Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans
← 2013-12-24 | 2013-12-26 → ↓
01:53 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16900 @ 0.00083595 = 14.1276 BTC [+] {3}
~ 48 minutes ~
02:42 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9500 @ 0.00083228 = 7.9067 BTC [-]
02:50 assbot [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 343 @ 0.002918 = 1.0009 BTC [-] {2}
02:56 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4205 @ 0.00083143 = 3.4962 BTC [-]
~ 29 minutes ~
03:25 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 200 @ 0.00083204 = 0.1664 BTC [+]
03:31 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.3209899 BTC [+]
~ 19 minutes ~
03:51 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.3209799 BTC [-]
03:52 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 13 @ 0.32351881 = 4.2057 BTC [+] {6}
03:56 assbot [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 7 @ 0.048999 = 0.343 BTC [-]
04:05 assbot [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 85 @ 0.002917 = 0.2479 BTC [-]
~ 20 minutes ~
04:25 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1500 @ 0.00083683 = 1.2552 BTC [+]
~ 57 minutes ~
05:23 BingoBoingo ;;later tell mircea_popescu "Have a translation for your homosexuality article up. Your comment system did not like the full text http://trilema.com/2010/tipologiile-homosexualitatii/#comment-97094 "
05:23 gribble The operation succeeded.
05:30 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6027 @ 0.0008351 = 5.0331 BTC [-]
05:42 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1550 @ 0.00083396 = 1.2926 BTC [-]
~ 17 minutes ~
05:59 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27850 @ 0.00083633 = 23.2918 BTC [+] {4}
06:05 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9850 @ 0.00083396 = 8.2145 BTC [-] {2}
06:09 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 10 @ 0.305012 = 3.0501 BTC [-] {8}
~ 55 minutes ~
07:05 IVANUS hey
07:05 IVANUS Anybody there?
07:06 IVANUS Hey . any one are used this graphs http://bitcoin-wisdom.net/ .. everybody say it's Amazing , But i don't know how can i used it
07:10 monolithik don't click on that link, IVANUS has been trying the same virus link in #bitcoin
07:10 BingoBoingo Ah, sucks to use WIndows
07:16 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 29 @ 0.2991524 = 8.6754 BTC [-] {10}
07:18 BingoBoingo I can confirm IVANUS is just trying to spread a windows wallet stealer.
07:18 kakobrekla well, i guess it justifies the anus in his name
07:19 monolithik I reported the link to google.
07:19 monolithik hopefully you should get a warning in chrome when you try to visit in a few days.
07:19 kakobrekla aha
07:20 kakobrekla NSA wants to protect its users from backdoors so they can have them
07:21 kakobrekla the good news is we are not paranoid, everyone IS trying to kill us
07:22 nubbins` hi folks
07:22 kakobrekla hi
07:22 monolithik nubbins I think you forgot to log in
07:23 nubbins` nope, i'm all logged in :D
07:23 kakobrekla nubbins` about half yirga and half harrar seems best so far
07:24 nubbins` ah, you're making your own blends already!
07:24 BingoBoingo kakobrekla: Who uses chrome except the NSA loggin shit logs?
07:24 kakobrekla heh
07:25 nubbins` little dusting of snow here last night: imgur.com/dtKh987
07:25 nubbins` sorry, that may not highlight for some
07:25 nubbins` http://imgur.com/dtKh987
07:25 ozbot imgur: the simple image sharer
07:26 BingoBoingo kakobrekla: I do want to than asciilifeform for his links to OpenGenera and lispmachine videos. I opened the link in the LISP browser and saw spam.
07:26 BingoBoingo Assumed it was harmful.
07:30 BingoBoingo nubbins`: Looks like a bit more than a dusing.
07:31 BingoBoingo Haven't seen shit like that since I was in grad school in the ever so slightly north of where I am nao.
07:31 nubbins` heh
07:31 nubbins` supposed to be 20cm by noon-ish
07:31 nubbins` hm, sounds like the wife is up
07:32 nubbins` merry christmas, heathens
07:33 BingoBoingo Did anyone else's favored liquor stores give them gifts when they picked up cigarettes yesterday?
07:35 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 40 @ 0.00301014 = 0.1204 BTC [-] {6}
07:37 BingoBoingo kakobrekla: I still can believe on the forum trust TradeFortress is only a quarter as bad as Garr255
07:38 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23375 @ 0.00083092 = 19.4228 BTC [-] {3}
07:38 BingoBoingo Maybe one of them gets a mistrust discount for being a child?
07:41 kakobrekla lol BingoBoingo
07:42 kakobrekla but i think garr is even younger than tf
07:42 kakobrekla afaik garr just went to college no, whats that, around 17?
07:42 BingoBoingo Well, Garr is definitely around 19-22.
07:43 BingoBoingo TF went from 28 when he smelled less bad to being 16-18 after the inputs hack.
07:43 BingoBoingo i guess if you average it out TF is still older.
07:43 kakobrekla lol
07:44 kakobrekla wait he claimed to be 28 first then changed to 18?
07:44 kakobrekla or you just guessing
07:44 kakobrekla i thought the general word was early twenties
07:44 BingoBoingo kakobrekla: I think TechCrunch called him 28 when they reviewed CoinChat as an obligation free way to get BTC
07:45 kakobrekla aha
07:45 BingoBoingo Then after the hack he claimed various ages that would be of legal minority
07:45 BingoBoingo A decade younger than he claimed, back when he was solvent-ish
07:47 kakobrekla at least he got himself a silver membership with the foundation
07:48 kakobrekla that was the capt obvious red flag not to deal with the service
07:48 BingoBoingo Here's the reference to being 28: Coinchat’s founder, a 28-year-old male freelance web developer based in Australia who (in keeping with Bitcoin’s shadowy origins) wishes to remain anonymous to avoid any Bitcoin associated “drama” or the threat of “doxxing”, tells TechCrunch the service has been up and running for about five months. -> http://techcrunch.com/2013/08/31/coinchat/
07:49 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.29799999 BTC [-]
07:49 kakobrekla did he get doxxed after the 'hack?
07:50 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.298 BTC [+]
07:50 BingoBoingo kakobrekla: It seems so. Not that dox are useful for anything, but someone going by "Mt Dox" is trying to make a name off of this doxxing
07:50 BingoBoingo And http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-11-08/bitcoin-site-hacked-founder-says/5078148 There he pretends to be a decade younger.
07:51 kakobrekla >TradeFortress, who says he is not much older than 18, does not want to be identified because he is worried about his personal safety.
07:51 kakobrekla that wouldnt be a minor any more anyway
07:52 kakobrekla or is it 21 in aussie land
07:52 BingoBoingo Who knows? May be Australasia is weird about such things.
07:54 BingoBoingo Maybe he's an Abbo and rights/ages/responsibility are less concrete?
07:55 kakobrekla seems like aussies think 18 the limit
07:55 kakobrekla anyway i doubt anything will happen anyway
07:55 BingoBoingo Any guessing on his age, ethnicity, or being a dirty Jewess became moot when he signed with GPG his declaration of default.
07:56 kakobrekla hehe
07:56 BingoBoingo Fuck the law and the law doing things. We'll ostracize him.
07:56 kakobrekla who is we?
07:56 BingoBoingo We is whoever We wants to be.
07:57 BingoBoingo No one has to be we.
07:57 kakobrekla yeah but he can just do /nick FotressTrade and make wallets.io
07:57 BingoBoingo We doesn't have to be anybody either.
07:58 kakobrekla 'the community' does not seem to be running out of coins yet unfortunatley
07:58 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5950 @ 0.00082733 = 4.9226 BTC [-]
07:58 BingoBoingo People just have to say fuck webwallets, and people who insist on node.js are lower than rats.
07:58 BingoBoingo Maybe he learns a new framework and sneaks a new business model that isn't a web wallet.
07:59 thestringpuller who got fucked using web wallets this time?
07:59 kakobrekla its been like 4 years, people still get scammed via paypal
07:59 thestringpuller blockchain got hacked?
08:00 kakobrekla so i dont expect for ppl to stop using web wallets
08:00 kakobrekla but they wont stop drinking and driving as well, so thats that.
08:00 BingoBoingo Fuck him if e can be identified. If he can't, well he's a new n00b.
08:01 BingoBoingo If he iden't then.. well... since default doesn't exist in bitcoin he's still a scammer until he makes people whole.
08:03 BingoBoingo Eh, drinking and driving seems like a much safer lapse of judgement than using a web wallet.
08:03 kakobrekla i guess it depends on how much you carry
08:03 kakobrekla of either
08:05 BingoBoingo In the worst case traffic cops have a price. The price of BTC though seems to make traffic cops seem... inexpensive?
08:07 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 849 @ 0.00082733 = 0.7024 BTC [-]
08:13 BingoBoingo What do I know about the 'Murican justice system though? All I have ALLEGEDLY done is solicit one elected official to kill another (emphasis on ALLEGEDLY). Anyone could see that any two elected officials though could be sodomygos and bound by darker forces than a voter could summon.
08:13 BingoBoingo (allegedly)
08:19 BingoBoingo Everything in my situation seems to be under control though. I am in 'Murica and my skin is pale.
08:23 BingoBoingo Why do we have to hurt so much, I can't decide. We are settling the final score.
08:24 BingoBoingo For the record: Kakobrekla + Garr255 -1262
08:30 kakobrekla so you are telling me im nobody?
08:30 kakobrekla :)
08:31 kakobrekla its not too far from the truth!
08:32 BingoBoingo kakobrekla: I'm not telling you you are nobody. I say you are a good body. Thermos though....
08:33 BingoBoingo HE says Garr is a major body
08:33 BingoBoingo Even though he is a hella negative body
08:34 BingoBoingo If BTC dies, it will be because of "In Thermos Tards Trust"
08:35 kakobrekla dat forum is one of the easiest cash cows around
08:35 kakobrekla or at least it was
08:35 kakobrekla it might have ended
08:36 BingoBoingo kakobrekla: Still sounds like it could be rich for people willing to abandon decency
08:37 kakobrekla i was thinking more from thermost point of view but yeah i see what you mean and is also true
08:39 kakobrekla i mean, he got kilos of btc from just keepin a forum up and he even fails at that
08:39 kakobrekla doesnt get much simpler
08:40 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.28320001 BTC [-]
08:40 kakobrekla i hear ads are not as hot as they used to be now though and id bet donations calmed down too.
08:40 BingoBoingo kakobrekla: Well, occasionally maybe the barnacle grows bigger tan some of the whales?
08:41 BingoBoingo I doubt ads can match their hottest from when it was TF and BFL fighting for slots, when they should have found sluts
08:42 kakobrekla TF and BFL? the real battle was Tom vs BFL iir
08:42 kakobrekla iirc
08:42 BingoBoingo Donations seems to have gone full stop because the only reason to donate this past year was to scam.
08:43 BingoBoingo Come on. TOm was over before Avolon "shipped for some definitions of shipped" in february. BFL is still living the lie.
08:43 kakobrekla yeah regardless of that facts there was an advertising battle at the time of uncertanty
08:44 kakobrekla sometime early 2013 i think
08:44 kakobrekla twas posted here i reckon
08:44 BingoBoingo Yeah. The advertising battle was hotter late 2013 though... (fuck that is already late 2013?)
08:45 kakobrekla haha
08:45 kakobrekla yeah its over.
08:46 BingoBoingo B/(asic) vs. BFL was big, but TF vs. BFL seemed, on the forum, Bigger. THen again the forum sucks and continues to suck
08:46 kakobrekla it seems i completley missed the latter battle
08:46 kakobrekla but i guess you see one, you seen them all
08:47 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4537 @ 0.00081947 = 3.7179 BTC [-]
08:47 BingoBoingo Well, your slanderous soul seems to have forced you into observing an unnatural cleanliness.
08:47 kakobrekla lol
08:47 BingoBoingo And yes, every forum bidding war looks the fucking same.
08:52 kakobrekla its all building up to my new brand name, SSSS
08:52 kakobrekla twice as bad as SS
08:53 kakobrekla we can ipo and have S.SSSS
~ 23 minutes ~
09:17 nubbins` snakey
09:28 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 7 @ 0.29899998 = 2.093 BTC [+] {3}
09:31 assbot [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 26 @ 0.02201885 = 0.5725 BTC [-] {7}
09:43 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11500 @ 0.00080464 = 9.2534 BTC [-]
09:57 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5400 @ 0.00080897 = 4.3684 BTC [+]
10:02 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 18 @ 0.27920444 = 5.0257 BTC [-] {7}
10:03 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 19 @ 0.27612 = 5.2463 BTC [-] {2}
10:15 assbot [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 100 @ 0.00144 = 0.144 BTC [+]
10:15 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3450 @ 0.0008001 = 2.7603 BTC [-] {2}
10:18 assbot [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 28 @ 0.02342091 = 0.6558 BTC [+] {5}
10:18 assbot [HAVELOCK] [DEALCO] 4285 @ 0.00132053 = 5.6585 BTC [-] {3}
~ 17 minutes ~
10:35 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 1100 @ 0.0008057 = 0.8863 BTC [+]
10:41 assbot [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 310 @ 0.00291946 = 0.905 BTC [+] {2}
~ 23 minutes ~
11:04 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9350 @ 0.00080649 = 7.5407 BTC [+]
11:13 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 459 @ 0.00283501 = 1.3013 BTC [-] {8}
11:26 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5350 @ 0.0008045 = 4.3041 BTC [-]
11:31 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14725 @ 0.00081031 = 11.9318 BTC [+] {2}
~ 22 minutes ~
11:54 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13000 @ 0.00080554 = 10.472 BTC [-]
11:54 pankkake happy festivus!
12:05 KRS|Gotyawallet I can't find my Festivus pole.
12:13 deadweasel happy fuckmas?
12:14 deadweasel ;;killsanta
12:14 gribble Error: "killsanta" is not a valid command.
12:15 jurov ;;gank santa
12:15 gribble Error: "gank" is not a valid command.
12:17 assbot [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 997 @ 0.00011 = 0.1097 BTC [-] {2}
~ 18 minutes ~
12:35 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7860 @ 0.0008001 = 6.2888 BTC [-]
12:35 assbot [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 15 @ 0.049999 = 0.75 BTC [+]
12:45 assbot [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 3 @ 0.05 = 0.15 BTC [+]
~ 40 minutes ~
13:25 Duffer1 merry holiday b-assets
13:31 deadweasel verily
~ 44 minutes ~
14:16 mircea_popescu bwahaha what do my eyes read. so some nut with a ltc denominated pnb is "making an exchange" and that's where the noobdom is all excited to go ?
14:16 mircea_popescu you people have what's technically known as a death wish.
14:16 mircea_popescu no other way to put is.
14:16 assbot [HAVELOCK] [VTX] 2 @ 0.072 = 0.144 BTC [-]
14:16 asciilifeform pnb ?
14:16 mircea_popescu pmb*
14:16 asciilifeform aha
14:18 mircea_popescu teh leading british entrepreneur that was born last june and did a... leading green it company.
14:18 mircea_popescu it's disease.
14:18 mircea_popescu it has to be a mental disease. no other way to explain this.
14:19 Duffer1 oh ciphertrade?
14:19 mircea_popescu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kate_Craig-Wood << check out self-shipping wiki. arguably taaki's is better because at least he's original in his stupidity.
14:19 ozbot Kate Craig-Wood - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
14:19 mircea_popescu Duffer1 yes.
14:19 asciilifeform well, eventually all the coin will be in the hands of people with brains.
↖
14:19 mircea_popescu asciilifeform no because they keep making doges.
14:19 asciilifeform this endgame looks obvious.
14:20 mircea_popescu endgame is at least 20 years away. the fuck im gonna do, that's my youth.
14:20 asciilifeform p. t. barnum and carnegie can co-exist
14:20 mircea_popescu "Ciphertrade is a fantastic new service that will change the way you work"Ciphertrade is a fantastic new service that will change the way you work.". does that "fantastic" only sound krameresque to me ?
14:21 mircea_popescu asciilifeform NOT when barnum thinks he's carnegie and his visitors think they're there spinning the world.
14:21 mircea_popescu 24/12/13 Countdown reset due to delays, mailshot has copies of screenshots...merry xmas all
14:21 mircea_popescu 13/12/13 ; Sadly the beta release we wanted will be delayed by a week or so, more details in the newsletter ; 27/11/13 We have the gui wireframes back from designers..
14:22 asciilifeform the furnace still burns, steel still pours, no?
14:22 mircea_popescu that's the news. this is how people think the reports of an it project look.
14:22 mircea_popescu i have only one mouth and i must laugh!
14:22 mircea_popescu asciilifeform no, you're right, i've just gone through five minutes of disbelief. i'm fine now.
14:23 asciilifeform the occasional luser falls into crucible; free carbon that day.
14:23 mircea_popescu incidentally, i think this may well be why otherwise intelligent people decide bitcoin is beyond stupid. they probably go through this intellectual cycle, "o, let's examine the data re this thing. what's intel got ? o wait, what ? you say what ? did what ? what ?"
14:23 mircea_popescu in the end it's just a blank stare with a "wat"
14:23 asciilifeform that was more or less my first post on the subject
14:23 Duffer1 they appear to be making a try at a legal exchange
14:23 asciilifeform microscope hammer.
14:23 mircea_popescu Duffer1 what makes you think you are qualified to judge whether this is the case ?
14:24 mircea_popescu there is nothing more deceiving than appearance. how do you judge ?
14:24 Duffer1 i'm not even a little bit, never claimed otherwise
14:24 mircea_popescu this is the topic of expertise. man walks into a bank, appears to intend to start a business. hoiw do you decide if you finance him ?
14:24 Duffer1 they
14:24 mircea_popescu this is the hardest job in all of banking, credit officer.
14:24 Duffer1 er
14:24 Duffer1 they 'appear' to be trying to go legal, but appear is my laymans perspective
14:24 mircea_popescu understand, thinking is not a crime. not thinking however is. you can't just gloss over stuff.
14:25 mircea_popescu well yes, but your laymans perspective can easily get you fucking killed.
14:25 mircea_popescu does a guy in a pink hat appear to be a pimp ?
14:25 Duffer1 i don't disagree with you, i'm curious what the issue is though
14:26 mircea_popescu i wish i could readily explain it somehow, save lots of people lots of pain.
14:26 mircea_popescu ask me.
14:26 asciilifeform what i meant earlier was, the 'doge' investors are going to do something idiotic with their coin, regardless of what happens
14:27 Duffer1 doge... investors....
14:27 asciilifeform if not doge, then lolcatcoin, or whatnot
14:27 mircea_popescu this is experimentally true.
14:28 mircea_popescu Duffer1 you recall the guy a day or two ago with the "200% is 200% no matter how you cut it" ?
14:28 asciilifeform but the people doing the fleecing, presumably have a bit more brain, and will do something moderately intelligent
14:28 asciilifeform and so on, up the foodchain
14:28 Duffer1 yea poor guy :/
14:29 asciilifeform the way i see it, it's rather like a farmer lamenting that a rotting deer carcass in his field is being eaten by maggots, rather than himself
14:29 mircea_popescu asciilifeform this is an exceedingly difficult proposition. my current belief is that mostly they're stupid in a different way.
14:29 mircea_popescu they're time-stupid rather than capital-stupid.
14:29 mircea_popescu in the end scammer and scamee make a tuple.
14:30 mircea_popescu asciilifeform the farmer is lamenting that the deer lays dead, no more.
14:30 mircea_popescu for it is bambi, and bambi's someone's mom.
14:33 Duffer1 mircea_popescui wish i could readily explain it somehow, save lots of people lots of pain. <<<< perhaps worth another article where my ignorance is yet again immortalized on your blog? :P
14:34 Duffer1 i hang out in here to learn
14:35 mircea_popescu that's fine, but i dunno how. at leasrt not yet.
14:35 mircea_popescu but let me expound on the capital/time stupud tuple.
14:36 mircea_popescu the sucker, let him be known as s, is in a rush. he has not the time to completely consider things, and this is built on a lengthy historical tradition of the same : he also "did not have the time" to properly consider functional analysis in highschool,
14:37 mircea_popescu which he mostly didn't have the time t odo because in junior high he didn't have the time to properly consider fractions,
14:37 mircea_popescu and as a result learning fa for him is "learn all calculus from fractions onward", which is easily months of HIS time (it'd be a lot less time for someone a lot more literate, because of the way economies of scale work in matters of the mind. however, this is not him)
14:38 mircea_popescu so basically the sucker's life is this escalating avalanche of unpaid time debts which he keeps extending and extending for more and more ridiculous interest.
14:38 mircea_popescu the scammer, let him be known as S, has been doing nothing but contemplating, the minutious detail that is otherwise irrelevant.
14:39 mircea_popescu for whatever reason, such as having a bad attitude to authority coupled with a duplicitous nature, he has managed to both escape re-education and avoid actually putting his mind to useful purpose.
14:39 mircea_popescu he is then stuck, but also unable to admit this to himself.
14:39 mircea_popescu and he has no money, or more properly put, he's not making nearly as much as his less clever peers from kindergarten are making.
14:40 mircea_popescu s naturally tries to use his relative advantage to defeat a problem, S equally so. together, they make a team. the alleged "theft" is nothing of the kind, teams reallocate resources all the time on common convention, which is hwat's happening here too.
14:41 mircea_popescu the sad part of this otherwise heroic arrangement is, however, that it STILL doesn't work.
14:41 mircea_popescu capital can be good. minutious attention to irrelevant detail can also be good. both need a lot of central thinking to actualise their potential utility,
14:41 mircea_popescu and that's what the scammer can't, fundamentally, have.
14:42 mircea_popescu the union becomes pernicious in that s's capital could be useful irrespective of him, but S's mental issues lock s out.
14:42 mircea_popescu there we go, i'm happy with this model. it's a tuple.
14:45 assbot [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 40 @ 0.02389999 = 0.956 BTC [+]
14:46 Duffer1 because s doesn't have time (or taken time to learn), he's doomed to be the s in the s + S = failure tuple
14:47 Duffer1 equation
14:47 mircea_popescu well equally so for S, he's also doomed being part of that nonsense.
14:48 mircea_popescu the irony here being that if you take the list of 100+ scammers they - each and every one of them - were at some point "bigger than me", in a particular "media's eye" view of the table.
14:48 mircea_popescu but then i'm the guy worth a billion dollars, and if you add their loot all together, you don't get a billion.
14:49 mircea_popescu way to turn "more" into definitely less, as it were.
14:52 Duffer1 thank you
14:57 Duffer1 how to remove yourself from the equation..
15:05 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9700 @ 0.00063366 = 6.1465 BTC [-]
15:10 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4000 @ 0.00063366 = 2.5346 BTC [-]
~ 19 minutes ~
15:29 assbot [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 187 @ 0.001 = 0.187 BTC
15:36 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: the scammers who 'appear big' are reminiscent of the well-known factoid of dynamite being considerably less energetic, per gram, than gasoline
15:36 mircea_popescu :p
15:36 asciilifeform but the everyday person wouldn't suspect it
15:37 mircea_popescu hence why it took a \while for fuelbombs
15:37 asciilifeform 'my candle burns at both ends, it will not last the night; but ah my foes, and oh my friends, it gives a lovely light!'
15:38 asciilifeform flashiness has very little to do with actual use
15:38 asciilifeform mircea_popescu: remember your observations about power plant?
15:39 mircea_popescu yeah
15:39 asciilifeform $1B, in every major city, and no advertising; no one thinks of it, or hears of it on tv, unless it burns down
15:45 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7150 @ 0.00062972 = 4.5025 BTC [-]
15:46 mircea_popescu http://trilema.com/2013/the-stuple/ << the treatment.
15:46 ozbot The stuple. pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu.
15:49 asciilifeform good sum.
15:50 asciilifeform also reminds me of orlov's essay on 'fufflers' and their symbiotic relation with the 'victims'
15:50 asciilifeform (http://cluborlov.blogspot.com/2009/03/welcome-to-fuffland.html)
15:54 mircea_popescu fluffers ?!
15:54 mircea_popescu you mean the girl on the porn set ?
15:54 asciilifeform good 'onion' piece:
15:54 asciilifeform http://www.duffelblog.com/2013/12/mikhail-kalashnikov-dead/
15:54 mircea_popescu lmao! re your club orlov : i was persuaded to add a disclaimer to my article, which reads "but before you run to the interpretative races be advised that the “money” sybol is used correctly in its proper sense, rather than in what mistaken cvasi-definition you might have intuited for yourself, and this use colors the meaning of “time” too."
15:55 mircea_popescu then i follow your link, and what do i see ? "In the unfolding global financial collapse, it is not just our accounts and balance sheets that come up short, but our language as well."
15:55 mircea_popescu word.
15:55 mircea_popescu it's not the language tho. it's the minds. language is but a cloth.
15:55 asciilifeform he was the fellow who introduced me to 'bezzle'
15:56 mircea_popescu yeah, i think i read this before
15:56 mircea_popescu prolly cuz you linked it.
15:56 mircea_popescu "It seems that the Russians are better-equipped to survive financial collapse than just about anyone else. They have formidable reserves of gold and foreign currency to soften the downward slide. " << actually, the romanians have more.
15:56 mircea_popescu isarescu squirreled away ~127 tons of the stuff, and that's >6 grams per capita.
15:56 asciilifeform possibly mongolia (or some other entirely un-drilled place) is the real champ.
15:57 mircea_popescu russia does not hold 1bn tons
15:57 mircea_popescu i mean, 1k tons, 1bn grams
15:59 mircea_popescu (Perhaps this psychological mechanism accounts for the fact the Anglo-Saxon tribe still has the vestigial word but no longer remembers its meaning.)
15:59 mircea_popescu yeah, this article should be linked more often.
15:59 asciilifeform mr. o neglects to mention another well-known meaning of фуфло - 'arsehole', specifically in the prison-buggery sense of the word.
16:00 mircea_popescu he has a point in that i suspect it's perhaps the easiest way to explain to the layman in laymen terms what exactly is the difference separating "me" or "us" from "them". teh fuffle readily makes sense or not at all.
16:00 asciilifeform new prisoner is asked to gamble, he asks what the stakes will be, told:
↖
16:00 asciilifeform 'фуфло'
↖
16:00 mircea_popescu lol
16:00 asciilifeform he things 'nothing'
16:00 asciilifeform (one common meaning outside the prison)
16:00 asciilifeform and plays.
16:00 asciilifeform loses.
16:00 mircea_popescu did any newbie ever win a cell gambling ?
16:00 asciilifeform doubt it.
16:01 mircea_popescu easy to stack games, especially when you have the excuse of material scarcity the prison offers
16:01 mircea_popescu and also the abundance of time it generously provides.
16:01 asciilifeform it is said that the newbie's mistake is always and without exception: playing on borrowed cash.
16:01 asciilifeform borrowed -> has to be repaid. in cash, or фуфло.
↖
16:02 mircea_popescu basically it's the United Fuffles of America
16:02 mircea_popescu this is a better model, they're not so much into socialism per se
16:03 mircea_popescu they're into anything that may enable fuffling.
16:03 benkay united stats of confidence games
16:04 mircea_popescu the old jew joke, which is why trilema has been making the point since the naughts.
16:04 mircea_popescu dja know it ?
16:04 asciilifeform which one? could be any of 100...
16:04 mircea_popescu well let me recount it for the public record anyway.
16:05 mircea_popescu Itzhak is a respectable moneylender in the small neighbourhood of Fool's Crossing.
↖
16:05 mircea_popescu one day an attractive young widdow that can't repay her husband's debts agrees to put out, like every other day, except with different girls.
16:06 mircea_popescu so as to not agress the public morals, itzhak upon living her house picks up a worthless old smoked over painting, and declares it to be the payment for the debt.
16:06 mircea_popescu the woman smiles and they part on friendly terms.
16:06 mircea_popescu his younger brother hirsz, a respectable moneylender in the slightly larger small neighbourhood of Sucker's Lament visits one day
16:07 mircea_popescu he notes the shitty painting, and asks his brother wherefore.
16:07 mircea_popescu itzhak tells him the exorbitant sum he has paid, and some theory about its artistic value.
16:08 mircea_popescu the next week, hirsz is beating down itzhak's door. for he must have the painting, it is keeping it up at night that his older brother in the pooer neighbourhood should have the piece of art!
16:08 mircea_popescu and so he buys it, in cash, for a hefty premium.
16:08 mircea_popescu returning the call, itzhak buys the painting back a few weeks later,
16:08 mircea_popescu and then in a couple months when he was building a new stable, his brother buys the painting back from him, at yet a heftier premium
16:09 mircea_popescu the painting moves back and forth at ever increasing nominal values among the families, as their capital needs dictate
16:09 pizzaman1337 MP's stories always have me on the edge of my seat
16:09 mircea_popescu until one day, a young girl one has hired for the purpose of cleanning the house in between polishing the cock
16:09 mircea_popescu accidentally spills potash all over the painting
16:09 mircea_popescu which now is no more.
16:09 mircea_popescu quoth the distraught brothers "that stupid girl. and what great business we had with that painting"
16:10 mircea_popescu indeed. a secure asset of ever-appreciating value, who'd not want fuffel on his books ?
16:10 asciilifeform sequel!
16:10 mircea_popescu lol
16:10 mircea_popescu no scripts are new...
16:10 asciilifeform another servant goes on a bender
16:10 asciilifeform vomits over the now-empty canvas
16:10 asciilifeform another masterpiece is born...
16:10 asciilifeform the story resumes from 0.
16:10 mircea_popescu you must be careful however, the lynchpin of this story is
16:11 mircea_popescu " so as to not agress the public morals"
16:11 mircea_popescu this only works in places which have "public morals".
16:11 asciilifeform correct.
16:11 assbot [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 1363 @ 0.00011111 = 0.1514 BTC [-] {2}
16:12 assbot [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 7420 @ 0.00010708 = 0.7945 BTC [-] {7}
16:12 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 1 @ 0.289 BTC [+]
16:14 assbot [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 10 @ 0.049 = 0.49 BTC [-]
16:15 mircea_popescu and this story made me appreciate a major point.
16:15 mircea_popescu intellectually, the main reason my blog exists is that i hate repeating myself.
16:16 mircea_popescu however, i've retold this joke dozens of times, and it seems to have gotten better every time.
16:16 mircea_popescu it makes me realise that in becoming very able to preserve through application of technology, we are losing the incentive to re-write and recall, which probably explains why we suck.
16:17 asciilifeform just as everyone derisively laughs at 'cut and paste' programmers
16:17 mircea_popescu just so.
16:18 benkay avoiding social media of all sorts has made me a better conversationalist by giving me the opportunity to tell and retell a story or a pitch, refining it on based on each recipient.
16:18 benkay contrast this with people who write jokes once for twitter and are forever doomed to hear "oh yeah i read that on your social whatever" when they want to iterate and improve.
16:19 mircea_popescu that part is important. you have to understand your story well enough to be able to contextualize it in different contexts.
16:19 mircea_popescu no three ring binder or company policy can help you there.
16:20 mircea_popescu in the end, money is an expression of culture. the chase for money in se is not much unlike the making of worthless paintings as a "commercial venture".
16:20 mircea_popescu without the attractive widow...
16:22 mircea_popescu asciilifeform "Unlike proper retirement systems, which transfer a percentage of earnings from working-age people directly to retirees, this fuffled scheme takes these earnings and invests them in some fuffles" << do explain ?!
16:22 asciilifeform this is how it actually happens in u.s.
16:22 mircea_popescu is the man insane ?! or am i ?
16:22 mircea_popescu no but the other end. a proper system is bismarck's ponzi ?!
16:23 mircea_popescu how doth he reason.
16:23 asciilifeform they try to talk you into dropping some pre-tax pay into a 'fund', where it turns into stocks, etc
16:23 asciilifeform you can't touch it without massive penalty until you're a certain age
16:23 mircea_popescu look i know how 401k/iras etc work. after all, we wouldn't have our friendly second market without them
16:23 mircea_popescu the question is, what sort of a fool contemplates the notion that direct transfer better, let alone proper.
16:24 asciilifeform in orlov's world, a proper system is where you rely on family to feed you in old age
16:24 asciilifeform (or throw you through the ice, as the case may be)
16:24 mircea_popescu no, he says "transfer a percentage of earnings from working-age people directly to retirees"
16:24 mircea_popescu this is the von bismarck model of ponzi pensions.
16:24 asciilifeform he's thinking of the slightly less broken soviet machine
16:24 mircea_popescu pay 5% all your life, get whatever's there
16:24 mircea_popescu how is it less broken ?
16:24 mircea_popescu it
16:25 mircea_popescu s not less broken. in the russian crisis of the 90s pensioneers bore most of the burden
16:25 asciilifeform because it was a straight tontine, without a casino in the loop
16:25 mircea_popescu except the politburo spent from the tontine all the damn time.
16:25 asciilifeform they sure did. but that was collapse.
16:25 mircea_popescu so it didhave a casino on the top.
16:26 asciilifeform at some point 'the bezzle' becomes real, the cartoon wolf looks down and finally obeys gravity, goes splat off the cliff.
↖
16:26 mircea_popescu i must petition to have that phrase struck.
16:26 mircea_popescu do you know how to contact the guy ?
16:27 asciilifeform his firs name dot last name at gmail, i think
16:27 mircea_popescu well what are those lol
16:27 asciilifeform sometimes he answers. wrote to him about stirling engines once
16:27 Duffer1 this orlov article reads a lot like our discussion on real estate rent
16:28 asciilifeform dmitry orlov
16:28 mircea_popescu a ty
16:28 asciilifeform he lives on a ship, and doesn't have net access every day
16:28 asciilifeform so he might take a while.
16:28 Duffer1 "Ideally, the initial transaction serves as the basis of a permanent arrangement, with the victim roped into an installment plan, which keeps the payments flowing even after the fuffle itself has crumbled into a pile of dust"
16:29 mircea_popescu must have ipads
16:29 asciilifeform orlov's point wasn't that ussr was a paradise, but that it was a more honest sort of open air prison than u.s.
16:30 asciilifeform fewer pretenses at 'you own your home - went broke? now get out'
16:30 assbot [HAVELOCK] [SFI] 569 @ 0.001 = 0.569 BTC
16:31 mircea_popescu but calling it proper ?
16:31 asciilifeform since ussr never really had a working economy, economic collapse wasn't the apocalyptic disaster it would be in a civilized country.
16:31 mircea_popescu it's one tyhing to say better
16:31 mircea_popescu haha, i wouldn't go as far as to say that the litmus for "working economy" is "consumer sector" tbh
16:31 asciilifeform it's more like: you go to a basement casino, and instead of letting you play, they club you over the head and take yer wallet
16:31 mircea_popescu obviously the consumer thinks so, clearly visible i nthings such as "bitcoin must be a sort of supermarket payment option to really exist"
16:32 asciilifeform and then you say to a chum: 'unlike a proper casino, where the house keeps X, they...'
16:32 mircea_popescu but no, he said the converse : unlike a fluffy casino, where they let you play, a proper casino takes your clothes and then makes you put out a show for their porn franchise.
16:33 mircea_popescu i mean i guess it's proper in the sense of "proper fucked"
16:34 asciilifeform orlov's painfully-repeated point is that systems with infinite growth assumptions baked in are worse than straight theft
16:34 mircea_popescu "It may be clear to us that fuffles must be eradicated." < ha! you can't eradicate these any more than you can eradicate moles
16:35 mircea_popescu if yo uget them rare enough courtier chicks will start adding mole stickers to their cleavage
16:35 asciilifeform the best you can do is to put up nets and keep them out, like mosquitos
16:35 mircea_popescu asciilifeform but the direct transfer system has infinite population growth baked right in
16:35 asciilifeform sure does.
16:35 asciilifeform i don't disagree with your objection re: 'proper retirement'
16:36 mircea_popescu terry gilliam's mole cartoon is eerily prescient.
16:36 asciilifeform orlov is a reluctant, dour sort of 'statist', he sees mega-empires as inevitable, but likewise their collapse.
16:36 asciilifeform hence his discussions re: how, when they fuck the populace, using some form of lube would be proper and decent.
16:37 mircea_popescu mega empires are quite evitable.
16:37 mircea_popescu i think the schelling point actually is warlordoms
16:37 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3630 @ 0.00063366 = 2.3002 BTC [+]
16:38 mircea_popescu this mega empire business is a momentary distraction.
16:38 asciilifeform orlov's prediction is that warlordoms will become schelling points again once various energy-hungry weapons systems stop being affordable
16:38 mircea_popescu said weapons (if you mean the atomic bomb) are already useless.
16:38 asciilifeform he plays with this in his '5 stages' book.
16:39 mircea_popescu they rely on some very convenient separations that are no longer factual.
16:39 asciilifeform the nukes rust, yes. the airplanes still work, for the time being.
16:39 mircea_popescu no but i mean, bomb what ?
16:39 asciilifeform invading flotillas, i think, is the remaining scenario
16:39 mircea_popescu and invade what ?
16:40 mircea_popescu the only place where that works is fuckland, and fuckland a) doesn't care and b) is tougher than you and will fuck you.
16:40 asciilifeform china/siberian oil; whoever/american carcasses for sausage ?
16:40 mircea_popescu afghanistan showed both points to both "megaempires"
16:40 mircea_popescu i would not invade the us atm even if they paid me.
16:40 mircea_popescu you get stuck administering it.
16:40 mircea_popescu baghdad has cost in peace more than it cost in war.
16:41 Duffer1 but but freedom
16:41 asciilifeform that's because they stuck with the 'hearts and minds' fluff, instead of 'remove unwanted bioforms and build drill platforms.'
16:41 Duffer1 shit where's my fuffle
16:41 Duffer1 brb
16:41 mircea_popescu asciilifeform you're very much mistaken. this is the us army propaganda as to why they failed.
16:41 mircea_popescu in point of fact they stguck with no such fluff.
16:42 mircea_popescu they simply did not have the ability to do any better.
16:42 asciilifeform surely they still have at least one working neutron bomb in a warehouse somewhere.
16:42 mircea_popescu the equation is quite simple : you kill more bioforms, you get your convoys bombed more.
16:42 mircea_popescu tyhere's a maximum bombing of convoys you can bear,
16:42 mircea_popescu and that limits how many bioforms you kill.
16:42 Duffer1 i'm pretty sure they didn't intend to do any better, there was no plan other than 'go there'
16:42 mircea_popescu asciilifeform and then how much do you pay haliburton to clean up and run the platforms ?
16:43 mircea_popescu Duffer1 how'd you know if there was ? plans are usually secret.
16:43 Duffer1 the end result speaks for itself imo
16:43 asciilifeform probably cheaper than what they actually ended up doing (being clobbered for nothing)
16:43 mircea_popescu the end result of a failure is not indicative of the absence of a plan more than of the poor quality of a present plan tho.
16:43 mircea_popescu asciilifeform only cheaper on a % basis.
16:44 mircea_popescu but there's a limit on how much cost you can bear, which caps your results
16:44 mircea_popescu in this case at 0.
16:44 mircea_popescu war is always a game of "there's a limit of how much X you can bear"
16:44 asciilifeform dollar for dollar, you'd get more energy by drilling at sea. the point, i think, was to display force
16:44 asciilifeform similar to soviet invasion of afghanistan, actually
16:44 Duffer1 you're not wrong, but they didn't secure the peace, they didn't even secure the oil fields right away
16:44 mircea_popescu asciilifeform and that display failed. similarly, in both cases, for the same reason.
16:45 mircea_popescu it showed force in the sense of making everyone realise they must be killed.
16:45 Duffer1 it seems like they created a debacle for the sake of being evil
16:45 mircea_popescu it did not show force in the sense of making anyone likely to not try.
16:45 asciilifeform afghan, 'graveyard of empires', etc
16:45 mircea_popescu basically our colonies, be their russia or the us, being a little new, still have to learn on own skin the history of medieval europe.
16:45 mircea_popescu there's shows of force and then there's shows of force. ask d'este.
16:46 asciilifeform one russian writer, who grunted in a., opined that 'we were the kid that lifts the weight bar, pushes it up a little, then crushed underneath. afghan is a weight bar.'
16:46 mircea_popescu forza managed to anihilate his entire house in a generation by simply not knowing the difference.
~ 17 minutes ~
17:04 assbot [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 145 @ 0.04999999 = 7.25 BTC [+] {2}
17:08 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9800 @ 0.00063773 = 6.2498 BTC [+] {2}
17:08 copumpkin man, mpoe isn't doing as well as it was
17:09 mircea_popescu hey look at that, all the way to summer.
17:14 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28576 @ 0.00064345 = 18.3872 BTC [+] {2}
17:15 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13200 @ 0.00069376 = 9.1576 BTC [+] {2}
17:17 benkay does mpoe track the coins or do the coins track mpoe?
17:17 benkay questions for the ages.
17:18 mircea_popescu i dunno man. i am looking forward to when i'm very old someone finally figuring this shit out and writing a clever paper.
17:19 copumpkin I guess mpoe order book isn't very deep
17:19 copumpkin so price isn't very meaningful
17:19 mircea_popescu !t m s.mpoe
17:19 assbot [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00062972 / 0.00078418 / 0.00084704 (320984 shares, 251.71 BTC), 7D: 0.00062972 / 0.00086521 / 0.00091394 (4812961 shares, 4,164.25 BTC), 30D: 0.00062972 / 0.00086925 / 0.00091394 (15872706 shares, 13,797.37 BTC)
17:20 mircea_popescu well... the spot price no. the averages however...
17:30 assbot [HAVELOCK] [HMF] 80 @ 0.02390124 = 1.9121 BTC [+] {3}
~ 26 minutes ~
17:57 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.2900002 = 0.58 BTC [+]
17:58 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.2900002 = 0.58 BTC [+]
18:03 mircea_popescu in unrelated news, bitcoin's rift guild is #4 largest on teh server.
18:04 Duffer1 wtb fallout mmo
18:04 assbot [HAVELOCK] [PETA] 37 @ 0.05 = 1.85 BTC [+]
~ 18 minutes ~
18:22 damian666__ Good comparison chart (btce vs. gox vs. btcchina) at http://btc.2097.com
18:23 Duffer1 yes damian666 i'll click your link
~ 22 minutes ~
18:45 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 11 @ 0.28327454 = 3.116 BTC [-] {3}
18:49 benkay much technical analysis
18:50 kakobrekla very money
18:53 thestringpuller much crypto
18:57 benkay !t m s.mpoe
18:57 assbot [MPEX:S.MPOE] 1D: 0.00062972 / 0.00078254 / 0.00084704 (311715 shares, 243.93 BTC), 7D: 0.00062972 / 0.00086429 / 0.00091394 (4712687 shares, 4,073.17 BTC), 30D: 0.00062972 / 0.00086926 / 0.00091394 (15871006 shares, 13,796.03 BTC)
18:58 benkay !l m s.mpoe
18:58 assbot Last trade for S.MPOE on MPEX was at 0.00069376 BTC [+]
19:02 assbot [HAVELOCK] [CBTC] 59935 @ 0.00011919 = 7.1437 BTC [-] {2}
~ 36 minutes ~
19:39 kleeck0 .d
19:39 ozbot 1180923195.25803 | Next Diff in 1246 blocks | Estimated Change: 14.6024% in 7d 9h 15m 11s
19:40 benkay ;;ticker --market btcavg
19:40 gribble BitcoinAverage BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 696.48, Best ask: 697.48, Bid-ask spread: 1.00000, Last trade: 697.07, 24 hour volume: 28078.07, 24 hour low: None, 24 hour high: None, 24 hour vwap: 667.45
19:55 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM100] 200 @ 0.00275213 = 0.5504 BTC [-] {7}
19:56 benkay http://doges.org/index.php/topic,5283.0.html
19:56 ozbot Dogewallet hacked
19:59 Duffer1 sigh
20:03 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 3350 @ 0.00079807 = 2.6735 BTC [+]
20:09 thestringpuller people are hacking doge coin wallets already?
20:10 Duffer1 could just be fud to crash price
20:11 Duffer1 "price"
20:14 thestringpuller isn't the price still under 1 cent?
20:16 Duffer1 probably, that's why i put 'price' in quotes because i'm hesitant to define doge as something that has a value
20:16 Duffer1 by using words normally associated with value, like "price"
20:16 Duffer1 fuffles
20:17 kakobrekla at the end of the day its worth what market pays
20:20 thestringpuller the free market is king
20:20 thestringpuller ALL HAIL KEYNES
20:26 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 2 @ 0.29982653 = 0.5997 BTC [+]
~ 36 minutes ~
21:03 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17000 @ 0.00079782 = 13.5629 BTC [-] {2}
21:09 assbot [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 170 @ 0.00281396 = 0.4784 BTC [-] {5}
21:10 assbot [HAVELOCK] [NEOBEE] 168 @ 0.00281 = 0.4721 BTC [-] {2}
~ 1 hours 11 minutes ~
22:21 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 900 @ 0.00079654 = 0.7169 BTC [-]
~ 1 hours 27 minutes ~
23:48 assbot [HAVELOCK] [AM1] 5 @ 0.2980079 = 1.49 BTC [-] {3}
23:56 assbot [MPEX] [S.MPOE] 5000 @ 0.00079573 = 3.9787 BTC [-]
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