#trilema | 2015-07-13

It's about aesthetics

00:07

aesthetics or anesthetics?

00:08

http://breakingdefense.com/2015/07/army-details-cuts-alaska-georgia-texas-hit-hardest/

00:08

Army Cuts Hit Alaska, Georgia, Texas Hardest « Breaking Defense - Defense industry news, analysis and commentary ... ( http://bit.ly/1fBnsjr )

00:13

" “At that point,” Allyn continued, “we will no longer be capable of fulfilling our responsibilities in accordance with the national security strategy.” " << Maybe they should bring some troops home from around the world?

00:14

meh, hire Triple Canopy.

00:14

PeterL: Totally about aesthetics

00:15

this reduction in force has been planned for a decade

00:15

by... politicians

00:16

well, the army is the biggest item in the budget, so if you want to make a dent it is the obvious place to start

00:21

my understanding is that the long term plan has been to reduce the size of conventional troops to pay for more stuff in the socom budget

00:21

since rumsfeld/bush

00:24

oglafbot

http://oglaf.com/synod/

00:24

Cadaver Synod ... ( http://bit.ly/1O54gpA )

00:24

BingoBoingo: http://cryptome.org/2015/07/force-052-050.pdf << carl force confiscations

00:24

... ( http://bit.ly/1O54fCg )

00:24

asciilifeform: ty

00:25

PeterL, hey congrats! missus and i banged it out a few times last month trying for another.. find out if it took this week

00:25

^ long live the waterfall, aha

00:25

it's funner if it takes longer

00:25

or will it pay for tx fees once gavinspam runs short of oldcoinz ?

00:25

(letting blocks fall under 950kB is out of the question, dontchaknow)

00:28

what medication is that guy on? anti-depressants?

00:28

asciilifeform: My guess is txfeespam

00:30

http://cryptome.org/2015-info/poor-door-nyc/poor-door-nyc.htm << also lulzy

00:30

... ( http://bit.ly/1O54YDn )

00:30

*

asciilifeform did not know ^ existed

~ 20 minutes ~

00:50

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 13850 @ 0.00054017 = 7.4814 BTC [+] {2}

00:52

poor door is SOP in larger US cities

~ 35 minutes ~

01:27

;;later tell peterl congrats. boy or girl ?

01:27

The operation succeeded.

01:28

gernika certainly a good objection.

01:28

seems beyond fucking stupid to frame that discussion in terms of banning tobacco. or for that matter, banning tobacco.

01:29

nevertheless, obese people are an offense to humanity.

01:30

and speaking of motivation to act healthy - http://31.media.tumblr.com/970b9af35bd767902b45116e3b5ab04a/tumblr_n7k8g6t70m1rl2fgko1_500.gif

01:30

... ( http://bit.ly/1SipssW )

01:42

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 34268 @ 0.00053256 = 18.2498 BTC [-]

01:47

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15826 @ 0.00053256 = 8.4283 BTC [-]

01:56

SO finally got 0.7.2 ish built on OpenBSD 5.6 again. Turns out the problem this whole week was pointing at the wrong BDB version

~ 33 minutes ~

02:30

mthreat

I just found out the search.b-a server is down until my friend pays the bill. sorry, search won't work until then.

02:30

mthreat

I'm going to move it to a different server soon to avoid this problem.

02:35

;;isup qntra.net

02:35

qntra.net is down

~ 43 minutes ~

03:19

mthreat send you a btc to help bills along ?

03:19

cazalla lookin into it

03:27

206.144.86.90 - - [13/Jul/2015:02:19:37 -0400] "GET /2015/02/ceo-of-bitcoin-exchange-killed-in-thailand/ HTTP/1.1" 200 6182 "http://qntra.net/" "PHP/5.{3|2}.{1|2|3|4|5|6|7|8|9|0}{1|2|3|4|5|6|7|8|9|0}"

03:27

lol somebody doesn't grok this entire regex thing

03:33

"Greece 'strikes deal with creditors' after all-night talks finally end in agreement following 17 hours of tense negotiations "

03:33

what's the highlights ?

03:33

you know, same deal as the one people voted off as "NO"

03:34

lol.

03:34

but now we've killed all trust in banks

03:34

oxicodone.

03:34

which is a good thing of course

03:34

eh, trust.

03:34

maybe they wanna buy up Greece before the "long winter" ?

03:34

aren't these the same banks that stole 90% of cypriot funds a coupla years ago ? what trust.

03:35

nobody has "any trust" of the theoretical verbal kind in banks, then they go use them 100%

03:35

much like idiot couples that "can't stand each other" to hear them talk, but then go have bad sex twice a week.

03:36

I don't see how they can remove capital controls anytime soon without... going more bankrupt?

03:39

it's probably coming out of land values.

03:40

what's a thousand sq ft in downtown athens go for these days ?

03:41

no idea, but the europeans have been eyeing all that land owned by greek church

03:41

o

03:41

that gotta go.

03:45

they'll definitely sell off the telecom company to ze germans, which owns most cables and rents them out to the private telecoms

03:46

the eternal dilemma of the margins : self owned by the local idiots ? or by a distant, thus disinterested if actually competent empire.

03:47

Deutsche Telekom owns 40% already

03:47

"Since I am no longer at the helm of UO, lets look at where it has gone in my absence. Elves and ninjas have been added into the game, things I specifically had banned. This is only a small example of why and how Ultima has drifted away from Richard Garriott, but I have not drifted away from Ultima. Overused, irrelevant & reused RPG elements are not the essence of my Ultimate RPG.

03:47

03:47

It is clear to me that I, Richard Garriott, am an essential ingredient of at least the Ultimate Ultima, if not more broadly the Ultimate RPG. Perhaps one day, now that the people who pushed me out of EA more than a decade ago are long since gone, EA will recognize that together, we could rebuild that franchise in a way that they have failed to do in the intervening years. Richard Garriott is an essential ingredient in

03:47

the Ultimate Ultima!"

03:47

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 22756 @ 0.00053256 = 12.1189 BTC [-]

03:48

for every actual steve jobs...

03:49

is that the portalarium guy?

03:50

well, legendary ultima creator, lord british etc. yes.

03:50

all the old game devs are trying to crowdfund games these days

03:51

idiots even bought back rights to Carmageddon

03:52

when it rains money, who's not gonna spare a pail ?

03:53

anyway, guy sold origin for 30mn. fucking nuts.

03:53

imagine, origin worth 30mn in 1992, watsap worth 20 bn in 2014.

04:01

I don't remember playing any of his games, were they good?

04:11

supposedly ultima online was major. i never really got into the series.

04:11

;;later tell whaack ever got it to run ?

04:11

The operation succeeded.

04:23

http://www.gamesradar.com/why-do-we-keep-forgiving-double-fine/

04:23

Why do we keep forgiving Double Fine? | GamesRadar ... ( http://bit.ly/1TwqmV0 )

~ 18 minutes ~

04:42

punkman: So now that there's a deal do you want to write up Greece again?

04:43

dat piece o shit site. 3k lines page, content starts at line 798

04:47

aaaaand by line 862 the schmuck's rehashed the same intro three times while proposing his spin on it also three times. substantiation is still implicitly promised but i lost hope of delivery and who the fuck is the author anyway ?

04:47

unemployed lousy public school teachers on the rampage.

04:49

heh

04:50

BingoBoingo: maybe end of this week, no reason to cover the derps move-by-move

04:50

Alright

04:51

when did this become a discursive style anyway, "general statement, unsubstantiated claim, restatement of general statement, restatement of unsubstantiated claim, second restatement of general statement, second restatement of unsubstantiated claim, and then move into "we" territory.

04:51

what fucking we.

04:51

the psychology of crowdfunders ^

~ 34 minutes ~

05:26

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 14400 @ 0.00051355 = 7.3951 BTC [-]

~ 42 minutes ~

06:09

scoopbot_revived

An image worth ten thousand words of sadness. http://trilema.com/2015/an-image-worth-ten-thousand-words-of-sadness/

06:11

"One intriguing detail with the EU statement: as part of market reforms designed to boost the economy, Greece will have to bring in Sunday trading hours."

06:25

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 17814 @ 0.00051757 = 9.22 BTC [+] {2}

~ 24 minutes ~

06:49

;;isup qntra.net

06:49

qntra.net is down

~ 22 minutes ~

07:12

jurov, did ml barf at my last email?

07:14

gpg: BAD signature from "punkman"

07:14

I wrapped at 74 columns before signing :/

07:15

try copying from sent mail and verifying

07:17

there are zillions of way how mail clients try to be helpful with autoformatting body text, not just wordwrap

07:17

better be safe and send clearsigned stuff as first attachment

07:17

^ explanation also for ben_vulpes

07:20

ok, it worked now

07:21

what was it?

07:21

I suppose squirrelmail did something to the message

07:22

one client that can be easily configured and relied on to keep body text intact, is kmail. maybe that's why kdepim shitgnome devs (reportedly) use thunderbird instead :D

07:23

made this patch with "git diff", hope it works

07:24

looks fine. pls, what version it applies on ?

07:24

oh thermonuke

07:29

still not added to http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/patches.html .. this is hopeless

07:29

... ( http://bit.ly/1GZZDZT )

07:29

i'm tempted to just abandon it ane let someone else try making turdatron_revived

07:30

how did I break patches.html?

07:30

not you

07:31

it's most likely my cancerous addon to gnu mailman that failed to process it

07:31

maybe it doesn't like git diff output?

07:31

it does not read the patch at all

07:32

if you sent lenna_full.jpg and lenna_full.jpg.sig it should add them to list, too

07:33

my .sig verifies right?

07:33

just checked.. it does not

07:34

wtf

07:35

it checks at your side?

07:35

yes

07:36

http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/2015-July/000122.html the sha1sums of your files are as shown here?

07:36

... ( http://bit.ly/1fCl6kl )

07:36

also works if I download .sig and --verify it

07:36

haven't you updated your key recently?

07:37

hmm I downloaded .patch attachment and it fails indeed

07:37

check the sums pls

07:38

if different, send me your ones and upload the patch, say, to dpaste for me to compare

07:39

I think something stripped a newline at eof

07:40

there is one empty line in the end of received .patch

07:44

I see sent patch ending with "}\n " and original with "}\n \n"

07:44

*

punkman flaps hands

07:44

*

jurov flails hands

07:46

cancer, indeed

07:49

does it work with --sign --armor files?

07:49

no it expects detached sigs

~ 16 minutes ~

08:06

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26900 @ 0.00051222 = 13.7787 BTC [-] {2}

08:11

it stripped the last newline from readme_s.txt as well

08:21

well if it doesn't reject files that don't match .sig, I could just put them in a tar.gz

08:24

it won't reject any files, it just won't track them either

08:24

The solution to this problem really seems to be all of the retarded mail clients.

08:27

guess I should try sending with mutt

08:27

BingoBoingo: what do you mean?

08:27

punkman: it was squirrelmail that removed these newlines?

08:28

There's just a huge disconnect between how people expect their mail client to behave and how they actually do

08:28

punkman pls check the outgoing folder (if you have any), we need to know what caused this

08:29

jurov, well I assume turdatron didn't do this, so must be squirrel or something inbetween

08:29

and i assume turdatron did. so let's get rid of these assumptions, don the gloves and check what's there

08:30

it won't help me if you resend .tar.gz and forget

08:30

the attachments in my "sent" folder had stripped newlines

08:31

okay. so it's squirrelmail, thanks for info

08:31

trying to google "squirrelmail strips newlines" and I get nothing though

08:31

and that's why i put "check if your outgoiug mail verifies" in the manual nobody reads

08:32

!s squirrelmail

08:33

: http://s.b-a.link/?q=squirrelmail

08:33

oh search down again?

08:35

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199092

08:35

Logged on 13-07-2015 06:30:15; mthreat: I just found out the search.b-a server is down until my friend pays the bill. sorry, search won't work until then.

08:37

what a flashback to rg times "nm, phriend pays" :)

08:41

Oh, before my time

08:44

basically, rg IPOed bitvps, happily paid divs, even submitted something resmbling monthly reports at first... until DC subscription ran out and nobody was around to pay it in fiat

08:49

heh

08:49

that's what happens when you let a 12yo run a business

08:50

those of you who are familiar with romance languages (mircea_popescu, davout, etc) may find this Canadian road sign amusing: http://i.imgur.com/GAdlYEM.jpg

08:50

... ( http://bit.ly/1GhfOQh )

08:52

(literal translation of french: "men's holes on the students")

~ 1 hours 31 minutes ~

10:24

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 15100 @ 0.0005184 = 7.8278 BTC [+]

10:33

punkman: http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/btc-dev/attachments/20150713/punkman_debug_sanity_part1_f0023d64470b05705a891da5b52bb1c24eed955b.patch << neato

10:33

... ( http://bit.ly/1HqpgCT )

10:33

punkman: but, tell me this, what was the rationale for nuking the random rpc pw generator thing ?

10:33

asciilifeform: not particularly needed is it?

10:34

imho it was precisely the correct thing. i don't use remote rpc, i don't give a fuck what the pw is so long as it can't be guessed

10:34

can put it back

10:34

and i don't relish having to create it manually on every new machine

10:34

punkman: well, not necessarily put it back, but think of whether there might be a more elegant pill

10:35

conf generator bash script that generates one?

10:35

aha

10:35

in that spirit.

10:35

keep in mind that not all systems will have bash

10:35

(iirc my pogo build does not)

10:35

nor perl, etc

10:36

put it in makefile?

10:36

i'm not even sure how to do this, other than in c, on a machine with no bash, perl, python, etc

10:37

for now i'd just let that thing live

10:38

other nitpick: the removal of the wx cruft is spiffy - it was next on my personal list. but i'd replace InitMessage with fprintf(FOO, ..... with FOO equalling stdout by default. this is because we might one day have a device with a character lcd screen, or teletype, or whatnot, and preserving the semantics of 'this is an init message' isn't entirely useless

10:39

InitMessage already had printf next to it

10:39

ah hm

10:39

what a crock of shit this thing was, from day 1...

10:40

perhaps some things that go to stderr currently, should also go to debug log

10:40

ideally it'd all go to debug.log

10:41

it's still a mess, will need debug_sanity_part2.patch

10:41

what's in that one ?

10:41

nothing yet

10:42

and what's the deal with removing ShrinkDebugFile ?

10:42

I remember people complaining about that

10:42

it needs to be switchable off, yes

10:42

but if it is absent entirely, log will fill disk

10:42

if you wanna logrotate, there's logrotate?

10:43

one more MB of shit for pogo rom ?

10:43

no thx

10:43

ok so I'll resubmit with those two back in

10:43

better solution is loglevels

10:43

max retains all, as your version does

10:43

min produces no log whatsoever

10:44

this one was on my list.

10:44

but i'm very much behind with my list.

10:44

what's inbetween min/max?

10:44

the replacement of various 'if debug ...'-isms

10:45

these are to be displayed on max, but not on 'normal'

10:45

if(fDebug) is not used much though

10:45

was gonna add verbosity in various spots, also, for 'max'

10:46

still, nice work punkman

10:47

i was certain i'd have to do this bit of cleaning myself, and it is a pleasant surprise not having to

10:47

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199135 << wouldjabelieve i played the whole series ~BUT~ for 9 and 'Online' ?

10:47

Logged on 13-07-2015 08:11:27; mircea_popescu: supposedly ultima online was major. i never really got into the series.

10:47

yes, especially loved the 1980s (commodore-64!) through '5'

10:48

but i never got into mmporgs at all. what sort of game is it where player is not the hero!

10:49

i can sorta picture the appeal of eulora, by imagining it as a kind of animated #b-a

10:49

but items like 'ultima online' never got me hot&bothered

10:50

asciilifeform: hello again, did you get my links above?

10:50

solrodar: aha

10:50

where's the recipe?

10:50

at the top of the script

10:51

neato

10:51

;;later tell mircea_popescu as soon as somebody reports a successful replication of solrodar's recipe, imho he ought get the prize

10:51

The operation succeeded.

10:52

where's the link?

10:52

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1198987

10:52

Logged on 13-07-2015 00:02:06; solrodar: asciilifeform: http://178.62.64.22/dot-filter.py and http://178.62.64.22/bitcoin.sexpr

10:52

the latter being the output of the former

10:53

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199110 << re: banks, they are a furniture in the jail. so i apply solzhenitsyn's formula, 'НЕ верь, НЕ бойся, НЕ проси' - don't trust, don't fear, don't ask anything of it.

10:53

Logged on 13-07-2015 07:35:15; mircea_popescu: nobody has "any trust" of the theoretical verbal kind in banks, then they go use them 100%

10:54

worthy to note that greece always had huge cash economy

10:54

some folks have the meatwot to avoid or mostly avoid fiat banks. (a few of them here, iirc.) good for them.

10:54

punkman: so does usa

10:54

but not everybody gets to be part of it.

10:56

solrodar: there is information loss in your s-expression output.

10:57

in particular, i have no idea how many times function x calls y

10:57

nor do the 'edges' specify in what direction goes the flow

10:57

(is this standardized and implicit ?)

10:57

the order is source and destination

10:57

aha thx

10:58

then this is usable.

10:58

are those nodes the filtered ones?

10:58

looks like it

10:59

yes, and overloads and template expansions have been merged into single nodes

10:59

if you don't want that then you can comment out the call to merge_overloads

11:00

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199113 << there is an interesting caveat, which is that land prices in the nato reich are proclaimed 'too big to fail' in the sense that they will never be permitted to fall into where a schmuck can buy a serious land holding

11:00

Logged on 13-07-2015 07:39:32; mircea_popescu: it's probably coming out of land values.

11:01

e.g., near where i live there is baltimore, md. a city where there are 5k usd plots of land. but i go and try to buy, and learn that it comes with a $maxint obligation to clean, build, guard...

11:01

fuck that

11:02

but logic suggests that if it were not for this 'small print', it'd be the same 200k as in washington

11:02

in that sense, all cheap real estate is a mirage. if it could be had for $smallint, a speculator would already own it.

11:03

(a large, industrial speculator, that is)

11:04

*

asciilifeform bll

11:04

*

asciilifeform bbl

11:16

punkman: thanks for your patch submission!

11:17

I tried to patch it in as it says in your email, but hit a snag in src/wallet.cpp -- any idea what might be going wrong here? : http://dpaste.com/24ZM2S0.txt

11:17

... ( http://bit.ly/1K3XjE5 )

11:18

mod6: try adding a newline at end of .patch file

11:19

there alredy was one there. i can add a new one, but then ofc your sha1 wont match. no worries, will try.

11:20

mail client ate last line which was part of diff context

11:21

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 28278 @ 0.00051208 = 14.4806 BTC [-] {2}

11:23

ok, so there is an 0a at the end of the file. tail doens't show it, but when I open it in ViM it's there... weird!: dpaste.com/0F8R1VJ.txt

11:24

punkman: just resend it with another mail client

11:24

I'll send new one with asciilifeform's suggestions

11:25

alright, cool. thx!

11:30

mod6, when you have a moment, could you have a look at my_snprintf, strprintf and error() in util.cpp? do we need all that?

~ 18 minutes ~

11:48

punkman: yeah, sure. i'll take a closer look at it here in just a bit. that work?

11:57

might be better to use `diff -uNr a b` on your changes as opposed to `git --diff` too.

11:57

or `diff --git` w/e.

12:07

makes it /slightly/ easier to read.

12:09

i have no idea why (as a lot of things in this code) this is done: btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/src/util.h#0080

12:09

so getting rid of that and just calling vsnprintf looks fine to me.

12:10

*

mod6 looks at others.

12:19

mod6: that's the output of "git diff -p" command. I don't see any differences besides the "index d91d969..6b38259 100644" sections.

12:26

if nothing else could you try with `git diff -pU`?

12:27

mod6 i happen to know exactly why _vsnprintf, it's windowsism

12:27

the main annoying thing here is that we see (ex): @@ -77,7 +72,6 @@ T* alignup(T* p)

12:27

type of stuff

12:27

jurov: ahh, ok didn't know that.

12:28

it's in std lib http://www.cplusplus.com/reference/cstdio/vsnprintf/

12:28

vsnprintf - C++ Reference ... ( http://bit.ly/1gxiRPC )

12:29

wanted to use snprintf in a win school project, had to call it as _snprintf

12:29

yeah, `man 3 printf`

12:29

never did further research why m$ did this

12:30

neither did satoshi, apparently :D

12:41

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 53650 @ 0.0005184 = 27.8122 BTC [+]

12:41

punkman: your changes to strprintf, error and my_snprintf to utilize vsnprintf directly look fine. I see in FormatException you changed snprintf to my_snprintf, which is apparently designed to be "safer".

12:41

Looks related to this: Concerning the return value of snprintf(), SUSv2 and C99 contradict each other: when snprintf() is called with size=0 then SUSv2 stipulates an unspecified return value less than 1, while C99 allows str to be NULL in this case, and gives the

12:42

return value (as always) as the number of characters that would have been written in case the output string has been large enough. SUSv3 and later align their specification of snprintf() with C99.

12:42

Is that the rationale there?

12:43

mod6, I just thought I'd remove some useless #defines, I got absolutely no clue what's going on there

12:46

looks like error(const std::string &&format, ...) does the same gyrations as around _vsnprintf/vsnprintf as my_snprintf. which is kinda strange. my_snprintf must have been added later.

12:47

http://btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/src/util.cpp#0232

12:47

Satoshi 0.5.3.1/src/util.cpp ... ( http://bit.ly/1SjtQYu )

12:48

and strprintf (http://btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/src/util.cpp#0205) except it checks (ret >= 0 && ret < limit) as well as a few other things.

12:53

!up ascii_field

12:58

punkman: the change from calling snprintf to calling my_snprintf (which inturn calls vsnprintf) might be a good change. but unless we know why we're doing it, maybe we should just leave that alone.

12:58

(in FormatException)

13:05

ben_vulpes, trinque, other apple users: http://www.lispworks.com/images/lw-ide-cocoa.png << apparently they have lower prices now. if you're still into commercial lisps

13:05

... ( http://bit.ly/1CAmuhJ )

13:06

('lispworks ltd.')

13:07

^ firm was once infamous for charging royalties on runtime (!!!) for commercial apps. apparently no more.

13:07

thestringpuller

;;later tell mircea_popescu https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3d4gbu/no_we_dont_we_dont_owe_you_anything/ << more hippie talk of hippies saying "Bitcoin will make poor people rich social justic and income inequality"

13:07

The operation succeeded.

13:08

punkman: also, there is a commandline option for -logtimestamps so maybe just leave fLogTimestamps = false;

13:12

why are boost/function.hpp and wallet.h added to headers.h ?

13:12

mod6: they used to be in noui.h

13:13

Ah!

13:13

ok.

13:13

thestringpuller: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3d4gbu/no_we_dont_we_dont_owe_you_anything/ct1rfi0

13:13

scrimrot comments on "No we don't. We don't owe you anything." ... ( http://bit.ly/1Sjv8CS )

13:14

so other than what I said above about keeping FormatException the same, and leaving fLogTimestamps = false, and asciilifeforms' notes above, looks pretty good :]

13:14

thanks for putting effort into cleaning this stuff up.

13:14

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199256 << maybe have two config options, one that determines which things go into log file (min/normal/max) and another option which limits how big that file can get?

13:14

Logged on 13-07-2015 14:42:16; asciilifeform: and what's the deal with removing ShrinkDebugFile ?

13:14

mod6: what kind of insane person doesn't timestamp logs?

13:14

thestringpuller: the obsession with 'fair' is interesting - psychiatrically

13:15

punkman: my thoughts too.

13:15

but if we /always/ want them in there, maybe we should remove the commandline flag.

13:15

yeah forgot to remove that, will do

13:17

phf: thanks for your submission be aware that this exists : http://btc.yt/lxr/satoshi/source/src/util.h#0046

13:17

Satoshi 0.5.3.1/src/util.h ... ( http://bit.ly/1CAnhz6 )

13:18

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 54400 @ 0.00051166 = 27.8343 BTC [-]

13:22

mod6: ah good to know. i'll resubmit, not sure how my patch interacts with recent changes from punkman yet

13:25

punkman: the change from calling snprintf to calling my_snprintf << there was a "#define snprintf my_snprintf" before, which I removed

13:26

phf: yah was just about to say, maybe wait until he submits his, then you can apply yours on top.

13:27

it might be worthwhile to replace all those printfs with syslog(3) calls, specifically introducing the priority as the first argument, i.e. LOG_ALERT, LOG_WARNING, LOG_DEBUG. maybe have it conditional compilation, so that real bitcoin instance will log to syslog, where's debug instance will still write to file

13:27

punkman: ah, ok.

13:27

i see that now. that's fine then.

13:27

thx

13:27

this will also let us remove dodgy log rotation and management functionality altogether

13:29

sounds nice, but im wary about relying on outside daemons

13:30

ben_vulpes, ascii_field, et. al. anyone have any other thoughts on this ^^

13:32

!up ascii_field

13:32

see thread, http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199260

13:32

Logged on 13-07-2015 14:42:55; punkman: if you wanna logrotate, there's logrotate?

13:36

ah, thx.

13:36

ascii_field: we seem to agree on loglevels, but what's your take on feeding logs into syslog?

13:37

phf: i'm biased in the direction of rolling functionality ~into~ bitcoind, rather than ~out~ to unixland

13:37

understood

13:38

I just added a -shrinkdebug option

13:38

i'll let others comment. maybe i'm wrong about this one

13:38

and log rotation, etc. ought to happen in separate proggies

13:38

doesn't pogo have logrotate or anything already?

13:38

but keep in mind that the thing needs to work on machines with no perl, no bash, etc

13:38

punkman: not afaik

13:39

what does it do with logs?

13:39

iirc it has none

13:39

:D

13:40

so shall I remove -logtimestamps?

13:40

i think libc's syslog facility tries to pass messages to syslog and if the daemon is not running, they go into /dev/console instead

13:41

but i think the easiest option is to adopt syslog interface (since they already have a reasonable list of priority tags), make it go to debug.log by default, and then interested parties can just do #define log syslog

13:42

people seem to think fair means "everyone has the same things"

13:43

but that's rarely, if ever, fair

13:43

wb nubbins`

13:43

ty

13:43

fair generally means "people have vastly different quantity and quality of things"

13:44

phf: i'd rather not have compilation involved in configuring logs.

13:44

ascii_field: the debug.log thing is horrendous imho

13:45

ben_vulpes: agreed, I'd like to make the log more parsable

13:45

ben_vulpes: i'm all ears re: an alternative that doesn't turn my 5MB pogo rom into 10

13:45

jesus that reddit diatribe was rough

13:45

great big screaming steamer of "i cannot reason about this system"

13:45

I'm sure my cats would have things to say about fair if I stopped feeding them.

13:46

ascii_field: turn it off on the pogo. they're fire and forget, are they not?

13:46

ben_vulpes: thing is, i like cutting code. but i dislike inserting dependencies on complicated unixisms like autorotators.

13:47

i also dislike increasing the subset of libc we use

13:47

what about a signal for it to close and reopen the log, and then people can do whatever they please outside it?

13:47

is disabling logs on the pogo not an adequate solution for you?

13:47

(I'm not aware of whether it already has this)

13:48

ben_vulpes: no.

13:48

i want log on mine, for example.

13:48

ascii_field: autorotators exist because people don't know how to syslog mostly. i.e. you build a syslog demon based on the constraints of your system, i.e. on pogo might just be busybox's syslog, that does rudimentary truncation. elsewhere syslog writes to postgresql or whatever

13:49

not running any syslog daemon turns it into fire and forget, so you won't get any logs unless you are physically connected to console

13:51

again this is entirely logical except that it creates a new dependency

13:51

i.e. one more thing i'd have to reimplement for msdos or bare-metal port.

13:52

can we get the best of both worlds? eg log to standard debug.log if unconfigured, syslog if configured?

13:52

you could have the best of both by having it just fart messages out stdout and stderr, then attaching it to something like svlogd if/when you want that in a file

13:52

^

13:52

^ my usual setup when running services with runit

13:53

dat unix philosophy

13:53

^

13:53

also logging is a pretty low priority ticket. if it looks better, has more information, is less braindamaged, is more consistent, great. does not deserve major surgery atm imho.

13:53

"ticket"

13:53

*

ben_vulpes still booting

13:55

https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/3d26tk/did_mike_hearn_work_in_sigint_does_he_now/

13:55

Did Mike Hearn work in SIGINT? Does he now? : Bitcoin ... ( http://bit.ly/1HY5wvQ )

13:55

ben_vulpes: I disagree, how the hell are we supposed to debug with insane logs?

13:56

"But if so, he'd be the least well hidden operative ever." << lol

13:56

yes because you as a reddit user know what an operative looks like

13:56

having watched many movies on the subject

13:56

https://archive.is/nAitN << archive-d. somebody wanna deedbot this ?

13:56

Mike Hearn - Binding to a specified symbol version ... ( http://bit.ly/1HY5MLg )

13:56

sure

13:59

deedbot- http://dpaste.com/2W904B9.txt

13:59

... ( http://bit.ly/1HY6acT )

13:59

deedbot-

accepted: 1

14:00

deedbot- http://dpaste.com/262H0V4.txt

14:00

Mike Hearn - Binding to a specified symbol version ... ( http://bit.ly/1HY6pEO )

14:00

deedbot-

accepted: 1

14:00

both direct and as seen by archive.is

14:03

!up ascii_field

~ 22 minutes ~

14:26

is gribble down?

14:26

'Disconnected by services' << ???

14:27

qntra also down ?

14:28

ascii_field, yes. http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/http://qntra.net/

14:28

Down For Everyone Or Just Me -> Check if your website is down or up? ... ( http://bit.ly/1HYak4v )

14:28

!8ball

14:29

gribble seems sick.

14:29

;;8ball

14:29

nothing.

14:29

I doubt it very much.

14:30

ah! up again.

14:31

punkman: i'm not advocating insane logs, i'm just saying pretty it up and make it consistent but perhaps we don't waste too much time arguing about syslog and logrotation at precisely this moment?

14:34

!up ascii_field

14:35

ben_vulpes: actually sane logs are rather essential for other work

14:37

i'm not arguing against sane logs!

14:37

out of curiosity, what is 'other work'?

14:37

ben_vulpes: say, figuring out how long it takes to verify block N

14:38

would be neat if i could learn this from looking at timestamps

14:38

ah indeed

14:38

or say i wanna pipe my node's log to a thermal printer.

14:38

eatblock doesn't provide for that?

14:38

ben_vulpes: eatblock returns immediately

14:39

hm

14:39

(iirc the process is asynchronous.)

14:39

relatedly, i'm always amazed at how `getinfo' blocks on...something.

14:40

prolly the innumerable 'critical section' nonsense

14:40

ascii_field: i don't think that's the case. i changed block processing to return false when the block is bastard, and eatblock started returning false for those.

14:41

neato

14:41

phf: post patch ?

14:41

in other nyooz,

14:41

https://blogs.securiteam.com/index.php/archives/2502 << mega-l0l

14:41

... ( http://bit.ly/1GhOh16 )

14:41

'Trend Micro Threat Intelligence Manager installs a secure web interface (httpd.exe, tcp port 443/https) which listens for incoming requests. Several vulnerabilities have been found in the product that would allow a remote attacker to cause the product to execute arbitrary code.'

14:42

lol!

14:42

yet they called it a "secure web interface"

14:43

http://www.businessinsider.com/proxyham-anonymising-router-project-mysteriously-closed-down-government-rhino-caudill-2015-7 << other lulz of the day

14:43

ProxyHam anonymising router project mysteriously closed down - Business Insider ... ( http://bit.ly/1GhOp0F )

14:43

^ seems to be a modernization of the ancient 'gold box'

14:43

( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gold_box_(phreaking) )

14:43

Gold box (phreaking) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1GhOwt4 )

14:44

pretty snoreworthy idea, but apparently hamhandedly desaparecido by usg

14:44

and now famous as result.

14:46

'Effective immediately, we are halting further dev on #proxyham and will not be releasing any further details or source for the device... Existing #proxyham units will be disposed of and no longer be made available at @_defcon_'

14:48

'it appears that his hand was forced – legally – complete with gags and destruction orders.'

14:48

( http://www.csoonline.com/article/2947377/network-security/privacy-talk-at-def-con-canceled-under-questionable-circumstances.html )

14:48

Privacy talk at DEF CON canceled under questionable circumstances | CSO Online ... ( http://bit.ly/1HYc5yq )

14:59

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 20030 @ 0.0005184 = 10.3836 BTC [+]

~ 17 minutes ~

15:16

!up ascii_field

15:17

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-07-2015#1198964 << the 'open source chinese phones' thing is a complete snorefest. wake me up when street urchins can fab even a, e.g., z80

15:17

Logged on 12-07-2015 22:24:39; *: jurov expects asciilifeform to shoot holes in it ^

15:17

any moron can get a pinout.

15:18

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-07-2015#1198977 << we had a 'novena' thread. sad joke

15:18

Logged on 12-07-2015 22:52:47; phf: jurov: bunnie's mostly famous for reverse engineering first xbox http://hackingthexbox.com, and recently designing novena laptop

15:18

z80 is closed source turd, too, no?

15:18

perhaps the ultimate joke. yet another schmuck helping to redefine what 'open' means, to the peanut gallery

15:18

jurov: not if you can read ru!

15:19

"Designed to augment existing privacy tools, ProxyHam is a Raspberry Pi computer with Wi-Fi enabled." << gag order for this??

15:19

punkman: not like usg considers the question 'is this trivial to make' before they gag

15:20

for all we know, usg just finished installing 900Mhz intercept network and now is banking on 'streisand effect' to get us to use it.

15:21

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-07-2015#1198976 << the point i'm trying to make is that 'open' design is meaningless if it cannot be made, or, once made, verified at reasonable expense

15:21

Logged on 12-07-2015 22:31:52; jurov: but anyway, what i'm interested in, that maybe really 10nm fab is not needed and lesser process would suffice

15:21

in that sense jurov is right, all microprocessors ever made are 'closed source'

15:22

what russians did with z80 was not "reasonable expense"

15:22

aha

15:22

jurov has it.

15:22

*

ascii_field idly wonders how big z80 would be if turned into discrete ttl

15:24

https://raw.githubusercontent.com/MXCHIP/MICO/master/MICO/Library/RF%20driver/wlan_firmware.c << and ~here~ is an example of what chinese consider to be 'open source'.

15:24

... ( http://bit.ly/1RuHM70 )

15:25

verified at reasonable expense << can you ever verify SoC in jungle conditions?

15:25

or back to wirewrap?

15:25

why wirewrap ?

15:25

solder.

15:26

haha @ wlan_firmware.c

15:39

nasty magenta print head clog

15:39

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30670 @ 0.00052756 = 16.1803 BTC [+]

15:39

turns out it's an issue with the cartridge in the CIS kit

15:39

or so they say, anyway

15:39

replacement part otw

15:44

ascii_field: solder, sure. what's the most complicated component we can verify in jungle? (is there previous thread?)

15:44

ttl

15:45

other thing is, items like z80 or rom of ~known vintage~ can be considered 'verifiable' in a weaker sense of the word

15:45

stockpile ~now~

15:46

not 5 years from now when the fakes are stamped out by the millions.

15:47

ttl?

15:47

!up ascii_field

15:48

oh nm, found it

15:52

ascii_field: might be cool to get a rough list of interesting historic artifacts from you sometime

15:52

trinque: what is interesting to one is just old junk to another.

15:53

but i like the idea of owning a lifetime's supply of non-nato cpu.

15:54

http://i.imgur.com/3E4znLe.gifv

15:54

... ( http://bit.ly/1K4pJ0F )

15:55

wat.

16:01

ascii_field: so btc node on some kind of cray-sized monstrosity?

16:01

doubtful

16:02

in other news,

16:03

http://dl-1.va.us.xda-developers.com/2/9/0/4/1/1/4/md321_front.jpg?key=4vm4IxchvTR9PpuKsJQPcQ&ts=1436817817

16:03

... ( http://bit.ly/1K4qaIa )

16:04

arm a9, 256M ram, video, usb; $12 or so in qty. 1 from cn

16:04

but afaik there is no (public) linux port

16:04

these are sold as 'miracast wireless hdmi receiver'

16:04

802.11 built in

16:04

I have one like it

16:04

mats: ported linux to it ?

16:05

ran openelec on it

16:05

http://www.rock-chips.com/a/en/products/index.html

16:05

nope

16:05

the included one, afaik, does not support the usb port

16:05

pretty cool

16:05

which is the only means of adding storage

16:05

(whether it even is usb2, is unknown to me)

16:05

if yes, this can run a node

16:05

and is price-comparable with pogo

16:05

and available in qty. MAXINT

16:08

http://www.cnx-software.com/2014/01/29/acer-aerialcast-miracast-adapter-powered-by-realtek-rtd1185pa-rtl8192dv << similar device

16:08

Acer AerialCast Miracast Adapter Powered by Realtek RTD1185PA + RTL8192DV ... ( http://bit.ly/1CC7Fel )

16:08

apparently these are rather plentiful

16:09

https://wikidevi.com/wiki/Realtek << looks like that realtek chip speaks usb2.0

16:10

Realtek - WikiDevi ... ( http://bit.ly/1CC83t9 )

16:10

so there's some hope

16:11

the one on the xda link, I mean.

16:14

danielpbarron

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199544 << not the kind of "replacement part" I usually hear about in regards to a "CIS kit"

16:14

Logged on 13-07-2015 19:39:41; nubbins`: replacement part otw

16:15

http://www.pandawill.com/e6-wireless-display-dongle-miracast-hdmi-wifi-display-tv-stick-black-p94914.html

16:15

E6 Wireless Display Dongle Miracast HDMI WiFi Display TV Stick Black ... ( http://bit.ly/1CC93h7 )

16:15

slightly costlier than pogo; comparable specs; would need a mechanical adapter for usb drive

16:15

user would have to plug the thing into a tv set to configure 802.11

16:16

and

16:16

i suppose it could display a spiffy graphical representation of blockchain, etc.

16:16

because, after all, has video jack

16:17

http://www.cnx-software.com/tag/mini-pc/page/30 << buncha material re: these machines.

16:17

mini-pc | Page 30 ... ( http://bit.ly/1CC9qrK )

16:19

danielpbarron 8)

16:20

!up ascii_field

16:20

thestringpuller

ascii_field: keep your css fingers off my bitcoins

16:20

l0l

16:20

none of these things have rtc, i must note.

16:21

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 29557 @ 0.00051166 = 15.1231 BTC [-] {2}

16:21

thestringpuller: you can have the thing display 'screensaver' kaleidoscope if you like.

16:21

just, if you have vga, why not use.

16:21

pipe log to it 8)

16:21

I'm a sucker for cool viz

16:23

but the point stands - after several months of on and off searching, i did find a box which 1) is less than 2x cost of 'pogo' 2) very close in cpu and has NOT LESS ram than pogo 3) available in virtually unlimited quantities for the foreseeable future

16:23

on top of this, 4) from multiple competing vendors

16:23

toldja

16:24

it still remains to be seen 1) whether a sane linux port is possible for these 2) whether usb flash, of reasonable cost, can keep up - on these boxes - with blockchain.

16:24

and 3) whether these can be configured by users without resorting to black magic,

16:25

still, a promising sign

16:26

anyone who tries this - write in.

16:27

!s force-052-050.pdf

16:28

: http://s.b-a.link/?q=force-052-050.pdf

16:28

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 9309 @ 0.00052756 = 4.9111 BTC [+]

16:28

nubbins`: search is down

16:28

then i apologize if repost

16:28

http://cryptome.org/2015/07/force-052-050.pdf

16:28

... ( http://bit.ly/1CCbIau )

16:28

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199067

16:28

Logged on 13-07-2015 04:24:26; asciilifeform: BingoBoingo: http://cryptome.org/2015/07/force-052-050.pdf << carl force confiscations

16:28

^ thread

16:28

ty

16:28

search down but alf still works.

16:28

order of forfeiture listing btc addresses, wonder if that's a first?

16:28

nah that was in the earlier one

16:28

ah

16:29

couple minor lels:

16:29

"49.999 BTC in 1YCMDxDoYwRApGjyoPVi5onrN8JRLt383;"

16:29

sent 50btc, took tx fee out of it

16:29

later learned his lesson:

16:30

"400.00101 BTC in 14QPeQ2UZaMw9khqQeisVNT54j6A3U5KfE;"

16:33

wow, typos in THREE of the listed addresses?

16:34

I'll never be able to understand how someone working for an entity with a goddamn NSA thought he'd get away with it.

16:34

the whole thing stinks of bullshit

16:45

*

ascii_field bought a few of these boxes, of different makes

16:46

for subscribers of 'amazon', if you go for hong kong you can get one of the clones for ~$6 each (incl postage)

16:46

ascii_field: novena's "open" is identity thing. kind of like "maker" means a person who buys lego pieces from adafruit website and then connects them using a tutorial. it just means that the buying demographic are the same people who have a handful of o'reilly books and run ubuntu

16:47

http://www.tmz.com/2015/07/13/donald-trump-el-chapo-fbi-son-tweet-death-threat/

16:47

Donald Trump Calls in FBI Over Death Threats Involving El Chapo | TMZ.com ... ( http://bit.ly/1O1Nxmr )

16:47

phf: aha

16:47

phf: 'make magazine disease'

16:48

phf: meanwhile, actual-open disappeared as a thing from the world

16:48

and perhaps a dozen people noticed.

16:48

perhaps a dozen cared to begin with

16:49

actually cared, not "signed this change.org petition" cared

16:49

the rest will only contemplate 'caring' when the dildoes stop buzzing

16:53

!up ascii_field

16:54

well, it was a recent mp thread, that i'm going to butcher, since i don't grok it fully yet, but it was something about how presence of the word already indicates the failure of described concept

16:55

aha, sorta like if it were usual for a bakery to advertise 'shit-free bread'

16:56

"doesn't contain asbestos!"

16:57

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canadian-embassy-used-as-safe-haven-during-ukraine-uprising-investigation-finds-1.3148719

16:57

Canadian embassy used as safe haven during Ukraine uprising, investigation finds - Politics - CBC News ... ( http://bit.ly/1O1OYRX )

16:57

16:58

Arseniy Yatsenyuk, Stephen Harper to sign Canada-Ukraine trade deal Tuesday - Politics - CBC News ... ( http://bit.ly/1O1P5wI )

17:00

l0l!

17:00

what do the urks intend to sell ?

17:00

stray dogs, for soap ?

17:00

themselves, idem ?

17:02

babies to all the new gay families?

17:02

O.O

17:03

oh wait it has been legal for a while in canada?

~ 31 minutes ~

17:34

!up ascii_field

17:34

https://lists.torproject.org/pipermail/tor-talk/2015-April/037549.html << lulzy

17:34

... ( http://bit.ly/1HDX1Qd )

17:44

ascii_field: lol @ the "bad exit node" whack-a-mole

17:48

i especially love how nobody suspects the isp

17:48

who could just as easily be the one to have fallen into the honeypot 'fake btc exchange login'

17:49

or the sheer militant idiocy in proclaiming the other exits innocent (by implication)

17:51

also https://www.reddit.com/r/onions/comments/3a3ckb/introducing_new_bitcoin_mixertumbler_payshield_by/

17:51

Introducing new Bitcoin Mixer/Tumbler: PayShield by Sigaint : onions ... ( http://bit.ly/1HE0caB )

17:52

Signed, SIGAINT Administration, Ministry of Darknet Finance

17:52

"guys look we're fighting the good fight against teh fedz! also pls to be using our tumbler!"

17:52

uh huh.

17:53

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 26897 @ 0.00053586 = 14.413 BTC [+]

~ 15 minutes ~

18:08

!up ascii_field

18:13

scoopbot_revived

UK Student Convicted On Darknet Drugs Purchase http://qntra.net/2015/07/uk-student-convicted-on-darknet-drugs-purchase/

18:15

nubbins` ^

18:15

and other 'it is not illegal to get a parcel with dope' folks ^

18:21

i actually found the guy on steam, waiting for him to come online to ask if he confessed under duress (i don't really expect much of an answer)

18:21

typically, being accused is duress enough

18:22

"confess and you only get community service"

18:22

just same now as in inquisition 500 yrs ago.

18:22

'confess and you get penance'

18:22

I remember being taught that the evil USSR forced confessions...

18:23

no more and no less than the example here.

18:24

yep, wondering aloud where this "good" other side might be

18:25

l0l

18:31

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=12-07-2015#1198641 << looks like this one was made for the occasion. student l0lpr0ject?

18:31

Logged on 12-07-2015 17:06:21; lobbesbot: New post: http://nosuchlabs.com/rss Phuctored RSA Modulus, GCD=3 (Joe Schmuckley; ) <http://nosuchlabs.com/gpgkey/976AAB6D6B7F325843FF0E3653C219B9D6738C5F016F72973E311181614ECAF5#928C2E1186A73348A919DFD04535B989BDD9497C80AE2DC96788955BFB99ECC9>

18:33

ascii_field, was it a direct submission?

18:35

http://shoestringfoundation.org/cgi-bin/blosxom.cgi/2004/07/01

18:35

The Shstring Foundation Weblog ... ( http://bit.ly/1M72vtT )

18:35

punkman: it appears to be in the sks data set

18:35

how it got there, is anyone's guess

18:36

^ someone found Joe before

18:36

^ does anyone have evidence that this text existed prior to may 20 ?

18:37

wayback machine has it

18:37

http://web.archive.org/web/20041119061023/http://shoestringfoundation.org/cgi-bin/blosxom.cgi/2004/07/01

18:37

The Bin ... ( http://bit.ly/1K4BxzP )

18:38

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55653 @ 0.00053068 = 29.5339 BTC [-] {2}

18:39

"Peter Palfrader supplied us with the key" << maybe ask this guy for some more keydumps

18:43

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 66347 @ 0.0005111 = 33.91 BTC [-]

18:45

http://www.joshwieder.net/2015/03/wikileaks-global-intelligence-file-dump.html

18:45

Josh Wieder: Wikileaks Global Intelligence File Dump is Loaded With Malicious Software ... ( http://bit.ly/1M73muP )

18:54

very interesting.

19:00

"As of this writing (3PM @ 7-13-2015) Wikileaks continues to provide a torrent file with an identical timestamp, filename and byte size as the one I analyzed without any warning message notifying users of the danger of handling the files."

19:01

another one via josh : http://arxiv.org/abs/1303.7476

19:01

[1303.7476] Conspiratorial cosmology - the case against the Universe ... ( http://bit.ly/1M74yOL )

19:01

side note of... people gotta learn to UTC or specify time zone on the internet

19:01

"Based on the cosmological results of the Planck Mission, we show that all parameters describing our Universe within the \Lambda CDM model can be constructed from a small set of numbers known from conspiracy theory. Our finding is confirmed by recent data from high energy particle physics. This clearly demonstrates that our Universe is a plot initiated by an unknown interest group or lodge. We analyse possible

19:01

scenarios for this conspiracy, and conclude that the belief in the existence of our Universe is an illusion, as previously assumed by ancient philosophers, 20th century science fiction authors and contemporary film makers."

19:01

*

pete_dushenski is reading the paper now

19:02

" Journal of Comparative Irrelevance"

19:02

heh!

19:03

it's a joke ?

19:03

doesn't seem to exist unfortunately

19:03

sure it does.

19:03

it's just called 'journal of epidemiology'

19:04

or 'journal of behavioural economics'

19:04

same concept.

19:04

April 1, 2013

19:04

also copyright "dada" may be part of the joke

19:07

http://lolmythesis.com/

19:07

lol my thesis ... ( http://bit.ly/1M74X3w )

19:10

heya mp

19:10

heya!

19:10

someone's excited to be here :)

19:11

what's new ?

19:11

it's hot as shit here. 30C+

19:12

very pleasant 12ish here

19:13

a bit cool, but really quite livable for the south's 'january'

19:14

yeh i have no comp;laints

19:14

also, i just brought back the old skool razr phone into service

19:14

black

19:14

it's insanely cool.

19:14

12c, are they all wearing heavy coats and furs now?

19:15

the razr really makes me wonder why people with laptops or desktops would have 'smartphones'

19:15

punkman like you wouldn't believe

19:16

is there an argentinian equivalent to the canadian 'toque' ?

19:17

everyone's office in microcentro is like, you know, 1/4 mile away at most, i usually go around in a suit. you'd think i'm in swimming trunks for the looks teh women give out.

19:17

pete_dushenski iirc that's a roman thing. but they wear coats and gloves and shit, it's ridiculous.

19:18

i seem to recall that women covering their heads the way we think 'muslims' do is in fact a byzantine tradition, but not sure about the men.

19:18

;;ud toque

19:18

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=toque | toque. the ultimate in high Canadian fashion. worn year round whether it's cold or warm outside. and yes it does get warm in Canada! "I never leave the house ...

19:20

eastern, i think it predates the byzantines

19:21

punkman http://globedia.com/imagenes/noticias/2014/1/15/moda-invierno-2014-chicos-dsquared2_4_1956833.jpg << the highest of high fashions

19:21

... ( http://bit.ly/1M75UZM )

19:21

mircea_popescu makes sense

19:21

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/food-and-drink/news/heinz-forced-to-apologise-after-qr-code-on-ketchup-bottle-linked-to-hardcore-porn-site-10327313.html

19:21

Heinz forced to apologise after QR code on ketchup bottle linked to hardcore porn site - News - Food and Drink - The Independent ... ( http://bit.ly/1M75ZwA )

19:23

baahhahah

19:23

too cheap to register the domain name for as long as the product isn't expired.

19:24

does Heinz even expire?

19:25

"Taking advantage of the free advertising, Fundorado also comment on the photo, and offered Korell a free year's subscription." << epic lols

19:25

punkman even if it doesn't, they still have to list one by law

19:25

not like kraft singles ever go bad either, still have label requirements

19:26

"Newly released records show the federal [canadian] revenue agency has written off at least $4 billion in debts in the last two years"

19:27

"The outstanding balance in undisputed, unpaid taxes was $29 billion as of March 31, 2012"

19:27

was it loans to Greece?

19:28

probably just canadian greeks using their deferred tax payments to buy real estate on mykonos 'while it's cheap' and getting roasted

19:28

http://i.imgur.com/UXCBWlW.gifv

19:28

... ( http://bit.ly/1TyBb9h )

19:28

there is no real eastate on mykonos

19:28

thus the scam!

19:29

lol

19:29

;;buy mykonos real estate invest business serious professional scholar

19:29

Error: 'mykonos' is not a valid positive floating point number.

19:29

;;google buy mykonos real estate invest business serious professional scholar

19:29

Why You Should Be Investing Your Money In Real Estate: <http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/228506>; Investing in Commercial Real Estate - Entrepreneur: <http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/196042>; Real estate investing vs. buying a business (tenant, 7 ...: <http://www.city-data.com/forum/real-estate/1362608-real-estate-investing-vs-buying-business.html>

19:29

right.

19:30

heh

19:34

http://blogs.wsj.com/bankruptcy/2015/07/13/rapper-50-cent-files-for-bankruptcy/

19:34

Rapper 50 Cent Files for Bankruptcy - Bankruptcy Beat - WSJ ... ( http://bit.ly/1M76NBx )

19:34

worth what it says on tin ^

19:34

not bad

19:35

i guess his little cameo in 'spy' didn't cut the escalade-flavoured mustard

19:35

"he was supposed to appear in a New York state court to determine whether he owes punitive damages in a 2010 lawsuit filed by Lastonia Leviston, rapper Rick Ross’s ex-girlfriend"

19:36

more sextape

19:37

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199706 << Run Moar Winblowz!!

19:37

Logged on 13-07-2015 22:45:12; punkman: http://www.joshwieder.net/2015/03/wikileaks-global-intelligence-file-dump.html

19:42

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199704 << he used ordinary sks, as far as i can tell.

19:42

Logged on 13-07-2015 22:39:20; punkman: "Peter Palfrader supplied us with the key" << maybe ask this guy for some more keydumps

19:42

quite enough keys 'to eat with one's arse'

19:42

asciilifeform: historical copies might also be interesting

19:43

punkman: theoretically, keys are never removed

19:43

finding this, alone, would be newsworthy

19:43

(that is, evidence that any historical copies are anything other than subsets of the current snapshot)

19:43

would be interesting to diff 2004 sks dump with 2015

19:43

aha.

19:44

keys that are altered or missing would be insta-newz.

19:44

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 55399 @ 0.00052554 = 29.1144 BTC [+]

19:44

if anybody in my wot has such a snapshot - please write in.

19:46

"Going forward, Greece will have to stash its assets in a specially created fund and prepare them for sale “under the supervision of the relevant European Institutions,” “That may include buildings, possible areas of land, and even islands,” he says."

19:46

"To protect the natural, historical and archaeological value of such real estate, Greece would need to pass laws and empower oversight bodies to make sure that “the new owner does not abuse or damage the property,” "

19:46

rapetime, aha

19:49

lawl.

19:49

"The idea of selling the Acropolis came up early in Greece’s debt crisis. In 2010, two conservative German lawmakers caused a furor in Greece by suggesting that ancient ruins should not be off limits to privatization. "

19:49

so the euros do not wish the russians to buy this ?

19:50

neways, after all the "dignity" talk, are these supposed people of greece actually beheading the politicos in front of the temple ? or ?

19:50

oh no, they already said Tsipras should stop talking to Putin, the Enemy of All Things European

19:51

"we had a referendum, said no. you agreed with the euros. here's your death sentence. it covers your parents and offspring"

19:51

beheading five year olds similarly should not be off limits, what's zee german conservatives say ?

19:51

rich cultural heritage and all that.

19:52

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 64456 @ 0.0005038 = 32.4729 BTC [-] {2}

19:52

i suppose dignity's a lot like property, erryone's more than happy to claim it for as long as it's free.

19:53

they behead, the trucks full of freebies stop coming.

19:53

no time for dignity now, have to work on penance

19:53

and other trucks come instead

19:53

dude, but the dignitit.

19:54

it isn't even a forebrain syllogism, they know this with their arse

19:54

just like the rest of the 'civilized' world

19:54

and, esp., its outskirts

19:54

i'd do it, honestly.

19:54

easy, when you don't need the 'normality' for anything.

19:55

not nearly enough beheaded politicos in a whole decade to pay for one single week.

19:55

we kinda run out of terrorist in the last few years

19:55

*terrorists

19:55

shortages everywhere... *sigh*

19:55

ahahaha

19:55

zing.

19:55

except in syria

19:56

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Organization_17_November#Victims

19:56

Revolutionary Organization 17 November - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ... ( http://bit.ly/1M77WsV )

19:56

aite, so then time to move the greeks off to the zoo.

19:56

they were ever out of the zoo ?

19:56

yes

19:57

last time i was in athens, these objectionable things were all over the acropolis, filling the cafes, pretending they're like human beings an' everything.

19:57

apparently i wasn't the only foreigner disgusted by the display.

19:57

which ?

19:57

teh locals

19:58

http://chicagoboyz.net/archives/48967.html << 'Shoeshine boy trading club, China chapter' is a kid on... bitcoinwisdom

19:58

Chicago Boyz » Blog Archive » Sic Transit Gloria China ... ( http://bit.ly/1M782Rm )

19:59

bananacoin trader

20:00

o.O

20:00

http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user3303/imageroot/2015/04-overflow/20150424_china.jpg << direct link

20:00

... ( http://bit.ly/1M7877s )

20:00

looks shopped

20:01

screen is kinda bright for outside eh?

20:01

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199825 << not all greeks wanted to live in a natoreich zoo, aha.

20:01

Logged on 13-07-2015 23:56:35; punkman: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolutionary_Organization_17_November#Victims

20:01

otoh china is smoghell

20:02

punkman anyway, terrorism's useless for this purpose.

20:03

gotta convict them to be beheaded, along with the entire fambly, through plain legal proceedings.

20:03

then carry it out.

20:06

gonna be a long wait for that

20:09

i guess so.

20:10

the terrorists never did much anyway, firebomb here and there every few weeks for a while

20:10

very few casualties

20:12

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 37701 @ 0.00053428 = 20.1429 BTC [+] {3}

20:12

http://cryptome.info/fm30-31b/FM30-31B.htm << relevant historical mega-l0l

20:12

... ( http://bit.ly/1HErFsD )

20:12

iirc they killed some cia dude then tapered off after that

20:13

(Official Truth holds that 'field manual 30-31b' is a ru forgery)

20:13

CIA station chief was their first one, then they killed some people in the 80s

20:13

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 46399 @ 0.00054175 = 25.1367 BTC [+] {4}

20:15

http://cryptome.org/cia-FM30-31B.htm << moar re: same.

20:15

... ( http://bit.ly/1HEs5z8 )

20:17

;;ticker

20:17

Bitfinex BTCUSD ticker | Best bid: 291.05, Best ask: 291.48, Bid-ask spread: 0.43000, Last trade: 291.28, 24 hour volume: 74167.38437043, 24 hour low: 281.5, 24 hour high: 312.0, 24 hour vwap: None

20:18

"the Baris journalist who had come into the possession of FM 30-31B disappeared and was never heard of again"

20:18

but it's totally a soviet forgery

20:18

'The Pentagon document first surfaced in Turkey in 1973 where the newspaper Baris in the midst of a whole range of mysterious acts of violence and brutality which shocked the Turkish society announced the publication of a secretive US document. Thereafter the Baris journalist who had come into the possession of FM 30-31B disappeared and was never heard of again. Despite the apparent danger Turkish Colonel Talat Turhan two year

20:18

s later published a Turkish translation of the top-secret FM 30-31 and revealed that in Turkey NATOs secret stay-behind army was codenamed Counter-Guerrilla directed by the Special Warfare Department. From Turkey the document found its way to Spain where in 1976 the newspaper Triunfo, despite heavy pressures to prevent the publication, published excerpts of FM 30-31B upon the fall of the Franco dictatorship. In Italy

20:18

on 27 October 1978 excerpts of FM 30-31B were published by the political magazine L'Europeo, whereupon the printed issues of the magazine were confiscated. The breakthrough for the document came arguably not in the 1970s, but in the 1980s, when in Italy the secret anticommunist P2 Freemason lodge of Licio Gelli was discovered. Among the documents seized by the Italian police ranged also FM 30-31B. The Italian parliamentary inv

20:19

estigation into P2 decided to publish FM 30-31B in the appendix of the final public parliamentary report on P2 in 1987.'

20:19

*

asciilifeform read the whole thing and observes that if it is a scam, it is a very high quality scam

20:20

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 112852 @ 0.00054015 = 60.957 BTC [-]

20:20

someday... it's going to be either the longest or shortest trial there ever was

20:21

who will try these folks? martians ?

20:21

or 'the beoble' ?

20:22

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 94600 @ 0.00054542 = 51.5967 BTC [+] {4}

20:23

who knows what the future will bring

20:24

nothing is ever more common than the delusional notion that "these people" will escape.

20:24

it hasn't yet occured to date anyone did escape.

20:25

yet it hasn't yet occured to date anyone skipped on the "impossibru" sauce, either.

20:26

<mircea_popescu> it hasn't yet occured to date anyone did escape. << if 'escape' means 'die of old age, not beheading, and pass throne to successor' than hardly any of 'these people' ever ~did not~ escape..

20:26

am i thick or what. i dun get it

20:26

*

mircea_popescu shrugs.

20:26

uk ruled the whole world; look at them now

20:26

from where I sit they got theirs

20:26

anglos still rule their reich

20:26

just a different branch of family tree

20:27

smooth change of management, w/out skipping a beat

20:27

maybe so, and maybe someone will say that's still true of the next thing

20:27

someone will definitely say that.

20:27

easiest thing in the world to say, after all.

20:28

^ incidentally, this touches on what imho was the major reason for the appeal of the soviet offering in the 'turd world.'

20:28

namely, that, whatever else could be said about it,

20:28

no one could confuse it with the anglo offerings.

20:30

no shortage of the confused.

20:31

who and where ?

20:31

Kicks, further documented http://www.jameslafond.com/article.php?id=2643

20:31

JL: Entitlement Based Aggression ... ( http://bit.ly/1HEvcr1 )

20:32

"This has become the case with many white employees in retain food establishments who spend their shifts being harangued, threatened and demeaned by hate-spewing black customers who typically spend more on groceries in a visit than many retail food employees make in two weeks. Being a white employee in a city supermarket is like being a peasant on a medieval lords land."

20:32

how the fuck is this a race issue ?

20:33

servants getting uppity ffs.

20:33

guy's got money and you're the clerk. go suck his fucking cock omfg.

20:33

because when the colours are reversed, 'omg111!!111!!1' r4c1sm!!

20:33

of course being an employee in a supermarket is being a peasant on a lord's land. that is EXACTLY what it is.

20:33

also exactly what it should be.

20:34

asciilifeform heh mkay, let's fix stupid by being stupid the other way!!1

20:34

#killallmen

20:34

wtf's next, we're all equal to the supermarket bozo and #holdhands ?

20:36

anyway, petty supermarket hostility bs. guy has better posts imo.

20:36

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 86500 @ 0.00053767 = 46.5085 BTC [-]

20:36

i suppose he doesn't know this, but hey, his loss.

20:36

god damn that cat in the sandal is hilarious

20:36

4th time opening it

20:36

in other news, http://41.media.tumblr.com/2015cd0f31424b30b7022c8ac229cefa/tumblr_n82k4dCqBH1t0jb24o1_1280.jpg

20:37

... ( http://bit.ly/1HEwemN )

20:39

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 30200 @ 0.00051702 = 15.614 BTC [-]

20:40

<mircea_popescu> anyway, petty supermarket hostility bs. guy has better posts imo. << Supermarket guy is rightly in a low place. Welafare orcs excessively elevated. It's this sort of mess that will take Aztalan all the way to Long Island.

20:41

i dunno dude, seems nuts to me. some derp wishes to justify his being an asshole to some woman on the grounds of wide reaching sociodynamics ?

20:41

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 12015 @ 0.00052569 = 6.3162 BTC [+]

20:41

what, he's a faitful soldier in the war of whitehood against the evil blacks through not holding the door to some woman ?

20:41

some people are born to die on plastic carpeting under fluorescent lights srsly.

20:42

Dude seems rather obviously nuts, but it seems a symptom of the larger American decay.

20:42

there was some random retard of equivalent potency i loled at the expense of on trilema. this one was on a trip about how he "is trying to live to the server's expectations" or some shit in a restaurant.

20:42

the issues people have in their own heads, when those heads are squarely devoid of anything worthwhile...

20:43

hanbot do you recall which article that was ?

20:43

from my reading, this is one of those 'nouveau poor', if you will. the absolute most abjectly miserable thing to be in usistan.

20:43

FOR HIS SINS

20:43

he's supposed to go "i'm a fuckwad of a lifeform, and not only i deserve every bit of the shit i get, but if i keep course there's going to be more"

20:43

folks with no experience of 'orcraft', of navigating that world, and having all the 'wrong' 'branded on the tongue' class markers, habits, etc. which set the buggers off

20:43

not this retarded "blacks made me be stupid and lousy" nonsense

20:44

asshole comes from a three generations line of jwz "i only wanted to...", and now he doesn't like the just dessers ?

20:44

fuck him.

20:44

should have beheaded tsipras when he had the chance.

20:44

beheaded hamilton.

20:44

whosoever.

20:45

(the actual plot of a famous 'alt-history' in usa)

20:45

lincoln, really, but anyway.

20:45

'the probability broach'

20:45

was even turned into a comic book..

20:46

http://www.bigheadpress.com/tpbtgn << now phree on publisher's www.

20:46

Big Head Press - Thoughtful Stories, Graphic Novels Online And In Print - The Probability Broach: The Graphic Novel, by L. Neil Smith and Scott Bieser ... ( http://bit.ly/1HZrrkg )

20:46

pretty lulzy

20:46

Millions of noveau poor USians emerge from school every year disadvantaged because they went to "good" schools in the suburbs that insulated them from orcraft

20:47

i thought us supermarkets all have those sliding autodoors anyway, specifically to deal with the ever growing social awkwardness of usians.

20:47

sucks to be them; I went to those shitty suburban schools too

20:47

doors - sop

20:47

but the people still meet.

20:47

the fucking problems to have, seriously.

20:47

they're in kindergarten, there's no other way to look at it.

20:48

they're in kindergarten and they're whacking each other over the head with the cubes.

20:48

<mircea_popescu> they're in kindergarten and they're whacking each other over the head with the cubes. << Seriously can't even have a good riot

20:49

anyway, alf's point re the recent poor is well taken

20:49

what i don't understand is why do they take it out on the blacks ffs.

20:50

THEY are to blame, for having believed bush or whoever the fuck they believed.

20:50

because they're there, and different

20:50

nothing more

20:50

in any case, the blacks WERE THERE

20:50

they will take it out on themselves once a hitler shows up to help with this process.

20:50

like, before. and for that matter, know the terrain a lot better.

20:50

i suppose these are the same typically retarded usians that go to india and blame the indians for their inability to dowhatever X they wish to do.

20:50

<mircea_popescu> what i don't understand is why do they take it out on the blacks ffs. << noveau poor envies the comforts of the old poor

20:51

BingoBoingo has it

20:51

not like black dude cold-called you and persuaded you to be poor, motherfuckar!

20:51

it was your state senator, go talk to him.

20:51

usa was a very different-flavoured place under the old white gov.

20:51

yaya

20:52

cowards, simple as that.

20:52

Mostly noveau poor lacks the refinement of the old poor which prevents them from going full orc and riding the welfare train

20:52

if white bitches spent more time learning how to twerk at age 6, perhaps anyone'd give a lot more of a shit about the problems of white trash.

20:52

hanbot

<mircea_popescu> hanbot do you recall which article that was ? < i apparently don't

20:52

americans are subconsciously terrified of their own govt

20:52

what, he's special or something ? can't fit a shoeshine box in his hands ?

20:52

BingoBoingo: not just. all sorts of bureaucratic gears won't turn for you if you have wrong face

20:52

they simultaneously derive some kind of self-esteem from this fact

20:53

so no, they're not going to lash out at the monster, just some weird looking guy if they run across one

20:53

asciilifeform so don't hold open the door to THAT OFFICE then!

20:53

trinque or an incapacitated woman with children, why not

20:53

what's she gonna do, bleed on you ?

20:53

yeah

20:53

the louder my "countrymen" shout about nonsense the more I smell pissed pants

20:53

dude's such a public danger, why doesn't he go around at night through the ghetto bumping into derps and immitating anything they say!

20:54

(yes, i used to do that, at that age. it was fun, fwiww.)

20:54

why's every american an anxiety-ridden, pill-popping nutcase?

20:54

that's what i wanna know!

20:54

couldn't possibly be the unpredictable insanity of the economic system, or the brutal, violent govt

20:54

probably the black bitch

20:55

trinque, abbot, costello &mp

20:55

heh

20:55

hanbot

mircea_popescu scratch that, comments section of fried chicken: http://trilema.com/2013/fried-chicken/

20:55

Fried chicken on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1HZsbWH )

20:55

hanbot oh right! i knew we had a lol at that thing

20:57

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 116100 @ 0.00052869 = 61.3809 BTC [+] {3}

20:58

asciilifeform ironically enough, with a beheaded hamilton the us would still to this day be a sort of congo.

20:58

the brief excursion into world relevancy of the shithole in question is wholly owed to hamilton & co.

20:58

the "evil bankers & capitalists"

20:59

true enough that it doesn't seem to last, congo is congo. but... it was a decent trip, for as long as it lasted.

21:01

I got a couple scamcalls from the Congo few months ago

21:02

bride ?

21:03

no idea, didn't pick up in time, just saw them in logs

21:03

twist : punkman's half brother has been in prison in congo since feb

21:04

BingoBoingo i wonder if this is going to lead to a new musical genre off the old superhero comics tree. just like destitute niggers had their stupid gangsta shit.

21:04

christian glam rock bands singin' about how they don't hold doors open at supermarket

21:04

"whatever... i slam doors and i kill people! it's my hot country and i do what i want!"

21:05

there's some kind of shitty white supremacist "punk" I think

21:05

I've long wondered where all the supposed neonazis are; met one a while back and I think all he did was shoot guns and get tattoes

21:05

should make for some pretty easy enthusiastic teenage poon, if it ever takes off.

21:09

mircea_popescu: I don't see how it doesn't happen as I only anticipate the rape of white trash to increase.

21:09

i dunno... there really aren't that many blacks.

21:09

it's strange; there's something similar between the guy's door-holding and the utter lack of any dangerous subculture

21:09

as if all we can do is "act as if X"

21:10

somebody more well-read could identify what's malfunctioning in american identity-synthesis there

21:10

!s not a country

21:11

: http://s.b-a.link/?q=not+a+country

21:11

who was i having this discussion with ?

21:11

mircea_popescu: Sure, but there's going to be a lot more Chinese. It also really doesn't help the newer generations of white trash that they are ill equipped mentally, physically, and morally to cope.

21:11

mircea_popescu: yeah, what you said about a country being a place where young men know who they are, it's right on the mark

21:11

I considered that particular line for a long while after

21:11

BingoBoingo on the positive side, all good things ever come out of an ill equipped kid stuck in a blender.

21:11

Of course.

21:12

the timeout on the search is outrageous.

21:12

kakobrekla mthreat said it's being moved to another server.

21:13

aha, i had that particular http request in mind, but good to know

21:14

60 seconds, exactly.

21:14

trinque and that's what multiculturalism actually is, ftr. given that it is SO COMPLICATED to have a cultural superstructure that allows any semblance of passible solution to that, and given that any sort of formal proof of superiority and inferiority ~AMONG THAT SET~, strictly, strictly among that set is so hopeless,

21:15

you're way the fuck better off just letting everybody use their own answers than trying to force some sort of homogenity.

21:15

obviously you can't have "multiculturalism" among things that aren't even subcultures, let alone cultures in their own right.

21:16

but go explain to taleb why he should stop wearing the facial hair style he does. because why ? reasons ? he got reasons too.

21:18

;;google knockout game

21:18

Knockout game - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knockout_game>; Man Punches Pregnant Woman In Brutal 'Knockout Game' Attack ...: <http://news.yahoo.com/man-punches-pregnant-woman-brutal-knockout-game-attack-131622429.html>; Pregnant woman sucker-punched in unprovoked attack | New York ...: <http://nypost.com/2014/08/14/pregnant-woman-sucker- (1 more message)

21:19

hm, it's like in the place where culture might develop, they've placed a culture-shredder

21:22

I wonder whether anyone actually intended it. It seems too well designed, that you create this concept "multiculturalism" which by definition subsumes whatever particular ideas you might have as an individual.

21:22

but you see.. in order for us to hold hands multiculturally, there are going to have to be some rules...

21:22

where have I seen this kind of short circuiting before

21:23

like in portland you can come to work at a software company as a male with a skirt on and your nails done, no shoes on, so long as you shut the fuck up and work

21:23

not that I mind that at all, but it illustrates the "make any choice, so long as your domain of choosing is entirely irrelevant"

21:24

the original concept is merely commentary, on lengthy extant tradition, and it stands on its own as a perfectly sensible term of art in its field.

21:24

except, all that stuff's in french.

21:24

that the usians can not read and regularly hang themselves in the fancy underwear they bought in paris is not the underwear's fault.

21:25

lol

21:25

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 133650 @ 0.00053734 = 71.8155 BTC [+] {2}

21:25

how exactly is arbitrary activity "culture" now...

21:26

srsly, painting your nails ? what culture is this ?

21:26

just a matter of words meaning whatever ya like

21:26

if there's a facebook group for it, it's a culture

21:26

no wonder the code doesn't work.

21:26

if there's a github, there's a community

21:27

the term for this is subculture

21:27

tho even that may be a stretch

21:27

gotta have that other thing of which to be "sub"

21:27

The United MultiSubCultural States of America

21:27

nb.

21:27

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 58500 @ 0.00051339 = 30.0333 BTC [-] {3}

21:28

reminds me of "romania multilateral dezvoltata"

21:29

mircea_popescu, would you give any weight to studies that show multiculti undermines social trust? (i try to keep in mind these are studies done by gov dept)

21:29

how do you measure "social trust" ?

21:29

muh feels of course

21:30

yeah well, here's the thing : the variable you are likely calling this is a direct inverse of graph connectivity.

21:30

which means it is being undermined by improved communication.

21:30

it stands to intuitive reason if you look at it : the more people can talk to more people, the less any individual talk can be trusted, yes ?

21:31

my experience is that no-one talks to anyone

21:31

once software acquired the ability to be "updated online", atomic software versions became less trustworthy.

21:31

because instead of doing anything right, people just slap it together and "we'll do an update later"

21:32

cazalla: I greet neighbors or people on the street here and they look down

21:32

technology's your enemy there, not anything to do with society.

21:32

I still do it, because fuck them.

21:32

but that was a nice thing about Texan (sub)culture

21:32

you goddamn greet people when you walk by

21:32

trinque all of them !?

21:32

i walked by at least 1k people today.

21:32

well there are unspoken rules of it

21:32

trinque, i talk to my neighbour over the back but i couldn't tell you who else lives in this street.. growing up it was rare not to know

21:32

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 63014 @ 0.00055212 = 34.7913 BTC [+] {2}

21:33

I knew and drank with everybody I lived in an apt building with in tx

21:33

dunno any of these nervous fucks

21:33

you were twenty then!

21:33

sure that might be a factor

21:33

older people eventually figure out everyone's an idiot anyway

21:45

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23518 @ 0.00054815 = 12.8914 BTC [-]

21:46

21:46

... ( http://bit.ly/1eY1dDx )

21:48

^ first-class lathe work !

21:48

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-07-2015#1200053 << iirc the item in question used something like 'people leaving doors unlocked at night'

21:48

Logged on 14-07-2015 01:29:17; mircea_popescu: how do you measure "social trust" ?

21:49

so max social trust = up on the mountain ?

21:49

*

asciilifeform when first heard that anyone, anywhere since ancient egypt where locks were supposedly invented, ever left their house unlocked other than by mistake, was floored

21:50

i scarcely bothered.

21:50

mircea_popescu: iirc the talk was exclusively of reasonably populated places

21:50

for one thing, because dumbass russian locks, kept no one out.

21:50

meh, I leave windows open all night on the ground floor

21:50

fgor the other, because orly, you're gonna ROB ME ?!!?

21:51

even very cheap lock gives extra second or two to aim ?

21:51

you ever read the story of the whores and the thieves ?

21:51

only crime around here is someone comes and steals your grill off the porch

21:51

ali baba ?

21:51

no , no, on trilema.

21:51

can't recall one

21:53

http://klmist.com/keysreport.html << unrelated lol

21:53

KLMist - Bitcoin blockchain keys report ... ( http://bit.ly/1eY24En )

21:55

asciilifeform http://trilema.com/2011/spargatorii-si-curva/

21:55

Spargatorii si curva on Trilema - A blog by Mircea Popescu. ... ( http://bit.ly/1eY2bQ1 )

21:55

!rated phf

21:55

You rated user phf on 24-Jun-2015, with a rating of 1, and supplied these additional notes: New blood.

21:55

in other 'news', microshit has bitcoin nodes on its campus

21:55

!rate phf 2 Actually managed to compile Eulora on OS/X, which is a first.

21:55

Request successful, get your OTP: http://w.b-a.link/otp/0341b9533b890be1

21:56

!v assbot:mircea_popescu.rate.phf.2:6b5c1f07e27f7b7ae974773e4c050cfce50f47f405a2e9fdf2666a78059e721a

21:56

Successfully updated the rating for phf from 1 to 2 with note: Actually managed to compile Eulora on OS/X, which is a first.

21:56

ben_vulpes ^

22:00

speaking of whom,

22:01

i advise all folk in usa with a spare twenty to get that box spoken of earlier

22:01

so it doesn't end up like pogo, with my desk having the only such for months

22:01

;;bc,stats

22:01

scoopbot_revived

New Java Zero Day Discovered Targeting NATO http://qntra.net/2015/07/new-java-zero-day-discovered-targeting-nato/

22:01

22:02

'The attack leverages a three-year-old vulnerability in Microsoft Windows Common Controls CVE-2012-015 which is addressed in MS12-027.'

22:02

Run Moar Winblowz, NATO !!

22:04

http://blog.trendmicro.com/trendlabs-security-intelligence/hacking-team-uses-uefi-bios-rootkit-to-keep-rcs-9-agent-in-target-systems << moar lulziez

22:04

Hacking Team Uses UEFI BIOS Rootkit to Keep RCS 9 Agent in Target Systems ... ( http://bit.ly/1eY2SsH )

22:04

ends with the obligatory [install nsa's ] 'Update the BIOS whenever there is a security patch'

22:08

ok turdatron must hate me, seems it even ate last email which I sent with "swaks"

22:09

*

punkman flaps hands

22:09

punkman: Have you tried sending with 'mail'

22:10

BingoBoingo: does it do attachments?

22:11

I don't know? Only one way to find out

22:12

Ah, on my system it doesn't seem to

22:12

swaks is a crazy perl script for smtp testing, it works.

22:14

BingoBoingo: http://www.bigheadpress.com/tpbtgn?page=45

22:14

Big Head Press - Thoughtful Stories, Graphic Novels Online And In Print - The Probability Broach: The Graphic Novel, by L. Neil Smith and Scott Bieser ... ( http://bit.ly/1eY3I8R )

22:14

asciilifeform: lol

22:15

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-07-2015#1200024 < the us had multiple cultures, they were not tolerated by the elites

22:15

Logged on 14-07-2015 01:15:43; mircea_popescu: obviously you can't have "multiculturalism" among things that aren't even subcultures, let alone cultures in their own right.

22:16

it did ?

22:16

absolutely. I've mentioned the german community that used to exist, for instance

22:17

there were also urban irish

22:17

and a number of others

22:17

us cities around 1900 were full of ethnic ghettos

22:17

the black were imported to bust these up in order to prevent 'independent vote blocs'

22:18

doesn't seem like those transplants took

22:18

eh for chrissakes. you and your wife going on a cruise does not now constitute an "english culture" in oceania.

22:18

my family goes back to a big italian clan that moved over in I think the 30s or so

22:18

do you think I have any connections?

22:18

hell no I don't

22:18

everybody who wouldn't bow to massachusetts got bugsprayed.

22:18

http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=14-07-2015#1199899 < the majority of these blacks are actually 'spending' usg's money

22:18

Logged on 14-07-2015 00:33:04; mircea_popescu: servants getting uppity ffs.

22:18

^

22:19

pecunia non olet.

22:19

they have it, you want it, fuck you.

22:19

maryland, for instance, has a 'poor people health insurance' where they are required to pay $1, if they can afford it

22:19

most can't afford it

22:19

lol how do they means-test that?

22:20

they don't, it's purely optional

22:20

ask for a dollar, and then write down the "no" response?

22:20

(medicaid)

22:20

yeah I think that's how it works

22:20

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 61593 @ 0.0005364 = 33.0385 BTC [-]

22:21

and ftr i am naught impressed with this "got bugsprayed" bs.

22:21

ei ce pazeau ?

22:21

decimation, i read the other day this Fair Housing update will result in blacks being bussed in to the rich white liberal areas.. btw Obama looking old as fuck https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0lSLIhXrs1Y

22:21

Weekly Address: Making Our Communities Stronger Through Fair Housing - YouTube ... ( http://bit.ly/1L3XVwf )

22:22

cazalla: heh I got bussed as a white kid to the shittier public school back in the day for the same reason

22:23

recall mr mold: 'my daughter's preschool is literally in a ruin - that is, a (nicely renovated) space which used to be part of a Catholic church. (The preschool is the former convent. The rest of the church remains a ruin proper.) Where are the people who used to pray in this church? They fled. Why? Because they were afraid for their physical safety.'

22:23

cazalla: Obama's a lame duck, the most he can do is hand out goodies so that democrats show up to vote next time

22:23

taking the bus to school such a strange concept.. i use to ride my bmx doing bunny hops and all sorts along the way

22:24

'I know, I know. It's gauche to even bring this kind of stuff up. It's not part of our consensus reality. It's not part of our consensus history. When it comes to actual history, however,...'

22:24

cazalla: most us towns - even little cities - have a massive bus infrastructure just to take kids to and from school - and nobody else

22:24

eh, nothing was ever built by the afraid.

22:24

what, is this the universal excuse now ? "why is he fucking dumb ?" "he is ~~~affraid for his own physical safety~~~ magic wordsd!!!" "oh ok then, all is well, carry on"

22:24

mircea_popescu: which is why they left, and it is crumbling

22:25

good riddance.

22:25

by any practical measure they were an offense to the land they shaded.

22:25

So over the weekend and today, was working on building a new gentoo-amd64-nomultilib (glibc) instance to test out application of patches with v0.5.3.1-RELEASE as the base. Was able to build static binaries with gentoo & glibc just fine with both a modified auto-static (auto.sh) and with a slightly modified stator.sh script.

22:26

good work mod6

22:26

modified how ?

22:26

mod6 they be actually static ?

22:26

Upon successful compilation, both static builds were able to pull at least 150`000 blocks from mp's node.

22:26

pretty cool

22:26

asciilifeform btw is your node stuck ?

22:26

*

asciilifeform had actual static, in 'stator', compare with the elf attached there

22:26

mircea_popescu: not at all

22:26

hasn't been stuck once since i moved the clock, afaik

22:27

tried to track it with a node, it resulted in a stuck node 0.O

22:27

mircea_popescu: it appears to me that they are. I have two build logs (one for with auto.sh and one with stator.sh). They can be found:

22:27

http://thebitcoin.foundation/misc/gentoo-amd64-nomultilib-glibc-20150713-AutoStaticv006-buildlog.txt

22:27

... ( http://bit.ly/1eY5bMi )

22:27

mircea_popescu: interesting! please say if you are able to replicate this

22:27

workin' on it.

22:27

(on clean box)

22:27

http://thebitcoin.foundation/misc/gentoo-amd64-nomultilib-glibc-20150713-statorBuildScript-buildlog.txt

22:27

... ( http://bit.ly/1eY5dDW )

22:27

decimation, they had a bus for the high school i attended and when i got sent to naughty boy school i was given a train ticket which provide free travel (which was self defeating in that i no longer had to jump the train but could now ride legit for free lol)

22:27

anybody else wedged ?

22:27

(other than mircea_popescu)

22:28

(at the bottom of these sizeable files, you can see me run `ldd` and `readelf` against the output binaries)

22:28

me==365216

22:28

I have created a simple build script that will pull all of the patches, verify them, apply the patches at the top of the file. Along with anything else that was required.

22:28

nice

22:29

cazalla: at least you rode transport that others in the city could use

22:29

^ just to be clear re: above, my node is not, as far as i can tell, wedged!

22:29

This is all leading up to a new "patching guide" that I'm working on. Which is basically finished, save the fact I've yet to decide which direction to go on the build script. On one hand, I really love how simple and clean stator.sh is, but with auto.sh, I like how it automatically pulls the archives for you and creates the directories. etc.

22:30

my node has taken almost 2 weeks to get to 264k

22:30

Anyway, working on it. :]

22:30

mod6: pretty cool!

22:30

decimation: plugged into mp's node?

22:30

hi ag3nt_zer0

22:30

hey trinque

22:30

is on' ascii's node I think

22:30

ah

22:33

<@asciilifeform> modified how ? << with stator, I needed to add back in 'no-shared', according to http://wiki.openssl.org/index.php/Compilation_and_Installation this is required for us (probably). And I also needed to modify your line `cd bitcoin/bitcoin/src;` to `cd bitcoin/src;`. All of the things are in the build log, I tried not to leave anything out.

22:33

Compilation and Installation - OpenSSLWiki ... ( http://bit.ly/1eY67An )

22:34

several months back I was at the plug and play bitcoin meetup... Nathaniel Popper was there talking about his book... anyway, after the talk I was standing in line to ask him to clarify something when this familiar-looking chap gets in line behind me. asks me who what etc...

22:34

Those were the only changes to stator that were required to make it fit with the release artifact.

22:34

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 74689 @ 0.00053922 = 40.2738 BTC [+] {2}

22:35

thx trinque, asciilifeform, mircea_popescu, et al. :]

22:35

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 198721 @ 0.00055277 = 109.847 BTC [+] {5}

22:36

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 182100 @ 0.000534 = 97.2414 BTC [-] {4}

22:37

at the time I was all zigzagged about Trilema and so I asked him if he had heard of it... he scanned the files that the eye accesses when it looks down/right and there was a spark... he said "what's that?"... I said "dunno, run by this guy Mircea something or other"... he said "oh, that guy doesnt like me"... later he asked for my number and when he pulled out his phone I saw his name was Tim Swanson

22:38

!b 1

22:38

Last 1 lines bashed and pending review. ( http://dpaste.com/2TF5RBP.txt )

22:38

trivial perhaps, and not to make fun of him, but I thought it was pretty funny...

22:40

http://www.businessinsider.com/proxyham-anonymising-router-project-mysteriously-closed-down-government-rhino-caudill-2015-7

22:40

ProxyHam anonymising router project mysteriously closed down - Business Insider ... ( http://bit.ly/1eY72kr )

22:41

ag3nt_zer0: was already done, look in the logs

22:45

decimation: thanks. guess I should make that a habit before posting here...

22:45

'tis the custom

22:46

i think the tim swanson story more than makes up for it ag3nt_zer0

22:47

hehe

22:47

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 51444 @ 0.00055465 = 28.5334 BTC [+] {2}

22:48

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 117256 @ 0.00055519 = 65.0994 BTC [+]

22:52

mod6: rather peculiar that you had to add in 'no-shared' - witness that there are no shared deps in my executable (attached to 'stator' post on ml)

22:56

well, actually, I didn't /have/ to at all.

22:56

every time i've built the 'stator' before, the output binary was fine.

22:56

mod6: have you made any experiment to learn whether binary changes at all when this flag is set ?

22:56

might be interesting

22:56

statically built. but I recall going through this in march how we needed that in there... just maybe overly paranoid.

22:57

<@asciilifeform> might be interesting << i have not, as of yet.

22:57

didn't openssl itself have some derpy module-loader thing?

22:57

would be easy for me to try now though.

22:57

perhaps the flag enables/disables that

23:00

yes, openssl had a dynamic library loader flag

23:00

aha

23:00

what was it

23:00

sigh, search is down

23:01

no-dso iirc

23:01

<mod6> I have created a simple build script << you may consider signing some of the things you pull

23:01

^^^

23:01

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 11900 @ 0.00055519 = 6.6068 BTC [+]

23:01

pleez folks, sign

23:01

if you read, understood - sign.

23:01

sign the patches before pulling?

23:01

can sign and say 'this is a bad idea', note

23:01

this is for *Experimental* only.

23:01

doesn't imply endorsement

23:02

yeah no-dso http://wiki.openssl.org/index.php/Compilation_and_Installation

23:02

Compilation and Installation - OpenSSLWiki ... ( http://bit.ly/1HZBy91 )

23:02

I only stamp approval at release time.

23:02

ag3nt_zer0 i dun particularly care one way or the other. the discussion's in teh logs which atm can't be searched it seems.

23:02

a signature from a reasonably literate wot face, 'i read this and it made sense', is worth something.

23:02

to me, at least.

23:03

mthreat explained his hosting guy forgot to pay the bills

23:03

yeah was just gonna say search not working

23:03

There are some very far reaching effects of the patches applied in these build logs. They appear to "work", but as of yet, they're basically untested.

23:03

mod6 not strongarming you

23:03

ag3nt_zer0: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=13-07-2015#1199502 << thread

23:03

Logged on 13-07-2015 18:43:01; ascii_field: http://www.businessinsider.com/proxyham-anonymising-router-project-mysteriously-closed-down-government-rhino-caudill-2015-7 << other lulz of the day

23:03

not taken that way :]

23:04

asciilifeform: yes I found that... thx

23:04

mod6: thus far the longest-running test is the s.nsa node.

23:04

it features my entire shebang through 'stator'.

23:04

that's good!

23:05

was just looking up z86 heh

23:05

presently 47 connections, incl. a bunch of cn, interestingly

23:05

nb.

23:05

z80

23:06

usually hovers between 35-50

23:06

mircea_popescu: pay it a visit, log in, see if spot anybody you know...

23:07

eh, im working on an eulora release rightnao

23:07

neat

23:08

ok building again without 'no-shared' for binary examination

23:09

<@asciilifeform> doesn't imply endorsement << ok. i was just under the impression that's excatly what it meant.

23:09

I emboss cryptographically, stating that I've read, comprehended, approved and would apply in my own battlestation.

23:10

normally folks say why they're signing something

23:10

when they sign it

23:10

That's fair if it has a disclaimer.

23:10

lol, guess I just didn't wanna clutter up the turdomatic or confuse anyone either.

23:10

compared to most similar boards, it is practically empty

23:11

(imho a 'feature, not bug')

23:11

less is more, as always. if there's too much in there, it's less likely to be read.

23:11

has plenty of room for assorted strange.

23:11

without becoming crowded.

23:12

I see, we just have a bit different view of the thing. I only wanna send stuff in that I can pretty much stand behind.

23:12

One of the resasons that I haven't even posted the gentoo build guide to the list either.

23:13

I've tested it, trinque has tested it, but we need a third party to independantly verify so I know what I'm publishing there is as correct as it can be.

23:14

I'll give this some further thought going forward. I don't wanna hold off on pulling the trigger on this stuff if all I need is simple skull & cross bones.

23:14

I can see the point that two signatures would've communicated what you said, mod6

23:15

feel free to use a different graphic if the old 'jolly roger' has gotten boring

23:15

with some note

23:15

ascii-dickbutt

23:15

asciilifeform: noted.

23:16

<+trinque> I can see the point that two signatures would've communicated what you said, mod6 << in that it would have been 1/2 of the foundation's official seal?

23:16

i thought so too. and it's a credit to my trust of asciilifeform that I verify his signature, and we have a L1 trust between us.

23:17

eh, that was poorly worded. I think you all understand my meaning.

23:17

trust & fuzzies is great, but i'd really like folks to start reading the patches

23:17

(mod6 does. ben_vulpes? who else)

23:17

trinque?

23:17

I mean that it indelibly marks the text in question with the involvement of the signers

23:18

and yes, after read, and think - sign.

23:18

I do read the mailing list, yes

23:18

'i read this, grasped it'

23:18

or even 'i read this and it made no fucking sense and wtf'

23:18

oh that reminds me

23:18

jurov: tls outbound smtp for the mailing list plz?

23:19

should be a simple switch to flip in main.cf

23:19

(if postfix)

23:19

for no better reason than I've required it on my end and it cut spam by 100x

23:19

trinque: why was this needed ?

23:19

hm

23:19

asciilifeform: point taken. glad we talked about it. and yeah, very much so read and examine every patch.

23:19

trinque: it's also how you get the next 'hearbleed' on your box

23:19

*heart

23:19

yeah that is true

23:20

this atmosphere where 'gotta have ssl or else' is an engineered product

23:20

sure, I wasn't saying that

23:20

i advocate - resistance.

23:20

the box was getting ass-blasted with spam

23:20

there are other ways to filter spam, no ?

23:20

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 8800 @ 0.00054366 = 4.7842 BTC [-]

23:20

sure, was running spamassassin and whatnot

23:20

your point about heartbleed is well taken

23:22

i also have a habit, of compulsively re-reading own patches

23:22

to see if made a mistake.

23:22

i recommend this habit.

23:22

it does help. i often have to come back to it like a day later and re-read my own stuff for the 9th time.

23:22

a mistake that is owned up to, before it sinks any ships - can perhaps be accepted as a mistake, and forgiven

23:22

not sure about other kinds

23:22

as the war heats up.

23:22

also more eyes help too. sometimes we all miss stuff.

23:23

[MPEX] [S.MPOE] 23750 @ 0.00054366 = 12.9119 BTC [-]

23:25

I'm off; gnite gents

23:25

night trinque

23:25

later

23:26

I'll make an effort this week to sign the patches I've read and understand, even if still experimental at this time.

23:27

i recall that last we spoke of this, folks signed and noticed that jurov's patch sig widget didn't eat them correctly

23:27

and stopped

23:27

and I'll find a new ascii art instead of the jolly roger ;)

23:27

possibly i misremember.

23:27

check, when search comes back

23:28

ah, yeah... hm. I believe when I went to sign all the patches from the last release, I had to pull the patches, and then sign them as if I had wrote them myself for them to be accepted.

23:28

They needed to basically have the same SHA1s as the originals, with my own detatched sig.

23:30

Anyway, yah, will take a look when search comes back.

23:30

Someday, we're gonna get the kinks worked out of this system.

23:30