuff
17:37 trinque would if freenode weren't a lying sack of hanno
17:38 trinque but it'll just mean later someone says to me "a111 was gone and deedbot silent, fuck you!"
17:38 trinque then later we're on gossipd and "online" doesn't mean anything
17:39 asciilifeform on gossipnet, 'online' means 'answers'.
17:39 asciilifeform just like, incidentally, on regular ne\t.
17:39 asciilifeform net.
17:39 shinohai pete_dushenski: !~help.bash
17:39 shinohai !~help.bash
↖
17:39 jhvh1 !~bash (x) will save the last number of chat lines specified. bashed content available @ http://bash.contravex.com/
17:41 trinque asciilifeform: so I have to mother-may-i to each other bot then
17:41 trinque lol, oh fuck we're about to concensus protocol!
17:41 * trinque runs away to drink
17:41 asciilifeform trinque: fortunately not.
17:42 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539978 << lulzily, 120+ and counting unique ip hits on my www with valid refer from the gossip page.
17:42 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 13:58 mircea_popescu: no, we're talking 17k different ips, plenty with garbled or no user agent, so you know. linked behind a password "protected" forum or w/e.
17:47 phf PeterL: search now case insensitive, but for english only. lmk if there are still issues. i kind of hacked it up by mapping A-Z to a-z during read. pretty sure last time i read the paper i had some elegant solution in mind, but it's been so long, i've forgotten what it was
17:49 phf proper unicode search (rather than octet matchin, the way it's doing it now) particularly with case-insensitivity takes like 40% performance hit.. so deferring on it for now
17:49 phf hmm, i'm thinking maybe "grep" search should stay case-sensitive..
17:49 phf asciilifeform: ^ ?
17:55 asciilifeform i regard case-sensitive search as ~useless.
17:55 asciilifeform but perhaps that's just me
17:57 ben_vulpes i'm with you
18:00 phf $s god
18:00 phf err
18:00 phf #% god
18:00 phf #!s god
18:00 phf !# god
18:00 phf !#s god
18:00 a111 2277 results for "god", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=god
18:00 ben_vulpes ^^ bash dat
18:01 trinque !~bash 8
18:01 jhvh1 Last 8 lines bashed and pending publication
18:01 trinque wow, how did I ever manage in one go
18:01 ben_vulpes lord almighty
18:02 trinque so hatch chiles, they're delicious
18:02 trinque chopped a bunch of them and went ahead and touched my eye
18:02 trinque like you do.
18:02 ben_vulpes touch your dick next
18:03 trinque done that one before too
18:04 asciilifeform !#s chemists wash
18:04 a111 0 results for "chemists wash", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=chemists%20wash
18:04 asciilifeform hm.
18:04 ben_vulpes so what's your escape...hatch?
18:04 trinque http://www.archaeologysouthwest.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/Hatch-chile-ristras.jpg << grocery stores overflowing with these right now
18:04 asciilifeform per al schwartz, 'biologists wash hands ~before~ toilet. chemists - ~after~. physicist - never needs wash'
18:04 trinque lol!
18:04 asciilifeform err, biologists after
18:05 asciilifeform chemists - before.
18:05 trinque brain autocorrected.
18:05 asciilifeform trinque is apparently a case of chemist who forgot-before
18:06 trinque where does putting hatch chile on my dick before sex fall in the prank to assault continuum?
18:07 mircea_popescu !!up kenpat06
18:07 deedbot kenpat06 voiced for 30 minutes.
18:08 ben_vulpes pete_dushenski: holy shit did you get a bouncer?
18:09 ben_vulpes i went to later you and your nick completed
18:09 ben_vulpes http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539737 << me too!
18:09 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 03:05 pete_dushenski is glad to see ben_vulpes blogging again
18:09 ben_vulpes pete_dushenski: in other portlandlulz: https://twitter.com/wheelergoogling
18:11 pete_dushenski ben_vulpes: i did, i taw a puddy tat!
18:12 ben_vulpes nice welcome
18:12 pete_dushenski my lines in channel are set to skyrocket
18:12 ben_vulpes moon?
18:12 pete_dushenski i think the doge took that one
18:13 * pete_dushenski goes to tweeter
18:13 ben_vulpes tweeeet on
18:13 pete_dushenski who is ted wheeler again ?
18:13 pete_dushenski !#s ted wheeler
18:13 a111 1 result for "ted wheeler", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=ted%20wheeler
18:14 ben_vulpes pdx insider baseball. twitter account in question is a good bit of "ted wheeler is a rich white out of touch dipshit" agitprop.
18:14 phf http://btcbase.org/log/2014-03-11#555189
18:14 a111 Logged on 2014-03-11 17:30 mike_c: wheeler & dealer
18:15 pete_dushenski aha. keepin it classy, libtards.
18:15 asciilifeform was pete_dushenski here for the gossipd mega-thread ?
18:16 pete_dushenski asciilifeform: bits and pieces. it's well over my paygrade.
18:16 pete_dushenski WHICH I'M NOT ASHAMED TO ADMIT UNLIKE SUOTS
18:17 pete_dushenski SUTOS*, simon kinahan in particular
18:18 asciilifeform who's that
18:18 pete_dushenski http://trilema.com/2016/superficial-ustardian-onanism-suto/#selection-205.0-207.2 <<
18:18 asciilifeform ah
18:19 pete_dushenski speaking of which, phf could a111 read out url titles ? or has mp nixed this function ?
18:20 pete_dushenski asciilifeform: anyways, why do you ask about the mega-thread ?
18:33 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#931 << no, more like /query bot then say help
18:33 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [21:08:38] <phf> i guess the idea is that you do "$help" and all the bots harass you with pm's of what they can do?
18:34 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#935 << word ; http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#937 << then you talk to all. there's no such usg.all as you use defined in this space.
18:34 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [21:30:19] <asciilifeform> what if i want ~all~ ?
18:34 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#943 << if you dunno where to send you should go read the logs instead. ha-ha! nothing to allcomers!
↖
18:34 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [21:33:04] <asciilifeform> not if i have nfi where to send'em, shinohai
18:35 pete_dushenski http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1539806 << http://bots.contravex.com updated
18:35 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 09:28 mircea_popescu: should have a proper list of commands rather than a few words description of what it does though.
18:36 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#949 << not just that ; but botmastering threatens to become a rite of passage. i'd much rather go from 1 to 2chars control seq now, when the inconvenience is mostly baseless bitching ; than in 18 months, when i actually run out of single chars and moving is the worst utter nightmare
18:36 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [21:36:00] <trinque> the prefixes were a good idea *because people's fucking bots wont stay up*
18:36 shinohai pete_dushenski: i like it
18:37 mircea_popescu pete_dushenski ok this is great.
18:38 pete_dushenski good to hear. por la republica!
18:39 mircea_popescu !topic
18:39 mircea_popescu nice.
18:39 trinque pete_dushenski: wd
18:39 mircea_popescu this is becoming quite well rounded huh.
18:39 pete_dushenski trinque: cheers
18:39 pete_dushenski mircea_popescu: that it is
18:40 phf pete_dushenski: i'm sure there's a whole bunch of people who'd want to implement url reading, i suspect it's first come first served
18:41 pete_dushenski it came to me not in a dream but just as i was falling asleep. i didn't write the 'bot directory' idea down because... same reason einstein didn't carry notebook
18:41 phf pete_dushenski: don't you have a bot running? maybe a way for you to reclaim that lordship ;)
18:41 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#952 << not to mention this is a bickening discussion. we'll have to SORT these in an order ? god help me, i'm not doing that.
18:41 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [21:37:23] <trinque> I'm not adding a bunch of retarded state to my bot to be polite to phf's et al
18:42 pete_dushenski phf: hehe i don't have a bot atm. though by xmas i'll be in better shape to take that on.
18:44 mircea_popescu phf first come hm ?
18:45 mircea_popescu oh the urls. hm.
18:45 mircea_popescu http://67.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmopt7Ldoc1qb9p9xo1_1280.jpg
↖ ↖
18:46 mircea_popescu i suspect we'll have no url readers ; with the exception that all logreaders may read the line in their own www.
↖
18:46 trinque the spaceman's wife?
18:47 mircea_popescu internet of things!
18:47 mircea_popescu comes alive at night and fucks your wife.
↖
18:47 trinque lol
18:47 mircea_popescu also gives her strange feet perspective.
18:48 BingoBoingo http://epmonthly.com/article/hold-oral-contrast/ << Lol, even less medical imaging studies for Hamplanets!
18:50 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#969 << i'm behind not even implementing unicode search.
18:50 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [21:49:09] <phf> proper unicode search (rather than octet matchin, the way it's doing it now) particularly with case-insensitivity takes like 40% performance hit.. so deferring on it for now
18:51 mircea_popescu i'm certainly against if it means significant performance degradation for proper alphabet searches.
18:52 mircea_popescu !#s dick
18:52 a111 703 results for "dick", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=dick
18:52 mircea_popescu !#s "dick"
18:52 a111 1153 results for "\"dick\"", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=%22dick%22
18:52 mircea_popescu !#s "dIcK"
18:52 a111 1155 results for "\"dIcK\"", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=%22dIcK%22
18:52 mircea_popescu !#s dIcK
18:52 a111 707 results for "dIcK", http://btcbase.org/log-search?q=dIcK
18:52 mircea_popescu hm.
18:52 mircea_popescu i guess.
18:53 phf later ones are picking up the searches themselves
18:54 mircea_popescu phf i know, i'm just thorn whether quoted should be case sensitive or not. aanyway, minor point.
18:54 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#993 << i had a very pleasantly mild red hot chilli in a stu last week. cut it in hand, above the pot as it was simmering. thought nothing of it, ate the stu, moved on with life. that night, i took a hot bath, and i drew the conclusion my hand had somehow gone frostbitten indoors.
18:54 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [22:04:15] <asciilifeform> !#s chemists wash
18:55 mircea_popescu because it felt EXACTLY like a very severe case.
18:55 mircea_popescu eventually girls figure out it's the chilli. crazy shit.
18:56 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#1004 << i'd say depends if you put it seed vein in or out.
18:56 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [22:06:45] <trinque> where does putting hatch chile on my dick before sex fall in the prank to assault continuum?
18:58 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1540748 << point
18:58 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 22:34 mircea_popescu: http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#943 << if you dunno where to send you should go read the logs instead. ha-ha! nothing to allcomers!
18:58 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [21:33:04] <asciilifeform> not if i have nfi where to send'em, shinohai
18:59 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1540772 << am i the only one who habitually #t's on boxes with no www browser ?
18:59 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 22:46 mircea_popescu: i suspect we'll have no url readers ; with the exception that all logreaders may read the line in their own www.
18:59 asciilifeform conversation where you have to click 1,001 times to know wtf was being answered, is not my idea of a good time.
19:00 mircea_popescu eh, let people curate their fucking links.
19:00 mircea_popescu or not put them in.
19:00 asciilifeform i was thinking of log links.
19:01 mircea_popescu they are always read by their respective bot
19:01 asciilifeform (rather than assbot-style randomola)
19:01 asciilifeform then ok.
19:01 mircea_popescu ben_vulpes pretty lulzy but some would benefit from a strategic misspelling or two.
19:01 mircea_popescu "how many vacation days does mayor of poortland get"
19:03 pete_dushenski http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1540670 << sweet.
19:03 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 21:39 shinohai: !~help.bash
19:04 shinohai i still got a few bugs to iron out, so patience is appreciated.
19:04 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#1058 << i finally grasp what you meant phf ; have a111 read links to btcbase.org ; scriba will read to log.mkj.lt and so on if further ones appear.
19:04 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [22:40:57] <phf> pete_dushenski: i'm sure there's a whole bunch of people who'd want to implement url reading, i suspect it's first come first served
19:04 mircea_popescu which is exactly as it works nao.
19:05 pete_dushenski shinohai: ofc
~ 20 minutes ~
19:25 * mircea_popescu actually took the trouble of specifying asciilifeform 's disorganised-six-comment-idea , lemme know if i fucked it up.
19:26 BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: http://qntra.net/2016/09/hillary-clintons-twin-legs-buckle-where-twin-towers-fell/#comment-70104
19:29 pete_dushenski BingoBoingo: she probably has the kind of pneu-monia typical of those with a, ahem, spare tire
19:29 pete_dushenski (lame french pun - pneu is tire en francais)
19:30 BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: At her age aspiration pneumonia is a concern. As a Clintion chemical induced pneumonia can not be dismissed either. Even a fungal Aspergillis infection is possible due to dope smoking.
19:30 pete_dushenski it's prolly also been a while (decades?) since hillary went for a jog or had a good shagging
19:37 BingoBoingo !!Up covertress
19:37 deedbot covertress voiced for 30 minutes.
19:39 BingoBoingo pete_dushenski: That's why I'd put a bet on aspiration pneumonia from inhaling food and beverages
19:43 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1540771 << dollars to doughnuts that was hans rickheit, my favourite living artist.
19:43 a111 Logged on 2016-09-12 22:45 mircea_popescu: http://67.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lmopt7Ldoc1qb9p9xo1_1280.jpg
19:43 asciilifeform known for, e.g., 'the squirrel machine'.
19:48 asciilifeform http://www.flickriver.com/photos/fantagraphics/sets/72157622162748846/ << excerpts.
19:50 asciilifeform i bet BingoBoingo would like subj.
19:54 * BingoBoingo may need to find that book
19:54 BingoBoingo brb
19:55 pete_dushenski bbl as well
19:55 asciilifeform BingoBoingo: it is sold wherever other children's picture b00kz are sold.
~ 34 minutes ~
20:29 mircea_popescu first!
20:29 mircea_popescu ahahaha.
20:33 mircea_popescu http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160912/#1127 << actually i think it's some chick by the name ingrid mouth
20:33 scriba Logged on 2016-09-12: [23:43:25] <asciilifeform> http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-12#1540771 << dollars to doughnuts that was hans rickheit, my favourite living artist.
~ 36 minutes ~
21:10 mircea_popescu asciilifeform ftr keccak is length-extension immune iirc.
21:13 hanbot http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160911/#220 << moar like retribution for that "elena" monstrosimovie, an exhilarating tale of beige and waiting.
21:13 scriba Logged on 2016-09-11: [14:50:25] * Framedragger wonders if it's the trilema-following bot army. will check
21:13 mircea_popescu lmao
21:19 hanbot http://log.mkj.lt/trilema/20160911/#226 << i updated it a week ago. possibly there are other guides floating around that still use $ ?
21:19 scriba Logged on 2016-09-11: [14:53:41] <mircea_popescu> hm i thought the wiki got updated.
~ 28 minutes ~
21:47 mircea_popescu a ok.
~ 25 minutes ~
22:13 shinohai o hey that reminds me eulora guide needs updating too
~ 18 minutes ~
22:31 asciilifeform sooooo it'd seem like we're pretty close to gossipd schematic
22:31 asciilifeform imho.
22:32 asciilifeform the kind that includes O(1) noise rejection AND repudiatronics.
22:32 asciilifeform ben_vulpes, trinque, Framedragger, et al ^
22:43 asciilifeform https://madfileformatscience.garymcgath.com/2016/09/08/libtiff-offline << in unrelated lulz:
22:43 asciilifeform 'The Libtiff library, which has been a reference implementation of TIFF for many years, has disappeared from the Internet. It was located at remotesensing.org, a domain whose owner apparently was willing to host it without having any close connection to the project. The domain fell into someone else’s hands, and the content changed completely, breaking all links to Libtiff material.'
22:43 asciilifeform 'For the moment, there’s no primary source for Libtiff on the Web.'
22:43 asciilifeform poor heathens.
22:53 * phf checks btcbase for canonical libtiff vpatch
22:53 phf waitaminute
~ 17 minutes ~
23:11 BingoBoingo !~ticker --market all --currency libtiff
23:11 jhvh1 BingoBoingo: Error: 'libtiff' is not a valid currency code.
23:11 ben_vulpes asciilifeform: does your trb node's memory usage grow unboundedly?
↖ ↖
23:11 ben_vulpes mircea_popescu, phf, mod6, trinque, shinohai, BingoBoingo, pete_dushenski etc
23:12 BingoBoingo ben_vulpes: mine holds rather steady between 1 and 1.1 GB, but different libc and other shit.
23:13 ben_vulpes i've been running this one for 9 days straight (previous box would OOM-kill the process every 2 days or so), and it's currently holding 3846M RES
23:13 ben_vulpes BingoBoingo: interdasting. and you never restart it?
23:14 BingoBoingo ben_vulpes: Restart every few weeks to back up blockchain. Is not trb, but other on Openbsd with trb shit bolted onto sides
23:14 ben_vulpes ah right. a 7.something iirc?
23:15 BingoBoingo ish
23:16 phf BingoBoingo: are you running the openbsd patch?
23:16 BingoBoingo phf: Nah, just some shit I chopped together drunk.
23:16 phf kk
23:17 BingoBoingo Still works so I work it.
23:17 mod6 ben_vulpes: my test node has ~4gb of ram, it usually hangs out around the same, ~3.5G of ram for bitcoin, then after like a month it ooms. then needs to be restarted.
23:21 asciilifeform http://btcbase.org/log/2016-09-13#1540863 << oddly enough, it does not. hovers around 3-4GB. which is i came to the fragging hypothesis.
23:21 a111 Logged on 2016-09-13 03:11 ben_vulpes: asciilifeform: does your trb node's memory usage grow unboundedly?
23:21 asciilifeform fwiw neither zoolag nor dulap have ever oom'd.
23:21 asciilifeform *how i came to the
23:22 mod6 huh, well, that's good to hear tho.
23:22 ben_vulpes asciilifeform: any recollection of how quickly it approaches that upper bound?
23:22 asciilifeform week or so.
23:22 ben_vulpes sounds similar to what i'm seeing over here.
23:22 asciilifeform possibly because same proggy, lol
23:24 asciilifeform btw i proved last year that the in-memory block index ~does~ grow unboundedly, but very slowly.
23:25 asciilifeform ( see july 2015 mailinglist )
23:25 ben_vulpes you apparently have more faith in cpp proggy determinism in memory use than i
23:26 asciilifeform well given as ben_vulpes was likely connecting to my boxes, he is seeing a quite similar mempool landscape to mine.
23:34 ben_vulpes i haven't leveled the aws banhammer, so my node's likely collecting all sorts of hilarious crud that yours isn't
23:40 BingoBoingo Oh, news from near ben_vulpes land http://www.jameslafond.com/article.php?id=5220
23:41 BingoBoingo !~later tell thestringpuller you have been slacking on blogging for a whole month
23:41 jhvh1 BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
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