Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2022-07-01 | 2022-07-03 → ↓
16:13 phf til that sbcl doesn't support eol style for external-format specification..
~ 3 hours 19 minutes ~
19:32 asciilifeform phf: is it permanently welded to the os's eol style or wat?
17:23 phf asciilifeform: probably, i've not tried it on anything but unix, but it's more like you can't open dos files and it just work
~ 3 hours 23 minutes ~
20:47 asciilifeform phf: just nao asciilifeform realized that in fact never tried sbcl on mswin (or w/ dos-style endings anywhere)
~ 33 minutes ~
21:20 phf asciilifeform: i often write scripts to process warez artifacts, which are more often than not latin1 and crlf
21:33 phf (i have this cue file for a cd rip, and i have a cue parser that i wrote for cmucl, which works great, except it wants an external-format '(:latin1 :crlf), which for some reason was cut from sbcl. why? because fuck you)
21:39 verisimilitude The portable method is to avoid these line functions and use character functions or, likely, work solely with octets.
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21:40 verisimilitude This can make using Common Lisp very inconvenient, yes.
21:49 phf http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-07-02#1110264 << that might be a portable way, but it's not the lisp machine way. your system ought to be a superset of the standard, making solving whatever tasks more convenient rather than less
21:49 dulapbot Logged on 2022-07-02 21:36:55 verisimilitude: The portable method is to avoid these line functions and use character functions or, likely, work solely with octets.
21:59 verisimilitude Sure, but Common Lisp wasn't designed that way; Ada's much better for this manner of thing, generally.
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22:00 verisimilitude Anyway, if this is just fiddling in the REPL and not something for release, just read in lines normally and mind the ending carriage return.
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22:01 asciilifeform verisimilitude: that's an arse-nail chair tho.
22:01 dulapbot Logged on 2022-01-04 14:19:43 asciilifeform: 'but you can get used to it, learn to sit down so nail goes in arsehole cleanly' 'nothx'
22:02 asciilifeform which is moar or less precise opposite of what folx using common lisp are fighting for.
22:03 phf http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-07-02#1110268 << you're talking out of your ass about something you have no knowledge off, fuck off.
22:03 dulapbot Logged on 2022-07-02 21:56:32 verisimilitude: Sure, but Common Lisp wasn't designed that way; Ada's much better for this manner of thing, generally.
22:04 asciilifeform phf: d00d seems to have enuff exposure to cl that oughta know sumthing re subj, is what's astonishing here
22:06 phf asciilifeform: it's the dark academia
22:06 asciilifeform in the lolcat sense? sadly likely
22:12 verisimilitude Oh, are we using Lisp Machines, phf, or does the real Common Lisp not actually support that so well?
22:12 verisimilitude I know more about Common Lisp than phf, I'd be willing to wager.
22:13 phf verisimilitude: go fuck yourself, don't ever fucking talk to me again
22:13 verisimilitude The portable parts of Common Lisp aren't so convenient to use; real portability means one can't even depend upon the ASCII character set.
22:13 asciilifeform verisimilitude: there ainta 'real common lisp', there's a buncha variously rusty pc impls
22:13 verisimilitude The character set has certain constraints placed upon it, but only some constraints.
22:14 verisimilitude There's a standard with which I've familiarized myself, and that's the real Common Lisp.
22:15 asciilifeform verisimilitude: got a 100% impl. of it yet ? intend to bake one ?
22:15 phf verisimilitude: you're full of shit
22:15 verisimilitude I'd like to one day, asciilifeform, but that's still a ways away.
22:15 verisimilitude How, phf?
22:15 phf verisimilitude: go. fuck. yourself.
22:16 verisimilitude What have I done to warrant this response?
22:18 asciilifeform verisimilitude: proposed an arse nail chair and doubled down, trololol
22:18 dulapbot (trilema) 2015-08-18 asciilifeform: cabbie: 'this ford is a piece of shit. stalled again.' mircea_popescu: 'i have a solution!' cabbie: 'oh???111' mircea_popescu: 'here, have this broomstick.' cabbie: 'how do i drive customers on that, feed my family' mircea_popescu: 'you misunderstand, my good man. you stuff it in your arse.' cabbie: 'and... how does this feed by family?' mircea_popescu: 'no, you sit there with it in.'
22:18 asciilifeform if aint obv
22:18 verisimilitude It's my fault for offering advice in good faith.
22:19 asciilifeform lol
22:19 asciilifeform some 'advice' it dun much matter in what faith, lol, offered
22:19 verisimilitude Yes, apparently.
22:19 phf which is by the way his modus operandi, a fucking reddit tier conversation. i don't think he even cares about the particular outcome, just to fucking pipe in with some kind of opinion, any kind
22:20 verisimilitude I would be lying if I were to claim to care about phf, so that's partially true.
22:20 asciilifeform phf: d00d is suffering from some kinda severe stimulus starvation on his asteroid, asciilifeform suspects
22:21 verisimilitude That's not false, sure.
22:21 asciilifeform verisimilitude: have you considered becoming embroiled with women ?
22:21 verisimilitude Then I'd have two problems.
22:22 verisimilitude So, no.
22:23 verisimilitude I've not.
22:32 phf http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-07-02#1110268 << this is factually incorrect, nor was common lisp "designed" as such. common lisp is a subset of various maclisp derivative systems, their "common" parts, where the standartization process was about finding the compromise between existing systems. so it was most certainly "designed that way": each individual lisp machine was free to provide superior set of functionality
22:32 phf (e.g. rich arrays or structs or memory management or whatever) as long as it fit into a conformant common subset
22:32 dulapbot Logged on 2022-07-02 21:56:32 verisimilitude: Sure, but Common Lisp wasn't designed that way; Ada's much better for this manner of thing, generally.
22:34 verisimilitude What standard doesn't have a superset?
22:34 phf zoomers and millenials fetishizing the standard, or really not seeing anything beyond the standard means that what we get is a significantly limited functionality
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22:34 verisimilitude I wasn't claiming a superset of Common Lisp doesn't exist.
22:34 verisimilitude We agree, phf.
22:34 phf verisimilitude: you weren't claiming anything, you're just a fucking markov chain generator, fuck off.
22:35 verisimilitude I'm better than a markov chain generator; I'm at least neural network nonsense.
22:35 verisimilitude Listen, phf, I'm obviously touched in the head, so I'm never going to ``fuck off'' and we know that.
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22:37 phf http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-07-02#1110310 << you can see this contrast between older systems that are closer to their lisp machine roots, like cmucl or acl, that provide internally coherent superset of common lisp, beyond just a handful of helper functions, that's driven by the needs of the hackers rather than "nothing beyond the standard" ideology.
22:37 dulapbot Logged on 2022-07-02 22:31:28 phf: zoomers and millenials fetishizing the standard, or really not seeing anything beyond the standard means that what we get is a significantly limited functionality
22:39 phf http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-07-02#1110315 << that's a position statement, rather than prescription. obv this is internet, i can't will you out of my attention space, but at the very least i can express how i feel about what you say, your communication style, etc.
22:39 dulapbot Logged on 2022-07-02 22:33:12 verisimilitude: Listen, phf, I'm obviously touched in the head, so I'm never going to ``fuck off'' and we know that.
22:39 verisimilitude I personally believe more systems should aim to be extremely bare ``nothing beyond the standard'' affairs, because nothing else is truly the language.
22:39 verisimilitude Listen, phf, tell me how to change, and I'll at least listen.
22:39 verisimilitude What, exactly, should I do?
22:40 verisimilitude Believe it or not, I do irritate others at times, unawares; I'm aware I've perhaps a problem, at the least.
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~ 58 minutes ~
23:39 phf http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2022-07-02#1110323 << you don't say. you've got personality issues, that i can't explain to you how to work through in two sentence. you're probably an autist or a psycopath, therapy and intentional mind work helps with that, but you have to will yourself into pursuing them, and also will yourself against the protective mechanisms, of which i'm sure you have many at 40+ and which you
23:39 phf consistently deploy when confronted by others (in the logs). but that's to the point of "irritate others at times". honestly i don't think you particularly care that you do, only as much as when it's an accute moment (this would also be consistent with your "condition").
23:39 dulapbot Logged on 2022-07-02 22:38:16 verisimilitude: Believe it or not, I do irritate others at times, unawares; I'm aware I've perhaps a problem, at the least.
23:46 phf the part that irks me is not that you're an autist, which usually provides for very interesting perspectives and ideas, but that you're a redditor autist, a criminal misuse of autism, meaning that very few things you say have any substance behind them: they are accumulated and internalized most upvoted opinions driven by subjects that are collectively sourced.
23:46 phf
23:48 phf my _honest and earnest_ advise for you is to stop programming entirely and take up a skill that's entirely outside of your domain and outside of internet, figure out how to become a club promoter, or a horse ferrier. learn to mimick human interactions, do a physical cause and effect skill. that i would insist you do if you were my ward, but you're not, so i hope you understand that given that you won't genuinely choose to follow my
23:48 phf guidance (that would be silly anyway, what am i some kind of mp?) and further you would continue being a neusance, it's in my self interest to cease any further communication with you.
23:59 verisimilitude I appreciate the suggestions.
23:59 verisimilitude I'm already taking up such a skill, Latin.
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