#trilema | 2018-02-13

Logged on 2018-02-10 14:58 mircea_popescu: nevertheless, reality can only be elided at significant personal sacrifice and over short intervals. so, to repeat it : there is no future for the republic without an isp.

01:50

hanbot

i suppose the amount of time it's taken to get to this point while the same death knell was present makes it easy to imagine things could just continue as they are, but i tell you that seems pretty dangerous.

01:51

hanbot

and i'd think salvaging bb's mission closer to the goal --any point closer than zero--, would be just about top priority. hence figure it out, and well before wednesday morning comes around.

~ 1 hours 5 minutes ~

02:56

diana_coman

I admit I don't really get what the sticking point is there in asciilifeform's calculations: the potential tax on shipped equipment? the cost of BingoBoingo ? the cost of racks? not enough sure revenue (how the fuck)? what?

~ 3 hours 1 minutes ~

05:58

ave1

Hanbot and Diana_coman, I thought so too. The past couple of days has cost me a few nights sleep. My thoughts here: http://ave1.org/2018/from-the-proverbial-peanut-gallery/

~ 55 minutes ~

06:53

Gah, the logs I wake to of late.

~ 17 minutes ~

07:11

<mircea_popescu> BingoBoingo soo, you're buying your ticket wednesday or what was it ? << I was planning on picking it up Thursday if there has been no interest through Wednesday in channel on a takeover mission for this venture. I can extend the timeline a bit, if it is prudent to do so.

07:15

<hanbot> and i'd think salvaging bb's mission closer to the goal --any point closer than zero--, would be just about top priority. hence figure it out, and well before wednesday morning comes around. << I can only hope other people are doing math and weighting costs versus warming up their other ISP plans they may have put on hold.

~ 1 hours 54 minutes ~

09:10

diana_coman

quite some very good points there in my opinion ave1

09:12

diana_coman

BingoBoingo, have you read that?

09:23

I am re-reading it a few times. Certainly it is helpful in a way that the gabriel_laddel-ism http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2018/02/09/a-long-descent-into-the-cargo-cult/#comment-114684 is not

09:26

TomServo

I'd very much like to see this endeavor succeed and would gladly offer assistance. I don't want to get out line if this discussion is for L1.

09:28

TomServo: At this point the discussion looks like it would be a way to get into L1

09:32

http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-13#1783471 << I can't speak for others, but talk (and opinions) are cheap! Only one willing to consider shouldering the post-mp burden/risk thus far has been asciilifeform.

09:32

Logged on 2018-02-13 06:48 hanbot: speaking of that wednesday, it's rather incredible how little discussion there is on the matter, especially considering http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-10#1783160

09:33

I'm a regular poorfag, but fuck, what is it FOOD for BingoBoingo that is standing in the way in alf's calcs? If that's what it takes I can throw a months worth of food in btc to bb as a one-time gift. (Though I think issue was longterm coin-to-food conveyor)

09:33

Bbl, mines

09:37

TomServo

For clarification, is the S.NSA gear verboten? Are phf's flight/courier arrangements still on the table?

09:39

lobbes: If necessary BingoBoingo can do some ugly things to keep fed. http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-11#1783247 Follows from BingoBoingo being a sort of religious fanatic ideologically aligned with the Republic, even if my inexperience and inability to effectively self direct are an impediment lords taking over this venture would need to compensate for.

09:39

Logged on 2018-02-11 14:00 mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo what your lack of experience isn't informing you is that you have a very significant advantage. your ~7k per annum cost compares very VERY favorable to what empire pays to hire a walmart drone (25k or so base + 20k or so in overload). the walmart drone costs 6x what you do, and i daresay they do not do 1/6th of what you do. just because you came out short of lordship in the field does not now mean the baseline of

09:44

That being said for my health I would like a proposal that includes the possibility of a BingoBoingo exit date away from cargo cult Alcoholics Anonymous

09:44

I've done ugly things to stay fed .... worked with fatty camgirls, etc. But echoing http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-10#1783160 none of my ventures have any future without isp.

09:44

Logged on 2018-02-10 14:58 mircea_popescu: nevertheless, reality can only be elided at significant personal sacrifice and over short intervals. so, to repeat it : there is no future for the republic without an isp.

09:45

Aside from Qntra I have no reliable income, so that brings all to screeching halt here.

09:47

*

BingoBoingo to shut up for a bit and compile as much of the ave1 requested material together into a blog and explore the possibility of making arrangements for a Dentist to follow the BingoBoingo camp to old country.

~ 26 minutes ~

10:14

I don't want to through good money after bad here.

10:15

So, indeed, I think we all want to see the ISP idea work. But after this entire snafu, I'm still confused as to what went wrong here. The foundation's plan here was in motion to bring machines there directly. Because of the ugly possible VAT or dissappearing of boxes themselves.

10:16

If part of the plan was to build machines on demand for customers, it sounds like we're in the wrong locale for that.

10:23

I'm gonna look at some things, will report back later.

10:32

deedbot

http://www.thedrinkingrecord.com/2018/02/13/twelve-runs-of-speedtest-cli-from-the-qntra-server/ << Bingo Blog - Twelve Runs Of speedtest-cli From The Qntra Server

10:40

http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-13#1783489 << S.NSA gear is not verboten, but my absolute deadline to leave expires in less than an hour

10:40

Logged on 2018-02-13 14:37 TomServo: For clarification, is the S.NSA gear verboten? Are phf's flight/courier arrangements still on the table?

10:40

On it.

10:47

TomServo

Sucks, I think getting that gear there was a critical piece.

10:48

Yeah. Stand-by.

10:52

<< this is the key question needing resolving, imo. "Is it worth it to continue throwing good money into orc-hole?". After BB's deep descent into the cargo cult looking for chassis n' such, it is certainly suggestive of more "tree-forts everywhere" ala http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-08#1782956

10:52

Logged on 2018-02-08 23:20 mircea_popescu: http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-08#1782932 << the only point to my eyes is that someone fucked in the head enough to run something they call "datacenter" without one ton of spare racks laying about is not distinguishable from three twelve year old white boys in a "tree fort" running a "porn business" through taking complicatedly filtered ipad shots of their own palms.

10:52

But for now I'll shut up and leave room for my betters to work out that question. Back to saeculum mines, and then archive-o-tronics

10:56

http://btcbase.org/log/2018-02-13#1783475 << this is not that clear to me. what i've penciled out is that there are some ~1.8kusd monthly of rack rental buy side floating around, and mircea_popescu's plan as i understand it was to build and rent vpsen to get to breakeven, which still needs someone in teh forums hawking vps

10:56

Logged on 2018-02-13 07:56 diana_coman: I admit I don't really get what the sticking point is there in asciilifeform's calculations: the potential tax on shipped equipment? the cost of BingoBoingo ? the cost of racks? not enough sure revenue (how the fuck)? what?

10:56

Can't sell what doesn't exist, neh?

10:57

shinohai: elaborate?

10:58

BingoBoingo: how much revenue was going to be pulled down by non-vps customers per month? The foundation had said "we want 2U", so that accounts for us.

10:59

If there are currently no vps boxxen to sell, cannot exactly sell anything besides promisetronic

10:59

(trying to establish how much VPS needs to be sold to make up the difference just to break even on bills)

10:59

shinohai: obviousl.

11:00

TomServo: it's critical only in a sense that the immediate opportunity was squandered, but right now most important is to provide bb with enough fiat to stay afloat, next requirement is to provide bb with enough fiat to pay dc fees, because those two are the ones that are going to shut down the operation

11:05

i'm guessing the initial subscription of just rack space comes to around 1.7k/mo; waving hands at a vps setup "special get us to breakeven" deal slicing up one of the mega boxes asciilifeform described implies a breakeven at some 57 monthly rentals at 20 usd/mo (which buys 4.5GB of ram, notbad.jpg in the grand scheme of things, but the tiny straw of bandwidth weighs against this)

11:08

ave1

BingoBoingo: read carefully these are not requests but suggestions, I even left some out. Also, at this point you still have a partner and I do not know your arrangements, so check before publishing what might be important / secret business operational data.

11:08

ben_vulpes: Another higher margin activity which can be marketed is good old fashioned shared hosting.

11:15

ave1: At this point the journey to here is documented in existing blog posts, there is no harm in collecting that data into a single larger post for the convenience not only of people who might be considering taking on this particular effort, but for those who may want to undertake their own as well.

11:15

neglecting shared hosting, and again waving hands at a sales rate on vps slicen of 10/mo and zero churn etc, thing could hit breakeven on the rack alone sometime in august

~ 23 minutes ~

11:39

ben_vulpes: it's $1423 for 20/200 pipe and $900 for 2.5KW rack (his pipe is effectively 18/183)

11:40

phf: yeah i rolled IVA into that number, is that wrong for some reason?

11:46