Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2020-05-23 | 2020-05-25 → ↓
10:18 asciilifeform !w poll
10:18 watchglass Polling 11 nodes...
10:18 watchglass 205.134.172.6:8333 : (172-6.core.ai.net) Alive: (0.082s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
10:18 watchglass 205.134.172.26:8333 : Alive: (0.082s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
10:18 watchglass 108.31.170.3:8333 : (pool-108-31-170-3.washdc.fios.verizon.net) Alive: (0.097s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549 (Operator: asciilifeform)
10:18 watchglass 205.134.172.4:8333 : (172-4.core.ai.net) Alive: (0.083s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
10:18 watchglass 205.134.172.27:8333 : Alive: (0.144s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549 (Operator: asciilifeform)
10:18 watchglass 208.94.240.42:8333 : Alive: (0.169s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
10:18 watchglass 192.151.158.26:8333 : Alive: (0.196s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
10:18 watchglass 143.202.160.10:8333 : Alive: (0.260s) V=70001 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.7.0.1/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
10:18 watchglass 213.109.238.156:8333 : Alive: (0.342s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
10:18 watchglass 188.121.168.69:8333 : (rev-188-121-168-69.radiolan.sk) Alive: (0.388s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
10:18 watchglass 103.36.92.112:8333 : (terebe.ns01.net) Alive: (0.622s) V=99999 (/therealbitcoin.org:0.9.99.99/) Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=631549
~ 1 hours 11 minutes ~
11:29 feedbot http://thimbron.com/2020/05/exploring-wot-search-project/ << Thimbron -- Exploring WoT Search Project
11:31 adlai oh look asciilifeform someone's building a kyristor again
11:32 adlai or perhaps, an exercise in disambiguation?
↖
11:36 adlai http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-20#1012666 << there is no 'again', yet, although i actually do have a "receipt" of some sort for the last time!
11:36 snsabot Logged on 2020-05-20 09:32:29 asciilifeform: lol adlai , thrown outta the corps again ?
11:36 adlai it says something along the lines of "adlai? we probably can remember who that was, if it really matters, but it doesn't"
11:42 adlai it actually contains a surprisingly nonexistent amount of information, although these things often hint at much more than they explicitly claim.
11:44 adlai for example, it contains too little information to neither value, nor price, the soldier, although as stalin may have quipped, the soldier outta formation, ain't worth none in formation
11:45 adlai (one of the easiest commands to remember is the information disclosable to captors, and that actually does have enough information to price a soldier)
↖
~ 15 minutes ~
12:01 asciilifeform http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-24#1012857 << the 'official' search engines have degraded to the point where it would be ~very~ difficult to do worse
12:01 snsabot Logged on 2020-05-24 11:32:48 adlai: or perhaps, an exercise in disambiguation?
12:02 asciilifeform http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/asciilifeform/2020-05-24#1012863 << the proverbial 'name, rank, and number' ?
12:02 snsabot Logged on 2020-05-24 11:45:48 adlai: (one of the easiest commands to remember is the information disclosable to captors, and that actually does have enough information to price a soldier)
12:04 adlai aha, almost!
12:04 adlai name, rank, job, and the average airspeed velocity of an F-16i
12:04 adlai (the number is in the identification document)
12:05 asciilifeform lol, what else is in there... logarithm table ?
12:05 asciilifeform sounds rather '30s sovok-esque
12:05 adlai believe it or not, some sort of identification stub is actually considered essential! in case you need to give an ambulance or somesuch a list of its contents.
12:06 asciilifeform adlai: they never invented 'dog tags' ?
12:06 adlai well israel was built, fed, and defended, on the bones of soviet expats
12:06 adlai yes, there are dog tags
12:07 adlai although dog tags are heavy pieces of metal. if you need to collect 300 pieces of id, and you're not quite cypherpunk enough to scan each soldier's neck chip, yet, then you collect 300 pieces of paper.
12:07 asciilifeform neck chip already sop or notyet ?
12:08 adlai not yet, although they are probably quite close to archiving uncompressed genetic samples.
12:09 adlai iirc, my first ~2 hours consisted of ... fingers, palms, retina (maybe both?), blood, and dental
12:09 adlai could be that retina was not an actual retinal scan, and just an, uh, "eye exam"
12:10 asciilifeform in usa, standard, entirely ordinary eye exam includes retina photo. since '90s.
12:11 Joe65 asciilifeform I found the forums from Qntra and BingoBoingo was nice enough to point me here. I am interested in Bitcoin, specifically I am trying to archive classic Bitcoin posts/essays in a github repo.
12:12 asciilifeform Joe65: why shithub?!!
12:12 Joe65 I am not super technical
12:12 adlai free markdown postprocessing
12:12 Joe65 It hists GitHub pages for me, so I can have a pretty front end for people to browse the archives
12:12 adlai also, iirc, you have to opt-out of them archiving your content in their subglacier volcanoproof bunker
12:12 Joe65 *hosts
12:12 asciilifeform Joe65: sure, but really, 1st choice to host something is ms ?!
12:13 adlai no guarantees that they'll give you a copy of the archive after the supervolcano turns the sky into nitrous oxide
12:13 Joe65 I wish I had a good answer for you
12:13 Joe65 I don't. I was looking for good places to freely host the repo and website and found GH pages
12:14 adlai Joe65, how about just reading the classics, writing on a piece of paper or notepad links.txt the addresses of the particularly good ones, and afterwards making sure that e.g. archive.is and web.archive.org have a copy ?
↖
12:15 adlai alternatively, become super technical
12:15 Joe65 I am trying to become more technical
12:15 adlai excellent. i'm gonna go play taps at the setting sun, something that nobody ever asked me to do :)
12:16 Joe65 My goal is to republish the articles in the repo, so there is a place to find them in case they are deleted or not indexed
12:17 asciilifeform Joe65: such item disappear considerably more often from shithub, then from orig. sources
12:19 Joe65 I have had a good experience (so far) with GitHub. I appreciate your concerns. I am open to more open solutions.
12:20 Joe65 Besides this being on gh, I am trying to track down content from the early days, before 2015
12:21 Joe65 Somehow I found myself on Trilema and was floored at the years of conent, TMSR, and all the folks involved
12:22 asciilifeform Joe65: for #t, phf has plain txt logs .
12:23 Joe65 404
12:23 Joe65 nm
12:24 asciilifeform Joe65: for trb, jurov also has plain txt
12:25 asciilifeform and asciilifeform's logger has complete db , of errything since apr. 2016, and snapshotted hourly
12:27 Joe65 Thanks for sharing
12:27 Joe65 That is a ton of information, I appreciate that
12:27 * asciilifeform will bbl
~ 2 hours 4 minutes ~
14:32 adlai Joe65, to dmca-proof a github repo that serves purely as a mirror, include detailed, and legally compliant, license information
14:33 adlai "crap was found on the internet without an explicit license, and is thus treated as having been placed in the public domain by the authors" is probably good enough, fwiw, although not watertight
14:34 adlai (there are quite a lot of jurisdictions where "public domain" is worse than "your honor, kindly tell the witness to hire a bodyguard after leaving the courthouse")
~ 26 minutes ~
15:00 asciilifeform the approach to censor-proofing that actually worx is 1) mirror the bloody thing 2) get 9000 people to do same.
15:00 asciilifeform errything else is an exercise in self-delusion
15:01 asciilifeform ( the most effective censor is -- nobody giving a damn. is how we lost most ancient works. )
15:01 asciilifeform conversely, euclid survived, even tho 'forgot' to 'include explicit license'.
15:06 asciilifeform the ultimate 'mirror' is: 1e6 paper copies, widely circulated. but 1st you gotta actually produce something that folx would give a damn about.
15:07 asciilifeform ( most recently, this approach worked for the orig. pgp. )
15:08 asciilifeform i cribbed from this when included paper copy of complete src w/ each FG .
15:09 asciilifeform ( not 1e6 copies; nor even 1e3; plus, errything still on www. but erryone who wants, indeed has a copy )
~ 1 hours 30 minutes ~
16:39 asciilifeform this is specifically the maximally wrong approach. for ~exactly~ the same reason why vpnism is the maximally wrong approach to privacy.
16:39 snsabot Logged on 2020-05-24 12:14:32 adlai: Joe65, how about just reading the classics, writing on a piece of paper or notepad links.txt the addresses of the particularly good ones, and afterwards making sure that e.g. archive.is and web.archive.org have a copy ?
16:41 asciilifeform 'oh i dun need crypto, i use $vpn' == 'oh i dun need to mirror, i put link in archive.gov' .
16:42 asciilifeform the 'archive services' aint working for ~you~. and their interest in 'anti-censorship' is quite selective .
16:47 Joe65 asciilifeform I've got nearly 500 Bitcoin articles loaded in the repo in markdown, also each month contains a pdf that could be printed out. Another 400 need to be loaded.
~ 1 hours 29 minutes ~
18:17 asciilifeform Joe65: what do you mean by 'bitcoin articles' ?
18:19 asciilifeform cuz what typically passes for this on the net, no self-respecting fish would want to be wrapped in, and no self-respecting parrot would want lining his cage
18:20 * asciilifeform was put off ~entire subject~ for ~years~ by reading 'bitcoin articles'...
↖
~ 1 hours 20 minutes ~
19:41 adlai glad as ever to identify global minima!
19:42 adlai at the second-least, stick a disco ball on the suspected global extremum, and wait for someone else to measure the relevants
19:44 asciilifeform adlai: i'm quite content to mark the minefields w/ flags. if other folx want to mark'em with their sprayed guts, it aint any of my biz
19:47 adlai what kinda mine you been stepping on! sheesh.
19:53 * trinque never had acid connects good enough to produce adlai-grade word-salad.
~ 1 hours 27 minutes ~
21:21 Vexual tbf conference in goa perhaps?
~ 28 minutes ~
21:49 feedbot http://mvdstandard.net/2020/05/ships-with-iranian-fuel-make-it-to-venezuela/ << The Montevideo Standard -- Ships With Iranian Fuel Make It To Venezuela
21:51 Joe65 asciilifeform "Bitcoin articles" means blog posts and essays. I am trying my best to filter through the bullshit. Everyone here has many more years experience with Bitcoin than me. I am sure there are some gaps and this is just a personal project I am running.
22:03 shinohai Joe65: is this Shithub repo public yet?
22:04 * shinohai will read ....
22:05 Joe65 https://github.com/bitcoinwords/bitcoinwords.github.io
22:05 Joe65 posts folder has the markdown\
22:05 Joe65 https://bitcoinwords.github.io/tags/
22:05 Joe65 Html there
22:07 Joe65 Here's the monthly journals https://bitcoinwords.github.io/categories/journals/
22:09 shinohai ty
22:24 Vexual publish or perish
22:26 adlai cool soap film thingy, Joe65 !
22:32 adlai please consider removing some of the excess gloss; it seems surprising to me that there are ~5GB of, uh, 'words'
↖
22:32 Vexual Joe, BingoBoingo is otherwise engaged these days, so I gotta ask: "Who is your daddy and what does he do"?
22:33 adlai Vexual: how long has it been since your last profession?
22:33 Vexual What's 0 divided by zero ?
22:34 Joe65 error
22:36 Joe65 adlai what soap film thingy? what do you mean gloss?
22:39 Vexual I'm always professional
22:42 adlai Joe65, at the top of the readme, you have a cool image, that's the "soap film thingy"
22:42 Joe65 Okay, I thought a screenshot would be helpful to direct people to the website
22:42 adlai by "gloss", i mean everything that is not text in markdown files.
22:43 Joe65 I see what you mean
22:43 adlai specifically, over a gigabyte of metadata created by git. you can significantly optimize your usage of git, if you insist on using it.
22:43 Joe65 I am a git noob, I use gh desktop fwiw
22:44 * adlai has never used github's desktop tool
22:44 Joe65 I foundthe soapfilm image on unsplash
22:44 Joe65 I am sure you haven't used GH desktop!
22:44 Joe65 lol
22:45 adlai maybe it's an oil thing, like the displays behind the performers half a century ago? possibly just a digital effect.
22:46 adlai whatever it is, it looks cool in the browser, although it is extraneous in the _minimal_ archive of the articles.
22:46 adlai if GH desktop supports "submodules", then have the directory with the articles themselves be a submodule; then, you have one repository with only the articles, and one with all the webpage metadata
22:46 Vexual https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yzx0HTCuydg
22:47 Joe65 is it possible to mute people in freenode?
22:47 adlai /ignore
22:47 Joe65 thanks
22:47 adlai your IRC client handles the muting
22:47 Joe65 this is the first time I've ever used irc
22:48 Joe65 pardon the ignorance
22:48 adlai ignorance is not a sin!
22:48 Joe65 Regarding the separate repo, I have not thought of moving posts and images to a separate repo
22:49 Joe65 it performs pretty well, page load etc
22:49 adlai when asciilifeform shows up, he'll probably berate me for suggesting ways to make git less horrid.
22:50 Joe65 yesterday I was dealing with hazing about the fact it is on gh, period.
22:53 adlai here's your "git for people who are on IRC for the first time, and only came here because of Bitcoin" summary: git is a tool for building private blockchains. github is microsoft's archive website, for directories structured as git trees. there is no fee structure built into git itself, so you don't notice that your git tree contains excessive data until you reexamine the entire structure of an
22:53 adlai existing copy of the entire archive, as I just did, in order to obtain an independent copy of your repo.
22:54 _joerodgers thanks for the explanation
22:54 * adlai geeked out on git for about a year before rediscovering bitcoin
22:55 adlai in my case, "rediscovering" just meant "encountering the existing Bitcoin implementation for the second time", rather than inventing it myself.
22:56 _joerodgers for me, it is a hosting provider for a webpage. It can also be easily copied and I can use git to push new articles and cosmetic changes easily with gh desktop
22:56 * adlai is a little younger than some of the other folks you've been reading, who actually were busy inventing a bitcoin when they encountered the already-invented Bitcoin
22:56 adlai it is quite a convenient tool
22:57 adlai if you dig deep enough in the old IRC archives (of other channels) you'll find me arguing several times with asciilifeform about this specific tool, and a few other similar ones.
22:57 _joerodgers I still don't understand how to understand that the tree has excessive data
22:57 adlai what content do you want archived?
22:57 _joerodgers Not sure if i care because it just works for what I need it to do
22:58 Vexual not a flight commander then young joe?
22:58 _joerodgers The goal of the project is to track down great Bitcoin blog posts and put them in the repo, with authors consent.
22:58 adlai what you have currently setup for archival is, not only a website of articles, but also your own work history, of every change made to the structure of that website, for its entire history
22:59 _joerodgers Vexual yesterday I sent my first pgp and got on IRC so no, I am not a captain
23:00 adlai if, for example, you resize the image at the top of the README, and make it a few pixels narrower in each direction, or change the saturation to be thismuch instead of thatmuch, and then `git commit` that change, you get another image in there. the old image is not gone.
23:01 _joerodgers oh really
23:01 _joerodgers I had no idea
23:01 adlai analogized to bitcoin: every transaction destroys one coin and creates another, yes, but every transaction also creates a new transaction. so each transaction increases the amount of transactions by... one! and another. and another. etc.
23:01 _joerodgers I thought it was just gone
23:02 adlai the whole point of systems like git, and bitcoin, is that things are not "just gone", rather, they become part of the readable archive.
23:02 Vexual here i thought joe had me on ignore
23:03 _joerodgers Vexual you just posting shit videos, I wanted to know if it is possible
23:03 Vexual try it cunt.
23:04 _joerodgers adlai well fuck, I didn't realize it saved every resized image too. I run a image compressor like once a month on new things I upload
23:04 adlai git, unlike bitcoin, makes it possible to rebuild the history so that you actually do delete things; in bitcoin, this would defeat the whole point of bitcoin, whereas with git, this lets you structure repositories more efficiently
↖
23:04 Vexual personally I like your www
23:04 _joerodgers but I guess that doesn't really matter
23:05 adlai ideally, git would store the fact of compression as the difference between the two images, rather than a copy of each :)
23:05 adlai however that is slightly smarter than the aptly-named git
23:06 _joerodgers you know more about this than me, I am just trying to save blog posts in a library for future bitcoiners
23:08 adlai there's a chance that my understanding is already outdated. i studied git during the same years when everyone's favorite romanian expatriate was studying bitcoin.
23:09 * adlai has not studied git much in the last ~5 years, beyond silently raging at changes to the commandline interface to the exact same backend tools that have not changed in over a decade
23:10 _joerodgers I don't build the "gh pages website" locally, so every little change I have to push to the repo in order to see it.
23:10 adlai the good news is that your article archive can actually be quite compact, whether or not you use git
23:10 _joerodgers fml
23:10 _joerodgers the articles and images are the two important folders
23:10 Vexual no. listen
23:11 Vexual not fml
23:11 adlai the git metadata is ~10x the size of those
23:12 _joerodgers kmfao
23:14 Vexual https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TSffz_bl6zo check your irc commands
23:14 adlai consider ditching the covers directory
23:14 adlai after all, this is the high-level algorithm recommended by book publishers to those who are most interested in the contents of the book!
23:17 _joerodgers Vexual takes me back to the skating rink days
23:17 adlai my guess is that github have their own optimizations in place - proprietary, of course - for updates to the website
23:18 Vexual https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oe-BV7OYepI
23:19 adlai does the GH Desktop client let you make rebases?
23:19 _joerodgers I don't know what that is
23:19 adlai rebase is git's way to delete commits, among other things
23:20 _joerodgers no clue
23:20 adlai so you can make several changes, settle on what you like, and then delete all the history except for one grand commit that includes all the changes you made
23:20 _joerodgers I would be 100% cool to delete all the previous commits lol
23:20 adlai a form of 'regrind' in the cool kids' version control system
23:22 Vexual call the waambulance
23:22 adlai waats a waambulance, Vexual ?
23:23 Vexual I'm not sure. never needed it
23:23 Vexual wzlk on precision
23:23 adlai they're often good for getting places fast
23:23 Vexual i've heard that
23:24 adlai when you have to go so fast that you can't even go real quick
23:24 * adlai hopes that after reading enough adlai, trinque will be able to make such finely chopped wordsalad too, and adlai can retire to never using irc again
23:25 Vexual let it be known that twinque in chine is almost precisely twink
23:28 Vexual https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXnT3LFTc-s
23:28 Vexual i'll protect twink
23:29 adlai isn't it just a name? that's like saying that mircea in idiotistan is meerkat, and adlai in japan is adoodai.
23:32 Vexual good point
23:34 Vexual joe trader quit
23:35 adlai probably busy reading about something other than Bitcoin, for a change!
23:36 Vexual did you go to goa whewn you quit the army?
23:36 Vexual heya joe
23:37 _joerodgers Hey, I can't figure out how to get the channels to stay subscribed sorry I keep dropping
23:39 Vexual https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q77YBmtd2Rw
23:39 _joerodgers ninja
23:40 _joerodgers chappy is underrated
23:41 Vexual chappy best flik
23:43 Vexual https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fe82eYRjiBU
23:57 adlai _joerodgers: there are publicly-readable logs of several channels linked from the /topic for exactly this reason, and so that I can, without ever having been in that channel, do things like:
23:57 adlai http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/agriculturalsupremacy/2020-04-15#1001900 << cool!
23:57 snsabot (agriculturalsupremacy) 2020-04-15 shinohai: TIL A policeman and news editor in Uruguay were given permission by gov to participate in a duel: https://archive.is/RWQUc
23:58 adlai now, to find out whether that archive is.gov
23:58 Vexual https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikJJX02G4Fk
23:58 adlai a job for "a greater liar than Baudolino"
23:59 _joerodgers I bookmarked the logs of several channels
23:59 _joerodgers gonna be a heroic effort to start reading (scanning/searching) through them for blog posts of interest
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