#asciilifeform | 2020-10-30

verisimilitude: I am sticking to a lower total payment to discourage acceptance of the contract

06:02

however, since I made an informal offer, and it was taken seriously, I am not going to retract the offer entirely.

06:04

*

adlai has treated composition of a publicly signable spec for this contract as low priority, since you have written of other projects planned for october, and also due to the strong sense that there is no fair way to compose such a contract

06:04

in this context, "fairness" is invalidated by inclusion of a subjective factor in the payment calculation.

06:06

so: a contract where I stipulate that the final payment is some function of the original files, your patches, and a subjective factor that I reveal after reading your patches - is not a fair contract.

06:07

quantifying unfairness between "objective core; subjective bonus; payment in escrow" and "op will deliver!!!!" is imo a waste of time

06:08

*

adlai aims at moon, someday might hit own ass if stopping power and orbital mechanics collude

06:12

*

adlai goes back to reading trilingual human rights predictions without diacriticals, or as he likes to call it - "volunteer fuzzing of literate democracy"

~ 4 hours 35 minutes ~

10:47

wb adlai

10:48

adlai: i can't help but suspect that you've put moar sweat into commissioning that job than it'd've taken to actually do...

10:48

http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-10-29#1023771 << notbad

10:48

Logged on 2020-10-29 19:12:09 dpb: http://danielpbarron.com/images/nsa.jpg

10:49

http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-10-29#1023772 << not esp. surprised. and quite lulzy complaint when coming from the fuckwad who personally censored the snowden papers.

↖

10:49

Logged on 2020-10-29 19:33:21 mats: https://greenwald.substack.com/p/article-on-joe-and-hunter-biden-censored

10:50

$ticker btc usd

10:50

btcinfobot

Current BTC price in USD: $13341.2

10:50

!w poll

10:50

Polling 16 nodes...

10:50

205.134.172.6:8333 : (172-6.core.ai.net) Alive: (0.060s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785

10:50

205.134.172.4:8333 : (172-4.core.ai.net) Alive: (0.102s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785

10:50

205.134.172.28:8333 : Alive: (0.081s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr=0.0.0.0:8333 Blocks=654593 (Operator: whaack)

10:50

108.31.170.3:8333 : (pool-108-31-170-3.washdc.fios.verizon.net) Alive: (0.162s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785 (Operator: asciilifeform)

10:50

54.39.156.171:8333 : (ns562940.ip-54-39-156.net) Alive: (0.183s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785

10:50

205.134.172.27:8333 : Alive: (0.138s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785 (Operator: asciilifeform)

10:50

192.151.158.26:8333 : Alive: (0.194s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785

10:50

208.94.240.42:8333 : Alive: (0.148s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785

10:50

143.202.160.10:8333 : Alive: (0.281s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785

10:50

84.16.46.130:8333 : (182518.pk.3pp.slovanet.sk) Alive: (0.301s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=431437

10:50

185.85.38.54:8333 : (tlapnet-38-54.cust.tlapnet.cz) Alive: (0.295s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785

10:50

213.109.238.156:8333 : Alive: (0.358s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=654785

10:50

176.9.59.199:8333 : (static.199.59.9.176.clients.your-server.de) Alive: (0.391s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=391673 (Operator: jurov)

10:50

185.163.46.29:8333 : (185-163-46-29.mivocloud.com) Alive: (0.069s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=456544

10:52

205.134.172.26:8333 : Busy? (No answer in 120 sec.)

11:04

asciilifeform: remember the old joke about cops having literacy of broken symmetry, being incapable of reading their own handwriting, taking their own advice, etc?

11:05

to be precise: "officer literacies are drawn from outside the symmetric <abstract nonsense>"

11:06

the commission that I'll sign won't explicitly forbid running the code, although it might include the entire text of mircea's licence, just as an example

11:07

however, the commission is specifically for studying the dead code, rather than the live program. what I spend my time doing is messing around with the live bug, so nothing is specified and everything is unexpected; thus, my wish to have someone investigate the dead thing.

11:11

How disappointing, I suppose, adlai.

11:12

I won't do it for the original payment offered, and don't need to harm my wagering ability by accepting it anyway.

11:12

I could study the program without actually running it, but I'd want extra, and it's impossible to reasonably verify anyway.

11:14

On this note, I still come across minor flaws in mine MMC; I didn't practice deoptimization enough. I want to write another MMC, which is completely deoptimized, and so more trivial to know to be correct.

11:14

dead serious question: deoptimized towards what?

11:14

I'll explain one way.

11:14

The program maintains an array of octets, along with metadata.

11:15

It's very bad if the field of some octets disagree with their association.

11:15

should I read your first abstract article about the Meta-Machine Concept, instead of the specific implementation you've been building?

11:15

I just shouldn't allow that possibility; rather than storing octets and rewriting them by rule when the values change, I should use a higher structure which either contains more integer, or a link to the name directly.

11:16

I'm going to answer yes, but it may not be so relevant to this particular conversation; I encourage anyone to read it, however.

11:16

*

adlai hopes you do not expect that readers of your articles adhere to strict-temporal partial-preordering

11:17

It's best to read them in-order, but readers who can handle it shouldn't have any issue.

11:21

*

adlai drops an explicit pointer to Evolution of the Metadata Format, queued as 2nd article after entry point

11:21

Logged on 2020-08-12 16:51:24 verisimilitude: This is the main page for my MMC, a machine code development tool.

11:23

*

adlai 'macroexpands', aka deconstruction _by_the_author_!!_ "deoptimized towards what": there are at least two audiences for an abstract disassembler, and they are the compiler, and the human operator

11:26

verisimilitude: thank you for humoring my thinking-aloud about the unsigned commission. I will continue drafting such a contract, using this specific instance as a hypothetical prototype.

11:27

*

adlai notes that "fail early" is a good practice, and is glad that verisimilitude has declared the offered payment insufficient!

~ 17 minutes ~

11:45

That metadata article describes the on-disk format, not the internals, although they mirror each other by now.

11:46

The primary metadata for each program unit is whether it's part of an instruction or data, any names associated, and how they're associated. Then when a name's value changes, it's updated according to the association.

11:49

The audience is the human operator, never a machine.

11:51

To rephrase, my next MMC will be deoptimized, so that I can more easily know it actually works, and perhaps add optimizations later. The machine code written with it by a human should still have effort expended to optimize it, but that's a different matter than the tool itself.

~ 1 hours 41 minutes ~

13:32

in other olds: you seem to, in your writing, prefer a different cut of first person pronouns than I do, as evidenced in a line where you use both, with seeming interchangeability. care to disambiguate?

13:32

Logged on 2020-09-08 19:33:46 verisimilitude: It's an advanced, interactive machine code development tool of mine own design, and I'm quite proud of the idea, even if my implementation falls short of my mind's eye's ideals.

13:33

*

adlai at first dumped "mine" into the "whomstebasket", although perhaps there is hidden logic overlooked?

13:35

adlai: apropos of nuffin in particular : when was the last time you wrote a proggy ?

↖

13:37

the "whomstebasket", for lack of a previously-existing neologism, is the bin where words that a child has never formally learned get tossed until someone explains what exactly distinguishes a specific word in the bin from the various equivalent words that are found outside of the bin; scilicet "orphan" (both of its distinct meanings from pre-cut trb), "homeomorphism", and the drat blasted example that

13:37

I forgot while writing the first half of this line.

13:38

for lack of a better recently-coined neologism: sentiment vs sentimentality

13:39

*

adlai is quite certain that the third example was along the lines of "who vs whom", i.e., contained a linguistics-nuisance-grade-difference, rather than "what kind of donkey gets homomorphisms and homeomorphisms confused, lol!"

13:40

*

adlai is still busy pinching off the previous 'proggies', they have a nasty tendency to each be their own strand

13:41

however, I have actually begun spending more time reading code; the recent pretext was estimating what could be reasonable inputs for the abandoned commission.

13:44

*

adlai also glanced at the various offerings of "mathematics software" hanging loww off the tree of not-quite-abandoned CL programs, and concluded that not a single one of the special-purpose programs is likely to be a general-purpose one

13:45

"ACL2" comes close, due to being so ambitious a project that I spent wall clock minutes reading documentation - and even waiting for www documentation renderers to run in the client! - before deciding to procrastinate even downloading the program.

13:48

so, at long last, the short straight simple answer to http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-10-30#1023837 is, with deepest regrets, "wrote, rather than just farted around with the ones that already exist? probably 2016"

13:48

Logged on 2020-10-30 13:35:20 asciilifeform: adlai: apropos of nuffin in particular : when was the last time you wrote a proggy ?

13:49

adlai: this acl2 ? i've the dead tree docs here. actually used (very briefly) for an industrial proj.

13:49

adlai: for what were you thinking of using it ?

13:51

pons asinorum for mathematical literacy as a recovering brogrammer

13:52

e.g., dead-tree text says, "prove that such-and-such is a contradiction of suchness", yet it never specifies to whom.

13:52

am I supposed to write the proofs in the margins, then burn the book when there are no margins left?

13:52

send a notebook and fanmail to the... editors? professor? randomly-selected bunch from the acknowledgement?

13:54

*

adlai barely remembers the grade-school textbooks that actually had the balls to charge you for the space, i.e. blank paper, in which you were supposed to dribble your own answers!

13:54

btw, I hope nobody took my namedrop of Gallian's "Abstract Algebra" as a recommendation.

13:55

it was published after the data fog caused the signal to go noise, sure, so it is allowed to use the word "computer" apersonally; yet, the use is ... fraudulent, for lack of an angrier word.

13:55

adlai: i gotta ask, what substance(s) are you taking ?! who the hell cares 'where to write the proof' ?!

13:55

for following the links at the start of each "computer exercise" section just leads you to the webpage that hunt-and-pecks code that works outside of your vision, rather than teaching anything about computers other than "ain't this cool"

13:56

why even study mathematics!

13:56

namedrop != study

13:56

adlai have you actually taken just even ~one~ of these b00x and worked through problems ??

13:56

anything useful, has been proven; and anything unproven, is probably so useless that it has remained unproven.

13:56

problems, yes. entire book? no.

13:57

'why lift weights, crane can do it better' ?

13:57

*

adlai lurks in #asciilifeform to grep instead of http

13:57

/away "read the fucking away messages!" - afk,ish

13:58

adlai: lol, you can get best of both worlds, download the db, then psql query..

13:58

( it's on bottom of log www page, updated hourly )

~ 55 minutes ~

14:54

I do incorporate new words or uses thereof into my writing, as I learn of them, and I occasionally make mistakes, yes, adlai.

14:55

When I wondered about ``alternate'' and ``alternative'' and whatnot, I learned about it, and realized I, along with most others, use the words interchangeably, and therefore erroneously.

14:55

I've updated much, but not yet all, of my writing to correct this.

14:58

I'll continue to learn more and update my writing to accomodate the new constraints.

14:59

Using ``mine'' before vowel sounds is the newest addition; it's one of the beautiful symmetries in English which has been abandoned, ``my'' and ``mine'' to ``thy'' and ``thine''.

~ 42 minutes ~

15:42

please do not consider my question as specifying a constraint; while I was taught the trivial parsing of "whom" as the accusative to whose [sic, because I hate the world] nominative, this was done in remedial grammar class instead of "english", and the explanation based on breaking the elisions does sound better than the voodoo approach of "enough cases declensions conjugations and other unnamed

15:42

unsortable dimensions and we will speak everyone at everything always forever" of classical linguistics.

15:43

*

adlai recalls the grammar instruction during "English" class as beginning and ending with owning a copy of Strunk&White, knowing how to find the lexemes "who's" and "whose", and then getting angry because Jesus's posessive has more esses than Yossarian the Assyrian.

~ 1 hours 4 minutes ~

16:48

Say, what do you use for your email setups? Mine is horrible. I only accept mail from local, so I must ssh in to send any, which means I must use emacs on the remote machine for this. I want to have OpenSMTPd check a queue directory for me, so I may use TRAMP, but don't know how to configure this.

16:49

I also must ssh in and use remote Emacs to use this IRC, which is part of why I'm not so active here. I need better SMPT and IRC setups.

~ 1 hours 24 minutes ~

18:13