Show Idle (>14 d.) Chans

← 2021-05-18 | 2021-05-20 →
09:41 asciilifeform $ticker btc usd
09:41 btcinfobot Current BTC price in USD: $35981.62
09:41 asciilifeform !w poll
09:41 watchglass Polling 17 nodes...
09:41 watchglass : Could not connect!
09:41 watchglass : Could not connect!
09:41 watchglass : Alive: (0.082s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr= Blocks=684199
09:41 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.098s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=684199 (Operator: asciilifeform)
09:41 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.084s) V=70001 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=684199
09:41 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.109s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr= Blocks=684199
09:41 watchglass : ( Alive: (0.173s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=684199
09:41 watchglass : Alive: (0.145s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Return Addr= Blocks=684199 (Operator: whaack)
09:41 watchglass : Alive: (0.236s) V=70001 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=684199
09:41 watchglass : Alive: (0.213s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=684199
09:41 watchglass : Alive: (0.307s) V=99999 (/ Jumpers=0x1 (TRB-Compat.) Blocks=684199
09:42 thimbronion I heard (haven't verified) Eth fees are like .3 eth rn.
09:42 billymg thimbronion: LOL
09:43 watchglass : Violated BTC Protocol: Bad header length! (Operator: trinque)
09:43 billymg thimbronion: i was a little surprised they brought back doge this year, i wonder what it will be next time
09:43 billymg maybe ltc
09:45 thimbronion These are the "elites" we have.
09:56 trinque .ticker btc btc
09:56 trinque Current BTC price in BTC: 1 BTC
09:56 trinque incidentally it's still up what, 3x, in that US shitcoin.
~ 1 hours 27 minutes ~
11:23 billymg asciilifeform: ready to see a quick demo of logotron html/css updates?
~ 20 minutes ~
11:44 asciilifeform billymg: sure
11:45 billymg asciilifeform: ok, here it is with "classic.css"
11:46 billymg as you can see i'm only tracking one channel now, but i have some dummies hardcoded in to show what that looks like
11:46 asciilifeform billymg: looks rather similar to mine -- what didja change ?
11:46 billymg asciilifeform: good! that was the point for the first pass on the "classic" theme (the changes are in the html/css)
11:47 billymg one sec, lemme enable a few fake chan links for demo purposes
11:47 billymg ok, now if you refresh you'll see a few more chans
11:48 billymg now, the fun part, i will switch one line in the conf to point to a different css file...
11:49 billymg asciilifeform: now try reloading and you will see my new theme (may not be to everyone's taste)
11:49 billymg but point is, it was a one-line change in the conf. anyone can write their own css file, no need to edit any other code
11:50 billymg asciilifeform: also note that this css conf change has zero effect on lynx -- will always render the same there
11:51 billymg asciilifeform: regarding lynx, would also like to get your feedback on the one change there. i changed the chan list from a table to a list, so lynx now renders it differently
11:51 * asciilifeform doesn't much like the dark theme but can see how some folx might
11:51 billymg wanted to see if you prefer it that way or if you'd rather see it in the table like before
11:51 asciilifeform billymg: i like the old one (that i cribbed from phf)
11:52 billymg asciilifeform: do you use light theme for all terminals and text/code editors as well?
11:52 billymg << this is in reference to lynx rendering or the css-ized version?
11:52 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-19 11:51:58 asciilifeform: billymg: i like the old one (that i cribbed from phf)
11:53 asciilifeform billymg: only for shells. for emacs i've 'borland pascal' colours
11:53 billymg asciilifeform: blue?
11:54 asciilifeform billymg: see photo.
11:54 billymg asciilifeform: neato
11:54 * billymg could spend a coupla hours making a borland.css for the logotron that mimics this (not suggesting that's what asciilifeform was suggesting, but could)
11:55 asciilifeform billymg: again i don't have a fixation on 'same errywhere'
11:55 asciilifeform shells, log www, etc. i never have borlandized
11:56 billymg asciilifeform: same here, i've got different themes going in different windows and machines
11:56 billymg asciilifeform: ok, for the purposes of lynx rendering, i will revert the chan list to a table so that the channels are displayed horizontally
11:57 billymg asciilifeform: in my dark theme, what do you think about the chan list in the right sidebar? does this work well on your vertical monitors? (i tried keeping it very narrow)
11:58 asciilifeform billymg: it eats horiz. space. on '4k' lcd there's enuff remaining to read, but i can picture on lower res would be tight
11:59 billymg lastly, i did fix one bug i noticed with the search bar, where it would cause a server error with queries less than 3 characters
11:59 billymg and i made the /log a knob in the conf file
11:59 billymg you'll see mine is living at /
11:59 billymg so now user can set to /foo/ or whatever they like
12:00 billymg asciilifeform: i haven't tried it on an ipad yet, but the css tightens it up on narrow displays (you can try by resizing your browser window)
12:01 billymg and for "mobile" (< 768px wide) it stacks
~ 57 minutes ~
12:59 asciilifeform billymg: i confess, i do not like chan list to eat full vertical chunk of the screen. simply can't see why to do this.
12:59 asciilifeform you're welcome to do whatever on your own www, of course. but i like the horiz. format.
13:03 asciilifeform billymg: congrats re baking own log box, btw !
~ 18 minutes ~
13:22 asciilifeform billymg: somehow i didn't realize you baked own chan. lemme know if you want it included in my logotron.
~ 25 minutes ~
13:47 billymg asciilifeform: yes, would be happy to have it hosted on yours as well
13:48 asciilifeform billymg: do you have the raw log export knob enabled ?
13:48 billymg would this be first instance of two nsabot loggers in the same chan?
13:48 billymg asciilifeform: will look and if not will get that for you
13:48 asciilifeform billymg: nah, there were at one pt 3 in #t. and iirc even now there's a lobbes box here
13:48 asciilifeform aite
13:49 billymg asciilifeform: i haven't thoroughly looked through the bot code yet, are there existing knobs so that two bots don't both echo pasted loglines?
13:49 asciilifeform billymg: bots only echo lines which cite their own log, by design
13:49 billymg ahh
13:49 billymg nice
13:51 billymg asciilifeform: also, minor clarification re: your comment of "eat full vertical chunk of the screen" -- when i said mine stacks on mobile i meant the layout (e.g. chans will be at top of screen, but arranged horizontally)
13:51 asciilifeform a.
13:51 billymg additionally, the stacking in lynx as a side effect of converting the chan list table to a ul will be reverted
13:52 asciilifeform billymg: i was speaking of the page currently visible from ordinary box. there is a chan list occupying right hand side.
13:52 * billymg will publish a patch of changes (minus personal theme) when it's cleaned up, most likely on my blog by tomorrow
13:53 asciilifeform billymg: why not add your favourite theme to the genesis too (in subdir if you like) -- maybe everyone but asciilifeform wants it
13:53 asciilifeform (if my 32in 'eizos' weren't standing vertically, i think i'd want it to)
13:53 asciilifeform *too
13:54 * asciilifeform wonders if it's possible to auto-toggle ~without jsism~
13:54 billymg asciilifeform: ah, i see. imo i like the vertical sidebar chanlist in the desktop view (it mimics many other interfaces i use) -- but will note to others, it's a simple flip of a css switch, no markup changes between what i showed earlier as "classic" and "bitdash" themes
13:56 billymg asciilifeform: i could make a separate patch for the theme
13:56 billymg asciilifeform: is possible to auto toggle with css
13:57 billymg asciilifeform: if you resize your browser window to less than 768px wide you will see it switch the layout to something closer to classic (chan list on top, arranged horizontally)
13:57 asciilifeform would be nifty imho (supposing worked 100% errywhere)
13:57 asciilifeform eh fixed pixel widths simply will never trigger on any box of mine
13:57 billymg asciilifeform: not sure how wide the support is but iirc been around decade+
13:57 asciilifeform i use 'ratpoison' which gives permenent fullscreen.
13:58 asciilifeform and my screens are 2160 wide.
13:58 asciilifeform *permanent
13:58 billymg asciilifeform: meaning your browser windows are never less than 2160px wide?
13:58 asciilifeform even on crapple box i have it set to fill the display always.
13:58 asciilifeform aha.
13:58 billymg asciilifeform: lol in that case i don't see why the fuss over the ~200px sidebar
13:59 asciilifeform cuz it irritates me to have a thing that never contains more than half dozen lines of text, eat a megachunk of screen from head to toe.
13:59 asciilifeform billymg: my q 'can autoswitch w/out js?' specifically, can one tell whether w < h ?
14:00 asciilifeform (and then execute the req'd case)
14:00 asciilifeform why the pixel constants?
14:00 billymg asciilifeform: answer is yes, and even wouldn't use "media queries" (css definitions targeting different viewport widths)
14:00 asciilifeform the last time i owned a display that was <768 pixels along either axis, was in 1990s
14:01 billymg would work with ?navtop=true in url or something
14:01 billymg presence of which loads an extra coupla lines of css
14:01 asciilifeform billymg: lemme know if you have this going, will test.
14:04 billymg asciilifeform: sorry, i just reread
14:04 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-19 13:59:52 asciilifeform: billymg: my q 'can autoswitch w/out js?' specifically, can one tell whether w < h ?
14:05 billymg my suggestion of adding a URL param would not be "auto", but selected the way "show inactive chans" works now (roughly)
14:05 asciilifeform iirc last time i looked into it, answer was 'nope'
14:05 billymg however, detecting the w < h also doable
14:05 billymg via css media query, which i'm pretty sure works on any browser anyone here is using (bold assumption, i know)
14:06 billymg not including lynx and other terminal browsers, obviously
14:06 asciilifeform if it fails 'safe' on lynx etc. i'd stil consider to use it
14:06 asciilifeform (i.e. defaults to old format)
14:06 billymg asciilifeform: yeah, that part is no problem
14:08 * asciilifeform tangentially, somewhat disappointed that no one has written any seriously improved logotron by nao ( no, not impressed at all w/ the php+awk hacks)
14:09 billymg asciilifeform: what do you want the seriously improved logotron to be?
14:10 asciilifeform billymg: say, a cl proggy w/ 0 lib deps
14:10 billymg for the bot or the www portion?
14:10 asciilifeform both. see also.
14:10 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-16 17:31:07 asciilifeform: this is probably a good time to point out that 1) asciilifeform did not make any attempt to preserve 'pip a la fossilized gentoo 2) when it dies, it dies, i will publish my existing set of logotron deps then, but no new py proggies
14:12 billymg asciilifeform: does 0 deps mean can't use a database, or db must also be written from scratch?
14:12 verisimilitude Be I the only one here who writes Common Lisp programs without others' libraries?
14:12 asciilifeform billymg: can use a db over localsocket, neh.
14:13 asciilifeform verisimilitude: very easy if you dun need i/o, lol
14:13 billymg so just no psycopg2
14:13 asciilifeform and no 'flask', regexes, etc
14:13 billymg right
14:13 billymg so rewriting all of those as well
14:13 billymg or at least the pieces needed
14:14 asciilifeform and ideally more readable than mine, while on subj.
14:14 asciilifeform billymg: i'm told py2.7 doesn't even build any longer on certain heathen systems.
14:15 asciilifeform so it's a dead end, and i did warn people.
14:15 billymg asciilifeform: why does it matter what builds on heathen systems?
14:15 asciilifeform asciilifeform's logger is what it is, in case anyone forgot, because it was made from contents of junk box, on literally 3day's notice.
14:15 asciilifeform billymg: i made 0 effort to preserve a fossilized snapshot of the deps. or any simple mechanism to install'em.
14:16 billymg asciilifeform: that strategy seems to have worked well enough for dulap gentoo, why not just save old version of flask and psycopg2
14:17 verisimilitude I'll write a Common Lisp program for this in exchange for payment.
14:18 asciilifeform billymg: it isn't that it's physically impossible to modify 'pip' etc. to do this. but i have not . (partly because not had time, but also would much rather not encourage folx to continue building houses in swamp)
14:18 billymg asciilifeform: pip isn't needed though
14:18 asciilifeform verisimilitude: i dun think anyone presently tuned in has that kinda dough.
14:18 verisimilitude As for Python, I recall being reviled by the ``Everything is a library someone else already wrote.'' model.
14:18 asciilifeform billymg: potentially not. if you want to share your fossilization setup, i'll read.
14:19 asciilifeform verisimilitude: i'm throwing an exception parsing that sentence
14:19 verisimilitude As for Python, I recall being reviled by the ``Everything is a library someone else already wrote.'' development model.
14:20 asciilifeform billymg: more generally , i'd like to see movement ~away~ from 'everything requires 10GB of fossilized ???' rather than ~towards~
14:21 verisimilitude In some languages, everything is an object, or an array, and in Python everything is a library someone else already wrote.
14:22 billymg asciilifeform: this i understand, and movement towards new silicon for running spherical lisp machine as well, but i don't see army of hands with spare time and resources for doing all of this
14:23 asciilifeform billymg: imho 'cleaner www stack' aint a silicon-complete problem.
14:23 asciilifeform (does not mean there is anyone with the time, even so)
14:24 * asciilifeform if had time, would attempt along these lines.
14:24 snsabot Logged on 2020-07-18 19:55:54 asciilifeform: trinque: since you mentioned script langs: considering, after ffa, to attempt a 'dethompsonizing' simple gc-less scheme in asm, in style of 'M' as a scripting lang. can't speak for erryone, but i've wanted a <32kB scripting lang that 'compiles with bare hands' for many yrs.
14:27 trinque billymg: regarding the "no one has written" problem, personally I'd rather you go make yourself independently wealthy, than write w/e additional artifact, if they were mutually exclusive.
14:27 asciilifeform trinque: iirc he already ?
14:28 verisimilitude Now asciilifeform and myself are the only two who really play at that low level, right?
14:28 asciilifeform verisimilitude: in re which ?
14:28 verisimilitude The issue with me ever doing that is x86_64 is irredeemably ugly.
14:29 verisimilitude What?
14:29 trinque << I see this as a deeper problem than "guy picked up php/awk"
14:29 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-13 20:29:52 trinque: the former for obvious reasons, the latter because they're cramming the development into what free time they have
14:29 asciilifeform verisimilitude: i'ma come back to this.
14:29 asciilifeform trinque: elaborate
14:31 trinque works that are not shaped like current OSS hacks must grow atop a different surface than the OSS hacks grew
14:31 trinque imho that surface is economic, tech subsequently
14:31 billymg trinque: not sure what you mean
14:32 trinque billymg: I mean you're employing the conceit of the republic that someone oughta show up and work for nothing.
14:32 asciilifeform oblig naggum!
14:32 billymg trinque: ahhh. i wasn't the one who brought it up though, asciilifeform did
14:33 trinque at any rate, isn't a critique aimed at an individual.
14:33 billymg trinque: to which i replied, where are the hands? why not first fossilize and polish something that works before rewriting everything
14:34 * billymg also doesn't write/grok at sufficiently low enough levels to undertake these tasks
14:34 trinque because the problem is still "where hands"
14:34 * asciilifeform not opposed to folx polishing oldies. so long as they understand that the floor might at some pt fall out from under'em, when e.g. can no longer find irons which boot asciilifeform's gentoo etc
14:35 trinque yeah, this is what I'm getting at. trinque gives zero fucks about IRC because it's a dead world.
14:35 trinque thus no further deedbot updates
14:35 asciilifeform aha, exactly what i was alluding to re pythonisms
14:36 asciilifeform yes, right now i have a box with x, y, z. and enuff spares to keep it going for decade or 2. but no intent to use the few spare hrs i have to build ~more~ artifacts which only work with earlier museum artifacts.
14:37 asciilifeform it's rather like how i have a bolix box, but not insane enuff to publish proggies i wrote for it!
14:38 billymg trinque: fwiw my working on the btc network crawler and new www to display obvious centralization of network is to attract more hands
14:38 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-09 15:01:20 billymg: and for me, just seeing that table sorted by len(peers) desc made it plainly, undeniably obvious that trb nodes are the only real nodes on the network
14:38 snsabot (alethepedia) 2021-04-26 billymg: i also created a chan at #billymg a couple days ago, and i'm working on a website to do some recruiting (it will present itself as a more welcoming on-ramp to V and TRB than the logs), hopefully attract some of the not complete morons
14:38 asciilifeform billymg: neat. potentially.
14:39 * asciilifeform historically not champion re 'attract hands'
14:39 billymg i know i'm not gonna be the guy who writes a new linux, or new tcp stack, etc. but hopefully i can at least find one or two people who can help with that
14:39 asciilifeform a++
14:39 trinque billymg: sounds super sensible
14:39 trinque I am just challenging you in the tradition of the republic, and intend to continue
14:39 trinque far too little arguing these days!
14:39 asciilifeform ^ lolyes
14:39 billymg trinque: lol fair enough
14:41 trinque it's timely too; we appear headed for a massive casino crash. perhaps that knocks loose a few more sound money people from the communists.
14:46 asciilifeform trinque: it's interesting to asciilifeform , even as spectator, how all the engines for damping btc-usd running 'redline'
14:48 asciilifeform trinque: it aint a given, incidentally, that a crash bumps up exch rate. given as weak hands panic & dump (as in summer of '20)
14:49 asciilifeform (panickers dump, but buyers do not necessarily proportionately materialize, they instead buy lead.
14:49 asciilifeform )
14:50 trinque yeah, it doesn't take much to move the btc exchange rates, since most volume is leveraged bullshit or outright fabricated trading. I expect that a dump in e.g. S&P500 would send BTCUSD plummeting near-term.
14:50 asciilifeform aha, iirc exactly this last july
14:50 trinque er, swap the comma and period
14:50 * trinque intends fully to buy when blood in the streets, as with all other BTC valleys
14:50 trinque not nearly enough wailing yet
14:51 asciilifeform annoyingly, thing seems to function as carousel.
14:51 snsabot (alethepedia) 2021-05-19 asciilifeform: thimbronion: occasionally (some of) the rats get off the boat. the unfortunate thing is that they always get back on.
14:52 trinque sure, just like wallstreetbets is probably some hedge fund(s) herding the lemmings.
14:53 trinque the exchanges work for their "prime brokerage" side now, so even more incentive to crash price for those customers.
14:53 asciilifeform the workings of the piston more or less in broad daylight these days.
14:53 snsabot Logged on 2021-04-23 13:08:03 asciilifeform: a major moving part behind the price swings are the people who run this heat engine -- 1) spread fud re bitcoin 2) 'buy the dip' 3) drum up enthusiasm among morons 4) sell dear 5) goto 1, nao w/ moar coin, extracted from morons on both strokes of the engine piston
15:02 asciilifeform revisiting upstack -- i suspect that ~nobody gives rat's arse re centralization of ~node~ net because no one can do a damn thing re centralization of ~hash~
15:02 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-19 14:38:09 billymg: trinque: fwiw my working on the btc network crawler and new www to display obvious centralization of network is to attract more hands
15:04 verisimilitude So, ready to come back to that, asciilifeform?
15:04 asciilifeform verisimilitude: x86? yes
15:04 asciilifeform verisimilitude: yes it's ugly. but can rewrite the equation as e.g. 'would you rather eat 1mg or 500mg of kcn.'
15:05 asciilifeform 0 aint on the menu.
15:06 verisimilitude Considering the machines I own, and am buying, I've a different menu.
15:07 asciilifeform verisimilitude: you can disregard the obvious problem at own peril.
15:07 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-19 14:36:55 asciilifeform: yes, right now i have a box with x, y, z. and enuff spares to keep it going for decade or 2. but no intent to use the few spare hrs i have to build ~more~ artifacts which only work with earlier museum artifacts.
15:07 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-17 22:38:42 asciilifeform: verisimilitude: this aside -- 'yeelong' is an interesting box, and i tried for many yrs to get hold of one. but no longer, even if found one today, would be 'museum queen', would not want to leave the house with it -- say it gets stolen or rained into etc., where wouldja get another ?
15:08 verisimilitude When my Pinebook arrives, I'll have an ARM.
15:08 asciilifeform verisimilitude: didja ever write asm for arm ? and , what, 'not ugly' ?!
15:09 verisimilitude I've not yet, but it's at least less ugly.
15:09 asciilifeform verisimilitude: fwiw my 'pine' is gathering dust. my patience ran out after 2 minutes of 'pushed key, but cursor moves 5s later'
15:09 asciilifeform (+ heathen linux with all the known cancers)
15:10 verisimilitude Well, thanks again for recommending it.
15:10 asciilifeform lol
15:10 asciilifeform verisimilitude: i dun see how 'less ugly' at all. same 1000+ instrs., same variable length encoding, and -- ever worse than in x64 land -- massive nonstandardized space
15:12 verisimilitude This is purely a software issue, right?
15:12 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-19 15:09:34 asciilifeform: verisimilitude: fwiw my 'pine' is gathering dust. my patience ran out after 2 minutes of 'pushed key, but cursor moves 5s later'
15:12 asciilifeform verisimilitude: i suspect. (tho the mouse does seem to pick up atmospheric noise or whatnot)
15:13 verisimilitude Alright; I expect to play with the default system to see how bad it's, before replacement.
15:14 asciilifeform verisimilitude: i imagine if yer standards are low enuff, you'll find it edible (presumably the orig. author did...)
15:15 verisimilitude Considering I'm using a Lemote Yeeloong and my Thinkpad fan failed over one year back, yes.
15:15 asciilifeform verisimilitude: fan costs what, 5 $ ?
15:15 verisimilitude It would be nice just to play video or music without skipping or reaching eighty degrees.
15:15 asciilifeform ( or can't be arsed to open it ? takes, what, 10min ? it aint a crapple )
15:16 verisimilitude The issue is it works if I don't stress it.
15:16 asciilifeform why wouldja live that way ?
15:16 verisimilitude It's been a wonderful analogy to computing as a whole for me.
15:17 asciilifeform i dun get it. it's ~5 $ + ~10min.
15:17 verisimilitude I see what I've put up with, and it begins to make some sense.
15:17 verisimilitude I'd wanted to be less dependent on the Thinkpad anyway.
15:18 asciilifeform verisimilitude: do you have an auto ? and does it drag its rusted muffler behind it, and its bumper -- in front of it, as it rolls along on 4 flat tyres ?
15:18 verisimilitude I had another machine just for WWW browsing and video, but it failed recently.
15:19 asciilifeform lemme guess, this one also collected cockroach in the fan blades, and so written off ?
15:19 verisimilitude No, I believe the charger failed and the battery exhausted.
15:19 asciilifeform i'm reminded of the legend of the bedouin sheiks who , suddenly rich from petro concessions, bought mercedeses. and threw'em out in the desert whenever ran outta petrol. simply bought new one each time.
15:20 asciilifeform asciilifeform is not a sheik, and therefore actually maintains his irons.
15:20 verisimilitude After the third or fourth Thinkpad repair, asciilifeform, I get tired of dealing with them.
15:20 asciilifeform verisimilitude: where didja get yours, so that 3/4 repairs? i dun think i had to open mine 1nce in past 5y
15:21 verisimilitude ``Oh, this fan failed, that backlight failed, etc.''
15:21 asciilifeform did clean it initially, it was of course already ~decade old then
15:21 verisimilitude These were different models.
15:21 asciilifeform my x60 still worx. (tho the chinese batteries last maybe 5-6 cycles, tops)
15:22 verisimilitude I've not portrayed myself as glamorously as I prefer.
15:23 asciilifeform lol
15:23 asciilifeform hey, did imply that lappy is disposable to you, verisimilitude
15:23 verisimilitude I'm not living in filth, there are no cockroaches, but I'm tired of repairing Thinkpads.
15:24 * asciilifeform is tired of plenty of things, but.. still doin'em
15:24 verisimilitude So when the fan died for no reason, and I did open and inspect it, I stopped caring because it still ran.
15:25 verisimilitude I'd wanted to distribute my computing, and it was a good reason to do so.
15:28 verisimilitude Considering what I'm accustomed to, a machine from the last five years will likely seem very fast.
15:28 asciilifeform try, whynot.
15:29 verisimilitude But yes, I've reflected on it and it's obscene what humans will cope with.
15:30 asciilifeform in other lullies,
15:30 asciilifeform 'jess(jess@freenode/staff/jess)- [Global Notice] Hi all. It feels like my moral responsibility to inform all users that administrative control of freenode and its user data will soon change hands, and I will be resigning from freenode staff effective immediately. It's been an honour to help you all.'
15:31 asciilifeform ( iirc trinque scooped earlier. tho his link nao seems to 404 )
15:31 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-14 09:55:19 trinque: << lol, fleanode continues to rot.
15:32 verisimilitude I'm reading this.
15:33 trinque so, what's malicious use of the NickServ database going to do?
15:34 asciilifeform trinque: moar lulzily,
15:34 asciilifeform 'ChanServ [ChanServ@services.] has quit [Killed (grumble (My fellow staff so-called 'friends' are about to hand over account data to a non-staff member. If you care about your data, drop your NickServ account NOW before that happens.))]'
15:34 asciilifeform ^ what's 'closing' yer acct supposed to do?
15:34 trinque protect your privates apparently
15:34 verisimilitude Well, plenty of fools reuse passwords.
15:34 asciilifeform in what universe, lol
15:35 trinque think of all the "unlogged" channels!11
15:35 trinque etc
15:35 asciilifeform lol
15:35 asciilifeform would be a++ hilarious if they 'accidentally' published the logs of 'unlogged'
15:36 verisimilitude The only sad thing about this is if it remains boring.
15:37 asciilifeform ftr if fleanode finally croaks tomorrow, readers are invited to read on asciilifeform's www where to find him, there's an ersatz box ready to go for this occasion.
15:38 verisimilitude All of the cool kids have websites, yes.
15:39 asciilifeform verisimilitude: pretty sure erryone tuned in has a www.
15:39 asciilifeform ( maybe gregorynyssa didn't ? )
15:39 verisimilitude That's what I wrote; we're the cool kids.
15:44 asciilifeform lol
15:45 trinque anyway check out this lul
15:45 trinque supposedly the "buyer"
15:45 asciilifeform lol dafuq's that
15:46 asciilifeform clicked 'chat', got 'this is taking longer than it should, there might be connectivity issues' , lol
15:46 asciilifeform very 'promising' start..
15:47 trinque looks like shitty front for various low-effort honeypots
15:47 asciilifeform even sadder than whatever the last thing was which 'bought fleanode'
15:47 asciilifeform ( see also )
15:47 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-18 11:55:08 asciilifeform: thimbronion: on the subj of 'gradual death of fleanode' -- for some yrs now it has been owned by nsa. most likely simply for the ease of hijacking simplistic orcish botnets which use irctronic command mechanism. erry once in a while they switch out the front company which 'owns' it.
15:48 trinque yep, yawn
15:50 asciilifeform << lulzy wank btw.
15:50 snsabot Logged on 2021-05-19 15:32:57 verisimilitude: I'm reading this.
15:51 asciilifeform 'We are founding a new network with the same goals and ambitions:
15:51 asciilifeform It is backed by a swedish non-profit which lets us hold the name,
15:51 asciilifeform domain and various other assets to avoid a hostile corporate takeover.
15:51 asciilifeform It allows us to continue to operate the network as unpaid, neutral volunteers.'
15:51 asciilifeform etc
15:51 asciilifeform hilarious 'washing' of nsa front.
15:51 asciilifeform 'look, we're making a new, clean one!'
15:52 asciilifeform 'what do you mean, exactly same thing as old'
15:53 asciilifeform 'A contract in which christel, former head of staff, allegedly sold freenode, surfaced. And while I personally think that this would have neither included any servers or code or user data, since that did not belong to christel to sell, I am not a lawyer and apparently some of our volunteers got pressured very hard and their personal life could have been ruined easily should we have fought
15:53 asciilifeform against this apparent contract.
15:53 asciilifeform '
15:53 asciilifeform ^ 'apparently wife was a dog all along'
15:55 verisimilitude I'm not familiar with that saying.
15:56 asciilifeform 'The democratically elected heads of their respective teams, development, infrastructure, projects and communities were removed by force'
15:56 asciilifeform ^ recall voting for'em ? cuz asciilifeform doesn't..
15:57 asciilifeform verisimilitude: it's an old #tism. i.e. if you somehow noticed 'only now' that wife was a dog, about whom does this say more, the dog, or you.
15:59 asciilifeform anyway whole story reduces to sumthing like weev's.
15:59 snsabot (trilema) 2017-12-22 weevlos: andrew anglin
16:00 asciilifeform or , for that matter, #t's. where there's a bunha folx who think they 'work together' etc but in actuality are shining the shoes of a sociopath, who, at the moment when most convenient for him, packs it.
16:01 asciilifeform *buncha
16:03 verisimilitude Let it be remembered that when I was insulted and told to ``read the logs'' before being able to write in his presence, I correctly saw the situation and lost interest until finding this channel.
16:03 asciilifeform verisimilitude: even now 99.9% of errything of interest, is in the old logs.
16:04 asciilifeform i aint about to explain a subj. 9000+ times , that already explained in e.g. 2013.
16:04 verisimilitude I'll read them when linked, but I'm not going to read them serially.
16:05 asciilifeform verisimilitude: even if you wanted to , would take rather long time, to 'read serially'.
16:05 asciilifeform there's almost decade's worth.
16:05 verisimilitude I've already decided I don't want a religion, and so don't read holy texts.
16:05 asciilifeform could point out that closing eyes in a dark room does not make said room empty.
16:06 asciilifeform (i.e. like it or not, you 'have religion')
16:06 asciilifeform 'By the way, when he mentions "the board of Freenode", he really just means himself.' << lel, familiar, aint it.
16:07 verisimilitude Opening them and seeing hallucinations brought by the lack of light doesn't make the room filled.
16:07 verisimilitude Still, I'll rephrase.
16:08 trinque verisimilitude: reading the logs wasn't solely a "him" thing, ftr.
16:08 trinque there is as asciilifeform says nothing gained and much lost by rehashing the same things for novices endlessly.
16:08 verisimilitude I'm already part of one loosely-organized Internet cult, and don't want for another.
16:09 trinque (there's a place for it of course, and it's called school)
16:10 verisimilitude It's better to distill these thoughts as articles, which is what I do.
16:11 trinque I'd agree that "read the entire logs" does not scale, and in practice didn't.
16:11 verisimilitude I've enough now I can often point others to them to spare myself.
16:11 trinque sure, and you see much of this in the aforementioned logs, quoting existing works
16:15 * asciilifeform will bbl
16:17 trinque verisimilitude: I'll say it's a curious thing that apparently so many people lurked in #t if it was obviously a doomed cult.
16:22 verisimilitude Isn't that sample bias; I'm the only one who didn't and yet is here to mention it, right?
16:24 verisimilitude I didn't write I saw it as ``obviously a doomed cult'', just something I saw as a bad deal for me.
~ 58 minutes ~
17:23 asciilifeform in other lulz, 'buyer' of fleanode.
17:24 asciilifeform btw, for anyone who doesn't know, this is what the 'volunteers' of fleanode historically volunteered .
17:24 snsabot Logged on 2020-07-29 12:34:18 asciilifeform: at one time considered to host a fleanode noad in his rack. but then learned that they expect, for 100% phree, an ~entire~ 1u, w/ exclusive root, running whatever shitware, and offer absolutely nuffin in exchange
17:25 asciilifeform i.e. was 100% centrally managed, and someone had master key. if the whines are to be believed, this someone sold it for btc to a craigwright-style d00d.
17:34 asciilifeform quite reminiscent of the case with the old prb 'alert key'.
~ 3 hours ~
20:35 verisimilitude I had a neat idea for how to secure security camera output sent over the network, where it only sent a small frame once per second or so: Using a one-time pad would work, so long as the camera be easy to periodically access; interference would be obvious as corruption in what should usually look about the same each time.
20:35 asciilifeform verisimilitude: at one pt asciilifeform had just such a camera going, lol. (won't say where..)
20:36 asciilifeform wasn't erry sec., tho, that would've been (at the time) expensive.
20:37 * asciilifeform coincidentally was rereading this ancient lul, arguably related. verisimilitude may find interesting. (warning:pdfism)
20:37 verisimilitude Well, ``great minds think alike'' and all of that.
20:38 asciilifeform verisimilitude: that otp authenticates as well as secures (when used as-prescribed) is 1 of the ancient appeals of the thing.
20:40 verisimilitude Reasonable authenticatation is just achieved by requiring a pattern occurs as agreed, right?
20:40 asciilifeform even unreasonable , also, lol
20:41 verisimilitude It could be anything from a header and footer to ``every pair of numbers agrees''.
20:42 asciilifeform verisimilitude: if 'reasonable' then it gotta be something that enemy cannot easily forge while modifying the rest of message
20:42 asciilifeform (incl. by replaying valid but old msgs)
20:42 asciilifeform in whole or in part.
20:43 verisimilitude Yes, which is why the latter suggestion is good, eg AABBCCDD.
20:43 asciilifeform verisimilitude: what does this give you that simply using otp does not ?
20:44 verisimilitude It's some protection against modification.
20:44 asciilifeform someone who surreptitiously obtained a copy of the pad, can repeat this pattern also. someone who has not, cannot send any message that would decode to anything other than rubbish.
20:45 verisimilitude Yes.
20:45 asciilifeform verisimilitude: a checksum/hash erry B bytes would give you similar effect (protect against random flips) and, notice, used even outside the context of crypto.
20:45 asciilifeform cuz random bitflips do happen.
20:45 verisimilitude For a security camera, just glancing at it should be fine.
20:46 asciilifeform if you've the time..
20:46 verisimilitude That also works.
~ 24 minutes ~
21:11 verisimilitude On one hand, I've gone roughly two months without mine RSS reader and usual WWW access, but on the other hand, that was probably good for me.
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