#trilema | 2016-04-01

ten dollar tacos?!

02:31

i grow convinced that wherever pete_dushenski hails from is even weirder than asciilifeform's big gulag

02:32

pete_dushenski: this interest rate claim: are you implying that house prices go up when interest rates go down, ergo the house won't appreciate if you buy when rates are low and so don't?

02:33

1% interest on checking or savings accounts oh my sides

02:33

canadoes that?

02:36

(and where is the "lease don't buy your car!1" tip?)

~ 6 hours 19 minutes ~

08:55

ben_vulpes he has a point re the interest rates.

09:04

pete_dushenski: http://www.contravex.com/2016/03/31/cheep-petes-guide-to-not-being-a-poorfag/#comment-42674

09:10

mircea_popescu: interesting gavin-heap

09:10

*

asciilifeform has not fully digested it yet

09:11

*

asciilifeform bbl

09:15

pete_dushenski mixing things like "make a budget" and "pack a lunch / brew your own coffee" seems improper.

09:24

save even more money, brew your own beer!

09:27

pretty sure it costs more to make beer than to buy it; my brother does that and it's a whole lot of work for not a lot of beer

09:29

pete_dushenski have you ever read the book "the total money makeover" by Dave Ramsey? I recommend the book, makes mostly similar points to your post

09:30

danielpbarron I guess it depends on how you do it, I never did beer, but I made mead, and it was much cheaper than buying an equivalent volume, about an hour of work and a few weeks of waiting

09:32

yeah beer is much more involved

09:32

you folks gotta try teh elderberry cordial.

09:35

ben_vulpes> 1% interest on checking or savings accounts oh my sides << at my local credit union you can get 2% interest with a 5 year certificate, does not keep up with inflation but its better than no interest

09:36

but yeah, a "savings account" gets 0.1% APY

09:41

*

shinohai makes a few bottles of wine every fall

09:41

I have elderberries and blueberries.

09:41

nice.

09:48

[Qntra] Latest Bitcoin Network Difficulty Adjustment ~0.82% - http://qntra.net/2016/04/latest-bitcoin-network-difficulty-adjustment-0-82/

~ 17 minutes ~

10:05

BingoBoingo hey do you recall the lafond article where he describes some woman taking a cab to escape urban race war and some dudes trying to flag it down to rape her ?

10:06

not offhand

10:07

darn.

10:07

well i guess i grep lafond in log.

10:21

going to harm city tonight, after lafond articles fully expect packs of roaming black urban youths terrorizing solitary whites all over the place

10:22

god damned it. so half hour's research has produced not the article i was looking for, and the knowledge that decimation actually introduced lafond to the chan.

10:23

lafond's long been part of collective tmsr unconscious thanks to BingoBoingo

10:23

first link is May 05 23:23:08 <decimation> http://www.jameslafond.com/article.php?id=2338 < baltimore man writes about what he saw

10:23

that's may 2015.

10:24

huh, well then. i somehow though people were reading him before the riots

10:24

*

phf actually remembers that very log entry

~ 16 minutes ~

10:41

first i found, mebbe i'm missing something, but no i dun recall him being discussed prior.

10:52

$part

10:52

$sex

10:53

this fembot sucks

10:53

i mean... blows.

10:53

god damned it.

10:53

$part

10:53

finally

10:58

[Trilema] Outrageous MP's guide to not being a poorfag - http://trilema.com/2016/outrageous-mps-guide-to-not-being-a-poorfag/

~ 25 minutes ~

11:24

mircea_popescu: i was actually trying to figure out what that interest rate point /was/

11:26

Apr 01 10:22:12 <mircea_popescu>god damned it. so half hour's research has produced not the article i was looking for, and the knowledge that decimation actually introduced lafond to the chan. << decimation introduced the thread about atomic clocks also. so cesium clock is a sc4m?!

11:26

so huh ?

11:27

how's scam enter into this

11:27

nfi, just pointing out that not everything the schmuck did was a work of evil

11:28

i wasn't proposing any such thing ?

11:28

in other morning lulz : argentinian owner of a rental wants to get together to discuss changing rental contract because "inflation has gone up".

11:28

this is a derp who wanted contract in dollars to protect self from inflation, got choice of X in pesos or y in dollars, picked y.

11:28

l0l!

11:28

no but this is how they think, srsly.

11:28

what does it mean to 'discuss changing rental contract'

11:28

whole point of contract is...

11:29

that he wants to unilaterally change teh amounts ?

11:29

and not for ~next~ contract but ~now~ ?!

11:29

hahaha.

11:29

no seriously. this is argentinian mind at work.

11:29

not even here in the zoo, does this make sense

11:29

ah, what you don't know is that there's but different zoos.

11:30

anywya, it was lulzy, guy wanted 12k pesos ; i offered 750 usd which he took - at the time ~6 mo ago it came to about 11k pesos on the black market and it looked like it will imminently will cross 12 13 15 etc.

11:30

it... never did.

11:30

to this very day, it's not there.

11:31

meanwhile, dollar liberalized so it's not going up ; prices soared because they're poor and pretentious.

11:31

lulz of all tim.

11:31

btw how does voice work here exactly? a whitelist?

11:32

atm yes.

11:33

what does 750 usd (per mo?) get mircea_popescu in b-a ?

11:33

a garage ?

11:33

1500 sqft or so.

11:34

what would 750 buy a civilian ?

11:34

but yes, rents are utterly outrageous, everything's gotta come down 2x-3x for sanity.

11:34

asciilifeform perhaps 2/3 that ?

11:34

and of what? (climate-controlled ? vermin-enabled?)

11:35

normal apt thing. two baths two bedrooms, kitchen, living room, appliances including ac.

11:35

neato

11:36

where i live, 750 would maybe get you an open air parking.

11:36

for small auto.

11:36

i didn't tell you to live there.

11:37

tru!

11:37

anyway, it's pretty ridiculous, ro/pl/etc rents are about half that, and that's in the eu.

11:37

no idea wtf is wrong with this particular thirld world nation, but w/e.

11:38

too many americans spreading printolade ?

11:38

(actually i do have a pretty good idea - they all live off the govt which is here so much like lice they crowd around)

11:38

nah.

11:38

ba is larger than ny. yet another place the us doesn't actually matter all that much.

11:38

i recall chetty mentioned an entire city quarter packed with idiot usaschwitz escapees ?

11:39

yeah. you know what they do all day ? bitch importantly about how the bus fare went up a quarter peso.

11:39

asciilifeform: this is not a particularly interesting exercise, because rent in DC is significantly above what you could be paying anywhere else in the country (except usual suspects, nyc and sf)

11:39

phf and for the same reason as here : us lives off govt dole, so the lice crowd the capitla.

11:40

right, there are no other redeeming qualities or reasons for why rent in dc should be this high

11:40

moreover, you can readily add wi/mn/whatever to the ro/pl/etc list.

11:41

$750 gets you a house in iowa.

11:41

or w/e, ten 2015 ford focus electric rentals.

11:42

uber drivers "mang you pay 1500 for yo plaaaas, should move to upper spring heights mang [20 minutes driving from metro, 10 minutes driving from any semblance of food] pay seven hundraaaayd. is cheap!"

11:43

i guess you have a solid point there - ba is an oldstyle city, eateries on every corner, etc. good reason for rent to be more than what it can be in industrially produced "suburub".

11:43

nevertheless...

11:44

you can't possibly convince me that rents can ever exceed ~half the average per capita income

11:44

well, right iowa counter example basically loses you all citiness, and you can get that here too

11:44

which is here about 600 bux

11:45

(which is not so terrible, even, considering gdp is like 18k pa)

11:46

i know nhi couple who own a house in gaithersburg, which is about 40 minute nhi commute (note nhi itself is 30 minutes outside dc center), it's a magnificent place and they put all the toys from their world travels there, englishmen style.

11:47

but there's literally nothing within 20 minute drive, fields, some new suburbia, that's it

11:47

well... country house has its place. i'm just not old enough to want one.

11:48

phf: i dun live in dc

11:48

having grown up with a dacha, i grok country house/city apartments, but that's not even under consideration for most people here, unless they are boomers, who bought ocean property in the 60s for peanuts

11:48

phf: i live in the 'cheap' suburbs next to umd.

11:48

asciilifeform: my condolences

11:49

i could not in a million years afford to live in the dc city walls.

11:49

lol

11:49

old woman!

11:49

11:41 <+mircea_popescu> $750 gets you a house in iowa. << aha and iowa shaves a zero off the salary.

11:49

someone works in iowa ?

11:49

i thought it's for dormitory.

11:50

so what's rent like in the cheap suburbs next to umd ?

11:50

proper way to deal with iowa is buy a house, get your 800$/mo satellite internet (not even checking what's available, why bother), and do your aerospace/banking/medical it consulting work remote

11:50

<+phf> i know nhi couple ... but there's literally nothing within 20 minute drive << my parents live in a place like this.

11:51

phf actually internet in midwest way better than on the coasts. usually run by township.

11:51

11:50 <+mircea_popescu> so what's rent like in the cheap suburbs next to umd ? << i pay ~2k (if you count electric, gas, etc) for <1k sq ft.

11:51

confirming the age old observation thart socialism works betterf the smaller it is.

11:51

asciilifeform unfurnished also ?

11:52

aha, as i insist

11:52

the FUCK i need some derp's furniture for.

11:52

so you don't have to haul various pointless ballast ?

11:52

mircea_popescu: hard to get furnished here, i price it out every time, and it's an extra 1k a month almost always

11:52

that's ridoinculous. 1k buys you the swhit in a coupla months.

11:52

mircea_popescu: i have extremely nonstandard furniture

11:52

that is if you don't lease it yourself from a third party

11:52

because unlike americans, i have books.

11:53

ah right, you're stuck with the mite traps.

11:53

phf such a bizarre place you know, they rent last years' car for 2 bux a day, everyone hauls countertops

11:53

mircea_popescu: idea is that furnished apartment is for a salariman on remote assignment, like amtrak and services like that, assumption is can jack up a price as much as you want

11:53

i can't help but think it's a mental issue.

11:54

how about never mind teh purposes, stick to the causes!

11:54

it is expensive to live in this country from causes

11:55

not that i don't, but my burn rate is significantly higher than a random schmuck

11:55

like everywhere huh.

11:56

mircea_popescu: not only books. i have nice desk that holds n displays, etc.

11:56

srsly why would i want the motherfucking pressed shitboard rental furniture.

11:56

WHY.

11:56

if i wanted to live in a hotel, i would live in a hotel !

11:56

living in a hotel is more expensive still

11:56

rentals are exactly that : correctly priced, multi-room hotels.

11:56

i have a motherfucking workshop.

11:57

with things like drill press.

11:57

where should these go? on rental stools in furnished apt ?!

11:57

ideally, they go in the form of renting time from a workshop wtf is this my garage is my workshop artisan thing.

11:57

<+mircea_popescu> rentals are exactly that : correctly priced, multi-room hotels. << only for a theorist like mircea_popescu

11:57

we've had that conversation before i believe

11:57

this conversation won't die.

11:57

mircea_popescu: do you have ANY idea what it would cost to 'rent a workshop' within 3 hrs of drive from here ?

11:58

nope. but this is just an argument towards "us is fucking nuts". why the fuck should it cost a lot ?

11:58

asciilifeform: within 3 hours drive? c'mon. i can find you a workshop within 3 hours drive for less than 500 a month

11:58

first off, that's the #1 a city wants t osponsor.

11:58

since when does a city sponsor anything sane ?!

11:58

american cities sponsor bum gardens

11:58

since it is in a place you live in.

11:58

and dope needles

11:59

i have friends with workshops in baltimore city, maybe an hour drive from where i am

11:59

closer from umd

11:59

isn't that the bad place ?

11:59

phf: baltimore is mega-cheap

11:59

phf: i used to dream of escaping to it.

11:59

o wait - turns out alf is actually closer to lafond's dear friends than to the white house ?

11:59

bwahahahaha

11:59

I THOUGHT YOU DIDN'T LIKE ROACHES YO!

11:59

mircea_popescu: 11km from whitehouse.

12:00

if you have any sort of income, you can go to bmore and play believe mp

12:00

phf: if i had a NON-COMMUTE income

12:00

phf it also happens to be the right thing to do, other than buying bitbet.

12:00

which i don't.

12:00

go to baltiomore, start a gang.

12:00

l0l white gang in bmore

12:00

five years in you'll prolly want to hold a conference. if not 3.

12:00

asciilifeform why white ?

12:00

if you have to ask...

12:00

i have burner friends with workshops that you literally drive into a fenced off area with barbed wire on top, go inside a heavily reinforced building and work with your 50k equipment in peace

12:01

if i can talk to anglos, you can talk to niggers.

12:01

i will start black gang after mircea_popescu does and i study his.

12:01

oh ffs.

12:01

do you actually believe blacks aren't people or something ?

12:01

i saw the cunts, still same shade of pink.

12:01

anyway in alls srsness bmore is a glorious place to live imho.

12:02

i tried to get work there, and failed.

12:02

to date.

12:02

what did you apply to ?

12:02

$firm_that_sells_0days

12:03

and $the_other_firm_that_sells_0days

12:03

eh, you know enough chemistry to be useful to meth lab.

12:03

apply to that.

12:03

l0l 'hi i'm totally not a usg stooge though i have no street experience'

12:03

mircea_popescu is a lulzy fella

12:04

nobody's born with street experience.

12:04

also, gangs aren't exactly intellectual strongholds. by and large they survive by not caring, not by fine-tuning their civ playing strat.

12:04

no but the correct brand of anticiv.

12:04

pashtun.

12:04

not generally.

12:05

generally it's the very simple "well... here i am".

12:05

anyway i don't touch things where i have no leverage.

12:05

the same thing that gets most women knocked up that ever carry to term.

12:05

why does mircea_popescu think i could be an ~average~ dope man, much less a heroic one.

12:05

how exactly is this "no leverage" computed ?

12:05

you have immense leverage - you're the only one that can make sense of the entire sea of symbols they don't grok.

12:06

what do you think whiteboy with compuyter habit ends up doing in prison ?

12:06

buggered to death ?

12:06

helps the bulked up dudes with their appeals.

12:06

oh gtfo.

12:06

you have any idea how rare fucking is, in human experience ?

12:06

stop flattering yourself. nobody's wasting an erectio0n on your sorry ass.

12:07

then perhaps eaten as long pig ?

12:07

helps the bulked up dudes with their appeals. <

12:07

i have nfi what they do with useless people in american prison

12:07

you can read. and you can read in such a way as to GUARANTEEDLY never end up in "i dunno man"

12:07

he can't. he's never met someone who can.

12:07

leverage ? you got more leverage in baltimore than you do here.

12:08

<asciilifeform> 11:50 <+mircea_popescu> so what's rent like in the cheap suburbs next to umd ? << i pay ~2k (if you count electric, gas, etc) for <1k sq ft. << my new house is ~1k for 2k sq ft (plus 1k basement, could be used as workshop)

12:08

PeterL: and in zimbabwe, can get even cheaper !

12:09

in the middle of nice town

12:09

no everything outside DC is africa

12:09

inside DC is also africa

12:10

trinque: i was offered work in other africas (e.g., san francisco)

12:10

but i don't have any reason to prefer them to this africa.

12:10

aw, beating on the left coast folk is a great passtime

12:10

just ask ben_vulpes

12:11

trinque: in fact, it costs 2x moar to live there LIKE A HUMAN (e.g., MOTHERFUCKING HOUSE WITH OWN 4 WALLS) than here and they only offered 1.5x moar.

12:14

PeterL one place in ro, suburb of supposedly nice town, ran me $2200 per quarter, house on two levels (bout 4k sqft total iirc) + a spot of land, fully furnished. and i mean, natural leather couches and walnut furniture and whatnot.

12:14

but as he says ... no reason to prefer...

12:15

other than that, two-girl furnished apt in town ran 3-400 monthly.

12:15

mircea_popescu: i dun need living LIKE A NATIVE in ro for anything.

12:16

hows like a native ?

12:16

well, on ~their~ salary

12:16

heh. i bet.

12:16

go work for alcatel, make 600 a mo :D

12:16

but it is pretty cool living with the natives you know ? girl can pillowtalk tell you about her bf, and how hard he's working for his promotion.

12:17

which yes, from 600 to 635

12:17

asciilifeform: when I moved to portland I told my employer I would either telecommute or quit.

12:17

it's afaik a common thing in software

12:18

trinque: i tried this in the past, was always told 'go, quit.'

12:18

asciilifeform needs an agent

12:18

:P

12:18

what is the moral you derive from this experience alf ?

12:19

that i'm not 133337 enough ?

12:19

i dunno, what else.

12:19

(lemma : the definition of shit job is one where employer says "go, quit.")

12:19

usually reserved to barristas etc.

12:19

then i've never seen 'non-shit' job and don't expect ever to.

12:19

almost like a cloud of perpetual brick rain follows you around.

12:19

even people doing shitty webstack dev HAVE.

12:20

was exactly what I was doing.

12:20

"I made this fucking mess, and fuck you I'm not helping you replace me, so let me telecommute"

12:20

lol.

12:20

i just realised we need a backup for deedbot.

12:21

imma publish all the source for the new one

12:21

next thing he's gonna want to telecomute instead of showing up in irc.

12:21

l0l

12:21

haha

12:23

asciilifeform for my own peace of mind : have you actually said this ? or just fantasized about saying it ?

12:23

which

12:23

i lost track

12:23

"i tried this in the past, was always told 'go, quit.'"

12:23

*

asciilifeform is on the spin cycle of the day's stake, when the barbs come out

12:25

mircea_popescu: i did precisely once, with my last employer. there was much gnashing of teeth, and ill feeling from the other slaves (there were only a handful of us, and no one was actually replaceable)

12:25

was this a concern ongoing or winding down at the time ?

12:25

the latter.

12:25

a sole attempt in a drowning boat does not constitute a valid basis for the response you presented.

12:26

should have made demands before the thing went south.

12:26

i started out largely tele

12:26

but was summoned back in as the shop was in dire straits

12:26

'we must all grunt on the stake!111 for victory111'

12:26

lmao

12:26

you remind me of that joke of the young slut.

12:27

which?

12:28

"mommy, mommy, i made five dollars!"

12:28

"how did you do that ?"

12:28

"this old guy said he'd give me five dollars if i climb up in that tree!"

12:28

"you slut, you. he only wanted to see your panties."

12:28

next day

12:28

"mommy, mommy, i made twenny dollars!"

12:28

"what now ?"

12:28

"old guy came by told me he'd give me five if i climb up that tree"

12:28

"didn't i tell you..."

12:29

"ha! joke's on him, i took them off first."

12:29

l0l

12:31

my last move was even a switch of profession, i'm no longer a reverser. turned out not to be a smart idea.

12:32

turns out, there were worse things.

12:32

what do you do now?

12:32

(i mean, by name)

12:33

phf: i was hired originally to (yes) calculate runtimes of gnarly algos

12:33

(why anyone would pay for this is a very long story)

12:34

that sounds a like a very respectable, if very narrow specialization

12:34

is that pen and paper by hand?

12:34

mostly.

12:36

then eminently commutable ?

12:36

how gnarly? 3sat, tsp heuristic solutions?

12:36

or gnarly as in "we wrote this over past 5 years, need to have upper bounds noa!!1"

12:36

gnarly in the sense where the working set is a meg of cpp code.

12:37

written by academics.

12:37

ah, the second kind

12:37

doing megatonnes of linear algebra.

12:37

and bignum

12:37

actually thast should ber the easy part neh ?

12:37

i'd imagine it's the control structures / branching that's problematic

12:37

oh, i grok the "go pound pavement" reason now

12:38

mircea_popescu: actually bignum is a nightmare because of algo transitions

12:38

ah

12:38

hey, hidden branching!

12:38

(e.g., gmp uses 4+ different mult algos)

12:38

academic offshoots treat their engineers the way they do grad students, because the two are usually the same and equally replaceable

12:39

and there was also to be reversing, of juicy things, but turned out that (apparently) i could only be used for it if i agreed to usgrasty

12:39

i once interviewed for an interesting problem shop, that was a upenn spinoff of some ph.d. thesis work, results could be immediately applied in oil refinery optimizations

12:40

the offer was so ridiculous, i couldn't even consider it. the woman in charge thought she was being generous!

12:40

clearly the downdraft of "phd work"

12:40

it's incredible what the grads will take,

12:41

and given that, it's incredible the females aren't actively pursuing prostitution.

12:41

and the shop itself was how i imagine alf shop is, a small group of math/compsci grads doing peanut work under inhumane conditions

12:41

phf: there are much worse conditions!

12:42

asciilifeform: there are also much much better conditions

12:42

at least here it's only 2 blokes to a 8x8 cell

12:42

phf: aha, in mircea_popescu's harem

12:42

on dirigible.

12:42

you're silly

12:42

you think ?!

12:42

anyway better conditions exist. for better peoplez.

12:43

ok, ~now~ i'm grokking

12:43

this is all academia mentality

12:43

i've never done 'honest work' in my whole life, phf .

12:43

so ?

12:44

mircea_popescu has a spiffy article, about folks 'worth their weight in frozen pork'

12:45

these are unrelated considerations.

12:45

how so ?

12:45

do you know any women who've never fucked a black guy in their life ?

12:45

100%

12:46

how would this circumstance influence their capacity to in the future conceive a baby with their putative black lover ?

12:46

count me as thick, i dun see the connection.

12:46

me either. because there isn't one.

12:46

obviously i will make passable pork when finally processed.

12:46

cunt works. you don't have to keep priming it with all sorts of cocks it could work with

12:46

and ok soap.

12:46

so as to maintain it's capacity to work with them in the future.

12:47

and perhaps a reasonable set of lampshades.

12:47

so : whether cunt works or not is a separate and distinct consideration from whether cunt ever did it with black cock before.

12:47

the mentality here is "i'm fucking all kinds of scum, but at least it's not a black fella"

12:47

which is why no sterility clinic makes woman fill out formulary, "have you done guy like your present so, in your teens ?"

12:48

<asciilifeform> how so ? << answered ?

12:48

well as i gather mircea_popescu's answer was 'you could start doing 17 yo work for shit wage' and i answer 'why the fuck should i a single day earlier than forced to.'

12:49

i guess we collectivelly just lost the past 5 minutes huh.

12:55

http://www.contravex.com/2016/03/31/cheep-petes-guide-to-not-being-a-poorfag/#comment-42690 << pete_dushenski

12:56

the 'make a budget' and 'don't drink through your whole wage' thing is REASONABLE as 'how to not GO IDIOT BROKE' advice

12:56

but 'how to get rich' ??

12:57

buy dirty potato, clean it, sell it, buy two dirty potatoes, clean them, sell them, then your father dies and leaves you the estate

12:57

^

12:58

go to baltimore, start gang, keep it cheap, effective and lean. under the pressure of all the other idiots nobody can afford to engage you, too painful bite for the calories contained, in twenty years trade the president his life in exchange for his daughter.

12:58

sorry folks, there never was nor ever will be another way.

12:58

review henry teh fifth.

12:59

"A very attractive couple enters and begins shopping with a basket. She is tall, elegant, and white, not busty enough to pose in playboy, and not thin enough to model clothes. She is beautiful in the very high heels she can barely stand on, doing the dopefiend lean as she is. Her date is a short muscular black man with his pants actually buckled around his waist. They are in their late twenties and he cant keep his hands o

12:59

ff of her as she staggers and drools in the aisle. He has a powder blue hat. She carries a finely stitched black leather purse about the size of one of her shoes. They cannot decide who should be pushing the cart. They head back to the womens room and have sex standing up, between the stall doors and the sink, with the door wide open. She is bent over the sink and he is having a hard time getting his pelvis level with her

13:00

rather remarkable Caucasian ass. She is spreading her legs to get lower for him. When I pass again coming back from the cooler he has had the decency to push her up against the wall so that she is not exposed to passersby. After their ten minute tryst they shop for another 20 minutes and then leave hand-in-hand."

13:00

apud lafond. fucking beautiful!

13:00

incidentally where in bmore do you get folks for your gang with >bathwater iq ?

13:00

asciilifeform you fight the war with the army you get.

13:00

this is why the jail is full of the idiots aha

13:01

jail is your home.

13:01

'big zone', 'little zone'

13:05

i am left to wonder, clearly mircea_popescu has a very high opinion of orc scum, why doesn't he recruit ~them~ to write his softs, run his companies, etc. ?

13:06

you keep making these whole insane jumps. first you went from "cunt works or doesn't work" to "cunt has or hasn't previous experience with black cock". now you went from "you want to not be poor, gotta act like it" to "why is mp not storing cheese in bottles and shoes on hooks".

13:06

wtf is this

13:07

this in re 'bmore gang' recipe

13:07

yes.

13:07

i don't even recall mentioning cunt.

13:08

or cheese or hooks, yes.

13:08

possibly i do not have sufficient lsd to properly do this thread..

13:08

is lsd like, superman vitamins ?

13:08

aha!

13:13

if only.

13:13

but anyway, let us elaborate, not like anything better to do on rainy day.

13:13

0l holy shit i just read a trilema where mircea_popescu agreed with me?!

13:14

i think i'ma get on my pig and fly around a bit ?

13:14

part one. you said "i've never done 'honest work' in my whole life, phf." ; and "mircea_popescu has a spiffy article, about folks 'worth their weight in frozen pork'". this equivocates experience with capacity.

13:15

in the illustration used, the cunt has the CAPACITY to procreate, with whatever man, as a function of whether it works or does not work. if it has the capaqcity to procreate, it will procreate. if it doesn't procreate, it's because IT didn';t work, NOT because the cock was black.

13:15

i have capacity ! worth about 80 kg of pork.

13:15

not grade-a tho.

13:15

the cunt's experience in fucking whatever penis is not related to this in any sense.

13:15

more importantly, since you won't let go : what you wish your asshole to be used for and what it is used for are also divorced.

13:16

infantine equivalencies you propose to the world notwithstanding, as they have no standing.

13:16

well no shit, i will have no say in who eats the pork.

13:16

moving on.

13:17

part two. how one proceeds to not be poor is unrelated to what mp does.

13:17

~fin~.

13:18

my original point is that it is also not related to pete_dushenski's peculiar cargo cultisms

13:18

(mortification of the flesh, saving pennies, etc.)

13:19

i think on that we're all agreed

13:19

possibly pete_dushenski himself as well.

13:19

mircea_popescu's advice, 'become a pirate!1111' is ~practical and mega-useful~ by comparison !

13:20

i admit that i wonder if pete_dushenski's misconceptions came to him from his ancestors, for whom saving sorta worked.

13:20

(because sound - relatively - money)

13:22

does saving in bitcoin work? Or not stable enough yet?

13:23

PeterL: ask this after you buy a bunch today, and mircea_popescu drops the nuke in the great phorkwarz of july

13:24

saving never worked.

13:24

does investing work?

13:25

efficiency works, in the sense that the more efficient corporation will drive the others out. but this is a business, not a household concern.

13:25

i suspect that 'sound money' is a fantasy

13:25

at least in the mythical sense of 'i put value in and arbitrarily later i get at least this much out NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENS'

13:25

PeterL it works for the group. a society with better investment policies will have more intensive usage of capital and thus drive other societies out

13:25

it doesn't do much for the individual.

13:26

investing is, by and large, the capitalist equivalent of honorable in fedualism. the country with more honorable barons had a better footing in war.

13:26

same headcount of cattle, weirs and lands to distribute as squires, stronger army nevertheless.

13:26

this is why i always had sympathy with the folks who pete_dushenski enjoys feeling superior to.

13:26

because the ONLY THING no one can ever take from you is the icecream you ATE YESTERDAY

13:27

this is basic animal wisdom.

13:27

(also more intensive use of capital : took 5 swings of the sword before running away, instead of 4. sword-on-battlefield is the eminent capital of feudalism)

13:27

(and yes, eventually it leads to the pork shop)

13:28

mircea_popescu: i understand why you pick example of feudal battlefield, rather than red army, but the latter was actually the state of the art afaik.

13:28

asciilifeform the reason "no one can take from you" is because it's been taken already. sorta like nobody can burn water or steal the intelligence of mongoloids.

13:28

in terms of most recent success of 'seppuku honour'

13:29

asciilifeform mostly didn't pick because marginal and not so interesting. what about it ?

13:30

interesting in that it refuted orwell's argument in re how folks renouncing their 'i'm a precious snowzflake!111 individual!' thing and dying with hounour have to buy into supernatural claptral

13:30

*claptrap

13:30

he gnashed his teeth at length about this, recall.

13:30

but they did buy into supernatural claptrap.

13:31

what, you think just because xtianity pretended to quarrel with itself, socialism is anything other than catolicism now ?!

13:31

same stupid shit, from the same roots, by the same people.

13:32

back!

13:32

http://www.contravex.com/2016/03/31/cheep-petes-guide-to-not-being-a-poorfag/#comment-42694 << asciilifeform

13:32

http://trilema.com/2016/outrageous-mps-guide-to-not-being-a-poorfag/#comment-116900 << mircea_popescu

13:32

april, may, july

13:32

not a lot of time to get keccak into the hairball.

13:33

ben_vulpes: whatchawaitinfor ?

13:33

go, get.

13:33

asciilifeform: who said anything about waiting

13:33

ben_vulpes: not saying you should rent a car and "win" "points", but you recall our earlier discussion of tco ?

13:34

btw, where is the epic mp asciilifeform thread about tuning the nonce shifting to ensure nodes have a market for their digests?

13:34

hard to beat $81/mo with another few bucks for leccy.

13:34

pete_dushenski: how many of these do you have now ?

13:34

i personally have 1 arse

13:34

and so never was tempted to keep >1 auto.

13:34

i'll take the odd thousand dollar charge over a car lease.

13:35

mostly because i intend to own the thing for over a decade, and not drive it a whole lot.

13:35

asciilifeform: cars ? just two, soon to be whittled back down to 1, but then perhaps back to two.

13:35

pete_dushenski: does the woman drive ?

13:36

sure, with own car. three in house atm.

13:36

pete_dushenski's wife's car is not on pete_dushenski's books?

13:37

ben_vulpes: what you'll take and what's more economical are different considerations

13:37

*

asciilifeform has ancient and uninteresting auto and will have it for so long as parts can be had for it

13:37

ben_vulpes: mnope

13:37

microelectric shitmobile is economical in the same way that ersatz american cheese is economical

13:38

asciilifeform: for the automologists, mind sharing make, model, and year ?

13:38

'acura', almost old enough to drive itself, 6 cyl.

13:38

i forget which model exactly

13:38

4 door ? tl ?

13:38

is that a toyota ?

13:38

early 2000s

13:38

honda

13:38

mircea_popescu: a type of honda

13:39

i thought honda made motorbikes.

13:39

mircea_popescu: they make even chainsaws

13:39

toyota makes lexus as 'lux brand'

13:39

asciilifeform: snowplows too

13:39

generators!

13:39

generators!

13:39

heh

13:40

hitachi wands ?

13:40

new from honda : the combination hitachi-tamaguchi

13:40

petrol-powered!

13:40

(or, a diesel diddler!)

13:40

now /those/ are some good vibrations.

13:40

im surprised these don't exist, ftr.

13:40

*

ben_vulpes hums

13:40

mircea_popescu: there ~were~ steam diddlers in 1880s

13:41

nono, the pet dildo.

13:41

ah

13:41

l0l

13:41

mega-concept

13:41

i almost want to build.

13:41

gotta ride it or it dies.

13:41

can develop personality, may end up wanting to fuck your friends etc.

13:41

and if it is unhappy, it burps, sputters

13:41

ben_vulpes: how does leased electricmobile that will work hummingly and economically for three years until returned to mothership compare to plastic food that becomes part of one's body ?

13:41

MY DILDO BROKE UP WITH ME WAAAHHH

13:42

dildogocchi!

13:42

this is really not a bad idea

13:42

should be in every elementary shcool

13:42

can make $$$ out of attachables, too, apple style.

13:42

nipple clamps, you name it.

13:42

'tis an ersatz auto

13:43

ben_vulpes: you ever buy that suv btw ?

13:43

"Im over six miles from the city line, among townhomes that go for 400K, walking through a park that is a slice of solitude during the day and a gauntlet at night; a park where I have seen two gangs parley in a formal manner as I pretended to be some homeless slob on the next bench, and where, this time last year, I saw a white stoner in his 20s trying to talk his girl into getting into a van full of black guys as she crie

13:43

d and gasped."

13:43

ima end up moving to baltimore for reals.

↖ ↖

13:43

this guy sure knows how to entice.

13:43

pete_dushenski: mhm

13:43

bmore is valhalla, at least in american terms

13:43

i enjoy taking day trips there

13:44

the sea even stinks correctly, per my lights

13:44

the fauna, strangely, never bothered me.

13:44

eh the fear is always overstated.

13:44

maidenly tremors.

13:44

srsly they never even so much as said a rude word.

13:45

aqnd yet you are convinced you'll get buttloved in prison.

13:45

prolly just bored to death.

13:45

or maybe bored to new life!

13:45

(perhaps i am already in prison?)

13:46

l0l we just had a man publicly quit in disgust

13:47

lol over what?

13:47

pay.

13:48

how much was he making ?

13:48

i have nfi!

13:49

but i dun think anyone, even janitor, taks home less than 6fig usa

13:49

heh. guy won't even share what he's making when quitting in disgust. teh bars run deep.

13:49

fella thought, as they often do, that 'deserved moar!1111'

13:50

"The NEWS will depict this violence as a protest gone out of control. However, as of 11:00 a.m. black female cashiers at the Shoppers supermarket at Mondawmin mall knew through social media that riots were being planned by high school studentsan attack from students at one school [Frederick Douglas high School] on the very shopping center their parent's patronized." << this actuallyt is very illustrative of the whole "spyi

13:50

ng/datamining" thing.

13:50

now he can have fun, likely, incinerating his savings while looking for shop that pays his old wage.

13:50

usg would like to know as much as black min wage workers ; but it can't ask them

13:51

why can't it ask them ? ha! because it's made up of pasty white boys. it can't ask them for the same reasonh the pasty ass white boys individually can't ask the cashiers for a blowjob.

13:51

mircea_popescu: there are entire office bldgs where they do nothing but hear out stoolies of all colours

13:51

usg ~knows~ but it is impolitic to ~do~ anything.

13:51

so ?

13:52

knows my foot.

13:52

what would it have done differently, in mircea_popescu's view, if it knew ?

13:52

what, there's a relation between knowledge and action now ?

13:52

what'd you do differently if you knew what ?

13:53

let's rephrase, how did mircea_popescu become convinced that usg did ~not know~ ?

13:53

by its attempts to find out.

13:53

~all of which~ he is privy to ??

13:53

looky : there's many kinds of know. couple lives across the hall from you. you "know" they're probably fucking now and again. this is very different from teenager spying through door cracks to catch glimpses.

13:54

which latter category the whole "datamining/surveillance" crap is all about.

13:55

the white people like it because it certifies their interesting-ness, just like a neglected housewife is flattered by the attention of pubescent makes. the government engages in the behaviour because it is a pubescent male. win-win as they say.

14:06

http://trilema.com/2016/outrageous-mps-guide-to-not-being-a-poorfag/#comment-116902 << mircea_popescu

14:06

bbl

14:07

so a grep through an entire log takes 1.5s (testing with grep lsd), same thing done in a log thingy takes 3s

14:07

anyone remember that article about grep doing some weird tricks to speed itself up?

14:08

aha!

14:08

specifically "selling out the general case to favour the common case"

14:13

oddest things using #'= in a search across numeric vectors instead of #'eql slows things down by 1.3 seconds...

14:15

sounds like poorly implemented whatever, lisp ?

14:17

yeah..

14:20

i tell you : store the thing as trees.

14:20

waste the ram, save the cpu.

14:24

but that means some tokenization algo, which presumably breaks ascii's "want search like grep!!!1" requirement

14:24

tokenize by space

14:24

if he doesn't like space as a tokenizer he has other issues.

14:25

yeah, that's what i'm thinking, and then things like $#434 will just have whatever own buckets that they want

14:25

specifically, $-#-4-3-4 and you found it 5 nodes down.

14:27

this is the golden means between the abaccus of filling the log with #twitter #dumb #shit and the insanity of string-searching gb of material each pageload.

14:27

like it or not, we, or at least i, actually DO tokenize by space.

14:31

phf how much is the actual log incidentally ? i see well over 600mb here.

14:43

So kako's dump which is only id;timestamp;nick;message adds up to ~~150mb

14:44

I think joins and quits add a lot of extra noise

14:45

Room on a running cmu instance gives 168mb. Peanuts

14:47

how many gigabits of ram you working with?

14:48

My assumption is always +inf but I like to keep heap minimal out of sportsmanship

14:56

(Erm `room' on a lisp says how much you're using rather than how much is left)

~ 16 minutes ~

15:12

deedbot-: http://explo.yt/public/fmpif_201603.txt.asc

15:12

accepted: 1

15:12

deedbot-: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/attachments/20160401/attachment.txt?sha1=c2d703eeb8d0553a3e66e2a981b99efe2f94b155

15:12

accepted: 1

15:13

'It is improper. Enumerations must always be made of items of the same kind. It's not enough that the items answer to the same purpose. They must actually be of the same kind.' << aaaaand this is how we learned that mircea_popescu , under the cover of darkness, programs! in ada !1111

15:16

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-virginia-cia-explosives-idUSKCN0WY59U <<< cia goes rogerkver

15:20

in other nyooz, http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-cyber-reddit-idUSKCN0WX2YF

15:20

'Social networking forum reddit on Thursday removed a section from its site used to tacitly inform users it had never received a certain type of U.S. government surveillance request, suggesting the platform is now being asked to hand over customer data under a secretive law enforcement authority.'

15:22

what is there even to surveil on reddit.

15:22

whole thing is public, like city sewer.

15:22

afaik.

15:31

ben_vulpes> btw, where is the epic mp asciilifeform thread about tuning the nonce shifting << http://danielpbarron.com/2016/the-new-bitcoin/

15:32

mircea_popescu, http://trilema.com/2016/outrageous-mps-guide-to-not-being-a-poorfag/#selection-99.36-99.46 << but it any case / but ~in~ any case ?

15:32

^ notably i was not involved with this iirc.

~ 16 minutes ~

15:49

asciilifeform: there are direct messages on reddit

15:49

prolly those

15:49

and 1337 terrorists in private subreddits

15:49

and ip addresses

15:49

l0l

15:49

prolly danielpbarron has it

15:50

there are 'dark market' 'subreddits'

15:50

not to mention, gotta plant flash 0days in selected folks' reddit hose

15:50

though i have nfi why this needs to happen with cooperation of reddit per se

15:50

they could as easily do it on isp end.

15:51

i recall the original silk road had it's own .onion web forum, but i guess this was too hard for the kids who showed up after it was cool

15:51

asciilifeform: smells like a general trend of making companies get used to acting as part of law enforcement

15:51

yeah but why reddit, vs isp.

15:51

thin end of the funnel.

15:51

already has isp

15:51

why not reddit too

15:52

sure.

15:52

and general trend of "oh ~now~ reddit plays ball with USG (implication that it hadn't been already)"

15:52

outsource as much "law enforcement" as possible

15:52

danielpbarron: yup, apple, google et al

15:57

when's gabriel_laddel going to join us

15:57

just outsource law enforcement all the way and make it illegal for people to break the laws!

15:58

win.

15:58

mircea_popescu: http://trilema.com/2016/outrageous-mps-guide-to-not-being-a-poorfag/#comment-116904

16:05

from the world of lisp rot, asdf, the `make' of common lisp, has been gaining features for a while now to the point that it contains all kinds of crazy shit, like a fullblown cross-lisp compatibility layer for various file operations, etc. so i pulled version 1.369, last one before faré took over the operations, it is 75kb vs current 560k (which is itself packed from a large repo). not surprisingly it works, but when it doesn't it exposes cockroa

16:05

ches in the walls. dodgy/clever hacks, "modern ecosystem" "improvements", etc. etc.

16:06

'quicklisp' sorta workx

16:07

quicklisp depends on asdf, in fact hard depends on asdf3. it takes exactly three places to patch it to support 1.369 and it continues working

16:07

it does.

16:07

i mean, 75kb or readable lisp vs. 560kb or crazy "with-upgradability" macros that break cross-referencing, etc.

16:07

and so i marvel that it worx.

16:07

ah ah

16:08

but increasingly i am convinced of mircea_popescu's point, 'ecosystem' of cockroaches is worse than none

16:08

which is one of the resons thinking folk so often succumb to the temptation of 'let's make a lang'

16:08

i'd read it to figure out what the "improvements" are, but i can't, because the new code is ~insane~

16:08

but roaches show up as quickly as they come to a newly-built block of flats in nyc

16:09

in other dirigible news, http://archive.is/eB7Yn

16:09

fare had to make "hacking on asdf" videos just to get people to read the damn thing

16:09

"The Local Dirigible Manufacturing requirement is expected to kickstart a nascent aerospace industry in Alberta, furthering government’s effort to diversify the economy. " << kek

16:09

pete_dushenski: this is hilarious

16:09

pete_dushenski: consider, a litre of hydrogen lifts ~1 gram.

16:09

helium - less.

16:10

hehe

16:22

use atomic instead of molecular hydrogen - half the mass, so lifts twice as much!

16:22

l0l!!

16:23

let's go straight to davinci's vacuum balloon .

16:23

but nature abhors a vacuum, would be like inciting the wrath of God

16:25

what if you heat the hydrogen?

16:25

heat, heat !

16:25

mix dirigible and hot air baloon into one sweet machine!

16:29

http://www.google.com/patents/US20060038062

16:33

;;later tell mircea_popescu http://imgur.com/a/aKIww

16:33

The operation succeeded.

16:35

phf you're really saying 2x slowdown factor of lisp vs. C is bad and should be further optimized?

16:35

phf: hey how do you deploy a lisp thing?

16:36

I might just ship new deedbot with swank attached

16:37

jurov: i can often get slightly better performance out of cmucl than out of c on critical paths, so that was purely algorithmic question under the assumption that i can easily get within same ballpark with the right algo

16:37

trinque: rsync, tmux, asdf, really nothing smarter than that

16:38

phf: remind me again why cmucl and not sbcl

16:38

swank is pretty useless on prod, unless you jump through all hoops ahead of time and get it to a casual state. you want ssh files to work and trump is still slow for that, so you have to do fusefs

16:38

yes but what about dumber !1!11

16:38

does cmucl even support ACTUAL threads yet

16:40

trinque: so just deploy the way you would normally deploy and write a simple set of operator commands (or even a menu driven thing) for repl, that you can control things over. "press 1 to asdf reload :FOO package, press 2 to reinitilize data, etc."

16:41

phf, as a lisp newbie i wondered why asdf is so consistently tagged "obsolete" everywhere

16:41

i played with swank on live webserver setup (back when marco's UnCommonWeb was a thing) and quickly gave up on it, when i was hit with a bug that 100+ people triggered

16:41

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2016/04/leaked-volkswagen-sends-ecoplus-diesel-fix-to-customer/

16:41

"Drivers may notice a decrease in fuel efficiency of between 5 and 32 percent, depending on climate, engine model year, and driving habits. Some drivers may also notice a decrease in power under certain conditions, such as full-throttle driving or highway operation. In some tests, the power rating of the VW TDI engine was affected by as much as 26 percent during full-throttle operation in cold climates. Finally, the increas

16:41

ty cycle brought on by changes in engine programming may significantly reduce the time between major services for TDI engines coupled to a manual transmission." << /me falls off chair

16:41

the whole swank debug on error thing is just not as good as Squeak/smalltalk

16:42

hm, could also use unix signals for reload and whatever else maybe

16:43

*

pete_dushenski called out the fact that "fixed veedubs" will be worth ~more~ than their unneutered counterparts on the used market. this confirms it.

16:43

pretty much all lisps are picky about signals

16:43

for now I'll just turd out a save-lisp-and-die and go from there

16:44

and i wondered whether it's me or swan is really so cranky

16:44

pete_dushenski: april1?

16:44

slad is brittle unless you have identical lisps (version/os) on dev machine and server

16:44

i don't on account of mac/linux

16:44

asciilifeform: lololol. i've been mega-had

16:44

also proper slad should be smart about resource handling on fork, like sockets. i think this is all somehow handled by the vm, but you still want to explore it

16:45

really, asdf lets you do "load all my source" quite trivially as long as you packed it into a package ahead of time

16:46

jurov: i've not seen where asdf is deprecated, you looking at this guy https://common-lisp.net/project/asdf/?

16:47

jurov: also i agree as far as swank being piece of shit, it's just that it supports a certain development style that you can't get anywhere else, except smalltalk

16:47

http://cliki.net/asdf "Do NOT use asdf-install anymore, for it is both obsolete and unmaintained."

16:48

ah, "asdf-install" is an old really hacky way of install lisp packages, that would pull things from cliki.net. it was very broken

16:48

bbl. apologies for fool's day spam.

16:48

and "(obsolete)" markers at many places like http://www.cliki.net/s-xml

16:50

so you generally have two problems, one is "how do i group together multiple source code files in order to indicate they are part of same codebase", second is "how do i indicate dependency of this codebase on this other codebase" and third is "how do i autodownload things from internet"

16:51

phf: does this remind you of anything ?

16:51

two problems, fear, surprise and a most ruthless

16:52

if only tmsr had a thing that solves all 3... l0l

16:52

i seem to recall..

16:52

jurov: so asdf solves first two, asdf-install used to solve third one, now superseded by quicklisp

16:55

asciilifeform: to be fair v doesn't solve third one

16:57

the third one is not a problem !

16:57

it is solved by ~not doing it~

16:57

'how do i remove the alligator from my bath'

~ 18 minutes ~

17:16

woo

17:17

boyer-mooring brought it down to 0.34s

17:18

neato

~ 34 minutes ~

17:52

;;later tell PeterL haven't read ramsey, no.

17:52

The operation succeeded.

17:56

;;later tell ben_vulpes it may well be that i hail from narnia, but yes, interest rates and house prices are inversely correlated. furthermore, and i forget sometimes that americans lock in rates for entire mortgages, but canadians typically renegotiate their rates every 5 years. longer terms are available, but it's been +ev to take shorter terms for so long that i don't know of a single homeowner who doesn't do 5-year term

17:56

The operation succeeded.

17:57

pete_dushenski: being the pig is also +ev until christmas.

17:57

<phf> proper way to deal with iowa is buy a house, get your 800$/mo satellite internet (not even checking what's available, why bother), and do your aerospace/banking/medical it consulting work remote << In Iowa you can probably get fiber internet unless you conciously decide to farm or hermit

17:58

BingoBoingo, phf: ever actually connect over satellite ? the lag is atrocious

17:58

asciilifeform: with 10-year MAX for mortgage rates in canada, even if amortization is 30 years, it's be a pig, buy house for cash, or rent.

17:58

and forget about 'all you can eat' bandwidth

17:59

asciilifeform: Which is why I suggest if choosing Iowa choose fiber internet. No Verizon needed.

17:59

" With only 7% of Canadians having mortgage terms between six and 10 years, long terms are not a popular choice in Canada. They are even less popular amongst younger age groups at only 3% uptake in ages 18-34."

17:59

good for mp internet, lynx, batch email u/d, git pull/push. basically all you need to do work (all i need anyway)

17:59

BingoBoingo: if you can do iowa, you can do timisoara, no ?

17:59

it's no wonder everyone is screaming "canada has a housing bubble"

18:00

asciilifeform: Only people I know from timisoara left there.

18:00

phf: you forgot tumblr gifpr0n

18:01

hell, if you can do remote, why even live on land and pay rent like an idiot. live on a motherfucking ship.

18:01

BingoBoingo: how many you know in iowa ?

18:02

boat living is kind of rough

18:02

asciilifeform: piracy is, after all, easier than bagging a lunch

18:02

*

shinohai buys a boat and starts a bitcoin privateer business with pete_dushenski

18:02

phf: if i could choose between rent and seasickness, i would choose the latter.

18:03

shinohai: we'll be consultants! like dogbert's bit wherein he sells $1k books on how to become a millionaire. inside book it suggests "sell 1k books for $1k!"

18:04

in other news, http://glyf.org/tmp/lsd.png

18:04

www.k-international.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/dogbert-consultants.jpg << from same series

18:04

http://www.k-international.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/dogbert-consultants.jpg

18:05

asciilifeform: 5, but my dick has been inside 1 of them so 20% interesting rate.

18:05

<mircea_popescu> ideally, they go in the form of renting time from a workshop wtf is this my garage is my workshop artisan thing. << Arises from the idea that public tools are icky

18:06

BingoBoingo: incidentally you can't actually rent time ~in someone else's~ workshop in usa - liability!1111

18:06

asciilifeform: grep search, so lsd matches rtlsdr or "woulsdn't" http://glyf.org/tmp/lsd.png AS REQUESTED

18:06

what one ~can~ do is participate in 'hackspaces' but i tried it and it sucked

18:06

i dun wanna talk to people.

18:06

https://calvy.files.wordpress.com/2011/02/89034-strip.gif << relatedly, stan as dogbert

18:06

when i'm trying to tool

18:06

phf: neato

18:07

phf: toggleable whitespace word boundaries would be useful but i argue that if we can only have one thing, we oughta have the thing you linked to.

18:07

ideally i oughta be able to search for " lsd " tho.

18:08

AS IN GREP

18:08

that doesn't match bol and eol of course

18:09

http://glyf.org/tmp/more-lsd.png

18:09

sure.

18:10

neato

18:12

it's also not as useful for freeform searching like

18:12

assbot: 1 results for 'meth lsd lisp' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=meth+lsd+lisp

18:12

which returns 29-08-2015 14:14:55 <mircea_popescu> maybe you're right, and it's incidentals. or maybe lisp to the young mind is like meth-lsd

18:14

http://www.cpsc.gov/en/Recalls/2016/Toshiba-Recalls-Laptop-Computer-Battery-Packs/ << pre-fools nooz

18:14

should probably call this search grep, and have that as first thing, eventually to be replaced by proper search-a-tron

18:15

pete_dushenski: what's the exciting part? this happens allt he fucking time

18:15

the one where people can tokenize and write queries and shit

18:15

replaced/augmented

18:16

asciilifeform: oh ?

18:18

pete_dushenski: li battery recalls are a snore

18:21

a side effect of all things being interconnected, http://glyf.org/tmp/all-one.png searching for bitcoind includes annotations, which in this case take you to correct follow ups

18:23

damn that's cool

18:23

nicely done

18:23

very spiffy

18:24

when can we use1111

~ 49 minutes ~

19:14

asciilifeform: nevermind that the tools in 'hackerspaces' are invariably so completely out of true as to be useless

19:14

;;later tell pete_dushenski interesting! so one can either borrow at a low rate and expect no return, or borrow at a high rate and pray for a return?

19:14

The operation succeeded.

19:21

[Ossasepia] The Coolest Guide to Coolness, Riches, Ginger and Spice - http://www.dianacoman.com/2016/04/02/the-coolest-guide-to-coolness-riches-ginger-and-spice/

19:21

ben_vulpes: I class that under "icky"

19:33

onoes, lengthy log

19:33

is there website yet ? ?? ????!

19:34

phf> So kako's dump which is only id;timestamp;nick;message adds up to ~~150mb <<< when does this start ?

19:35

danielpbarron aha!

19:40

PeterL> mix dirigible and hot air baloon into one sweet machine! << self heating, and also propelling!

19:42

phf> so you generally have two problems, one is "how do i group together multiple source code files in order to indicate they are part of same codebase", second is "how do i indicate dependency of this codebase on this other codebase" and third is "how do i autodownload things from internet" <<< all of which are really "how do i install v"

19:44

asciilifeform> pete_dushenski: being the pig is also +ev until christmas. << he has a point. "renegotiable" when your side of the negotiation is pack it and leave and their side is "take it or leave it" is insanity on a stick.

19:47

phf> it's also not as useful for freeform searching like << why not ? reunion!

19:49

diana_coman "Ha, wouldnt you say thats how it happens really?" << hey what's this mean ?

19:50

don't millionaires really get there by reading guides?

19:50

no?

19:50

as in my pretty picture?

19:51

and doing all the exercises in the guides, ofc, not "just reading"

19:52

i read it like 3 times still dun know which one are you saying

19:53

you saying they are or you saying they aren't ?

19:53

heh, was I having so much fun that it's unclear whether I am serious or having fun? lolz

19:54

hmm, let me try to make it clearer maybe

19:54

2 min

19:54

"At the very least, they need to do what they can do, as it were" << but this is not ~specific~.

19:55

nope, nor can it be; my observation for what it's worth is that people interact with reality at different levels basically, as they can

19:55

quite.

19:55

it's not a matter of doing X or Y, but rather HOW one does X or Y

19:55

well no. it's a matter of being what they are. hence the ancient "you can't just power cycle a box with no idea of what you are doing".

19:56

the same exact action, in the hand of the idiot is an idiocy ; and in the hand of the millionare, millionarcy. hence the ancient "there's no such thing as your idea" thread

19:57

hm: a. people change who they are all the time really (think dementia for a clear example, not that all are through illness or that radical)

19:58

and b. this thing is quite circular as you say it or as I read what you say

19:58

so I don't quite see the point to expressing circles (other than they are satisfying)

19:58

this "people change" thing is very dubious.

19:59

people turn to shit as they age, and that's all.

19:59

some quicker than others.

19:59

except some actually improve as they age

20:00

to quote marsellus "the punk" wallace, " You see, this profession is filled to the brim with unrealistic motherfuckers. Motherfuckers who thought their ass would age like wine. If you mean it turns to vinegar, it does. If you mean it gets better with age, it don't. "

20:00

and if people don't change, then get yourself a newborn and tell me how is s/he the millionaire

20:01

children aren't people.

20:01

by that measure old people aren't people and idiots aren't people and non-millionaires aren't people and yeah, sure, there's nothing left to discuss either

20:01

certainly

20:02

whether other items are or aren't people has no bearing on the fact that children aren't however.

20:02

mk; define people then

20:02

it'll have to be argued on its own merits, not collective-bargained for.

20:02

so that we know what we are talking about

20:03

adults of the hs species.

20:03

it's not about collective-bargaining, it's about the fact that all of a sudden it seems we are talking about different entities, so we need to set the definitions somehow

20:03

juveniles aren't the animal in any other consideration or context. they WILL be the animal at some point, sure. but the very point of juvenility is they aren't.

20:03

not just yet.

20:04

mhm, so biologically adults or what?

20:04

whatever way you please.

20:07

mk, so an adult is set then to whatever s/he is; is that your position above that people don't change? (I still don't see how is this really reconciled with "they turn to shit as they age!!" - if they change, they can't turn to anything )

20:07

if they don't change*

20:08

they turn to corpses.

20:08

life isn't "whatever we make of it", but a rather well constrained biological process.

20:08

similarly a string doesn't "turn into anything". and main section stars don't turn into really large conglomeration of bathroom rubber duckies.

20:09

so let me see this: child-adult-corpse-dead

20:09

right?

20:09

something like that.

20:09

but things don't turn into anything, so how is this child turns into adult?

20:09

huh ?

20:10

and for that matter what is learning exactly if not change

20:10

you're not about to try and parlay the fact that the space of possibility is narrower than the space of representations into some sort of dilemma ?

20:10

the things that can happen are fewer than the things that can be said.

20:11

not sure I follow

20:11

when i broadly reject your proposition of "change" understood in representational terms, i do not by that rejection also somehow reject actual change understood in actual terms.

20:12

children turn to adults. this does not mean adults can turn into "millionaires".

20:12

adults are adults or is now millionaire some other thing in there in between child-adult-corpse-dead?

20:12

i have no idea what it is, and i don't see that it is very much at all.

20:13

the whole point is that you can "be" a millionaire in the exact sense you can "be" a wife ; or a tree can "be" yours.

20:13

so no, adults do not turn into anything other than corpse by the previous definition, but they do not remain immutable really, precisely as they were, precisely what they will always be

20:14

depends in what terms.

20:14

as far as this aspriational "being X" is concerned, yeah, they're closer to immutable than anything else.

20:15

in purely atomic terms they're incredibly mutable, and a rather good approximation of "random pile of carbon nuclei".

20:15

I suppose the difference comes at heart from defining millionaire as a state of being and thus an inevitable characteristic of the essence of a person (that's my understanding of your position)

20:15

mno. at best it is a state of vision, and thus entirely unrelated to the object,

20:15

much like any other psychosis.

20:16

and my view of it as a stage basically

20:16

being "a millionaire" is much like "being really scary". it's not something the thing IS, it's something the subject perceives.

20:16

the object is just the object.

20:16

mk, a state of vision so then what does this have to do with "being better" at all?

20:16

no idea ?

20:17

which is why i didn't approach the matter in ethical terms at all ; much to pete's displeasure.

20:17

uhm, didn't you write "people who are better are better"

20:18

would you prefer "seen as better" ?

20:18

I read that as an implied millionaire=better otherwise why not right it as such: people who are millionaires, are millionaries

20:19

ugh, write!

20:19

millionaries like missionaries now, can't spell

20:19

because i have no confidence the million is in any way related. it would seem to me the better is truly at issue.

20:23

well, going back to the "interact with reality on different levels" thing might make it perhaps clearer: would this "millionaire vision" be basically a superior level of interaction?

20:24

unrelatedly, this theory that baltimore riots is directly resulting from john hopkins hospital/uni buying gangland, much like flooding of a spot of floor is directly resulting from broom pushing on the other side of puddle is rather interesting.

20:24

or just something in the eyes of the beholder?

20:24

she's a beauty and he's a millionaire? lol

20:25

diana_coman i believe it's not so different from any other simplified approach, such as johnny bravo seeing hot mammas all around ; or else orc warrior seeing world in terms of threats etc.

20:26

I increasingly get the impression that you are trying to answer in that post to what you perceive to be people's actual ideas of the thing, but

20:26

but it's not really clear what that is in itself anyway and then it gets mingled with what is actually said

20:26

or maybe I just don't get it

20:26

hey, if i didn't know better i'd think you're discussing a trilema article.

20:27

lol

20:34

anyway,at this level of haziness I don't think there's much that I can say further;

20:36

"The white men that were visible were all driving; either cop cars or luxury sedans and SUVs. One SUV-load of stoned and drunk white men were shadowing a group of three black girls, calling out the window asking about prices, assuming they were hookers. A young guy standing at the stop next to me yelled to the insane looking Eastern European drunk that was hanging out the window, Yo fool, they either givin it away or ki

20:36

ckin yo ass. Nobody pays fo pussy anymore up in dis joint." << bwahahahaha

20:36

see alfie, erections are scarce now that they have a cure for it.

20:42

waiwut

20:43

i still wish i knew what mircea_popescu means by 'erection is scarce'

20:43

what is usually meant ?

20:43

because if taken literally, it is absurd

20:44

you get 9 tools type A to 10 tools type B ; all the B's work, about half the A's work and while Bs are always on As are on 1% of the time or so.

20:44

erection is cheapest thing in the world

20:44

what part of fucking scarcity needs explaining ?

20:44

the sort where it is wholly imaginated?

20:44

erection is "cheapest thing in the world" in the sense "sword in battlefield is cheapest thing in the world". in yo dreams.

20:44

even a tard can muster erect

20:45

hardly.

20:45

even beggar

20:45

even old women can get wet.

20:45

well no, not symmetrical

20:45

fwiw my understanding of that is simply that there are a whole lot of women around who can't get enough

20:45

but they want enough-mp

20:45

so kind of more demand than supply

20:45

not enough-genericbloke

20:45

the supply is utterly constrained, no matter how you dish it

20:46

'erection is scarce' is a laugh

20:46

asciilifeform average whore still works 4 an hour for 6 hours. do i sign you up for 24 fucks a day ?

20:46

yes?

20:47

lolk.

20:47

ima start s.malebrothel

20:48

but plox call things as they are, it is not erections that are scarce, but that mircea_popescu has only 1 cock afaik

20:48

and the chix can't all ride

20:48

why do you think everyone'd want me specifically ?

20:49

who wants reddit cock?

20:49

i have nfi, reddit people ?

20:49

well, they don't seem to be adults there really, hence not people :D

20:49

afaik not

20:50

typical cunt wants nothing to do with typical cok

20:50

i dunno that there's that many sexually active womenz on reddit. seems mostly BingoBoingo's mayogenders & weirdo bois.

20:50

twitter im sorry

20:50

uh no nm, you said reddit

20:51

im fucking confused, reading lafond on one screen, talking to you here, and you don't use the same word for websocialmedia

20:51

at this point i'm not even sure whether most reddit userz are even made of meat

20:52

lol im also konphyoosed, i'm in a room full of chinese

20:52

in other news, "Chamicka, age 14, says she accepted Hot Pockets frozen toaster sandwiches for sex and would gladly do it again.Nicole, age 15, says her and her 14 year old sister had sex with a man for a double cheeseburger. Whether it was the cheeseburger meal, and if it was supersized, was not made clear. And Chiquanna, age 14, says she had sex for a lobster buffet dinner."

20:52

bbl

20:52

check it out, ten bitcents buys you all four.

20:55

mircea_popescu: 26-04-2013

20:56

**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Apr 12 23:03:54 2012 < i have them earlier

20:56

but of course they're only while i personallt was on

20:57

If you can pack&upload from 2012 to date above, I can integrate them

20:57

yeah ima do that ; tomorro.

20:57

Unless somebody steps forward who had a bouncer instance running since the early days

20:58

but yes a proper bouncer log would be better, save you the gaps you know ?

20:59

I'm not sure of a reasonable way of integrating it though. Main issue, and general with canonical log approach taken so far is each entry has an id, starts at 1, and incremented by assbot database

21:00

mod6 hey man do you have bouncer logs of historical b-a ?

21:00

phf no negative numbers on your planet ?

21:00

Hacky

21:00

why ?!

21:03

Maybe not, I should think about it

21:03

there's nothing inherently inferior about black oops i mean negative numbers, is there ?

21:04

You get a lot of nice properties if all your data has a positive fixnum ids

21:04

such as ?\

21:05

Can put it all in array, index things by ids

21:05

there's a rule you can't index by negative numbers ?

21:07

Could add an offset to your references

21:07

sure ; if you're going to do that might as well rebase your indexes in db, but anyway.

21:08

Then going to lose all old links

21:08

you mean implicit array such as nth element of A as opposed to A[-5] sorta references ?

21:08

Right now there's a nice property of clicking old links in log and being redirected to new logger

21:08

why, not able to also rebase the links in question ?

21:09

Well you can't do a[-1] because array indexing don't go that way. Can write two arrays a and b and make [n] access one or the other depending on the value

21:10

it huh ?

21:10

why the fuck not ?

21:11

You have to allocate underlying memory in which case a[n] is a claim about where in memory you are reading

21:11

these are associative arrays, key ai, value bi.

21:11

o this is in c ?

21:12

Nah, universally. A significant property of arrays shared across languages is that they give you some guarantees about access time, space utilization

21:13

There are dodgy array like things, that are not actually arrays. Like php that has dictionaries, and uses those to emulate arrays using something they call associative arrays

21:13

if an array is not a key-value datastore, wtf is it ?

21:13

a string ?

21:13

A key value data store is a dictionary

21:14

An array is a superset of string

21:14

or otherwise : why the fuck would i use anything but strings if the only way to access elements is through a n-th reference.

21:14

why even call this "an array". it's not an array ; it's a string.

21:14

You can store other things in arrays that are not chars, like pointers

21:14

so you can store things in strings that aren't characters

21:14

like utf abominations.

21:15

<+mircea_popescu> mod6 hey man do you have bouncer logs of historical b-a ? << sadly, no. :/

21:15

aw!

21:15

irk

21:15

pigeons is gone, rg is gone

21:15

look at that patrickharnett etc

21:15

That's fair, but mostly because the whole thing is a fiction

21:16

My logger thing stores log messages as arrays for example

21:16

its a cryin' shame. i /used/ to log shit like a long time ago when it was #bitcoin-otc

21:16

but stopped iirc once it was #b-a

21:16

well seems i am actually the only one with the logs.

21:17

ya, i'd give you a coin to bundle them up for me -- i'll store 'em somewhere for safe keeping.

21:17

Upload em and I will implement mp-array that can be indexed with negatives

21:17

phf now i much better understand your reluctancy to tree

21:17

let me guess, trees also can't be hash-indexed or some such bs

21:18

There's no reluctance to tree

21:18

ah k

21:18

There's a fact that this code is written for my own amusement, so figuring out how to make memory grep fast is a priority

21:19

But implementing proper search is also a good direction

21:19

the other fact is that i really don't do much coding (mostly because whenever i try i start throwing things out of displeasure of the sort seen above)

21:19

Since it's all written without use of any third party libraries I basically just take knuth and code it from scratch

21:30

mircea_popescu: what means 'historical b-a' here ?

21:30

i have ~98% logz from 2013 up

21:32

**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Sat Oct 6 11:29:23 2012

21:32

but i was a late-comer

21:46

<mircea_popescu> check it out, ten bitcents buys you all four. << i bet it buys a good bit of hot air. 14yos ~lie~...

21:47

also in usa 'sex' (esp among teenage scum) often refers to cock suction or otherwise cuntless pasttimes

21:50

in other nyooz,

21:50

http://imgur.com/a/vBI8K

21:51

^ 'Soft Rotten Meat Flavour'

21:51

Fat is not Greasy, Lean not Wood!111

21:53

<phf> Upload em and I will implement mp-array that can be indexed with negatives << phun phakt, c will ~happily~ permit you to index with negatives.

21:53

at one rupturefarm where i applied to work, there was a notebook of 'pwn this proggy' underhanded-c questions, and one of them relied on this fact.

21:53

(yes you can walk up the stack - or heap, as the case may be - with a negative/overflowing array index)

21:54

this is your fav. isn't it?

21:54

haha

21:54

mod6: which this

21:54

foo[-1]

21:54

nah it's a kind of pons asinorum of underhanded c

21:54

pretty basic.

21:55

yah, we've discussed a bunch.

21:56

*

asciilifeform comes home and finds business card from woman, 'special investigator, diplomatic security service, u.s. dept of state', is momentarily puzzled, notices hand-written note on the back, asking for a fella who lives 2 houses DOWN THE STREET

21:57

:)

21:58

such disappoint.

21:58

momentarily though, CLASSY gassing, sawn to pieces in a motherfucking EMBASSY, my limbs carried out in DIPLOMATIC BAGZ!11111

21:58

but no.

21:58

mere illiteracy.

21:58

*thought

22:05

let us hope not.

~ 50 minutes ~

22:55

http://www.jameslafond.com/article.php?id=4114

22:59

holy shit, 74b?

22:59

half an nsa?

23:00

Yeah. Obesity ain't cheap

23:01

it lives

23:02

congrats trinque

23:02

takes the usual commands, among them: !register, !up, !down, !rate, !unrate, !rated, !gettrust, and !deed

23:03

so wot finally forked?

23:03

yep.

23:04

and I have not imported the old wot

23:04

woah

23:04

why's that

23:07

matter for the forum to discuss; it's not a decision to not, but haven't.

23:08

imho this will just lead to buckets of pointless sweat

23:08

regrunting the old ratingz

23:09

mircea_popescu: ^ ?

23:09

not to mention when folks show up from outside, they still have their keyz, their histories, nobody cancelled them

23:12

!register FC66C0C5D98C42A1D4A98B6B42F9985AFAB953C4

23:12

(register <nick> <keyid>) -- Register your GPG identity, associating GPG key <keyid> with <nick>. <keyid> is a 16 digit key id, with or without the '0x' prefix. We look on servers listed in 'plugins.GPG.keyservers' config. You will be given a random passphrase to clearsign with your key, and submit to the bot with the 'verify' command. Your passphrase will expire in 10 minutes.

23:12

deedbot

FC66C0C5D98C42A1D4A98B6B42F9985AFAB953C4 registered as trinque.

23:13

Seems like WOT fork bots are always unveiled on Fridays

23:15

I'll properly package the source, clean shit up a bit, then post for asciilifeform, ben_vulpes, phf to give a beating.

23:15

then appropriate to make a genesis v-patch and deed

23:16

https://cryptome.org/2016/04/cia-schillings.htm << holy fuck, nightmare fuel

23:16

that mug.

23:17

in other nyooz, 'ALEXANDRIA, Va. – The hacker "Guccifer," alleged to be Marcel Lehel Lazar, 44, of Arad, Romania, made his initial appearance today here in federal court on charges relating to unauthorized access of protected computers. According to the indictment, from December 2012 to January 2014, Lazar hacked into....'

23:19

old deedbot- will handle feeds til I make an rsstron for the CL guy

23:33

trinque> and I have not imported the old wot << why not ?!

23:34

by all means, import, import.

23:39

asciilifeform shame on you for intimating indignities on the angelic character of children. do you not know they be pure as teh driven snot ?!

23:51

man... who uses mysql

23:52

[Qntra] US Spy Agency To Demolish Low Income Housing - http://qntra.net/2016/04/us-spy-agency-to-demolish-low-income-housing/

23:54

You will be given a random passphrase to clearsign with your key <<< this is the wrong way to proceed. how about "we'll encrypt a random string to your key, which you must send back".

23:55

o nm, lol gribble.

23:55

yeah, that's what I'm doing

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