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search trilema search all chans

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00:12	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14450 @ 0.00036428 = 5.2638 BTC [-]
00:15	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 42100 @ 0.00035449 = 14.924 BTC [-]
00:17	decimation	stupid redhat doesn't supply zlib-static by default
00:17	asciilifeform	you don't need zlib!!!
00:17	asciilifeform	in bitcoin.
00:17	asciilifeform	it isn't used anywhere.
00:17	decimation	it wants to link
00:17	asciilifeform	nix it in the bitcoind make
00:17	asciilifeform	as shown in my old instructions.
00:17	decimation	also -l dl
00:17	asciilifeform	it doesn't ever get used.
00:18	decimation	does it dynamically load code?
00:18	decimation	why does it need libdl
00:18	asciilifeform	damned if i know. kill it.
00:18	asciilifeform	(winblows version may have used that)
00:19	BingoBoingo	!up jitenm
00:19	decimation	nano redhat calls static pthread pthread_nonshared.a
00:21	mod6	hrm. ok, i'm gonna try building without -l dl and -l z
00:21	danielpbarron	mod6, http://danielpbarron.com/mod6.txt << got an error :<
00:21	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1AgYdWV )
00:22	mod6	ok thanks danielpbarron.
00:23	mod6	i'll have to figure out what needs to be different in the 32 bit version.
00:24	decimation	ok I got it to compile on centos6 but I had to add the following to the end of the linking command line: -static-libgcc -Wl,-Bstatic -l pthread_nonshared -Wl,-Bdynamic -l m -l dl
00:24	decimation	apparently centos doesn't come with a static libdl or libm
00:25	danielpbarron	it might be the thing i ran into last time i tried this
00:25	asciilifeform	why dl again
00:25	asciilifeform	zap it & say what dies
00:25	decimation	it puked without it
00:25	danielpbarron	i had to change "make install" to "make install_sw"
00:25	asciilifeform	let's see the puke
00:25	mod6	i wanna say that i ran into that as well.
00:25	mod6	cant recall for sure though
00:25	mod6	i'll know in a minute.
00:25	decimation	/build/ourlibs/lib/libcrypto.a(dso_dlfcn.o): In function `dlfcn_globallookup': dso_dlfcn.c:(.text+0x31): undefined reference to `dlopen'
00:25	mod6	ah yeah that
00:25	asciilifeform	wawhat
00:26	asciilifeform	is that in openssl ?
00:26	decimation	why is ssl linking to dl
00:26	asciilifeform	!
00:26	danielpbarron	i just changed it and it gave same error, but maybe because I didn't start from scratch
00:26	mod6	danielpbarron: i think you have some other issues going on probably.
00:27	assbot	[HAVELOCK] [RENT] 70 @ 0.015 = 1.05 BTC [+]
00:28	decimation	asciilifeform: whatever you thought you knew about openssl is truer than you thnk
00:28	danielpbarron	oh wait, i want to be compiling this for arm don't I?
00:29	asciilifeform	which openssl this was again?
00:30	decimation	the label says 1.0.1g
00:30	asciilifeform	aahahaahaha.
00:30	mod6	danielpbarron: oh you're running this on ARM? this won't build on arm probably.
00:30	asciilifeform	https://www.openssl.org/docs/crypto/OPENSSL_config.html
00:30	assbot	OPENSSL_config, OPENSSL_no_config - simple OpenSSL configuration functions ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgYJEd )
00:30	asciilifeform	achtung shitgnomologists!
00:31	asciilifeform	even if you like static builds, openssl slips dynamic code loading up your arse when you're not looking.
		↖ ↖
00:31	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu, ben_vulpes, anyone else who gives a damn ^^^^
00:31	decimation	asciilifeform: does this really dynamically load crypto from disk at runtime?
00:31	asciilifeform	https://www.openssl.org/docs/crypto/engine.html << moar
00:31	assbot	engine - ENGINE cryptographic module support ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgYLvT )
00:32	decimation	who would ever think that is a good idea?
00:32	asciilifeform	decimation: ahaha, guess who
00:32	decimation	imma gonna load me critical pathways from a random .txt
00:32	asciilifeform	see fellas, when i said, 'hey hey ho ho openssl has got to go'
00:32	asciilifeform	i meant it
00:32	asciilifeform	and what's more, For Reasons
00:33	decimation	the paragraphs starts with "There are several reasons why calling the OpenSSL configuration routines is advisable."
00:33	decimation	and then fails to name a single reason
00:34	mod6	here's my output from no "-l dl" and no "-l z" in the makefile: http://dpaste.com/0YYYWEJ
00:34	assbot	dpaste: 0YYYWEJ ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgYXeM )
00:34	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu wants a provably-correct replacement. can't disagree, but i personally probably won't get around to it until after the war.
00:34	asciilifeform	all you lot, i suggest, learn ada/spark.
00:34	mod6	<+asciilifeform> see fellas, when i said, 'hey hey ho ho openssl has got to go' << I'm with you .
00:34	decimation	mod6: yeah that's the same error
00:34	decimation	at any rate, you can probably cut n paste the parts of openssl you need
00:34	decimation	gonna take longer though
00:34	asciilifeform	decimation: nope
00:34	mod6	at some future point, we'll get the crypto libs built in directtly.
00:34	asciilifeform	try it
00:34	asciilifeform	it's a spittoon
00:35	asciilifeform	!s spittoon
00:35	assbot	16 results for 'spittoon' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=spittoon
00:35	decimation	asciilifeform: for reasons...
00:35	decimation	is there a 'configure' arg you can pass to get rid of the -ldl stupidity
00:36	decimation	yeah
00:36	decimation	no-dso
00:36	mod6	ok if i re-add back in "-l dl" into the makefile, then I get this:
00:36	asciilifeform	worth a try
00:36	mod6	http://dpaste.com/319C632
00:36	assbot	dpaste: 319C632 ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgZ7ml )
00:36	asciilifeform	see, i missed all of this because did not even suspect this level of shitgnomery
00:37	decimation	how did you get yours working asciilifeform?
00:37	mod6	which works, because those are just warnings. it does output a bitcoind in the bitcoin/src dir
00:37	decimation	mod6: try modding the openssl 'configure' stuff to use 'no-dso'
		↖
00:37	asciilifeform	decimation: i don't think i noticed/touched this knob
00:38	asciilifeform	this is why it helps to have >1 of us pay attention
00:38	mod6	here's a full shot: http://dpaste.com/06NAYCD
00:38	assbot	dpaste: 06NAYCD ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgZ8Xl )
00:38	asciilifeform	i suggest fixing by using a pre-heartbleed openssl
00:39	asciilifeform	if anyone has any reason why this is a bad idea, please suggest it
		↖
00:39	mod6	pre-heart bleed? like 0.9.8o or whatever?
00:39	asciilifeform	pre-1.0.1 iirc
00:40	decimation	not that heartbleed really matters for our purposes
00:40	decimation	or have we not snipped the rpc stuff yet
00:40	asciilifeform	it doesn't, if the https-snipper patch was merged.
00:40	mod6	well, it was 0.9.8o that was giving us the issues with the tx in the 168`001 block
00:40	asciilifeform	rpc is still in
00:40	asciilifeform	but i personally ripped out https
00:41	asciilifeform	mod6: did anyone ever fully crack the conundrum ?
00:41	decimation	yeah if you are commanding bitcoind on an untrusted network you are fucktarded
		↖
00:41	mod6	no, not yet. i've been focused on just getting a release out.
00:42	asciilifeform	could find boojum therein, one wholly worth the effort
00:42	mod6	yeah certainly.
00:42	danielpbarron	mod6> danielpbarron: oh you're running this on ARM? this won't build on arm probably. << ahh you called it the "modified pogo script" which gave me the wrong impression.. but I understand what you meant now
00:42	mod6	ahh, my bad. sorry I didn't clairify
00:42	mod6	decimation: so no-dso gets passed to the openssl build?
00:43	decimation	yeah you put it on the Config arg line
00:43	mod6	ok, sweet, i'll give that a try now.
00:44	*	asciilifeform still suspects that: 168001 was a stealthfork
		↖
00:44	mod6	building...
00:44	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64750 @ 0.00035793 = 23.176 BTC [+]
00:45	mod6	asciilifeform: it is certainly /strange/ that this problem occurs right after the last checkpoint in our version.
		↖
00:45	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22400 @ 0.00037275 = 8.3496 BTC [+]
00:50	decimation	ok I have to dynamically link -l m and now it works without -l dl
00:50	decimation	at least, it starts
00:50	mod6	alright gents, i added 'no-dso' to the openssl configure and removed "- dl" from the makefile, and it compiled just fine:
00:50	mod6	http://dpaste.com/1HYJCGS
00:50	assbot	dpaste: 1HYJCGS ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgZMnQ )
00:50	decimation	me too
00:51	mod6	you had to add in
00:51	decimation	except for the dynamic -l m and pthread_nonshared
00:51	mod6	"-l m" ?
00:51	decimation	yep
00:51	decimation	it must be a redhat-ism
00:51	mod6	ah. ok.
00:51	mod6	well, that's good to know i guess in case of RH
00:53	mod6	so i'll re-submit that makefile patch and what will be v0.0.5 of the mod'd pogo script (with 'no-dso')
00:53	asciilifeform	neato
00:53	asciilifeform	builds, but does it run ?
00:53	decimation	ok you have to install glib-static on redhat
00:53	mod6	that bitcoind does run and start pulling blocks btw too
00:53	asciilifeform	aha!
00:54	asciilifeform	so this, then, is the new state of the art.
00:54	decimation	yes, 'strip out all the static libs 'cause it saves space'
00:55	mod6	http://dpaste.com/0RFHH3E
00:55	assbot	dpaste: 0RFHH3E ... ( http://bit.ly/1AgZZHA )
00:56	mod6	i'll do some more sync testing once I get the changes we found tonight resubmitted to the mailing list.
00:56	mod6	this was highly productive tonight; I thank you all who helped!
00:56	decimation	no problem, good night
00:57	mod6	still have a moutain of work ahead, but we're on a good track.
00:57	decimation	ok so the only remaining redhatism is to strip out the 'realpath' thing and add '-l pthread_nonshared to the makefile
00:57	mod6	you too. many thanks.
00:58	mod6	decimation: i think, in interest of time.. perhaps (with your help/testing) we'll post a patch for the makefile & the auto.sh post release.
00:59	mod6	or at least once we have a "freeze"
00:59	mod6	then going forward, we'll add in more conditions into these things to account for various platforms/configurations
01:01	danielpbarron	and removed "- dl" from the makefile << where is this?
01:02	scoopbot	New post on Qntra.net by cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/03/winner-of-27k-bitcoins-purchased-at-usms-auction-revealed/
01:05	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 93794 @ 0.00035276 = 33.0868 BTC [-] {3}
01:09	mod6	danielpbarron: it would have been like line 34
01:09	mod6	i think 33 was "-l w"
01:09	mod6	im getting laaaaaged
01:09	mats	http://www.gamedev.net/topic/666419-what-are-your-opinions-on-dx12vulkanmantle/#entry5215019
01:09	assbot	What are your opinions on DX12/Vulkan/Mantle? - Graphics Programming and Theory - GameDev.net ... ( http://bit.ly/1Ah0IIT )
01:15	asciilifeform	qntra ddos ?
		↖
01:16	asciilifeform	somebody has cache ?
01:17	asciilifeform	also ddoslurkbot is back.
01:18	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 91553 @ 0.00035063 = 32.1012 BTC [-]
01:19	Adlai	since lds has refused to comment, wouldn't a better title be "Winner Of 27K Bitcoins Allegedly Purchased At USMS Auction Alleged" ?
		↖
01:19	Adlai	asciilifeform: works for me just fine
01:20	asciilifeform	loads now aha
01:20	cazalla	it's working fine here
01:23		Bet placed: 1 BTC for No on "BTC to top $700 before 1st July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1128/ Odds: 20(Y):80(N) by coin, 20(Y):80(N) by weight. Total bet: 42.55120426 BTC. Current weight: 96,640.
01:34	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49600 @ 0.0003631 = 18.0098 BTC [+] {2}
01:37	BingoBoingo	!up wangxinxi
01:38	wangxinxi	Thanks BingoBoingo
		~ 19 minutes ~
01:57	mircea_popescu	<mod6> decimation: anyway, it totally works fine for me on my aws machine. << hehehe
01:58	mircea_popescu	!up mollison
01:59	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049677 << wut ?!
01:59	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 03:16:38; danielpbarron: fwiw, I got 50 USD worth of link clicks pointing at this -> http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2015#1042514
02:02	mircea_popescu	mod6: im glad we're all trying this now. << kinda the advantage of doing stuff here.
02:04	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049802 << i fail to be surprised.
02:04	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 04:31:10; asciilifeform: even if you like static builds, openssl slips dynamic code loading up your arse when you're not looking.
02:04	mircea_popescu	also gotta upgrade to latest version
02:04	mircea_popescu	etc.
02:06	mircea_popescu	decimation: the paragraphs starts with "There are several reasons why calling the OpenSSL configuration routines is advisable." and then fails to name a single reason << the actual reasons are not the point, the statement that "there are reasons" is the point. fashion, no substance. you wanna be with the in crowd, don't you ? be hip, upgrade. there are reasons.
02:07	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049846 << iirc heartbled was replacement orifice.
02:07	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 04:39:03; asciilifeform: if anyone has any reason why this is a bad idea, please suggest it
02:07	mircea_popescu	there's no clean openssl post ~2002.
02:08	mircea_popescu	i don't see anyone using 1999 version.
02:08	mircea_popescu	0.9.4 and such bs.
02:10	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049910 << no ?
02:10	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 05:15:44; asciilifeform: qntra ddos ?
02:11	Adlai	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=05-03-2015#1042552 << /methinks the civilians doth play too much vidya
02:11	assbot	Logged on 05-03-2015 04:19:56; decimation: asciilifeform: it's not even clear that having full auto ar-15's would be much of an advantage at all
02:11	mircea_popescu	trilema's been getting a shitton of traffic past week, maybe you got it on a blink.
02:12	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049914 << just about lol.
02:12	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 05:19:15; Adlai: since lds has refused to comment, wouldn't a better title be "Winner Of 27K Bitcoins Allegedly Purchased At USMS Auction Alleged" ?
02:13	Adlai	there are so few situations where it's remotely helpful to have an assault rifle in full auto, afaict the risk of accidentally using full auto in any other situation make it "wasach" but nothing more
02:13	Adlai	"wasach" = army slang, from arabic 'weight' - ie, extra weight which doesn't help you, but you carry it around to look tough
02:14	mircea_popescu	those situations being providing cover
02:14	mircea_popescu	they're not that few, if you're actually fighting. as opposed to what regular armies regularly do.
02:14	fluffypony	http://kukuruku.co/hub/diy/usb-killer
02:14	assbot	USB Killer ... ( http://bit.ly/1C7RXFK )
02:14	fluffypony	want
02:14	Adlai	a bit of training and you can give MUCH better cover with *aimed* selective fire
02:15	mircea_popescu	depends if it's five of you or five hundred of you.
02:15	mircea_popescu	with batallion size deployments rolling auto is much more effectual than "selective" whatever, because people are weird. sorta like how women living together synch periods, soldiers end up all looking in the same spot.
02:16	Adlai	you can drain a 30 round magazine in ~10 seconds and get most of your shots on target, and all of them in the right direction; or drain it in ~3 seconds, overheat your barrel, and kill half your friends
02:16	Adlai	there are situations where "spraying" is exactly what you want, but there are better tools for that than 'assault rifle'
02:16	*	mircea_popescu agrees that in practical terms, the useful full auto is a shrinking space.
02:17	Adlai	on the contrary, there's a lot less picking off enemies hundreds of meters away, and a lot more 'clearing rooms'
02:18	mircea_popescu	it comes to us from a time of emplaced machine guns and stuff
02:18	mircea_popescu	nono, i meant "space".
02:18	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51279 @ 0.00037237 = 19.0948 BTC [+] {2}
02:18	Adlai	in which sense?
02:18	mircea_popescu	lemme rephrase.
02:18	*	mircea_popescu agrees that in practical terms, the useful full auto is rarer and rarer
02:19	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45071 @ 0.00037452 = 16.88 BTC [+] {2}
02:19	Adlai	'situations where full auto is what you want', or 'firearm which usefully implements full auto' ?
02:19	mircea_popescu	first.
02:20	fluffypony	first
02:20	mircea_popescu	well honestly the second too, but unrelatedly.
02:20	*	Adlai maintains that both of these are INcreasing, but neither has anything to do with the AR15 family
02:20	mircea_popescu	hahaha what.
02:20	fluffypony	I don't know enough about firearm development to speak to the second
02:21	mircea_popescu	"but brother, why do you try to rescue cost savings ? you know it;s in its nature to sting you". "yes. but it is in my nature to be stingy."
02:21	Adlai	full auto is very useful in urban "kill everything" warfare. no country likes admitting that's what they're training for, but they train for this too.
02:22	mircea_popescu	nonsense. what are you going to do, spray and pray ?
02:22	Adlai	that's what it's called
02:22	mircea_popescu	the only thing that's useful in urban warfare is hiding.
02:22	mircea_popescu	everything else is a liability.
02:22	Adlai	and artillery/air support, with a few guidance chips
02:23	mircea_popescu	hey, half the us casualties, gotta provide them somehow.
02:24	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47650 @ 0.00037564 = 17.8992 BTC [+] {2}
02:38	mod6	<+mircea_popescu> mod6: im glad we're all trying this now. << kinda the advantage of doing stuff here. << true enough :]
02:42	mod6	night #b-a!
		~ 18 minutes ~
03:00	mircea_popescu	!up tsoulus
03:01	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9400 @ 0.00036986 = 3.4767 BTC [-]
03:05		Bet placed: 15.4 BTC for No on "BTC to top $700 before 1st July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1128/ Odds: 14(Y):86(N) by coin, 15(Y):85(N) by weight. Total bet: 57.95120426 BTC. Current weight: 96,565.
		~ 28 minutes ~
03:33	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58400 @ 0.00037586 = 21.9502 BTC [+]
03:36	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38800 @ 0.00037791 = 14.6629 BTC [+] {2}
03:38	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 19572 @ 0.00036986 = 7.2389 BTC [-]
03:43	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 27759 @ 0.00036986 = 10.2669 BTC [-]
03:55	cazalla	i guess i was wrong about danielpbarron being mircea_popescu because apparently asciilifeform is mircea_popescu http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2yrkh4/winner_of_27k_bitcoins_purchased_at_usms_auction/cpccmq0
03:55	assbot	usrn comments on Winner Of 27K Bitcoins Purchased At USMS Auction Revealed ... ( http://bit.ly/1MvazCt )
03:55	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 31487 @ 0.00037914 = 11.938 BTC [+] {2}
03:56	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 131113 @ 0.00038367 = 50.3041 BTC [+] {3}
		~ 38 minutes ~
04:35	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29850 @ 0.00036986 = 11.0403 BTC [-]
04:38	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 57850 @ 0.0003733 = 21.5954 BTC [+]
04:51	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7812 @ 0.0003733 = 2.9162 BTC [+]
04:58	fluffypony	cazalla: the comment about the incorrect use of "allegedly" is right, though
04:58	fluffypony	as a reporter you don't want to claim something as fact when it isn't, but the USMS holding 3 auctions is accepted enough that it doesn't have to be "alleged" :-P
		↖
05:00	Adlai	the allegation here is that the auctions were theater
05:04	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 87932 @ 0.00038774 = 34.0948 BTC [+] {2}
05:06	fluffypony	doesn't matter, the term is still used incorrectly
05:07	fluffypony	"apparently" would be a more appropriate term
05:13		Bet placed: 1.0006 BTC for Yes on "BTC to top $700 before 1st July" http://bitbet.us/bet/1128/ Odds: 16(Y):84(N) by coin, 16(Y):84(N) by weight. Total bet: 58.95180426 BTC. Current weight: 96,470.
05:15	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7678 @ 0.00039483 = 3.0315 BTC [+]
05:18	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 24905 @ 0.00039483 = 9.8332 BTC [+]
		~ 15 minutes ~
05:33	ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-03-2015#1048149 << what is the lisp concept and how is hickey crapping on it?
05:33	assbot	Logged on 11-03-2015 01:56:57; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: i still fucking hate that piece. the sheer mendacity of rich hickey in saying 'simplicity matters' while crapping all over lisp concept
05:39	Adlai	ben_vulpes: for one, read macros
05:40	Adlai	eg http://www.loper-os.org/?p=103
05:40	assbot	Loper OS » Nock Nock (Part 1) ... ( http://bit.ly/1D97SVF )
05:41	ben_vulpes	i've yet to get to read macros in my studies
05:55	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53200 @ 0.00039787 = 21.1667 BTC [+] {3}
05:56	ben_vulpes	re: 'mit' - feeder college for northrup grumman and loyal derpy armsmiths
05:58	Adlai	please don't go full cultard
05:59	Adlai	that's kinda like saying #b-a is feeder college for altcoin creators
06:02	fluffypony	lol
06:08	ben_vulpes	wink
06:08	ben_vulpes	nudge
06:08	ben_vulpes	elbow in ribs
06:08	ben_vulpes	sour grapes re youth wasted on the young
06:08	ben_vulpes	some mixture of all the above
06:10	ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049633 << oh just extreme naivte in thinking things like the bail on exit flag would be set the same way on other platforms
06:10	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 02:58:53; mod6: ben addded those, not exactly sure what they do. lol.
06:10	ben_vulpes	bail on *error*
06:10	ben_vulpes	wtshit linux
06:12	ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=11-03-2015#1049268 << cardano-like thinger over serial someday, one hopes
06:12	assbot	Logged on 11-03-2015 21:30:54; trinque: I'm thinking programmable light switch with ethernet port
06:12	davout	http://i.imgur.com/vCifNrr.jpg
06:12	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1wZaVhi )
06:13	trinque	ben_vulpes: sleep? never heard of it
06:13	ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049682 << hah i ran into this as well, thought it was due to mounting the working dir in from the host machine
06:13	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 03:17:11; decimation: you need to add --lock-never to make it work, because I am using a shitty vm-mounted filesystem that doesn't support hardlinks
06:14	ben_vulpes	trinque: you know it
06:14	ben_vulpes	thick ass logs today
06:15	ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049735 << pastebin *specifically*. i've seen this again and again, eventually diddled something in my environment to keep it from happening.
06:15	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 03:39:21; mod6: i don't even own or use a M$ machine, so it has to be the paste sites.
06:17	ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049802 << this is amazing
06:17	assbot	AMAZING COMPANY!
06:17	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 04:31:10; asciilifeform: even if you like static builds, openssl slips dynamic code loading up your arse when you're not looking.
06:18	ben_vulpes	jesus shit
06:19	ben_vulpes	so basically pwn the vm layer, pwn txn validation possibly?
06:20	ben_vulpes	knowing c it's probably just like hell breaks loose in the operating system
06:20	ben_vulpes	that filesystem code does whatever it wants to your balance, coins etc.
		↖
06:20	ben_vulpes	surely that's a paranoid jump too far.
06:21	*	ben_vulpes knows nothing about external libs and safety in c
06:22	Adlai	if you're going that far, a better approach would be inserting something that reports wallet.dat+password to a remote server, which waits until there's something worth stealing. one day, "all the bitcoins are gone"
06:23	ben_vulpes	bleeee
06:24	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63805 @ 0.00040007 = 25.5265 BTC [+] {2}
06:24	ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049856 << another reason why 0.5.3 needs getblock functionality. i can't trust anything out there, and the best way to handle bitcoins safely is to be able to canvass a mess of bitcoinds and make some decisions about how to squirt txns into the network
06:24	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 04:41:19; decimation: yeah if you are commanding bitcoind on an untrusted network you are fucktarded
06:25	ben_vulpes	i kind of have to assume that any hardware i touch these days is wholly compromised
06:25	Adlai	fwiw, sending a relay node your transactions is no guarantee that a miner will see them
06:25	ben_vulpes	myeah
06:25	ben_vulpes	i'd actually like to see relay rules opened up
06:26	ben_vulpes	but i suppose that's what gossipd's for
06:26	Adlai	bitcoin-over-gossipd is rather useless without miners in the wot
06:28	ben_vulpes	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049865 << see the impossible coincidence of http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049868 .
06:28	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 04:44:18; *: asciilifeform still suspects that: 168001 was a stealthfork
06:28	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 04:45:02; mod6: asciilifeform: it is certainly /strange/ that this problem occurs right after the last checkpoint in our version.
06:31	ben_vulpes	Adlai: more along the lines of piggybacking messages on the btc txn relay network.
06:32	ben_vulpes	anyways, sleep doth conquer
		~ 56 minutes ~
07:29	gabriel_laddel	ben_vulpes: "what is the lisp concept and how is hickey crapping on it?" << the lisp concept is: "a crystalline pyramid of comprehensible mutually-interlocking concepts", see Thumbs Down for Clojure http://www.loper-os.org/?p=42 The parens (i.e., syntactical correspondence with ast) so far as I can tell are inescapable, but incidental. They are simply the most obvious product of the philosophy "sophistication blosso
07:29	assbot	Loper OS » Thumbs Down for Clojure ... ( http://bit.ly/1AojvBc )
07:29	gabriel_laddel	ms from comprehensibility".
07:35	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51977 @ 0.00039727 = 20.6489 BTC [-]
07:41	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56109 @ 0.00039239 = 22.0166 BTC [-] {2}
07:42	gabriel_laddel	!gettrust trinque
07:42	assbot	Trust relationship from user gabriel_laddel to user trinque: Level 1: 0, Level 2: 0 via 0 connections. | http://w.b-a.link/trust/gabriel_laddel/trinque | http://w.b-a.link/user/trinque
07:50	gabriel_laddel	trinque: regarding "linux sucks but could be better" see the thread here http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=01-03-2015#1036490
07:50	assbot	Logged on 01-03-2015 00:35:29; gabriel_laddel: Eh, perhaps I'm strange, but these things don't tickle me in the right places. Mountains of coke? Fun, surely, but it gets boring after a while...
07:51	gabriel_laddel	trinque: also, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=26-01-2015#992409
07:51	assbot	Logged on 26-01-2015 03:00:06; gabriel_laddel: I've actually done very little development for this dirtro. Most of my time has been spent finding perfect little individual peices and assembling them. Out of the box it has:
07:52	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 108800 @ 0.00039012 = 42.4451 BTC [-] {4}
07:54	gabriel_laddel	trinque: it seems to me that arguing with e.g., ascii as to if you can make linux less terrible is by and large useless sans the loot (useful technical tidbits) he drops occasionally. If you'd like to work on such a thing I can set you on the only sane path that I'm aware of, with justification as to why you'd do this instead of else.
07:58	Adlai	gabriel_laddel: what's the 'status' of your project?
07:59	gabriel_laddel	Adlai: currently pestering bezzle lords to pay my bills so I can finish it off
		↖
08:00	gabriel_laddel	right now I'm writing up a thing so that anyone can finish it off, in case I run into alphabet soup or w/e
08:00	Adlai	so not quite as bad as http://log.bitcoin-assets.com//?date=10-03-2015#1047620
08:00	assbot	Logged on 10-03-2015 13:50:02; asciilifeform: adlai: shelved
08:02	gabriel_laddel	Adlai: Ascii wants to fix everything all at once. I understand his position but don't see how to accomplish it.
08:02	Adlai	no, he wants to fix everything from the bottom up
08:02	gabriel_laddel	Adlai: that is correct, my mistake.
08:02	Adlai	this is a workable approach, it just has higher capex demands (as opposed to 'all at once')
08:03	gabriel_laddel	Adlai: In any case, Emacs works just fine and is sufficently lispy without dropping the Von N. arch.
08:03	gabriel_laddel	and there is money to be made by exploiting the comprehensibility advantage
08:03	Adlai	sure, one of my big struggles lately is pushing myself to read slime source in the hope of contributing patches, rather than bemoaning that the bugs lurk in elisp and leaving it at that
		↖
08:04	*	Adlai is rapidly becoming the archetypical smug[common]lispweenie
08:04	gabriel_laddel	:)
08:05	gabriel_laddel	I fucking hate elisp, and happily cut much of it out of Masamune.
08:05	gabriel_laddel	I currently edit english text in Climacs sometimes
08:05	Adlai	ah, it supports clim!
08:05	gabriel_laddel	Perhaps I'll have the chance to clean up the CL interface at some point.
08:06	gabriel_laddel	ah, it supports clim! << yep
08:06	gabriel_laddel	!s screenshots
08:06	assbot	35 results for 'screenshots' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=screenshots
08:06	gabriel_laddel	Adlai: some clim stuff
08:06	gabriel_laddel	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=26-01-2015#992348
08:06	assbot	Logged on 26-01-2015 02:28:29; gabriel_laddel: http://i.imgur.com/YDS7DZR.png http://i.imgur.com/er5HT6O.png http://i.imgur.com/nsvxhzs.png http://i.imgur.com/Ius6a3h.png
08:07	gabriel_laddel	And I'm off for nicotine and a walk. Toodles.
08:07	Adlai	o/
		↖
08:08	Adlai	"Killed buffer" << even the lispiest abstractions leak
08:13	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 44650 @ 0.00040205 = 17.9515 BTC [+]
08:22	*	Adlai desperately hopes that '21' are trying to commoditize asic mining, rather than just another mining ktulu
		↖ ↖
08:28	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 77300 @ 0.00037616 = 29.0772 BTC [-] {2}
08:29	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 35122 @ 0.00039583 = 13.9023 BTC [+] {2}
08:30	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 48278 @ 0.0004024 = 19.4271 BTC [+]
		~ 17 minutes ~
08:47	danielpbarron	height=271804 vs height=206911
08:48	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 79900 @ 0.00037102 = 29.6445 BTC [-]
08:55	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 6726 @ 0.00037102 = 2.4955 BTC [-]
08:57	Adlai	!s height=
08:57	assbot	199 results for 'height=' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=height%3D
08:59	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 69300 @ 0.00037762 = 26.1691 BTC [+]
		~ 15 minutes ~
09:15	davout	very skill, much wow
09:15	davout	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKtfjB3F_c0
09:15	assbot	Trust me I'm Mechanic Engineer. - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1L1AiFs )
09:15	Adlai	trust me, i speak asslish
09:17	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29620 @ 0.00039614 = 11.7337 BTC [+]
09:17	jurov	these openssl shenanigans...anyone tried libressl if it, say, needs -ldl?
		↖
09:24	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30550 @ 0.00039614 = 12.1021 BTC [+]
09:32	assbot	[HAVELOCK] [RENT] 99 @ 0.014 = 1.386 BTC [-]
09:35	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 242409 @ 0.00036706 = 88.9786 BTC [-] {7}
		~ 37 minutes ~
10:12	danielpbarron	re: "50 USD worth of link clicks" : this is where I got the number from, and it's up to 100 USD worth now -> https://i.imgur.com/4Ylwt2s.png
10:12	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1xgx70R )
10:13	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23300 @ 0.00039904 = 9.2976 BTC [+]
10:14	danielpbarron	on a related note, I learned how to get my print screen key working on gentoo for this
10:19	Adlai	the hardcore version of "created an account just to upvote this"
10:28	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 45000 @ 0.00040102 = 18.0459 BTC [+] {3}
10:30	thestringpuller	asciilifeform: i'm rather surprised it took them so long to hook up the goldpricedumpatron to btc << You once said, "USG is still trying to find way to put lead into bitcoin bars."
10:43	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15000 @ 0.00039334 = 5.9001 BTC [-]
10:53	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34000 @ 0.00039442 = 13.4103 BTC [+] {2}
10:54	assbot	[HAVELOCK] [B.MINE] 302 @ 0.0041 = 1.2382 BTC [-] {3}
		~ 28 minutes ~
11:23	fluffypony	http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2yrkh4/winner_of_27k_bitcoins_purchased_at_usms_auction/cpclco3?context=5
11:23	assbot	fluffyponyza comments on Winner Of 27K Bitcoins Purchased At USMS Auction Revealed ... ( http://bit.ly/1C92ksE )
11:23	fluffypony	apparently I'm financially involved with Qntra
11:23	fluffypony	who knew
11:23	PeterL	do you own any shares?
11:24	fluffypony	nope
11:25	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63750 @ 0.00038078 = 24.2747 BTC [-]
11:28	danielpbarron	"how dare they get paid to write when I have to pay reddit!!1"
		↖
11:28	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4797 @ 0.00038078 = 1.8266 BTC [-]
11:28	PeterL	why would anybody pay to use reddit?
11:29	danielpbarron	to get "Achievement Unlocked: I'm redditarded" on their profile
11:29	jurov	for reddit bezzlegold
11:29	danielpbarron	(unless you balance it out with 9x non-promotional material) << there is a ratio specified in the rules?? reddit is like USG training camp
11:31	PeterL	so you need to do 9 unpaid spams for each spam you are paid to produce? More spam is better spam!
11:33	fluffypony	danielpbarron: yes, there's a 10% rule
11:33	fluffypony	http://www.reddit.com/wiki/selfpromotion
11:33	assbot	selfpromotion - reddit.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1C9485c )
11:33	fluffypony	http://www.reddit.com/wiki/faq#wiki_what_constitutes_spam.3F
11:33	assbot	faq - reddit.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1C94jgF )
11:33	fluffypony	"If over 10% of your submissions and conversation are your own site/content/affiliate links, you're almost certainly a spammer."
11:34	fluffypony	and not spamming is one of the 5 rules Reddit actually has: http://www.reddit.com/rules/
11:34	assbot	reddit.com: rules of reddit ... ( http://bit.ly/1C94tVs )
11:34	fluffypony	the rest are just recommendations (eg. reddiquette) or sub-reddit specific rules that anyone can make
11:36	danielpbarron	i remember many years ago not liking reddit based soley on this one really annoying kid being way too enthusiastic about it. He went on and on about how some anime trailor was "totally a troll" as he hammered away on his keyboard.
11:38	chetty	all these years and still people feed the trolls
11:38	PeterL	http://xkcd.com/1385/ << reddit fits too
11:38	assbot	xkcd: Throwing Rocks ... ( http://bit.ly/1C94YPk )
11:38	danielpbarron	"Don't post personal information." << WTF!? it is required to be anonymous on reddit or what?
11:38	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 4135 @ 0.00038078 = 1.5745 BTC [-]
11:39	PeterL	anonominity helps the derps feel better about not mattering, since nobody else can matter either
		↖
11:39	mats	rip pratchett
11:41	PeterL	I've been reading through his books lately, quite funny stuff in there
11:42	PeterL	A while ago I got the entire discworld series as ebooks for like 0.005 btc, back when a btc was about 10 bucks
11:45	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37350 @ 0.0004024 = 15.0296 BTC [+]
11:46	fluffypony	danielpbarron: they mean don't post someone else's personal information
11:46	fluffypony	unless it is commonly public, eg. domain whois details
11:46	fluffypony	the problem is that Reddit tends to breed "investigators" that post about what they've "discovered", when meantime it's pure conjecture
11:54	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 89450 @ 0.00040268 = 36.0197 BTC [+] {2}
11:59	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 40515 @ 0.00039552 = 16.0245 BTC [-]
12:10	PeterL	you know what is annoying? online articles which are split into pages. It is a webpage, I should be able to keep scrolling down, instead of increasing the "click numbers" for advertising!
12:10	PeterL	(another reason why qntra is better than so many other news sites)
12:11	*	danielpbarron shelves his "10 weird tricks to increase your MPEx portfolio" article..
12:12	PeterL	would be fine as an article if the whole things is all on one page! grumble grumble
12:20	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 49709 @ 0.00038135 = 18.9565 BTC [-]
12:27	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47900 @ 0.00037497 = 17.9611 BTC [-]
12:31	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 7550 @ 0.00038135 = 2.8792 BTC [+]
12:36	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9500 @ 0.00037497 = 3.5622 BTC [-]
12:43	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 25110 @ 0.00034888 = 8.7604 BTC [-]
12:44	thestringpuller	danielpbarron: I'm totally doing an onion spoof with it
12:45	mats	http://chargen.matasano.com/chargen/2015/1/6/bypassing-openssl-certificate-pinning-in-ios-apps.html
12:45	assbot	Bypassing OpenSSL Certificate Pinning in iOS Apps - Blog - Matasano Security ... ( http://bit.ly/18DVOhr )
12:45	asciilifeform	mats: old nyooz
12:45	mats	:(
12:47	mats	http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/03/12/nsas_on_drugs_infosec_bods_unveil_space_grade_malware kek
12:47	assbot	Kaspersky claims to have found NSA's 'space station malware' • The Register ... ( http://bit.ly/18DWdAB )
12:47	mats	(nothing new here, just amusing)
12:48	asciilifeform	more re: disk fw diddler ?
12:49	mod6	jurov: can you see if a message got snarffed from the btc-dev list, i sent one in with the subject "Static Makefile Patch v0.0.2"
12:49	mod6	had 2 attachments, a .patch file and a .sig file
12:49	mats	related to framework that enables diddling
12:49	mod6	all sigs verify.
12:50	mats	http://www.scribd.com/doc/258494173/FCC-15-24A1
12:50	assbot	FCC-15-24A1 ... ( http://bit.ly/1Bw7caN )
12:50	asciilifeform	mats: i for one am still puzzled by kaspersky's use of the idiot euphemism 'equationgroup'
12:51	mats	its all about the clicks, man
12:51	asciilifeform	mats: when the actual authorship is plain as daylight
12:51	mats	math, computers, fingerless gloves, all the tropes are there
12:53	asciilifeform	mats or anybody else: if you have the disk diddler sample, post it
12:53	asciilifeform	crapware artists around the world will appreciate the ready-baked fw diddlamatic library, as will winblows users!
12:56	asciilifeform	https://securelist.com/files/2015/02/Equation_group_questions_and_answers.pdf << pp. 32,33 have hashes.
		↖
12:56	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/18DYCes )
13:04	scoopbot	New post on Trilema by Mircea Popescu: http://trilema.com/2015/argentina-for-business/
13:10	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: 'Why would a property in a peso land be worth dollars ? Oh, because the peso is shit, they readily explain to you. Well, if the peso is shit, why do you imagine your real estate is worth anything at all ? ' << because if it were 10 usd, a beggar from calcutta would buy it and live in it; if it were 10K usd, i'd buy it; if it were 100K usd, american speculator corps. would buy it. so it has to be 150K.
		↖
13:11	asciilifeform	m4rk3tz
13:12	assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 399 @ 0.01318937 = 5.2626 BTC [+] {4}
13:15	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 93650 @ 0.00035843 = 33.567 BTC [-] {3}
13:15	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: 'unlike anywhere in the civilised world, the Argentines rent unfurnished.' << wai wat?! most rental pads where i live are unfurnished - just the way i like it (wtf to do with the incl. furniture if you have your own?)
		↖
13:18	danielpbarron	!up shesek
13:18	danielpbarron	!up stunna
13:18	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: 'Well... truth is a lot more complicated than that - in many places, in most places really national sovereignity is implemented as "being incredibly stupid in our own special way", which is of course neither "their own" in any sense nor to any degree special. This has to be broken down...' << aha colonization.
13:19	*	Adlai wonders how http://trilema.com/2015/argentina-for-business/#footnote_1_60514 fits with https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzQuuoKXVq0
		↖
13:19	assbot	Argentina for business pe Trilema - Un blog de Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/18E2Cf6 )
13:19	assbot	EUROPA & ITALIA - Europe vs Italy - Bruno Bozzetto (Official) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/18E2Cvq )
13:19	asciilifeform	thing is, colonizing power is not necessarily a civilizing one. how'd ya like ru colonial period in ro?
		↖
13:19	Adlai	on that scale, israel = 'italia baribua' (squared)
13:28	mod6	jurov: i don't think the mailing list is working. it has snarffed 2 different messages from me so far today. i know the sigs are good on each & attachments.
13:29	mod6	;;later tell jurov btc-dev mailing list is snarffing messages again
13:29	gribble	The operation succeeded.
		~ 22 minutes ~
13:51	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 81355 @ 0.00034863 = 28.3628 BTC [-] {4}
		~ 56 minutes ~
14:47	BingoBoingo	;;later tell fluffypony You could have also pointed out that there's 496 total posts on qntra compared to the small portion of those on Reddit
14:47	gribble	The operation succeeded.
14:48	asciilifeform	So, phun phakt time
14:48	asciilifeform	on 2/18 i ordered some boards made at 'macrofab'
14:48	asciilifeform	they were mailed out, according to the latter, on 3/10
14:49	asciilifeform	today u.s. post office tracker reads 'delivered, 10:35am', 'Waiver of signature was exercised at time of delivery.'
14:50	asciilifeform	funny thing is, i have cameras. and they show that no one crossed perimeter until postman around 1400 hrs (with only junk mail.)
14:50	asciilifeform	and i did not authorize the 'no signature' crap.
14:50	BingoBoingo	Sounds very phun
14:51	danielpbarron	sounds like the kind of story you tell kids around a camp fire while pointing a flashlight at your face
14:51	asciilifeform	no idea if anyone gives a fuck, but it is quite reminiscent of mircea_popescu's experience when i happened to mail him something last year.
14:52	trinque	asciilifeform: well established that mail gets rerouted to diddle-factories
14:52	asciilifeform	i think this one went to /dev/null
		↖
14:54	danielpbarron	helps to get to know your local postman
14:55	cazalla	they don't even knock on your door here, they just stick a "we missed you" notice in the letter box and force you to pick it up from the local post office yourself.. god forbid the postman knock at your door and wait for you to answer
14:55	chetty	hmm isnt there a coffee shop around there you can check for it?
14:55	asciilifeform	cazalla: this wasn't a 'missed delivery' thing
14:56	asciilifeform	those get a door sticker, yes, and appropriate text in the www tracking gizmo
14:56	*	Adlai had to pick up his reserve summons - A PIECE OF PAPER - at the post office
14:57	Adlai	package slip in the mailbox was identical to the kind indicating eg miner
14:57	trinque	I highly suspect they tag people to fuck with
14:57	trinque	not that I'm interesting enough to have had this happen
14:57	*	Adlai got asked to turn on and log in his laptop at CDG while just transferring through, had to explain stumpwm
14:58	trinque	Adlai: heh! terrorist
14:58	trinque	looks like hacker stuff to me
14:58	asciilifeform	Adlai: i still don't get this notion where t3rr0s1stz -somehow must- replace -all- of the cells in the battery with plastique, instead of only half
		↖
14:59	Adlai	it's the ponytail. flew through in september with a hobo mop, no comment. look like a dealer or hacker? step aside please.
15:01	asciilifeform	funny thing is, i won't be surprised if it does show up some time tomorrow
15:01	asciilifeform	seen this before.
15:01	asciilifeform	postman hits 'delivered' on his turdpad while it's still in the truck
15:01	asciilifeform	(why? no one knows)
15:02	trinque	non-govt mail tends to be much better
15:02	asciilifeform	trinque: vendor did not offer options for shipment
15:02	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform why do you mean no one knows lol. they gotta make the targets.
15:02	asciilifeform	^ probably this
15:02	mircea_popescu	cazalla "usrn -1 points 10 hours ago Doesn't make any difference." << lawl.
15:03	mircea_popescu	"mp is bad mmkay!11" "you know the only reason you eat is his tolerant magnanimity" "doesn't make a diference".
15:05	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1049998 << accepted by reddit does not make it accepted.
15:05	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 08:58:59; fluffypony: as a reporter you don't want to claim something as fact when it isn't, but the USMS holding 3 auctions is accepted enough that it doesn't have to be "alleged" :-P
15:05	mircea_popescu	that the usms claims to have held auctions is undisputed. that it in fact did not is also plainly factual.
15:06	mircea_popescu	and this is why "apparently" is not more appropriate. the locus of power is b-a, not usg. when we say something here, fact or no fact, it becomes "apparently", like it or not like it.
15:06	mircea_popescu	when usg says something, it becomes allegedly, and until and unless it receives our imprimatur, it STAYS allegedly.
15:07	mircea_popescu	and thus, bush allegedly won the 2nd electoral term.
15:07	asciilifeform	is 'auction' where shill guaranteed to win still called 'auction' ?
15:07	asciilifeform	or something else.
15:07	mircea_popescu	well... allegedly.
15:08	mircea_popescu	it's a tardstalk auction, basically.
15:08	mircea_popescu	who was that guy kakobrekla really liked, cognitive-something. kept making these and then posing into the forum's ethics board.
15:08	mircea_popescu	!up Aquent
15:09	asciilifeform	to the extent something takes place on a known muppet theatre stage, it is not even all that important to go into the supposed 'motivations' of the muppets, when you can plainly see the arms growing out of their arses
15:10	Aquent	did you buy 27k btc from the marshals mircea_popescu ?
15:10	chetty	lmao
15:10	mircea_popescu	i didn't make a statement on that.
15:10	Aquent	yey or ney
15:10	asciilifeform	Aquent: around here we buy only direct from hitler
15:11	mircea_popescu	ahaha that ben_vulpes / adlai cultard thing. i'm bashing it.
15:11	Aquent	ppl are saying you did
15:11	Aquent	so you want to deny it?
15:11	mircea_popescu	we should prolly hold a call vote see how mit is regarded, i thought it unanimously despised.
15:11	mircea_popescu	Aquent i don't want to anything dood. you want to, an' so far it's not going too well.
15:11	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: i'm enthusiastically in favour of either bulldozing or turning into leprosorium
15:11	asciilifeform	(mit)
15:11	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform ironically, 50 years ago it was tip top
15:12	asciilifeform	as recently as 30!
15:12	mircea_popescu	arguably yes.
15:12	chetty	whoa, what 'ppl are saying?'
15:12	Aquent	well how did you come up with this name
15:12	Aquent	this guy - what was the name again
15:12	mircea_popescu	with what name ?
15:12	Aquent	like no evidence no connection just some name
15:12	mircea_popescu	you talking bout cazalla's article on qntra ?
15:13	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 220450 @ 0.00033231 = 73.2577 BTC [-] {4}
15:13	Aquent	yes
15:13	mircea_popescu	well you better ask him then neh ?
15:13	Aquent	Larry Dean Silvey
15:14	trinque	the article itself gives its evidence
15:14	Aquent	does it?
15:14	cazalla	Aquent, not everything that pointed to him is included in the article
15:15	Aquent	not anything that points to him is included
15:15	trinque	the bit about the tweeted address is there
15:15	mircea_popescu	the beauty of the internets, srsly. who the hell ever called up w r hearst to inquire about whatever points of minutia in some goddard article.
15:15	mircea_popescu	we've clearly progressed.
15:15	Aquent	lol
15:16	Aquent	beauty of journalism innit
15:16	Aquent	to do that research for me to easily read it
15:16	Aquent	not do my own
15:16	mircea_popescu	has little to do with journalism an' everything to do with... wel, irc, basically, and the very republican roots of la serenissima.
15:17	Aquent	mircea_popescu if you did win the auction how much would have you paid per btc?
15:17	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050043 << this is technically possible and not a negligible avenue of attack.
15:17	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 10:20:24; ben_vulpes: that filesystem code does whatever it wants to your balance, coins etc.
15:17	mircea_popescu	i can readily see in the future "special" hard drives being made.
15:18	mircea_popescu	Aquent i didn't make a statement about that, either.
15:18	asciilifeform	re: post office idiocy: i fully expect that before the era of usg is over, 'serenissima' cargo will routinely travel with real-time ir camera (and 'glonass') feed from inside the box.
15:18	mircea_popescu	in other news, http://i.imgur.com/SZFFlf1.jpg
15:18	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1BwJFXl )
15:18	Aquent	I didn't say you did
15:18	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: 'special' hard drives made presently.
15:18	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform so you open it by the stove.
15:19	asciilifeform	neh i meant - belonging to sender or receiver
15:19	mircea_popescu	oh
15:19	asciilifeform	a precious and carefully-sewn item
15:19	asciilifeform	sent back, forth...
15:19	asciilifeform	between phriends
15:20	asciilifeform	if real-time satellite is costly and unreliable, a 'poor man's' version will contain two rsa keys. one will sign every frame and globe coordinate tuple -until package is opened-, the other - after
15:21	asciilifeform	with the usual caveats re: sensor cat-mouse games
15:21	mircea_popescu	i don't imagine that anyone cares this much.
15:21	asciilifeform	depends what is moving, no?
15:21	mircea_popescu	cheaper to use sluts curriers only.
15:21	mircea_popescu	currently it's about half girls anyway
15:21	asciilifeform	and who said inapplicable for living courier
15:21	asciilifeform	iirc diplomatic mail already works quite like this.
15:22	asciilifeform	with addition of manual pull ring for courier in case he is being poked
15:22	asciilifeform	(thermite)
15:22	mircea_popescu	something like that.
15:22	asciilifeform	an absolutely-perfect $maxint gadget is not necessary to utterly deter idiots from fucking with mail
15:23	asciilifeform	because their faced will be on 'youtube' etc. in real time.
15:23	asciilifeform	*faces
15:23	asciilifeform	and coordinates
15:23	mircea_popescu	mail is not opened by hand
15:23	asciilifeform	depends which set of idiots
15:24	asciilifeform	when -from- 'respectable' folks like cisco - yes, by hand, stable of monkeys (its exact location was in #b-a not long ago)
15:24	mircea_popescu	also true.
15:24	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050076 << haha
15:24	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 11:59:26; gabriel_laddel: Adlai: currently pestering bezzle lords to pay my bills so I can finish it off
15:26	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050086 << well, fwiw it's a worthy thing to do.
15:26	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 12:03:56; Adlai: sure, one of my big struggles lately is pushing myself to read slime source in the hope of contributing patches, rather than bemoaning that the bugs lurk in elisp and leaving it at that
15:27	asciilifeform	Adlai: it is quite a feat to bring oneself to program in elisp after working with proper common lisp. don't know how you manage it. (iron will?)
15:27	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050103 << don't be ridiculous. for one thing, commodizing asic mining is a larger task than commodizing cpu arch. for the other, they're a fucking sv corp, they're not going to DO ANYTHING. just sit around and talk about shit. preferably at "conferences", or else "liveblog" it.
		↖
15:27	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 12:22:05; *: Adlai desperately hopes that '21' are trying to commoditize asic mining, rather than just another mining ktulu
15:28	asciilifeform	'commoditize' is a very, very odd thing for anyone to wish to do to mining.
15:28	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050118 << tyhe problem is that baked in bitcoin dependencies can not be replaced.
15:28	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 13:17:45; jurov: these openssl shenanigans...anyone tried libressl if it, say, needs -ldl?
15:28	mircea_popescu	EVEN IF "it works now"
15:29	*	Adlai has babbled about such concepts to vc-types while orbiting those circles (at a safe distance), there's always the faint glimmer of hope that a good meme takes root
15:29	mircea_popescu	the only solution is to pull in the relevant code and encase it in acrylate.
		↖
15:29	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 132400 @ 0.0003337 = 44.1819 BTC [+] {2}
15:29	mircea_popescu	which is roughly what the power rangers figured out eventually too.
15:29	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: read openssl. it's a spittoon.
15:29	mircea_popescu	Adlai that faint glimmer reflects principally your tender years.
15:29	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: and, no, they didn't. they rewrote haphazardly and went 'so it works, stfu'
15:29	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform no practical considerations will interfere with my strategic management!!1
15:30	asciilifeform	l0lziez
15:30	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform i don't mean in the past. i mean for the future. they're trying to make a "special file".
15:30	mircea_popescu	put all the braindamage in there.
15:30	Adlai	1st ¶ http://www.winstonchurchill.org/resources/quotations/quotes-falsely-attributed
15:30	assbot	Quotes Falsely Attributed ... ( http://bit.ly/1BwPdRr )
15:31	mircea_popescu	heh
15:34	mircea_popescu	danielpbarron 66 shitty twitter clicks are worth 50 bucks in the lalaland whjere twitter is a public company and so on and so forth.
15:34	mircea_popescu	otherwise, they're a coupla hundred bucks to the million.
15:36	mircea_popescu	fluffypony that's some kickass research on reddit submissions ? do you like do this professionally or something ?
15:37	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050139 << lawl.
15:37	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 15:28:00; danielpbarron: "how dare they get paid to write when I have to pay reddit!!1"
15:38	asciilifeform	update on 'macrofab' - vendor apologized, insists that they did not authorize 'no signature', offers to do another run (schedule unspecified) gratis
15:38	asciilifeform	if thing doesn't show up by end of wk
15:38	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050161 << the chemist got it.
15:38	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 15:39:19; PeterL: anonominity helps the derps feel better about not mattering, since nobody else can matter either
15:38	mircea_popescu	animality, anonimity, what the hell's the difference.
15:39	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform so vendor knows they never shipped.
15:39	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: i wrote in a 'wtf'
15:39	asciilifeform	shortly before sharing the tale
15:39	mircea_popescu	seems this process would have sunk them by now, but hey.
15:39	asciilifeform	'macrofab' opened ~1 mo. ago
15:40	asciilifeform	and is, afaik, presently the only outfit of its kind
15:40	asciilifeform	(who knows how long will last, or even if works. i was going to learn something by opening that crate...)
15:40	mircea_popescu	aite, i take it back, we see.
15:41	asciilifeform	it'd still have a 'too good to be true' flavour were it at 10x the quoted price - so i'm not expecting much
15:42	Adlai	even if you think both of those are tentacles of the same octopusg, they do have independent nervous systems
15:42	asciilifeform	Adlai: the tentacles, where i stand, flail wildly and without purpose
15:42	asciilifeform	Adlai: i know this because of being still alive
15:42	Adlai	sure
15:42	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050204 << just to blow your mind : you are speaking to a man who has bought that sort of thing (apartment, 3 rooms, 75 sqm) for 350 dollars.
15:42	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 17:10:37; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'Why would a property in a peso land be worth dollars ? Oh, because the peso is shit, they readily explain to you. Well, if the peso is shit, why do you imagine your real estate is worth anything at all ? ' << because if it were 10 usd, a beggar from calcutta would buy it and live in it; if it were 10K usd, i'd buy it; if it were 100K usd, american speculator corps. would buy it. so it
15:43	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: betcha you had to spend more than 350 to turn into the sort of fella who might open the door behind which it costs 350.
15:43	asciilifeform	'linux is free if...' etc
15:43	Adlai	both hands thinking they're the right one is functionally equivalent to 'all thumbs'
15:43	mircea_popescu	Adlai you know, you should probably write an exhaustive discussion of the cult an' publish it on yoru blog, rather than bottle it up and end up pankkake'd.
15:43	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform nope.
15:43	*	Adlai has a blog?
15:43	mircea_popescu	make one.
15:44	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: ok i'll bite. where do i buy one.
15:44	mircea_popescu	gorj, romania's lignite mining county, finally had govt subsidies cut after 5 years of the mines n olonger being economically workable.
15:44	asciilifeform	and i think i'd like a 'boeing' too, for 250.
15:44	mircea_popescu	prices collapsed, an apt could be had for a working color tv.\
15:44	mircea_popescu	because everyone wanted to just fucking leave.
15:44	mircea_popescu	it came back to sense within a decade.
15:45	mircea_popescu	this was an earlier time in romania : foreigners weren't allowed to own property, like in fucking burma, and locals were the sort of retards the soviet collapse left behind,
15:45	asciilifeform	as i understand it costs more than that to have your title not magicked away by the 'big boy' privatizers in the locale
15:45	mircea_popescu	not the slightest clue of a commercial spirit.
15:45	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform you misunderstand. no title was ever magicked.
15:45	asciilifeform	aha if no foreigners, even easier
15:45	asciilifeform	that's the only way prices like this can exist
15:45	mircea_popescu	yup
15:46	asciilifeform	or soros et al would snap up the whole shebang
15:46	mircea_popescu	worthless dollars being worthless, of course.
15:46	asciilifeform	only'
15:46	asciilifeform	' 500k 'worthless' dollars buy a moscow flat
15:46	asciilifeform	today.
15:46	mircea_popescu	Adlai there's nothing wrong with hatin' an' railin'. on the contrary. meanwhile the attempt to not do so seems to be damaging for the attempter.
15:47	mircea_popescu	i wouldn't live in moscow if the flat were free.
15:47	asciilifeform	just example.
15:47	*	Adlai isn't hating and generally doesn't reach critical mass of serialized words to justify a 'blog'
15:48	mircea_popescu	Adlai just a thought.
15:48	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050208 << why the fuck would you own furniture in excess of the real estate you own ?
15:48	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 17:15:40; asciilifeform: mircea_popescu: 'unlike anywhere in the civilised world, the Argentines rent unfurnished.' << wai wat?! most rental pads where i live are unfurnished - just the way i like it (wtf to do with the incl. furniture if you have your own?)
15:48	mircea_popescu	this is like renting cars without the engine. "because i have an engine"
15:48	mircea_popescu	why the fuck are you going around with an debodied engine!
15:49	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: not in excess. in exactly the correct volume.
15:49	mircea_popescu	to rent means, ready to use.
15:49	mircea_popescu	if i rent i expect to take the keys, take a girl there and fuck her in this order.
15:49	asciilifeform	but no, i don't have precisely same items to put in rented space as the neighbouring derps
15:49	mircea_popescu	if i wanted a place to work on i'd buy it.
15:49	*	Adlai has also been busy with the likes of https://github.com/adlai/bip0032sbcl/commit/d5b1b52
15:49	assbot	http://www.dorodango.com/create.html · d5b1b52 · adlai/bip0032sbcl · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1Mwt35I )
15:49	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform so then you're muddying the discussion up by being one of those who lives in a warehouse
15:49	mircea_popescu	obviously warehouses are rented empty whether you live in them or not.
15:50	mircea_popescu	this is residential not commercial space we're discussing here.
15:50	asciilifeform	Adlai: aaargh, is that a shell callout!? wtf
15:50	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: speaking of my actual residence here
15:50	asciilifeform	i -like- my desk, chair, etc. don't want 'generic' ones when i move
15:50	chetty	germany unfurnished apts didnt even have a kitchen sink
15:50	mircea_popescu	you're nuts, the lot of you.
15:50	Adlai	asciilifeform: i've not yet polished hdw, the only reason i touched that file is so the commit would still pass tests
15:51	Adlai	(guy used a defconstant symbol as a local variable)
15:51	mircea_popescu	who the fuck cares about the desk! and a chair, whatever, you just... buy a new one! that fits!
15:51	mircea_popescu	what sort of consumerist culture is this anymore!
15:51	asciilifeform	Adlai: and srsly, sha256 as a callout?! it's a pg or 2
15:51	*	Adlai will lift from ironclad when the time comes
15:51	trinque	mircea_popescu: do you know how long it takes to get the perfect ass crease in an office chair?!
15:51	Adlai	(with the medium/long plan, if this thing reaches usable quality, being backporting)
15:52	Adlai	or upstreaming
15:52	Adlai	or whatever the kids call it
15:52	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: if were moving to, wherever, jp, yes - things more economical to buy 2nd time than ship - would
15:52	mircea_popescu	trinque i never used a chair for more than i dunno, a year ? two ?
15:52	asciilifeform	but that isn't 100% of furniture
15:52	chetty	<trinque> mircea_popescu: do you know how long it takes to get the perfect ass crease in an office chair?!// longer than modern ones last
15:52	trinque	haha
15:52	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform you also go around with your bed ?
15:52	mircea_popescu	"this is my bed, my grandmother died in it"
15:52	asciilifeform	phun phakt: i once had a costly, 'premium' type office chair spontaneously convert into a stake
15:52	Adlai	;;ud chair ass
15:52	gribble	http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Chair+Ass | Chair Ass. The natural effect of the slow growth and spread of a clerical worker's physical frame, across the span of years of combining vending machine snack ...
15:52	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform kinda why you change them yearly.
15:52	Adlai	clerical workers, the lot o ya
15:53	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: or use one made 20+ yrs ago
15:53	trinque	Adlai: standing desk is where it's at
15:53	trinque	better for pacing angrily
15:53	danielpbarron	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xCmeHCnPwxY
15:53	assbot	Homer - Ass Groove - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1BwZOvL )
15:53	asciilifeform	my brother works in a chair that almost certainly was once at 'bell labs'
15:53	mircea_popescu	look, if you're going to fill a place with antiques, YOU SHOULD NOT BE RENTING IT
15:53	asciilifeform	it is indestructible.
15:53	mircea_popescu	antiques suffer from transport, and wtf do you even want to put nice furniture in a place you don't like.,
15:53	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: yes, plainly antiques should only travel in atomic dirigible
15:54	asciilifeform	for the rest of us, who don't have access to $maxint - they sit in rented hovels, yes
15:54	chetty	oo thats what I want a desk that goes up and down so you can sit or stand :D
15:54	asciilifeform	chetty: we have these where i work
15:54	asciilifeform	chetty: overrated imho
15:54	Adlai	!s ikea shelf
15:54	assbot	0 results for 'ikea shelf' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=ikea+shelf
15:54	mircea_popescu	basically, you're in this space that doens't eixst, at all. there's a) real estate you own, and you like enough to own, which contains furniture of value proprotionate to that. and b) real estate you don't give a shit about, if you come back to find it ablaze you just shrug and move on.
15:54	mircea_popescu	yours is some sort of insane c) where it has all the disadvantages of both.
15:54	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu is approximately correct
15:54	mircea_popescu	well so then, here's an idle thought :
15:55	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu is puzzled because he can afford sanity
15:55	mircea_popescu	the reason you find it so hard to escape the gravity well is in no small part due to the fact that you;ve spent many decades making the wrong decisions and they're a bitch to undo.
15:55	asciilifeform	but over here we live in demented pauper-land where sanity is a premium product available to select few.
15:55	mircea_popescu	hardest of all is to move from c).
15:55	asciilifeform	decades << not quite decade
15:56	mircea_popescu	may explain why you're even contemplating the alien insanity, instead of just telling me i'm evil.
15:56	asciilifeform	but otherwise a nearly obvious description of what a gravity well even is
15:56	mircea_popescu	i guess so huh.
15:56	asciilifeform	i mean no shit, it sucks and no one would climb in on his own volition
15:56	asciilifeform	if knew what's in the tank
15:56	mircea_popescu	myeah. i see it. well... i feel better for having discussed it!
15:57	asciilifeform	but i probably should elaborate a little
15:57	asciilifeform	would happily set fire to all of it if had the other half of the conundrum licked
15:57	mircea_popescu	that's a rare man, and a virtually inexistent woman.
15:57	chetty	I beg your pardon
15:57	asciilifeform	l0l
15:58	trinque	easier when you're poor, heh. I've moved across the country several times, selling all the crap that didn't fit in a car
15:58	asciilifeform	trinque: i used to be 'theoretical'
15:58	mircea_popescu	chetty it's rare. you know it's rare.
15:58	asciilifeform	which is what i call folks who don't need any physical plant
15:58	trinque	better to advance the career, get another tv or whatever
15:58	asciilifeform	a good friend of mine is 'theoretical'
15:58	trinque	asciilifeform: ah yeah, I am mostly bits
15:58	asciilifeform	a mathematician
15:58	asciilifeform	i envy him often
15:58	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform> which is what i call folks who don't need any physical plant << which is why i said i was a theoretical physicist :)
15:58	trinque	heh!
15:59	chetty	rare it may be, but it does exist
15:59	mircea_popescu	it does.
15:59	mircea_popescu	hey, i covered my ass with that virtually in there.
15:59	fluffypony	BingoBoingo: yeah, when he accused me of having a financial interest I got bored
15:59	asciilifeform	i trained the pet, inadvertantly, by threatening, for some years, to move us into a ship
15:59	fluffypony	stupid moron
15:59	asciilifeform	(which at one point wanted to do)
15:59	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 97406 @ 0.00034083 = 33.1989 BTC [+] {3}
16:00	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform the what's his name disease
16:00	mircea_popescu	orlov
16:00	asciilifeform	aha
16:00	mircea_popescu	i've been on ships. they suck.
16:00	mircea_popescu	fucking bilge, nuff said.
16:00	asciilifeform	know what else sucks?
16:00	asciilifeform	living on land in gringolandia
16:00	fluffypony	mircea_popescu: I don't redditard professionally, I used PRAW + some python to grab the info and then shoved it into Excel of all things
16:00	asciilifeform	on $smallint
16:00	mircea_popescu	fluffypony well the results were so out of place for the venue. like... wow.
16:00	asciilifeform	on the ship you get the thing americans pay $maxint for - maximize distance from nearest human on command - for $0.
16:01	mircea_popescu	well, for $gas
16:01	fluffypony	I was very annoyed :-P
16:01	asciilifeform	sail.
16:01	mircea_popescu	op get the motherfucking fuck out.
16:01	asciilifeform	(orlov has a small engine, he claims only for parking)
16:01	mircea_popescu	you were going to live on a sailboat ?
16:01	mircea_popescu	what are you, a cartoon character ?
16:01	asciilifeform	had idea before reading mr o, but it was him who demonstrated that it can be done on something less than orbital budget
16:02	asciilifeform	anyway, i'm not satisfied presently with his demonstration. he cheated.
16:02	mircea_popescu	you ever like... i dunno, ever had a friend in porn invite you to spend a while with a coupla girls on a yacht ? or generally, spent any time on a sail vessel ?
16:02	*	asciilifeform is not an expert or veteran of the art. but also is not esp. susceptible to motion sickness
16:03	mircea_popescu	but have you ever spent, a whole day, on a sail anything, at sea.
16:03	asciilifeform	nope.
16:03	mircea_popescu	yes. well, before you expend any serious money / other resources on this, do that.
16:03	trinque	the sail really gets the thing swaying
16:03	mircea_popescu	you can not begin to imagine how fucking inconvenient it is. at all.
16:03	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: for this and other reasons decided that 'too orbital' for budget constraint.
16:03	mircea_popescu	i mean sure, as an outing, soemthing to do for a day or w/e, great. splendid sport.
16:03	mircea_popescu	but otherwise, jail is BY FAR more comfortable.
16:04	mircea_popescu	you wouldn't want to live in a bob sleigh or inside your go-kart either. it's not that dissimilar.
16:05	*	asciilifeform searches memory for historical figures who are known to have done any serious thinking while under sail
16:05	mircea_popescu	nelson, for one.
16:05	mircea_popescu	but he sailed an english manowar.
16:05	asciilifeform	aha
16:05	mircea_popescu	also franklin. but he sailed english ocean liners.
16:05	mircea_popescu	also twain, same.
16:05	mircea_popescu	none of these are the thing here discussed.
16:06	asciilifeform	at any rate, mr o spends most of his time at anchor
16:06	mircea_popescu	because "he chooses to" right ?
16:06	asciilifeform	the machine, as i understand, is for reasonably quick, inexpensive, and unobtrusive jurisdiction-switching
16:06	mircea_popescu	would be a shitload cheaper to just rent serially. FURNISHED appartments.
16:06	asciilifeform	as well as climate-switching
16:07	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: air travel -> arse inspection. sail - not yet (doesn't scale well)
16:07	mircea_popescu	yeah, sure, because he couldn't be served just as well by a common bus.
16:07	asciilifeform	bus to uninhabited islands ?
16:07	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 70100 @ 0.00034423 = 24.1305 BTC [+] {2}
16:08	asciilifeform	boat is a machine for getting away from fucking humans
16:08	asciilifeform	bus, passenger plane, auto - no.
16:08	mircea_popescu	mkay.
16:08	mircea_popescu	i propose this matter still needs a lot more thinking.
16:09	asciilifeform	it solves an actual problem, that some folks perceive themselves as having
16:09	asciilifeform	which is the one in 'stand on zanzibar' and of the 'mouse city' overpopulation experiment
16:09	chetty	I could go for a deserted island :)
16:09	asciilifeform	chetty: by far the most economical way to get there is on water
16:10	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050212 << i'm on the record saying that italians are really the scourge of europe, gypsyes muchly preferable.
16:10	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 17:19:11; *: Adlai wonders how http://trilema.com/2015/argentina-for-business/#footnote_1_60514 fits with https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tzQuuoKXVq0
16:11	Adlai	https://i.imgur.com/xV3sl.gif
16:11	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1MwvPHU )
16:11	mircea_popescu	yeah well, there could scarcely be imagined a more degenerate people.
16:12	mircea_popescu	make the italian a cook and forget it.
16:13	mod6	jurov: not even a test email made it through.
16:15	mircea_popescu	hahaha the youtube ends on the same note. "let them do the food"
16:15	danielpbarron	this video about itally might as well be about U.S., or Connecticut at least
16:16	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050215 << this is a complicated question. generally, the damage was done early on by a (perhaps understandably) revancharde russia, and late on, by a completely local brewed idiot.
16:16	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 17:19:15; asciilifeform: thing is, colonizing power is not necessarily a civilizing one. how'd ya like ru colonial period in ro?
16:16	mircea_popescu	otherwise, romania was in europe throughout, it was going to push industrialization through regardless.
16:17	mircea_popescu	danielpbarron the problem with places that used to be great but lacked the social structure to support it is they degenerate essentially the same way.
16:17	asciilifeform	walls of constantinopol
16:17	mircea_popescu	"give us your tired, your hungry" omits the whole picture : sure a country of immigrants is a grand way to build yourself up. but, necesarily, it's a great way to fall over like a deflated donut within a century.
16:17	mircea_popescu	happens every time.
16:18	mod6	give us ur derps
16:21	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050233 << funny thing being, that if they actually want a copy they can just ask neh ?
16:21	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 18:52:56; asciilifeform: i think this one went to /dev/null
16:21	asciilifeform	phr33 s4mpl3
16:21	asciilifeform	will hand-deliver to hitler if he asks nicely
16:22	asciilifeform	nobody wants a copy, but only to be annoying
16:22	mircea_popescu	which is the ridiculousness of it all. teenaged priss kinda likes a boy, does not find it within her purview to go on knees moan for cock. oh no, must pretend this that and the other.
16:23	mircea_popescu	god forbid we think less of her unless she doesn't do the exact things that make one think less of her.
16:23	mircea_popescu	basically the usg is about 15 and has grown up on a gated community. in connecticut.
16:23	asciilifeform	more like cat that 'plays with its food'
16:24	asciilifeform	'we're in no hurry, you and i', the beast says to the mouse
16:24	mircea_popescu	mno.
16:26	danielpbarron	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=21-01-2015#985304 << is the "BTC" side of this to be paid post-fork, because otherwise the deal is really 750 BTC + 750 gavincoin in exchange for 1k gavincoin
16:26	assbot	Logged on 21-01-2015 02:32:01; mircea_popescu: ;;sell 1000 "Gavin Scamcoins" @ 750 BTC Future delivery. Larger amounts will get you an even better deal. Smaller amounts may be considered.
16:26	asciilifeform	i mean, i'd like to think not, but cannot fairly claim to be certain of not being mouse
16:26	mircea_popescu	danielpbarron ahem. through what sort of magic the parts summed exceed the sum ?
16:27	danielpbarron	750 BTC today will be on both chains post-fork
16:28	mircea_popescu	right.
16:30	danielpbarron	so someone pays you 750 BTC today, which turns into 750 BTC and 750 GSC (gavinscamcoin) later, and you just need to buy another 250 GSC to settle the deal
16:33	mircea_popescu	or in other words, they make 250 gsc for no risk, if they believe this theory whereby "people" will "update" to gavincoin on gavin's say so.
16:33	thestringpuller	danielpbarron: that assumes this 750 BTC is prefork.
16:33	danielpbarron	right, it's still a "good deal" to those who are so sure the fork will be a hit; i'm just trying to figure out how "good a deal" it is
16:39	danielpbarron	so it's kinda like they are trading 750 BTC for 250 GSC, no?
16:39	danielpbarron	where BTC is this "stilly worthless thing" to them
16:41	mike_c	danielpbarron: you need to be 75% confident to break even
16:41	mike_c	if you are > than that confident in gavincoin, it's a good deal
16:42	mike_c	i can do the math for you if it's helpful
16:43	danielpbarron	I think I got it now. I was hung up on my own bias against GSC
16:44	danielpbarron	in that, I would probably be willing to trade 750 GSC for 250 BTC
16:45	mike_c	then you can undercut mp :) quick, make an exchange!
16:46	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9293 @ 0.00033945 = 3.1545 BTC [-]
16:46	danielpbarron	are you making me an offer?
16:47	mike_c	no, i don't sell btc for fiat or for gavincoin.
16:49	davout	this video about italians is amazing
16:49	assbot	AMAZING COMPANY!
16:50	davout	the retarded part of the french also clap at landings
16:50	davout	mircea_popescu: furnished flats are the exception in france too
16:52	asciilifeform	davout: i suspect that they're absolutely standard wherever inhabited by ordinary folks, rather than business travellers or mircea_popescu with $maxint
16:53	Adlai	davout: my cdg layover mia→tlv was packed with equal parts frenchman and jew... confusion over whether to clap was palpable.
16:54	davout	haha
16:54	asciilifeform	davout: unfurnished, that is
16:54	asciilifeform	rather than furnished
16:54	davout	asciilifeform: yea you got me confused
16:55	davout	Adlai: they seriously made you login to your comp? that's pretty retarded
16:55	mike_c	americans only clap when landing in las vegas.
16:55	asciilifeform	davout: the laptop thing is becoming standard in most of the usg world
16:56	Adlai	after i repeated "linux" a bunch of times, ran xterm and opened random man pages, eventually the guy got overwhelmed/embarassed and just waved me on
16:56	asciilifeform	davout: if it has any purpose whatsoever, it is a training run for shoulder-surfing the pw in case they decide to confiscate the machine
16:56	davout	asciilifeform: is it to search it? or to check that it isn't just filled /w explosives?
16:56	asciilifeform	davout: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050246
16:56	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 18:58:33; asciilifeform: Adlai: i still don't get this notion where t3rr0s1stz -somehow must- replace -all- of the cells in the battery with plastique, instead of only half
16:57	Adlai	asciilifeform: if that's the case, the guy failed afaict, seemed to be waiting for graphical login and was shocked to discover that all had taken place in text
16:57	davout	good thing i'm only carrying my friends laptop i don't have the credentials to
16:57	Adlai	(he was totally zoned out until i pulled him back to reality, impatient to get IN the plane)
16:57	asciilifeform	davout: insta-confiscation, presumed plastique.
16:57	asciilifeform	in usg airport
16:58	*	Adlai is amazed that his laptop passes chemical swabs
16:58	asciilifeform	(sorta like admitting that you have someone else's suitcase)
16:58	davout	asciilifeform: i don't really get why logging in to it isn't deemed enough proof it isn't a bomb
16:58	Adlai	for, ahem, contraband of the airborn pollen variety.
16:58	asciilifeform	davout: because it's a lie
16:58	Adlai	it's proof that you don't care about 'unlocking' the device
16:58	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51800 @ 0.00033945 = 17.5835 BTC [-]
16:58	davout	braindamaged on so many levels
16:58	Adlai	you've never had security at an event ask to open a bag/compartment, only to barely glance what was inside once open?
16:59	davout	danielpbarron: btw when i say an exchange, i mean an exchange
16:59	Adlai	not really, it's behavioral profiling and it works when you're less braindamaged than your expected enemy
16:59	trinque	they're just derping through a script they've been taught
16:59	trinque	they care that they hit the major bullet points, don't care how effectively
16:59	asciilifeform	Adlai: everyone has. because actual anal inspection for every 'client' takes far too long. instead - lottery.
16:59	asciilifeform	when your number comes up - then, then the fun.
16:59	trinque	generally smiling at the fucks and making pleasantries is enough to get through quickly
17:00	danielpbarron	davout, well I posted the invite on the forum; they know where to come
17:00	trinque	though I may be white and combed-hair enough to not be bothered often
17:00	Adlai	army tactic: let 99% pass unmolested, anally inspect the random 1%. (and call in female sergeant for the other inspection)
17:00	Adlai	like TA, this only works if everybody knows you're doing it
17:00	trinque	Adlai: the point in my mind is that these aren't ideologically motivated goons
17:01	davout	danielpbarron: you mean an invite to -otc?
17:01	Adlai	no, the guy at the border check was just doing his job
17:01	trinque	they're just bored kids, with as much focused malice as a bored kid can muster
17:01	Adlai	he was really embarassed at how impatient i got
17:01	*	Adlai wasn't sure what to expect, but in his mind, it involved at least being led away from the public areas... no such privilege, just awkwards blocking the line
17:02	trinque	I have no trouble smiling and being friendly with some govt goon if it gets me on my plane quicker, or out of the airport quicker
17:02	danielpbarron	davout, to here.. -assets
17:03	davout	ah, well to take up the offer you got clarification about amirite
17:05	davout	either way, it can't really work now, there can't really be a contract that defines what a gavincoin is before the guy actually commits some code
17:06	danielpbarron	it can't really work now because anyone dumb enough to want to make the deal doesn't actually have enough money for it to be worthwhile
17:06	danielpbarron	that aside, it should technically be possible to strike a deal
17:07	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 38900 @ 0.00033945 = 13.2046 BTC [-]
17:08	davout	there are plenty of people dumb enough to take the deal that also happen to have >1k
17:09	davout	it's not possible, because defining gavincoin as "everything that is not bitcoin" just doesn't work
17:10	danielpbarron	i'd define it the way they do: a fork of bitcoin that gets 80% consensus from miners (or 75% or 95%, whatever magic number they want)
17:11	davout	what if it's like a emergency bugfix harfork? or any kind of non-braindamaged hardfork we actually agree with?
17:13	davout	because the contract also has to have an expiration, in case the hardfork never actually happens
17:13	asciilifeform	80% << obligatory >> 'We use the term "thieves" if the number of men does not exceed seven, "band of marauders" [or "war-band"] for a number between seven and thirty-five. Anything beyond this is an "army".'
17:13	asciilifeform	( http://www.regia.org/research/warfare/fyrd1.htm )
17:13	assbot	Regia Anglorum - The Fyrd (Army) in Anglo-Saxon England - Part 1 ... ( http://bit.ly/1C9XjQK )
17:14	danielpbarron	i could specify that it doesn't count as a fork if the resulting coin is still accepted by MPEx :p
		↖
17:15	asciilifeform	lol, package -did- show.
17:16	asciilifeform	even a free sample board in there.
17:20	mike_c	pics
17:20	mike_c	do they look visually reasonable? no balls of solder hanging off the sides?
17:21	asciilifeform	visually yes
17:22	asciilifeform	http://www.loper-os.org/pub/mf1.jpg http://www.loper-os.org/pub/mf2.jpg
17:22	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu ^
17:23	asciilifeform	one of the bags contains an empty board (souvenir?) - order consisted of two assembled standard rng
17:24	davout	danielpbarron: :)
17:24	nubbins`	alf, cool
17:24	asciilifeform	did not yet test
17:25	asciilifeform	dimensions are perfect within visual limits, though boards have panelization burrs
17:25	asciilifeform	(unlike my cn supplier which ships only perfectly-smooth edges)
17:25	asciilifeform	ic orientations are correct
17:25	nubbins`	where'd this batch come from?
17:25	asciilifeform	'macrofab'
17:25	nubbins`	a
17:26	nubbins`	much price diff?
17:26	asciilifeform	recently-opened outfit in usa
17:26	asciilifeform	nubbins`: i have nothing with which to compare the price. nobody else on the planet does qty.1 smt assembly+board with no tooling charge
17:26	nubbins`	that's the ultimate bespoke, hey?
17:27	asciilifeform	for their weight in gold.
17:27	nubbins`	HEH.
17:27	asciilifeform	will say later if these even work.
17:28	nubbins`	i was gonna offer to purchase the empty board for posterity, but i doubt that's on the table anymore 8)
17:30	*	nubbins` generally only buys two things at gold/oz cost -- gold and printer ink
17:30	nubbins`	and even printer ink, i'm buying in bulk these days
17:33	nubbins`	...and fwiw there was a tooling charge, just not presented as such :P
17:42	scoopbot	New post on Qntra.net by cazalla: http://qntra.net/2015/03/latest-ransomware-targets-game-files-related-applications/
		↖
17:42	asciilifeform	http://www.loper-os.org/pub/mf3_compare.jpg
17:42	asciilifeform	^ left hand: them. right hand: me.
17:45	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu, anyone else who cares ^
17:47	asciilifeform	nubbins`: tooling charge is rolled into everything, sure
17:47	Adlai	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050687 < a fork by any other name... what's so hard about referencing blocksize in the contract?
17:47	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 21:14:18; danielpbarron: i could specify that it doesn't count as a fork if the resulting coin is still accepted by MPEx :p
17:47	asciilifeform	nubbins`: but very different from when you pay 500 usd per individual change in the layout.
17:48	nubbins`	re pics, nb!
17:49	nubbins`	i came across a picker/placer robot arm project recently that i meant to paste here
17:49	nubbins`	will literally never find it again
17:50	Adlai	;;google zenrobotics
17:50	gribble	ZenRobotics: Product: <http://www.zenrobotics.com/>; Company | ZenRobotics: <http://www.zenrobotics.com/company/>; ZenRobotics - YouTube: <https://www.youtube.com/user/ZenRobotics>
17:55	danielpbarron	what's so hard about << I guess I care more about it being accepted by MPEx than I care about the blocksize
17:55	danielpbarron	that is, if MP says the blocksize needs to go up, then up it shall go!
17:57	davout	Adlai: because imo a one-off 2mb block size increase coin would be valued very differently from an exponential-growth block size coin
17:57	danielpbarron	not that i think this will ever be demanded, but there could other changes needed to avert catastrophe that depend on a fork
17:58	danielpbarron	especially when considering how messy the code apparently is
17:58	davout	Adlai: for such a thing to make sense it has to give the ability to short gavincoin into the dirt, nothing else
17:58	danielpbarron	sounds like the thing could accidentally fork at any moment
17:58	davout	lol
17:59	danielpbarron	ascii is right though, for the purpose of this gavincoin thing, specifying block size should be sufficient
17:59	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56300 @ 0.00033986 = 19.1341 BTC [+] {2}
18:00	danielpbarron	ah i see what davout is sayinng
18:00	danielpbarron	your exchange could have many different fork-coin options to trade
18:00	danielpbarron	"if there is a block bigger than X, Y, or Z
18:02	*	danielpbarron is still skeptical that there is any demand for USGavincoin
18:03	danielpbarron	when it's not that the deal isn't good enough, or that it's too hard to define, it becomes "can't trust you -- need to first invent smart contracts"
18:04	danielpbarron	"By developing software that does that and by assuring that we have enough block space to include all the rules. Why everything that you say has to be limited somehow? Why can't we have freedom to do whatever we want?"
18:05	davout	this one is magical
18:06	*	Adlai is reminded of #b-w the other day starting around https://botbot.me/freenode/bitcoin-wizards/2015-03-10/?msg=33809596&page=6
18:06	assbot	IRC Logs for #bitcoin-wizards | BotBot.me [o__o] ... ( http://bit.ly/1F58hY8 )
18:06	Adlai	if you really want to boost bitcoin's hashrate, why not organize a tx processing strike?
18:06	Adlai	(answer: because miners dgaf)
18:07	mircea_popescu	ugh.
18:07	mircea_popescu	so fucking stupid srlsy.
18:08	davout	mircea_popescu: Y U NO BLOCKCHAIN TECHNOLOGY???
18:09	mircea_popescu	Most of these folks simultaneously demand government programs to alleviate poverty and hunger, mass transit so the poor can get to where the good jobs are, and international aid to the Third World. In short they want structured, paternalistic programs that address needs defined by the intellectual elite. They are bitterly opposed to innovations that merely give the masses more goods, food, or money and leave the decisi
18:09	mircea_popescu	on making to individuals.
18:09	mircea_popescu	First, the money has to be taken by force from the wealthy. Voluntary contributions don't count. Taxation at a level that the wealthy will consent to doesn't count. Any approach that recognizes the wealthy as having rights is unsatisfactory. Even worse is any recognition of philanthropy and the idea that some of the wealthy have social consciences.
18:09	mircea_popescu	Second, the programs can only address needs defined by the intellectual elite. We won't provide cheaper cars; we'll force people to use mass transit. One volunteer aid group once did a study of Third World needs, concluded that one of the most pressing needs in Third World countries was transportation, then excluded automobiles from consideration because they felt that automobiles had a negative effect. When mass trans
18:09	mircea_popescu	it doesn't work in the low-density U.S., we'll try to compel people to live in higher density housing.
18:09	mircea_popescu	see, this is exactly adeuqate : these fuckwits are the exact prototype of the sterile "intellectual". they wish to matter, and they wish this mattering to happen through administrative measures.
18:09	mircea_popescu	so "why don't you organize a boycott"
18:10	mircea_popescu	"well... because i'm not a dickless dipsit, like you."
18:10	mircea_popescu	dipshit*
18:15	cazalla	Adlai: you've never had security at an event ask to open a bag/compartment, only to barely glance what was inside once open? <<< my first evar job was bag checker/door security at a retail store, i would ask to look in bag, they would open, i would nod and they'd walk out.. they might've easily walked in, filled up the bag and walked out with the goods because i sure as fuck didn't know
18:16	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 149732 @ 0.00034058 = 50.9957 BTC [+] {4}
18:17	Adlai	but if they don't want to open the bag? game's over
18:18	mircea_popescu	Adlai i dunno, i told a schmucky kid once to mind his own business. nothing happened./
18:18	Adlai	how inconvenient
18:18	mircea_popescu	um ?
18:19	davout	cazalla: it's all theatre
18:19	Adlai	nm !
18:19	cazalla	Adlai, no-one ever objected and i imagine that to anyone who wanted to come steal socks and undies, i was a god send
18:19	Adlai	where was this? there are probably better targets for shoplifters who need to make a living
18:20	Adlai	oz?
18:20	mircea_popescu	some supermarket.
18:20	mircea_popescu	well... i also told the derpy organisers of some local "swinger's club" to get bent after they wanted the chick to check her clutch.
18:20	cazalla	Adlai, it was at store similar to target or kmart, but just clothing
18:20	mircea_popescu	wtf ever heard of such nonsense.
18:21	Adlai	there's something intoxicating about a position of power, even if it doesn't really mean anything
18:21	Adlai	especially when the intoxicated goon thinks it means the world
18:21	mircea_popescu	autoritah!
18:22	Adlai	dishiprin.
18:22	mircea_popescu	really, it's not about the position, it's about the scumbag. this is how you know vulgar folk in all times of places, that they're made of base metal : if put in charge they foul things up.
18:22	cazalla	Adlai, ah i never saw it as such, i was only placed at the door because i got the job as a result of nepotism and they had to put me somewhere hence first evar security guy for that shop lol
18:22	mircea_popescu	plenty of people do just fine in positions of authority.
18:23	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8200 @ 0.00033633 = 2.7579 BTC [-]
18:23	Adlai	cazalla: most tlv venues ranging from cafes to clubs, movie theaters to supermarkets - have 'somebody' at the door, generally with a pulse or an expression (rarely more than one), and this the
18:23	Adlai	* theater is accepted as 'security'
18:24	cazalla	i don't recall ever feeling it was a position of authority, more reminded of the fact i was nervous but at same time excited to get pocket money
18:24	Adlai	sure, the bit about authority was more >> 'wtf ever heard of such nonsense.'
18:26	trinque	heh, I was buying bulk tp at walmart recently and the door troll stopped me and tried to block my exit
18:27	trinque	"I did not steal toilet paper, you idiot." -> walked around her and out
18:27	trinque	she seemed shocked that this could be possible
18:27	nubbins`	she seemed shocked to learn that she doesn't have the authority to stop you? o.O
18:27	Adlai	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k1vKDM7wfiA
18:27	assbot	Respect my authoritah! (Compilation) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1F5dHT9 )
18:27	trinque	nubbins`: people are so goddamn polite around here, practically canadian
18:28	nubbins`	canadians are rude
18:28	Adlai	oh canada
18:28	cazalla	trinque, ya know, i didn't buy toilet paper for many years (use to take 1 or 2 rolls home from work each day)
		↖
18:28	trinque	cazalla: heh! I had a gf that would jack my tp from her work when I was 19; that's called having connections
18:28	nubbins`	it sure is
18:28	Adlai	;;ud g i butt wipe
18:28	gribble	http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=G.I.%20butt%20wipe | G.I. butt wipe. During World wars I and II,American foot soldiers were only issued about 10 individual squares of toilet paper to keep backpack weight and ...
18:29	cazalla	the cost of wiping your ass adds up
18:29	mircea_popescu	get a dog, will lick you clean for free.
		↖
18:29	trinque	lol
18:29	Adlai	that is wrong on so many levels, except the dog's
18:30	trinque	I've seen a dog devour cow turd after cow turd; a mere human ass is nothing
18:30	mircea_popescu	lol
18:30	cazalla	ya, that's why i don't understand how people can have their dogs or other animals inside the house
18:31	mircea_popescu	cazalla i knew a chick that actually loved her dog.
18:31	cazalla	mircea_popescu, i loved my dog too but she was a dog
18:31	mircea_popescu	aussies.
18:31	Adlai	!b 3
18:31	assbot	Last 3 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/3G2Q3WE.txt )
18:32	cazalla	said dog http://i.imgur.com/nqNNNvP.png made it to 16 years too, quite good for a staffy
18:32	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1F5eXFP )
18:33	mircea_popescu	eee
18:33	*	Adlai always imagined that an uncomfortable posture
18:33	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 67900 @ 0.00034518 = 23.4377 BTC [+] {3}
18:33	mircea_popescu	you know that dog is practically saying "aussies..."
18:33	Adlai	twist your torso, now put all your upper body weight right on the twist!
18:35	assbot	[HAVELOCK] [AM1] 130 @ 0.01099999 = 1.43 BTC [-] {2}
18:36	cazalla	mircea_popescu, despite not allowing her in the house, i am quite sensitive about my Lucy, so please don't be saying she had such a look :(
18:36	mircea_popescu	aw sorry!
18:36	mircea_popescu	just teasing you a little.
18:37	jurov	mod6 sorry, dns problem, fixed
18:37	mircea_popescu	wow! it actually happened that ppl complained about jurov's email thing and it actually was the case it was broken
18:37	mircea_popescu	i been waitin' for this...
18:38	davout	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050798 <<< such life haxxor
18:38	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 22:28:01; cazalla: trinque, ya know, i didn't buy toilet paper for many years (use to take 1 or 2 rolls home from work each day)
18:38	davout	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050804 <<< in romania, dog cleans you
18:38	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 22:29:29; mircea_popescu: get a dog, will lick you clean for free.
18:38	trinque	davout: next tier up is only shitting at work
18:38	trinque	at least on weekdays
18:38	mircea_popescu	meanwhile in france... http://41.media.tumblr.com/655c83b5213fb218ae4a102611225095/tumblr_n30s9xDvX81s8rc6go1_1280.jpg
18:38	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1F5gpIl )
18:39	cazalla	trinque, not of the class who waits until arriving home to do such things?
18:39	trinque	I self employ now, but the joke always was among friends to shit on the company dime
18:39	davout	mircea_popescu: notbad.jpg
18:39	trinque	so I guess I'm always shitting on the company dime these days
18:40	mircea_popescu	i fucking managed to find salt pickles.
18:40	mircea_popescu	such relish
18:41	Adlai	boss makes a dollar while i make a dime // that's why i shit on company time
18:41	trinque	!b 1
18:41	assbot	Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2G2RHM9.txt )
18:41	trinque	that's the one
18:41	Adlai	bathroom poetry
18:42	Adlai	vandals carrying spraypaint, sure. but it always seemed a different breed of vandal to wander around with a sharpie
18:42	cazalla	easier to pretend to go on break with others who actually are on break (dependent on type of job of course)
18:44	davout	Adlai: so it should really be "boss makes a dollar while I make a dime, and a turd"
18:44	mircea_popescu	the turdime!
18:45	Adlai	better yet, run one of those bitcoin shit-ship-shops... just don't let corporate know you're doing materials r&d for the startup on the company clock
18:47	mircea_popescu	how do you think the extant ones are made ?
18:48	cazalla	quote from a coindesk article.. who is missing from the list of 5 twitter accounts? http://dpaste.com/0NSJG4T.txt
18:48	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1F5iROV )
18:48	davout	http://imgur.com/J5U3l1j <<< god knows what these little girls will sell for bitcoin once they turn 16
18:48	assbot	Little girls wearing google glasses selling cookies for bitcoin. This is Silicon Valley. - Imgur ... ( http://bit.ly/1F5iV1a )
18:48	*	Adlai thinks of this every day, 3-4 times, while tesla wags his tail like he's cured parkworm
18:50	mircea_popescu	cazalla lmao nitwits.
18:50	mircea_popescu	cazalla and do they link to qntra or ?
18:50	cazalla	what do you think?
18:51	mircea_popescu	i think it sounds like a first best ever news site
18:53	cazalla	it's not that i mind that they mentioned other people part of a possible syndicate with silvey (which i didn't include in article as no proof of this anyway) but least they could do is admit that yeah, we followed it back from the avatar after having read about it on qntra
18:53	Adlai	they're just recycling http://blog.cryptocrumb.com/2015/03/fbi-silk-road-auction-of-march-2015.html although ferrin doesn't mention Steve Youngblood
18:53	assbot	Crypto Crumbs: FBI Silk Road Auction of March 2015 ... ( http://bit.ly/1F5k8pd )
18:54	Adlai	but everybody knows steve youngblood right guise?
		~ 20 minutes ~
19:14	jurov	;;ticker
19:14	gribble	Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 295.51, Best ask: 295.68, Bid-ask spread: 0.17000, Last trade: 295.7, 24 hour volume: 27046.72490813, 24 hour low: 291.04, 24 hour high: 298.8, 24 hour vwap: None
19:18	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64000 @ 0.00033633 = 21.5251 BTC [-]
19:19	jurov	;;ticker --currency EUR --market all
19:19	gribble	Bitstamp BTCEUR last: 278.22547, vol: 8229.45591540 | BTC-E BTCEUR last: 279.3, vol: 122.00342 | BTCChina BTCEUR last: 276.313023, vol: 138319.96870000 | Bitcoin-Central BTCEUR last: 278.0, vol: 84.6419943 | Volume-weighted last average: 276.423721036
19:20	jurov	;;calc 290/278
19:20	gribble	1.04316546763
19:30	chetty	insomnia treatment: http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2015/db0312/FCC-15-24A1.pdf
19:30	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1Cb8Dh0 )
19:36	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9966 @ 0.00033633 = 3.3519 BTC [-]
19:38	davout	chetty: looked at the page count, felt sleepy
19:38	jurov	i scrolled into the middle, saw fotnote number 1216 O.o
19:39	jurov	*footnote
19:39	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 198450 @ 0.0003323 = 65.9449 BTC [-] {6}
19:54	jurov	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-03-2015#1050355 see classic essay ont he subject: https://www.peereboom.us/assl/assl/html/openssl.html
19:54	assbot	Logged on 12-03-2015 19:29:16; mircea_popescu: the only solution is to pull in the relevant code and encase it in acrylate.
19:56	jurov	in short, we're standing on the shoulders of monkeys
20:01	danielpbarron	only to barely glance what was inside once open? << i confidently walked through security at the new york marathon (post boston bombing) without having my backpack checked; had a stainless steel 64 oz bottle inside
20:02	*	jurov at first read stainless steel 64 oz blade inside
20:03	danielpbarron	everyone else queued up with their bag in hand, arms outstretched
20:04	danielpbarron	i walked right up to the guy with the wand, he waved it around and let me through
20:04	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14000 @ 0.00033617 = 4.7064 BTC [+]
20:07	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 47362 @ 0.00032865 = 15.5655 BTC [-]
20:08	danielpbarron	!up Transisto
20:08	danielpbarron	!up ohhahh
20:12	jurov	also, while code may be encased in acrylate, it's easy victim for future C compilers hyperoptimizations
20:16	mircea_popescu	<jurov> in short, we're standing on the shoulders of monkeys << quite.
20:17	mircea_popescu	!up cuwirebeard
20:19	mircea_popescu	;;google "Satoshi Dice couldn't merge tx's anyway because bitcoind is written by monkeys"
20:19	gribble	Inputs.io hacked – 4100 BTC stolen | Hacker News: <https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6687795>; How would you make an extra ,000 in a month? :: Kopywriting Kourse: <http://kopywritingkourse.com/10000-in-a-month/>; Is Louisiana's Oil-Blocking Sand Berm Project Doomed? - 80beats ...: <http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/80beats/2010/06/25/is-louisianas-oil-blocking-sand-berm- (1 more message)
20:19	mircea_popescu	gtfo google. there's exactly one source on the whole internet.
20:27	ben_vulpes	decimation, asciilifeform, mod6, mircea_popescu, et al: what does it mean for openssl to load files in from disk as discussed last night? is it compiling .txts into machine code? loading precompiled stuff?
20:28	ben_vulpes	cazalla: i don't know a transisto, no.
20:28	decimation	ben_vulpes: usually libdl is used to load a binary library *after* the program has launched
20:29	decimation	a common scenario is when you want to load 'binary plugins'
20:29	decimation	which themselves are compiled .so files
20:29	mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes essentially, it means they have not an inkling of how to code. they're importing code as data.
20:30	ben_vulpes	heh
20:30	mircea_popescu	"oh but it works"
20:30	ben_vulpes	<mircea_popescu> ben_vulpes essentially, it means they have not an inkling of how to code. they're importing code as data. << i would like to hear the seasoned lispers take on this
		↖
20:31	mircea_popescu	"After messing around with this code for about a month I decided to write this up for the tubes in the hope that I can save some souls. I have come to the conclusion that OpenSSL is equivalent to monkeys throwing feces at the wall. It is, bar none, the worst library I have ever worked with. I can not believe that the internet is running on such a ridiculous complex and gratuitously stupid piece of code. Since circa 199
20:31	mircea_popescu	8 the whole world has been trusting their secure communications to this impenetrable morass that calls itself the "OpenSSL" project. I bet that the doctors that work on that shitshow can not prescribe anything useful either!"
20:31	mircea_popescu	maybe this guy should be in here.
20:31	decimation	http://www.mail-archive.com/openssl-dev@openssl.org/msg05003.html < "Support for hardware acceleration is on its way that will use DSOs, this is so that the library and applications can have acceleration support but still run on platforms that don't have the acceleration drivers. Eg. you could even build applications that *can* support hardware acceleration using platforms without the hardware/drivers."
20:31	assbot	Re: Why is dso a part of openssl? ... ( http://bit.ly/1BAJits )
20:31	decimation	so what he's saying is that they put the libdl stuff in there so that you could load a binary driver for custom hardware
20:31	mircea_popescu	lol, conformal guy. kay.
20:31	decimation	without recompiling the openssl library
20:32	trinque	that module loading thing is like they almost knew the thing should be broken into small pieces, but not quite
20:33	decimation	what it comes down to is that distribution 'vendors' wanna ship you binaries
20:33	cazalla	ben_vulpes, ah you mentioned him in the logs so i thought otherwise
20:33	trinque	decimation: here attach this mystery device to your bloodstream
20:33	trinque	you'll be fine
20:33	decimation	hehe
20:33	ben_vulpes	cazalla: i hm what when?
20:33	ben_vulpes	!s transisto from ben_vulpes
20:33	assbot	0 results for 'transisto from ben_vulpes' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=transisto+from+ben_vulpes
20:34	cazalla	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=02-06-2014#698249
20:34	assbot	Logged on 02-06-2014 01:23:02; benkay: !up Transisto
20:36	mircea_popescu	#ifndef OPENSSL_NO_STDIO
20:36	mircea_popescu	* Load CA certs from a file into a ::STACK. Note that it is somewhat misnamed;
20:36	mircea_popescu	* it doesn't really have anything to do with clients (except that a common use
20:36	mircea_popescu	* for a stack of CAs is to send it to the client). Actually, it doesn't have
20:36	mircea_popescu	* much to do with CAs, either, since it will load any old cert.
20:36	mircea_popescu	* \param file the file containing one or more certs.
20:36	mircea_popescu	* \return a ::STACK containing the certs.
20:36	mircea_popescu	*/
20:36	mircea_popescu	STACK_OF(X509_NAME) *SSL_load_client_CA_file(const char *file)
20:37	mircea_popescu	ahaha epic. no fucking wonder bitcoin-proto works on open-ssl
20:37	decimation	re: full auto < yeah us mil agrees, the ar-15 (m16) isn't made with full auto anymore, only 3-round burst. even this is almost never used. There is a place for full auto, and it is on a machine gun that is heavy enough to fire at full auto without completely losing accuracy
20:37	decimation	mircea_popescu: openssl has weird re-implementations of all kinds of crazy shit
20:38	mircea_popescu	decimation that, exactly. emplaced, basically.
20:38	decimation	yeah, crew served or mounted on a vehicle
20:41	cazalla	ben_vulpes, nothing untoward, his name just popped up in a trailer for a video and i searched logs here but few hits
20:43	ben_vulpes	ahmkay.
20:54	mircea_popescu	http://41.media.tumblr.com/29d64bd0a3aa3757ca989ff98bf618ca/tumblr_mowkmf8aaE1r0qabqo1_1280.jpg
20:54	assbot	... ( http://bit.ly/1x0iyUI )
20:54	decimation	re: asciilifeform on a boat < wash dc is famous for having a 'marina' on the potomac where one can live for the price of a boat and a few $k per year
20:55	decimation	re: italians < especially southern italians. northern ones tend to be a bit more germanic
20:57	decimation	asciilifeform: wow they even placed your shield? neat
20:57	mircea_popescu	yeah, the southerners are too disorganised to even be corrupt properly
20:57	mircea_popescu	need a berlusconi or something to show them how it'd sone
20:57	decimation	of course, note that nearly all 'italian americans' come from southern italy
21:00	BingoBoingo	Midwest "Italian Americans" are the worst
		~ 21 minutes ~
21:22	Adlai	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1050906 < having the evaluator|compiler available at compil|evaluation time vs asking it to (eval (read (http-request "wack")))
21:22	assbot	Logged on 13-03-2015 00:30:52; ben_vulpes: <mircea_popescu> ben_vulpes essentially, it means they have not an inkling of how to code. they're importing code as data. << i would like to hear the seasoned lispers take on this
21:24	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 16100 @ 0.00032594 = 5.2476 BTC [-]
21:27	danielpbarron	!up Bagels7
21:35	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 33050 @ 0.00033617 = 11.1104 BTC [+]
21:46	asciilifeform	decimation: wow they even placed your shield? neat << it's a part, like the others, with footprint & centroid coordinates, etc. i'd be rather pissed if it were missing
21:50	mircea_popescu	what, "we did most of the job" not good enough for ya ?!
21:50	mircea_popescu	in this day and age things aren't as they used to be, yo!
21:58	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20350 @ 0.00032473 = 6.6083 BTC [-] {2}
22:06	asciilifeform	"we did most of the job" << these folks even offer a 'test' service but i can't really make use of it for these parts
22:07	thestringpuller	mircea_popescu: what airport is best? or does it matter?
22:07	asciilifeform	( for folks who missed wtf thread was about - http://www.loper-os.org/pub/mf3_compare.jpg )
22:08	mircea_popescu	generally everyone flies through ezeiza, but it doesn't matter.
22:08	decimation	asciilifeform: how did you get prices for your bom?
22:08	decimation	their 'house parts' list is small
22:09	asciilifeform	decimation: most of the parts aren't house
22:09	asciilifeform	they charge extra for the kitting
22:09	decimation	do they take ie digikey?
22:09	asciilifeform	takes most anything
22:09	asciilifeform	but adds days (they wait for order to come)
22:09	decimation	ah. so they order on your behalf?
22:09	asciilifeform	aha
22:09	mod6	<+jurov> mod6 sorry, dns problem, fixed << ahh, awesome. not a problem. Thanks!
22:09	asciilifeform	they outsource the boards too - took most of the time, it appears
22:10	asciilifeform	guessing it's somewhere slow - therefore american
22:10	decimation	cool. well, I'm glad it worked out for you. I suspect that this is probably being subsidized by bezzlars
22:10	asciilifeform	actually i've yet to plug them in...
22:10	asciilifeform	so won't say for certain that 'worked out' yet.
22:10	decimation	hehe true
22:10	decimation	actually now is the time to find prototyping services in europe or ru
22:11	decimation	with the strong dollar
22:11	asciilifeform	it is very easy to find manufacturing service. but mostly impossible to find one that does onesies economically
22:12	decimation	I wonder if they have heavy automation or cheap labor?
22:13	asciilifeform	claims the former
22:13	decimation	I'm dubious
22:13	decimation	someone has to load your custom parts
22:15	asciilifeform	decimation: there's exactly 1 through-hole part
22:15	asciilifeform	3 pads
22:16	asciilifeform	everything else is pick'n'place-able
22:16	PeterL	asciilifeform:the concept is meant to address an earlier thread - 'pashtun can make ak but rounds are still from izhevsk' << how about caseless rounds?
22:16	decimation	right, but how could it possibly be economical to load two parts into a pick n' place
22:16	decimation	might as well use your 'waldo'
22:20	asciilifeform	PeterL: dimensional tolerances
22:20	asciilifeform	PeterL: even worse problem
22:20	mircea_popescu	btw re computers and looms thread a coupla months back, i somehow forgot to mention the jacquard loom specifically.
22:20	mircea_popescu	the damned thing had cards. in 1801
22:20	decimation	asciilifeform: somewhat before babbage
22:21	asciilifeform	unit 1 is a dud
22:21	decimation	shucks
22:21	mod6	jurov: still doesn't seem to be working.
22:23	asciilifeform	unit 2 is a dud.
22:23	asciilifeform	motherfuckers.
22:23	mircea_popescu	aww.
22:23	decimation	sucks. is it a board issue?
22:23	mod6	asciilifeform: this is the device you ordered?
22:23	asciilifeform	i haven't the faintest clue
22:24	asciilifeform	it's an analogue circuit, will presumably find out
22:24	thestringpuller	http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2015/03/12/bitbeat-bitcoin-coder-garzik-signs-deal-to-deploy-bitsats-in-space/
22:26	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29950 @ 0.00032688 = 9.7901 BTC [+]
22:26	mircea_popescu	this should be interesting.
22:27	mircea_popescu	$1 million for one BitSat,
22:27	mircea_popescu	this does not sound rightsomehow
22:28	decimation	everyone and his mom in sillycon valley wants to loft a satellite constellation
22:28	decimation	what are they gonna use for the uplink/downlink frequencies? access equipment?
22:28	mircea_popescu	simpler problem : leaving aside the "Ever and ever" bs, even if you plan for 10 years you need tbs of hdd and gbs of ram. in space.
22:28	mircea_popescu	which means, shielded.
22:29	mircea_popescu	you're already talking half a ton of gear here. i didn't hear of aerospace material going for $200 / kg yet.
22:29	mircea_popescu	less than good tuna ? srsly ?
22:29	decimation	the attitude in the sillycon valley space complex these days is that you can just launch some more sats
22:29	Adlai	nah the blockchain will be in storj
22:29	mircea_popescu	lmao
22:30	decimation	also, it's not quite as big an issue since they are below the van allen belts
22:30	mircea_popescu	so wild pr piece, rly.
22:30	decimation	but it also means that the sats won't stay up very long
22:30	mircea_popescu	well which is ? ever and ever or $1mn / year ?
22:30	asciilifeform	moreover,
22:30	decimation	yeah $1 mn sounds too cheap
22:30	asciilifeform	not a single one of the rng submodules works.
22:30	mircea_popescu	i'm half tempted to do a "basics of satellites" like the hollywood and the corn one. however...
22:31	mircea_popescu	i suspect there are more experienced aerospace minds here. how about you do it instead ?
22:31	asciilifeform	!s reducing space mission cost
22:31	assbot	2 results for 'reducing space mission cost' : http://s.b-a.link/?q=reducing+space+mission+cost
22:31	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform shoulda ordered icecream :D
22:31	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: aha i'll bring ice cream to confIII
22:31	asciilifeform	l0l
22:31	mircea_popescu	btw... the icecream in this country... it can not be described.
22:32	mircea_popescu	it stands with the finest italian handmade gelateria in the same relation as this later beast stands with budweiser
22:32	decimation	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=17-09-2014#831933
22:32	assbot	Logged on 17-09-2014 02:27:20; decimation: herr walker believes this could be scaled: http://www.fourmilab.ch/documents/rocketaday.html << the nazis paid $13k 1945 dollars per V2
22:32	*	asciilifeform is floored by the sheer retardation. gave those idiots the simplest circuit in the world, as test
22:33	decimation	asciilifeform: they aren't gonna last very long if they can't deliver working circuits
22:33	asciilifeform	took'em almost a month, too
22:35	*	asciilifeform is not inclined to believe that it was accidental
22:35	wangxinxi	Have you guys heard of hedgy.co?
22:36	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform why not ?
22:39	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: both modules in both rng boards 100% dead
22:39	asciilifeform	without any visual signs of defect
22:40	asciilifeform	no visibly misaligned parts, no shorts
22:40	mircea_popescu	incompetence is the parsimonious explanation
22:40	decimation	asciilifeform: did you order these with all parts populated?
22:40	asciilifeform	decimation: yes
22:40	asciilifeform	decimation: these are ordinary rngs, as seen at conference II
22:40	asciilifeform	100% analogue
22:40	decimation	can't imagine it's that complex
22:40	asciilifeform	it isn't
22:40	decimation	sounds like a bad board to me
22:40	asciilifeform	two bad boards
22:41	asciilifeform	in entirely invisible way
22:41	decimation	which implies their turdware manged your design I suspec
		↖
22:41	asciilifeform	again, not in any way detectable to naked eye
22:41	asciilifeform	about to manually probe the components under microscope
22:41	asciilifeform	but conclusive test would involve desoldering them
22:42	BingoBoingo	Maybe the wrong shade of blue for the PCB is problematic?
22:42	decimation	heh
22:42	asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: no
22:42	*	asciilifeform was gonna order mainboard from these folks, to have in time for C III
22:42	asciilifeform	now going empty.
22:43	BingoBoingo	How do these fuckers expect to do a business off of 1-off boards when a two board order offers two dead boards
22:44	asciilifeform	BingoBoingo: i'll tell you how
22:44	asciilifeform	notice a sucker just paid'em 75 usd.
22:44	asciilifeform	me, that is
22:44	asciilifeform	because no alternative.
22:44	asciilifeform	it's exactly like the apple thread
22:44	decimation	presumably they will make you two more if it's their fault
22:45	asciilifeform	in another month
22:45	asciilifeform	and how the fuck do i prove whose fault
22:45	asciilifeform	and the game can be kept going as long as they like
22:46	thestringpuller	asciilifeform: can't you make them an offer they can't refuse?
22:49	asciilifeform	thestringpuller: if i could offer anyone anything, would not be having muppet problems
22:49	ben_vulpes	<mircea_popescu> btw... the icecream in this country... it can not be described. << so i expect: helado primo, vino tinto, y carne gargantua.
22:49	asciilifeform	so on first glance, their 470k resistors (0805 size) are actually 200k
22:49	asciilifeform	though they have the correct printing
22:49	asciilifeform	and that's just one piece.
22:49	thestringpuller	asciilifeform: i meant. you know "come to an understanding" if fuck ups occur?
22:50	thestringpuller	you're russian!
22:50	BingoBoingo	Prolly time to get some Chinese sweatshop workers into your shed with that H1B visa deal
22:52	thestringpuller	lol those poor chinese workers. dunno if asciilifeform is as benevolent of slave driver as mircea_popescu
22:56	asciilifeform	470 and 200
22:56	asciilifeform	(not k)
22:56	asciilifeform	incidentally, 'house parts'
22:59	danielpbarron	!up NewLiberty
22:59	decimation	lol they put 200 on the 470k pads?
22:59	asciilifeform	no
23:00	asciilifeform	their 470 (not k) resistors are marked correctly (470) but have resistance of 200.
23:00	asciilifeform	and that is -only one- problem
23:00	asciilifeform	i have not even bothered to look at the rest of it
23:00	asciilifeform	this was not part of the deal
23:01	ben_vulpes	they're more efficient
23:01	ben_vulpes	you didn't need to burn that current anyways
23:01	ben_vulpes	it's like i tell the boys
23:01	ben_vulpes	"look, we're ording from a taco shop. the tacos cost a dollar fifty a pop. they're not going to be pleased with crazy custom orders, so cut it out.
23:01	ben_vulpes	"
23:02	ben_vulpes	extra cilantro get out of here
23:02	decimation	ben_vulpes: yeah except in this case, the taco stand bills itself as a custom taco stand
23:02	ben_vulpes	sure
23:03	ben_vulpes	and their tacos are clocking in at .75 per, to extend the metaphor.
23:03	ben_vulpes	outrageous claims are outrageous.
23:03	asciilifeform	it isn't even about the money as such
23:03	asciilifeform	i would have gladly paid 4x more if guaranteed working.
23:03	asciilifeform	as in - hard guarantee
23:04	asciilifeform	as in, i get a head on a stake if doesn't work
23:04	ben_vulpes	glhf. not happening.
23:04	danielpbarron	i guess there's an obvious reason as to why they can't do whatever tests you are doing before they ship the things
23:04	asciilifeform	that's the idea here
23:04	thestringpuller	asciilifeform: http://www.quickmeme.com/img/32/32b4229145de0a2c1171b9b5757f25dfaa1bbf7b9be0b687be4dd5aec76a34d6.jpg
23:04	asciilifeform	danielpbarron: obvious idea is obvious
23:04	danielpbarron	it's intentional :<
23:04	decimation	testing boards is a whole other layer of complexity
23:04	ben_vulpes	shouldn't be, really.
23:04	decimation	could be done, but not over mass production of one-offs
23:04	asciilifeform	however, no one cancelled physics
23:05	ben_vulpes	no, it should be easy, decimation.
23:05	asciilifeform	testing that board corresponds to given gerber mask is trivial
23:05	asciilifeform	testing that parts have their marked values - also trivial
23:05	asciilifeform	testing that they are actually attached - harder, but also doable
23:05	decimation	yeah good point
23:05	asciilifeform	they do not need to know what it does!
23:05	decimation	I'm surprised the pick n place doesn't auto test passives actually
23:05	asciilifeform	decimation: rubber suction cup, typically
23:06	ben_vulpes	the tooling investment to make this feasible for every board sent through a given shop is non trivial though, ibid for customer education.
23:06	asciilifeform	decimation: interestingly, in the old days, they were brass, and shaped in such a way that -did- test
23:06	asciilifeform	some of the german machines from the '80s, when computer sucked, did this
23:06	asciilifeform	i even had opportunity to buy one
23:06	asciilifeform	for a few $k
23:06	asciilifeform	but no place to put it
23:06	asciilifeform	so passed it up
23:07	asciilifeform	fella even reserve-engineered the controle console, wrote own proggy, would have thrown in the source
23:07	asciilifeform	but i had no climate-controlled space where it could fit.
23:07	decimation	yeah, failing to insert proper part in the tube is electronics manufacturing 101 error
23:07	asciilifeform	decimation: again, that was NOT what happened
23:07	asciilifeform	the fucker is marked 470.
23:07	asciilifeform	marked.
23:07	ben_vulpes	during my days in the wafer biz the shop for whom i slaved had a high-res testing machine that could test arbitrary board designs
23:07	decimation	heh
23:07	decimation	so you suspect that they bought shitass chinese parts?
23:08	asciilifeform	i have no idea where they got them
23:08	asciilifeform	and for all i know the rest of the board also has no correspondence whatsoever to marked values
23:08	ben_vulpes	the only reasonable conclusion is that someone at the nsa is gaslighting alf
		↖
23:08	decimation	ben_vulpes: sure, for arbitrary $$$ can be done
23:08	cazalla	poor shrem, 2 years ago paraded around as the bitcoin millionaire kid, but today relegated to begging for $10 so as not to eat the prison food http://charlieshrem.com/so-im-going-to-prison/
23:08	assbot	So, I’m going to prison. Reflections from Bitcoins’ first felon | Charlie Shrem ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9S3sT )
23:09	cazalla	"I will need the support of everyone while inside, and I would appreciate it so much. Even $10 would go along way. There are a few days to send me money."
23:10	decimation	asciilifeform should send him some smoked sprat
23:10	asciilifeform	idiot does not deserve one sprat
23:11	decimation	heh
23:11	asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: there is a reason why i am building own conveyor
23:11	asciilifeform	but it isn't happening in time for c3
23:11	asciilifeform	and the motherfuckers knew that, of course.
23:11	decimation	noisy chump falls into the noisy usg chumpatron, news at 11
23:11	ben_vulpes	news at 11
23:12	ben_vulpes	hey noisy chump what travel bezzle are you using to procure tickets to con3?
23:12	*	asciilifeform also chumped, out of 75 bux. did not really expect the thing to work
23:12	*	asciilifeform grinds in gears
23:12	decimation	asciilifeform: it appears you can RMA the thing
23:12	decimation	might as well turn the chumpatron wheel
23:12	asciilifeform	decimation: aha lol sure. these are going in my butterfly collection.
23:13	asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: lessee
23:13	asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: 'copa airlines'
23:13	ben_vulpes	purchased direct?
23:13	asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: and 'aerolineas argentinas'
23:13	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51108 @ 0.00033045 = 16.8886 BTC [+] {3}
23:14	asciilifeform	ben_vulpes: nah through 'orbitz'
23:14	decimation	re: argentinean aviation: http://www.miamiherald.com/entertainment/celebrities/article13640420.html
23:14	assbot	Crew was filming when helicopters crashed in Argentina | Miami Herald Miami Herald ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9SnYQ )
23:15	ben_vulpes	so i just received my new passport
23:16	ben_vulpes	i'll admit to shitting more than a single brix over its issuance, given my presence here and name change froofraw.
23:16	decimation	ben_vulpes, asciilifeform: http://www.faa.gov/about/initiatives/iasa/ < usg says that ar civil aviation bureaucracy is rated "1"
23:16	assbot	International Aviation Safety Assessment (IASA) Program ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9SvaB )
23:16	ben_vulpes	fuckers declined to send me back my court papers and expired passport.
23:16	decimation	ben_vulpes: I think you can pay to expedite
23:17	ben_vulpes	despite! claims all over forms that supporting docs will be returned with issued passport.
23:17	ben_vulpes	decimation: i'm aware.
23:17	ben_vulpes	that part was unnecessary, and risks putting one in the 'extra scrutiny' bin as i see it.
23:17	ben_vulpes	anyways
23:17	ben_vulpes	i have the *passport*
23:17	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051059 << likeliest explanation
23:17	assbot	Logged on 13-03-2015 02:41:13; decimation: which implies their turdware manged your design I suspec
23:17	ben_vulpes	but my *other* documents.
23:17	ben_vulpes	mircea_popescu: no you see, the lizard shitgnomes got to it
23:17	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: again, there is no detectable trace of a mistake in their procedure or in the physical board
23:18	decimation	ben_vulpes: did your passport come with 'rfid condom'?
23:18	thestringpuller	LOLOL
23:18	ben_vulpes	lol no plain book
23:18	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: there is at least one part where all four instances differ by a factor of ~2 from the marked value.
23:18	asciilifeform	MARKED value
23:18	decimation	ben_vulpes: the state dept faq claims they issue one with each
23:18	thestringpuller	decimation: i thought all passports had RFID chips in them
23:18	asciilifeform	on the thing itself
23:18	ben_vulpes	decimation: by 'condom' i assume you mean faraday cage?
23:18	decimation	yes
23:18	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform well... the cutout of the two boards sounds like a great blogpost.
23:18	mircea_popescu	write the whole story, send them a link.
23:19	decimation	'metallized' paper bag
23:19	ben_vulpes	decimation: lol no.
23:19	ben_vulpes	std us mail envelope
23:19	mircea_popescu	decimation what's an ungrounded faraday cage supposed to do again ?
23:19	mircea_popescu	or do these new passprots come with a rail contact ?
23:19	decimation	like so http://www.idstronghold.com/
23:19	assbot	RFID Wallet | Identity Stronghold | Credit Card Sleeve ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9SDqG )
23:19	ben_vulpes	ssn and passport number no doubt lifted en route
23:19	decimation	it's not a true faraday cage, but it will attenuate
23:20	ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: what l33t deelz did you find? the best i'm offered is ~1.3k rt
23:20	thestringpuller	someone finds a 900 rt from US that'd be dope
23:21	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 56800 @ 0.00034124 = 19.3824 BTC [+] {2}
23:21	thestringpuller	as long as I don't have to sit between two fat people
23:21	ben_vulpes	do any of you know anything about relational schema design? i'm derping on a thing and would like to run an early early early schema draft by someone who actually understands relational dbs.
23:21	ben_vulpes	trinque's already helped with it, but i'm looking for more eyes
23:21	decimation	actually I think the new 'chip n pin' implementation for credit cards in the us is rf-id based
23:22	decimation	so you gotta buy a stack of these
23:22	ben_vulpes	(project is relational modeling of blockchain, for the curious)
23:23	ben_vulpes	(it'll be done in two weeks, i swear)
23:23	mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes ibidem actually means "in the same place". if you mean idem (ie, the same) say idem!
23:24	ben_vulpes	!
23:24	decimation	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-01-2015#991265 http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=25-01-2015#991268
23:24	assbot	Logged on 25-01-2015 06:52:34; asciilifeform: chain of pointers << tree.
23:24	assbot	Logged on 25-01-2015 06:53:07; asciilifeform: (satoshi did not go in for book-learning, it seems, esp. re: data structures, but that doesn't mean that we have to forget school)
23:25	ben_vulpes	right.
23:25	ben_vulpes	i want it in a database, though.
23:26	ben_vulpes	the storage on disk is a thing of import, no doubt.
23:26	ben_vulpes	but a *queryable* blockchain is something else entirely.
23:26	mircea_popescu	incidentally, i wonder if one could make a filesystem specifically for blockchain storage.
23:26	decimation	yeah I don't have enough database design experience to comment on that
23:27	mircea_popescu	there's absolutely no doubt this will be the largest usecase for harddrives going forward
23:27	ben_vulpes	mircea_popescu: i grow more and more tempted every day to use postgres as a filesystem.
23:27	mircea_popescu	and as they become obsolete in the future, ppl not wanting to upgrade their bitcoin archives will provide hdds with one of those ada or lisp-esque eternal lives.
23:27	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: filesystem specifically for blockchain storage << i spoke of this, right here in #b-a
23:28	mircea_popescu	ben_vulpes im not informed enough to guess, but maybe a "best of both words" hybrid could thrive.
23:28	assbot	[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30100 @ 0.0003485 = 10.4899 BTC [+] {2}
23:28	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform either i missed it or forgot it!
23:28	ben_vulpes	lol no i
23:28	asciilifeform	'That is very strange indeed. All of the house parts we currently carry are supplied by Digikey and Mouser, and are name-brand parts. At this moment, we only stock and only order parts from US vendors who are authorized vendors for the components we purchase. (This is why our BoM tool will often list parts as unavailable, even if they can be found at non-US or non-authorized dealers.)
23:28	asciilifeform	I will have our reels of 470 Ohm resistors verified first thing in the morning. I'd like to send you a return label in the morning to send the boards back, so that we can review the work on the boards and verify and replace any parts which are not testing at their required values. Additionally, this step would help us to determine what has gone wrong in the assembly and why your components are not operating within specificati
23:28	asciilifeform	on to prevent any future issues. If you are able to provide us a test procedure, we will be happy to use that to verify the boards before sending them back to you.'
23:28	ben_vulpes	nor* i
23:28	asciilifeform	^ macrofab inc.
23:28	NewLiberty	ben_vulpes: "Gweedo" did quite a bit of RDBM crunching of the block chain for a project of his, he had many failures and learned much
23:28	decimation	asciilifeform: well at least they replied promptly
23:28	ben_vulpes	NewLiberty: who now?
23:28	asciilifeform	'I will ship them back, but I needed working sample units -this week-.
23:28	asciilifeform	Not a month from now.
23:28	asciilifeform	And now I don't have them.
23:28	asciilifeform	And was going to order another, much larger, device made at your shop,
23:28	asciilifeform	but now find it very hard to believe that it will work to spec, before
23:28	asciilifeform	the deadline.' -- me
23:28	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform they sound very nice you know ? i'd send them the boards an' detail.
23:29	mircea_popescu	omg stop being so petulant eh!
23:29	ben_vulpes	asciilifeform: if you're spending 75 dollars, you didn't need them at all sheesh
23:29	ben_vulpes	you're not siemens, you don't swing 500m in legal fees every quarter, you don't get to go over the bills with a fine toothed comb etc
23:29	*	mircea_popescu makes mental note : if alf spends time anticipating a nice itam and then doesn't get it, alf gets very pissy!
23:30	asciilifeform	now mostly pissed at self for falling for this nonsense
23:30	ben_vulpes	happy to spend thousands on worthless arcana tho :P
23:30	mircea_popescu	NewLiberty what ever happened to that guy ? still around ?
23:30	mircea_popescu	!up NewLiberty
23:30	ben_vulpes	!up NewLiberty
23:30	NewLiberty	Yes, he is still around
23:30	asciilifeform	no one can offer this particular good for the advertised price.
23:30	NewLiberty	Not so much on BCT, more on CryptoCrypt
23:30	asciilifeform	wondered what was the catch - turns out, this.
23:30	mod6	<+mircea_popescu> incidentally, i wonder if one could make a filesystem specifically for blockchain storage. << i definately wanna discuss this.
23:30	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform seriously, send them the things, gotta help em. they're new.
23:31	asciilifeform	funnily, if it were a digital device (e.g., the mainboard) it'd have probably worked
23:31	asciilifeform	mircea_popescu: i will
23:31	mircea_popescu	mod6 if you write a spec or something ima read it, for whatever good that's gonna do
23:31	mircea_popescu	asciilifeform cool.
23:31	NewLiberty	He was doing a rdbs project with open API for folks that want cloud nodes but didn't want to run them.
23:31	*	decimation was hoping to send them some analog designs, was waiting to see what happened to ascii after he entered the chumpatron
23:32	NewLiberty	sort of like chain.com but open
23:32	mod6	mircea_popescu: ok thanks!
23:32	asciilifeform	on the flip side, all the folks who laughed at me for slowly grunting to build own p&p fab, can begin to consider stopping laughing now...
23:33	NewLiberty	His latest project though was for a bitcoin webcam company, pretty girls and such
23:33	decimation	I think the 'waldo' device is a great idea for building small prototypes
23:35	NewLiberty	https://goseemybits.com/
23:35	assbot	GoSeeMyBits.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9TAzf )
23:37	NewLiberty	I was an rdb wonk but my expertise is a decade or so stale.
23:43	mircea_popescu	that is good right ? past decade all gunk ?
23:50	BingoBoingo	asciilifeform: When you grow more shiva hands may I suggest a hobby? Photograph pine trees. Contemplate which one when converted to stake best matches each shitgnomism.
23:52	decimation	BingoBoingo: asciilifeform need only drive a few hours south to see the perfect stake-pine, the loblolly https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinus_taeda
23:52	assbot	Pinus taeda - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9USue )
23:53	decimation	for mounting the convicted at the appropriate height pour encourager les autres
23:55	mircea_popescu	https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DtZ6hjiJmTU
23:55	assbot	Frank Zappa - Broken Hearts are for Assholes (Live) - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9Vdgm )
23:57	mircea_popescu	http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-03-2015#1051148 << a whole team.
23:57	assbot	Logged on 13-03-2015 03:08:17; ben_vulpes: the only reasonable conclusion is that someone at the nsa is gaslighting alf
23:58	decimation	apparently the police shot some bum the wash dc subway http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/crime/shooting-in-metro-system-dc-police-say/2015/03/12/8f3abf6e-c921-11e4-b2a1-bed1aaea2816_story.html
23:58	assbot	Metro Transit Police fatally shoot man in Potomac Avenue station’s tunnel - The Washington Post ... ( http://bit.ly/1E9VwI6 )

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