Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2016-02-28 | 2016-03-01 → ↓
00:50 mircea_popescu and in other news, http://41.media.tumblr.com/3df1b14e966c727a62ef37f7b04ab97f/tumblr_meo8gnZO971qcl6pmo1_1280.jpg
00:50 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/215mkFb )
00:56 * BingoBoingo relishes in that feeing of power that follows one's presence ending a turf war.
00:58 BingoBoingo the turf, one well lit front yard. The combatants a vocal orange neighborhood cat and a fox
00:59 BingoBoingo I go out front to see what the fuss is and the cat shoots out of the tree and under a car while the fox shoots off into a the park
01:01 phf BingoBoingo sets own yard on fire to settle a long running dispute between cat and fox in favor of man
01:02 BingoBoingo Nah, just smoke a cigarette and pissed on some bushes
01:04 BingoBoingo They gotta understand that when man can mark territory with their weight in piss it is man's world.
01:05 phf i'm always reminded of that movie where i guy was living among wolves, every morning he'd drink a lot of coffee and make rounds
01:06 BingoBoingo Well coffee helps when keeping up with all the rest of nature
01:21 punkman https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CcWsxw8UMAAI2El.jpg:large
01:21 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1pjL2pr )
01:22 phf that evokes images of a decisive cup, rationed coffee as a boost for man's will in harsh conditions. most of the coffee experience i'm surrounded with is not like that at all. office workers on a litre a day, hipsters with artisanal pourovers, three jobs just to keep up crowd on a dunken donuts extra large. not much keeping up with nature
01:22 mircea_popescu you should see the coffee here.
01:24 BingoBoingo Wait, you don't drink it all by the pot?
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01:24 mircea_popescu nah, i drink a pot of coffee in like a month
01:24 phf http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2011/images/08/04/t1larg.business.coffee.jpg
01:24 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1pjLkwG )
01:28 phf i don't mind the idea, but, if you need this much coffee, why not just take amphetamines?
01:31 BingoBoingo phf: Because that would be bad for my sobriety
01:33 phf i thought aa mostly object to other substances only as much as they trigger alcohol abuse. unless you have a history of mixing alcohol and speed, there shouldn't be any crossover
01:35 BingoBoingo How would I know if I did have a history of that?
01:35 phf some good parties you go to
01:37 phf it was mostly a rhetorical question, i just think that once you cross certain line with a substance, perhaps it's worthwhile to try something different. but since coffee guzzling is mostly done from lack of attention, perhaps it's not a good idea
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01:38 BingoBoingo Well, supposedly coffee is good for the liver
01:40 phf in a correlation/causation world of pop medicine here's ten things that you need to know about new use for an old drug that's all the rage
01:41 BingoBoingo Well, the mechanics make sense
01:47 phf so does any other arbitrary chain of biochemical events that some team somewhere decides to investigate. it's the mutual interaction of those events that makes the entire system not amenable to reasoning
01:49 phf throw in statistical ranges and often shoddy studies and you might as well go quoting ayurvedic doctors
01:53 mircea_popescu well nobody seriously wants to contemplate that hey, 19 haplogroups, 100+ subgroups each, subgroups of subgroups, and serious test of "is coffee good or bad" needs 1mn+ subjects
01:54 * mircea_popescu is vaguely bracing himself for discovery that tobacco essential for healthy, cca 2050 or so
01:59 BingoBoingo Well, grandpa did smoke into his late 60's to early 70's
02:00 phf from the study of dynamic systems, "researches put more wood on kindling, create big fire. more wood is good for fire!" "researches put more wood on massive fire, fire suffocates. less wood is good for fire!"
02:06 * BingoBoingo wonders what could be so harmful about drinking less coffee con a daily basis than I often did vodka
02:08 mircea_popescu !up b6
02:09 mircea_popescu BingoBoingo lol so apparently r/btc moderator turned out to be con man, took donations to hash, kept donations since classic doomed anyway.
02:10 * BingoBoingo not surprised
02:11 * BingoBoingo not sure if news
02:12 mircea_popescu kinda so-so.
02:12 mircea_popescu notrly. more like a logline at best.
02:12 phf BingoBoingo: oh i wasn't saying it's harmful, i was saying that when coffee stops working, perhaps it's time to take amphetamines, since it's a cleaner and longer productive high. of course with a history of substance abuse of any kind it is perhaps not a good idea (same people who drink coffee by the litre, start eating amphetamines, etc.)
02:12 phf but i'm going to drop the subject, i'm being tedious and i need to pass out anyway
02:12 mircea_popescu phf amphetamines are not a good idea in any case.
02:12 BingoBoingo Eh, coffee still works
02:13 mircea_popescu contrary to a whole lot of gargle, the list of +ev usage is ~empty.
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02:13 b6 Oh my, i have voice
02:13 mircea_popescu so you do. who're you ?
02:14 b6 Just someone interested in bitcoins, and related interests.
02:14 mircea_popescu aha.
02:14 b6 Found you guys in a weird way, not gunna lie.
02:14 b6 Through the most recent f2pool ddos, to be exact.
02:15 ben_vulpes how through a ddos did you get here?
02:16 ben_vulpes b6: ^^
02:16 mircea_popescu how through an english did you speak that
02:18 b6 Icebreaker was claiming something about coming from La serenissima
02:18 b6 Googled that, found MP's article, googles them, found this channel
02:19 ben_vulpes mircea_popescu: gutter cascadian lingo
02:19 ben_vulpes straight from the streets yo
02:20 ben_vulpes homie
02:20 phf all dat dank ass portland weed
02:21 ben_vulpes b6: what is an icebreaker?
02:22 ben_vulpes phf: i humbly bring lolz: http://www.everetthousehealingcenter.com/
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02:22 assbot Everett House Healing Center ... ( http://bit.ly/21uRprj )
02:25 b6 The guy on BTC-T claiming he shut down f2pool this week
02:25 b6 In response to them allowing miners to use classic
02:37 mircea_popescu and what's btc-t ?
02:37 mircea_popescu anyway b6 make yourself a key get in teh wot.
02:49 BingoBoingo !up eth2
02:50 eth2 ohai
02:50 BingoBoingo hai thur
02:50 eth2 i guess you've had quite a lot of visitors today haha
02:50 eth2 them logfiles
02:51 BingoBoingo it happens
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04:12 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11700 @ 0.00057919 = 6.7765 BTC [+] {2}
04:19 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49305 @ 0.00058034 = 28.6137 BTC [+]
04:23 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57850 @ 0.00058034 = 33.5727 BTC [+]
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05:15 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54078 @ 0.00058165 = 31.4545 BTC [+] {3}
05:16 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8622 @ 0.00058345 = 5.0305 BTC [+]
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06:02 assbot [MPEX] [FT] [X.EUR] 698 @ 0.00261992 = 1.8287 BTC [-] {10}
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06:37 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20200 @ 0.00058301 = 11.7768 BTC [-]
06:38 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 65016 @ 0.00058612 = 38.1072 BTC [+] {4}
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07:43 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25283 @ 0.00057919 = 14.6437 BTC [-] {2}
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07:59 asciilifeform 'Even without adding D-Bus to the default runlevel it often will get started by D-Bus dependent services. This should explain why D-Bus mysteriously gets started even though it has not been added formally added to a system runlevel.'
07:59 asciilifeform (gentoo docs)
07:59 asciilifeform and apparently emacs will no longer build without it.
08:01 asciilifeform https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-992146.html << fascinating read
08:01 assbot Gentoo Forums :: View topic - Uninstalling dbus and *kits (to Unfacilitate Remote Seats) ... ( http://bit.ly/1QQ8p6l )
08:02 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48100 @ 0.00058648 = 28.2097 BTC [+] {2}
08:02 asciilifeform by the author of https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-p-7558880.html#7558880
08:02 assbot Gentoo Forums :: View topic - Air-Gapped Gentoo Install, Tentative ... ( http://bit.ly/1QQ8rv1 )
08:13 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11375 @ 0.0005892 = 6.7022 BTC [+] {4}
08:25 punkman interesting stuff asciilifeform
08:28 punkman "basically, Grsecurity fixes what Linus leaves open and unprotected for whichever reason in the GNU/Linux kernel, and that seems to annoy the genius very much... It's a real though subdued war out there, and Grsecurity had a moment of mild failure for a few days, exactly after a major contribution by, wait, wait!... by the Dear Leader himself..."
08:30 asciilifeform http://www.croatiafidelis.hr << herr rovis himself.
08:30 assbot Udruga Croatia Fidelis ... ( http://bit.ly/1QQ9drP )
08:31 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: can you get him in here somehow ??
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08:32 asciilifeform 'Somebody seems to have been joking with portage, and not in a nice way (maybe they aim at hurting the feelings of some pizza delivery guy, because that's not illegal like hurting animals)... '
08:33 asciilifeform 'Most of those are conditional dependencies (useflag ? ...), and I checked and all of those with dbus ? sys-apps/dbus) have -dbus or no dbus at all in the output of emerge -p. But if I try and check dependencies on those that do depend on dbus...: ...it appears that if gtk+ with useflag X can't work without accessibility/at-spi2-atk ...'
08:33 asciilifeform '... why should, say, Emacs depend on dbus? '
08:35 asciilifeform 'Do I really have to be forced to use accessibility if I want just the gtk gui? I don't have the time needed to learn to modify ebuild, and keep a separate overlay... I want to use Gentoo, not keep building it forever. Do I really have to accomodate for remote seat to be able to use Gentoo? '
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08:35 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 171400 @ 0.0005796 = 99.3434 BTC [-] {6}
08:36 asciilifeform gold from the commentz:
08:36 asciilifeform 'Launching Tor Browser Bundle for Linux in /tmp/tor-browser_en-US XPCOMGlueLoad error for file /tmp/tor-browser_en-US/Browser/libxul.so: libdbus-glib-1.so.2: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory'
08:36 asciilifeform ^ 'tor browser' eats dbus
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08:38 asciilifeform rovis reminds me more than ANYONE of dragos ruiu.
08:39 asciilifeform but there are really not so many folks soldiering on to keep the last usable linux quasi-alive.
08:39 asciilifeform 'go to war with the army you have.'
08:42 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418055 >>>>> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=10-02-2016#1402410
08:42 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 07:22:50; ben_vulpes: phf: i humbly bring lolz: http://www.everetthousehealingcenter.com/
08:42 assbot Logged on 10-02-2016 20:28:39; asciilifeform: or everett's solution !
08:43 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418017 << there are devil knows how many people who would be on dope if they had any way of getting to it.
08:43 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 06:37:37; phf: it was mostly a rhetorical question, i just think that once you cross certain line with a substance, perhaps it's worthwhile to try something different. but since coffee guzzling is mostly done from lack of attention, perhaps it's not a good idea
08:45 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418038 << does mircea_popescu remember the sleep ad libitum thread ?
08:45 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 07:13:02; mircea_popescu: contrary to a whole lot of gargle, the list of +ev usage is ~empty.
08:45 asciilifeform yes, it is better to sleep ad libitum, and wash yourself in the morning with fresh virgin tears and panda milk.
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08:46 asciilifeform than to take dope.
08:46 asciilifeform and works best on a dirigible, also.
08:48 asciilifeform caffeine etc. users are not typically faced with a mircea_popescutronic choice of 'should i dope or should i sleep how much i want and bathe in virgin tears.' more often, it is a 'i WILL get 4 hrs. of sleep and there is nothing to be done about it. will it be 4 hr and then i fall asleep at my desk and get sacked or 4 hr of being reasonably awake.'
08:48 asciilifeform *4 hr and
08:50 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-08-2014#808005 << related thread.
08:50 assbot Logged on 25-08-2014 03:08:03; asciilifeform: busy as a bee << funny that they show an idiot sow scrubbing, and not, e.g, paul erdos crapping out theorems
08:51 * asciilifeform bbl
~ 43 minutes ~
09:34 trinque wtf happened to freenode this weekend?
09:35 trinque deedbot- was connecting to adam.freenode.net successfully, then never appearing here.
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09:35 trinque switched to the chat.freenode.net rotation, joins.
09:36 trinque https://freenode.net/ << "Making freenode great again..." lolwut
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09:36 assbot freenode - supporting free and open source communities since 1998! ... ( http://bit.ly/1T45tDn )
09:44 PeterL trinque: I wonder if we ever get gossipd to replace freenode, will we still have these sorts of connection problems?
09:46 mircea_popescu not globally.
10:01 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418119 << quite psychanalizable, ftr. notice the spurt of "make x great again" ever since 2015 or so.
10:01 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 14:36:29; trinque: https://freenode.net/ << "Making freenode great again..." lolwut
10:01 mircea_popescu meanwhile, water infrastructure has decayed to the point nobody involved EVNE KNOWS you can't drink from lake then switch to river
10:01 mircea_popescu and new york has been failing to maintain it's nuclear power plants.
10:02 mircea_popescu think about it - by the time a nuclear plant starts crying out for lack of maintenance, how badly maintained was everything else ?
10:02 mircea_popescu and for how long ?
10:02 PeterL It wasn't clear in the story, is the nuclear problem in New York leaking into their water system and poisoning everybody?
10:03 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418089 << how lol.
10:03 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 13:31:04; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: can you get him in here somehow ??
10:03 mircea_popescu PeterL no, the water thing is re michigan.
10:04 PeterL yeah, I know about MI water, but NY is leaking into their river, are they taking river water into their drinking water?
10:04 mircea_popescu kakobrekla jurov either of you doing on the side the gfs of any croatian nazi leader doods ? that might know this guy ? lol.
10:04 mircea_popescu PeterL you are aware NOBODY KNOWS what ny water does, not anymore. shit in there that hasn't been touched in 50+ years.
10:04 jurov doing what?
10:05 mircea_popescu it's "unmaintainable" ie, unmaintained. once it goes, it goes. start trucking water bottles for 5mn people.
10:05 mircea_popescu jurov "doing on the side" means, fucking, as an extra, other than current relationship.
10:05 jurov there's a nzi leader in slovakia but im not doing his bfs
10:05 PeterL I guess my question is: where does NY city pull it's drinking water from? Is it at all connected to the Hudson River?
10:06 mircea_popescu i do not believe anyone alive today can answer this question cogently.
10:06 PeterL millions of people live in new york, and they all just assume somebody else is keeping their stuff running for them
10:07 PeterL world would be better off if they all get sick and die
10:08 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418093 << accessibility , for the record, is another dns/ntp/font bs.
10:08 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 13:35:07; asciilifeform: 'Do I really have to be forced to use accessibility if I want just the gtk gui? I don't have the time needed to learn to modify ebuild, and keep a separate overlay... I want to use Gentoo, not keep building it forever. Do I really have to accomodate for remote seat to be able to use Gentoo? '
10:08 thestringpuller PeterL: prob why they used to make a lot of escape from new york movies.
10:08 mircea_popescu PeterL no argument there.
10:09 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418097 << doh.
10:09 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 13:36:35; asciilifeform: ^ 'tor browser' eats dbus
10:10 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418108 << sfyl.
10:10 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 13:45:59; asciilifeform: yes, it is better to sleep ad libitum, and wash yourself in the morning with fresh virgin tears and panda milk.
10:11 thestringpuller 5k more blocks on node
10:11 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418117 << they have to put in some emergency patches once people here have started blocking dns autoresolution.
10:11 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 14:35:18; trinque: deedbot- was connecting to adam.freenode.net successfully, then never appearing here.
10:11 mircea_popescu sorry, should have announced trilema article in advance for cia/nsa/blablabla.
10:12 mircea_popescu i must have misplaced my copy of the agreement.
10:14 PeterL in other news, my trb node (syncing since January) is now up to July 2014
~ 20 minutes ~
10:35 mircea_popescu nb.
10:48 deedbot- [serialized delusions] Embedded Common Lisp for Eulora - http://explo.yt/post/2016/02/29/Embedded-Common-Lisp-for-Eulora
10:51 jurov ;;later tell fghj ^
10:51 gribble The operation succeeded.
10:51 deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 5.00000000 BTC on 'Yes' - Donald Trump will win the 2016 United States Presidential Election - http://bitbet.us/bet/1250/donald-trump-will-win-the-2016-united-states/#b1
10:54 phf i think emacs has dbus support to do fluff like message notification, last time i built it on linux it built without dbus just fine, but i prefer xlib/athena widgets (i know ascii hates them), since i basically disable menu/scrollbar/etc. not sure if maybe gtk widgets now have dbus hardwired
10:54 phf of course fact that emacs supports dbus but not a generic ffi goes back to thread about rms and wreckers
11:02 asciilifeform not simply 'supports'.
11:02 asciilifeform pulls in.
11:03 asciilifeform i am seriously fucking pissed
11:03 asciilifeform because, among other things, i mistakenly blamed openbsd for this.
11:04 phf you mean in gentoo parlance? an emacs ebuild doesn't respect -dbus flag, and pulls it unconditionally?
11:04 asciilifeform aha.
11:07 asciilifeform https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-gnu-emacs/2012-08/msg00014.html << the rot goes way back.
11:07 assbot bug#12112: 24.1.50; Starting emacs without dbus ... ( http://bit.ly/1LPVHwN )
11:14 asciilifeform http://changelog.complete.org/archives/9317-has-linux-lost-its-way-comments-prompt-a-debian-developer-to-revisit-freebsd-after-20-years << in other nyooz.
11:14 assbot “Has Linux lost its way?” comments prompt a Debian developer to revisit FreeBSD after 20 years | The Changelog ... ( http://bit.ly/1LPWGNH )
11:14 asciilifeform well, oldz
11:14 asciilifeform or nm, i think this is in the logz.
11:16 asciilifeform http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=108616&start=60#p577538 << far more interesting.
11:16 assbot Debian User Forums • View topic - Grsecurity/Pax installation on Debian GNU/Linux ... ( http://bit.ly/24x4gZ4 )
11:16 asciilifeform ^ moar rovis
11:19 asciilifeform ;;google "emacs without dbus"
11:19 gribble Re: Emacs insists on starting dbus? - Lists - GNU: <https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2012-07/msg00715.html>; Re: Emacs insists on starting dbus? - Lists - GNU: <https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2012-07/msg00687.html>; bug#12112: 24.1.50; Starting emacs without dbus - Lists - GNU: <https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-gnu-emacs/2012-08/msg00014.html>
11:28 deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.00000000 BTC on 'No' - Donald Trump will win the 2016 United States Presidential Election - http://bitbet.us/bet/1250/donald-trump-will-win-the-2016-united-states/#b4
11:39 phf tuomo valkonen has been ranting about that stuff back in 2005 or so
11:39 phf "why is this freedesktop shit being compiled in with no way of disabling it"
11:41 phf his (and mine) pet peve at the time was mandatory freetype (i think that linux's dodgy hinting and antialiasing are worse then running it aliased and at the time i wanted bitmap fonts everywhere)
11:43 phf not to mention that freetype pulls in the whole dodgy freedesktop stack. why do i need 5 different libraries to support arabic ligatures?
11:43 mircea_popescu heh
11:44 mircea_popescu you don't understand universalism.
11:44 mircea_popescu the reasoning goes, that if arabs have no way of knowing they're arabs, such as for instance if the use of THEIR script happens transparently everywhere, then they won't be able to maintain a sense of nationality and consequently jena bush's tush will remain unmolested.
11:45 phf https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmpMO2dJQ6Q
11:45 assbot Barney - I Love You (Extended Play 15 times back-to-back!!) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1RfEi2m )
11:45 phf ^
11:46 mircea_popescu this of course means you must support arabic ligature in your kkkapp made specifically to scrawl white supremacist nonsense on virtual toilets in gta4.
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11:47 mircea_popescu but it also means you needn't worry about it - as a consumer, it'll just be done for you, automagically!
11:47 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45397 @ 0.00059164 = 26.8587 BTC [+] {2}
11:48 mircea_popescu and to take the discussion up a coupla levels of abstraction : this is not a technical problem in any sense. in fact, the only thing that a classification of problems into technical and otherwise says is that ~the classifier~ is broken in the head.
11:48 mircea_popescu or if you prefer, poorly socialised. still entertains the delusion that he'll make a nice woman out of marble and invent a lock that'll keep rats out of his granary.
11:51 mircea_popescu !up deupork
11:55 asciilifeform so at this point i'm satisfied that rms either 1) does not actually use an x60 machine with 'libreboot' ~~or~~ does not program.
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12:05 mircea_popescu all he does is prepare conference slides. for 20+ yearsn ow
12:06 asciilifeform proving that it is eminently possible to be eaten alive by fungus ~without~ working directly for usg.
12:06 asciilifeform fungus is available to all.
12:07 mircea_popescu ie, old age ?
12:07 asciilifeform not only.
12:07 asciilifeform (rms was, what, 40, 20 yrs ago ?)
12:08 asciilifeform my current understanding is that he didn't really psychologically weather the hurd thing.
12:09 mircea_popescu what thng again ?
12:09 asciilifeform he had a thing that was supposed to be what linux was
12:09 mircea_popescu oh
12:09 asciilifeform called gnu hurd
12:09 mircea_popescu hm
12:09 asciilifeform for various reasons, rms et al were unable to produce a usable kernel.
12:10 asciilifeform then linus appeared, and did
12:10 asciilifeform and 'stole' the gnu userland, to go with it
12:10 mircea_popescu aha.
12:11 mircea_popescu various reasons = being flaming imbeciles with no inclination towards work
12:11 mircea_popescu he basically saw himself as a sort of jimbo wales. except forgot the part where tardpedia can contain anything, epistula non erubiscit, but the compiler doth complain.
12:11 asciilifeform as i recall, the original plan was to use some bsd variant
12:11 mircea_popescu and if a community vote is held to silence the complaints for racist and whatrever,
12:11 asciilifeform and rms wrote, later, that not doing this was a catastrophic mistake
12:11 mircea_popescu the system just hangs.
12:12 asciilifeform instead, he went with 'mach', which was owned by - iirc - CMU, and stuck in legal limbo
12:12 asciilifeform and while the latter hashed out, the project withered.
12:12 asciilifeform so no, this was not a pediwikian sort of catastrophe, but worse.
12:12 mircea_popescu environment not yet ripe for "fuck you - breaking the law by license!" alexandrine solution
12:12 asciilifeform aha.
12:12 mircea_popescu it being the 80s and shit.
12:13 asciilifeform it was the '80s, and the man was 'dependently wealthy.'
12:14 asciilifeform (rms won some sort of prize for gcc, but it was only enough for a few yrs, apparently, and parasites helped to eat it faster)
12:14 asciilifeform i do not know where it went, but afaik he still lives in a repurposed closet at mit.
12:15 mircea_popescu afaik.
12:15 mircea_popescu "being flaming imbeciles with no inclination towards work".
12:18 punkman relevant http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=24-01-2016#1384117
12:18 assbot Logged on 24-01-2016 12:42:16; punkman: http://www.softpanorama.org/People/Stallman/history_of_gcc_development.shtml
12:19 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: i don't see the 'no inclination towards work' thing
12:20 asciilifeform rms was working on catastrophically broken priors, but worked.
12:22 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60450 @ 0.00059164 = 35.7646 BTC [+]
12:23 asciilifeform interesting, from punkman's link:
12:23 asciilifeform 'Even when the SC is asked to decide something, they never go to RMS when they can help it, because he's so unaware of modern real-world technical issues and the bigger picture. It's far, far better to continue postponing a question than to ask it, when RMS is involved, because he will make a snap decision based on his own bizarre technical ideas, and then never change his mind in time for th
12:23 asciilifeform He can be convinced. Eventually. It took the SC over a year to explain and demonstrate that Java bytecode could not easily be used to subvert the GPL, therefore permitting GCJ to be checked in to the official repository was okay. I'm sure that someday we'll be using C++ in core code. Just not anytime soon.'
12:23 asciilifeform e new decision to be worth anything.
12:23 asciilifeform ^ rms when seen from the gnome pit
12:24 asciilifeform stung from all sides by vermin who want him to 'get with the times', is it any wonder rms turned to stone ?
12:24 asciilifeform 'real-world technical issues and the bigger picture.'
12:24 asciilifeform 'his own bizarre technical ideas'.
12:25 mircea_popescu asciilifeform how does a man work who can't support himself ?
12:25 punkman ah there'[s more http://www.softpanorama.org/People/Stallman/index.shtml
12:25 assbot Richard Stallman ... ( http://bit.ly/1UupnXv )
12:26 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: how does prisoner in butugychag work ?
12:26 mircea_popescu masturbation is not work.
12:26 mircea_popescu asciilifeform with the axe.
12:26 asciilifeform it is when you're masturbating ~someone else~
12:27 mircea_popescu mno.
12:27 asciilifeform at gunpoint
12:27 punkman http://www.softpanorama.org/People/Stallman/philosopher.shtml#Lab%20Dweller
12:27 assbot Part I. Philosopher ... ( http://bit.ly/1Uupylz )
12:27 punkman "Here at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, he has made his home - literally, sleeping for 13 years on a narrow cot in a cubbyhole that resembles a nest, littered with candy wrappers, food containers, papers and magazines. Garbage tumbles off every surface, piles up in corners, allowing only a narrow track through which to navigate a life."
12:28 mircea_popescu also, the proper quote is "modern real-world technical issues and the bigger picture". gotta get that MODERN in there, it is a key element of the belief system of idiots that the problems they encounter are novel.
12:28 asciilifeform http://www.softpanorama.org/People/Stallman/prophet.shtml#An attempt of hostile takeover of glib << l0l drepper gold
12:28 assbot Part IV. Stallman as a Prophet ... ( http://bit.ly/1VNbn9V )
12:28 asciilifeform pretty sure this was in the logz at some point
12:28 mircea_popescu wtf is with all these urls with spaces in them
12:28 asciilifeform 'Stallman recently tried what I would call a hostile takeover of the glibc development. He tried to conspire behind my back and persuade the other main developers to take control so that in the end he is in control and can dictate whatever pleases him. This attempt failed ... '
12:28 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: nfi
12:29 mircea_popescu asciilifeform this was in the log.
12:29 asciilifeform yeah iirc.
12:30 phf is that drepper quote?
12:30 mircea_popescu yeah.
12:30 phf back against the wall
12:30 mircea_popescu anyway, the ridiculousness of form aside, i can readily see the twin point that rms is catastrophically blind and strategically worthless.
12:30 mircea_popescu enough illustration - he went to fucking glbse conference.
12:31 trinque rms strikes me as a few rounds of imitation back from poettering and that ethereum kid
12:31 asciilifeform srsly?
12:31 mircea_popescu yes srsly.
12:31 asciilifeform glbse?!
12:31 mircea_popescu !s from:nefario stallman
12:31 assbot 0 results for 'from:nefario stallman' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=from%3Anefario+stallman
12:31 mircea_popescu pff
12:31 asciilifeform 'In 1990, the John D. and Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation granted Stallman a MacArthur fellowship. The grant, a $240,000 which is more then $500K in 2000 dollars provided Stallman with a source of income and health insurance for five years. That made it less necessary to do consulting work to support himself. Although RMS now can devote more time to the writing GNU software, but actually h
12:31 trinque playing the role of slovenly hacker guy who chews his toenails
12:32 asciilifeform e was almost 40 and his best years as a programmer were in the past. Programming is a young men game and such grants usually are a clear signs of a starting decay.
12:32 asciilifeform 'Unpleasant surprises followed. As leader of the GNU Project, Stallman experienced the first fork of Emacs in 1991. As we will see below by 1993, the GNU Project's completely lost the initiative due to an inability to deliver a working POSIX kernel. In March, 1993, a Wired magazine article by Simson Garfinkel described the GNU Project as "bogged down". GCC fork occurred a several years late
12:32 asciilifeform r (1997) and was the last straw... '
12:32 trinque same as any other chief scientist or wannabe religious nut leader
12:32 asciilifeform nobody lives forever.
12:33 asciilifeform some folks just spend longer time walking around as a zombie before burial, than others.
12:33 mircea_popescu http://dpaste.com/0H4QRZ4.txt << flavour of history, sep 2013.
12:33 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1VNbQc1 )
12:34 asciilifeform so we're taking nefario's word for it ?
12:34 mircea_popescu the guy was actually there.
12:37 phf https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pube5Aynsls
12:37 assbot Soulja Boy dance, MIT style - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1VNc7fe )
12:37 mircea_popescu to put this in proper perspective : "genjix" is the garbage-eating, underage-cousin-pimping, imbecile on a stick amir taaki.
12:37 mircea_popescu stallman has reduced himself to the position where street urchins are pulling the "i'm paying you, stand up to attention" trick on him
12:37 mircea_popescu in 2013.
12:38 kakobrekla afaik it wasnt 'glbse conference' per se, however nefario had a talk there as well as stallman. https://sites.google.com/a/bitcoin2012.com/homepage/speakers / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FN6Q--zqroM / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmPD_YSQ--k
12:38 assbot Speakers - Bitcoin Conference London 15-16 September 2012 ... ( http://bit.ly/1VNcd6D )
12:38 assbot Bitcoin 2012 London: Richard Stallman - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1VNcdmT )
12:38 assbot Nefario - Bitcoin capital markets - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1VNcdmX )
12:38 mircea_popescu and i do mean street urchins quite literally, the sort of mostly-nude eastern flesh that'd follow europeans begging for candy, either as a freebie or in trade for butthole.
12:39 mircea_popescu kakobrekla tell you what, if maddof has a talk there as well as obama, it'll be the ponzi conference.
12:39 asciilifeform public toilet is, well, public
12:39 mircea_popescu not how this works.
12:39 mircea_popescu you have to BUY A LICENSE to run a public house and be protected by this "publichouse" theory.
12:40 mircea_popescu and i sold them no such license.
12:40 asciilifeform rms, as i understand, goes to all kinds of crud ('phreeee palestine!1111') to play at relevancy
12:40 asciilifeform *relevance
12:40 phf well, it's an opportunity for him to get his talking points in
12:40 asciilifeform some intern, likely, told him a five minute spiel re: bitcoin
12:41 mircea_popescu well, it's an opportunity for him to make nice for 500 bux.
12:41 asciilifeform and he looked up 'bitcoin conference' and went.
12:41 mircea_popescu but, back to the original point : catastrophic blindness and strategic worthlessness. the embodiment thereof, this is it.
12:51 kakobrekla rms was on nefarios conference as much as nefario was on rms conference
12:52 asciilifeform ^
12:52 asciilifeform but i suspect that mircea_popescu is operating on the 'spoon of shit in barrel of wine' theorem
12:52 kakobrekla aha
12:52 asciilifeform but did rms even know that he was bathing in shit ?
12:55 kakobrekla if i had to guess mps argument here; 'shit doesnt know/care about itself bathing in shit, only actual person does'
12:59 mircea_popescu well no, actually, it's moreover related to
12:59 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=26-02-2016#1416038
12:59 assbot Logged on 26-02-2016 14:55:06; mircea_popescu: everything is on the exam. including stuff from the future.
12:59 mircea_popescu oh, he "didn't know" what was in front of him ? that's the definition of blindness. and he didn't know WHAT WAS GOING TO HAPPEN ?
12:59 mircea_popescu well wtf, i get the same results from my dog. i don't make the dog a strategist. FOR THIS REASON.
13:00 mircea_popescu if dog could see future, dog would also be general.
13:00 asciilifeform actually rms is the most consistently and accurately long-term doom prophet i'm personally aware of.
13:00 asciilifeform beats the shit out of everyone else.
13:00 mircea_popescu prophets are not strategists.
13:00 mircea_popescu they're a sort of singers.
13:00 asciilifeform ~accurate~ prophet.
13:00 mircea_popescu ~good~ singers.
13:01 kakobrekla yeah, his talks have been a carbon copy for a very long time on all the confs.
13:01 asciilifeform so what's the operative difference ?
13:01 mircea_popescu between what and what!
13:01 asciilifeform prophet / strategist
13:01 asciilifeform is it that the latter tells you what to do ?
13:01 mircea_popescu listen to prophet, be entertained ; follow strategist, survive.
13:02 asciilifeform well yes.
13:02 asciilifeform but i was asking, what they do differently.
13:02 mircea_popescu because why, anything can be expressed in pascal ?
13:02 asciilifeform aha!
13:03 asciilifeform remember, i don't deal in inexpressables. or i'd be hanging at the dirigible club with mircea_popescu, and not here in this ditch
13:04 asciilifeform i'm stuck with expressable.
13:04 mircea_popescu you'll have to one day tell me what's the "operative difference" between peach and pear, but not in the sense of "one has a wooden pit". instead, in the sense of "what do the trees do differently"
13:04 mircea_popescu and i presume "everything" doesn't suit you.
13:04 asciilifeform i can arrange this but the answer will be a few MB long.
13:04 asciilifeform but certainly not inexpressable.
13:04 mircea_popescu don't flatter yourself. you can't arrange this, and the answer would provably be > petabytes long.
13:05 asciilifeform MB if we get to #include from the genus.
13:05 mircea_popescu but you UNDERSTAND the meta point, which makes you lie to yourself about your capacities, because you really really want things to be a certain way.
13:05 asciilifeform otherwise mircea_popescu has it.
13:05 mircea_popescu so basically this discussion just became 'explain this to me, and if you do i'll just pretend the explanation doesn't exist"
13:05 asciilifeform actually i have a suitably grim picture of the capacities.
13:06 asciilifeform having actually been tasked with attempting something quite like the peach/pear before.
13:06 mircea_popescu aha
13:06 mircea_popescu note in any case that "operative" in that context specifically seeks "wooden pit" type answers.
13:07 asciilifeform but mircea_popescu misunderstood, i have no intention of pretending that the inexpressable distinction does not exist. merely stating that i am not equipped to deal in it.
13:07 mircea_popescu and who is.
13:07 asciilifeform possibly mircea_popescu ?
13:07 asciilifeform whose profession it is.
13:07 mircea_popescu sadly, nope.
13:08 asciilifeform ( strategist )
13:08 mircea_popescu o, it is ? maybe when i'm having a good day.
13:09 phf goes back to cause/purpose thing
13:09 mircea_popescu now, granted, in re the trees, while it stands that you can't do it, i suspect you're right in suspecting it CAN be done.
13:09 mircea_popescu which makes it perhaps a substantially different bojum.
13:09 asciilifeform i can't personally, with own hands, put a satellite in orbit, either.
13:09 mircea_popescu right.
13:10 mircea_popescu but i know people who put satellites in orbit ; i know no one who made the answer to the tree question.
13:10 mircea_popescu "step towards" is you know... another ledge.
13:12 asciilifeform the tree question is approx. where rocketry was in 1930.
13:13 mircea_popescu mebbe.
13:13 mircea_popescu note that cold fusion has been approx where rocketry was in 1930 for a good century now.
13:14 asciilifeform mno.
13:14 asciilifeform it was where transmutation was in 1500.
13:14 mircea_popescu what's the operative difference ?
13:15 mircea_popescu they're both where virgin teen is on prom night. is it going to be a good experience/marriage/life ? who knows ?
13:15 mircea_popescu who even cares ? take it off!
13:15 asciilifeform the difference between 'needs moar engineering' and charlatanry that can absorb $trillion with not a blip of result ?
13:15 mircea_popescu note that mom and dad of virgin teen can liberally hold either of these views, interchangeably.
13:15 asciilifeform also fusion is very much the wrong term.
13:15 asciilifeform you can go and fuse in your kitchen right now.
13:15 asciilifeform (see, e.g., farnsworth's device)
13:15 asciilifeform the boojum is ~ +EV fusion ~.
13:16 mircea_popescu i think that's what the "cold" part is trying to suggest.
13:16 mircea_popescu otherwise... all sorts of "more expensive than it's worth" methods are known
13:16 asciilifeform you can also cold fuse right now.
13:16 asciilifeform whack palladium deuteride with hammer.
13:16 mircea_popescu in a different take of "cold".
13:17 mircea_popescu ie, not high temperature, cold. but the meaning contemplated in the expression is, i suspect, quite, "+ev, ie cold"
13:17 mircea_popescu as in cold ownage.
13:17 asciilifeform well there are two schools of fusion crackpottery, the 'hot' (tokamak, but really is just refinement of hbomb codes) and 'cold'.
13:17 asciilifeform both have delusions of '+ev any day now'.
13:18 mircea_popescu i like the laser pumping people.
13:18 mircea_popescu lasers are fun.
13:18 asciilifeform the 'hot' folks managed to strangle the 'cold' for the usg pig trough fight, yes.
13:18 asciilifeform the laser thing is really the quest for the 'clean thermonuke' in disguise.
13:19 asciilifeform (i.e. thermonuke that doesn't require a fissile initiator, ergo no need for refining U)
13:19 mircea_popescu aha.
13:19 asciilifeform usg has an interesting relationship with the thing
13:20 asciilifeform on one hand, it is the last thing a lizard wants to see appear.
13:20 asciilifeform anywhere.
13:20 asciilifeform on other hand, nobody can resist asking the question.
13:20 mircea_popescu "ideally, it would want it not to exist ; but if it must exist, it wants to be the only one to ever have it"
13:20 asciilifeform aha.
13:21 mircea_popescu in a very "sf" take of the thing - actually workable, and perhaps miniaturizable laser-initiated compression would put the nuclear issue on about the same terms the war on drugs finds itself.
13:21 mircea_popescu ie, anyoen can make drugs and you won't be able to detect them and fuck you.
13:21 asciilifeform aha.
13:21 mircea_popescu "here's where washington used to be, that crater to the left. oh, you never saw that 100cc of methane gas, did oyu ? awww!"
13:22 asciilifeform and it won't cost much, either.
13:22 mircea_popescu shoulda looked for methane instead of 2,3-blablatronium.
13:23 asciilifeform quite possibly everything else that usg does is preparation for this exam.
13:23 mircea_popescu unlike the qc thing, i can't even say this is not in the cards.
13:23 asciilifeform since '53 or whenever ulam realized that you don't actually need the fissile firecracker.
13:23 mircea_popescu besides. gotta explain all the other lifeless planets out there ~somehow~.
13:24 asciilifeform i can see hitler and dulles nodding to one another, 'yeah it'll be better to create a planet of castrated zombies'
13:24 mircea_popescu i don't see that better.
13:24 asciilifeform ~they~ see it.
13:24 mircea_popescu as the romanian expression goes, "apai atunci nu-i prea vad in clar"
13:25 asciilifeform i'll take the lifeless crater, plox.
13:25 mircea_popescu literally, "thus therefore, i don't see them to clearly", but that "not see clearly" really means, "it won't end up well for them". sort-of like prophet not seeing your future too clearly.
13:26 mircea_popescu "in clar" also denotes plaintext, ie, immediately accessible. no need to explain and mediate their carcass into being, as it were.
13:28 asciilifeform yudkowsky, of all people, wrote some story where there was a planet where they learned to make fusion device with ancient greek level tech. and the survivers evolved. into something strange.
13:28 asciilifeform (into some monstrously happy/dopy/cooperative beast)
13:29 asciilifeform at any rate, even orwell had his fingers on it
13:30 asciilifeform !s you and the atomic bomb
13:30 assbot 16 results for 'you and the atomic bomb' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=you+and+the+atomic+bomb
13:30 asciilifeform as in http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=15-11-2014#923509
13:30 assbot Logged on 15-11-2014 07:02:37; asciilifeform: 'Had the atomic bomb turned out to be something as cheap and easily manufactured as a bicycle or an alarm clock, it might well have plunged us back into barbarism, but it might, on the other hand, have meant the end of national sovereignty and of the highly-centralised police state. If, as seems to be the case, it is a rare and costly object as difficult to produce as a battleship, it is likelier to p
~ 17 minutes ~
13:48 mircea_popescu fortunately, it is not MERELY the atomic bomb that is rare and costly and as difficult to produce as a battleship.
13:48 mircea_popescu ~CARING~ about the otherwise irrelevant item is ALSO rare and costly and difficult to produce. moreso than a battleship.
13:48 mircea_popescu hence why the meanwhile-barbarianized new yorkers couldn't care less if the nuke plant blows.
13:49 mircea_popescu so what if it does ? more varied tail for the lot of them!
13:59 asciilifeform phun phakt, seems like 'genkernel' won't allow you to disable flag SYSTEM_TRUSTED_KEYRING .
13:59 asciilifeform y'know, the one in http://perception-point.io/2016/01/14/analysis-and-exploitation-of-a-linux-kernel-vulnerability-cve-2016-0728 .
13:59 assbot Analysis and Exploitation of a Linux Kernel Vulnerability (CVE-2016-0728) | Perception Point ... ( http://bit.ly/1WSlv1p )
14:00 mircea_popescu but at any rate, notice how the "worldwide peace" movement seamlessly morphed into the "antiatomic movement" seamlessly morphed into the "ecology" movement.
14:00 mircea_popescu and recall tlp's wunderwaffenwords,
14:00 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: it was a kgb golem, and this is amply documented.
14:01 mircea_popescu motherfucker, there's some ad on his page that blocks the loading.
14:02 asciilifeform l0l i thought you had his complete worx cached.
14:03 mircea_popescu https://archive.is/SzW0e#selection-181.0-100.74 will have to do
14:03 assbot The Last Psychiatrist: You Are The 98% ... ( http://bit.ly/1WSlL0i )
14:03 phf i think the "advanced user" workflow is to pick up genkernel config, menuconfig it, put the config back into genkernel, recompile
14:04 asciilifeform phf: well yes, but the result is usually that the compile barfs
14:04 phf in before asciilifeform finally goes all LFS
14:04 phf ah
14:04 asciilifeform lfs ?
14:04 phf linux from scratch
14:09 asciilifeform ah
14:09 asciilifeform that'd be merely gentoo without portage.
14:09 asciilifeform wtf is the point.
14:10 trinque decent as a learning tool and not much else.
14:10 * trinque did it once
14:11 asciilifeform i'm beginning to understand why the enemy is not particularly scared of trb.
14:11 asciilifeform we don't actually have a kernel that isn't fully, certifiably porous.
14:13 asciilifeform the mice have been in the granary for... 20 yrs ?
14:13 asciilifeform and there is scarcely any grain at all to be found there.
14:13 asciilifeform only mouse shit.
14:14 asciilifeform and we (or at least i) are still baking bread from it.
14:17 asciilifeform because there is not another granary.
14:23 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86051 @ 0.00058627 = 50.4491 BTC [-] {3}
14:38 trinque http://www.cvedetails.com/product/163/Openbsd-Openbsd.html?vendor_id=97 << >> http://www.cvedetails.com/product/47/Linux-Linux-Kernel.html?vendor_id=33
14:38 assbot Openbsd Openbsd : CVE security vulnerabilities, versions and detailed reports ... ( http://bit.ly/1TLLuYK )
14:38 assbot Linux Linux Kernel : CVE security vulnerabilities, versions and detailed reports ... ( http://bit.ly/1TLLuZ0 )
14:38 trinque yes, I understand I just said "this food has less shit in it!"
14:39 trinque worth mentioning too that one's referring to an entire *usable* operating system and the other to only a kernel
14:41 trinque I personally would far sooner deal with a shitty package management system than a swiss cheese kernel
14:42 trinque and obviously the hardware's all rotten too; I get that, but that's not an argument in favor of linux.
↖
14:43 trinque tbh bitching about the openbsd ports tree is a matter of having missed the point; pester the maintainer or become him if you want something changed.
~ 18 minutes ~
15:02 asciilifeform trinque: 'want something changed' is not the right description for granary full of mouse shit.
15:13 trinque actually most of the remote code execution exploits in recent OpenBSD were the fault of X
15:14 asciilifeform kernel exploit is not usually a remote but more privesc thing, anyway
15:14 trinque it seems to have done pretty well across the board
15:15 trinque whether that's due to it being a less prevalent target, I do not know.
15:15 asciilifeform i have a brick here that also did pretty well.
15:15 asciilifeform no remote exploits for it !1111
15:16 trinque heh, I'll have to try running my emacs env on your brick sometime
15:19 asciilifeform anyone ever build a working trb on openbsd ?
↖
15:19 trinque !s from:phf openbsd
15:19 assbot 20 results for 'from:phf openbsd' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=from%3Aphf+openbsd
15:21 asciilifeform i don't recall a ~rotor~ trb working there.
15:21 asciilifeform phf, is there one ?
15:22 trinque it doesn't run linux binaries, which would preclude buildroot, wouldn't it?
15:23 trinque in openbsd's case the operating system's version number refers to an entire base system
15:23 trinque could just target one of those and results should be the same on same arch
15:24 asciilifeform buildroot, theoretically, ought to work on bsd.
15:25 asciilifeform (recall, we're not building a kernel with it, only the toolchain)
15:25 trinque lemme see what it does and I'll paste; I've done it before and it barfed.
15:25 asciilifeform understand why i went with buildroot.
15:26 asciilifeform we need a thing that will 1) let us 'vendor' gcc and the WHOLE toolchain
15:26 asciilifeform 2) GUARANTEE that a build pulls in NOTHING from outside.
15:26 trinque yep, sensible
15:27 asciilifeform there may be other ways to achieve this, e.g., a bsd 'jail'
~ 26 minutes ~
15:53 deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 17.40000000 BTC on 'Yes' - Donald Trump gets Republican Nomination - http://bitbet.us/bet/1206/donald-trump-gets-republican-nomination/#b126
~ 25 minutes ~
16:19 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49800 @ 0.00059163 = 29.4632 BTC [+] {2}
~ 18 minutes ~
16:37 phf asciilifeform: there's no rotor
16:39 phf i think i wanted to figure out how to package openssl/db/boost as buildroot native packages, rather then doing adhoc, which is a task in itself
16:40 phf once i do can probably produce buildroot for mac os x too
16:41 phf i'm though confused, i thought buildroot is explicitly a cross-compilation mechanism?
↖
16:42 phf "Buildroot is a tool that simplifies and automates the process of building a complete Linux system for an embedded system, using cross-compilation.
16:42 phf
16:42 phf In order to achieve this, Buildroot is able to generate a cross-compilation toolchain, a root filesystem, a Linux kernel image and a bootloader for your target."
16:47 ben_vulpes > verify with text message (most secure)
16:47 ben_vulpes mhm sure
16:50 ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=27-02-2016#1416923 << this girl i'm rather fond of convinced me that it wasn't a half-bad way to spend thirty years while my brain rots building apps for various usg tentacles.
16:50 assbot Logged on 27-02-2016 20:00:05; asciilifeform: in this particular case, why offspring
16:50 ben_vulpes sure as hell beats drinking the horror at my own existence away
16:52 ben_vulpes http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-02-2016#1415503 << mount her on a bicycle, pilfer a bottle from the office, mash around the city on bikes, break onto the in-decomissionment sellwood bridge and fuck on it? iono man what does one do with random girls anyways
↖
16:52 assbot Logged on 25-02-2016 18:22:46; pete_dushenski: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-02-2016#1415189 << inquiring minds would like to know what you'd have done with her if you caught her !
~ 18 minutes ~
17:11 asciilifeform http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418499 << we abuse it...
17:11 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 21:41:44; phf: i'm though confused, i thought buildroot is explicitly a cross-compilation mechanism?
17:23 phf oh so it's not even crosscompile?
17:25 asciilifeform well we cross-compile.
17:26 asciilifeform from derplinux to ideallinux.
17:26 phf :)
17:26 asciilifeform thinkaboutit.
17:26 asciilifeform and, originally, i picked up buildroot to make pogotron.
17:33 thestringpuller everytime I see pogo reference I think of butt plug
17:35 phf http://www.toysrus.com/graphics/tru_prod_images/Fisher-Price-Grow-to-Pro-Pogo-Stick--pTRU1-2909797dt.jpg
17:35 assbot 200 OK ... ( http://bit.ly/1TMcE1C )
17:42 BingoBoingo <mircea_popescu> << quite psychanalizable, ftr. notice the spurt of "make x great again" ever since 2015 or so. << It's a Trump slogan, that's why it went meme
17:46 asciilifeform hay mas futuro!
17:56 BingoBoingo <trinque> it doesn't run linux binaries, which would preclude buildroot, wouldn't it? << Last week Openbsd killed linux_compat on i386 which is the last platform they supported it on
17:58 phf oh ffs
17:58 phf i was hoping to get intellij idea running on that
17:59 BingoBoingo http://undeadly.org/cgi?action=article&sid=20160227163716
17:59 assbot Linux Emulation goes to the great bitbucket of the sky ... ( http://bit.ly/1RBvhU8 )
18:00 asciilifeform phf: l0l! are you slaving in a java mine ?!
18:00 * asciilifeform used 'idea' as a student, many years ago.
18:00 phf nah, actually use it for day to day development
18:01 asciilifeform how is that not slaving in a java mine ?
18:01 phf err, i mean, python mostly
18:01 asciilifeform or does idea do other langs now
18:01 asciilifeform hm
18:02 phf it does, and it has very elaborate python plugin (can be had separately as "pycharm")
18:02 jurov they have a sibling of idea named pycharm
18:02 jurov i use, too
18:03 phf it does things for you, autoimports, large scale refactoring, working jump to/from functionality
18:05 phf it's got some other niceties, like a db integration, where it introspects into the scheme and then does static analysis on your sql code, including sql code that's inline somewhere in python
18:05 phf *schema
18:07 asciilifeform this is spiffy, but closed source crud belongs in a specially-designated leprosorium (malware box, or at least, if you like living dangerously, a vm) rather than on naked civilian box !
18:09 phf i don't know what constitutes naked civilian box
18:09 asciilifeform depends.
18:09 asciilifeform 'don't shit in the kitchen' is valid, despite different folks having different kinds of kitchen
18:10 asciilifeform i.e. places where definitionally one ought not shit.
18:13 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4882 @ 0.00058647 = 2.8631 BTC [+]
18:13 jurov that it's good thing to dream about :)
18:13 * ben_vulpes shits in sink, eats from toilet bowl, never knew to do anything else before 2013
↖
18:14 ben_vulpes AM PASHTUN
18:14 jurov As long as you use the proper hand for each.
18:17 ben_vulpes american pashtun!
18:17 ben_vulpes i have tp ffs jurov
18:17 ben_vulpes sheesh this is like when i moved to new york and people were astonished to learn that there's electricity west of the rockies
18:17 deedbot- [Ossasepia] Coordinate Eulometry (or Tomb of the Dead Mollusc) - http://www.dianacoman.com/2016/03/01/coordinate-eulometry-or-tomb-of-the-dead-mollusc/
18:17 phf toilet paper is barbaric
18:21 ben_vulpes at mp's prompting i added a plastic handheld thing to the shower
18:21 thestringpuller ben_vulpes: isn't that for old people?
18:22 deedbot- [Qntra] Google At Fault In Motor Vehicle Collision - http://qntra.net/2016/02/google-at-fault-in-motor-vehicle-collision/
18:29 phf asciilifeform: i guess i can't seem to find a baseline that doesn't suck in all kinds of obvious and non-obvious ways. for all practical purposes i operate out of a semipublic terminal that i don't own. various attempts to establish non-superficial ownership were unsuccessful for reasons amply discussed here
18:31 phf i found my way here to begin with because i was following your loperos project and your conclusions were then correct, only to be re-confirmed as part of b-a research
18:31 asciilifeform phf: iirc several people did
18:31 asciilifeform (adlai ?)
↖
18:32 phf probably all the common lispers
18:32 asciilifeform not all, ben_vulpes was here before me.
18:33 phf ah, i think that's from before i was paying close attention to logs
18:34 phf but anyway, chuck moore probably has clean kitchen and terry davis :p
18:34 asciilifeform iirc he was named benkay in those days.
18:36 phf i think he renamed himself during my 6 months
18:42 phf my current goal is to have better compartmentalization, like have a gaming machine (i.e. libretto running dos, i've been unwinding with ~~'95 games), a work machine (i.e. a thing that can run intellij and which is compromised for all the practical purposes) and a b-a machine whatever that evolves into, because i don't think the future of a computer as a progrock moog station is panning out
18:43 phf ^- http://assets.rollingstone.com/assets/2015/list/50-greatest-prog-rock-albums-of-all-time-20150617/199927/medium_rect/1434559354/720x405-GettyImages-74702183.jpg
18:43 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1oU2hxL )
18:45 BingoBoingo <asciilifeform> not all, ben_vulpes was here before me. << iirc benkay you and myself were part of the 2013 #b-a cohort
18:49 phf that must be right because that's when asciilifeform published the mpex review, so i must've been reading mp since then, but ben_vulpes renamed himself quite recently
18:49 phf sometime summer last year
18:59 mats http://i.imgur.com/gJj95hz.jpg
18:59 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1XWn5jS )
19:03 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37300 @ 0.00058663 = 21.8813 BTC [+] {2}
19:18 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35750 @ 0.00058156 = 20.7908 BTC [-] {3}
19:31 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33700 @ 0.0005812 = 19.5864 BTC [-] {2}
19:32 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22050 @ 0.00058874 = 12.9817 BTC [+] {4}
19:43 deedbot- [Qntra] Qntra (S.QNTR) February 2016 Report - http://qntra.net/2016/03/qntra-s-qntr-february-2016-report/
19:44 BingoBoingo deedbot-: http://dpaste.com/24MYF1J.txt
19:44 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1pmp7OE )
19:44 deedbot- rejected: 1
19:44 BingoBoingo deedbot-: http://dpaste.com/0X484WG.txt
19:44 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1pmpeJO )
19:44 deedbot- accepted: 1
19:46 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35300 @ 0.00059143 = 20.8775 BTC [+]
19:47 jurov http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418008 lol i measure my coffee consumption by "does the shit smell like coffee? if not, all ok"
19:47 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 06:24:02; BingoBoingo: Wait, you don't drink it all by the pot?
19:49 jurov but i started to mix it with cereal/chicory coffee to make it easy on stomach
19:52 BingoBoingo Ah, a couple days after I open a can I'll start adding cold milk to it when I pour for the same reason
19:54 BingoBoingo I don't really have chicory around this time of year
20:00 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 32342 @ 0.0005812 = 18.7972 BTC [-] {2}
20:05 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28002 @ 0.0005812 = 16.2748 BTC [-] {2}
20:15 deedbot- [Trilema] What MP wants MP gets, the funarg problem and other Mecano considerations - http://trilema.com/2016/what-mp-wants-mp-gets-the-funarg-problem-and-other-mecano-considerations/
20:16 ben_vulpes looks like i changed nicks 7/29/2014
20:16 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418468 << no, it's an argument in flavor of linux.
20:16 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 19:42:04; trinque: and obviously the hardware's all rotten too; I get that, but that's not an argument in favor of linux.
20:18 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40036 @ 0.00058011 = 23.2253 BTC [-] {3}
20:18 ben_vulpes what flavor of linux though?
20:20 mircea_popescu nono, in flavor of linux. like, in the style of bosch.
20:21 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418478 << i vaguely recall BingoBoingo sort-of trying
20:21 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 20:19:25; asciilifeform: anyone ever build a working trb on openbsd ?
20:23 BingoBoingo I have a partially trb-icized 7 series in the name of implementation pluralism. No earthly idea what all changes happened.
20:24 mircea_popescu on bsd ?
20:24 asciilifeform phf had stator on bsd.
20:25 asciilifeform but no one, to date - rotor.
20:25 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19100 @ 0.00057892 = 11.0574 BTC [-] {3}
20:25 asciilifeform now rotor is not ~quite~ as necessary on bsd, because drepper is absent there. BUT we still need deterministic nailed-down toolchain, esp. for when we finally do the deterministic binary thing.
20:26 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 39200 @ 0.00058768 = 23.0371 BTC [+] {2}
20:26 mircea_popescu aha
20:27 mircea_popescu besides, as per satoshi's argument ("no, don't bring it on"), might not be the smartest thing in the world to give drepper incentive to exist on bsd anyway
20:27 asciilifeform the idea is to categorically cut off the very possibility of drepper existing.
20:27 BingoBoingo mircea_popescu: On OpenBSD. It's the one I chopped together mostly while drunk and still works.
20:27 mircea_popescu aha
20:29 BingoBoingo Dropped in low-s a month or two (mebbe 3) before trb, has -minrelaytx flag, from trb orphanage slaughters and malleus were definitely implemented. Other things but would take reading to recall them.
20:30 mircea_popescu cool.
20:30 ben_vulpes hue, ether's hardforking already?
20:31 deedbot- [BitBet Bets Bets] 1.50000000 BTC on 'No' - Donald Trump will win the 2016 United States Presidential Election - http://bitbet.us/bet/1250/donald-trump-will-win-the-2016-united-states/#b7
20:31 BingoBoingo oh? did they drop the old bottle with the precipitated peroxides already?
20:31 ben_vulpes https://github.com/ethereum/EIPs/blob/master/EIPS/eip-2.mediawiki and https://github.com/ethereum/EIPs/blob/master/EIPS/eip-7.md, although the latter is only noted as a hardfork on a blog page
20:31 assbot EIPs/eip-2.mediawiki at master · ethereum/EIPs · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1TMDFSG )
20:31 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1TMDFSI )
20:32 mircea_popescu http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=29-02-2016#1418548 << ben_dog!
20:32 assbot Logged on 29-02-2016 23:13:58; *: ben_vulpes shits in sink, eats from toilet bowl, never knew to do anything else before 2013
20:33 mod6 http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2016-March/000217.html
20:33 assbot [BTC-dev] The Bitcoin Foundation: STATE OF BITCOIN ADDRESS ... ( http://bit.ly/1ndQyZg )
20:34 BingoBoingo ben_vulpes: Seriously, they heated their Ether up into a gas?! No wonder it is already hardforking everywhere.
20:34 ben_vulpes tastes great with alf_dog
20:35 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 10817 @ 0.00057878 = 6.2607 BTC [-] {2}
20:36 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35583 @ 0.00057749 = 20.5488 BTC [-] {3}
20:39 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 52850 @ 0.00058798 = 31.0747 BTC [+] {2}
20:42 ben_vulpes why are all of the self-hosted rss readers written in php
20:42 ben_vulpes i found one in rubby
20:44 fluffypony ben_vulpes: because PHP is secure and easy to use
20:44 fluffypony everything should just be written in PHP
20:44 fluffypony Bitcoin should switch to the Timekoin codebase
20:45 * ben_vulpes bites
20:45 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26450 @ 0.00059143 = 15.6433 BTC [+]
20:46 ben_vulpes heh
20:46 ben_vulpes gold, fluffypony
20:46 fluffypony btw did anyone else notice that RealSolid is back?
20:47 fluffypony https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1381328.0
20:47 assbot MicroCash. Now in Alpha 2 release. ... ( http://bit.ly/1TMG67K )
20:51 ben_vulpes > juices flowing
21:02 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25502 @ 0.00058137 = 14.8261 BTC [-] {2}
21:07 mats hot
21:10 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28185 @ 0.00058138 = 16.3862 BTC [+]
21:24 phf http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-01-2016#1366068
21:24 assbot Logged on 11-01-2016 05:12:12; phf: ben_vulpes: i'll take at look in the next few days, but one quick comment, fwiw i built it on a 32-bit openbsd.
21:24 phf and http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-01-2016#1366069
21:24 assbot Logged on 11-01-2016 05:13:29; phf: the goal was to run it on a libretto and try to eat the first couple of blocks, but it wouldn't even connect to rpc for whatever reason, so i gave up on the whole distraction
21:25 phf now that there was a suggestion of treating specific openbsd version as baseline, i think problem was that i built in on one openbsd and tried running on another
21:26 phf node was running fine inside a virtualbox openbsd though, same one that i built it on.
21:26 asciilifeform wai wut, openbsd has no stable abi at all ?!!!
21:27 phf hehehe
21:27 mircea_popescu fluffypony> everything should just be written in PHP << word.
21:28 phf asciilifeform: they take a "we'll make sure to break abi, rebuild from source every time" position
21:28 mircea_popescu not even sure this is wrong.
21:30 asciilifeform this is only a good thing in the sense that spraying ddt in every room of your house is.
21:30 asciilifeform yes, no mosquitoes.
21:31 asciilifeform but this is simply yet another way for mosquitoes to win.
21:31 mircea_popescu i guess.
21:32 mircea_popescu in other news, til i learned that the criteria for "fridge big enough" is : if one discrete item won't fit, push. if it now fits, fridge is big enough. if it still won't fit, "wtf is with these tiny-ass euro style fridges already!!1"
21:32 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15170 @ 0.00058571 = 8.8852 BTC [+] {2}
21:34 mircea_popescu asciilifeform i was tempted throughout eulora lifetime to go "fu, no binaries, compile, always". and i can still contemplate why this would be the case with trb.
21:34 mircea_popescu heck, isn't the whole v system technically speaking just this ?
21:35 asciilifeform sure is.
21:35 mircea_popescu so then.... still not sure this is wrong.
21:35 mircea_popescu ddt persuasiveness notwithstanding.
21:35 asciilifeform it isn't ~wrong~, merely annoying.
21:35 mircea_popescu the brothel is also "just another way for housewife to win", at least according to her.
21:36 asciilifeform gotta decide how much ddt you want to spray in your living room.
21:36 asciilifeform this is in some ways a personal choice.
21:36 phf i thought whole exercise is to produce byte to byte equivalent binaries, as another step in verification process. "sealed vpatches -> press -> binary -> shasum"
21:37 mircea_popescu where this comparison breaks down is that your biology is fundamentally cunt-based and perl-run. you necessarily respirate the ddt. meanwhile, your mental life is supposed to be hermetic and under your control. you shouldn't fucking respirate the environment wtf.
21:37 mircea_popescu phf yeah.
21:37 asciilifeform (the ultimate thermonuclear version of this is to ~randomly generate~ a cpu arch, instantiate on an fpga ~and generate a compiler~, and compile for THAT! and i was very sad as a student to discover that one cristina cifuentes invented this long before i did)
21:37 mircea_popescu and i appreciate your "is to produce" construction :)
21:38 mircea_popescu for they not blessed with knowledge of actual languages, there's significant aspectual difference between "is to produce" which talks of the state, like to be, and "produces", which talks of movement.
21:38 asciilifeform and wow, that name was buried in the nethermost depths of my skull before this convo.
21:38 mircea_popescu asciilifeform women in tech.
21:38 asciilifeform i have nfi if it even was an actual woman.
21:39 asciilifeform was just a name.
21:39 mircea_popescu yeah is woman, worked for oracle.
21:39 mircea_popescu you mean her, no ?
21:39 asciilifeform probably
21:39 mircea_popescu reverse compilation techniques etc
21:40 asciilifeform http://zyloid.com/recomposer/files/decompilation_thesis.pdf << aha
21:40 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/21y2t6Y )
21:40 asciilifeform ^ thesis
21:40 asciilifeform had an almost-useful x86 decompiler before 'hexray'.
21:40 asciilifeform first, afaik.
21:48 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18309 @ 0.00057733 = 10.5703 BTC [-] {2}
21:49 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4441 @ 0.00057628 = 2.5593 BTC [-]
21:55 asciilifeform now i gotta ask, how does mircea_popescu know that it was 'actual woman'
21:55 asciilifeform met in the flesh ?
21:56 mircea_popescu nah.
21:57 asciilifeform https://cryptome.org/2016/02/usg-apple-edny-029.pdf << lulz! apple 'wins'
21:57 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/21y4ShZ )
21:57 asciilifeform mega-muppet-warz
22:07 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 21638 @ 0.00057628 = 12.4695 BTC [-]
22:16 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11600 @ 0.00058594 = 6.7969 BTC [+] {3}
22:21 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 18300 @ 0.00059143 = 10.8232 BTC [+]
22:24 ben_vulpes the only line i have for coworkers and plebs on this topic is "you haven't thought for half a second why the /nsa/ didn't bring this suit?"
22:26 mircea_popescu on which side ?
22:29 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19800 @ 0.00059143 = 11.7103 BTC [+]
22:30 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64950 @ 0.00057612 = 37.419 BTC [-] {3}
22:30 ben_vulpes the fbi's side - why would they argue apple's side?
22:30 ben_vulpes but really it's ambiguous for a reason
22:31 ben_vulpes got someone bought in on the "drop on first packet or gtfo" mentality, but still have to conquer the "well first you have to transfer the IP buffered packets into user space" mindset
22:31 ben_vulpes "because lol what we're going to fab our own chips?"
22:31 ben_vulpes mwell now that you ask...
22:33 ben_vulpes asciilifeform: what's your cad poison of choice?
22:37 mircea_popescu ben_vulpes> got someone bought in on the "drop on first packet or gtfo" mentality, but still have to conquer the "well first you have to transfer the IP buffered packets into user space" mindset <<< can you say this in other words ?
22:40 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 60500 @ 0.00059143 = 35.7815 BTC [+]
22:41 ben_vulpes "yeah man! big challenge though is to get it to operate at line speed."
22:42 ben_vulpes "pff line speed. you still need to get the buffered packets from the kernel into userspace, and that's an abstraction you'll have a hard time getting around."
22:42 ben_vulpes because the counterparty in this conversation is not thinking of gossipd as a device but a proggy that runs on a computer.
22:50 asciilifeform ben_vulpes: i have a (unpublished, for good reasons) prototype that doesn't have 'kernel' or 'userland' at all, but just this bare metal thing that sets up the nic ring buffer (coreboot payload) and loops, checks rsa, retransmits on other nic...
22:50 asciilifeform on ordinary (well, 'pcengines' pancake) computer.
22:51 asciilifeform asm, it's good for you.
22:52 mats that sounds fun
22:52 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70150 @ 0.00059146 = 41.4909 BTC [+] {2}
22:53 asciilifeform mats: the idea is, a kind of line-speed (GB ethernet) wall, where crud goes in, and valid in-wot gossipd out.
↖
22:53 asciilifeform if so much as 1 packet per billion is valid.
22:56 mats did you actually write the routines in asm?
22:57 asciilifeform aha.
22:57 asciilifeform but doesn't work as well as i'd like, not line speed (uses dumb bignum)
22:58 asciilifeform i will pick this back up again when there is reason to.
23:01 asciilifeform the idea is very simple, anybody who really wants to can pick his favourite nic chipset and implement.
23:02 asciilifeform not much in terms of moving parts, ought to handily fit in a nic boot rom.
23:06 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 80050 @ 0.00059441 = 47.5825 BTC [+] {7}
23:07 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48600 @ 0.00058718 = 28.5369 BTC [-] {2}
23:19 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26070 @ 0.00058718 = 15.3078 BTC [-] {2}
23:20 mircea_popescu <asciilifeform> if so much as 1 packet per billion is valid. << this sounds like the ticket.
23:31 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: that's what 'line speed' means.
23:31 asciilifeform it means that the crud doesn't affect the valid payloads.
23:31 asciilifeform in whatever way.
23:31 asciilifeform (at least, not after it leaves isp)
23:34 mircea_popescu aha.
23:35 mircea_popescu i could see even dedicating a box to this.
23:35 mircea_popescu make it a nice firewall.
23:35 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: that's sorta how it is meant to work.
23:35 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: prototyped on one of these, https://rhomberg.org/images/apu-oberseite.jpg
23:35 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1Seh15M )
23:37 asciilifeform ^ these are prolly the only 100% open x86 box presently made
23:37 asciilifeform (no-turd firmware, full schematics)
23:40 mircea_popescu aha
23:45 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15806 @ 0.00057979 = 9.1642 BTC [-]
23:47 punkman https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CcWIHP3UYAIO3uC.jpg:large
23:47 assbot ... ( http://bit.ly/1Sei9X6 )
23:52 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15847 @ 0.00058068 = 9.202 BTC [+] {2}
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