#pest | 2022-01-08

despite having tried with everyone else in here

00:03

do you have more than one party in this state in your pest wot?

00:03

if so probably that bug I found

00:04

what do you mean by 'more than one party in this state'?

00:04

as in, users that i have at and key entries but somehow don't peer directly?

00:04

yeah

00:04

yeah, everyone except asciilifeform and awt

00:04

blatta currently thinks these are duplicate names

00:06

which are duplicates?

00:06

any which have not yet received packets, if there is more than one name that has not.

00:06

lemme get you the line to hax, sec

00:06

(sorry i must have missed the earlier discussion of this bug, and possibly a thread the bot didn't pick up)

00:12

re: lightning on top of segwit, yeah, it's unfortunate, but i figure it can be used the way one carries cash in their wallet, i.e. never more than what they would feel comfortable losing

00:13

billymg: here's a draft patch http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=wQJn

00:13

I wont sign because awt may want to refactor this in another way, but it fixes the bug.

00:19

billymg: had not seen the dominical bitcoin project yet, but i have heard that bitcoin beach is a bit of a disaster, specifically i heard that a common wallet (name escapes me) that they (i.e. the people who style themselves as bitcoin ambassadors) set people up with lots people's coins. whether that was because of user er

00:19

alright, lemme try this out, brb one sec

00:20

the drag-everyone-we-can-into-bitcoin mentality does more harm then good

00:21

chivo

00:21

signpost: that was the one

00:22

something like ln ==== deedbot wallet

00:22

to take the other side, somebody's got to make the move toward practical use.

00:26

without every food cart, bnb, hardware store, etc. etc. accepting btc then the only way to use it is to go through an enemy controlled chokepoint first

00:26

sure, and without transiting enemy territory no new nation was ever born

00:28

sending lighting sats to fruit vendor is still using enemy territory though (fritz phone and cell tower), it's just fragmenting and distributing the activity enough to increase their cost of engagement

00:28

lightning*

00:29

but the angle is not to attack small targets like jorge's fruit stand, it's to be able to get big suppliers to accept large transactions for btc, the former just results in a lulzfest

00:29

yup, I'm making no defense of lightning, though there are ideas in it that aren't casually dismissable, could in principle exist atop trb too, without segwit.

00:29

btw, i'm on the patched version now. will i need to redo the peering steps to fix my AT?

00:30

maybe, not sure. give it a try

00:30

whaack: I dunno man, this cynical view is not one I share.

00:30

like I said, have to start somewhere shitty.

00:30

signpost: iirc orig scheme in 'lightning' (naturally implemented via various prbisms) was to 'hawala' b/w 2 noades to save on tx fees.

00:31

(similar to how national banks do not often actually move gold bricks but instead keep tally)

00:32

i.e. rather like a vast rube goldberg attempt at clone of signpost's walletron

00:32

yep, fund a multisig addy and ratchet forward txn that adjust balance of same back to originators, without broadcasting txn

00:32

anyone broadcasts, "channel" is done

00:32

this doesn't need any of the other piled-on shit

00:33

signpost: come to think of it, potential fyootoor pest knob

00:33

e.g. 'iou'

00:33

doesn't need to involve trb directly

00:33

indeed!

00:33

simply needs 2 peers to trust ea. other enuff to eventually settle acct when asked

00:34

*

asciilifeform not 100% certain whether it'd win over what he already does w/ isp customers informally, say

~ 18 minutes ~

00:52

ok, i think i'm back in

00:53

*

whaack hears you loud and clear through peers signpost and asciilifeform

00:58

!. uptime

00:58

billymg: time since my last reconnect : 0d 0h 0m

00:58

boo

00:59

hm i've an at entry for it nao

01:00

billymg: maybe need to set its 'cut' to something higher than 3

01:00

oh, wth, i see it in the log: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1001943

01:00

Logged on 2022-01-08 00:58:44 bitbot: billymg: time since my last reconnect : 0d 0h 0m

01:00

but i didn't see it in my console

01:00

me neither

01:01

!. uptime

01:01

asciilifeform: time since my last reconnect : 0d 0h 3m

01:01

nope

01:01

shows in billymg's log but not in asciilifeform's console

01:02

is the 'cut' value a startup flag?

01:02

the bounces cutoff, right?

01:02

aha

01:02

but apparently cmd not yet implemented in blatta

01:03

oh hm

01:03

it's a 'knob', 'max_bounces'

01:03

try /quote knob max_bounces 5

01:04

i'd have to do this while connected to the bot's station though

01:04

right

01:05

(or via sqlite console)

01:05

it's in 'knobs' table

01:05

ah neat

01:05

seems easier in this case

01:06

come to think of it, max_bounces wouldn't explain why bot logs but we aint seeing its echos

01:06

!. uptime

01:06

asciilifeform: time since my last reconnect : 0d 0h 8m

01:06

*

asciilifeform set his own max_bounces to 5 and still aint seeing

01:06

right, was thinking the same thing, wouldn't need any bounces since we're peered directly with it

01:06

for that matter, bounce distance of asciilifeform and bitbot is 1

01:06

aha

01:07

*

asciilifeform sets own back to 3

01:07

anyone else here see bitbot's echos in their console?

01:07

nfi what's going on there

01:07

*

asciilifeform suspects dedupe bug

01:07

btw for the above thread that got lost if anyone wants to send it over in a paste i'll manually add it to the log

01:08

seemed like we were having a good discussion

01:08

for that matter may explain the thing w/ mod6's station similarly

01:08

i.e.a dedupe bug which somehow removes the ~last~ copy of a msg

01:13

i'll have to look at the station's logs a little later, about to sit down to dinner

01:13

aite

01:13

*

asciilifeform also bbl

01:13

re-added and keyed signpost with the patched state.py, will see if that works

01:20

billymg: give AT signpost 96.43.130.234:7778 a try

01:21

so far doesn't appear I am receiving packets from you

01:24

signpost: same here, and that's the same address i have in the AT: "signpost 96.43.130.234:7778 no packets received from this address"

01:25

bot appears properly peered asciilifeform now at least: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1001988

01:25

Logged on 2022-01-08 01:21:07 signpost[asciilifeform|billymg]: so far doesn't appear I am receiving packets from you

01:26

!. uptime

01:26

whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: time since my last reconnect : 0d 0h 28m

01:26

whaack: do you see the echo in your console? i only see it in the log

01:26

Logged on 2022-01-08 01:26:09 bitbot: whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: time since my last reconnect : 0d 0h 28m

01:28

billymg: maybe send me your ip and port, and I'll try your direction?

01:28

not sure wtf

01:29

205.134.172.29:7778

01:31

signpost ^

01:31

popped it in

01:32

still got that as hearsay

01:32

yeah, and I'm receiving you as hearsay. however I do see your IP in my logs.

01:35

hm

01:35

AT says I still haven't received packets from you

01:35

billymg: firewall on your end by chance? my logs look like I'm sending to you, but not receiving

01:35

i have the same issue with shinohai jonsykkel PeterL

01:35

i've only been able to peer with asciilifeform awt and bitbot

01:35

i've only been able to peer with asciilifeform awt and bitbot

01:36

signpost: i never configured any extra firewall on this box, it's just the standard dulap

01:36

not sure if it's got something configured by default that could be causing issues though

01:48

http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1001992 <<-- i don't see the echo, i only see the msg in the log

01:48

Logged on 2022-01-08 01:26:09 whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: !. uptime

01:53

!. uptime

01:53

billymg: time since my last reconnect : 0d 0h 3m

01:53

there it is

01:54

earlier i only restarted the bot's pest station, to peer it with asciilifeform. i didn't restart the bot itself

01:55

in theory that *shouldn't* have had an effect on the bot

01:58

the bot's logs showed the normal series of 'connecting' 'connection refused' until finally a 'connected' when the pest station came back up

~ 1 hours 7 minutes ~

03:05

wow that unpeer bug is nasty

03:06

leaves orphaned keys in the db

03:09

issue was mod6's clock was off

03:10

:}

03:10

welcome mod6

03:10

Thank you awt, much appreciated. I'll come back tomorrow, add a few more peers & keys. Cheers!

~ 16 minutes ~

03:26

welcome to pestnet, mod6 !

03:27

awt: good catch re: clock. this prolly oughta be part of 'pre-flight checklist' for new station setup.

03:27

(once we have actual docs..)

03:28

oddly enuff asciilifeform's station still shows 'no packets received...' for mod6 in AT

03:28

currently seeing him via mod6[awt|jonsykkel|billymg]

03:28

actually mine too hrm

03:29

although I'm getting messages directly from mod6

03:29

per my station's AT, apparently i've not received any

03:29

(unless the AT timestamp thing is buggier than i thought)

03:30

seems buggier than you thought since it's not updating for me and I definitely received messages from him

03:30

this is even stranger

03:30

Logged on 2022-01-08 03:10:02 mod6[asciilifeform]: :}

03:31

i.e. bitbot indicates having received a mod6 msg from asciilifeform

03:31

then again may well correspond to my mod6[awt] | :}

03:31

possibly not updating the timestamp at all since 9983

03:31

so doesn't contradict the observation that asciilifeform's station still not received msg from mod6

03:32

*

asciilifeform goes to restart pestron, maybe is a peculiar wedge state..

03:32

*

asciilifeform back

03:33

still 'no packets received..' re mod6

03:35

*

asciilifeform to bed soon, has to meet construction folx at new pad in the wee hours

03:36

!. uptime

03:36

asciilifeform: time since my last reconnect : 0d 1h 45m

03:36

heh at least this worx nao

03:39

ok fixed the timestamp update issue locally

03:39

now updates on every received message including rubbish

03:39

awt: asciilifeform was thinking, the [x|y|z] thing prolly oughta behave slightly differently: should only count the peers who gave same (min(all copies)) bounce# of the msg

03:39

otherwise in fact misleading

03:40

does this make sense to you?

03:40

*

awt scratches head

03:41

the orig. purpose of that thing was to try and show how many peers may be relaying an authentic (i.e. immediate) copy of msg

03:41

ah ok hm

03:42

whereas atm you can have the case where only 1 in fact received directly from $peer, but some arbitrary subset of your wot is relaying an n-th bounce copy from that one back to you

03:42

*

asciilifeform will update spec later

03:43

this was prompted by seeing mod6[awt|jonsykkel|billymg] while afaik jonsykkel not yet peered w/ mod6

03:43

yes this makes sense. so exclude handles that relayed with higher than the lowest number of bounces

03:43

aha

03:43

if awt agrees that this makes sense, i'ma amend the spec (later this wknd)

03:44

actually yes now the whole idea makes more sense

03:44

a++!

03:44

such observations are made possible by having an actual draft proggy! ty again for baking it, awt

03:45

prolly this aint the last mechanism that'll need tuning prompted by actual field tests.

03:45

con gusto!

03:48

overall helps to remember that a msg can take 'winding' path from orig -> dest

03:48

(which, depending on what the default 'cut' ends up being in later pestrons, can be quite long)

03:49

the current '3' asciilifeform pulled outta own arse

03:49

*

asciilifeform to bed

~ 15 minutes ~

04:05

http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1002059 <-- makes sense, i agree this should be added.

04:05

Logged on 2022-01-08 03:43:07 awt[asciilifeform|billymg]: yes this makes sense. so exclude handles that relayed with higher than the lowest number of bounces

04:05

asciilifeform and awt: this proggy is super neat, thanks for writing the spec/draft

04:16

also awt i have to check this, but i think the NOTICE messages being sent out by blatta are ill formatted to the irc spec

04:17

*

whaack hits the hay

~ 8 hours 29 minutes ~

12:47

http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1002073 << yw!

12:47

Logged on 2022-01-08 04:05:37 whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: asciilifeform and awt: this proggy is super neat, thanks for writing the spec/draft

~ 2 hours 27 minutes ~

15:14

morning asciilifeform

15:15

mod6: welcome!! do my messages reach you?

~ 22 minutes ~

15:37

*

billymg waves to mod6

~ 32 minutes ~

16:10

shinohai

Buenas dias #pest

16:15

gm

16:17

shinohai

oh hai awt how goes?

16:21

Going pretty good shinohai! Trying to figure out how to incorporate some bone broth into my breakfast.

16:23

*

shinohai is incorporating moar espresso into his breakfast right now .....

16:27

nice. caffeiine is the best drug.

16:28

bone broth, nice. i need to start doing that

16:30

i added raw eggs to my diet about a month ago (12 to 18 per day), total game changer. much more energy for lifting, faster recovery

16:30

billymg: have you heard of grass fed costa rica?

16:31

i don't really cook myself anymore so i'm not using them, but they deliver quality meat and all meat related products (probably some type of bone broth) right to your door

16:34

signpost: what tool did you use to measure the mineral quality of your water?

16:37

awt: do you take collagen supplements? i've started doing that, as well with magnesium, and my hand pain has been reduced tremendously (not necessarily because of the collagen/magnesium, of course, but perhaps..)

16:46

whaack: yes I do

16:47

whaack: i have not, what's that?

16:47

I believe it helped me heal from a rather bad hand injury last year

16:47

lol, should really read more than the one line with the mention before responding

16:48

whaack: these guys? https://grassfedcr.com/

16:48

ah, yeah, i actually remember seeing one of the twitter bitcoiners mention this one

16:48

billymg: yeah i'm pretty sure that's them

16:49

yup, it's quite popular with the bitcoin twitter people down in S.T.

16:50

i ate some of their meat, it was delicious, we even blind tested rib eye with some decent auto mercado meat and grass fed was the clear winner

16:51

yeah, i stopped getting steaks from auto mercado a while ago, really not that great. first switched to pricemart but now getting from an importer (US beef)

16:51

but would prefer local, so i should try these guys

16:52

absolutely would recommend

16:52

and looks like they have bone broth delivery as well as per their fb page

16:52

good deal

16:53

that's a hell of a lot of eggs billymg

16:54

indeed

16:54

I haven't even been able to find ribeye cuts at automercado. don't know what they're called in spanish.

16:55

ojo de bif sometimes

16:55

it's the literal translation iirc... ojo de costilla

16:55

oh ok makes sense

16:58

ah, spelled bife wrong, https://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ojo_de_bife

16:58

as the article says most people will understand "ribeye" too

17:01

is cola de lomo a thing? I had a cut called something like that last trip and it was really good

17:06

i haven't heard of it but image search turned up some tasty looking dishes

~ 2 hours 16 minutes ~

19:22

hi, wow. lot to catch up on here. i'm currently only peer'd with awt/thimbronion. so that may be why you all aren't seing things directly.

19:22

< whaack[awt]> mod6: welcome!! do my messages reach you? << if you sent me a dm, then no. but I did see this line in here, ofc.

19:23

got a few chores to do here. will be back in ~1 hour and can go through it closer & get more peers added. thanks! :]

~ 23 minutes ~

19:46

http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1002091 << crappy little total-dissolved-solids meter that came with my "zero filters"

19:46

Logged on 2022-01-08 16:34:04 whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: signpost: what tool did you use to measure the mineral quality of your water?

19:47

http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1002092 << I take collagen every morning as part of a smoothie, has whey protein also, and "athletic greens"

19:47

Logged on 2022-01-08 16:37:13 whaack[asciilifeform]: awt: do you take collagen supplements? i've started doing that, as well with magnesium, and my hand pain has been reduced tremendously (not necessarily because of the collagen/magnesium, of course, but perhaps..)

19:48

I also dump a hell of a lot of cacao in there, because I'm a glutton, and also somethingsomething antioxidants

19:49

anecdotally, I have zero RSI or other joint issues, no health issues of any kind. lots of different things are probably contributing to that.

19:50

*

signpost works out some, but oughta moar.

19:51

http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1002103 << nothing beats freshly dead, no matter what food one's discussing.

19:51

Logged on 2022-01-08 16:51:56 billymg: but would prefer local, so i should try these guys

19:52

at least in terms of health, lol. plenty of long-since-died items are good fun.

19:53

signpost: been reading a book called Deep Nutrition that says exactly that

19:53

might check that out

19:53

*

signpost figures one's tongue is also mighty tuned, will tell you what to eat if you pay attention.

20:04

awt: i have that book sitting on a shelf somewhere too, haven't gotten to it yet. bought it along with Nutrition and Physical Degeneration, which was enlightening. published in the 1930s, studies indigenous tribes around the world and finds those on their nati

20:06

also includes data on those who grew up on their native diets then switched to the white man's diet (canned fruits, white flour, lots of sugar) later in life -- immediately start getting cavities

20:06

*

mod6 waves at billymg[awt]

20:06

< asciilifeform[awt]> welcome to pestnet, mod6 ! << ty ty!

20:07

reading stuff like that and knowing that my parents never stood a chance given the "food pyramid" and other socialist propaganda enrages to no end

20:10

asciilifeform: ok, re-peer'd and re-key'd with you on my end. also sent you a dm, plz to verify.

20:13

welcome mod6!

20:14

howdy signpost o7

20:23

mod6: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=MdIN

20:23

*

mod6 gets

20:28

Ok signpost, I think we're good.

20:30

forgot a step on my side

20:31

I think that should be it. send another msg please?

20:31

Sure, one sec.

20:31

yep, got that one directly, woot

20:31

Great, thanks!

20:31

This pest is awesome.

20:34

billymg: I have the degeneration book as well, haven't yet read.

20:34

billymg: yeah boomers really got rolled

~ 32 minutes ~

21:07

fwiw nmap says asciilifeform awt and billymg have UDP ports properly open, and so do I, but my station doesn't receive from them.

21:07

checked myself also

21:08

signpost: who are you receiving from?

21:08

hm. you know what? your message just said it came from awt.

21:08

so perhaps the output of AT is wrong

21:08

I also see messages from asciilifeform above that appear to have arrived directly

21:08

not sure wtf atm, just putting these observations in the log

21:09

i'm checking the date on my pest station box now, currently: Sat Jan 8 21:09:24 -00 2022

21:09

*

signpost would chuckle if for some of these a hop through an intermediary is actually faster than a direct shot

21:10

this is probably a stupid question, but how does the time synchronization requirement work with different timezones?

21:10

the req that pest stations must be within 15 mintues of each other

21:12

heh, timezone bugs are never a stupid question

21:12

hear hear

21:13

it appears that blatta mostly uses time.time(), but there's at least one datetime.now() call in state.py, looking at it

21:13

that one does return local time, and is a "timezone-naive" type

21:13

confirmed locally in a pyrepl

21:21

billymg: doesn't appear to be the issue between our stations, since your machine is set to utc

21:21

awt: perhaps something to fix though, to use instead datetime.utcnow() in state.py

21:23

(time.time() always gives utc epoch, so this can otherwise be mismatched)

21:33

just tried peering with mod6, also no luck

21:33

though looking at logs it seems at first glance like it's working properly: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=8vPb

21:34

fwiw my clock looks spot on

21:35

yeah, had no issue peering with mod6

21:35

billymg: did you try adding that patch I made for is_duplicate?

21:36

signpost: yup, been running that since last night

21:36

Logged on 2022-01-08 00:29:43 billymg: btw, i'm on the patched version now. will i need to redo the peering steps to fix my AT?

21:40

head scratcher

21:41

i'm going to try creating an at.py file with everyone's peer info, blow away the db, and restart blatta

21:41

maybe save a copy of the deeb for awt

21:41

ah, good point

21:42

just holler if anyone needs any of my log info or DB. will hand over asap.

21:44

signpost: at is lying rn. never updates the updated_at field

21:44

ah ok

21:46

you can remove the if around that code in update_at and it will fix

↖ ↖

21:48

ah yeah, the one inside the try block?

21:51

yeah, that added a timestamp for everyone but billymg

21:51

so it seems like there's indeed an issue with our peering

21:54

mod6: added you as a peer

21:57

weird. my blatta went down.

21:57

restarted with DEBUG log level.

21:59

http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1002189 << Ok cool. Let me check my settings over here.

21:59

Logged on 2022-01-08 21:54:54 whaack[asciilifeform|billymg]: mod6: added you as a peer

22:04

blatta crashed again, but this time I captured the st & log snip. http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=n0cU

22:07

Ok, crashed again when I pasted the link in here: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=GQk6 ;; this line in particular: http://logs.bitdash.io/pest/2022-01-08#1002194

22:07

Logged on 2022-01-08 22:04:22 mod6[asciilifeform|asciilifeform|billymg]: blatta crashed again, but this time I captured the st & log snip. http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=n0cU

22:09

Ok, didn't puke that time. The first time was kinda weird though - I do have a peer setup with whaak, and a shared key. But I did not have an addy in my AT table for him, yet. So maybe that was it. But the error says 'unknown handle or handle with no key', which didn't seem accurate.

22:09

mod6: I suspect you have a badly formatted address in your at - perhaps missing a port

22:10

yeah, I think so, awt. just writing in as I see stuff. hope it's helpful.

22:11